The Official Survivor: China discussion thread (spoilers possible)

[Swaggs]

I can't wait to see who the final two are!

[Jas_lov]

Well it's down to the final 3 like I said it would be. I hope this tactical error doesn't cost Amanda the victory. She should have never took Todd to the final 3. Denise was no threat. Actually, I hope she loses to Todd now just for being such an idiot!

[saldana]

is anyone else sick of the jury making all their faces and gesticulations everytime something happens in the coucil chats.

i liked it alot more in the past when they werent allowed to make any sort of communication to the people still in the game

[Jas_lov]

Yep, blowout for Todd. He fed Jean Robert's ego and won his vote. He won Jamie's. He was just a better schemer and talker than Amanda. She never should have let him get to the final 3. Could have at least forced a 2-2 tie or convinced Courtney it was in her best interest to get rid of him. She just cost herself $1 million.

[General Mike]

I hated everyone on this show this season.

[Bisbo]

Amanda had it locked up until she was totally outplayed by Todd and even Courtney at the final council. She may have been too overconfident to think about what she should say, and it was one of the least effectual performances in recent memory.

[Racer]

Does it bother anyone else that Denise and James got extra money? It's really not fair to Amanda or Courtney who in my opinion played better games then those two.

[PilotMan]

I was happy that Todd won. I think that he played a great game. I really wish that Amanda's ass had been shown more, and was generally happy with the way that the show went down.

As far as Denise and James go? James' money was sponser money that was outside the game. It has been done before. Denise's money was a good gesture and good PR for Burnett. These people have to quit their jobs and in her situation especially, he doesn't want them to be worse off than they were before.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Jas_lov

Well it's down to the final 3 like I said it would be.

you're really proud of yourself, aren't you?

[FrogMan]

Originally Posted by Jas_lov

Well it's down to the final 3 like I said it would be. I hope this tactical error doesn't cost Amanda the victory. She should have never took Todd to the final 3. Denise was no threat. Actually, I hope she loses to Todd now just for being such an idiot!

OMG! I CAN'T BELIEVE SHE DID THAT!!!! DID YOU SCREAM AT HER THROUGH YOUR TV SCREEN???????

FM

[Joe]

Originally Posted by Racer

Does it bother anyone else that Denise and James got extra money?

Only because it means on future seasons we'll be subjected to more "poor me" talk.

[Raiders Army]

I really hate Jamie and Pei-Geih. They're idiots.

[Raiders Army]

I can't believe Jeff went there with Eric.

[Jas_lov]

Originally Posted by FrogMan

OMG! I CAN'T BELIEVE SHE DID THAT!!!! DID YOU SCREAM AT HER THROUGH YOUR TV SCREEN???????

FM

It's just a game show dude. Calm down, ok? Anyway, I thought Denise's story was a little weird. I don't think she should have gotten any money for losing the most popular vote. James probably shouldn't have either, but everyone felt bad for him because he made the biggest blunder in Survivor history. Jeff was going for the jugular tonight, almost making James cry and asking very personal questions of Eric.

[FrogMan]

Originally Posted by Jas_lov

It's just a game show dude. Calm down, ok? Anyway, I thought Denise's story was a little weird. I don't think she should have gotten any money for losing the most popular vote. James probably shouldn't have either, but everyone felt bad for him because he made the biggest blunder in Survivor history. Jeff was going for the jugular tonight, almost making James cry and asking very personal questions of Eric.

err, dude, you freaked out, went all ballistic in here first. I'm all cool. Simply pointing out how stupid your first reaction was...

FM

[Lathum]

I am glad for Denise. My wife was almost crying she felt so bad for her.

I am excited to see who will be on next season, I think it will be James from this season. I would be surprised to see anyone from pre-all stars, this seems like am All Stars II with a twist

[Joe]

rumored list of contestants for the next season:

Spoiler

Eliza Orlins - Vanuatu
Jonathan Penner - Cook Isl.
Yau-Man Chan - Fiji
Jon Dalton - Pearl Isl.
James Clement - China
Ami Cusack - Vanuatu
Ozzy Lusth - Cook Isl.
Amanda Kimmel - China
Parvati Shallow - Cook Isl.
Cirie Fields - Exile Isl.

[Lathum]

Number 3 on that list would be awesome

[korme]

Yea Courtney looked a lot better, though I think Survivor always makes the chicks way too make-up-up'd at the live show.

[korme]

Originally Posted by Lathum

Number 3 on that list would be awesome

Agreed, though was he a right place, right time guy? Could he last that long a second run through?

[PilotMan]

Originally Posted by Lathum

Number 3 on that list would be awesome

+1

[Kodos]

I love the Yau-Man!

But I don't think they should have people back on. It's move fun with people who aren't known quantities.

[EagleFan]

I thought we were going to have a tie since we had 3 finalists (with the preview after Thursday saying 3 remaining tribal counsils, not sure what the hell the third one was).

All in all this season was rather dissapointing.


I would like to see them add a few different possible twists:

1) All on the same beach and randomly select the teams for the challenges (the losing team goes to tribal for immunity thus making the alliances even tougher to make as you have no idea who will be on your team).

2) Enough of the people who are just trying to use this show to get exposure and publicity (unless there is a season of "minor celebrities").

3) Only use the "popularity" type of challenges for reward (they seem to have begun to do that) as it seemed way too unfair to use for immunity.

4) I would like to see a cold weather location (but they won;t do that since they can't have women wearing barely anything then).

5) Not sure how this would go over in terms of production.... have 4 teams to start (the same size as the 2 they have now) but have them get dropped off without any knowledge of the other. 1st reward and 1st immunity have the same sets pair off. For the next set surprise them by having them rotate and pair off against another of the teams. Etc...

5a) or... Have them comtinue dow until the merger and then surprise them by having them face off against the other set of tribes that merged to continue the team challenges until the "final" merger. For time sake there could be multiple vote outs taking place at times.

I know the ideas in number 5 would never go over but I think it would be kind of cool.

6) Have a season of Amazing Race alumni. At the same time have an Amazing Race season of Survivor alumni (no more Rob and Amber though ).

7) Add an individual immunity portion to the team immunity challenges. Team A loses and must go to Tribal but player A from that team won individual immunity and cannot be voted for.

7a) Allow the team that won immunity to select a player from the other team for immunity (not to be revealed until after the vote to really make it challenging).

[TazFTW]

Originally Posted by Lathum

Number 3 on that list would be awesome

If only he had a "strong black man" to join forces with...

[CleBrownsfan]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

I thought we were going to have a tie since we had 3 finalists (with the preview after Thursday saying 3 remaining tribal counsils, not sure what the hell the third one was).

All in all this season was rather dissapointing.


I would like to see them add a few different possible twists:

1) All on the same beach and randomly select the teams for the challenges (the losing team goes to tribal for immunity thus making the alliances even tougher to make as you have no idea who will be on your team).

2) Enough of the people who are just trying to use this show to get exposure and publicity (unless there is a season of "minor celebrities").

3) Only use the "popularity" type of challenges for reward (they seem to have begun to do that) as it seemed way too unfair to use for immunity.

4) I would like to see a cold weather location (but they won;t do that since they can't have women wearing barely anything then).

5) Not sure how this would go over in terms of production.... have 4 teams to start (the same size as the 2 they have now) but have them get dropped off without any knowledge of the other. 1st reward and 1st immunity have the same sets pair off. For the next set surprise them by having them rotate and pair off against another of the teams. Etc...

5a) or... Have them comtinue dow until the merger and then surprise them by having them face off against the other set of tribes that merged to continue the team challenges until the "final" merger. For time sake there could be multiple vote outs taking place at times.

I know the ideas in number 5 would never go over but I think it would be kind of cool.

6) Have a season of Amazing Race alumni. At the same time have an Amazing Race season of Survivor alumni (no more Rob and Amber though ).

7) Add an individual immunity portion to the team immunity challenges. Team A loses and must go to Tribal but player A from that team won individual immunity and cannot be voted for.

7a) Allow the team that won immunity to select a player from the other team for immunity (not to be revealed until after the vote to really make it challenging).

You should submit those to CBS 'cause I like all those suggestions!

[Toddzilla]

Originally Posted by Racer

Does it bother anyone else that Denise and James got extra money? It's really not fair to Amanda or Courtney who in my opinion played better games then those two.

Runners-up in Survivor get $100,000 each, so Amanda and Courtney got paid.

[Toddzilla]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

5) Not sure how this would go over in terms of production.... have 4 teams to start (the same size as the 2 they have now) but have them get dropped off without any knowledge of the other. 1st reward and 1st immunity have the same sets pair off. For the next set surprise them by having them rotate and pair off against another of the teams. Etc...

I mentioned this idea in a Survivor thread a few seasons ago...

Baiscally have 2 games of survivor going on at the same time - 2 groups of 2 tribes each, each group unaware of the other.

Then, after the tribes in each group merge and get down to 5-6 people, you pull the mega-merge where they learn of the other group for the first time.

[Toddzilla]

FWIW - do NOT run a GIS of #2 in the spoiler list with your safe search off.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by Lathum

I am glad for Denise. My wife was almost crying she felt so bad for her.

Agreed. For all the people on this show that appear to be self-serving, there are the occasional few people who are good people who really deserve a break in life. That $50K will help her and her family's life immensly. She can go get an associate's degree at a minimum and make a much better living for her family. In addition, she can put away some of that money to make sure her child can go to college. Most of us are blessed that we don't have most of the worries she has on a daily basis.

[Racer]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

I thought we were going to have a tie since we had 3 finalists (with the preview after Thursday saying 3 remaining tribal counsils, not sure what the hell the third one was).

All in all this season was rather dissapointing.


I would like to see them add a few different possible twists:

1) All on the same beach and randomly select the teams for the challenges (the losing team goes to tribal for immunity thus making the alliances even tougher to make as you have no idea who will be on your team).

2) Enough of the people who are just trying to use this show to get exposure and publicity (unless there is a season of "minor celebrities").

3) Only use the "popularity" type of challenges for reward (they seem to have begun to do that) as it seemed way too unfair to use for immunity.

4) I would like to see a cold weather location (but they won;t do that since they can't have women wearing barely anything then).

5) Not sure how this would go over in terms of production.... have 4 teams to start (the same size as the 2 they have now) but have them get dropped off without any knowledge of the other. 1st reward and 1st immunity have the same sets pair off. For the next set surprise them by having them rotate and pair off against another of the teams. Etc...

5a) or... Have them comtinue dow until the merger and then surprise them by having them face off against the other set of tribes that merged to continue the team challenges until the "final" merger. For time sake there could be multiple vote outs taking place at times.

I know the ideas in number 5 would never go over but I think it would be kind of cool.

6) Have a season of Amazing Race alumni. At the same time have an Amazing Race season of Survivor alumni (no more Rob and Amber though ).

7) Add an individual immunity portion to the team immunity challenges. Team A loses and must go to Tribal but player A from that team won individual immunity and cannot be voted for.

7a) Allow the team that won immunity to select a player from the other team for immunity (not to be revealed until after the vote to really make it challenging).

I think the reason why they will never do #1 on your list is because to many fans like to pick a tribe to root for at the start of the game. They also did #1 on your list for Pirate Master and that didn't go well.

[Racer]

Dola, I like the idea. I'm just saying that I don't think it will ever happen.

[Racer]

Originally Posted by Joe

Only because it means on future seasons we'll be subjected to more "poor me" talk.

Yeah, this was kind of the reason why I didn't like seeing it at the time. I mean it's good that they gave Denise the money because it can help her family out, it's just now that future contestants are probably more likely to try to get more money from CBS.

By the way, I think it's pretty ridiculous that the school didn't give her old job back to her. That's really crappy. Hopefully that school gets some negative local publicity from it now.

[Kodos]

I think some season they should just never merge. Or once there is an imbalance in team sizes, the smaller team gets to draft the player they like from the bigger tribe. And to keep teams from taking the best opposing player and voting them off, anyone who gets transferred would get a one round immunity.

[LloydLungs]

Well, this was the first time I really felt the jury vote shifted because of performance at the final tribal council -- Amanda was terrible, ridiculously apologetic. It was sad to watch. I felt like she played the best game heading into the FTC, and she totally screwed it up. Todd and Courtney did pretty well and really swept in and got some votes that could have easily gone to Amanda (i.e. PG's). Great jury, though. One of the few times in Survivor history there was a good jury. Not bitter, some pretty good questions, and voting on the right criteria for the most part.

[LloydLungs]

dola

Originally Posted by Toddzilla

Runners-up in Survivor get $100,000 each, so Amanda and Courtney got paid.

Yeah, but 4th and 7th place get paid too. Not $100,000, but enough to where, cumulatively, James and Denise both took home more than Amanda and Courtney.

[Thomkal]

Originally Posted by LloydLungs

Well, this was the first time I really felt the jury vote shifted because of performance at the final tribal council -- Amanda was terrible, ridiculously apologetic. It was sad to watch. I felt like she played the best game heading into the FTC, and she totally screwed it up. Todd and Courtney did pretty well and really swept in and got some votes that could have easily gone to Amanda (i.e. PG's). Great jury, though. One of the few times in Survivor history there was a good jury. Not bitter, some pretty good questions, and voting on the right criteria for the most part.

I agree with you Lloyd. When Amanda won the final immunity challenge, I thought she had won the game right there. But she was so unhappy and unsure in the final council. And Todd and Courtney were so upbeat and not afraid to say bad things about themselves. I never thought Courtney would get a single vote and she nearly won the game. Todd's playing on JR's ego was fantastic, and has to be considered one of the best Survivor strategic moments ever. If Amanda had gone in there happy and cheerful, and really drove in the point that her getting James voted out was the biggest most important move in the game it might have been a different story for her at the end.

[Racer]

Originally Posted by Thomkal

I agree with you Lloyd. When Amanda won the final immunity challenge, I thought she had won the game right there. But she was so unhappy and unsure in the final council. And Todd and Courtney were so upbeat and not afraid to say bad things about themselves. I never thought Courtney would get a single vote and she nearly won the game. Todd's playing on JR's ego was fantastic, and has to be considered one of the best Survivor strategic moments ever. If Amanda had gone in there happy and cheerful, and really drove in the point that her getting James voted out was the biggest most important move in the game it might have been a different story for her at the end.

I also thought Amanda should have brought up the point that she participated in that one immunity challenge instead of eating hamburgers whereas Courtney and Todd didn't. That seemed like a really big deal to Frosti at the time and might have gotten him to vote for her. I guess it's possible that she did and the editors didn't include it.

Overall, I thought it was a great season with a lot of entertaining personalities and I'm glad the jury wasn't very bitter.

[Joe]

School superintendent says 'Survivor' "lunch lady" lied

Dec 17, 2007, 06:57 PM | by Mike Bruno

Millions sat with their jaws agape waiting to hear who would win $100,000 as Survivor China's most popular contestant on the series' reunion show Sunday night (it was James) -- but perhaps none was more agape than Nancy T. Lane's. Lane is the superintendent of the Douglas Public Schools in Douglas, Mass., and she says that her employee, "lunch lady" contestant Denise Martin, lied on Sunday's live broadcast when she stated that she was not given her job back as a cafeteria worker upon her return from taping the reality show and instead was made to "clean the toilets" as a janitor working night shifts. At the end of the show, host Jeff Probst gave Martin $50,000 on behalf of producer Mark Burnett to help get her life back on track.

"Yeah, I watched my own jaw drop when she said that, because it's absolutely not true," Lane told Hollywood Insider. Lane released a statement on Monday, on the Douglas Public School District website, explaining that Martin was actually promoted to the position as custodian -- a promotion Lane claims Martin asked for herself. Reached for comment, CBS responded: "The comments made by Ms. Martin on the program were compelling and sympathetic. If these statements were misleading or false, we hope that she will take immediate and public steps to clarify her remarks."

Lane's statement says that "Martin held a full-time position as a custodian prior to her participation in the series, and she returned to this same position upon her return from China." The statement continues, "Although Mrs. Martin was a cafeteria employee prior to her selection as a contestant, she asked to be considered for a promotion to full-time custodian, and was promoted to this position on March 30, 2007. This promotion came with additional benefits and a higher salary. Following her leave, she then returned to this same position." Martin has held the new position since August, when she returned from taping the show, up until last week, when she traveled to California for the live Survivor broadcast, according to Lane.

"I can empathize, having been a working mother," Lane said. "It's tough to work those night shifts. But she took the job; that's the job she took leave from [to do Survivor]. If she wants to go back to the day shift, she should apply when one comes open."

Lane says she spoke with Martin on the telephone on Monday afternoon and that the show's fourth-place finisher was apologetic, but that "she did not explain why she said that to my satisfaction," Lane explained. "It's difficult to grasp. We did nothing but encourage her. She took leave for almost three months, she was given additional times off when ever she needed it. Now she says this on national TV.... Douglas is a nice little town. Everybody was rooting for her, the local paper was bending over backwards with positive articles. Then to have it end this way. Talk about a letdown."

Martin was still in California on Monday, but Lane says her job is waiting for her when she comes back home on Friday. "I told her, 'I think we have a few things to go over,'" Lane says. "I might have a few things I'd like to talk about."

http://hollywoodinsider.ew.com/2007/...-superint.html

[Raiders Army]

She should go by the excuse: "I was playing the game!"

[korme]

I'd fire her

[mauchow]

Nah, they won't fire a celebrity. Oh, wait, she will never be a celeb. this situation might turn her into one though. lol Good for her.

[Toddzilla]

What a scumbag - I hope she gets shitcanned and Mark Burnett takes back his money.

[Vinatieri for Prez]

I don't believe Burnett will write her the check after learning that. I actually didn't like her playing the poor me card one bit - have some pride -- but if it turns out to be BS, I hope she ends up in that same or less dead end job the rest of her life.

[Desmond]

Amanda and Denise both had the game in the palms of their hands and just went stupid. Denise is a real good story and should come off as sympathetic but she played a horrible game, and then backed that up with incesent whining. Every chance she had to sway the game in favor, she refused to do so and then cried to whoever had the most power about "friendship" and doing "the right thing", never mind that she stuck it to Pei Ghee pretty awfully more than once. That's the good thing about good reality tv, you can try and mold someone into a certain type of character, but in the end the real person will come out and I just don't think Denise is a very smart or sympathetic person.

And it's been stated alot in this thread but yeah, Amanda totaly fubared the endgame, she was almost a lock until that last council and she just went stupid.

And what the hell is up with the hair and makeup crew at Survivor? The live show looked liked something right out of 1985.

[Kodos]

It was sad. Most of them looked better in the wild.

[Maple Leafs]

I've been late to the game on this season since Mrs. Leafs and I have been days behind on most episode. Here are some quick thoughts on the final few episodes:

- I know Pei Ghee was an interesting character, and her sticking around was necessary to keep the final episodes from being too predictable, but even by Survivor standards some of the challenges were ridiculous. Immunity challenges that are going to won or lost based on your knowledge of Chinese culture? Nobody thinks this might give the Chinese contestant an advantage? I'm all for a little selective challenge here and there -- like choosing a balance challenge if too many women are being voted off -- but at what point should the producers just stop having rigged challenges and simply tell the contestants who's going to win?

- On a similar note, how is that Amanda was allowed to wear that hat in the final challenge? You have a challenge that involves no skill other than the ability to withstand the heat, and the pretty girl is allowed to wear a sombrero? We're all OK with this?

- There's a pretty good chance that nobody in the final six has ever had sex with a woman

- When I'm eventually on this show, and I have a strong position in my alliance towards the end, I'm going to specifically tell my allies not to pick me for any reward challenges. Pick the people at the bottom of the totem pole! Yes, it would be nice to have a pizza and an afternoon of whitewater rafting. It will be better to have a million dollars! What are you thinking? Don't pick me!

- Crap, I turned into Gregg Easterbrook in that last paragraph. Sorry about that.

- Todd gave probably the best final jury performance of all time. His entire game was excellent, what a good player.

- Denise made absolutely the right call by sticking with the final four. If she had jumped to Eric and Pei Ghee she couldn't have finished any better than third (and that's assuming they'd win the tie-breaker -- if they don't she goes out fifth). Instead she chose the path that made her more likely to finish in fourth but gave her a chance to win the whole thing. That's the right call, play to win.

[Maple Leafs]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

I would like to see them add a few different possible twists:

Cool ideas.

Here's one I'd like to see... During tribal council, allow players to vote for anyone they want, including the player with the immunity idol. After the votes are submitted but before they're read, that's when Jeff asks if the person wants to give up immunity. If they have a friend who's in trouble, they can hand it over -- but at the risk that they're now vulnerable. Obviously any votes against the person who winds up with the idol wouldn't count.

The whole "do you want to give up the idol" deal is a waste of time right now. I still don't think you'd see it handed over too often with the twist above, but it would add some new strategy. And it could lead to a great moment where somebody gives up the idol only to find out everyone else voted for them. Oops.

[Joe]

On the CBS "Early Show" today, Denise Martin faced her boss, Douglas Schools Superintendent Nancy T. Lane.

By Andrew Ryan, Globe Staff

Denise Martin, the former lunch lady who claimed she had been demoted to janitor after appearing on “Survivor: China,” acknowledged today that the hard-luck story she told in the reality show finale was not true.

Martin, who works in an elementary school in Douglas, Mass., appeared on the CBS "Early Show'' in a split screen with Schools Superintendent Nancy T. Lane in a segment dubbed "Survivor Scandal." As her voice cracked, Martin confirmed what Lane told the Globe on Monday -- that she had been promoted to a janitorial position before trying out for the show, a job that came with a $10-an-hour pay raise.

"It was not my intention to be misleading," Martin said from studio in Los Angeles. "Nancy has been outstanding to me. She has done everything possible. She has given me the leave of absences to be on the show."

"I'm sorry," Martin continued, sounding as though she was near tears. "And I apologize to everybody. Believe me, I wish none of this had happened. I couldn't say I’m sorry enough."

During the live broadcast of the show's finale Sunday, Martin told viewers she had been demoted from her $7-an-hour job as a lunch lady because she had become too popular at Douglas Intermediate Elementary School.

"They didn't give me my job back," said Martin, 40, who finished fourth in the reality show and missed the $1 million grand prize. "I'm a janitor now. I clean toilets. I wash the floors in the bathroom. I vacuum the kids' rugs."

The producer of "Survivor" responded on live television by surprising Martin with $50,000 to help "get her life back." The story sparked an avalanche of e-mails to Lane and the Douglas public schools, as thousands of viewers blasted the superintendent for being a "Scrooge" and ruining the country. The superintendent said today she was glad Martin acknowledged the truth.

"What I really want to do is make sure the community has a chance to realize that Denise is sorry," said Lane, who appeared from a television studio in New York City. "It really cast a negative light on the whole experience for the entire community. I feel badly for them."

Then the segment's moderator, Julie Chen, asked another question. "Denise, what about the $50,000 you got for what appeared to be a sob story?"

Martin stammered, but didn’t answer. "It was not in my intention," Martin said. "I had no idea I was going to be awarded that."

With eight seconds left in the segment, Chen pushed harder, asking whether she was going to keep the money. Martin shook her head from side to side but never said yes or no.

"I love my town," Martin said. "I love my community. Nancy does a great job."

[Joe]

NEW YORK (AP) — Denise Martin, who gained fame as the lunch lady on CBS' reality show "Survivor: China," is donating the $50,000 she received from producer Mark Burnett to the Elizabeth Glaser Pediatric AIDs Foundation.

Martin told viewers on Sunday night's live finale that she'd been demoted to janitor at a school in Douglas, Mass., after finishing fourth on the show. After hearing her story, Burnett surprised Martin with the money to help get her life back.

On Tuesday, Martin acknowledged on CBS' "The Early Show" that she'd been promoted to custodian, at her own request, before the competition began.

"It was not my intention to be misleading," Martin, 40, said on the broadcast. "I'm sorry, and I apologize to everybody."

In a statement issued Tuesday by the network, Martin said she took "full responsibility" for her actions.

"I do not feel comfortable about accepting the $50,000. I would instead ask that it be donated to the Elizabeth Glaser Pediatric AIDS Foundation," the statement said. "Please accept my apology. I would also like to thank all the people who have supported me through this experience. "

[Raiders Army]

Never trust the mullet. Lesson learned.