NFL Draft thread 2012

[M GO BLUE!!!]

if you open up the execute trades function and make a trade, putting this in your window:

2012 1st Round
2012 2nd Round
2013 1st Round
2014 1st Round

And receive this in return

2012 1st Round

You have surely NOT given up three 1st round pics to get a first round pick. Right?

[Sweed]

Originally Posted by M GO BLUE!!!

if you open up the execute trades function and make a trade, putting this in your window:

2012 1st Round
2012 2nd Round
2013 1st Round
2014 1st Round

And receive this in return

2012 1st Round

You have surely NOT given up three 1st round pics to get a first round pick. Right?

If RGIII were under contract to the Rams wouldn't it be said that Washington traded three first rounders for him?

And to me the draft table would look more like this



2012 1st Round(6)
2012 2nd Round
2013 1st Round(to be determined)
2014 1st Round(tbd)

And receive this in return

2012 1st Round(2)

So yes, they did trade three first round picks + a second round pick for a first round (2) overall.

Sure you can argue they ended up only losing 2 first rounders since they got one back. IMHO though since they traded in essence not for a #1(2) but rather a known player, RGIII, they did actually trade 3-#1s for him. It is no different than if the trade were the same but instead of getting #1(2)RGIII, they had traded for Bradford. Surely people wouldn't argue it was really only two #1 picks since Bradford himself was a #1, would they?

[stevew]

I'm interested to see how RG3 will perform when he's no longer the best athlete on the field by a large margin. Cam was so successful, in part, because he's built like a tank. I don't know if RG3 will be as elusive as Vick, but they share a similar build. Vick has always taken a ton of pounding as well, so RG3 better be durable.

[Grover]

I really think we're all making way too much out of the number of picks traded.

It's a swap of 2012 first rounders, + 2 future first rounders and a 2012 second rounder.

That's it. Nothing more, nothing less. You can call it three first rounders for a first rounder if you want, or call it two first rounders + a second. It's all the same in the end. po-tay-to, po-tah-to.

[fantom1979]

.

[miked]

For those that care...

HUGE run for @M0SAnu in the 40-yard dash ... 4.41!!!! #RFootb


Apparently Sanu went from a 4.52 at the combine to a 4.41 on the pro day. Maybe he helped get himself back in the late 1st or early 2nd after the bad combine.

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by miked

For those that care...

HUGE run for @M0SAnu in the 40-yard dash ... 4.41!!!! #RFootb


Apparently Sanu went from a 4.52 at the combine to a 4.41 on the pro day. Maybe he helped get himself back in the late 1st or early 2nd after the bad combine.

What is his height?

[miked]

6'2" 211. And apparently he was over 4.6 at the combine. Good news for a player who set all kinds of records last season.

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by miked

6'2" 211. And apparently he was over 4.6 at the combine. Good news for a player who set all kinds of records last season.

Yeah that is very impressive speed(4.41) for a player his size. I think if the NFL scouts are buying into the 4.41 speed he will get into the 1st round.

[Logan]

Yeah I didn't expect him to run fast, but the 4.65 at the combine still surprised me. He was considered a late 1st rounder heading into the combine, an early to mid 2nd rounder after, and I think now he'll be back into that original range. He has freakish strength to go along with that speed, and he'll be an awesome interview.

And if you ever need a safety...

[spleen1015]

RG3 looking good at Pro Day!!

[stevew]

Once again, who asked for this bullshit Thursday night draft? It's infuriating.

[albionmoonlight]

Originally Posted by stevew

Once again, who asked for this bullshit Thursday night draft? It's infuriating.

Especially if your team does not pick until late in Round 3.

At least it gives me Thursday and Friday to do something other than watch the draft.

[spleen1015]

Originally Posted by stevew

Once again, who asked for this bullshit Thursday night draft? It's infuriating.

What's so bad about it?

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally Posted by stevew

Once again, who asked for this bullshit Thursday night draft? It's infuriating.

Stop your whining and just deal with it. It's not going anywhere.

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

Especially if your team does not pick until late in Round 3.

At least it gives me Thursday and Friday to do something other than watch the draft.

Doesn't this make it more convenient for you? Instead of having to keep tabs all day Saturday for when the 3rd round starts, you can just start it right up Saturday afternoon!

You're welcome!

[Logan]

Originally Posted by spleen1015

What's so bad about it?

I'll only speak for myself, but it used to be a day where I would wake up, get together with my buddies, eat a bunch of crappy food and drink a bunch of beer. It was enjoyable to just hang out and BS while picks were announced. It's nice to get a full day (or two) of football in the middle of the offseason.

Sure we can meet up after work and do a lot of the same, but with getting out late, having to go in the next day, it's just not the same. I suppose this is something that could benefit me more as I get older, and I won't need to give up a Saturday afternoon that could be better spent doing family stuff. But I don't have kids yet and I have done very little watching of the draft since they made this change, so I'm not sure that would improve for me anyway.

[Kodos]

I vastly preferred the weekend drafts too. Last year, I forgot that the draft was starting on a week day. So I missed the first day.

[QuikSand]

Justin Blackmon has all the markings of a guy who is going to slide a lot further than everyone thought a couple months ago. Still seems possible the Rams take him based on need, but they don't seem to be in love with him, and I don't rule out the possibility he's not even the first receiver taken, which would be a stunner considering 10 weeks ago he was very much in the conversation for "first non franchise QB taken" discussions.

[Blackadar]

I concur with my esteemed colleagues Logan and Kodos. The weekend draft was preferable - we'd throw a little party, have some snacks, a cookout and so forth while watching the names come off the board. Now, on a Thursday night, it's just a struggle to stay up before I have to head to bed and get up to go to work the next day.

[Grover]

I agree with Logan, Kodos and Blackadar. When I worked in supermarket management, I would always take draft weekend off. Always, always looked forward to it.

[sterlingice]

The draft is not on a weekend? (clearly, I'm on the ball!)

SI

[Blackadar]

Originally Posted by QuikSand

Justin Blackmon has all the markings of a guy who is going to slide a lot further than everyone thought a couple months ago. Still seems possible the Rams take him based on need, but they don't seem to be in love with him, and I don't rule out the possibility he's not even the first receiver taken, which would be a stunner considering 10 weeks ago he was very much in the conversation for "first non franchise QB taken" discussions.

I think that's just a bit of the ole' rumor mill prior to the draft. Blackmon is one of those guys whose lack of amazing size (6-1) or amazing speed (low/mid 4.4s) makes it easy to dismiss him and knock him down a few spots. He's not a physical freak like AJ Green or Julio Jones. Then you look at the tape and see a guy who catches everything, comes down with everything, has wonderful body control, runs very good routes and plays "bigger" than he really is. I don't see him falling out of the top 6 because what's on the game tape is pretty amazing.

Then again, none of us were in the room for interviews or anything like that, so there's a lot of info none of us have. We'll find out Thursday.

One guy who everyone thinks is falling is Poe. The tape isn't all that impressive - not nearly like his freakish combine numbers. There's still a chance he could go to KC at 11, but I wouldn't be surprised in the least if he's still on the board at #24 when the Steelers select - and they may pass him up.

[Honolulu_Blue]

Don't get me wrong, I I agree with Logan, Kodos, Blackadar and Grover. I did prefer it the old way, but I accept the new way.

[Logan]

Don't worry, voicing my displeasure on here is the extent of how far I'm fighting it.

I just always find these types of things interesting. Yes, there's a reason why these moves take place. No, I don't know anyone who is now glued to the screen on a Thursday night that wouldn't also be glued to the screen on a Saturday afternoon. Yes, I know plenty where the reverse is true. So where are all those people? Somewhere I guess, where my own anecdotal evidence doesn't reach.

[molson]

I'm sure they wouldn't do it like this if more people weren't watching it in primetime on a weeknight, but I do miss the old days as well. It worked out great because the drunker you got the less attention to the draft you paid. But it was still on and you could perk up if something funny or unusual happened. And there's something about the later rounds of the draft and alcohol that just blended together.

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by Logan

Don't worry, voicing my displeasure on here is the extent of how far I'm fighting it.

I just always find these types of things interesting. Yes, there's a reason why these moves take place. No, I don't know anyone who is now glued to the screen on a Thursday night that wouldn't also be glued to the screen on a Saturday afternoon. Yes, I know plenty where the reverse is true. So where are all those people? Somewhere I guess, where my own anecdotal evidence doesn't reach.

Agree!

Saturday was a day you get together with some of your buddies, have a few drinks and talk football. I really havent figured out what this new way accomplished. Now its like well Thursday isnt the great night to party and its not as much fun to get together for rounds 4th-7 on Saturday when the players are pretty much a mystery and usually arent going to be the gamechangers that get people excited.

[chadritt]

I could see them doing it even if the ratings were lower. JIMGA can probably give more specifics but I remember being taught that ad time on Thursday nights was MUCH higher than on any other night, particularly the weekends. They may still make much more profit even if they lose a bunch of viewers.

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by chadritt

I could see them doing it even if the ratings were lower. JIMGA can probably give more specifics but I remember being taught that ad time on Thursday nights was MUCH higher than on any other night, particularly the weekends. They may still make much more profit even if they lose a bunch of viewers.

They should be more worried about keeping their existing fans happy and getting fans excited for the following season. IMO the extra revenue they may bring in from Thursday nights isnt better than having excited fans waiting for the new year. The draft is the biggest event of the year for some of the crappy teams in the league. Atleast, you have optimism for that brief period of time.

I am certain they have gotten millions of letters about this change and I am also sure that Goodell is such a stubborn fuck that he doesnt care what the fans want.

[spleen1015]

If having Round 1 on Thursday cost the NFL money, they wouldn't keep it there.

[Logan]

I wouldn't be surprised if the move to Thursday cost them money right now. It's reasonable to think that with any sort of move like this, it could take a few years to reach the anticipated viewer base that will result in the improved actual dollars.

[Izulde]

I actually like the Thursday night start. Most people only pay attention to the first and second rounds anyway, and it frees up Saturday to concentrate on other stuff.

[spleen1015]

Originally Posted by Izulde

I actually like the Thursday night start. Most people only pay attention to the first and second rounds anyway, and it frees up Saturday to concentrate on other stuff.

This is me too. I typically have other things that need doing on Saturday, lawn etc.

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by Izulde

I actually like the Thursday night start. Most people only pay attention to the first and second rounds anyway, and it frees up Saturday to concentrate on other stuff.

It would make sense if the majority of the people only really cared about the draft.

It is the event that is now kind of messed up. Saturday used to have house parties and different events up in the twin cities every year that made the entire day just a lot of fun. The NFL just kind of took that away from people that enjoyed the draft for them reasons.

I guess I dont know the actual percentages of who watched the draft for informational purposes and who watched it to party and have a good time but it seemed like a high number enjoyed the party part of the draft.

I guess it works for some people and doesnt for others. Kind of seemed strange to change something that had picked up so much popularity from the way it was being done though.

[Passacaglia]

Originally Posted by Izulde

I actually like the Thursday night start. Most people only pay attention to the first and second rounds anyway, and it frees up Saturday to concentrate on other stuff.

The NFL: Freeing up weekends across America.

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by Passacaglia

The NFL: Freeing up weekends across America.

haha

[JPhillips]

Originally Posted by jbergey22

They should be more worried about keeping their existing fans happy and getting fans excited for the following season. IMO the extra revenue they may bring in from Thursday nights isnt better than having excited fans waiting for the new year. The draft is the biggest event of the year for some of the crappy teams in the league. Atleast, you have optimism for that brief period of time.

I am certain they have gotten millions of letters about this change and I am also sure that Goodell is such a stubborn fuck that he doesnt care what the fans want.

There's not a single fan that cares about the draft, but won't watch in the Fall because the draft started on Thursday. I don't like it, but there's no reason the NFL shouldn't take the extra money they can get from primetime ad rates.

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

There's not a single fan that cares about the draft, but won't watch in the Fall because the draft started on Thursday. I don't like it, but there's no reason the NFL shouldn't take the extra money they can get from primetime ad rates.

Plenty of good reasons but I dont want to get into it.

One of them is the free advertising the NFL gets from the previous Saturday parties. I would be willing to bet that at all of these parties that happened Sat atleast 1 new fan was created. Word of mouth is still the best method of cheap advertising. The more people getting excited about the NFL season the better it is for the NFL. I think we both know the NFL has A LOT of bandwagon fans.

[JPhillips]

I just think that any fan that cares enough to watch the draft isn't going to leave the NFL because the raft started on Thursday. The draft is a fairly hard-core fan only event. Casual fans don't sit around obsessing about who the Rams will take in round 4.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by jbergey22

Plenty of good reasons but I dont want to get into it.

One of them is the free advertising the NFL gets from the previous Saturday parties. I would be willing to bet that at all of these parties that happened Sat atleast 1 new fan was created. Word of mouth is still the best method of cheap advertising. The more people getting excited about the NFL season the better it is for the NFL. I think we both know the NFL has A LOT of bandwagon fans.

Maybe I don't have enough friends but I've never been invited to or considered hosting a draft party

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by Lathum

Maybe I don't have enough friends but I've never been invited to or considered hosting a draft party

A friend of mine would have one every year and was very upset when it was changed. He tried to have one on Thursday but the interest just wasnt there anymore.

They have these get togethers though at the Vikings practice facility and they probably have some things in Seattle where fans of the teams get together for some sort of team sponsored party.

[SteveMax58]

Originally Posted by jbergey22

Plenty of good reasons but I dont want to get into it.

One of them is the free advertising the NFL gets from the previous Saturday parties. I would be willing to bet that at all of these parties that happened Sat atleast 1 new fan was created. Word of mouth is still the best method of cheap advertising. The more people getting excited about the NFL season the better it is for the NFL. I think we both know the NFL has A LOT of bandwagon fans.

+1

I think the part thats lost here is that ANY time you can have people spend a day organizing & socializing because of your business...you are creating a tradition/buzz that will attract people who aren't even fans. People like reasons to celebrate...its why Cinco de Mayo just works. And I'm sorry, if the NFL only sees revenues from advertising on Thursday nights as their only mechanism to get revenue from the draft...then I think they should get new business analysts because there are massive amounts of money to be made when you have a yearly "party day" because of your particular sport/business.

The Super Bowl is obviously an example of a "party day" but the draft was also in my circle of friends & family, and I suspect many others. Certainly not as big as the Super Bowl but it was a day we spent hanging out, talking football, eating & drinking. By the end of the 2nd round or early 3rd, people start trickling out, so there's absolutely no reason for us to get together on Saturday for the purpose of the draft.

I guess what I'm saying is...if you have a party day for your sport (or even 2 or more of them)...thats a better thing for you financially as your audience will be much bigger than only the people interested in the draft itself. And if the NFL doesn't see that, it doesn't mean the end of the NFL...it just means they are not capitalizing or identifying the bigger picture, imho.

[Blackadar]

Originally Posted by SteveMax58

+1

I think the part thats lost here is that ANY time you can have people spend a day organizing & socializing because of your business...you are creating a tradition/buzz that will attract people who aren't even fans. People like reasons to celebrate...its why Cinco de Mayo just works. And I'm sorry, if the NFL only sees revenues from advertising on Thursday nights as their only mechanism to get revenue from the draft...then I think they should get new business analysts because there are massive amounts of money to be made when you have a yearly "party day" because of your particular sport/business.

The Super Bowl is obviously an example of a "party day" but the draft was also in my circle of friends & family, and I suspect many others. Certainly not as big as the Super Bowl but it was a day we spent hanging out, talking football, eating & drinking. By the end of the 2nd round or early 3rd, people start trickling out, so there's absolutely no reason for us to get together on Saturday for the purpose of the draft.

I guess what I'm saying is...if you have a party day for your sport (or even 2 or more of them)...thats a better thing for you financially as your audience will be much bigger than only the people interested in the draft itself. And if the NFL doesn't see that, it doesn't mean the end of the NFL...it just means they are not capitalizing or identifying the bigger picture, imho.

I don't know if they are or aren't. This is Goodell's NFL, where everything is done for the best corporate spin/benefit. So I think they probably have analyzed this to death and this is probably the "best" decision for the NFL.

One of my thoughts was that - like the World Series - this is too late for younger fans to see. Then I realized that most younger fans aren't going to watch a program where names are being called off the board. That's not the audience for this. It's boring. So I don't think there is any bigger picture or larger audience when it comes to the draft. The people who care and will watch it are already NFL fans. The games are for attracting younger/casual fans, not the draft. That's just my opinion, I could be wrong.

I'll miss my Draft Cookouts, but my guess is that this is the best decision for the NFL. Even if it's not the best decision for me.

[SteveMax58]

Originally Posted by Blackadar

I'll miss my Draft Cookouts, but my guess is that this is the best decision for the NFL. Even if it's not the best decision for me.

See, thats kinda my point on it. You and your circle won't be engaging in the cookout & socialization, which presumably includes friends/wives/kids/general people who are there to hang out with you more than they are there to discuss the 40 time of the #29 pick.

I guess I see all of the Doritos branded with "NFL Draft" logos, Pepsi advertising to buy the "NFL Draft Beverage of Choice", and all of the other products that will want to put the NFL logo on their product to sell in anticipation of increased consumerism for the draft.

You're right, casual fans/non-fans won't watch intently for the draft picks. But thats a wash either way since Thursday night is only going to be the more hardcore NFL fans anyway. But the casual fans would be engaging in the consuming of products because they are there for the social atmosphere.

IDK...I just see many other revenue streams beyond the TV commercials for an event that only hardcore fans would watch by themselves. Plus...I miss it & want to whine about it.

[spleen1015]

My experience is pretty much the opposite. I look forward to watching the draft every year, but none of my friends care about it, even the ones who play fantasy football.

My wife makes fun of me for watching it. She doesn't understand what is so appealing. You're watching a guy call names. You're watching so called experts give opinions that have a good possibility of being wrong in the long run.

I like it for the moments like the Eagles takes McNabb and all of the Philly fans losing their minds. I watch it to see Brady Quinn sitting uncomfortably in the Green Room because he hasn't been picked.

[jbergey22]

I wonder if Jon would be kind enough to post us some NFL draft TV ratings from say 1985-2012.

I know they were down 17 percent last year but that was after setting the all time high in 2012.

[BillJasper]

Watching the Baylor/Oklahoma State game, Griiffen is lucky this isn't the only available film of him or else he'd go undrafted.

[Ronnie Dobbs2]

Just realized to Gosselin mock tomorrow as he's now a columnist:

Discussed in the chat here

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by jbergey22

I wonder if Jon would be kind enough to post us some NFL draft TV ratings from say 1985-2012.

I know they were down 17 percent last year but that was after setting the all time high in 2012.

About as far back as I've found are some references like this:
-- 2010 was the high water mark as you mentioned with a little over 8m viewers on the two networks combined ... down about 18% in 2011

--But 2010
saw a 30% increase over 2009, and a nearly 55% increase over 2008.

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

About as far back as I've found are some references like this:
-- 2010 was the high water mark as you mentioned with a little over 8m viewers on the two networks combined ... down about 18% in 2011

--But 2010
saw a 30% increase over 2009, and a nearly 55% increase over 2008.

Interesting, thank you.

[Kodos]

I might just record it and watch on Saturday anyhow.