Alright Boyz, 'ere we go... WAAAAAAGGGGHHH!!! (The Blood Bowl Impressions Thread) - Page 5

Axxon · 07-04-2009, 01:01 PM

I just found a flaw in the campaign and I have a question about same campaign.

If you don't choose any players at the start you can choose "Improve team value to 0 and you'll get 32000 for the goal. You only get 35000 for improving fan factor to 10 and only 43000 for First in table. I'd think this is a pretty big issue.

My question is about Rankings. You get more money for finishing 14th 22,000 than 1st 1000 leading me to believe they rank from 14 ( top ) to 1 ( worst ) but in game rankings seem to go the other way. What's up with that?

chinaski · 07-04-2009, 01:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Axxon

I just found a flaw in the campaign and I have a question about same campaign.

If you don't choose any players at the start you can choose "Improve team value to 0 and you'll get 32000 for the goal. You only get 35000 for improving fan factor to 10 and only 43000 for First in table. I'd think this is a pretty big issue.

My question is about Rankings. You get more money for finishing 14th 22,000 than 1st 1000 leading me to believe they rank from 14 ( top ) to 1 ( worst ) but in game rankings seem to go the other way. What's up with that?

The ranking payout is actually not your teams win rank, but how many times your players and team appears on the seasons stat ranking in the #1 position. Aka, player with most interceptions, team with highest attendance etc. 14 would be total domination of the season basically.

aran · 07-04-2009, 01:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Honolulu_Blue

I play the humans as well. I've played 6 or 7 games so far. I tend to run the offense aran described, relying on my blitzers to be very agressive in opening up holes and relying on my throwers and catchers for the offense. So far, it's worked extremely well. I'm 4-1-1, with my only loss coming against a skaven team that totally caught me unprepared. I was able to make adjustments in the second game against them and made sure I didn't lose track of their gutter runners.

My offense is pretty much entirely funneled through my catcher (he has a +1 movement and has scored more than half of my touchdowns). The rest of the offense goes through the blitzers, since they tend to be around the ball a lot and act as a combination of linebackers and running backs.

I purchased an Ogre, simply 'cause I like the big fellas. He gained a level after his first game and got a +1 strength. I am really enjoying that.

I didn't start with an ogre. Maybe that was a problem. I was aiming for flexibility, so I went with 4 blitzers, 2 catchers, 1 thrower, 4 linemen.

The linemen have to double team opponents in order to get reasonable dice, which wastes a lot of manpower. I guess that's why you pick up the ogre. You need someone to absorb a beating in the middle and keep their stronger players occupied.

I wasn't forming good walls as humans. I'd concentrate too many of my linemen in one place trying to stack the odds in my favor.

Maybe I should go back to orcs.

Axxon · 07-04-2009, 01:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chinaski

The ranking payout is actually not your teams win rank, but how many times your players and team appears on the seasons stat ranking in the #1 position. Aka, player with most interceptions, team with highest attendance etc. 14 would be total domination of the season basically.

Thanks!!!

Honolulu_Blue · 07-04-2009, 02:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aran

I didn't start with an ogre. Maybe that was a problem. I was aiming for flexibility, so I went with 4 blitzers, 2 catchers, 1 thrower, 4 linemen.

The linemen have to double team opponents in order to get reasonable dice, which wastes a lot of manpower. I guess that's why you pick up the ogre. You need someone to absorb a beating in the middle and keep their stronger players occupied.

I wasn't forming good walls as humans. I'd concentrate too many of my linemen in one place trying to stack the odds in my favor.

Maybe I should go back to orcs.

I didn't start with an ogre either. I didn't pick him up until the second tournament. The ogres are a bit of a risk. The bone head flaw makes them suspect and they also lack the "block" skill. That said, I enjoy having one on the team and it has helped me anchor the middle of the field more often than not.

aran · 07-04-2009, 02:09 PM

I find that the BB tabletop mechanics are solid and enjoyable and that almost all the annoyances I've had have been Cyanide having poor English localization, a weak interface, unnecessarily detailed graphics, and a hyperactive camera. I wish they would've spent more time making the game more of a pleasure to play--I think that the part of the game that Cyanide worked on is not worth $50, though the BB tabletop rules implemented with reasonable AI is worth most of the money.

Eaglesfan27 · 07-04-2009, 02:35 PM

Turning off the hyperactive camera (by hitting escape at the beginning of each game) is a necessity to my enjoyment of the game.

thesloppy · 07-04-2009, 03:13 PM

Yeah, I too turn off the auto camera immediately, turned off the commentary after two games, don't like the slow-mo replays, and detest the long loading times that are probably a result of all the other attempts at eye candy.

MacroGuru · 07-04-2009, 04:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MacroGuru

Hooked is all I can say.

I am running a campaign with a Human team, I won the first cup I played without a loss, and I have yet to lose...however I have a draw with my first game.

I am an open offense, not afraid to pass and I try to strike quick. I have noticed the computer also goes into a stall tactic offense when they are up by 1, which makes it even harder to get the ball back.

Well, I will be playing my 2nd cup championship game tonight and I think I will end up losing this one. The playoff game I played against the Skaven decimated my team.

I lost my lvl 4 catcher who leads the league with 10 TD's and I have 3 players that will miss this next game and I do not have enough cash to buy the mercs to give me an extra player or two for the game, so I will be entering the game against the orcs with just the 11 players needed to play.

I wanted to throw my laptop when the catcher was killed.

chinaski · 07-04-2009, 04:12 PM

arg, just played a random game on line with my 1000 skaven vs 1000 orc team....I got totally decimated.... by the 12th turn i had no players left.. NONE! lol

I now hate skaven, im done with them for good. He killed 2 players, knocked out 6 for my next game and took stats away from 3. yowsa.

BYU 14 · 07-04-2009, 04:16 PM

I have avoided deaths so far, pretty much because Dwarves are so rugged I suppose and my Apothocary has saved 2 deaths, including my best runner Walik Swiftfoot.

Still having problems with Orcs and have lost 2 of 3 to them in competition. The one game I did win I lead 2-0 at the half after getting two turnovers deep in their side. Thought I had it made, but it ended 2-1 and they had the ball at the end and just ran out of time.

Also pulled off a rarity for a Dwarf team, a comeback from a 2-0 down by hitting a hail mary on the last play of the game that required a team reroll and a reroll from the thrower using his pro skill to win 3-2.

This game is already in my top 3 ever for fun factor.

Eaglesfan27 · 07-04-2009, 04:25 PM

I just finished a championship game in the 2nd tourney with my orcs against some dwarves. I was worried because they hired a star player for the game, and I was even more worried when he took down my bashing troll on the 1st turn with a serious injury. However, I got 3 orcs around him and then my strongest black rock orc hit him and caused a serious injury to knock him out. Made me laugh to know they probably wasted a few hundred grand on him. We took control after that and won the match 2-0.

Calis · 07-04-2009, 04:42 PM

I've deifinitely noticed in my Chaos campaign that I'm blowing past the CPU teams in terms of total team value. It seems like I'm giving up 400+k a game to them, so it's always a star player and an extra reroll or two. Sure makes things interesting.

It sure seems like the AI doesn't utilize the star players very well though. They treat them basically as a line of scrimmage lineman which they're usually pretty good at it, but seems like a bit of a waste. I've yet to really worry about one.

thesloppy · 07-04-2009, 05:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Calis

I've deifinitely noticed in my Chaos campaign that I'm blowing past the CPU teams in terms of total team value. It seems like I'm giving up 400+k a game to them, so it's always a star player and an extra reroll or two. Sure makes things interesting.

Chaos teams seem to have the cash....in my human campaign I'm always hurting for money, to the point where I've started fielding a 9 man team, using 2 freebie linemen and pocketing the savings. I've got an upcoming game against a chaos team, and clicked on their team to take a peek....they had over a MILLION dollars in cash, and a 15 person team. Youch.

Conversely, I'm playing like my 40th game last night, and somehow play my first ever game against a goblin team. Haven't been avoiding them (like the wood elves) just somehow never played against them......oooooh, those little fellas went down like 11 folding chairs, that was fun!

Calis · 07-04-2009, 05:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thesloppy

Chaos teams seem to have the cash....in my human campaign I'm always hurting for money, to the point where I've started fielding a 9 man team, using 2 freebie linemen and pocketing the savings. I've got an upcoming game against a chaos team, and clicked on their team to take a peek....they had over a MILLION dollars in cash, and a 15 person team. Youch.

Conversely, I'm playing like my 40th game last night, and somehow play my first ever game against a goblin team. Haven't been avoiding them (like the wood elves) just somehow never played against them......oooooh, those little fellas went down like 11 folding chairs, that was fun!

Yeah I think maybe it's a benefit to having a pretty resilient team. I don't think I've had anyone die yet in the first three tournaments, and not even anyone injured beyond one game, so apart from buying 2 backups just in case I've spent everything on rerolls, so I'm up to 6 now.

I did just start my first tournament with Lizards and Elves involved. Get a nice little jump in difficulty after playing the same three guys over and over the first few tourneys. Lizards were the first team that really outbashed me. With 6 4 strength Sauruses, a 5(?) strength big guy, and another 5(?) strength star player they really had their way with me the first half. I was eventually able to pound their skinks enough though that they had no one to reliably move the ball and I eked out an ugly and painful draw.

thesloppy · 07-04-2009, 05:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Axxon

I just found a flaw in the campaign and I have a question about same campaign.

If you don't choose any players at the start you can choose "Improve team value to 0 and you'll get 32000 for the goal. You only get 35000 for improving fan factor to 10 and only 43000 for First in table. I'd think this is a pretty big issue.

My question is about Rankings. You get more money for finishing 14th 22,000 than 1st 1000 leading me to believe they rank from 14 ( top ) to 1 ( worst ) but in game rankings seem to go the other way. What's up with that?

I have to admit, I don't understand one lick of what the fuck is going on in the 'sponsor' screen. % of my winning this season? The rankings thing is totally and completely confusing, and the extra bits about 'improving team value or fan factor' never even seem to apply (my fan factor's a 5, I'm guessing it's not getting to 10 in 3 games). Then, to top it off, it seems like the more I win, the less happy my sponsor is. Go figure.

Axxon · 07-04-2009, 05:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thesloppy

I have to admit, I don't understand one lick of what the fuck is going on in the 'sponsor' screen. % of my winning this season? The rankings thing is totally and completely confusing, and the extra bits about 'improving team value or fan factor' never even seem to apply (my fan factor's a 5, I'm guessing it's not getting to 10 in 3 games). Then, to top it off, it seems like the more I win, the less happy my sponsor is. Go figure.

You can pay money though to raise fan factor. I'd imagine if you win a bit and blow your cash on that maybe you'd be able to do it.

thesloppy · 07-04-2009, 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Axxon

You can pay money though to raise fan factor. I'd imagine if you win a bit and blow your cash on that maybe you'd be able to do it.

That's the second part of the problem: the cash offered sucks too (for humans at least). Like, I'd probably get an extra $6000 from my sponsor for raising my fan factor, but it would cost me 5 times that. Is there another benefit from fan factor that would make it worth the cost (other than the occasional kick off event)?

SirFozzie · 07-04-2009, 06:14 PM

It was kinda cool, I had to deal with family here, so I spent the time re-reading the Blood Bowl graphic novel and the fiction omnibus.. it's light reading but fun stuff

Honolulu_Blue · 07-04-2009, 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thesloppy

I have to admit, I don't understand one lick of what the fuck is going on in the 'sponsor' screen. % of my winning this season? The rankings thing is totally and completely confusing, and the extra bits about 'improving team value or fan factor' never even seem to apply (my fan factor's a 5, I'm guessing it's not getting to 10 in 3 games). Then, to top it off, it seems like the more I win, the less happy my sponsor is. Go figure.

I am glad to hear that I'm not the only one.

Eaglesfan27 · 07-04-2009, 08:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Honolulu_Blue

I am glad to hear that I'm not the only one.

You two aren't alone. I understand the basic win% and stuff, but the extra goals menu on the far right is very confusing.

Calis · 07-04-2009, 08:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

It was kinda cool, I had to deal with family here, so I spent the time re-reading the Blood Bowl graphic novel and the fiction omnibus.. it's light reading but fun stuff

You know sadly I've been loving this game enough that I actually thought about ordering some of those novels. I just assumed they had to be beyond terrible, even for game-based novels. Are they worth taking a look at? Looks like the first few are out of print also.

I had no idea there was a graphic novel also. I might have to look for that.

Add me to the list who didn't understand the sponsor program and after fiddling with it a bit just went back to classic mode.

thesloppy · 07-04-2009, 08:37 PM

You know, I'm going to step it up here, blow past all of you guys and finally admit to you and myself that I don't understand how ANY of the money shit works in this game. Some guys' contracts seem to get renewed automatically, then some guys'll just disappear in the middle of a season, only to show up on the free agent list next season, then I swear I've had dead dudes pop up on the free agent list. At the end of the game, it'll show your earnings, I don't know what that's based on, and then there's also some number that's subtracted from those earnings, I don't know what that's based on either, but it's probably related to the two numbers in parentheses next to it (I don't know what those are, by the way). Then there's your inducement money. I don't know where the hell that comes from. I mean, I know that I can contribute money towards it, but sometimes there's money in there already, and sometimes there isn't, and sometimes they show you that there's money in there but then it disappears. Then after every game you get back to the team page, and you've got some money, that may or may not be related to the money you got for winning the last game, and or your roster. And you've got the end-of-season stat page that shows your earnings for the season, and first off those team stats are all wrong, and show career stats, and then the earning stats will say you've earned $20000000000000, and your average attendance is 75000 fans, but you've still only got $4000 on hand, and only 20,000 fans were at your last match. And you're thinking well surely this must all be related to my roster so I just have to go look at the total salary of my team.....oh no, that would be too easy, Sherlock. And what the hell is a players 'value' and how come it doesn't match up with his salary?

So yeah, anybody know what's up with that?

I was amusing myself realizing how much slack I had given this game, thinking "it's nearly perfect!", and then after reading aran's post saying the Cyanide part of the game sucks, realizing how right he was. The 'board game' part IS nearly perfect.

The confusing sponsors page
Horrible financial interface
One-run-and-done commentary
Unnecessary animation replays
'Classic-style' slow load-times
Sparse animations, body types and sound effects
Horrendous auto-camera
Static AI

But other than that, it's perfect!!! Hehe. That said, most importantly, it is tons of fun....and it does look pretty good.

aran · 07-04-2009, 09:14 PM

The interface is pretty awful. It doesn't explain to you what the hell it's trying to let you do.

So I had one marathon of a game to win the Clean Cup over a Skaven team. I was playing orcs. The game went on for 28 (yes, that's right 28) rounds!

I was quite shocked when one of my blitzers was KILLED outright in the first half before I had even knocked out a single Skaven. Last time I played this team, I beat the crap out of them, leaving them with only four or so players on the pitch at the end of the game. This time was a bit different. I tried to take advantage of a "get the ref!" event but I only ended up knocking out Skaven. One of my players got red carded during the second half because I didn't know that kickoff event only lasted for one half, so we were 10 v 10. G

Going into the overtime (apparently you just play on from the end of the second half) I had a one-man advantage (8 v 7 at that point) but I couldn't move the ball from out of my zone. I had my thrower standing there with the ball, surrounded by some of my players on my side of the LOS. The Skaven kept piling players on my cage which was stationary as I fended them off. I didn't want to risk putting my thrower in space to try to score, because they had a couple of linemen and their thrower in the middle of their half of the field tied up with my best blitzer and a black orc. They rolled some lucky blocks with their linemen stacked up on top of a couple of my isolated players, which stopped me from overwhelming them where I was holding the ball.

While I've got my cage intact, they get lucky on a blitz and doge through the cage to get at my thrower. They KO him, sending the ball into the arms of one of my lineman who is staring down two opposing linemen at the edge of the cage. I scramble my blitzers and do some serious blocking to rescue the lineman from ratrape. A hand-off to my blitzer and a failed last minute tackle attempt later, my blitzer is in the endzone for a score!

I thought it was sudden death and the game was over, but that wasn't the case. I was at round 25/28. I had to last roughly two rounds on defense. I tried to beat their linemen up while keeping a good prevent defense in place and largely succeeded. I was concerned when I couldn't knock down their gutter runner, but they couldn't get him the ball and reverse field in time to come up with a score.

Very exciting game!

thesloppy · 07-04-2009, 09:19 PM

Those Skaven are tricky, if the dodge dice are rolling their way, they can be a real headache. They're putting it on me, as we speak.

aran · 07-04-2009, 09:29 PM

Well, Cyanide's idea of overtime is not rules-as-written. At all. And it barely makes sense.

Here's how I think it works (NOTE: I wasn't really paying attention to the turn numbers as I played because I thought it was just "play until someone scores, then stop", but once I started noticing the numbers change i tried to figure out what was going on).

At the end of regulation, the game continues (which is against RAW which says flip a coin for a kick-off). The turn on which the game ends increases somewhere between one and three turns. Turns continue to count to the counter at the top of the screen as usual. If a team scores, the teams play until the ending round number on the counter is reached. This means that the other team has an opportunity to come back and tie the game! The Skaven in my game had two full rounds (if not three? I don't remember) with the ball after I had scored.

I don't know what happens if the Skaven tie the game before the round limit is up. Will the game continue playing as it had before while we were tied? Will the game bug out and randomly assign a winner? The behavior of overtime doesn't seem entirely logical.

I would hate if there was a kick-off going into overtime, because with certain teams it would be "win the coin toss and win the game". I prefer playing on from the end of the second half and playing sudden death.

SirFozzie · 07-04-2009, 09:32 PM

Basically, what happens is they tack four turns on (so there will be 20 turns if the game goes into OT, goes to 24 if no score, etcetera).. if at the end of one of these mini-halves, someone is ahead, the game is over.

aran · 07-04-2009, 09:38 PM

Who made up that rule? I was playing classic mode. Shouldn't that be LRB5 RAW?

MacroGuru · 07-05-2009, 08:09 AM

Just went and peaked at the data folder for the game...most of the settings are stored in XML, meaning we should be able to customize the game and the settings including AI....I wonder if anyone has done anything with it yet.

BYU 14 · 07-05-2009, 08:32 AM

I am sure there are some modders in the community that are working on something. I am starting to get a bit perplexed about money too. I have not had to replace a single player, but I never have more than 150,000 for inducements (usually much less) and the teams I am playing now have over 500,000 much of the time, so on top of their skill now being better, they have tons of money.

I like that the game gets tougher, but money should be earned on equal footing IMO.

Anyone else have issues with the training? I would think the idea is to stop the bar as close to the end as possible, but it seems when I press the button to stop late, it just keeps going to the end and my player is out. Hitting it early just gives a ridiculously low chance to improve. This is one area I wish Cyanide would have handled with dice. Train a player on low level and less chance to roll an improvement, but also less chance to miss a game. Then increase the odds of both as your training intensity goes up.

RendeR · 07-05-2009, 09:18 AM

See I've just ignored the training screen altogether and I almost always get a random player with a stat increase anyway. not sure whats up with that.

The things I'd like to be able to change, but can't:

unnecessary animations of the players on the pitch. Why the frack does every single player have to to back flips or pick their noses every 10 seconds? talk about RAM sucking uselessness....

Slow mo' replays

bench reviews(glancing at the benches) between every score (yes I know you can hit ESC and they jump by faster, but still. I paid 50 bucks for this game it should be far more technically sound =)

Improve the AI (HOWEVER I am seeing a marked increase in AI play as I move through a campaign. the teams are playing smarter as I keep climbing the standings and moving along. I think I'm on my 6th location now and its getting damned hard to win games.

BYU 14 · 07-05-2009, 09:41 AM

I agree on the difficulty RendeR, it seems like teams have "scouted" me as I move up. The one part that still lacks in terms of AI to me is the end of half/end of game logic. The opposition should try a desperation hail mary when losing or use all their GFI's to get to my ball carrier and they don't.

When the CPU has a lead I think it does a decent job, trying to stall and hurting my players as much as possible.

Honolulu_Blue · 07-05-2009, 10:40 AM

I am really enjoying this game and have played about 12 games over the last 3 days.

That said, I agree with the consensus that the greatness of this game is largely due to the work Games Workshop and others did with the actual Blood Bowl game. The AI is fine (not great), but the Cyanide-only implementations are clunky and opaque.

There is also a surprising lack of customization. You can pick a generic logo (one of 20 or so) and a base color and that's it. In EA sports games you can customize nearly everything for your team in terms of color and feel and when you get down to individual players in borders on the ridiculous (i.e., customizing tattoos, scars, brands of equipment, type of beard, type of socks, etc.). While I don't think you need all of those options, I think the ability to have some options for customization of each player would have been a very nice and easy thing to implement. All it would take is say, a dozen different types of faces for each race, a dozen different helmets and shoulder pad options, and then a dozen or so different types of leg armor. That'd be more then enough and, again, would seem pretty easy. It would help give each guy a little more personal flavor and would actually help in the actual game play since it would be easier to tell your guys apart.

Still, I will definitely keep playing it. I have no clue how contracts will work, so I am saving my money. That said, I don't seem to be making a lot. I have won 10 out of my 12 games and only have around $140,000. I have spent a bit on new players and re-rolls, but I haven't made a purchase in a while.

My catcher is awesome. 20 TDs in 12 games. He has a +1 MA, Sprint, Sure Feet, Dodge and block. I just keep him a square or two out of the fray and a the moment my blitzers open a gap and the ball is free, he zips in there and is off to the races.

Eaglesfan27 · 07-05-2009, 10:54 AM

I think I figured out inducements, at least how much your opponent gets. They always seem to have 10* the difference in value between the 2 teams. I guess this is to keep things interesting between 2 uneven teams. I just suffered my 1st loss in 10 teams as I faced a Dwarf team with over 500k in inducements which bought them a star player (which I didn't knock out this time), a few good mercenaries, and a few key bribes.

BYU 14 · 07-05-2009, 11:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eaglesfan27

I think I figured out inducements, at least how much your opponent gets. They always seem to have 10* the difference in value between the 2 teams. I guess this is to keep things interesting between 2 uneven teams. I just suffered my 1st loss in 10 teams as I faced a Dwarf team with over 500k in inducements which bought them a star player (which I didn't knock out this time), a few good mercenaries, and a few key bribes.

That makes sense as my team is fairly high in value, due to players leveling, so there is usually a difference.

I had one game where I had one Blitzer out injured and I gave my other blitzer and a runner potions and both got nailed on the PED test, so I played a game against an Orc team with 1 runner and they had a star player and 3 enhanced players due to $540,000 in inducements....Of course I lost 2-0.

Fidatelo · 07-05-2009, 11:14 AM

I've been playing this a bunch, and while I agree with some of the complaints re: Cynaide (and that most of the goodness is provided by the BB rules themselves), I will give Cyanide a bunch of credit for putting out a game that stays true to most of those rules that make BB great.

Let me put it this way: playing this game makes me want to buy the BB table top game to play against friends. But then I look at the rules and all the scatter templates and tackle zones and stuff and realise that the computer game is encapsulating all of those things that make you have to skim through the rules for 5 minutes or mis-calculate how many block dice you should get and whatnot. You get to focus 100% on the strategy of the game itself, without having to worry about the 'annoying details'. To me, that is a huge win!

Also consider this: for years I've thought it would be cool if someone made a computer version of Warhammer 40k. But whenever 40k properties get announced, they are never true to the table top game. Dawn of War and its sequel are supposedly great games, but they are RTS games. I don't want an RTS game. I don't want an MMO like Warhammer Online. I want something exactly like what Cyanide has done with BB.

So in summary, is the video game perfect? No. But it's the closest thing by a mile to allowing me to play a warhammer-esque game on my computer, and that is a dream come true for me! I think with a couple patches to the AI to make it understand time a little better, or maybe some tweaks to those XML files, and this game will give me everything I want, even if certain elements could be better (can't they always?).

As it is, even if nothing changes at all I think I'm extremely happy with this game. So kudos to Cyanide!

Honolulu_Blue · 07-05-2009, 11:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fidatelo

I've been playing this a bunch, and while I agree with some of the complaints re: Cynaide (and that most of the goodness is provided by the BB rules themselves), I will give Cyanide a bunch of credit for putting out a game that stays true to most of those rules that make BB great.

Let me put it this way: playing this game makes me want to buy the BB table top game to play against friends. But then I look at the rules and all the scatter templates and tackle zones and stuff and realise that the computer game is encapsulating all of those things that make you have to skim through the rules for 5 minutes or mis-calculate how many block dice you should get and whatnot. You get to focus 100% on the strategy of the game itself, without having to worry about the 'annoying details'. To me, that is a huge win!

Also consider this: for years I've thought it would be cool if someone made a computer version of Warhammer 40k. But whenever 40k properties get announced, they are never true to the table top game. Dawn of War and its sequel are supposedly great games, but they are RTS games. I don't want an RTS game. I don't want an MMO like Warhammer Online. I want something exactly like what Cyanide has done with BB.

So in summary, is the video game perfect? No. But it's the closest thing by a mile to allowing me to play a warhammer-esque game on my computer, and that is a dream come true for me! I think with a couple patches to the AI to make it understand time a little better, or maybe some tweaks to those XML files, and this game will give me everything I want, even if certain elements could be better (can't they always?).

As it is, even if nothing changes at all I think I'm extremely happy with this game. So kudos to Cyanide!

+1!

I agree about the Warhammer 40K game. I'd love to have something like that. I always thought the game would work exceptionally well with something like a large planetary map in which each side held certain territories, have a troop movement turn where sides decide to fortify or advance and then have the actual battles executed in a turn-based Warhammer 40K type battle.

aran · 07-05-2009, 12:57 PM

I did a little reading on the Cyanide boards. Seems like the aim isn't always to put team value as high as possible, but instead to be as efficient with it as possible. Be careful with your players so they level up and take less valuable but perhaps equally useful skills. Sell off high level players if they're disproportionate to the rest of your team. This keeps opponents inducements down, but still gives you a customized team build to play the game you want to play.

Cyanide also messed up the implementation of inducements. Teams short on players are supposed to be filled with journeyman linemen, then have the inducements calculated on their TV with the linemen. This would significantly reduce inducements and let the player have higher TV teams without opponents getting absurd inducement money.

Eaglesfan27 · 07-05-2009, 01:08 PM

Is there a way to extend players contracts before they expire? Does it prompt me to extend them when they expire?

edit: Nevermind, just read in the manual that it will offer me a chance to extend it when the season is over.

Eaglesfan27 · 07-05-2009, 11:21 PM

I'm impressed with how differently the AI plays against different styles of teams. When I played the Skaven with my Orcs, they avoided contact as much as possible and tried to use their superior speed/agility to avoid me and complete long passes. Now, against my Wood Elves, they bashed me to death and mostly relied on a ball control offense for a 2-2 tie. I'm having a tough time defending with the Wood Elves, but they are a blast to run an offense with. I've scored some very fast TD's and I have a catcher with plus 1 agility is who is absolutely lethal so far.

RendeR · 07-06-2009, 12:05 AM

The AI definitely gets better as you go up through the campaigns. I'm on the 6th event, 8 teams (one of each) and I have had to really work my ass off not to lose these games. the Dwarves went down fairly easily but they beat the living shit out of me. The Woodies tripped me 2 yards from a winning TD to get a tie and I almost dropped a game to Goblins but got saved on a last ditch blitz by my only conscious player that forced a fumble which he then recovered and ran in for a score.

Loving this game but I REALLLLLLLY need to go to bed.

Eaglesfan27 · 07-06-2009, 12:10 AM

This was awesome. I just had a "blitz" event happen where all of my guys got a free turn as we kicked off. My catcher ran the length of the pitch and caught the ball deep in their zone. 2 linemen dodged their way through to be near him and since they only had 2 guys deep, we weathered their turn and scored on our 1st official turn of the game.

aran · 07-06-2009, 12:33 AM

That's a pretty awesome "drive", Eaglesfan.

One time, I knocked down the opponent's ball-carrier along the sideline a few squares from my endzone. The ball scatters out of bounds. Two throw-ins see the ball go scattering out of bounds again. In the end, the ball was at midfield and chaos ensued as the mad scramble was on to get possession. EVERYONE on the field was out of position. My troll (I was palying orc) was all the way down the field defending, my black orcs were scattered around beating up opposing players... It was brutal. I wasn't lucky, though, and they opponent ended up repossessing the ball and scoring before the end of the half.

BYU 14 · 07-06-2009, 12:42 AM

That is a cool drive EF, something that would never happen with my Dwarves.

I lost a game on throw ins, I was tied with an Orc team and failed my GFI and fumbled in the end zone. They couldn't get to the ball, so I had a chance to pick it up for the win next turn and my runner (with sure hands) fumbled it out of bounds. Two throw-ins later the ball ends up on my side of the pitch and nobody around it but four of their players, who gladly pick it up and take it in.

Also played a Goblin team for the first time tonight, was disappointed to only win 1-0, but I beat the hell out of them, 6 injuries and 5 KO's! Though their big uns injured three of mine as well. I might try Goblins as a challenge, seems like they have a bunch of fun secret weapons. Tonight they broke out the Ball and Chain and then a Pogo Stick on me, funny stuff.

Tasan · 07-06-2009, 12:54 AM

I just almost had a horrible, horrible thing happen. I was playing in the Championship game in the last 4 team tourny before moving to the 8 team ones, and I'm humans going against a dwarf team we just mopped the floor with 2-0. I get a quick 1-0 lead after they turn the ball over real early after the opening kickoff. I hold them off the rest of the half, then receive the kickoff to start the second half.

Things are going awesome as I get a rock thrown, taking out 1 of the two guys defending the side I had stacked to. My return man can't quite get to the ball, but my thrower grabs it and tosses it to a catcher, who runs to mid field. I stack my +1 movement catcher next to him and next turn we take off down the sideline with a convoy of blitzers, and no dwarf within 4 spaces even after their turn. So, since this catcher had scored in the opening half, 3 squares away from the endzone and certain victory, I decide to hand off to a blitzer so he can get some points. Well, I fail the first roll then the reroll and fumble the ball away. I have 4 guys around it and there's only 1 dwarf close, so I'm ok, right? Wrong. His lone troll killer gets there and knocks one of my guys down and is in everyone else's tackle zone. My catcher (with dodge) sucessfully gets away but fails the pickup roll. By this time his runner is there and he snags it and takes off down the open side. EVERYONE is out of position, and in the mean time I've lost 2 guys to knockouts. I keep losing rolls to get my guys in pursuit. I finally get a catcher with an angle and my Ogre giving chase. My thrower gets in clean but is so weak he has a 2 dice their pick shot. He's Pro though, and my last hope, since they are about 5 squares away. I get his pro-reroll and a double knockdown, kicking the ball loose. He has two guys right there though. The first one grabs the ball and takes off, but he's got a Go For It to score and fails! The ball carroms RIGHT NEXT TO HIS OTHER GUY. My catcher is still seeing stars and the Ogre can't catch up yet. They've knocked out 3 more of my guys, so I really don't want to see overtime, but I fully expect it now. However, instead of using his one guy standing (who granted doesn't have sure hands), he stands his sure handed runner up to get the ball, which he does. However, this is the last turn, and time expires with them not even trying the pass to win. I was happy to win my first trophy, but I would have liked to see them at least attempt the pass.

thesloppy · 07-06-2009, 01:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eaglesfan27

This was awesome. I just had a "blitz" event happen where all of my guys got a free turn as we kicked off. My catcher ran the length of the pitch and caught the ball deep in their zone. 2 linemen dodged their way through to be near him and since they only had 2 guys deep, we weathered their turn and scored on our 1st official turn of the game.

The 'blitz' kick-off event is a good time, I've also recovered my own kickoff once, I guess that would be the BB equivalent of an onside kick.

Also fun: Watching one of your guys 'shadow' an opposing player all over the board, until finally tripping him up.

Icy · 07-06-2009, 09:23 AM

Good guide on setting up tactics:

TACTICS: Basic Tactics Introduction

and lots of different guides:

http://www.blood-bowl.net/Tactics/BBTactics.html

RendeR · 07-06-2009, 09:32 AM

Am I alone in always choosing to kick off in the first half? I love getting the ball first in the second so i always choose to kick first.

Honolulu_Blue · 07-06-2009, 09:52 AM

Thanks for the guides, Icy. Some good stuff.

My general tactic on offense is to completely over load one side of the ball. I like to throw almost everyone I can over there, leaving one blitzer on the other side just in case. I tend to be able to overwhelm my opponent and the moment a gap appears, my zippy little catcher breaks through. His combo of +1 MA, Sure Feet and Sprint means he can usually score in 2 turns.

Defensively, I like to be balanced. I use a high pressure defense. I have gotten caught with my pants down a few times against the skaven, but usually I get decent front line pressure and have at least one blitzer circling around the backside to cause havok. Again, I keep my catcher in the back to assist with blocks and as soon as we get the ball he makes a break for it.

He now has 23 TDs in 13 games and more than twice the rest of my team combined.

Honolulu_Blue · 07-06-2009, 09:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RendeR

Am I alone in always choosing to kick off in the first half? I love getting the ball first in the second so i always choose to kick first.

I tend to ask for the ball first.

07-04-2009, 01:01 PM	#201
Axxon Pro Starter Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Phoenix, AZ	I just found a flaw in the campaign and I have a question about same campaign. If you don't choose any players at the start you can choose "Improve team value to 0 and you'll get 32000 for the goal. You only get 35000 for improving fan factor to 10 and only 43000 for First in table. I'd think this is a pretty big issue. My question is about Rankings. You get more money for finishing 14th 22,000 than 1st 1000 leading me to believe they rank from 14 ( top ) to 1 ( worst ) but in game rankings seem to go the other way. What's up with that? __________________ There are no houris, alas, in our heaven.

07-04-2009, 02:35 PM	#207
Eaglesfan27 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: New Jersey	Turning off the hyperactive camera (by hitting escape at the beginning of each game) is a necessity to my enjoyment of the game. __________________ Retired GM of the eNFL 2007 Super Bowl Champion Philadelphia Eagles (19-0 record.) GM of the WOOF 2006 Doggie Bowl Champion Atlantic City Gamblers. GM of the IHOF 2019 and 2022 IHOF Bowl Champion Asheville Axemen. Last edited by Eaglesfan27 : 07-04-2009 at 02:35 PM.

07-04-2009, 04:12 PM	#210
chinaski College Prospect Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Portland, Oregon	arg, just played a random game on line with my 1000 skaven vs 1000 orc team....I got totally decimated.... by the 12th turn i had no players left.. NONE! lol I now hate skaven, im done with them for good. He killed 2 players, knocked out 6 for my next game and took stats away from 3. yowsa. __________________ CCFL - Buffalo Bills IHOF - Houston Mustangs GML - San Diego

07-04-2009, 04:25 PM	#212
Eaglesfan27 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: New Jersey	I just finished a championship game in the 2nd tourney with my orcs against some dwarves. I was worried because they hired a star player for the game, and I was even more worried when he took down my bashing troll on the 1st turn with a serious injury. However, I got 3 orcs around him and then my strongest black rock orc hit him and caused a serious injury to knock him out. Made me laugh to know they probably wasted a few hundred grand on him. We took control after that and won the match 2-0. __________________ Retired GM of the eNFL 2007 Super Bowl Champion Philadelphia Eagles (19-0 record.) GM of the WOOF 2006 Doggie Bowl Champion Atlantic City Gamblers. GM of the IHOF 2019 and 2022 IHOF Bowl Champion Asheville Axemen.

07-04-2009, 06:14 PM	#219
SirFozzie Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: The State of Insanity	It was kinda cool, I had to deal with family here, so I spent the time re-reading the Blood Bowl graphic novel and the fiction omnibus.. it's light reading but fun stuff __________________ Check out Foz's New Video Game Site, An 8-bit Mind in an 8GB world! http://an8bitmind.com

07-04-2009, 02:09 PM	#206
aran High School Varsity Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: New Jersey, USA	I find that the BB tabletop mechanics are solid and enjoyable and that almost all the annoyances I've had have been Cyanide having poor English localization, a weak interface, unnecessarily detailed graphics, and a hyperactive camera. I wish they would've spent more time making the game more of a pleasure to play--I think that the part of the game that Cyanide worked on is not worth $50, though the BB tabletop rules implemented with reasonable AI is worth most of the money.

07-04-2009, 03:13 PM	#208
thesloppy Pro Starter Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: PDX	Yeah, I too turn off the auto camera immediately, turned off the commentary after two games, don't like the slow-mo replays, and detest the long loading times that are probably a result of all the other attempts at eye candy.

07-04-2009, 04:16 PM	#211
BYU 14 Coordinator Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The scorched Desert	I have avoided deaths so far, pretty much because Dwarves are so rugged I suppose and my Apothocary has saved 2 deaths, including my best runner Walik Swiftfoot. Still having problems with Orcs and have lost 2 of 3 to them in competition. The one game I did win I lead 2-0 at the half after getting two turnovers deep in their side. Thought I had it made, but it ended 2-1 and they had the ball at the end and just ran out of time. Also pulled off a rarity for a Dwarf team, a comeback from a 2-0 down by hitting a hail mary on the last play of the game that required a team reroll and a reroll from the thrower using his pro skill to win 3-2. This game is already in my top 3 ever for fun factor.

07-04-2009, 04:42 PM	#213
Calis College Starter Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Kansas	I've deifinitely noticed in my Chaos campaign that I'm blowing past the CPU teams in terms of total team value. It seems like I'm giving up 400+k a game to them, so it's always a star player and an extra reroll or two. Sure makes things interesting. It sure seems like the AI doesn't utilize the star players very well though. They treat them basically as a line of scrimmage lineman which they're usually pretty good at it, but seems like a bit of a waste. I've yet to really worry about one.

07-04-2009, 08:37 PM	#223
thesloppy Pro Starter Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: PDX	You know, I'm going to step it up here, blow past all of you guys and finally admit to you and myself that I don't understand how ANY of the money shit works in this game. Some guys' contracts seem to get renewed automatically, then some guys'll just disappear in the middle of a season, only to show up on the free agent list next season, then I swear I've had dead dudes pop up on the free agent list. At the end of the game, it'll show your earnings, I don't know what that's based on, and then there's also some number that's subtracted from those earnings, I don't know what that's based on either, but it's probably related to the two numbers in parentheses next to it (I don't know what those are, by the way). Then there's your inducement money. I don't know where the hell that comes from. I mean, I know that I can contribute money towards it, but sometimes there's money in there already, and sometimes there isn't, and sometimes they show you that there's money in there but then it disappears. Then after every game you get back to the team page, and you've got some money, that may or may not be related to the money you got for winning the last game, and or your roster. And you've got the end-of-season stat page that shows your earnings for the season, and first off those team stats are all wrong, and show career stats, and then the earning stats will say you've earned $20000000000000, and your average attendance is 75000 fans, but you've still only got $4000 on hand, and only 20,000 fans were at your last match. And you're thinking well surely this must all be related to my roster so I just have to go look at the total salary of my team.....oh no, that would be too easy, Sherlock. And what the hell is a players 'value' and how come it doesn't match up with his salary? So yeah, anybody know what's up with that? I was amusing myself realizing how much slack I had given this game, thinking "it's nearly perfect!", and then after reading aran's post saying the Cyanide part of the game sucks, realizing how right he was. The 'board game' part IS nearly perfect. The confusing sponsors page Horrible financial interface One-run-and-done commentary Unnecessary animation replays 'Classic-style' slow load-times Sparse animations, body types and sound effects Horrendous auto-camera Static AI But other than that, it's perfect!!! Hehe. That said, most importantly, it is tons of fun....and it does look pretty good.

07-04-2009, 09:14 PM	#224
aran High School Varsity Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: New Jersey, USA	The interface is pretty awful. It doesn't explain to you what the hell it's trying to let you do. So I had one marathon of a game to win the Clean Cup over a Skaven team. I was playing orcs. The game went on for 28 (yes, that's right 28) rounds! I was quite shocked when one of my blitzers was KILLED outright in the first half before I had even knocked out a single Skaven. Last time I played this team, I beat the crap out of them, leaving them with only four or so players on the pitch at the end of the game. This time was a bit different. I tried to take advantage of a "get the ref!" event but I only ended up knocking out Skaven. One of my players got red carded during the second half because I didn't know that kickoff event only lasted for one half, so we were 10 v 10. G Going into the overtime (apparently you just play on from the end of the second half) I had a one-man advantage (8 v 7 at that point) but I couldn't move the ball from out of my zone. I had my thrower standing there with the ball, surrounded by some of my players on my side of the LOS. The Skaven kept piling players on my cage which was stationary as I fended them off. I didn't want to risk putting my thrower in space to try to score, because they had a couple of linemen and their thrower in the middle of their half of the field tied up with my best blitzer and a black orc. They rolled some lucky blocks with their linemen stacked up on top of a couple of my isolated players, which stopped me from overwhelming them where I was holding the ball. While I've got my cage intact, they get lucky on a blitz and doge through the cage to get at my thrower. They KO him, sending the ball into the arms of one of my lineman who is staring down two opposing linemen at the edge of the cage. I scramble my blitzers and do some serious blocking to rescue the lineman from ratrape. A hand-off to my blitzer and a failed last minute tackle attempt later, my blitzer is in the endzone for a score! I thought it was sudden death and the game was over, but that wasn't the case. I was at round 25/28. I had to last roughly two rounds on defense. I tried to beat their linemen up while keeping a good prevent defense in place and largely succeeded. I was concerned when I couldn't knock down their gutter runner, but they couldn't get him the ball and reverse field in time to come up with a score. Very exciting game! Last edited by aran : 07-04-2009 at 09:15 PM.

07-04-2009, 09:19 PM	#225
thesloppy Pro Starter Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: PDX	Those Skaven are tricky, if the dodge dice are rolling their way, they can be a real headache. They're putting it on me, as we speak.

07-04-2009, 09:29 PM	#226
aran High School Varsity Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: New Jersey, USA	Well, Cyanide's idea of overtime is not rules-as-written. At all. And it barely makes sense. Here's how I think it works (NOTE: I wasn't really paying attention to the turn numbers as I played because I thought it was just "play until someone scores, then stop", but once I started noticing the numbers change i tried to figure out what was going on). At the end of regulation, the game continues (which is against RAW which says flip a coin for a kick-off). The turn on which the game ends increases somewhere between one and three turns. Turns continue to count to the counter at the top of the screen as usual. If a team scores, the teams play until the ending round number on the counter is reached. This means that the other team has an opportunity to come back and tie the game! The Skaven in my game had two full rounds (if not three? I don't remember) with the ball after I had scored. I don't know what happens if the Skaven tie the game before the round limit is up. Will the game continue playing as it had before while we were tied? Will the game bug out and randomly assign a winner? The behavior of overtime doesn't seem entirely logical. I would hate if there was a kick-off going into overtime, because with certain teams it would be "win the coin toss and win the game". I prefer playing on from the end of the second half and playing sudden death.

07-04-2009, 09:32 PM	#227
SirFozzie Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: The State of Insanity	Basically, what happens is they tack four turns on (so there will be 20 turns if the game goes into OT, goes to 24 if no score, etcetera).. if at the end of one of these mini-halves, someone is ahead, the game is over. __________________ Check out Foz's New Video Game Site, An 8-bit Mind in an 8GB world! http://an8bitmind.com

07-04-2009, 09:38 PM	#228
aran High School Varsity Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: New Jersey, USA	Who made up that rule? I was playing classic mode. Shouldn't that be LRB5 RAW?

07-05-2009, 08:09 AM	#229
MacroGuru Coordinator Join Date: May 2003 Location: Utah	Just went and peaked at the data folder for the game...most of the settings are stored in XML, meaning we should be able to customize the game and the settings including AI....I wonder if anyone has done anything with it yet. __________________ "forgetting what is in the past, I strive for the future"

07-05-2009, 08:32 AM	#230
BYU 14 Coordinator Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The scorched Desert	I am sure there are some modders in the community that are working on something. I am starting to get a bit perplexed about money too. I have not had to replace a single player, but I never have more than 150,000 for inducements (usually much less) and the teams I am playing now have over 500,000 much of the time, so on top of their skill now being better, they have tons of money. I like that the game gets tougher, but money should be earned on equal footing IMO. Anyone else have issues with the training? I would think the idea is to stop the bar as close to the end as possible, but it seems when I press the button to stop late, it just keeps going to the end and my player is out. Hitting it early just gives a ridiculously low chance to improve. This is one area I wish Cyanide would have handled with dice. Train a player on low level and less chance to roll an improvement, but also less chance to miss a game. Then increase the odds of both as your training intensity goes up.

07-05-2009, 09:18 AM	#231
RendeR Coordinator Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Buffalo, NY	See I've just ignored the training screen altogether and I almost always get a random player with a stat increase anyway. not sure whats up with that. The things I'd like to be able to change, but can't: unnecessary animations of the players on the pitch. Why the frack does every single player have to to back flips or pick their noses every 10 seconds? talk about RAM sucking uselessness.... Slow mo' replays bench reviews(glancing at the benches) between every score (yes I know you can hit ESC and they jump by faster, but still. I paid 50 bucks for this game it should be far more technically sound =) Improve the AI (HOWEVER I am seeing a marked increase in AI play as I move through a campaign. the teams are playing smarter as I keep climbing the standings and moving along. I think I'm on my 6th location now and its getting damned hard to win games. __________________ http://wotlabs.net/s...8/signature.png http://wotlabs.net/sig_dark/na/banichi18/signature.png

07-05-2009, 09:41 AM	#232
BYU 14 Coordinator Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The scorched Desert	I agree on the difficulty RendeR, it seems like teams have "scouted" me as I move up. The one part that still lacks in terms of AI to me is the end of half/end of game logic. The opposition should try a desperation hail mary when losing or use all their GFI's to get to my ball carrier and they don't. When the CPU has a lead I think it does a decent job, trying to stall and hurting my players as much as possible.

07-05-2009, 10:40 AM	#233
Honolulu_Blue Hockey Boy Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Royal Oak, MI	I am really enjoying this game and have played about 12 games over the last 3 days. That said, I agree with the consensus that the greatness of this game is largely due to the work Games Workshop and others did with the actual Blood Bowl game. The AI is fine (not great), but the Cyanide-only implementations are clunky and opaque. There is also a surprising lack of customization. You can pick a generic logo (one of 20 or so) and a base color and that's it. In EA sports games you can customize nearly everything for your team in terms of color and feel and when you get down to individual players in borders on the ridiculous (i.e., customizing tattoos, scars, brands of equipment, type of beard, type of socks, etc.). While I don't think you need all of those options, I think the ability to have some options for customization of each player would have been a very nice and easy thing to implement. All it would take is say, a dozen different types of faces for each race, a dozen different helmets and shoulder pad options, and then a dozen or so different types of leg armor. That'd be more then enough and, again, would seem pretty easy. It would help give each guy a little more personal flavor and would actually help in the actual game play since it would be easier to tell your guys apart. Still, I will definitely keep playing it. I have no clue how contracts will work, so I am saving my money. That said, I don't seem to be making a lot. I have won 10 out of my 12 games and only have around $140,000. I have spent a bit on new players and re-rolls, but I haven't made a purchase in a while. My catcher is awesome. 20 TDs in 12 games. He has a +1 MA, Sprint, Sure Feet, Dodge and block. I just keep him a square or two out of the fray and a the moment my blitzers open a gap and the ball is free, he zips in there and is off to the races. __________________ *Steve Yzerman*: 1,755 points in 1,514 regular season games. 185 points in 196 postseason games. A First-Team All-Star, Conn Smythe Trophy winner, Selke Trophy winner, Masterton Trophy winner, member of the Hockey Hall of Fame, Olympic gold medallist, and a three-time Stanley Cup Champion. Longest serving captain of one team in the history of the NHL (19 seasons).

07-05-2009, 10:54 AM	#234
Eaglesfan27 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: New Jersey	I think I figured out inducements, at least how much your opponent gets. They always seem to have 10* the difference in value between the 2 teams. I guess this is to keep things interesting between 2 uneven teams. I just suffered my 1st loss in 10 teams as I faced a Dwarf team with over 500k in inducements which bought them a star player (which I didn't knock out this time), a few good mercenaries, and a few key bribes. __________________ Retired GM of the eNFL 2007 Super Bowl Champion Philadelphia Eagles (19-0 record.) GM of the WOOF 2006 Doggie Bowl Champion Atlantic City Gamblers. GM of the IHOF 2019 and 2022 IHOF Bowl Champion Asheville Axemen.

07-05-2009, 11:14 AM	#236
Fidatelo Pro Starter Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Winnipeg, MB	I've been playing this a bunch, and while I agree with some of the complaints re: Cynaide (and that most of the goodness is provided by the BB rules themselves), I will give Cyanide a bunch of credit for putting out a game that stays true to most of those rules that make BB great. Let me put it this way: playing this game makes me want to buy the BB table top game to play against friends. But then I look at the rules and all the scatter templates and tackle zones and stuff and realise that the computer game is encapsulating all of those things that make you have to skim through the rules for 5 minutes or mis-calculate how many block dice you should get and whatnot. You get to focus 100% on the strategy of the game itself, without having to worry about the 'annoying details'. To me, that is a huge win! Also consider this: for years I've thought it would be cool if someone made a computer version of Warhammer 40k. But whenever 40k properties get announced, they are never true to the table top game. Dawn of War and its sequel are supposedly great games, but they are RTS games. I don't want an RTS game. I don't want an MMO like Warhammer Online. I want something exactly like what Cyanide has done with BB. So in summary, is the video game perfect? No. But it's the closest thing by a mile to allowing me to play a warhammer-esque game on my computer, and that is a dream come true for me! I think with a couple patches to the AI to make it understand time a little better, or maybe some tweaks to those XML files, and this game will give me everything I want, even if certain elements could be better (can't they always?). As it is, even if nothing changes at all I think I'm extremely happy with this game. So kudos to Cyanide! __________________ "Breakfast? Breakfast schmekfast, look at the score for God's sake. It's only the second period and I'm winning 12-2. Breakfasts come and go, Rene, but Hartford, the Whale, they only beat Vancouver maybe once or twice in a lifetime."

07-05-2009, 12:57 PM	#238
aran High School Varsity Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: New Jersey, USA	I did a little reading on the Cyanide boards. Seems like the aim isn't always to put team value as high as possible, but instead to be as efficient with it as possible. Be careful with your players so they level up and take less valuable but perhaps equally useful skills. Sell off high level players if they're disproportionate to the rest of your team. This keeps opponents inducements down, but still gives you a customized team build to play the game you want to play. Cyanide also messed up the implementation of inducements. Teams short on players are supposed to be filled with journeyman linemen, then have the inducements calculated on their TV with the linemen. This would significantly reduce inducements and let the player have higher TV teams without opponents getting absurd inducement money.

07-05-2009, 01:08 PM	#239
Eaglesfan27 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: New Jersey	Is there a way to extend players contracts before they expire? Does it prompt me to extend them when they expire? edit: Nevermind, just read in the manual that it will offer me a chance to extend it when the season is over. __________________ Retired GM of the eNFL 2007 Super Bowl Champion Philadelphia Eagles (19-0 record.) GM of the WOOF 2006 Doggie Bowl Champion Atlantic City Gamblers. GM of the IHOF 2019 and 2022 IHOF Bowl Champion Asheville Axemen. Last edited by Eaglesfan27 : 07-05-2009 at 01:15 PM.

07-05-2009, 11:21 PM	#240
Eaglesfan27 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: New Jersey	I'm impressed with how differently the AI plays against different styles of teams. When I played the Skaven with my Orcs, they avoided contact as much as possible and tried to use their superior speed/agility to avoid me and complete long passes. Now, against my Wood Elves, they bashed me to death and mostly relied on a ball control offense for a 2-2 tie. I'm having a tough time defending with the Wood Elves, but they are a blast to run an offense with. I've scored some very fast TD's and I have a catcher with plus 1 agility is who is absolutely lethal so far. __________________ Retired GM of the eNFL 2007 Super Bowl Champion Philadelphia Eagles (19-0 record.) GM of the WOOF 2006 Doggie Bowl Champion Atlantic City Gamblers. GM of the IHOF 2019 and 2022 IHOF Bowl Champion Asheville Axemen.

07-06-2009, 12:05 AM	#241
RendeR Coordinator Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Buffalo, NY	The AI definitely gets better as you go up through the campaigns. I'm on the 6th event, 8 teams (one of each) and I have had to really work my ass off not to lose these games. the Dwarves went down fairly easily but they beat the living shit out of me. The Woodies tripped me 2 yards from a winning TD to get a tie and I almost dropped a game to Goblins but got saved on a last ditch blitz by my only conscious player that forced a fumble which he then recovered and ran in for a score. Loving this game but I REALLLLLLLY need to go to bed. __________________ http://wotlabs.net/s...8/signature.png http://wotlabs.net/sig_dark/na/banichi18/signature.png

07-06-2009, 12:10 AM	#242
Eaglesfan27 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: New Jersey	This was awesome. I just had a "blitz" event happen where all of my guys got a free turn as we kicked off. My catcher ran the length of the pitch and caught the ball deep in their zone. 2 linemen dodged their way through to be near him and since they only had 2 guys deep, we weathered their turn and scored on our 1st official turn of the game. __________________ Retired GM of the eNFL 2007 Super Bowl Champion Philadelphia Eagles (19-0 record.) GM of the WOOF 2006 Doggie Bowl Champion Atlantic City Gamblers. GM of the IHOF 2019 and 2022 IHOF Bowl Champion Asheville Axemen. Last edited by Eaglesfan27 : 07-06-2009 at 12:10 AM.

07-06-2009, 12:33 AM	#243
aran High School Varsity Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: New Jersey, USA	That's a pretty awesome "drive", Eaglesfan. One time, I knocked down the opponent's ball-carrier along the sideline a few squares from my endzone. The ball scatters out of bounds. Two throw-ins see the ball go scattering out of bounds again. In the end, the ball was at midfield and chaos ensued as the mad scramble was on to get possession. EVERYONE on the field was out of position. My troll (I was palying orc) was all the way down the field defending, my black orcs were scattered around beating up opposing players... It was brutal. I wasn't lucky, though, and they opponent ended up repossessing the ball and scoring before the end of the half. Last edited by aran : 07-06-2009 at 12:34 AM.

07-06-2009, 12:42 AM	#244
BYU 14 Coordinator Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The scorched Desert	That is a cool drive EF, something that would never happen with my Dwarves. I lost a game on throw ins, I was tied with an Orc team and failed my GFI and fumbled in the end zone. They couldn't get to the ball, so I had a chance to pick it up for the win next turn and my runner (with sure hands) fumbled it out of bounds. Two throw-ins later the ball ends up on my side of the pitch and nobody around it but four of their players, who gladly pick it up and take it in. Also played a Goblin team for the first time tonight, was disappointed to only win 1-0, but I beat the hell out of them, 6 injuries and 5 KO's! Though their big uns injured three of mine as well. I might try Goblins as a challenge, seems like they have a bunch of fun secret weapons. Tonight they broke out the Ball and Chain and then a Pogo Stick on me, funny stuff.

07-06-2009, 12:54 AM	#245
Tasan College Starter Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Houston, or there about	I just almost had a horrible, horrible thing happen. I was playing in the Championship game in the last 4 team tourny before moving to the 8 team ones, and I'm humans going against a dwarf team we just mopped the floor with 2-0. I get a quick 1-0 lead after they turn the ball over real early after the opening kickoff. I hold them off the rest of the half, then receive the kickoff to start the second half. Things are going awesome as I get a rock thrown, taking out 1 of the two guys defending the side I had stacked to. My return man can't quite get to the ball, but my thrower grabs it and tosses it to a catcher, who runs to mid field. I stack my +1 movement catcher next to him and next turn we take off down the sideline with a convoy of blitzers, and no dwarf within 4 spaces even after their turn. So, since this catcher had scored in the opening half, 3 squares away from the endzone and certain victory, I decide to hand off to a blitzer so he can get some points. Well, I fail the first roll then the reroll and fumble the ball away. I have 4 guys around it and there's only 1 dwarf close, so I'm ok, right? Wrong. His lone troll killer gets there and knocks one of my guys down and is in everyone else's tackle zone. My catcher (with dodge) sucessfully gets away but fails the pickup roll. By this time his runner is there and he snags it and takes off down the open side. EVERYONE is out of position, and in the mean time I've lost 2 guys to knockouts. I keep losing rolls to get my guys in pursuit. I finally get a catcher with an angle and my Ogre giving chase. My thrower gets in clean but is so weak he has a 2 dice their pick shot. He's Pro though, and my last hope, since they are about 5 squares away. I get his pro-reroll and a double knockdown, kicking the ball loose. He has two guys right there though. The first one grabs the ball and takes off, but he's got a Go For It to score and fails! The ball carroms RIGHT NEXT TO HIS OTHER GUY. My catcher is still seeing stars and the Ogre can't catch up yet. They've knocked out 3 more of my guys, so I really don't want to see overtime, but I fully expect it now. However, instead of using his one guy standing (who granted doesn't have sure hands), he stands his sure handed runner up to get the ball, which he does. However, this is the last turn, and time expires with them not even trying the pass to win. I was happy to win my first trophy, but I would have liked to see them at least attempt the pass. __________________ 2011 Golden Scribes winner for best Interactive Dynasty

07-06-2009, 09:23 AM	#247
Icy Pro Starter Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Toledo - Spain	Good guide on setting up tactics: TACTICS: Basic Tactics Introduction and lots of different guides: http://www.blood-bowl.net/Tactics/BBTactics.html __________________ Last edited by Icy : 07-06-2009 at 09:25 AM.

07-06-2009, 09:32 AM	#248
RendeR Coordinator Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Buffalo, NY	Am I alone in always choosing to kick off in the first half? I love getting the ball first in the second so i always choose to kick first. __________________ http://wotlabs.net/s...8/signature.png http://wotlabs.net/sig_dark/na/banichi18/signature.png

07-06-2009, 09:52 AM	#249
Honolulu_Blue Hockey Boy Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Royal Oak, MI	Thanks for the guides, Icy. Some good stuff. My general tactic on offense is to completely over load one side of the ball. I like to throw almost everyone I can over there, leaving one blitzer on the other side just in case. I tend to be able to overwhelm my opponent and the moment a gap appears, my zippy little catcher breaks through. His combo of +1 MA, Sure Feet and Sprint means he can usually score in 2 turns. Defensively, I like to be balanced. I use a high pressure defense. I have gotten caught with my pants down a few times against the skaven, but usually I get decent front line pressure and have at least one blitzer circling around the backside to cause havok. Again, I keep my catcher in the back to assist with blocks and as soon as we get the ball he makes a break for it. He now has 23 TDs in 13 games and more than twice the rest of my team combined. __________________ *Steve Yzerman*: 1,755 points in 1,514 regular season games. 185 points in 196 postseason games. A First-Team All-Star, Conn Smythe Trophy winner, Selke Trophy winner, Masterton Trophy winner, member of the Hockey Hall of Fame, Olympic gold medallist, and a three-time Stanley Cup Champion. Longest serving captain of one team in the history of the NHL (19 seasons).

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