NFL Week 4 Discussion Thread: McNabb returns to Philly.. - Page 6

Thomkal · 10-03-2010, 10:08 PM

man can't watch anymore of this joke of a game. Have fun those gluttons for punishment and/or giants and bears fans who watch the whole game.

Crapshoot · 10-03-2010, 10:10 PM

Stupid question - but why not pass once out of the end zone? 3 straight runs seems insane, and a higher risk of a safety.

Atocep · 10-03-2010, 10:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crapshoot

Stupid question - but why not pass once out of the end zone? 3 straight runs seems insane, and a higher risk of a safety.

They threw the ball on 2nd down and it was batted down at the line.

Crapshoot · 10-03-2010, 10:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atocep

They threw the ball on 2nd down and it was batted down at the line.

aha - sorry flipped channels to MLB network, missed that. Mea culpa.

This is a hell of a defensive performance by the Giants.

miami_fan · 10-03-2010, 10:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coffee Warlord

Caleb Hanie may need to warm up.

As you wish.

miami_fan · 10-03-2010, 10:20 PM

Who is the fourth string QB?

Pumpy Tudors · 10-03-2010, 10:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by miami_fan

Who is the fourth string QB?

Either Devin Hester as a wildcat QB or Lovie Smith.

Lathum · 10-03-2010, 10:27 PM

An ugly win but I'll take it.

If nothing else the defense showed they want to play for Coughlin.

weegeebored · 10-03-2010, 10:27 PM

The 4th stringer is Jerry Angelo, but he quit the team because he didn't want to have to play QB behind that O-line he put together. Lovie-dovie, all of the proven losers on that coaching staff, and Angelo have to go. ASAP.

And Giants fans are going to have some hope but they are really fooling themselves as well.

Groundhog · 10-03-2010, 10:38 PM

Cutler should have the entire Giants Defense charged with aggravated assault and his own offensive lineman should be put to trial for violating the Good Samaritan law.

RainMaker · 10-03-2010, 10:42 PM

Cutler deserves equal blame. He has to throw the ball. A few of those sacks he had guys open and was looking in their direction and decided to hang on.

In fact, some of us who were watching the game thought Cutler may have been sat down because of some internal issues. It seemed he wasn't interested in throwing the ball or running the plays being called, just proving a point to his OC about something. So blame the O-Line all day, but Cutler played like shit and underthrew Hester on a TD pass in the first quarter.

RainMaker · 10-03-2010, 10:43 PM

Oh and are there any other failed head coaches we can put on the staff? Mike Tice is working out great with that offensive line and Mike Martz sure looks to have an offense that isn't 10 years behind the times.

henry296 · 10-03-2010, 10:56 PM

Right now there are 24 teams with either 2 or 3 wins. I have feeling the playoff scenarios are going to be crazy this year.

B & B · 10-03-2010, 11:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Cutler deserves equal blame. He has to throw the ball. A few of those sacks he had guys open and was looking in their direction and decided to hang on.

In fact, some of us who were watching the game thought Cutler may have been sat down because of some internal issues. It seemed he wasn't interested in throwing the ball or running the plays being called, just proving a point to his OC about something. So blame the O-Line all day, but Cutler played like shit and underthrew Hester on a TD pass in the first quarter.

Attention: HOMER ALERT!

Atocep · 10-03-2010, 11:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Cutler deserves equal blame. He has to throw the ball. A few of those sacks he had guys open and was looking in their direction and decided to hang on.

In fact, some of us who were watching the game thought Cutler may have been sat down because of some internal issues. It seemed he wasn't interested in throwing the ball or running the plays being called, just proving a point to his OC about something. So blame the O-Line all day, but Cutler played like shit and underthrew Hester on a TD pass in the first quarter.

Not even close to equal blame. Yes, Cutler underthrew hester and didn't see the corner playing zone on the INT. However, you can't blame Cutler for holding onto the ball too long when too long is typically 3 seconds from snap. The play Collinsworth was railing on him for holding onto the ball for 5-6 seconds was more like 4.

When you're a QB and you're continually hit that much I don't care what your name is or how talented you are you aren't going to play close to your talent level. You get shell shocked, you start seeing guys that aren't there, and your thoughts on are on not getting hit rather than reading the defense.

Thomkal · 10-04-2010, 05:34 AM

I see my Cards were sacked 9 times and the "future savior" Max Hall picked up 6 of them. The only TD they got was a fumble or INT return. *sigh* How many sacks did the Giants end up with?

Is it just me or are we seeing way more extreme stats this year? A number of 400 yard passing days, including two in one game, all these sacks, etc?

weegeebored · 10-04-2010, 08:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Cutler deserves equal blame. He has to throw the ball. A few of those sacks he had guys open and was looking in their direction and decided to hang on.

In fact, some of us who were watching the game thought Cutler may have been sat down because of some internal issues. It seemed he wasn't interested in throwing the ball or running the plays being called, just proving a point to his OC about something. So blame the O-Line all day, but Cutler played like shit and underthrew Hester on a TD pass in the first quarter.

Yes partly, he does, and I'm not the biggest Cutler fan but if any QB deserves to have happy feet it's him. And I think that his concussion -- if real -- may have happened earlier, kind of like a aggregate affect after all of those hits all season long. I mean, is Cutler so bad that he can't see the corner blitz and hit a wide-open Bennett? No, I don't think so. Where were the quick hit plays that were so successful against Dallas?

cuervo72 · 10-04-2010, 08:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thomkal

I see my Cards were sacked 9 times and the "future savior" Max Hall picked up 6 of them. The only TD they got was a fumble or INT return. *sigh* How many sacks did the Giants end up with?

Is it just me or are we seeing way more extreme stats this year? A number of 400 yard passing days, including two in one game, all these sacks, etc?

You must be aggravated with them - you used "my Cards" and not "my beloved Cards."

Thomkal · 10-04-2010, 09:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cuervo72

You must be aggravated with them - you used "my Cards" and not "my beloved Cards."

Very observant my friend Cuervo, I'm not feeling the love for them too much right now.

Mustang · 10-04-2010, 09:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Cutler deserves equal blame. He has to throw the ball. A few of those sacks he had guys open and was looking in their direction and decided to hang on.

I don't think this is a homer statement. In watching the Packers last year and how they started the season, I would tend to agree with this. It's like Deja Vu, but it is happening to the Bears instead of the Packers. 1 part porous line, 1 part holding it too long.

remper · 10-04-2010, 10:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mustang

I don't think this is a homer statement. In watching the Packers last year and how they started the season, I would tend to agree with this. It's like Deja Vu, but it is happening to the Bears instead of the Packers. 1 part porous line, 1 part holding it too long.

I think the accumulated pass rush is getting into Cutler's head, and he has looked extremely skittish and indecisive the last two games. He held the ball too long a few times, but when the Giants are getting that kind of pass rush with just a four man rush Cutler has a tough choice. Throw it on time into 8 man coverage, and hope your wide receiver is there on time as well, or hold onto it and see if someone comes open, which is when a few of the sacks happened.

This is what I expected week 1. And then they fooled me for three weeks, before they finally got exposed. If Cutler is gone for any length of time... yeesh... They might as well punt the ball on first down and hope the defense and special teams scores for them. Either way, I know I won't be watching Collins or Hanie running the show.

BishopMVP · 10-04-2010, 01:03 PM

So the consensus is now that Cutler was concussed early on and the one they showed where his head hit the turf was actually his second of the game.

GrantDawg · 10-04-2010, 01:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thomkal

I see my Cards were sacked 9 times and the "future savior" Max Hall picked up 6 of them. The only TD they got was a fumble or INT return. *sigh* How many sacks did the Giants end up with?

Is it just me or are we seeing way more extreme stats this year? A number of 400 yard passing days, including two in one game, all these sacks, etc?

Adjust the sliders, it will be fine.

JediKooter · 10-04-2010, 01:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thomkal

I see my Cards were sacked 9 times and the "future savior" Max Hall picked up 6 of them. The only TD they got was a fumble or INT return. *sigh* How many sacks did the Giants end up with?

Is it just me or are we seeing way more extreme stats this year? A number of 400 yard passing days, including two in one game, all these sacks, etc?

It was a fumble by Sproles they ran back for a TD.

Hall did look better than Anderson though, if it's any consolation.

Thomkal · 10-04-2010, 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JediKooter

It was a fumble by Sproles they ran back for a TD.

Hall did look better than Anderson though, if it's any consolation.

woops sorry, the point I was trying to make was that it was a defensive touchdown. The offense got shut out, making it an even more pathetic game.

And hey how about those nice numbers for FB (and Coastal Carolina grad) Mike Tolbert? He's certainly been a pleasant surprise this season.

Thomkal · 10-04-2010, 01:58 PM

And my long dead grandmother would have looked better than Anderson

Abe Sargent · 10-04-2010, 02:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BishopMVP

So the consensus is now that Cutler was concussed early on and the one they showed where his head hit the turf was actually his second of the game.

A lot of studies show that concussions don;t always happen in one big hit, but over many hits. So Cutler may have been getting a concussion the entire time.

RainMaker · 10-04-2010, 03:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atocep

Not even close to equal blame. Yes, Cutler underthrew hester and didn't see the corner playing zone on the INT. However, you can't blame Cutler for holding onto the ball too long when too long is typically 3 seconds from snap. The play Collinsworth was railing on him for holding onto the ball for 5-6 seconds was more like 4.

When you're a QB and you're continually hit that much I don't care what your name is or how talented you are you aren't going to play close to your talent level. You get shell shocked, you start seeing guys that aren't there, and your thoughts on are on not getting hit rather than reading the defense.

Half those sacks he had enough time to get a pass off. I'm not giving the line a pass at all, it was an abortion. But Cutler has to realize that he doesn't have time to throw and has to get rid of it faster. On his two fumbles he had a lot of time in the pocket and held on to it for over 5 seconds. I'm sorry, but half those sacks were not jailbreaks, they were a QB who failed to get rid of the ball fast enough or didn't see a corner blitz and the guy who was left wide open because of it.

It's one thing if we're talking about a rookie missing those reads, but Jay Cutler is being paid like an elite QB and shouldn't miss those things. You can't throw horrible picks on your side of the field and miss wide open touchdown throws on a regular basis.

JediKooter · 10-04-2010, 03:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thomkal

woops sorry, the point I was trying to make was that it was a defensive touchdown. The offense got shut out, making it an even more pathetic game.

And hey how about those nice numbers for FB (and Coastal Carolina grad) Mike Tolbert? He's certainly been a pleasant surprise this season.

Ah gotcha! I think because the running game just didn't (no pun intended) get off the ground, killed much of any chance for the offense to do anything and the Cardinals defense just looked confused the whole game. Well, except for that fumble return. I just don't understand how a team can leave a future hall of fame tight end wide open almost the whole game. It's as if the D coordinator for the Cardinals only looked at final scores of the past 3 Chargers games instead of looking at the actual game footage. The 2 losses the Chargers have were self induced and not really anything the other team did.

Tolbert has been crazy so far this year. There's been flashes of it in the past, but, this year he is like a mini Earl Campbell with how he is running people over. Definitely a pleasant surprise.

Coffee Warlord · 10-04-2010, 03:32 PM

I only saw one instance where he missed a wide-open received en route to a sack. Every other time, the replays showed not a single receiver close to being open. Should he have thrown it away? Yes. Seperate issue. But when the Giants could get that much of a pass rush sending only 4 (which was largely the case), you're not going to find anyone open. 1 second or 20 to throw, if there's no one open, it doesn't matter.

bhlloy · 10-04-2010, 04:16 PM

Well, having real receivers probably would help as well. Hester has made strides but you are never going to learn the nuances of route running in a few years of playing the position and even beyond Hester it's basically just a bunch of fast guys.

I despise Cutler and he could do a better job of throwing the ball away last night but it's really on the front office to put him in a situation where he's not getting killed. Poor line + no reliable receiving corps = short career for QB.

bhlloy · 10-04-2010, 04:18 PM

DOLA - 3 of 5 receivers on the Bears roster are listed as KR/PR, one is 5'9 and the other is Devin Aromashadu. Worse than I thought.

Honolulu_Blue · 10-04-2010, 04:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bhlloy

Well, having real receivers probably would help as well. Hester has made strides but you are never going to learn the nuances of route running in a few years of playing the position and even beyond Hester it's basically just a bunch of fast guys.

I despise Cutler and he could do a better job of throwing the ball away last night but it's really on the front office to put him in a situation where he's not getting killed. Poor line + no reliable receiving corps = short career for QB.

I agree. In fact, I recommend using Top 10 draft picks in 3 out of 4 years on WRs. It's a great way to build a solid foundation for your team and your offense will become unstoppable.

How can anyone cover 3 Top 10 wideouts???

Coffee Warlord · 10-04-2010, 04:46 PM

I see what you're doing there...

bronconick · 10-04-2010, 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Honolulu_Blue

I agree. In fact, I recommend using Top 10 draft picks in 3 out of 4 years on WRs. It's a great way to build a solid foundation for your team and your offense will become unstoppable.

How can anyone cover 3 Top 10 wideouts???

molson · 10-04-2010, 04:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Honolulu_Blue

I agree. In fact, I recommend using Top 10 draft picks in 3 out of 4 years on WRs. It's a great way to build a solid foundation for your team and your offense will become unstoppable.

How can anyone cover 3 Top 10 wideouts???

Especially if you lock up a can't miss QB-prospect the year before you get the WRs. You see, everybody enters their prime at the same time that way. Un-freaking-stoppable.

Atocep · 10-04-2010, 05:05 PM

So Bears have contacted Juice Williams.

My first thought was it would be to give him a look as a receiver. No, the Chicago bears are probably the only team at the college or pro level that thinks Juice Williams can play QB at any level.

JonInMiddleGA · 10-04-2010, 05:07 PM

Didn't see this in the thread yet, sorry if double-posting

Packers S Burnett out for season with torn ACL *| ajc.com

RainMaker · 10-04-2010, 05:12 PM

Mike Ditka said Chicago Bears quarterback Jay Cutler needs to get rid of the ball quicker - ESPN Chicago

RainMaker · 10-04-2010, 05:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atocep

So Bears have contacted Juice Williams.

My first thought was it would be to give him a look as a receiver. No, the Chicago bears are probably the only team at the college or pro level that thinks Juice Williams can play QB at any level.

Where did you see that?

Atocep · 10-04-2010, 05:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Where did you see that?

Someone linked Juice Williams' twitter comment on it.

Quote:

Juice Williams Twitter: talked to the Bears. Told me to be prepared and stay ready in case of injury, I'm high on the list. That's encouraging

The Bears love those local guys...

Honolulu_Blue · 10-04-2010, 05:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by molson

Especially if you lock up a can't miss QB-prospect the year before you get the WRs. You see, everybody enters their prime at the same time that way. Un-freaking-stoppable.

So many weapons. Just... so many weapons.

larrymcg421 · 10-04-2010, 05:27 PM

There's no doubt that the pass protection scheme is problematic unless you have Dan Marino back there. Still, Cutler causes some of his own problems. They showed a replay of one of the fumbles and how a guy was running wide open underneath and Cutler basically ignored him trying to find someone downfield until the ball got stripped. On another play, the CB blitz came and Cutler wasn't aware enough to throw it right to where the CB blitzed from, where there was of course a wide open receiver.

RainMaker · 10-04-2010, 05:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atocep

Someone linked Juice Williams' twitter comment on it.

The Bears love those local guys...

I'm hoping there is a UFL team that goes by the Bears.

johnnyshaka · 10-04-2010, 05:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bhlloy

I despise Cutler and he could do a better job of throwing the ball away last night but it's really on the front office to put him in a situation where he's not getting killed. Poor line + no reliable receiving corps = short career for QB.

Yeah, at least Reid had a decent line in front of McNabb for most of his career.

Neuqua · 10-04-2010, 05:48 PM

Juice said on his twitter that the Bears told him that he's "next on the list" and to be prepared.

Chief Rum · 10-04-2010, 06:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Honolulu_Blue

So many weapons. Just... so many weapons.

Imagine if you then hired a gifted megalomaniac offensive wizard to run schemes for them! That team would score faster than a straight kickoff return.

Shkspr · 10-04-2010, 06:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neuqua

Juice said on his twitter that the Bears told him that he's "next on the list" and to be prepared.

Six minutes later Williams was concussed when Justin Tuck gained entry to his home and sacked Williams from behind in his kitchen.

bhlloy · 10-04-2010, 06:22 PM

I thought it was Umeniyora who was into that kind of freaky shit?

JediKooter · 10-04-2010, 06:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neuqua

Juice said on his twitter that the Bears told him that he's "next on the list" and to be prepared.

When did OJ get out of jail??

10-03-2010, 10:20 PM	#256
miami_fan Coordinator Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Land O Lakes FL	Who is the fourth string QB? __________________ "The blind soldier fought for me in this war. The least I can do now is fight for him. I have eyes. He hasn’t. I have a voice on the radio, he hasn’t. I was born a white man. And until a colored man is a full citizen, like me, I haven’t the leisure to enjoy the freedom that colored man risked his life to maintain for me. I don’t own what I have until he owns an equal share of it. Until somebody beats me and blinds me, I am in his debt."- Orson Welles August 11, 1946

10-03-2010, 10:38 PM	#260
Groundhog Coordinator Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Sydney, Australia	Cutler should have the entire Giants Defense charged with aggravated assault and his own offensive lineman should be put to trial for violating the Good Samaritan law. __________________ Politics, n. Strife of interests masquerading as a contest of principles. --Ambrose Bierce

10-03-2010, 10:56 PM	#263
henry296 College Starter Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Pittsburgh, PA	Right now there are 24 teams with either 2 or 3 wins. I have feeling the playoff scenarios are going to be crazy this year. __________________ "It's a great day for hockey" - "Badger" Bob Johnson

10-04-2010, 05:07 PM	#288
JonInMiddleGA Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Behind Enemy Lines in Athens, GA	Didn't see this in the thread yet, sorry if double-posting Packers S Burnett out for season with torn ACL \| ajc.com __________________ "I lit another cigarette. Unless I specifically inform you to the contrary, I am always lighting another cigarette."* - from a novel by Martin Amis

10-04-2010, 05:27 PM	#293
larrymcg421 Head Coach Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Georgia	There's no doubt that the pass protection scheme is problematic unless you have Dan Marino back there. Still, Cutler causes some of his own problems. They showed a replay of one of the fumbles and how a guy was running wide open underneath and Cutler basically ignored him trying to find someone downfield until the ball got stripped. On another play, the CB blitz came and Cutler wasn't aware enough to throw it right to where the CB blitzed from, where there was of course a wide open receiver. __________________ Top 10 Songs of the Year 1955-Present (1976 Added) Franchise Portfolio Draft Winner Fictional Character Draft Winner Television Family Draft Winner Build Your Own Hollywood Studio Draft Winner

10-03-2010, 10:08 PM	#251
Thomkal Head Coach Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Surfside Beach,SC USA	man can't watch anymore of this joke of a game. Have fun those gluttons for punishment and/or giants and bears fans who watch the whole game.

10-03-2010, 10:10 PM	#252
Crapshoot Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Dec 2003	Stupid question - but why not pass once out of the end zone? 3 straight runs seems insane, and a higher risk of a safety.

10-03-2010, 10:27 PM	#258
Lathum Favored Bitch #1 Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: homeless in NJ	An ugly win but I'll take it. If nothing else the defense showed they want to play for Coughlin.

10-03-2010, 10:27 PM	#259
weegeebored High School Varsity Join Date: Sep 2006	The 4th stringer is Jerry Angelo, but he quit the team because he didn't want to have to play QB behind that O-line he put together. Lovie-dovie, all of the proven losers on that coaching staff, and Angelo have to go. ASAP. And Giants fans are going to have some hope but they are really fooling themselves as well.

10-03-2010, 10:42 PM	#261
RainMaker Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Chicago, IL	Cutler deserves equal blame. He has to throw the ball. A few of those sacks he had guys open and was looking in their direction and decided to hang on. In fact, some of us who were watching the game thought Cutler may have been sat down because of some internal issues. It seemed he wasn't interested in throwing the ball or running the plays being called, just proving a point to his OC about something. So blame the O-Line all day, but Cutler played like shit and underthrew Hester on a TD pass in the first quarter.

10-03-2010, 10:43 PM	#262
RainMaker Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Chicago, IL	Oh and are there any other failed head coaches we can put on the staff? Mike Tice is working out great with that offensive line and Mike Martz sure looks to have an offense that isn't 10 years behind the times.

10-04-2010, 05:34 AM	#266
Thomkal Head Coach Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Surfside Beach,SC USA	I see my Cards were sacked 9 times and the "future savior" Max Hall picked up 6 of them. The only TD they got was a fumble or INT return. sigh How many sacks did the Giants end up with? Is it just me or are we seeing way more extreme stats this year? A number of 400 yard passing days, including two in one game, all these sacks, etc?

10-04-2010, 01:03 PM	#272
BishopMVP Coordinator Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Concord, MA/UMass	So the consensus is now that Cutler was concussed early on and the one they showed where his head hit the turf was actually his second of the game.

10-04-2010, 01:58 PM	#276
Thomkal Head Coach Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Surfside Beach,SC USA	And my long dead grandmother would have looked better than Anderson

10-04-2010, 03:32 PM	#280
Coffee Warlord Head Coach Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Colorado Springs	I only saw one instance where he missed a wide-open received en route to a sack. Every other time, the replays showed not a single receiver close to being open. Should he have thrown it away? Yes. Seperate issue. But when the Giants could get that much of a pass rush sending only 4 (which was largely the case), you're not going to find anyone open. 1 second or 20 to throw, if there's no one open, it doesn't matter.

10-04-2010, 04:16 PM	#281
bhlloy Coordinator Join Date: Nov 2003	Well, having real receivers probably would help as well. Hester has made strides but you are never going to learn the nuances of route running in a few years of playing the position and even beyond Hester it's basically just a bunch of fast guys. I despise Cutler and he could do a better job of throwing the ball away last night but it's really on the front office to put him in a situation where he's not getting killed. Poor line + no reliable receiving corps = short career for QB.

10-04-2010, 04:18 PM	#282
bhlloy Coordinator Join Date: Nov 2003	DOLA - 3 of 5 receivers on the Bears roster are listed as KR/PR, one is 5'9 and the other is Devin Aromashadu. Worse than I thought.

10-04-2010, 04:46 PM	#284
Coffee Warlord Head Coach Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Colorado Springs	I see what you're doing there...

10-04-2010, 05:05 PM	#287
Atocep Coordinator Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Puyallup, WA	So Bears have contacted Juice Williams. My first thought was it would be to give him a look as a receiver. No, the Chicago bears are probably the only team at the college or pro level that thinks Juice Williams can play QB at any level.

10-04-2010, 05:12 PM	#289
RainMaker Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Chicago, IL	Mike Ditka said Chicago Bears quarterback Jay Cutler needs to get rid of the ball quicker - ESPN Chicago

10-04-2010, 05:48 PM	#296
Neuqua Pro Rookie Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Chicago, Ill	Juice said on his twitter that the Bears told him that he's "next on the list" and to be prepared. __________________ Our Deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our light, not our darkness that most frightens us. We ask ourselves, 'Who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous, talented, fabulous?' Actually, who are you not to be?

10-04-2010, 06:22 PM	#299
bhlloy Coordinator Join Date: Nov 2003	I thought it was Umeniyora who was into that kind of freaky shit?

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