The Trump Presidency – 2016

[QuikSand]

This sort of conversation is just going to be endemic with him. He doesn't read, he doesn't have any interest in learning about history, policy, or government. He's just not that person.

When he talks about these things, he just slides into bullshit mode. Maybe he heard something, somewhere, about Jackson having opinions on the political divides that eventually led up to the Civil War. And he wanted to say something that sounded vaguely insightful. But to a guy like Trump, even that phrase right there "political divides that eventually led up to the Civil War" is beyond his grasp. He's not a 9-word guy, he's a 2-word guy.

Not saying he doesn't deserve the ridicule he's going to get for this. Just saying it's not as simple and fixable as someone who is ignorant of something specific... this isn't Dan Quayle and "potatoe" written on the card handed to him. Trump is a willfully and enthusiastically ignorant person, and that is the root cause for a ton of his flip-flops and gaffes, and will continue for as long as he remains near a microphone.

[Thomkal]

I just cannot believe his level of ignorance and arrogance. I'm sure if he was alive then, he would have solved things in five minutes and there would have not have been a civil war. The only reason he was talking about Andrew Jackson was for the photo op, PR, and giving a speech in Tennessee.

[Thomkal]

Originally Posted by larrymcg421

To me, the idea that Jackson thinks Trump was alive during the Civil War is not nearly as bad as his idea that pro-slavery Jackson should've been President during that time or the idiotic assertion that no one asks about why was there a Civil War.

yes I guess my six years of college where I studied the Civil War extensively were a failure because I never asked why.

[PilotMan]

Originally Posted by QuikSand

This sort of conversation is just going to be endemic with him. He doesn't read, he doesn't have any interest in learning about history, policy, or government. He's just not that person.

When he talks about these things, he just slides into bullshit mode. Maybe he heard something, somewhere, about Jackson having opinions on the political divides that eventually led up to the Civil War. And he wanted to say something that sounded vaguely insightful. But to a guy like Trump, even that phrase right there "political divides that eventually led up to the Civil War" is beyond his grasp. He's not a 9-word guy, he's a 2-word guy.

Not saying he doesn't deserve the ridicule he's going to get for this. Just saying it's not as simple and fixable as someone who is ignorant of something specific... this isn't Dan Quayle and "potatoe" written on the card handed to him. Trump is a willfully and enthusiastically ignorant person, and that is the root cause for a ton of his flip-flops and gaffes, and will continue for as long as he remains near a microphone.

You're trying too hard Quick. I agree with you and your analysis is spot on, but the only thing that is going to give this the play it deserves is if it's treated with the incredible disdain that it deserves with unrelenting abuse and vilification of the man in charge. His off the cuff, bullying and general ignorance on things he doesn't really care about or care to know about only reinforce to his supporters that feelings about things are much more important than facts. So you respond to that with more feelings and humiliation, because that's how you deal with that personality. He doesn't give 2 shits about what the facts are if he thinks what he meant is more important, even if he was completely, factually wrong. Which would imply that his feelings were predicated on a false belief, but again, his reality is his truth. Steve Jobs was famous for this line of thinking, and he used it to create things that were life altering and move people to his cause. With Trump, his movement is to tear down. You have to call him names, and keep the tide of humiliation rushing against him. He responds to that. Not that it'll change him, but it'll keep drawing out that idiot that resides inside.

[NobodyHere]

Originally Posted by mckerney

I think Andrew Jackson was alive when that show started

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by PilotMan

You're trying too hard Quick. I agree with you and your analysis is spot on, but the only thing that is going to give this the play it deserves is if it's treated with the incredible disdain that it deserves with unrelenting abuse and vilification of the man in charge. His off the cuff, bullying and general ignorance on things he doesn't really care about or care to know about only reinforce to his supporters that feelings about things are much more important than facts. So you respond to that with more feelings and humiliation, because that's how you deal with that personality. He doesn't give 2 shits about what the facts are if he thinks what he meant is more important, even if he was completely, factually wrong. Which would imply that his feelings were predicated on a false belief, but again, his reality is his truth. Steve Jobs was famous for this line of thinking, and he used it to create things that were life altering and move people to his cause. With Trump, his movement is to tear down. You have to call him names, and keep the tide of humiliation rushing against him. He responds to that. Not that it'll change him, but it'll keep drawing out that idiot that resides inside.

He is the guy that recently said our government system is archaic because it has a system of checks and balances in place. The fact that he can't act as dictator is bad for the country.

[JPhillips]

As pointed out by Josh Marshall, Trump knows nothing, but thinks he's the smartest person in the room, so when he learns something that everyone else already knew he acts as if he's got some special insight no one else has had. I think it's possible that he really thinks he has something smart to say about Jackson.

[HomerSimpson98]

fits

[JPhillips]

So Trump told Bloomberg he'd be open to an increase in the gas tax to pay for an infrastructure package.

If the Dems somehow take both houses of Congress in 2018, I'm going to predict Trump will pass pass far more legislation than in his first two years. I expect he'll largely abandon his current platform and become a Bloomberg style independent. Or he'll get impeached and go to jail. One of those two.

[AENeuman]

Originally Posted by QuikSand

Not saying he doesn't deserve the ridicule he's going to get for this. Just saying it's not as simple and fixable as someone who is ignorant of something specific... this isn't Dan Quayle and "potatoe" written on the card handed to him. Trump is a willfully and enthusiastically ignorant person, and that is the root cause for a ton of his flip-flops and gaffes, and will continue for as long as he remains near a microphone.

It really is turning into Elmer Gantry. Trump is way more religious than political. The near absolute reliance of emotional appeals on the mythos of America exposes our hypocrisy that rational dialogue and pragmatism are essential qualities we demand in our leaders. In other words, he is exposing human truth:that which gives us the most meaning is mostly abstract.

“He had learned how to assemble Jewish texts, Greek philosophy, and Middle-Western evangelistic anecdotes into a sermon. And he had learned that poverty was blessed, but that bankers make the best deacons.”

“And when Elmer was about to slip out to the kitchen with her to make lemonade, Benham held him by demanding, 'What do you think of John Wesley's doctrine of perfection?'
'Oh, it's absolutely sound and proven,' admitted Elmer, wondering what the devil Mr. Wesley's doctrine of perfection might be.”

Besides, I'm for a free press, for free enterprise... and for whatever the hell the other freedoms are!

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

It's a big fuck you to big blue states, but those states send a lot of GOP reps to congress. The @30 GOP reps from NY, NJ and CA are going to be a tough sell for any tax bill that eliminates that deduction.

True, but there are a lot of purple states with relatively high state income tax rates. Can't see it going over well in an upcoming election. Iowa and Minnesota get close to 9%. North Carolina and Virginia are over 5%. South Carolina gets to 7%. Even Georgia is at 6%.

I mean it'll get it's votes but I have to imagine that'll be a breaking point for a lot of GOP congressman. How does a rep in Georgia explain to his constituents that their tax bill is going up a few hundred bucks next year?

[RainMaker]

The weird thing about the Jackson comments is he claimed to have read a book on Jackson a couple months ago.

For anyone interested in Jackson, Robert Remini's "The Life of Andrew Jackson" is phenomenal. It's an abridged version of a trilogy he wrote. Jackson is one of the most fascinating individuals in American history.

[Butter]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

The weird thing about the Jackson comments is he claimed to have read a book

LOLOL

[RainMaker]

Trump says he would be honored to meet with Kim Jong-Un.

Originally Posted by JPhillips

So Trump told Bloomberg he'd be open to an increase in the gas tax to pay for an infrastructure package.

If the Dems somehow take both houses of Congress in 2018, I'm going to predict Trump will pass pass far more legislation than in his first two years. I expect he'll largely abandon his current platform and become a Bloomberg style independent. Or he'll get impeached and go to jail. One of those two.

Spicer walked this back at the press conference.

[JPhillips]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Trump says he would be honored to meet with Kim Jong-Un.



Spicer walked this back at the press conference.

Yeah. I just think that with the Dem congress, Trump would sign a lot of bills that wouldn't fit with today's version of Trump.

[pbot]

Originally Posted by HomerSimpson98

fits

So does this one...

Dumb and Dumber - We Landed on the Moon! - YouTube

[Atocep]

Did Trump get anything he wanted in the new budget? Obamacare still funded, planned parenthood funded, increases to science and research funding, increase in education funding, and no wall.

[RainMaker]

1% cut for the EPA, more money for defense and border security. Think that's it.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

1% cut for the EPA, more money for defense and border security. Think that's it.

Didn't he ask for a 30%+ cut to the epa though?

[JPhillips]

Rep. Mo Brooks R-AL

“My understanding is that it will allow insurance companies to require people who have higher health care costs to contribute more to the insurance pool that helps offset all these costs, thereby reducing the cost to those people who lead good lives, they’re healthy, you know, they are doing the things to keep their bodies healthy,” he said. “And right now, those are the people who have done things the right way that are seeing their costs skyrocketing.”

That isn't a winning political message.

[QuikSand]

Alabama, so well known for its residents and their deep commitment to "doing the things to keep their bodies healthy."

The Most and Least Obese States in America—Ranked!

5 Alabama
[33.5% obese]

Alabama’s obesity rate has been climbing since the 1990s, and you can tell by the adult hypertension rate—40.3%! That’s second in the nation, after West Virginia.

The Most and Least Obese States in America—Ranked! | Eat This Not That

Liberal propaganda, I know, I know.

[CrescentMoonie]

Originally Posted by QuikSand

Alabama, so well known for its residents and their deep commitment to "doing the things to keep their bodies healthy."




The Most and Least Obese States in America—Ranked! | Eat This Not That

Liberal propaganda, I know, I know.

I didn't feel like scrolling through 9,000 pictures, do they actually link to the study anywhere? Sorry if I don't believe what looks like a money making blog with linked headlines like "The Best and Worst McDonald's Breakfasts - Ranked!" It also talks about completely debunked crap like cleanses and literally everything that is linked has an exclamation point after it.

[digamma]

Originally Posted by CrescentMoonie

I didn't feel like scrolling through 9,000 pictures, do they actually link to the study anywhere? Sorry if I don't believe what looks like a money making blog with linked headlines like "The Best and Worst McDonald's Breakfasts - Ranked!" It also talks about completely debunked crap like cleanses and literally everything that is linked has an exclamation point after it.

Adult Obesity in the United States: The State of Obesity

There are dozens of these and Alabama pretty consistently ranks in the top five. It's neither here nor there, but this isn't exactly a stretch or an alternative fact, bruh.

[SirFozzie]

At least he admitted today that he doesn't stand behind anything he says:

" I don’t stand by anything. I just– you can take it the way you want."

‘I don’t stand by anything’: Trump withers under heat from CBS News’s John Dickerson - The Washington Post

[CrescentMoonie]

Originally Posted by digamma

Adult Obesity in the United States: The State of Obesity

There are dozens of these and Alabama pretty consistently ranks in the top five. It's neither here nor there, but this isn't exactly a stretch or an alternative fact, bruh.

I'm not disagreeing with the rankings, just the use of a blog full of list posts where several of them are about dietary ideas that have been completely disproven.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by CrescentMoonie

I'm not disagreeing with the rankings, just the use of a blog full of list posts where several of them are about dietary ideas that have been completely disproven.

It's a website that sells dieting "opportunities" from various franchises.

Right or wrong, it probably isn't going to be the best source for much of anything on a regular basis.

[CrescentMoonie]

May as well have been the Food Babe or Avocado Wolfe.

[RainMaker]

I'd be curious to see the overall cost of an obese person vs healthy person long term. I remember a study I believe in Sweden that showed smokers actually cost taxpayers less money. Basically if you die at 60 you aren't collecting 20-30 years of social security and using Medicare.

[JPhillips]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bikgLIK9OlU

Start at 3:20 and behold the joy of Trump pretending to work.

[digamma]

Originally Posted by CrescentMoonie

I'm not disagreeing with the rankings, just the use of a blog full of list posts where several of them are about dietary ideas that have been completely disproven.

Your browsing and clicking preferences are noted. Thanks.

[PilotMan]

Apparently it's handjobs for everyone in the GOP tonight. They say they've got the votes for Trumpcare and will vote tomorrow, before the CBO can score it.

[Easy Mac]

Originally Posted by PilotMan

Apparently it's handjobs for everyone in the GOP tonight. They say they've got the votes for Trumpcare and will vote tomorrow, before the CBO can score it.

Its like when I clean the house. Yes, I did a horrible job... and maybe the vacuum no longer works... and maybe I broke a few lamps while dusting... but I cleaned the house. I did something, so my wife should be happy, not mad that we have to buy a new vacuum, new light fixtures, and she has to re-clean the house.

Oh, but I didn't clean my side of the bedroom. It may be dirty, but it still looks cleaner than the rest of the house does now.

[bronconick]

Originally Posted by PilotMan

Apparently it's handjobs for everyone in the GOP tonight. They say they've got the votes for Trumpcare and will vote tomorrow, before the CBO can score it.

40 minutes alloted for discussion before voting on 1/6th of the US economy.

Sounds about right.

[Jas_lov]

I thought we didn't want to ram bills down people's throats. I don't get why they think they have to do this so quickly and with a slim party line majority. Seems like they're doing the same thing Dems did with Obamacare. Hopefully it dies in the Senate.

[Jas_lov]

Looks like it's coming up for a vote shortly.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by Jas_lov

Looks like it's coming up for a vote shortly.

It's going to pass. You know a bill is good when it's being pushed through before it's scored and the people voting for it are making themselves exempt.

[miked]

Wow, they won by a few votes and are now singing, nah nah nah, goodbye. These are the party in charge of your government.

[Jas_lov]

It passed 217-213. 20 Republicans voted against it.

[Atocep]

Well according to Harvard's look into the bill if your household makes less than $75k you likely won't be able to afford Healthcare soon.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Jas_lov

It passed 217-213. 20 Republicans voted against it.

As they should have.

Obamacare Lite is nothing to celebrate.

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

As they should have.

Obamacare Lite is nothing to celebrate.

To be fair, a lot of the Republicans who voted no were the moderates you like to hate who think it cut too much .

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

To be fair, a lot of the Republicans who voted no were the moderates you like to hate who think it cut too much .

Last list I saw (shortly before the vote) had the GOP no's coming largely from my side of the campground. Actual results may vary I guess.

It's a woefully insufficient bad bill that should never have seen the light of day.

Just another in the steadily growing line of missteps from a guy who seems to be living down to some of the more reasonable concerns a number of supporters had. Best of a bad lot of choices, may not amount to much.

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Last list I saw (shortly before the vote) had the GOP no's coming largely from my side of the campground. Actual results may vary I guess.

Combination maybe. A good portion of the 20 GOP 'no' votes came from NY, NJ, PA. Only ONE member of the Freedom Caucus (Rep Biggs from Arizona) voted no.

[Ben E Lou]

[Radii]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

As they should have.

Obamacare Lite is nothing to celebrate.

Millions of poor people will lose coverage, surely that's a start?

[Easy Mac]

Originally Posted by Ben E Lou

In other words, those most concerned about getting beaten.

[Radii]

So I wonder with pre-existing conditions, if I'm diagnosed as a diabetic, but have normal A1C values due to diet and need no medication and am told by my doctor to stop coming in for regular diabetic checkups and instead just for a physical once a year, will my insurance still be able to gouge the fuck out of my premium?


OR, do my premiums come down AND I get subsidies (oh sorry, tax credits. Subsidies are evil) and I benefit as someone who uses exchange insurance but makes too much for subsidies on Obamacare by more than double, but who would get a ridiculous tax credit under this new thing.


The bill that comes out of the senate, if anything ever does, won't look anything like this so it doesn't really matter yet. But I can't wait to find out.

[bronconick]

Originally Posted by Easy Mac

In other words, those most concerned about getting beaten.

Well, Ros-Lehtinen already said she's not running in 2018, so she might be in "gives zero fucks" mode

[Thomkal]

The GOP's big lie: Healthcare bill 'protects people with preexisting conditions' - LA Times

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by miked

Wow, they won by a few votes and are now singing, nah nah nah, goodbye. These are the party in charge of your government.

Ummmm...you might want to check your sources there...