2005-2006 baseball offseason

[oykib]

I don't understand why the Mets would deal for Lo Duca.

Just pick up Hernandez or Molina. You won't have to give up any prospects-- let alone major league players.

[lungs]

Who wants Lyle Overbay?

[dawgfan]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

Wow!


Rafael Furcal has agreed in principle to a three-year, $40 million contract with the Dodgers, according to the Los Angeles Times.
He's expected to undergo a physical tomorrow and the deal could be announced on Monday. It's a great contract for Furcal, who will likely be able to land another big deal in three years at age 31. The Dodgers will put Furcal at shortstop and likely leave Jeff Kent at second to start the season. Kent could then move to first base when Cesar Izturis returns in July, although Izturis' lack of offense at second would be a real problem. Perhaps this increases the chances that the Dodgers will go into the season with Hee Seop Choi at first base. They're not going to spend much on a replacement if the plan is for Kent to slide over. Dec. 3 - 11:04 pm et

Further proof that the relative fiscal sanity of 2-3 years ago has vanished...

[Vince]

Originally Posted by lungs

Who wants Lyle Overbay?

The Giants want Lyle Overbay. And if they don't, they should.

[SackAttack]

Originally Posted by Vince

If they had zero other needs? Yes, then it would be irrelevant. If they had an unlimited budget? Yes, then it would be irrelevant. However, the Dodgers have a ton of holes, Furcal is not worth that contract, and the Dodgers, while able to field an expensive team, have a finite budget.

I agree with all of this. Terrible signing. This is why you don't bring a Giant in to run the Dodgers, dammit.

I'm not happy to see Furcal as a Dodger, but I love the contract.

I don't mind that we have Furcal. He's not worth $13m/year. For Christ's sake, that's close to what we're paying J.D. Drew. Does McCourt have some kind of a hard-on for ex-Braves?

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by ESPN

Free-agent right-hander Paul Byrd and the Cleveland Indians reached agreement Sunday on a two-year contract worth $14.25 million.

They do know that they just signed Paul Byrd, right? At least they're smart in that it's a 2 year contract. This is the type of guy that even last year would have commanded about $4M on the market but gets $7M+ this year.

I really hope the Royals just sit this one out and let the other teams eat up their salary space with crap contracts. The Royals aren't winning anything next year and it will let them test out some more young players. Sure, they'll lose but if they can discover another decent player or two in their system, that's a couple less holes to fill next year with even more cash after saving some from last year.

SI

[Logan]

Mets get Lo Duca for a couple pitching prospects, the notable one being Gaby Hernandez

Mets acquire catcher Paul LoDuca from Marlins



By BILL MADDEN

Sunday, Dec. 4, 5:52 p.m.
Mets GM Omar Minaya has crossed catcher off his holiday shopping list, shunning the free agent market and turning once again to the Florida Marlins in a deal for Paul LoDuca, the Daily News has learned.

In exchange for the 33-year-old Brooklyn-born LoDuca, Minaya sacrificed one of the Mets' top pitching prospects, 21-year-old righthander Gaby Hernandez, a Miami high school product, and another minor leaguer pitcher to be named. But LoDuca, who hit .283 with six homers and 85 RBI last season, is regarded as one of the top offensive catchers in the game as well as a team leader and positive clubhouse presence.

When the offseason began, Minaya cited a closer, a middle-of-the-order first baseman and a catcher as his top three priorities and he has now satisfied all of them, having previously obtained Carlos Delgado in a trade with the Marlins and signed closer Billy Wagner as a free agent. It was not until a trade to send LoDuca to the Arizona Diamondbacks fell through last week that Minaya went back to his Florida counterpart, Larry Beinfest, to land a first-string catcher to replace Mike Piazza.

LoDuca essentially wound up replacing Piazza as the Dodgers' catcher five years ago and was a driving force in their winning of the National League West title in 2003. Then-Dodger manager Jim Tracy cited LoDuca as the Dodgers' team leader and was openly critical of the deal that sent the catcher to the Marlins at the trading deadline in '04.

Until the last few days, Minaya had been focusing on the free agent market, particularly Ramon Hernandez and Benji Molina, to fill his catching need. However, he grew impatient when the agents for both catchers kept holding out for three-year deals worth in excess of $7 million per. LoDuca will earn $6.25 million in each of the next two seasons.

Minaya also talked to the Devil Rays about their catcher, Toby Hall, but zeroed in on LoDuca when the Diamondbacks-Marlins deal for him was killed because of Arizona's insistence on Florida including substantial cash in it.

The trade of LoDuca comes two days after the Marlins sent second baseman Luis Castillo to the Twins for two other pitching prospects. In all, the Marlins have now dealt Delgado, Castillo, LoDuca, Josh Beckett and Mike Lowell in what they have termed a "market adjustment" representing a savings of nearly $70 million. In addition, they are expected to let shortstop Alex Gonzalez go and are actively shopping center fielder Juan Pierre, who will likely be the next to go in a deal at the winter meetings in Dallas this week.

[dervack]

You know, with the Cubs losing the Furcal derby, does that mean that they are now going to overpay in the Pierre sweepstakes, make a move for Bradley, or go after Damon?

[Young Drachma]

Originally Posted by lungs

Who wants Lyle Overbay?

The Blue Jays among others, apparently.

[oykib]

The Lo Duca move was just stupid.

Year Ag Tm  Lg  G   AB    R    H   2B 3B  HR  RBI  SB CS  BB  SO   BA   OBP   SLG   TB   SH  SF IBB HBP GDP
1998 26 LAD NL   6   14    2    4   1  0   0    1   0  0   0   1  .286  .286  .357    5   0   0   0   0   0
 1999 27 LAD NL  36   95   11   22   1  0   3   11   1  2  10   9  .232  .312  .337   32   1   2   4   2   3
 2000 28 LAD NL  34   65    6   16   2  0   2    8   0  2   6   8  .246  .301  .369   24   2   2   0   0   2
 2001 29 LAD NL 125  460   71  147  28  0  25   90   2  4  39  30  .320  .374  .543  250   5   9   2   6  11
 2002 30 LAD NL 149  580   74  163  38  1  10   64   3  1  34  31  .281  .330  .402  233   4   4   2  10  20
 2003 31 LAD NL 147  568   64  155  34  2   7   52   0  2  44  54  .273  .335  .377  214   7   1   6  10  21
 2004 32 LAD NL  91  349   41  105  18  1  10   49   2  4  22  27  .301  .351  .444  155   2   2   0   6  15
         FLA NL  52  186   27   48  11  1   3   31   2  1  14  22  .258  .314  .376   70   6   4   0   3   7
         TOT NL 143  535   68  153  29  2  13   80   4  5  36  49  .286  .338  .421  225   8   6   0   9  22
 2005 33 FLA NL 132  445   45  126  23  1   6   57   4  3  34  31  .283  .334  .380  169   5   8   5   4  16

One of these things is not like the others. Lo Duca was a 35 double, ten homer guy. Magically, ten of those doubles found the stands in '01. That's called a career year. How GM's can't see that is beyond me. His offensive numbers are not good. And they aren't going to get better. As a matter of fact, They're going to get worse.

He's a thirty-three year old catcher! Manaya, what are you thinking! You gave up two prospects for this!

[Logan]

I don't like the move either. But there's a couple schools of thought out there:

1. Lo Duca is our starting catcher. He's (supposedly) a great clubhouse guy and the leader you want from a catcher. Solid offensively and defensively. People think Minaya was starting to get annoyed by the delay from both Hernandez and Molina, and that the price for those 2 was getting too high, especially after what the Japanese catcher got. So, he went the trade route and gave up a guy who is probably the Mets 4th/5th best pitching prospect when looking at overall potential (and probably 2nd best pitcher when talking about being close to ML-ready).

2. They picked up Lo Duca to wheel him to Arizona for Vazquez. Benson would then remain on the market for a reliever, with Seo/Heilman still able to be moved in a big deal like for Manny. Then he goes back to Hernandez/Molina for the starting job.

I don't know what I prefer--probably choice 1. I like Lo Duca...the lack of HR power doesn't bother me. The Mets should have enough HR production. I want him to get on base at the bottom of the lineup, which I think he should be able to do for the life of his contract. And at this stage of the game, I choose to put my faith in Minaya.

[oykib]

The problem with that thinking is that you don't trade for a guy that might get you the guy you want. You just flat out structure a three-team deal so that you're not left holding the bag.

As to the second point, it's not just homerun power that Lo Duca lacks. He's losing his gap power as well. He also doesn't walk. He's only had one year above a .350 OBP. His next highest was .338.

As to the leadership part, where was the leaderhip when the Marlins collapsed and players were dogging it at the end of last year.

[samifan24]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

They do know that they just signed Paul Byrd, right? At least they're smart in that it's a 2 year contract. This is the type of guy that even last year would have commanded about $4M on the market but gets $7M+ this year.

I really hope the Royals just sit this one out and let the other teams eat up their salary space with crap contracts. The Royals aren't winning anything next year and it will let them test out some more young players. Sure, they'll lose but if they can discover another decent player or two in their system, that's a couple less holes to fill next year with even more cash after saving some from last year.

SI

I agree that the Tribe overpaid for Byrd but he's a decent pitcher and they needed to fill a hole quickly in case Millwood doesn't return. The bad news is that if Byrd commands 14.25 mil over 2 years just imagine what Millwood is asking. It's not a terrible move, imho.

[st.cronin]

Did Piazza retire?

[Mr. Sparkle]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

Did Piazza retire?

No, last I heard the Twins and A's have shown the most interest in him as a DH/C.

[Mr. Sparkle]

Dola

Funny, I read on a Cardinals site (hxxp://stlcardinals.scout.com/2/474652.html) that A.J. Burnett had agreed in principle to a 5 year deal pending physical, but on rotoworld it says team sources said they likely wouldn't go 5 years. Hmm...

From a Giants fan's perspective, the Cards signing Burnett would make me extremely confident that Matt Morris is coming to San Fran. Guess we'll find out soon if the report is true...

[Ksyrup]

Anna Benson believes the Mets are trying to trade her husband because of her negotiations to pose nude for Playboy.
Anna added that there would be no pictorial, as talks broke down last month over money. There is believed to be some truth to the idea that Mets management was uncomfortable with the idea that she might go through with it. Still, Kris Benson wasn't one of current GM Omar Minaya's acquisitions and his departure probably wouldn't have a lot to do with his wife. Dec. 5 - 4:47 am et

[Blade6119]

Have the cardinals done anything, even if its only renegotiations?

[Ksyrup]

They're about to sign AJ Burnett and pray that he's not the second coming of Darren Dreifort.

[Bearcat729]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

Anna Benson believes the Mets are trying to trade her husband because of her negotiations to pose nude for Playboy.
Anna added that there would be no pictorial, as talks broke down last month over money. There is believed to be some truth to the idea that Mets management was uncomfortable with the idea that she might go through with it. Still, Kris Benson wasn't one of current GM Omar Minaya's acquisitions and his departure probably wouldn't have a lot to do with his wife. Dec. 5 - 4:47 am et

Yep apparently she asked Playboy for 1 million dollars to pose for them. I'm not sure why she thinks that the Mets give a damn about that though.

[LoneStarGirl]

I am tired of not hearing anything about the Astros or Cardinals. Clemens needs to hurry up and make up his damn mind.

[lungs]

Originally Posted by Vince

The Giants want Lyle Overbay. And if they don't, they should.

Some of the Giants pitchers intrigue me as a Brewer fan(not Schmidt).

Which ones do you think the Giants plan to make available?

[Vince]

Originally Posted by lungs

Some of the Giants pitchers intrigue me as a Brewer fan(not Schmidt).

Which ones do you think the Giants plan to make available?

Sadly, none. I don't think Sabean sees the hole at 1B as that big a problem, and even if we did trade for Overbay, we'd probably have to give up more than he's worth. He'd be a significant upgrade for us, however.

He hit 19 HR last year, a career high (albeit in only his second full season), but that still means there were about 20 1B's in the league that hit more than he did. He's young and a lefty, so we'd have to pay a bit more for him. Is it worth it to give up someone like Hennessey for Overbay? Eh...I don't know. I'm sort of ambivalent about it. What makes the Overbay move bad/not going to happen, is that Hennessey is probably not enough for Overbay. And giving up more than that is definitely not worth it (in my opinion). So while I'd like to see the Giants try to get Overbay, I don't think it'll happen.

[Ksyrup]

Originally Posted by Vince

Sadly, none. I don't think Sabean sees the hole at 1B as that big a problem,

Apparently not, since they've had JT Snow playing there for the past 35 years.

[Ryche]

Hopefully Minnesota will talk to Milwaukee about Overbay. He fits their mold perfectly (cheap and good contact, gap paower) and we have the pitching to offer.

I'm surprised more teams are not going after Molina. All he has is the best arm among major league catchers and he's developed into a decent threat with the bat as well.

[Vince]

I've always justified Snow because of my rose colored glasses. It's impossible to hate the guy. Even when he's an offensive black hole (comparatively at 1st base).

When building a basebally team, you need to realize that your power comes from the corner positions -- 1B, 3B, LF and RF. It's the middle positions (2B, SS, CF, C) who are supposed to be 'light hitting.' If you take one of those corner positions, and place a player there who will give you marginal (at best) offensive output, you have to make up for it elsewhere with a hard hitting 2B, SS, CF or C. For a while we had Kent at 2B, and that was great. Even after he left, Bonds was so good that you could afford to have Snow at 1st and not lose much production overall. Now that Bonds is injured and not expected to be -- well, Barry Bonds -- for a full season, we can no longer afford to have that hole at 1B. Take into account that nowadays there are 2B like Alfonso Soriano, SS like Alex Rodriguez (not anymore, but I'm illustrating a point ), and some teams don't even have to take a knock offensively at those positions, so you're even further behind the 8-ball, so to speak.

It looks as if we're going to have a Niekro/XXX platoon at 1B this year, and that's not so good.

[Crapshoot]

Originally Posted by Vince

I've always justified Snow because of my rose colored glasses. It's impossible to hate the guy. Even when he's an offensive black hole (comparatively at 1st base).

When building a basebally team, you need to realize that your power comes from the corner positions -- 1B, 3B, LF and RF. It's the middle positions (2B, SS, CF, C) who are supposed to be 'light hitting.' If you take one of those corner positions, and place a player there who will give you marginal (at best) offensive output, you have to make up for it elsewhere with a hard hitting 2B, SS, CF or C. For a while we had Kent at 2B, and that was great. Even after he left, Bonds was so good that you could afford to have Snow at 1st and not lose much production overall. Now that Bonds is injured and not expected to be -- well, Barry Bonds -- for a full season, we can no longer afford to have that hole at 1B. Take into account that nowadays there are 2B like Alfonso Soriano, SS like Alex Rodriguez (not anymore, but I'm illustrating a point ), and some teams don't even have to take a knock offensively at those positions, so you're even further behind the 8-ball, so to speak.

It looks as if we're going to have a Niekro/XXX platoon at 1B this year, and that's not so good.

Ditto - was hard not to like Snow, but his time has gone. I was praying that ANA would get Konerko, because then they might move Kotchman - who the appear to completely lack faith in- thinking Darrin "HTWG" Erstad is a better player is absurd. As it stands, I wonder if acquiring Gonzales from Texas is the best option - though the Giants lack of faith in youngster's (that stupid Worrell signing) is disturbing.

Heck, I'm still bitter about 2003, when they could have signed Vlad - instead, distributed money to frigging Neifi, JC, Grissom, Cruz and what not - that is the Giants, spend money on mediocrity, but refuse to pay for top notch talent.

[lungs]

Overbay actually isn't young for only completing his second year in the bigs. He'll be 29 in January.

You are correct when you say somebody will likely have to overpay for him. Doug Melvin has been posturing all offseason that the Brewers don't "have to" trade Overbay at all. Basically, he won't settle for low-minors prospects or mediocre starting pitching. Looking at Hennessey's numbers, I highly doubt he'd do the trick straight up. In fact, I'd rather not have him. K/BB ratio is horrible IMO.

I think it's also safe to say that giving up Lowry or Cain would be far too much for the Giants to give up to get Overbay. Need any corner outfielders? Corey Hart is probably untouchable but Nelson Cruz is an interesting prospect I'd dangle if it helps get more for Overbay.

[Vince]

Originally Posted by lungs

Overbay actually isn't young for only completing his second year in the bigs. He'll be 29 in January.

You are correct when you say somebody will likely have to overpay for him. Doug Melvin has been posturing all offseason that the Brewers don't "have to" trade Overbay at all. Basically, he won't settle for low-minors prospects or mediocre starting pitching. Looking at Hennessey's numbers, I highly doubt he'd do the trick straight up. In fact, I'd rather not have him. K/BB ratio is horrible IMO.

I think it's also safe to say that giving up Lowry or Cain would be far too much for the Giants to give up to get Overbay. Need any corner outfielders? Corey Hart is probably untouchable but Nelson Cruz is an interesting prospect I'd dangle if it helps get more for Overbay.

True, he isn't young for a 2nd year player. But overall (especially compared to the geriatric Giants), he's young.

Cain is worth well more than Overbay, and if the Giants even consider trading him for less than an absolute stud, there will be pitchforks, tar and feathers, guaranteed. Lowry doesn't have that 'uber prospect' halo around him, but I would absolutely hate to lose him...especially since we're a team that is still trying to sign pitchers. Basically, in my mind the only expendable pitchers we have are Correia and Hennessey, and frankly they won't net all that much in a trade.

As for Outfielders, with the dynamic duo of Moises and Barry locking down the corner spots, and Super Randy Winn in CF, our OF is pretty solid. Consider our 4-6 OF of Linden, Ellison and Ortmeier, and we don't need any more OF unless we want to really significantly upgrade, and move Alou to 1B or something.

Crapshoot (you used to be Aadik, and still are over at McCovey Chronicles, right?) -- I agree wholeheartedly, though I admit I didn't think about Kotchman's availability if the Angels had gotten Konerko. I can't stand the settling for mediocrity...but the aversion to youth only bugs me to a point. As long as we still have Bonds, management has an out for not going for youth. I still disagree, and I think it's foolish (you can still try to be competitive in the now while keeping an eye on the future), I see what they're trying to do, and I can't be completely depressed about it. I wish it was different, but there's not much to be done.

If, in two years, they still continue to ignore younger players almost completely in free agency/trade negotiations, and continue to piss away draft picks, I'll be much more upset. But for now, they at least have a game plan.

[Vince]

Basically, Overbay's a guy I'd like to have on the Giants, but wouldn't want to spend what it would take to get him.

[lungs]

Originally Posted by Vince

Basically, Overbay's a guy I'd like to have on the Giants, but wouldn't want to spend what it would take to get him.

You're right, this isn't a salary dump so naturally the Brewers are going to hold out for more in a trade.

I am beginning to wonder if Miguel Batista will come into the equation as the Blue Jays have expressed interest in Overbay.

[TazFTW]

On the AJ Burnett front, Gammons is reporting that the Blue Jays are close to signing him to a 5 yr, $55 million deal.

[Ksyrup]

A.J. Burnett will make $7 million next year and $12 million in each of the following four season under the terms of the deal he's agreed to with the Jays.
The contract is supposed to be finzlized after a physical today. Burnett's five-year, $55 million deal will make him the No. 2 starter in a rotation that could also include Roy Halladay, Ted Lilly, Gustavo Chacin and Josh Towers. Lilly might become trade bait as the Blue Jays seek a bat. David Bush and Miguel Batista fit into the same category. Dec. 6 - 4:10 am et

[Ksyrup]

Is it completely salary that has the Phillies trying to deal Abreu? I don't get it. Are they still pissed that he won the HR hitting contest and then didn't hit more than 6 or 7 for the rest of the season?



The Philadelphia Daily News says the Phillies asked for Mark Prior when discussing Bobby Abreu with the Cubs yesterday and weren't dismissed outright.
They probably will be. Abreu is great, but the Cubs won't be dealing Prior, and even if they were open to the possibility, they wouldn't do it for an outfielder making more than $15 million per year. Maybe the Cubs will be interested in a lesser price. The Red Sox, Orioles, Blue Jays and Astros are also looking at Abreu, but the Orioles won't part with Erik Bedard and the Jays may have to lose interest if they get A.J. Burnett. There's been speculation that the Astros could offer Brandon Backe and Chad Qualls, but that'd be a huge salary for them to take on when they still don't know about Roger Clemens and Jeff Bagwell. Dec. 6 - 3:57 am et

[Ksyrup]

The Red Sox, Angels and Diamondbacks have talked about a three-team deal that would put Manny Ramirez on the Angels and bring Troy Glaus to Boston, according to both the Globe and the Herald.
An old rumor back again. The Red Sox might also receive Darin Erstad in a deal. And prospects would change hands, of course. It's becoming less likely that the Mets will make a strong run at Manny. However, the Rangers might yet be in the chase. Dec. 6 - 3:46 am et

[Ksyrup]

Arizona, Atlanta and Tampa Bay have reportedly discussed a three-team deal sending Julio Lugo to the Braves, Johnny Estrada to the Diamondbacks and pitching from Arizona to Tampa Bay.
We assume the Braves would also have to throw something else Tampa Bay's way. The Diamondbacks aren't going to meet Tampa Bay's demands for Lugo, not if they're only getting Estrada in return. Tracy Ringolsby of the Rocky Mountain News said the Braves and Rays have also discussed a trade of Lugo and Danys Baez to Atlanta for Brian McCann and two prospects. Dec. 6 - 1:29 am et

[CraigSca]

Ksyrup, what website are you getting this information from?

[TazFTW]

Looks like rotoworld.

[Ksyrup]

Rotoworld.com. Best site I've found for pulling together all of the stuff that gets reported. SI's Truth & Rumors is pretty good, too, except that most of it shows up on Rotoworld hours earlier.

[Cuckoo]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

The Philadelphia Daily News says the Phillies asked for Mark Prior when discussing Bobby Abreu with the Cubs yesterday and weren't dismissed outright.
[color=blue]They probably will be. Abreu is great, but the Cubs won't be dealing Prior, and even if they were open to the possibility, they wouldn't do it for an outfielder making more than $15 million per year. Maybe the Cubs will be interested in a lesser price.

This is actually incorrect, at least according to the Chicago Sun Times. Apparently, they asked for Prior and were categorically dismissed. Hendry said Prior, Wood and Zambrano were untouchable and the lefty prospect Hill was pretty close to untouchable.

[Cards4ever]

Cuckoo, in your opinion, is Wood untouchable?

[Ksyrup]

This is from SI:

Teams bidding on A.J. Burnett should not count out a sneak attack from the Cubs, who then would send the surgically repaired Kerry Wood, Todd Walker, prospects and maybe some cash to Texas for Alfonso Soriano and Kevin Mench.
-- Chicago Tribune

[Johnny93g]

Toronto sports radio is reporting the Burnett deal is done, and he will be announced as a Blue Jay this afternoon...Im pumped, AJ has always been one of my favourite pitchers....ever sense he threw that no-hitter only throwing fastballs!!!!!

[Cuckoo]

I don't think Wood would be untouchable based on his performance, but apparently he has a no-trade clause that he would have to waive to be traded.

Originally Posted by Chicago Tribune

Hendry said Monday that he has "no intention of trading [Mark] Prior or [Carlos] Zambrano, and Kerry Wood has a full no-trade clause."

Now, I could see Wood waiving that to go to Texas since he's from Texas. And he could possibly waive it if the Cubs convinced him he was unwanted, but I'd call it a longshot at this point. Anything's possible I suppose.

[Cards4ever]

Ok, in that context I understand what he is saying.

If he was just dead set against trading him like I understood it in the first place, well, that's another matter!

[Cuckoo]

Originally Posted by Cards4ever

Ok, in that context I understand what he is saying.

If he was just dead set against trading him like I understood it in the first place, well, that's another matter!

Yeah, personally I'm a big Wood fan. And I hope he doesn't get traded. I'm eternally optimistic (a condition of being a Cubs fan) and have really high hopes for him. I think that if he can keep his injuries under control, he can be absolutely dominant (as in 2003, especially postseason).

But even more than that, I just know that if the Cubs trade him, he'll be a Cy Young guy... Being bitten repeatedly is another condition of being a Cubs fan.

[sterlingice]

Ugh- apparently Cleveland did KC a favor for Paul Byrd. 3/$22 for him would have been insane, moreso than 2/$14.25. That said, this should tell anyone how hard it is to get players to KC:
"Kansas City offered three years, about $22 million.
Cleveland offered two years, $14.25 million."
SI

[Ksyrup]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

Ugh- apparently Cleveland did KC a favor for Paul Byrd. 3/$22 for him would have been insane, moreso than 2/$14.25. That said, this should tell anyone how hard it is to get players to KC:
"Kansas City offered three years, about $22 million.
Cleveland offered two years, $14.25 million."
SI

There you go. Just like I was saying in the other thread. Here's an example where the pursuit of a FA wasn't hampered by money. KC "lost out on" (and I use that phrase loosely) Byrd because the organization sucks, not because they didn't offer more money than the team he chose. If you gave KC $50M more to spend a year, you'd be reading the same thing about AJ Burnett turning down their 5 year, $65M offer.

[sterlingice]

As I've been saying in the other thread, if you level out the playing field, it doesn't end up that KC's only options to attract talent is to vastly overpay them, putting them in an even deeper hole in an attempt to get better. They already went after Furcal, Giles, and Loaiza and got rebuffed. They've spent the last season and a half evaluating practically everyone who was major league ready and some who weren't in an attempt to find where they had good young players. You can't build your entire team from the farm- there are going to be players who crash and burn and you'll have to fill those holes. They determined they have some good young arms but Baird wants a veteran to help mentor them- it's not a bad idea.

But it's a downward spiral- team sucks so you have to overpay so team sucks, etc. If there's a more level playing field, this isn't as magnified. Even the Bengals have proven that you can't suck forever. Your mistakes that you made 5 years ago don't just keep haunting you forever.

SI

[Young Drachma]

Jays get Burnett for $55m/5 years. I have to say that as a Jays fan, if nothing else, it's nice to be relevant again. I don't know that the signings of him and Ryan, who other teams would've snapped up, will be complete disasters...because playing up there in relative obscurity seems to be great for players looking to resurrect their careers or for prospects looking to blossom usually.

But..I just hope the deals don't bite us in the ass later, as I'm not sure I'm completely sold that we'll contend next year. I still think the club is a year away.