2009 MLB Regular Season Thread

[MikeVic]

It would have to be a great deal for Halladay for me to not hate J.P.

[lungs]

You all like your Canadian players in Canada? The Brewers have plenty of Canadians in the system including two pretty good prospects (Brett Lawrie could probably be called almost blue chip). Taylor Green also being a pretty darn good 3rd base prospect.

I'm guessing any talks would have to start with Alcides Escobar, as much as that makes me cringe. I'd rather send JJ Hardy, but 6 years of Escobar is probably more valuable than 1.5 years of JJ Hardy

[Ksyrup]

Fielder will soon be overpriced and should be traded, but now is probably not the right time to do it.

[lungs]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

Fielder will soon be overpriced and should be traded, but now is probably not the right time to do it.

He signed a two year contract before the season that is pretty reasonable. He'll have one year of arbitration left after this contract is up. No big hurry there. Now is definitely not the time.

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by Logan

When a PTBNL is included in a deal, both teams agree on a list of players that the receiving team will be able to select from down the road. So it won't matter how Freel performs.

Not quite. Sometimes teams will have different "pools" of a couple players, and depending on the performance or games played/started of Freel in this case, that team would get the option of picking between a different level of prospect.

It is doubtful that Freel's performance will matter, but if he ends up being a starter for the rest of the year it could be along the lines of a B-/C+ prospect instead of complete filler.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by MikeVic

It would have to be a great deal for Halladay for me to not hate J.P.

they said on sports center that the price is "total of 5-6 prospects including the top 2 in your system, one of whom is preferably a pitcher that Toronto could control for several more years."

with $22m due to him before the end of next year that's a steep price and i don't think he gets dealt

[Young Drachma]

Dear JP:

Fuck you.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

they said on sports center that the price is "total of 5-6 prospects including the top 2 in your system, one of whom is preferably a pitcher that Toronto could control for several more years."

with $22m due to him before the end of next year that's a steep price and i don't think he gets dealt

There's no way.

Teams value their prospects way to much to see a deal like that happen. I can see 3-4 prospects with one of them being an elite prospect happening, but that's about it. People as stupid as Bill Bavasi are rare and its even more rare that their team actually has prospects worth trading. JP should just ask for eleventy billion dollars.

[miami_fan]

Ryan Demspter

Chicago Cubs send Ryan Dempster to 15-day disabled list - ESPN Chicago

CHICAGO -- Just when the Chicago Cubs figured they were getting healthy, a freak accident landed right-hander Ryan Dempster on the disabled list with a fracture of his big right toe. He could be out for up to a month.

Dempster was hopping over the dugout railing to go on the field and celebrate Sunday's victory over the Milwaukee Brewers when he caught his back leg on the railing and landed hard, injuring his toe. An X-ray taken Tuesday revealed the non-displaced fracture.

"It's not pretty. It's pretty ugly right now," Dempster said.

Dempster had been scheduled to pitch Tuesday night against Atlanta and said he hoped he would only miss three starts, including one after the All-Star break.

But manager Lou Piniella said that was an optimistic view and that after talking with trainer Mark O'Neal, Dempster could miss up to three weeks and maybe a month.

"I was coming out of the dugout, stepping over the top of the railing there, sitting up on the ledge, and caught my left foot on the rail as I was coming over and it spun me around and slammed me into the ground," Dempster said.

"When I did it, I thought I just ripped my nail back on my foot. ... My foot I guess just the way it hit came down straight into the ground."

Dempster had planned to numb up his toe and make the start Tuesday, but decided to get an X-ray to make sure everything was OK.

"You never want to do anything like this," said Dempster, a 17-game winner last season.

"It's a weird thing. Three days before that I took a ball off the shin and kick-saved one to myself. And I took a ball off my face in batting practice, off the cage, and I was just fine. And then something as simple as that happens and I put myself on the DL."

The Cubs recalled right-hander Kevin Hart from Triple-A Iowa, one day after he'd been optioned back to the minors, and plan to put him in the rotation. He'll start Wednesday against the Braves.

Carlos Zambrano, on three days rest, made the start Tuesday night in Dempster's place.

"We were healthy for a day," Piniella said. On Monday, the Cubs had activated Aramis Ramirez, Reed Johnson and Angel Guzman off the disabled list. And now they've put one of their most reliable pitchers right back on.

"Dempster is sick about this and so am I," Pinella said. "It's something you never expect to happen. Just a freak thing."

Dempster is 5-5 with a 4.09 ERA in 17 starts for the Cubs this season. He made the switch back to starter last season after being the Cubs' closer for three years. He went 17-6 with a 2.96 ERA in 33 starts and was picked for the All-Star team in 2008.

Now he's got to get treatment and stay in shape. He'll have another X-ray right after the All-Star break.

"I was just going out to celebrate the win," he said. "It's unfortunate, but at the same time, it's a small little injury. Hopefully the time will be minimal and I'll be back and ready to go."

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Atocep

There's no way.

Teams value their prospects way to much to see a deal like that happen. I can see 3-4 prospects with one of them being an elite prospect happening, but that's about it. People as stupid as Bill Bavasi are rare and its even more rare that their team actually has prospects worth trading. JP should just ask for eleventy billion dollars.

that was my thought too, but it was whoever sportscenter's big baseball guy is (might have been olney, maybe one of the others...was only half-listening to the intro bit). and it was "word out of toronto is..." so it's not like that was just hypothesizing

[miked]

Seems like the Sox would be a good fit. Dice-K sucks, Smoltz sucks, Wakefield is average, and if they're going to let Bucholz rot in AAA, they might as well package him with a few others to get Halladay.

[larrymcg421]

Gotta love asking your hottest hitter to sac bunt.

Oh wait. No, you don't gotta love that at all.

[Big Fo]

At least they gave Vazquez enough run support tonight.

[Crapshoot]

Originally Posted by larrymcg421

Gotta love asking your hottest hitter to sac bunt.

Oh wait. No, you don't gotta love that at all.

That's Dusty for you.

[Ksyrup]

I really don't think the Halladay thing is that much news. Unless they do a deal that suggests otherwise, they aren't trading Halladay unless they get half a farm system in return. So yeah, they would listen to offers and consider trading him, but only if you pay such a steep price that JP would be stupid NOT to take it. There are probably a half-dozen REAL untouchables in MLB right now that the same thing JP said today would not apply to, no matter the offer. Everyone else is available for a price, even if that price is ridiculously and prohibitively high.

[DeToxRox]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

I really don't think the Halladay thing is that much news. Unless they do a deal that suggests otherwise, they aren't trading Halladay unless they get half a farm system in return. So yeah, they would listen to offers and consider trading him, but only if you pay such a steep price that JP would be stupid NOT to take it. There are probably a half-dozen REAL untouchables in MLB right now that the same thing JP said today would not apply to, no matter the offer. Everyone else is available for a price, even if that price is ridiculously and prohibitively high.

That leads me to the question, who are the absolute untouchables in baseball today?

Pujols is obviously #1 on the list. Tim Linecum is probably on that list. Justin Morneau (after signing his new deal) is probably on that list. Miguel Cabrera is probably on that list. Dustin Pedroia is probably on that list.

I am having a hard time off the top of my head trying to think who is absolutely untouchable.

[k0ruptr]

Mauer?

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by DeToxRox

That leads me to the question, who are the absolute untouchables in baseball today?

Pujols is obviously #1 on the list. Tim Linecum is probably on that list. Justin Morneau (after signing his new deal) is probably on that list. Miguel Cabrera is probably on that list. Dustin Pedroia is probably on that list.

I am having a hard time off the top of my head trying to think who is absolutely untouchable.

I seriously doubt the Wilpons would let David Wright go for anything, including Pujols.

[Crapshoot]

I think the list is:

1. Pujols
2. Lincecum
3. Jeter/Mariano (not in terms of value - in terms of the Yankees actually trading him)
4. Wright
5. Dan Haren (The D-Backs have him signed cheaply for 6 years; not going to happen)

[stevew]

Mauer-connection to region, position, skill level

[stevew]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

they said on sports center that the price is "total of 5-6 prospects including the top 2 in your system, one of whom is preferably a pitcher that Toronto could control for several more years."

with $22m due to him before the end of next year that's a steep price and i don't think he gets dealt

Obviously Toronto needs to hold out for value, but I can't see them getting that much in return for 16 months of a guy.

[lungs]

Ryan Braun is untouchable unless another untouchable is had in return.

[Ksyrup]

Yeah, young guys - especially pitchers - locked into good deals are probably untouchable. I'd definitely add Longoria to the list.

[DeToxRox]

Yea I knew I forgot a few. I would say there are probably 10 to 12 truly untouchables.

[Ksyrup]

I know it wouldn't happen - because it would look like a salary dump and no team would be stupid enough to do it - but if the Jays are really intent on trading Halladay and can't find anyone to give them the top-shelf talent they want, why not try packaging him with Vernon Wells? I can't believe the ridiculousness of the contract they gave him. It's basically structured like an NFL contract (goes from like $12M in 2010 to $23M in 2011), except they can't just cut him and not pay. Getting out from underneath that contract might be worth more than several guys who, if they become stars early on, are going to need to be paid at the same time Wells is going to be taking up around $20-$23M of salary for 4 straight years.

I doubt they could sell it to fans, and no team would do it, but I'd consider at least floating the idea if teams aren't willing to give up what they want.

[Ronnie Dobbs2]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

and no team would do it

I think this is the main part. I can't really think of a team, possibly excluding the Yankees, who would consider this.

[SackAttack]

Originally Posted by lungs

You all like your Canadian players in Canada? The Brewers have plenty of Canadians in the system including two pretty good prospects (Brett Lawrie could probably be called almost blue chip). Taylor Green also being a pretty darn good 3rd base prospect.

I'm guessing any talks would have to start with Alcides Escobar, as much as that makes me cringe. I'd rather send JJ Hardy, but 6 years of Escobar is probably more valuable than 1.5 years of JJ Hardy

Lawrie can rake.

He looked a bit shaky with the glove when I saw him against the Timber Rattlers a week or two ago, though. He made...what was it, three errors?

In a game where his starting pitcher took a no-hitter into the 7th or 8th inning, and the Rattlers rallied for a 9th inning victory.

[lungs]

Originally Posted by SackAttack

Lawrie can rake.

He looked a bit shaky with the glove when I saw him against the Timber Rattlers a week or two ago, though. He made...what was it, three errors?

In a game where his starting pitcher took a no-hitter into the 7th or 8th inning, and the Rattlers rallied for a 9th inning victory.

Did you happen to see Wily Peralta pitch? He's going to be a good pitcher.

[Logan]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

I really don't think the Halladay thing is that much news. Unless they do a deal that suggests otherwise, they aren't trading Halladay unless they get half a farm system in return. So yeah, they would listen to offers and consider trading him, but only if you pay such a steep price that JP would be stupid NOT to take it. There are probably a half-dozen REAL untouchables in MLB right now that the same thing JP said today would not apply to, no matter the offer. Everyone else is available for a price, even if that price is ridiculously and prohibitively high.

I think Halladay is a good enough pitcher that you could still get a great package for him a year from now as a rental, and it will probably be only slightly worse than what you get for him today with 1.5 years on his deal. We all know Toronto isn't getting six guys back for him. Maybe today they can net one A+ prospect, an A- prospect, and 2 Bs...but next year they can probably get that one A+ guy plus the 2 Bs.

If I'm Toronto and have to deal with my fanbase, that one extra really good prospect is worth taking one last shot with Halladay at the helm in 2010 plus not alienating my revenue stream.

[DeToxRox]

So I am sure a lot of you know that Magglio Ordonez sucks this season and has benchmarks in his contract that make him 18 mil next year. They are 135 games played or 560 AB (I believe that's the #)

At one point Magglio was benched for a few days to clear his head which Boras was pissed about, and now, Magglio is being platooned, only playing vs lefties. He has at I believe 250 - 260 AB right now, but if he plays just vs lefties for even a month he is probably not going to hit his triggers, and hell, even then if he is close he still will probably be cut by August if he isn't producing.

Anyway, except some drama from Detroit in the coming months. This is gonna be a fun, fun ride with Boras and Leyland.

I think Detroit is smart; see if he can do anything at all before you cut him for good. If he picks it up and becomes a legit middle of the order player like he was last year, then fine, bite the bullet for next year if you can win the AL Central. If you can win the AL Central without him, then obviously you cut him loose, and if you're not going to win, it's a no brainer.

However it goes, it'll be ugly though.

[MizzouRah]

Here's a trade, the Cardinals farm club for Halladay.

WS here we come baby!

I drool thinking of this rotation:

Carpenter
Halladay
Wainwright
Lohse
Piniero

[Atocep]

Its nice to see that the knee injury didn't mess with Ollie's pin-point control.

[Chief Rum]

So last year, (Ervin) Santana was naturally throwing in the mid-90s. This season, after his arm issues, he's throwing 92-93. Everyone's saying he's pitching great, no pain all the confidence. But he's getting smacked around...again! Look, don't BS a BSer, ya know? I don't want to see Ervin out there unless his fastball's hitting the speed it's supposed to be hitting--or someone at least acknowledge he's not the same pitcher right now that he was last year.

We really need to pursue these SP options that are out there. Lackey has been hit or miss, see above on Santana, Saunders has over a 5.00 ERA over the last two months, and Escobar is pretty much done for the season.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

So last year, (Ervin) Santana was naturally throwing in the mid-90s. This season, after his arm issues, he's throwing 92-93. Everyone's saying he's pitching great, no pain all the confidence. But he's getting smacked around...again! Look, don't BS a BSer, ya know? I don't want to see Ervin out there unless his fastball's hitting the speed it's supposed to be hitting--or someone at least acknowledge he's not the same pitcher right now that he was last year.

We really need to pursue these SP options that are out there. Lackey has been hit or miss, see above on Santana, Saunders has over a 5.00 ERA over the last two months, and Escobar is pretty much done for the season.

From what Will Carroll was saying in spring training its just a matter of time before he has to be shut down for Tommy John surgery. He's pitching through the same injury Liriano tried to pitch through (difference being his elbow gave out in the 1st start after rehab). It comes down to when the ligament gives out. I can only assume the Angels are doing it because of the other injury problems they've had this season because I'd rather have him healthy for a full season next year than give me a bad year this year (or however long he makes it) and then have to shut him down for most, if not all, of next season.

It sucks to see. He pitched lights out last season and looked like he was ready to be a cy young candidate for the next several years.

[SackAttack]

Originally Posted by SackAttack

Lawrie can rake.

He looked a bit shaky with the glove when I saw him against the Timber Rattlers a week or two ago, though. He made...what was it, three errors?

In a game where his starting pitcher took a no-hitter into the 7th or 8th inning, and the Rattlers rallied for a 9th inning victory.

Originally Posted by lungs

Did you happen to see Wily Peralta pitch? He's going to be a good pitcher.

I'm actually wrong. It wasn't Lawrie I was thinking of. It was Josh Vitters I was describing above. Lawrie can rake, too, but he appears to be a better defender than Vitters.

Both of those guys are going to be good major league hitters.

Peralta started that game for Appleton, and yeah, he's incredible. He went pitch for pitch with Peoria's Christopher Archer for the first 3-4 innings. He ended up giving up two hits. Archer didn't allow any, as it turns out; the guy who gave up the first hit of the game was a reliever who came in in the 6th (but I think he gave up his first hit in the 7th).

[stevew]

Originally Posted by DeToxRox

So I am sure a lot of you know that Magglio Ordonez sucks this season and has benchmarks in his contract that make him 18 mil next year. They are 135 games played or 560 AB (I believe that's the #)

At one point Magglio was benched for a few days to clear his head which Boras was pissed about, and now, Magglio is being platooned, only playing vs lefties. He has at I believe 250 - 260 AB right now, but if he plays just vs lefties for even a month he is probably not going to hit his triggers, and hell, even then if he is close he still will probably be cut by August if he isn't producing.

Anyway, except some drama from Detroit in the coming months. This is gonna be a fun, fun ride with Boras and Leyland.

I think Detroit is smart; see if he can do anything at all before you cut him for good. If he picks it up and becomes a legit middle of the order player like he was last year, then fine, bite the bullet for next year if you can win the AL Central. If you can win the AL Central without him, then obviously you cut him loose, and if you're not going to win, it's a no brainer.

However it goes, it'll be ugly though.

The pirates have a similar drama with Freddy Sanchez. He's producing and is an all star. But he has an 8m vesting option with 600 plate appearences. 8m isn't horrible for a producing player, but you're talking pirate dollars and that's approx 14% of the payroll budget for the year.

I think it's pretty unavoidable he will trigger the option, which is unfortunate since they really would be better off spending that money on the draft and latin america.

[DaddyTorgo]

11 wins for wakefield

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

11 wins for wakefield

Never has their been a better demonstration of how relatively meaningless wins are in determining how good a pitcher is. 4.31 ERA with 6.6(!) runs scored per game in support. Tip your hat to the Boston offense for 11 wins, not Tim Wakefield.

[Ksyrup]

Originally Posted by stevew

The pirates have a similar drama with Freddy Sanchez. He's producing and is an all star.

Then it's not similar. Ordonez sucks this year, and regardless of what Boras says, it is entirely appropriate for the Tigers to sit him. Actually, instead of platooning him and making him barely miss his incentives, they could just cut him and achieve the same thing, and there's not a thing Boras could do about it. He no longer hits for power and isn't that great in the OF. He's a sunk cost, and one you don't want to pay next year (when they'll still be paying Nate Robertson, Bonderman, and Dontrelle about $30M+, I think).

[miked]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

Never has their been a better demonstration of how relatively meaningless wins are in determining how good a pitcher is. 4.31 ERA with 6.6(!) runs scored per game in support. Tip your hat to the Boston offense for 11 wins, not Tim Wakefield.

Well, to be fair, he did manage to scatter 10 hits in 6 innings while only allowing 3 runs. That's hard to do for a Boston pitcher not named Beckett these days

Or you can thank their ridiculous pen where the highest ERA is like 3.50 or something.

[Big Fo]

Awesome play by Daniel Murphy last night, even if the runner might have been safe. Maybe the best I've seen all season.

[ISiddiqui]

Yeah, that defensive play was top notch. I couldn't believe Murphy made that play.

[Ksyrup]

LOL Andruw matched last year's HR total (and probably nearly matched his hit total!) in one game last night. LA really should have some sort of recourse against a guy who was that out of shape and completely shit the bed last year.

[larrymcg421]

Andruw has a higher OPS than any other Braves starter.

[Logan]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

Yeah, that defensive play was top notch. I couldn't believe Murphy made that play.

Baseball Video Highlights & Clips | LAD@NYM: Murphy makes a heads-up flip for the out - Video | MLB.com: Multimedia

Warning, they inexplicably show Joe Torre running forever.

[kingfc22]

Lincecum making his final push to start the All-Star game tonight. So far so good.

[kingfc22]

Bah! No-hitter broken up in the top of the 7th.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Another yuck outing by Mike Gonzalez, with a walk, an HBP, and a pinch hit double by Garrett Atkins to give the Rockies an eventual 7-6 win over Atlanta, the Braves fourth loss in the last six games.

editing to revise stats from the AJC article "Gonzalez (3-2) has a 10.29 ERA and .308 opponents’ average in his past eight appearances, with eight hits, eight runs and four walks allowed in seven innings."

[Crapshoot]

Originally Posted by kingfc22

Bah! No-hitter broken up in the top of the 7th.

That was an annoying fucking inning, but he clearly had lost it right there.

[kingfc22]

Originally Posted by Crapshoot

That was an annoying fucking inning, but he clearly had lost it right there.

Yep, once he gave up the hit it seemed like his focus was gone and the next thing you know the Pads put together a couple bloop hits and some walks for 3 runs.