The Official 2013 Stanley Cup Playoffs Thread

[RomaGoth]

Originally Posted by Crapshoot

Funny how all the bad calls are against the Wings in your reading eh?

Nope the calls have been bad in every series with every team, I just pointed out some of the ones in the Wings series because, you know, that's who I watch.

[Matthean]

Detroit Red Wings Fans Are The Best

[Suburban Rhythm]

With the Tigers in Pittsburgh, Leyland was asked if he was pulling more for the Penguins or the Wings. His response (paraphrasing)

I really like the Penguins...but the Wings owner also signs my paycheck

[Vince, Pt. II]

Originally Posted by RomaGoth

Nope the calls have been bad in every series with every team, I just pointed out some of the ones in the Wings series because, you know, that's who I watch.

Truth. There were several awful calls in both the Sharks/Canucks and Sharks/Kings series' as well. Going both ways, the Sharks definitely got the benefit of some questionable calls in each series.

[Danny]

All these sports threads need their titles revised.

"The Official 2013 Whine About the Refs Stanley Cup Playoffs Thread"

[RomaGoth]

Originally Posted by Danny

All these sports threads need their titles revised.

"The Official 2013 Whine About the Refs Stanley Cup Playoffs Thread"

This could be true, but as fans aren't we entitled to fair and competent officiating? I sure as hell know if I owned, coached, or played for a professional sports team (or even college for that matter) I would expect those things each and every game. If the current officials are not capable of doing their job correctly, then find someone who can. At any "normal" job (like the ones most of us on this board have) we would be fired for job performances like some of what I have seen in the NHL and NBA playoffs this year.

Why would you call a game changing/series changing penalty shot without being 100% sure it was the right call. All the shit that players get away with and these officials choose which ones matter and which ones don't? There is no consistency at all.

/end rant

[RomaGoth]

Originally Posted by Suburban Rhythm

With the Tigers in Pittsburgh, Leyland was asked if he was pulling more for the Penguins or the Wings. His response (paraphrasing)

Hopefully he won't be signing that paycheck much longer.

[RomaGoth]

Originally Posted by Matthean

Detroit Red Wings Fans Are The Best

lol

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by RomaGoth

The Blackhawks are coming dangerously close to being in the same Buttman club as the Pens.

Is that the "send the Red Wings" packing club?

[Fidatelo]

Originally Posted by RomaGoth

This could be true, but as fans aren't we entitled to fair and competent officiating? I sure as hell know if I owned, coached, or played for a professional sports team (or even college for that matter) I would expect those things each and every game. If the current officials are not capable of doing their job correctly, then find someone who can. At any "normal" job (like the ones most of us on this board have) we would be fired for job performances like some of what I have seen in the NHL and NBA playoffs this year.

Why would you call a game changing/series changing penalty shot without being 100% sure it was the right call. All the shit that players get away with and these officials choose which ones matter and which ones don't? There is no consistency at all.

/end rant

If every professional sport has such unfair, biased, crappy referees in the eyes of the fans then all I can say is that those fans need to get out and ref some games themselves. You know how hard it is to do the level of shit Sidney Crosby does? It's almost as hard to ref it.

[RomaGoth]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Is that the "send the Red Wings" packing club?

hahahaha good one RainMaker. Let me know when your team makes the playoffs 22 straight years and has 11 Stanley Cups over it's history.

[RomaGoth]

Originally Posted by Fidatelo

If every professional sport has such unfair, biased, crappy referees in the eyes of the fans then all I can say is that those fans need to get out and ref some games themselves. You know how hard it is to do the level of shit Sidney Crosby does? It's almost as hard to ref it.

I'm not saying that being a referee is easy, but if they aren't doing their job correctly then why are they still employed? Are there not certain guidelines and expectations to be followed?

[Fidatelo]

Originally Posted by RomaGoth

I'm not saying that being a referee is easy, but if they aren't doing their job correctly then why are they still employed? Are there not certain guidelines and expectations to be followed?

Of course there are guidelines, these guys are evaluated constantly. Who would you replace them with? Guys from the minors? Why would that be any better?

I'm sure you can find individual cases where a few minor league refs would be better than some of the 'fourth line' NHL refs (for lack of a better term), but on the whole the refs currently at the NHL level are there because they are the best in the continent at doing their job.

[Suburban Rhythm]

Originally Posted by Fidatelo

Of course there are guidelines, these guys are evaluated constantly. Who would you replace them with? Guys from the minors? Why would that be any better?

I'm sure you can find individual cases where a few minor league refs would be better than some of the 'fourth line' NHL refs (for lack of a better term), but on the whole the refs currently at the NHL level are there because they are the best in the continent at doing their job.

If you got rid of the "bad" officials, how would Gary Bettman carry out his grand scheme to favor the 23rd largest TV market in the country, after he already had to rig the lottery system to boost them up in the first place?

[Fidatelo]

Originally Posted by Suburban Rhythm

If you got rid of the "bad" officials, how would Gary Bettman carry out his grand scheme to favor the 23rd largest TV market in the country, after he already had to rig the lottery system to boost them up in the first place?

I always forget that Bettman is rigging things! Silly me. That totally explains why the Coyotes are perennial contenders as --- oh.

[Carman Bulldog]

Originally Posted by RomaGoth

Why would you call a game changing/series changing penalty shot without being 100% sure it was the right call.

Rule 61 - Slashing 61.1 Slashing - Slashing is the act of a player swinging his stick at an opponent, whether contact is made or not. Non-aggressive stick contact to the pant or front of the shin pads, should not be penalized as slashing. Any forceful or powerful chop with the stick on an opponent’s body, the opponent’s stick, or on or near the opponent’s hands that, in the judgment of the Referee, is not an attempt to play the puck, shall be penalized as slashing.


61.6 Penalty Shot – refer to Rule 57.3 – Tripping.


57.3 Penalty Shot - When a player, in the neutral or attacking zone, in control of the puck (or who could have obtained possession and control of the puck) and having no other opponent to pass than the goalkeeper, is tripped or otherwise fouled from behind, thus preventing a reasonable scoring opportunity, a penalty shot shall be awarded to the non-offending side. Nevertheless, the Referee shall not stop play until the attacking side has lost possession of the puck to the defending side.
The intention of this rule is to restore a reasonable scoring opportunity which has been lost by reason of a foul from behind when the foul is committed on the opponent in the neutral or attacking zone. If, however, the player fouled is able to recover and obtain a reasonable scoring opportunity (or a teammate is able to gain a reasonable scoring opportunity), no penalty shot should be awarded but the appropriate penalty should be signaled and assessed if a goal is not scored on the play.
“Control of the puck” means the act of propelling the puck with the stick, hand or feet. If while it is being propelled, the puck is touched by another player or his equipment, or hits the goal or goes free, the player shall no longer be considered to be “in control of the puck”.
In order for a penalty shot to be awarded for a player being fouled from behind, the following four (4) criteria must have been met:
(i) The infraction must have taken place in the neutral or attacking zone (i.e. over the puck carrier’s own blue line).
(ii) The infraction must have been committed from behind.
(iii) The player in possession and control (or, in the judgment of the Referee, the player clearly would have obtained possession and control of the puck) must have been denied a reasonable chance to score. The fact that he got a shot off does not automatically eliminate this play from the penalty shot consideration criteria. If the foul was from behind and he was denied a “more” reasonable scoring opportunity due to the foul, then the penalty shot should be awarded.
(iv) The player in possession and control (or, in the judgment of the Referee, the player clearly would have obtained possession and control) must have had no opposing player between himself and the goalkeeper.
It should be noted that if the attacking player manages to get around the goalkeeper and has no defending player between him and the open goal, and he is fouled from behind by the goalkeeper or another defending player, no goal can be awarded since the goalkeeper is still on the ice. A penalty shot would be awarded.

Looks pretty clear to me that it was the right call. You could argue the lack of consistency with officials enforcing penalty shots correctly, but by definition, that infraction was a penalty shot.

[Suburban Rhythm]

Originally Posted by Fidatelo

I always forget that Bettman is rigging things! Silly me. That totally explains why the Coyotes are perennial contenders as --- oh.

Winnipeg could be the Pittsburgh of Canada...there is hope for the Jets yet.

[Danny]

Pretty awesome conference finals matchups we have.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Carman Bulldog

Looks pretty clear to me that it was the right call. You could argue the lack of consistency with officials enforcing penalty shots correctly, but by definition, that infraction was a penalty shot.

Out of all the calls in the playoffs, I don't get why people are upset with the penalty shot. The refs followed the rules and it was a textbook penalty shot situation. I'm critical as hell of bad officiating, but they are in a no-win situation there. If they make the correct call, they get people saying "you don't normally see that". If they don't make the correct call, they get people saying "why aren't you following the rules?".

This was a pretty good write-up of the situation.

After Blackhawks’ penalty shot, what do we really want from NHL playoff officiating? | Puck Daddy - Yahoo! Sports

[Crapshoot]

Why Can't Canada Win the Stanley Cup? - NYTimes.com

Anyone else read Nate Silver on hockey?

[RomaGoth]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Out of all the calls in the playoffs, I don't get why people are upset with the penalty shot. The refs followed the rules and it was a textbook penalty shot situation. I'm critical as hell of bad officiating, but they are in a no-win situation there. If they make the correct call, they get people saying "you don't normally see that". If they don't make the correct call, they get people saying "why aren't you following the rules?".

This was a pretty good write-up of the situation.

After Blackhawks’ penalty shot, what do we really want from NHL playoff officiating? | Puck Daddy - Yahoo! Sports

Awarding a penalty shot in such a critical situation of a playoff game is like allowing the kicker to kick a free field goal during an NFL playoff game after the opponent ran into him. The consistency of officiating in the NHL is just abysmal from game to game and even from referee to referee. Of course, I am a Wings homer and gladly admit it. I guarantee the reaction would be the same from any other team if this situation happened to them.

In any case, it's over and done with. Time to move on. Still excited for the Wings future and they definitely got further this year than anyone could have imagined.

[RomaGoth]

Originally Posted by Carman Bulldog

Looks pretty clear to me that it was the right call. You could argue the lack of consistency with officials enforcing penalty shots correctly, but by definition, that infraction was a penalty shot.

I would argue this all day. Yes there was an infraction (slashing), but he still had a reasonable scoring chance there. Worst case scenario it should have been a 2-minute penalty. A penalty shot? That is a game-changing call in a tight series where worse things were not called on either side.

[RainMaker]

So you don't want the officials to make the correct calls if it can change a game? If you don't want to give up a penalty shot, don't commit a penalty that leads to one.

[RomaGoth]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

So you don't want the officials to make the correct calls if it can change a game? If you don't want to give up a penalty shot, don't commit a penalty that leads to one.

My argument was it could have been, and probably should have been, a 2 minute penalty. Calling a penalty shot there is marginal imo.

[Sublime 2]

I have no clue what the numbers are, but is penalty shot THAT much more favorable than a power play? Again, no clue...and the general point doesn't change, but just curious.

[britrock88]

Originally Posted by Sublime 2

I have no clue what the numbers are, but is penalty shot THAT much more favorable than a power play? Again, no clue...and the general point doesn't change, but just curious.

VERY rough math, but I would estimate a 2-2.5x better chance at converting a penalty shot.

[RomaGoth]

Originally Posted by Sublime 2

I have no clue what the numbers are, but is penalty shot THAT much more favorable than a power play? Again, no clue...and the general point doesn't change, but just curious.

Originally Posted by britrock88

VERY rough math, but I would estimate a 2-2.5x better chance at converting a penalty shot.

But hey, a penalty shot is more exciting right? Kinda like a shorter version of the shootout.

[britrock88]

Originally Posted by RomaGoth

But hey, a penalty shot is more exciting right? Kinda like a shorter version of the shootout.

4-on-4 is the most exciting aspect of the game, IMO. I sometimes wish they did playoff OT that way.

[bhlloy]

Not saying anyone is right or wrong, but I've never remotely thought of whether the player got a shot off as having any bearing on a penalty shot being called. My perception is if you are clear from the blue line and a penalty gets called, it's a penalty shot.

Now if that's not the rule and it sometimes doesn't get called that way, cool. But I can't ever remember seeing a situation where they didn't call it that way either.

[MizzouRah]

Should be a good day of hockey!

[Suburban Rhythm]

Originally Posted by bhlloy

Not saying anyone is right or wrong, but I've never remotely thought of whether the player got a shot off as having any bearing on a penalty shot being called. My perception is if you are clear from the blue line and a penalty gets called, it's a penalty shot.

Now if that's not the rule and it sometimes doesn't get called that way, cool. But I can't ever remember seeing a situation where they didn't call it that way either.

I believe the official wording is something to the effect of "interferes with a scoring chance", and must occur by a player from behind.

So, in theory if a guy is a poor skater, and the defender overtakes him, while it would still result in a penalty, if warranted, it wouldn't be a penalty shot.

I've always wondered if the NHL would ever consider the option to decline the PS and choose a 2:00 PP. Maybe not always the best strategy, but if you are up 1 with under 2:00...might be smarter to take the 2:00. Would make it harder for the opposition to pull the goalie. Attempting the PS and failing, other team has the remaining time to tie.

[Dr. Sak]

How Boland didn't get a penalty for that hit on Richards is beyond me. Left feet...check...initial contact with head...check...

[Dr. Sak]

Matt Cooke being Matt Cooke

[DaddyTorgo]

Crosby's a fucking little punk. Wish Chara had fucking decked him.

[SirFozzie]

a near Line-brawl at the end of the 2nd.. it's good to have a good hate on for the playoffs.

[EagleFan]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

Crosby's a fucking little punk. Wish Chara had fucking decked him.

Can't stand that punk Chara but would have loved to see him step on Cindy like the little bug he is.

[Suburban Rhythm]

Rask was un-fucking-real

Cooke is a dirtbag. But I love seeing him get 5+game, Marchand 2, and people will still cling to the "favored Penguins" BS.

Most enjoyable thing was Milbury post game.

"Malkin tried to go toe to toe with Bergeron..."
What a clown.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

Can't stand that punk Chara but would have loved to see him step on Cindy like the little bug he is.

Chara punk??

[Sublime 2]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

Chara punk??

Yeah, I'm thrown off by this as well. Sure he's a monster goob sometimes, but punk seems a little much.

one MTL hit aside (Pacioretty)

[Suburban Rhythm]

Not trying to answer for EF, but...

Tonight not the same, but going back to last year, Chara has acted...different in games against Pittsburgh. In particular, Dupuis, Kunitz and Neal made it a point to him EVERY.SINGLE.TIME. Chara eventually got...for lack of a better word, pissy. Almost like how dare these guys have the audacity to hit me!

The MaxPac play aside, I don't think Chara is dirty. And not sure if punk is the right word. But there's a bit of petulance there.

And yes, I'm saying this as fan of a team that employees Crosby, and some of you will find great irony in this.

[MizzouRah]

how do you shut out the penguins?

[Suburban Rhythm]

Originally Posted by MizzouRah

how do you shut out the penguins?

Well, Colin Campbell's son does play for Boston

wanted to see how it felt to say

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Suburban Rhythm

Not trying to answer for EF, but...

Tonight not the same, but going back to last year, Chara has acted...different in games against Pittsburgh. In particular, Dupuis, Kunitz and Neal made it a point to him EVERY.SINGLE.TIME. Chara eventually got...for lack of a better word, pissy. Almost like how dare these guys have the audacity to hit me!

The MaxPac play aside, I don't think Chara is dirty. And not sure if punk is the right word. But there's a bit of petulance there.

And yes, I'm saying this as fan of a team that employees Crosby, and some of you will find great irony in this.

Is that being pissy though? Or is that just being surprised that guys are actually putting a body on him? Maybe he's just not used to it?

[Suburban Rhythm]

I'd hope by this point in his career, he's adjusted to being hit.

PING Fidatelo-

I believe it was this year, but possibly late last season, Burmistrov caught Chara coasting after clearing a puck and dropped him. The remainder of the game, Chara went out of his way to chase Burmistrov. Remember this?

[Fidatelo]

Originally Posted by Suburban Rhythm

I'd hope by this point in his career, he's adjusted to being hit.

PING Fidatelo-

I believe it was this year, but possibly late last season, Burmistrov caught Chara coasting after clearing a puck and dropped him. The remainder of the game, Chara went out of his way to chase Burmistrov. Remember this?

I don't actually remember that but I don't doubt that it happend (I have a terrible memory). Burmy is actually surprisingly strong on his skates for his size and I can see him catching someone unawares.

Chara's response also wouldn't surprise me, and here is why I feel he acts like this. I feel that with his size, he could probably injure guys every second game if he were to really go throwing his body around. So, for the most part, I think he actually lays off guys a lot, not to the point of being ineffective or anything, but I just get the impression he actually goes a bit out of his way to try not to destroy people just because of his size (Paciorety hit aside, perhaps). So anyways, I wouldn't be shocked if in his head he gets pretty fucking pissed if some guy starts taking liberties with him when they both know Chara could destroy the other guy if he did similar things. So that's when he gets pissed and maybe tries to teach the guy a lesson about respect or whatnot.

It's just like that argument with Crosby last game. If Chara wanted to, he could have turned Crosby's tender jaw into mush in one swat, but instead he just talked trash and even let Crosby take a swat at him. I actually really respect that about Chara.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Fidatelo

I don't actually remember that but I don't doubt that it happend (I have a terrible memory). Burmy is actually surprisingly strong on his skates for his size and I can see him catching someone unawares.

Chara's response also wouldn't surprise me, and here is why I feel he acts like this. I feel that with his size, he could probably injure guys every second game if he were to really go throwing his body around. So, for the most part, I think he actually lays off guys a lot, not to the point of being ineffective or anything, but I just get the impression he actually goes a bit out of his way to try not to destroy people just because of his size (Paciorety hit aside, perhaps). So anyways, I wouldn't be shocked if in his head he gets pretty fucking pissed if some guy starts taking liberties with him when they both know Chara could destroy the other guy if he did similar things. So that's when he gets pissed and maybe tries to teach the guy a lesson about respect or whatnot.

It's just like that argument with Crosby last game. If Chara wanted to, he could have turned Crosby's tender jaw into mush in one swat, but instead he just talked trash and even let Crosby take a swat at him. I actually really respect that about Chara.

Very good point Fidatelo.

[Suburban Rhythm]

Originally Posted by Fidatelo

I don't actually remember that but I don't doubt that it happend (I have a terrible memory). Burmy is actually surprisingly strong on his skates for his size and I can see him catching someone unawares.

Chara's response also wouldn't surprise me, and here is why I feel he acts like this. I feel that with his size, he could probably injure guys every second game if he were to really go throwing his body around. So, for the most part, I think he actually lays off guys a lot, not to the point of being ineffective or anything, but I just get the impression he actually goes a bit out of his way to try not to destroy people just because of his size (Paciorety hit aside, perhaps). So anyways, I wouldn't be shocked if in his head he gets pretty fucking pissed if some guy starts taking liberties with him when they both know Chara could destroy the other guy if he did similar things. So that's when he gets pissed and maybe tries to teach the guy a lesson about respect or whatnot.

It's just like that argument with Crosby last game. If Chara wanted to, he could have turned Crosby's tender jaw into mush in one swat, but instead he just talked trash and even let Crosby take a swat at him. I actually really respect that about Chara.

I'm not even talking taking liberties here. No Matt Cooke shananigans.

As simple as it sounds, and you hear it talked about, especially over a 7 game series, hit the D every time they have to turn and retrieve.

The games that always stands out to me were a pair of of Sunday afternoon games last season, March/April time frame.

The first game, the Penguins jumped out to a big lead in the first, 3-0, Thomas got pulled. Seconds game a couple weeks later.

NBC made a point during the in-game video recaps, besides goals, to show the Penguins plan to hit Chara every time. I saw him get knocked over more that first game than I think all other PIT-BOS games combined.

I'm sure the score had alot to do with it too.

So, back to the original, punk I don't think is the right word. But there's a pattern with the Penguins games mentioned, the Burmi incident, and the MacPac incident - part of the reason Habs fans went nuts over that whole thing was Paccioretty had knocked over Chara just shifts before, and a scrum started after that. Many didn't believe Chara when he said he didn't know who the player he had hit was. I believe he knew, and for lack of a better word targetted him. Though I don't believe his intentions were to dent the post with Paccioretty's head.

He's not a dumb guy, and generally respected as a great captain, but seems like he snaps.

[Sublime 2]

Kind of hope the next time he 'snaps' it looks like this:

[Suburban Rhythm]

Originally Posted by Sublime 2

Kind of hope the next time he 'snaps' it looks like this:

Obligatory "Too bad that's all he'll be lifting this season" post

[DaddyTorgo]

Bad giveaway Sid

BAM...MARCHY!!!

28 seconds in.