Colts vs. Pats

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by Greyroofoo

Its Official

Manning > Brady

3 > 0

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by wade moore

Yeah, Brady is the man, Brady is the Golden Boy...

EAT THAT BRADY!

that's not on Brady. That was a tipped ball. As was (at least) one of the others.

[SirFozzie]

and two-three of em were tips :P Receivers had to be better

[Craptacular]

Originally Posted by Easy Mac

wow, completely unexpected. again, June is not on your team, Brady.

He didn't throw it to June.

[Vinatieri for Prez]

Originally Posted by wade moore

So NE fans can make all the excuses they want about refs, etc, etc... but 4 INT's from Brady really spells out what happened this game.

He played poorly, no doubt. I only blame him for 2 of them.

[SirFozzie]

BTW, grey.. as you can see, I am living up to my bet...

[McSweeny]

Originally Posted by wade moore

So NE fans can make all the excuses they want about refs, etc, etc... but 4 INT's from Brady really spells out what happened this game.

oh i'll make no excuses

peyton played great tonight. i tip my hat to him

brady however... he was terrible. the play calling was terrible. special teams were terrible. it's amazing it was even a 7 point game really. very depressing game to watch i tell ya

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by wade moore

So NE fans can make all the excuses they want about refs, etc, etc... but 4 INT's from Brady really spells out what happened this game.

oh for fuck's sake...(at least) 2 of them were tipped by the receivers into the Colts hands. You wouldn't assign those to your QB if they happened, so don't act like they're Tom's fault.

[wade moore]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

that's not on Brady. That was a tipped ball. As was (at least) one of the others.

As some of the Manning passes have been over time.

I got a little overzealous, but it just feels good to win one where Brady was the guy who had a "bad game". Yeah, one or two of them were tipped passes, but he still had 4 INTs.. and that one, for instance, wasn't terrible, but it was a bit high and behind, so you can't totally blame Faulk.

[Vinatieri for Prez]

This sucks. Time to go get drunk. I think the viewers deserved an OT game, no matter who won.

[Greyroofoo]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

BTW, grey.. as you can see, I am living up to my bet...

rock on

[Crapshoot]

Hell, I'd say Peyton's always been the better QB - but Brady's done a wonderful job of managing games and working within the system. They're both damn good players, no matter what Bill Simmons tells you.

[wade moore]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

oh for fuck's sake...(at least) 2 of them were tipped by the receivers into the Colts hands. You wouldn't assign those to your QB if they happened, so don't act like they're Tom's fault.

A) I would assing them to my QB.
B) Point still stands that 4 INT's lost the game, not the ref excuses I am expecting.

[Marathoner]

I am not really sure why the Pats didn't put this game on Dillon and Maroney. They could have hammered down the undersized Colts D and worn them out in the second half.

[Galaril]

I wonder what the boyz in the front office think about letting Branch and Givens go now.

[ISiddiqui]

The Curse of Vinateri has begun!!

It has made Brady "un-clutch"

[wade moore]

Originally Posted by Galaril

I wonder what the boyz in the front office think about letting Branch and Givens go now.

Well, at least one of the tipped INT's was a RB, so I don't know that those two are really a factor here.

FWIW, I actually think the biggest blame goes on the coaching staff. I just feel like, particularly in the first half, they could have really dominated the line of scrimmage by running more. And none of the "fancy" crap. Just up the gut with Maroney.

[Vinatieri for Prez]

Originally Posted by Marathoner

I am not really sure why the Pats didn't put this game on Dillon and Maroney. They could have hammered down the undersized Colts D and worn them out in the second half.

I'm thinking the same thing. Especially with how the passing game was going.

The defense played great when you consider all the chances the offense gave the Colts. They did all they could. The simple fact is the offense, with Brady at the helm, let them down.

The good thing I take from this is that if the two teams meet again, the Pats could win.

[Oilers9911]

Manning is without a doubt the better QB. However Brady has proven to have the ability to win. I'd rather have Brady's 3 rings than Manning's skill.

[molson]

Originally Posted by Galaril

I wonder what the boyz in the front office think about letting Branch and Givens go now.

Branch is debatable, but if you haven't noticed, Givens has been a huge bust.

Neither would have helped tonight. Brady was bad, the offensive game plan was worse. It happens.

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by Oilers9911

Manning is without a doubt the better QB. However Brady has proven to have the ability to win. I'd rather have Brady's 3 rings than Manning's skill.

Not to get in the middle of this... but I wonder what Manning's record would be with Brady's defense. Just like Montana and Marino, if you took Dan Marino and put him with Roger Craig, Jerry Rice, Ronnie Lott, etc, I think he wins a few Super Bowls.

[Vinatieri for Prez]

Originally Posted by Oilers9911

Manning is without a doubt the better QB. However Brady has proven to have the ability to win. I'd rather have Brady's 3 rings than Manning's skill.

Hmm, I would agree better physically that Manning is better. But QB is also mental, leadership, avoid mistakes, clutch passes,winning etc. Because of that, Brady is the better QB.

[wade moore]

Originally Posted by Oilers9911

Manning is without a doubt the better QB. However Brady has proven to have the ability to win. I'd rather have Brady's 3 rings than Manning's skill.

I'm a huge Manning fan.

I would not say that Manning is without a doubt the better QB. I know this argument is hashed out all of the time. I get all upset at the people that say Brady is clearly the better QB too.

I just don't think that you can say that one is clearly far better than the other. I think they both are amazing QB's and each has some things over the other and that neither one is clearly better.

[molson]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

Not to get in the middle of this... but I wonder what Manning's record would be with Brady's defense. Just like Montana and Marino, if you took Dan Marino and put him with Roger Craig, Jerry Rice, Ronnie Lott, etc, I think he wins a few Super Bowls.

Manning's salary hinders the Colts from having that kind of defense. You have to factor that into any discussion comparing value between the two.

[McSweeny]

Originally Posted by Vinatieri for Prez

I'm thinking the same thing. Especially with how the passing game was going.

The defense played great when you consider all the chances the offense gave the Colts. They did all they could. The simple fact is the offense, with Brady at the helm, let them down.

The good thing I take from this is that if the two teams meet again, the Pats could win.

i'd love to see what the average field position the colts had to start a drive. I think the pats went away from the run far too early and it ended up costing them. Having Sanders back for the Colts turned out to be huge. It was still nice to see Mr. Icewater in his viens miss two kicks though.

I'm looking forward to a rematch

[Oilers9911]

Originally Posted by Vinatieri for Prez

Hmm, I would agree better physically that Manning is better. But QB is also mental, leadership, avoid mistakes, clutch passes,winning etc. Because of that, Brady is the better QB.

When I said better I meant the skills and physical tools. I guess there is better as in skills and better as in success. I also think that Brady has benefitted from having a better all-around team around him.

[Vinatieri for Prez]

On a side note. What do the Pats fans think about Faulk? I use to love him. Think he is the most underrated receiving RB out there. He's made big plays that have won us games.
He's breaking my heart the last two seasons, with serious mistakes.

With Maroney in, I think I would like to see Faulk benched now. He's starting to kill us in crucial times.

[Crapshoot]

Originally Posted by molson

Manning's salary hinders the Colts from having that kind of defense. You have to factor that into any discussion comparing value between the two.

No, you don't. Its a discussion of who the better player is, not what the better allocation of resources is.

[PraetorianX]

Originally Posted by wade moore

Well, at least one of the tipped INT's was a RB, so I don't know that those two are really a factor here.

FWIW, I actually think the biggest blame goes on the coaching staff. I just feel like, particularly in the first half, they could have really dominated the line of scrimmage by running more. And none of the "fancy" crap. Just up the gut with Maroney.

I think coaching had a lot to do with it. The Patsies seemed to try and be too smart, too fancy. Sometimes ugly and dumb just running straight at them is the best, certainly against the Colts.


Anyway, Tottenham beating Chelsea and Indy beating New England, today is a great day.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Vinatieri for Prez

On a side note. What do the Pats fans think about Faulk? I use to love him. Think he is the most underrated receiving RB out there. He's made big plays that have won us games.
He's breaking my heart the last two seasons, with serious mistakes.

With Maroney in, I think I would like to see Faulk benched now. He's starting to kill us in crucial times.

yeahhh...i might hafta agree with you here VfP

[molson]

Originally Posted by Crapshoot

No, you don't. Its a discussion of who the better player is, not what the better allocation of resources is.

The discussion can vary - but if you're talking who you'd rather have, price tag is obviously relevant.

[McSweeny]

Originally Posted by Vinatieri for Prez

On a side note. What do the Pats fans think about Faulk? I use to love him. Think he is the most underrated receiving RB out there. He's made big plays that have won us games.
He's breaking my heart the last two seasons, with serious mistakes.

With Maroney in, I think I would like to see Faulk benched now. He's starting to kill us in crucial times.

if maroney can prove he can be effective in the passing game, then yes i'd love to see him replace faulk

[Neuqua]

Originally Posted by wade moore

A) I would assing them to my QB.

Just thought that was funny.

[Daimyo]

Manning vs Brady is almost as bad as political threads... can't we just call it a tie and just be happy we get to see them play at least once every season? (although hopefully it will be back in the dome again soon!)

[BYU 14]

Originally Posted by PraetorianX

Anyway, Tottenham beating Chelsea and Indy beating New England, today is a great day.

Tottenham/Chelsea was the EPL match of the year so far, back and forth excitement throughout.......The last 12 minutes were insane with Chelsea trying to get the equaliser 1 man down.

[TroyF]

Originally Posted by molson

Manning's salary hinders the Colts from having that kind of defense. You have to factor that into any discussion comparing value between the two.

Not entirely fair.

It isn't like the Patriots are spending millions more on their defense than the Colts are. The difference is in the scheme and design of the two systems. I think the big thing is Seymour. He's the difference maker on that Patriots defense. They can use him in so many ways it helps the entire DL of the Pats. Freeney is an incredible pass rusher, but he has weaknesses and flaws that can be exploited. Seymour is just dominant at what he does.

Both are incredible QB's. Brady has won more, obviously, but I don't think Manning has ever had the type of defense Brady has had playing for him. To be honest, I don't think he's had anything close, even last year.

[Vinatieri for Prez]

Originally Posted by McSweeny

if maroney can prove he can be effective in the passing game, then yes i'd love to see him replace faulk

Yeah, the problem is I'm wondering if you can even call Faulk effective anymore.

[wade moore]

Originally Posted by Daimyo

Manning vs Brady is almost as bad as political threads... can't we just call it a tie and just be happy we get to see them play at least once every season? (although hopefully it will be back in the dome again soon!)

This is exactly what I'm trying to say.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by wade moore

This is exactly what I'm trying to say.

oh i concur. they are quite equals, in different ways.

[INDalltheway]

Colts win! Good game. Harrison's 2nd TD catch was unreal. Still can't believe that catch.

[bhlloy]

The last interception was at least partly Brady's fault. If you are going to throw a pass that hard to a guy who is 5 yards away from you, at least put it low and into the body. Putting it high and away is asking for trouble.

That being said, Faulk is in there to make that catch and he dropped the TD earlier in the game that would have been a complete momentum changer. Maroney seems to be just as good in the passing game and way more of a threat to break a big play.

And I completely agree ... the running game was working and it seemed every time they called a pass play of over 10 yards something bad happened. Everyone raves about Belicheck being a great coach which is true, but he deserves to get a lot of shit for the way the game went tonight. Everyone in the country knew that the Pats gameplan was to run the ball down the Colts throat and they had a good chance to win, and they just went away from it for no apparent reason. Maybe last weeks game went to his head, very strange.

[Vinatieri for Prez]

Yep.

[Vinatieri for Prez]

In other news, Michael Bishop came off the bench to lead the Toronto Argonauts to a victory in the CFL eastern division final.

[Oilers9911]

I may get crucified for this but that Toronto-Winnipeg game was head and shoulders above any NFL game this weekend.

[Raiders Army]

Originally Posted by TroyF

Not entirely fair.

It isn't like the Patriots are spending millions more on their defense than the Colts are. The difference is in the scheme and design of the two systems. I think the big thing is Seymour. He's the difference maker on that Patriots defense. They can use him in so many ways it helps the entire DL of the Pats. Freeney is an incredible pass rusher, but he has weaknesses and flaws that can be exploited. Seymour is just dominant at what he does.

Both are incredible QB's. Brady has won more, obviously, but I don't think Manning has ever had the type of defense Brady has had playing for him. To be honest, I don't think he's had anything close, even last year.

Then again, Brady hasn't had the offense that the Colts have had. When Dillon came over to the Colts he was in the decline of his career. Edge > Dillon. Harrison, Wayne > Pats receivers.

So in the end, it's just a wash anyhow.

[wade moore]

Originally Posted by Raiders Army

Then again, Brady hasn't had the offense that the Colts have had. When Dillon came over to the Colts he was in the decline of his career. Edge > Dillon. Harrison, Wayne > Pats receivers.

So in the end, it's just a wash anyhow.

1,400 yards is the decline of his career?

[rkmsuf]

Originally Posted by wade moore

1,400 yards is the decline of his career?

Yeah, what exactly is he talking about?

[PraetorianX]

Originally Posted by Raiders Army

Then again, Brady hasn't had the offense that the Colts have had. When Dillon came over to the Colts he was in the decline of his career. Edge > Dillon. Harrison, Wayne > Pats receivers.

So in the end, it's just a wash anyhow.

The difference is, the Patriots offense was full of 'good' players that while not as good as Edge or Harrison/Wayne and Manning's other weapons, they were an above average unit all together.

Meanwhile, the Colts defense has just been abysmal for most of Manning's time their.

[Kodos]

Brady must think he is the NFL's David Conti...

[wade moore]

Originally Posted by rkmsuf

Yeah, what exactly is he talking about?

Exactly .

I'm not saying that the Colts haven't had more offensive weapons (although I think it's up for debate how much better), but to use Dillon being on the "decline" of his career when he had his best year (sorry, 1600 yards) with the Patriots doesn't make sense.