FOFC - ESPN NFL 2k5 league

[gstelmack]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

Sun Tzu:????

I'm with Fozz. There have been 7 other games in the league so far, only one of which was a bad experience for the 2 involved and that was due to lag, not poor play. You have one bad game (was it really only 9 plays like gadfly said?) and you're willing to drop the whole league? I mean, if he's really using cheese tactics, we'll find out in a game or two as others start complaining and kick him. But I haven't heard anything said so far that sounds all that bad. If someone blitzes the heck out of you, start calling short passes into the spots being vacated (my brother tried this all-blitz tactic on me 2 weeks ago and stopped when I hit 2 TD passes on him). If they go no-huddle and you don't like your defensive package, call timeout or go offsides to stop the clock and change your defense.

I just don't see either of these as particular cheese tactics, given that NFL teams do both all the time. It's all part of the chess match.

What exactly did he do that you considered so cheesy? And why would one game against one player cause you to drop out on the rest of us when you may never have to face him again?

[gstelmack]

Okay, with the dropout, I've advanced us to week 2. MGadfly picks up the win, and it looks like whoever plays San Fran is basically getting a bye each week (although it appears as though I have to manually advance it). I'm surprised the management software didn't resolve this game since it was actually started, but it's been taken care of now.

So week 2 games may be played at any time now.

[RPI-Fan]

Sun Tzu:

Stop being such a freaking baby.

[Sun Tzu]

I have zero tolerance for unrealistic play.

Chill out.

[gstelmack]

BigDPW, I'm available any night from 8 - 10 Eastern, or can arrange a time tomorrow (Sunday) to be on if you let me know when.

[BigDPW]

I will be available this afternoon and evening... Also I will be available tomorrow afternoon... Typically I am only available to about 8:30 on most nights however b/c I have to be at work around 5:00am... Monday night and Friday night will be out because I am on call those nights... Hopefully we can play this afternoon or tomorrow afternoon and not have to worry about evenings so much... let me know what you think or PM me...

[RPI-Fan]

Originally Posted by Sun Tzu

I have zero tolerance for unrealistic play.

Chill out.

Quitting half-way through the first game of the season is realistic???

[mgadfly]

I don't really want to get into this what is realistic and what is not thing with Sun Tzu, but at the same time he is impliedly (if not explicitly) characterizing my play as something other than it is. I'm not sure if this is because he doesn't know what is realistic or if it is just because he's kind of a poor sport. Here is what happened:

I won the coin flip and elected to receive.
Kickoff was pretty normal.
1st and 10: I ran a slant and go with my WR. I figured if he was in a zone or cover two I would hit my guy on the slant portion of the play. If he was in man, I'd lob the ball out deep during the go portion of the route. The idea was that even if it was incomplete, maybe a deep pass would get him thinking I like to go deep which would keep him in nickle/bear/and dime packages more than usual. I snapped the ball, read the defense, it was cover 2, so wanted to throw a quick strike quickly. Unfortunately I tapped the button instead of pressing it hard and my QB floated a perfect pass to his safety. Interception.

1-10 his ball: I called a Bear package and rushed my ROLB in addition to my four down linemen. Safties dropped into zone, with CBs bumping at the line. He ran the ball for negative or no gain.

2-11 his ball: I called a two deep soft zone rushing just four linemen. I did move my DE (that I was controlling) behind my DT because I called a loop stunt and I started to go early and decided to just keep him there rather than try to get him back to his spot. He dropped back, no pressure from my four man rush, fired a nice pass off to the flat where his HB was. His HB ran over my LB that was covering the flat, and then ran over the first DB he came to. 12 yard gain, first down.

1-10 his ball: I rushed my four down linemen and my MLB (figuring it'd be a run). But the MLB blitz was a dotted line blitz which I think means "delayed" blitz. I was hoping that if a whole opened up for the HB, that my MLB would fill it during his blitz. It worked and he only got a yard or two on the play.

2-long his ball: He'd burnt my two deep soft zone the first time, so this time I decided to really blitz (the other two times I'd rushed five guys were on running downs, and I still dropped 6 guys into coverage on those). I brought two LBs in addition to my four down linemen. He rolled out to his left and got creamed by one of my players (not sure which one) and his QB dropped the ball and my team recovered.

1-10 my ball: I called a quick play (regular process) because I was afraid he was going to challenge the play (I wasn't sure if he was in the process of throwing--see "tuck" rule from NE v. Oak). He didn't challenge the play. I have to admit that I'm not positive what package he was in, but I think it was bear. I had a running formation in and rushed off the right side (I'd learned my lesson about throwing against him) for seven yards.

Now, what I wanted to do was to keep his same package on the field. If the game completely accurate there would be a "quick huddle" option where neither team was allowed to change packages, but are able to call a new play. I had a running formation on the field with his formation that I felt I could run against, and had short yardage for a first down. SO I no huddled... but, I sent a man in motion, took my time and gave him every opportunity to call a timeout or to call an audible.

2-3 my ball: I ran off the left side for a pick up of 3 and had a 3rd and less than 1.

Now, I still have my formation that I like to run with, and he has a play/package that I can run against, and I have a 3rd and less than 1. During the first 20 plays of an NFL game a coach would probably stick to their scripted plays allowing a change of personnel, but not necessarily. In addition, if the same situation occurred at another point in the game, I'm quite confident the NFL team on offense wouldn't make a personnel change thus being forced to allow the other team to bring in their goal line package.

3rd and 1: he hits start and selects quit game.

That's a play by play of the entire game... Obviously this is from memory, and I might be wrong or have missed a play, but this is what happened as I recall it. If going no huddle from time to time is "unrealistic" to such a degree that others don't want me to do it, or if blitzing 6 guys once every five or so plays on defense (right after the other team burns my zone coverage) is "unrealistic" then I very willing to adjust my play. The only times where I plan to use no-huddle is when the other team has the wrong defensive package (goalline of 43 in a long yardage situation or nickel/dime/bear in a short yardage situation) for the situation, and I have the proper offensive package. So both conditions have to be met (I have the right package on offense and they have the wrong package of defense), which doesn't happen all that often.

As for the blitzing, that's just a joke in my opinion, because in the two passing situations I called a blitz once, but only after my zone had been burnt (plus, with the DBs the Seahawks have in this game, I'm going to have to blitz a little more often than other teams).

Now I've said my peace.

[Eaglesfan27]

Blitz against me

I'll burn you

[gstelmack]

Gadfly, right now I still haven't seen any evidence you did anything wrong. And as Eaglesfan says, you start blitzing a lot, players will start burning you. There's a counter to pretty much everything.

BigDPW, I am likely to be busy this afternoon, but if not I'll drop you a line. Otherwise I can arrange to be online at any point tomorrow. Pick a time and I will be there (if you want me to pick a time, I'd do sometime between noon and 1 Eastern when my daughter is taking a nap, but I really have nothing else planned all day and so can arrange to be on at any time).

[Eaglesfan27]

Originally Posted by gstelmack

Gadfly, right now I still haven't seen any evidence you did anything wrong. And as Eaglesfan says, you start blitzing a lot, players will start burning you. There's a counter to pretty much everything.

Exactly. I wasn't trying to be cocky, ok maybe I was being a little cocky and funny. I haven't heard anything that you have done wrong. There is a counter to pretty much everything which is why I do think this game is so good in the gameplay aspect (particularly in the MP area) I just wish the franchise mode was on par with the gameplay (although I'm still having fun with my dynasty despite several shortcomings in franchise mode that bother me.)

[SackAttack]

I had no idea quitting was part of the art of war.

[gstelmack]

Important safety tip: there are no ties. Every game is treated like a playoff game. So if, say, you're in a tight defensive battle, and the game is tied at 14-14, and it goes to overtime, and on the last play of overtime you go for a 50-yard FG in the hopes that you might win it, and you miss the FG, your opponent will get the ball to start the second overtime.

BigDPW and I just had a WHALE of a game. I kept Jamal Lewis mostly in check until late, but Delhomme could not complete a pass to save his life. Two big runs by Stephen Davis kept me in it, but a fumble in the red zone by Davis and an interception by Delhomme while near FG range on my first possession of overtime kept the Ravens in it. See-saw battle ended 3:12 into the second overtime when Boller found Darling in the right corner of the end zone for the winning TD.

We were both shocked when he missed the 50-yarder at the end of OT1 and it started OT2, so everyone be ready. But man, what a game! I'll have to rest a bit before figuring out a good recap for this one.

[BigDPW]

WOW what a game... I will have a recap later too... Gotta go to work right now... I wish I could watch this game over and over... So many twists and turns...

[gstelmack]

(I'll post this on the league site as well, soon. BigDPW, I think you can also edit the recap on the league site if you want to add your 2 cents there...)

In a titanic, back-and-forth, defensive struggle, Baltimore game out the winner with a 20-14 double-overtime victory over Carolina.

Neither team did much in the first quarter. Each team went 3-and-out on their first possession. Baltimore did manage two first downs on their next drive, including a 4th-and-1 conversion from Jamal Lewis, but Panthers Safety Traveras Tillman intercepted Kyle Boller to kill the drive.

On the ensuing drive, Stephen Davis broke open down the left side of the field for a 68-yard touchdown run on the first play of the second quarter. It looked like that might be all Carolina would need as the teams again traded 3-and-outs on the next two drives. Then Boller hit Kevin Johnson for a 21-yard strike, and suddenly Baltimore was threatening. Jamal Lewis ground out 14 yards on 3 carries to get Baltimore to Carolina's 28 yard line with 1:29 left in the first half, but a delay-of-game penalty thanks to one too many hot route calls followed by a sack of Kyle Boller by Julius Peppers left Baltimore with a 4th-and-21 at the Carolina 40 and 46 seconds on the clock. Baltimore ran the clock down, then trotted out Matt Stover to attempt to put some points on the board before the half.

Stover lined up, pummeled the ball, and had it headed down the middle. Everyone is holding their breath, watching close as it sails to the uprights, but it falls about a yard short. Unbelievable kick, but with a crosswind there was no help to nudge it the extra little bit. Carolina decides to play it safe and tries a sweep around the right side that goes nowhere, and the first half ends with Carolina clinging to a 7-point lead.

To this point, there has not been much offense. Take away the Stephen Davis 68-yard TD run, and Carolina has done nothing, going 3-and-out on 2 of their drives and the second half whistle ending their other drive. Baltimore has put together some first downs, but their only threat died on penalties and a sack. The second half changed all that, however.

Chris McAlister finally makes a mistake, and Steve Smith gets open behind him for a 42-yard reception down the right sideline to put Carolina in scoring position. Three Stephen Davis runs sets up Carolina at the Baltimore 11 yard line. Delhomme drops back and finds Stephen Davis all alone in the right flat. Davis grabs the ball, takes 2 steps, and a mad Chris McAlister pummels him and knocks the ball loose. Baltimore returns the fumble 28 yards to set them in business at their own 37 yard line. A huge opportunity wasted that will come back to haunt Carolina.

Baltimore uses the momentum to get their offense going again. Two 20+ yard completions by Kyle Boller sandwich a pair of Jamal Lewis runs to set up a 1-yard TD run by Lewis. Carolina's defense looks lost as they give up the 7 play TD march that ties up the game at 7 apiece.

But things quickly return to normal, as the third quarter closes with a Carolina 3-and-out followed by a Ravens 3-and-out.

Thanks to the strong punting leg of Todd Sauerbrun and strong returning of Drew Carter, Carolina is winning the field position battle in these punt exchanges and has the ball at their own 44. Mushin Muhammed finally manages to hang on to a pass for a nice short completion on the first play of the fourth quarter, and then Carolina watches Baltimore pinch in their linebackers towards the middle. Stephen Davis takes the handoff, steps out of a shoestring tackle, and breaks open another long run (this time 51 yards) down the left side for the go-ahead touchdown! The extra point is good, and Carolina has the lead again at 14-7.

Baltimore gets the ball back with plenty of time on the clock, knowing they need to put something together. Todd Heap finally comes alive with a couple of nice catches, and Jamal Lewis finds a bit of running room to move Baltimore into Carolina territory. Travis Taylor and Jamal Lewis combine to keep the drive alive, and Baltimore caps it off with an 8-yard TD run by Jamal Lewis off the left side. The tight end on that side does a nice job of sealing off the blitzing linebacker to open the hole, and once again the game is tied.

And the game immediately returns to form, as regulation ends with three 3-and-out drives, 2 from Carolina and one from Baltimore. Baltimore wins the toss in overtime and elects to receive.

Carolina catches a huge break, though, as Clarence Moore misjudges the kickoff and ends up smothered at his own 9. Boller and Lewis can't get anything going against the aggressive Carolina defense and are forced to punt from deep in their own territory. Drew Carter gets a nice 20-yard return, and Carolina is set up on Baltimore's 39-yard line.

Knowing they have a weak leg in John Kasay, Carolina knows they need a first down before they have a shot at kicking the winning FG. When Stephen Davis goes nowhere, Delhomme drops back and tries to find Ricky Proehl on a corner route. But Gary Baxter is right there and makes a nice leaping interception to kill the Carolina drive. Once again a Carolina threat is defused thanks to a turnover.

Baltimore is set up at their own 19, but manages to once again find some offense. Todd Heap grabs a 17-yard pass, and Jamal Lewis puts in some solid if unspectacular runs, but an incompletion breaks up the pattern and Baltimore is forced to punt from midfield.

Drew Carter manages another nice 20-yard return for Carolina to set them up at the 24, and Stephen Davis uses 2 strong runs to set up a second-and-1 at the 45. But a busted screen pass and a drop by Steve Smith (who had Chris McAlister draped all over him for most of the game) forces another punt.

Thanks to both teams finding some offense, Baltimore now has the ball back at their own 15 but with only 21 seconds left on the clock. Kyle Boller looks unconcerned, however, as completions to Todd Heap and Travis Taylor move them 45 yards in only 11 seconds. A 7-yard run by Jamal Lewis sets up Matt Stover at the 33 with 4 ticks left on the clock.

Once again he lines up, has a clean snap and hold, and nails the ball hard, straight, and true. Everyone is holding their breath as the ball sails closer, closer, closer, starts dropping, still true, and CLANG! hits the crossbar! The ball pops straight up, spinning end-over-end, and drops back in to the end zone. No good! The Panthers are jumping up-and-down celebrating.

But wait! The referee is trotting the ball back to the 39? What? You mean the game is not over yet? Carolina's offense trots back out onto the field.

And now Baltimore is hungry. Carolina gives up 2 sacks, and only manages 1 yard on a Stephen Davis run, and looks rattled. Sauerbrun punts away, and Baltimore is in business at their own 43. After an incompletion to Kevin Johnson, the offense gets rolling behind big Todd Heap receptions and solid Jamal Lewis running. Kyle Boller finally puts the fork in the game by finding Devard Darling open in the right corner of the end zone for a 6 yard touchdown.

This game was all about the defenses. Carolina bent but did not break, while 2 long runs by Stephen Davis kept them in it. Baltimore slowly wore down the Carolina defense by shutting down their offense and keeping the defense on the field, allowing them some late drives including the game-tying and game-winning drives. Carolina had their chances, but a fumble and an interception deep in Baltimore terriroty took the wind out of their sails. Both teams left it all on the field.

[SirFozzie]

Yo: Pumpy Tudors.. When do you want to play?

[SirFozzie]

Pats 17, Broncos 14. Wow.. what a game. Corey Dillon imitates Jim Brown on a couple plays, and we BARELY withstand a 4th quarter charge.. Great game, against a great opponent.

[Pumpy Tudors]

YEEEAAAH!! Broncos are on fire! We scored some points in Week 2! Bring on the next opponent!

Great game, SirFozzie. It was a joy to play you.

[SirFozzie]

So many long passes over the defenses head. Pissed me off near the end

[Pumpy Tudors]

That kid Luke can motor. It's too bad that he has stone hands. I'm surprised he held on for his touchdown catch. I just wished that I could've gotten Lelie more opportunities, but Ty Law had him blanketed. I had to keep everything on the other side of the field.

[SirFozzie]

Yup.. that last play was frightening. Too bad my "Opponent Time Out wasting" plays cost Dillon his 100 yard day.. how many tackles did he break on that first TD? five maximum tackles?

[Pumpy Tudors]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

Yup.. that last play was frightening. Too bad my "Opponent Time Out wasting" plays cost Dillon his 100 yard day.. how many tackles did he break on that first TD? five maximum tackles?

I lost count. It felt like every player on my team got at least one hand on him during that run. I almost cried.

[SirFozzie]

Laughs.. he kinda did it again on that second touchdown. All my games so far online have been nailbiters. I just want to get my mic working again

[Ironhead]

RainRaven, just wanted to let you know that I will be available any day after 6:00 PM EST this week.

[RainRaven]

Want to play at about 6:30 tonight and what's your AIM name?

[Ironhead]

Sure! I'll go fire it up in a few minutes! AIM name is Aaenuel.

[Ironhead]

Idabeejesus! If this league were any longer than 8 games I might just be mad that VC didn't include free agency in online leagues. After tonight's league game my injury list looks like this:

Starting OLB Matt Stewart - OUT, 15 Weeks
Starting FS Cory Hall - DOUBTFUL, 4 Weeks
Starting/Backup RB T.J. Duckett - OUT, 10 Weeks
Backup CB Kevin Mathis - OUT, 18 Weeks

[gstelmack]

Maybe next time we'll have to turn injuries off

[cartman]

In the first game against the Colts, Edgerrin James got hurt on the very first play!

Looks like I have the Sun Tzu bye this week, so no game for me. Next week is going to be iffy. What are the timeframes for the games? I'm leaving out on Sunday for a week long conference in Chicago. I'm back on Friday night, hopefully I can get the game in with my opponent.

[SirFozzie]

I'll be away Friday-Tuesday as well, but that should leave plenty of time.

(BTW, thank goodness for CD-RW's.. it allowed me to rip really good stadium Music

[gstelmack]

Originally Posted by cartman

In the first game against the Colts, Edgerrin James got hurt on the very first play!

Looks like I have the Sun Tzu bye this week, so no game for me. Next week is going to be iffy. What are the timeframes for the games? I'm leaving out on Sunday for a week long conference in Chicago. I'm back on Friday night, hopefully I can get the game in with my opponent.

There is a week to play the games. Typically the rounds end Friday at midnight (they can end sooner if everyone plays their games and I manually advance the league), which means you'll either want to get your game in on Saturday or late Friday.

[JeeberD]

Is Flasch still in the league or did he drop? I'm back in town and ready to play...

[ageofquarrel]

Hey bearcat when is a good time we can play? I can play at any time except thursday night.

[SackAttack]

Packers lost two more LB to the injured list this week. One of 'em is listed as out for a week, so I'm hopeful that means he'll be healthy for week 3.

[gstelmack]

Originally Posted by JeeberD

Is Flasch still in the league or did he drop? I'm back in town and ready to play...

Have you heard from him yet Jeeber? I know he was having connection issues, so I'm not sure of his status.

[Flasch186]

im in, just hadnt paid a lot of attention since i played early in wk. 1......ill be able to play Saturday night, jeeber

[JeeberD]

I'll be working Saturday night until about midnight central, so that won't work for me. Any other times that are good for you?

[Flasch186]

Originally Posted by JeeberD

I'll be working Saturday night until about midnight central, so that won't work for me. Any other times that are good for you?

Monday night or Tuesday night is best. If I know in advance I could play, early in the morning EST. start at around 8am, but i would rather not have to do that if possible.

[gstelmack]

Originally Posted by Flasch186

Monday night or Tuesday night is best. If I know in advance I could play, early in the morning EST. start at around 8am, but i would rather not have to do that if possible.

That's too late. We have a week for the league games, and I think the deadline right now is Saturday night at midnight (August 15 at 12AM, if memory serves). If the game is not played by then, the service will decide the result (I have no idea if it will be a tie, or if it will award a winner based on some arcane formula they have buried in there based on who shows on Live, how many drops/quits they've had, etc).

[JeeberD]

Crap. My available time the rest of this week is:

Friday night (after 9 or so Central)
Saturday morning and afternoon until about four Central

Any of that compatible with you, Flasch?

[Flasch186]

unfortunately, If Friday night can happen it'll be by luck. Its my GF's b-day this weekend and while when it comes to the USFL, and other stuff I put quite a demand on keeping my own time sacred, this weekend is basically hers. I know for sure a bunch of us are having a late night dinner at a steak house and if we end up home sometime early that night, Ill pop on to see if youre on. Saturday day is when i work, I sell new homes, so Saturdays and Sundays are the busy days. Saturday night im available and then perhaps early sunday morning, but apparently that would be too late. Ill try and get home Friday night otherwise we'll have to see what the hand of god decides, sorry.

[JeeberD]

No problem, if it works out, it works out. If not, no big whoop...

[gstelmack]

RainRaven, I can play anytime tomorrow (Sunday) up until about 10PM Eastern, so give me a yell if you're available. Otherwise it's 8-10 Eastern during the week, or anytime next Saturday.

[gstelmack]

Jeeber/Flasch, looks like the league has not advanced yet. You may still have today to play your game...

[gstelmack]

The league did not roll over as expected to the next week. You guys still have time to play your game. But don't take too long as the rest of us are waiting for week 3...

[Flasch186]

wha wha what!!?? my gawd, Jeeber, what about tonight?

[Eaglesfan27]

Once we do roll over to week 3, I'm available to play my next opponent most nights after 6:00 PM Central time up til about 11:00 PM. This weekend I should also be available for a fair amount of time (not sure when yet) Drop me a PM or post in this thread to set something up.

[JeeberD]

Gimmie a couple of hours and I should be good to go, Flasch. I have something to do now...

[Flasch186]

k post on here when youre ready, i check this much more often then im on xbox live

[JeeberD]

I'm ready to go! Let the ass kicking of the Titans begin!