Werewolf XCVIII - 24 Day Game Over - Post 2899

[henry296]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

soothsayer-pass vouched for saldana.

Just re-reading. Was this privately or publicly?

[henry296]

Alright,

I just finished re-reading the thread and even with current information I didn't pick up much else new.

My schedule on Monday will be even worse tomorrow with a business dinner tomorrow night which probably means i want even start reading until 9 PM at the earliest.

Given the events of Friday, I'm good with EagleFan, nfg22 and Kingfc22. DT seems really convinced on Schmidty and I have no read other than UTR, so he is not on my suspect list. For now Path and PurdueBrad, and saldana are ok due to their Telle vote, but we probably need to revisit in a day or two.

Therefore, I have four suspects, but all voted for Pass. They are Autumn, ISiddiqui, Jackal and Thomkal.

Since Thomkal cast the final vote on Pass, I won't vote for him today even though it looked like Pass was done no matter what.

Autumn - given the exchange a couple of days ago I think he is ok.

Jackal- The voting pattern with Chief Rum makes him lower on the list.

That leaves ISiddiqui and although it seems he has some type of power dealing with PMs, it seems a little odd to me. While, I know he is new that is often a good strategy for a new wolf, plus I noticed a lot of agreement posts and not much new info.

Therefore, since I'd like to make sure I least get in a vote since it is getting closer to the end.

Vote ISiddiqui

[EagleFan]

henry,

do you have any information about how the cunning would be handled with your power?


others.

I am still not sold on PB. I don't remember everseeing someone get saved that close to being voted out on the first two days of a game and not be a wolf.

He sent me a PM claiming a third party type of role and asking me to not vote for him. This could very easily be the case, or he could be the cunning (just following this through as it sounds as if he has at least told DT the same, of not others). If the cunning is in trouble of being lynched claim a different role, one that doesn't seem to be able to be verified based on what he told me at least, and hope it gets you scanned. This way maybe you survive the lynch and you get scanned and "cleared".

He may very well be clean and just got a bad break but I would think that he would have been lynched by now in most games just due to the fact that it looked like he was being saved in each of the first two days.

Okay, now I am probably out for the night (just got done a conference call with off-shore and this game is a lot less frustrating so I figured it could help me recover from the call-- we're a casino software and hardware company and the idea kept coming up to discontinue doing something and I had to keep saying "this is something that ALL our Vegas clients, even in their non-Vegas properties, use, it was requested by and designed for them, we NEED to keep doing this." but the idea kept coming up to stop doing it because it would be easier to not have to support it).

oh, don't read that as "we need to vote PB", just trying to figure out what got him to high trust. Was it just a PM from the seer? If that is the case we still no nothing about this seer and if they are just a wolf lying to DT (this is the crux of my arguement).

[EagleFan]

Norm!!!!!!!!!

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

henry,

do you have any information about how the cunning would be handled with your power?


others.

I am still not sold on PB. I don't remember everseeing someone get saved that close to being voted out on the first two days of a game and not be a wolf.

He sent me a PM claiming a third party type of role and asking me to not vote for him. This could very easily be the case, or he could be the cunning (just following this through as it sounds as if he has at least told DT the same, of not others). If the cunning is in trouble of being lynched claim a different role, one that doesn't seem to be able to be verified based on what he told me at least, and hope it gets you scanned. This way maybe you survive the lynch and you get scanned and "cleared".

He may very well be clean and just got a bad break but I would think that he would have been lynched by now in most games just due to the fact that it looked like he was being saved in each of the first two days.

Okay, now I am probably out for the night (just got done a conference call with off-shore and this game is a lot less frustrating so I figured it could help me recover from the call-- we're a casino software and hardware company and the idea kept coming up to discontinue doing something and I had to keep saying "this is something that ALL our Vegas clients, even in their non-Vegas properties, use, it was requested by and designed for them, we NEED to keep doing this." but the idea kept coming up to stop doing it because it would be easier to not have to support it).

oh, don't read that as "we need to vote PB", just trying to figure out what got him to high trust. Was it just a PM from the seer? If that is the case we still no nothing about this seer and if they are just a wolf lying to DT (this is the crux of my arguement).

i will tell you this - it's more than just the PM from PB that earned him this trust. I have alluded to it before, but i won't go into more detail right now. it's not my place.

EF - if the seer is a wolf lying to me then frankly...we are fucked. if that's the crux of your entire argument that is a pretty weak argument. I only had one person reveal to me as a seer all game, and I've gotten reveals from everyone. i find it inconceivable that in a game this size and complexity we wouldn't have an ordinary-seer.

[DaddyTorgo]

EF - you're obsessing over this whole cunning thing. Let's catch the regular wolves first and THEN worry about the cunning.

[PurdueBrad]

Catching back up, will be on mid to late morning and then most of the day.

[PurdueBrad]

Although looking at the unverified list, especially IF paired with Henry's list, it's almost fish in a barrel time.

[PurdueBrad]

Originally Posted by henry296

Therefore, I'm convinced Thomkal, Pass, Isidiqui and Autumn are our conspirators.

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

No Verified Trust
TheJackal
Autumn
ISiddiqui
Thomkal

Until I see a real reason to distrust the above two posters, I will vote off of their lists (which are virtually identical with the exception of Jackal appearing on DT's which means no vote for Jackal for now). So until I really get back into this, I'll introduce Danny's choice for lynch again:

vote Thomkal

[PurdueBrad]

As for EF pushing for more info, I understand that as he usually has a good thinking-outside-the-box mind (so I wouldn't hang him for it yet) but I do also think that sometimes there are things that need to remain unclear. IF the scanned players are laid out, I agree whole-heartedly with DT that then we end up painting a target on someone. Why push to out someone?

I do understand, again, where EF is coming from as the public role of Jack Bauer makes it hard to question him but I felt that DT was far from lathuming and I don't think he's even really used his influence too much or to the detriment of the village. I will say this, lynching me on day 1 or day 2 would have been the same result, basically another lost villager.

EF, I can say this, don't say you've never seen something and expect it to remain that way because things will happen (for instance, end of this game, I'm going to be good and you were also in the game where I melted down at Lathum [Danny's?] where I was up for lynch D1 and D2, beat both, got lynched D3 and was good there too, so I think you have seen it).

Also, and I am probably mistaken and don't have complete time to go back, but was EF the other person that claimed they have a separate win condition of having to outlive someone? If so, then I'm guessing by his push that I'm the person he needs to outlive to win his own game. If that wasn't EF then, well, I'm wrong.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by PurdueBrad

Until I see a real reason to distrust the above two posters, I will vote off of their lists (which are virtually identical with the exception of Jackal appearing on DT's which means no vote for Jackal for now). So until I really get back into this, I'll introduce Danny's choice for lynch again:

exactly what i'd propose. *nods*

i likely have a fairly busy day, but am trying to make myself around.

[EagleFan]

Originally Posted by PurdueBrad

EF, I can say this, don't say you've never seen something and expect it to remain that way because things will happen (for instance, end of this game, I'm going to be good and you were also in the game where I melted down at Lathum [Danny's?] where I was up for lynch D1 and D2, beat both, got lynched D3 and was good there too, so I think you have seen it).

I'm not saying that you are bad because of teh day one nd day two stuff. I am just saying that I have never seen a circumstance like that happen where the village doesn't try to find out more about that (which yes may end up in a bad lynch but it also may end up netting more).


Messed up on my multiple quote but for DT. It is not a week arguement. The argument is that we are not being given a chance to make the decision ourselves but told to blindly trust. More can be done from a team working together than from one person trying to call all the shots.


"Just do what I say and don't question" does not go over well with me in any situation. Every time I have encountered a situation like that (RL, non-RL, whatever) it has always led to disaster.

[EagleFan]

dola: I know I typed he wrong weak but realized it when I hit submit...

[Barkeep49]

For official purposes the clock began again at 5 AM. No votes from the weekend are accepted.

[nfg22]

I dont know who to vote but since im going to be out for a while ill throw a provisional out there.

Acted way too cool when I revealed pass was a wolf. I think He thought it was over and tried to earn cred.

Vote ISiddiqui

[nfg22]

Im out till much later...

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

I'm not saying that you are bad because of teh day one nd day two stuff. I am just saying that I have never seen a circumstance like that happen where the village doesn't try to find out more about that (which yes may end up in a bad lynch but it also may end up netting more).


Messed up on my multiple quote but for DT. It is not a week arguement. The argument is that we are not being given a chance to make the decision ourselves but told to blindly trust. More can be done from a team working together than from one person trying to call all the shots.


"Just do what I say and don't question" does not go over well with me in any situation. Every time I have encountered a situation like that (RL, non-RL, whatever) it has always led to disaster.

what you're missing though is that i'm not trying to call all the shots. I'm just telling you what is a good idea and a bad idea from what i know. obviously if you come out saying you want to vote for someone in my CoT (outside of PB and NTN) I have to be more-defensive than I would otherwise though, because that person might be the seer. That's why I'm pushing back very hard on all of those people.

I don't think anybody is pushing for an NTN-lynch, but in the case of PB I'd simply push back and say "go ahead, but it's not the highest-probability of finding a wolf."

He's not in my high-trust list, but he also doesn't appear on henry's list, so I'm not sure why we'd even look in his direction until we have exhausted the list of 3-4 that we have that are in worse-shape trust wise.

I'm not trying to be heavy-headed EF, or shut down discussion. I'd be curious to know which of the people on my list or henry+my combo list you'd be interested in lynching?

[Thomkal]

I'm leaning towards voting EagleFan today personally. I can't understand why he's being so forceful and negative towards the only known good in the game.

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by henry296

That leaves ISiddiqui and although it seems he has some type of power dealing with PMs, it seems a little odd to me. While, I know he is new that is often a good strategy for a new wolf, plus I noticed a lot of agreement posts and not much new info.

Not exactly (on the power). Though DT knows more about it.

I may tend to agree a lot, but I'm still figuring this game out, after all. I tend to have a lot of questions on is a certain poster acting like they normally do and whatnot, but not all that comfortable with advancing new info, especially when more experienced WW players may consider it not that new. Basically, I'm just feeling things out.

[hoopsguy]

Conspiracy kill coming momentarily - just in case anyone was planning any actions as I'm writing this one up.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

Not exactly (on the power). Though DT knows more about it.

I may tend to agree a lot, but I'm still figuring this game out, after all. I tend to have a lot of questions on is a certain poster acting like they normally do and whatnot, but not all that comfortable with advancing new info, especially when more experienced WW players may consider it not that new. Basically, I'm just feeling things out.

please, ask your questions. it might help us to reconsider things we overlooked, or you might have a unique insight.

as far as your power - i'm having a hard time figuring who it can be used on, and i want to be sure, because if it fails you're going to be an immediate target of a lot of folks. you might be able to use it on PB (again everyone, to my knowledge it's non-lethal).

[DaddyTorgo]

bastard conspiracy members

[DaddyTorgo]

in-thread: brian d, saldana, thomkal

[DaddyTorgo]

(just fyi, not saying draw any conclusions from that about anyone)

[BrianD]

Even with all of the arguing taking place over most of this game, I'm thinking that EF is probably OK. I don't get the impression that he is fighting against DT as much as he is fighting for the respect of his ideas. It can be frustrating when you come out with a long thorough analysis and have it not gain much attention. I'm just reading frustration in most of EF's posts.

[DaddyTorgo]

i'm sorry if EF feels like i'm not respecting his ideas. i certainly do. hell...i consider myself generally a weak villager, so this is a tough game for me.

i just have to push back hard when he goes after someone he knows is good so that my pushing back if/when someone looks towards the seer looks exactly the same. i want to cut off the potential that we lynch the seer before it ever gains any momentum, which means cutting off the potential for lynching anyone in my high-trust list (by definition).

[DaddyTorgo]

sorry - should say "when he goes after someone I know is good"

[DaddyTorgo]

i'm unsure which of ISid, Autumn, and Thomkal to go after first - hell I welcome everyone's insight into that.

Autumn has provided me with correct information, but that isn't to say that he couldn't be a wolf seeking to gain trust (hence why he's on medium-trust)

[Thomkal]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

(just fyi, not saying draw any conclusions from that about anyone)

as well you shouldn't as everyone has had all weekend to get orders in.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Thomkal

as well you shouldn't as everyone has had all weekend to get orders in.

very true. it's just my habit of noting who's around.

[Poli]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Conspiracy kill coming momentarily - just in case anyone was planning any actions as I'm writing this one up.

Beep, beep, beep, beep...

[The Jackal]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

very true. it's just my habit of noting who's around.

Careful with that though, way too close to metagaming. It's one thing to note who's around at a lynch deadline in the thread and has a chance to change a vote or whatever, but it's another to base suspicions off who's in the thread when an event happens. No thanks.

[The Jackal]

We'll see what happens with this conspiracy kill but I'm still deciding between Thom and ISidd.

[DaddyTorgo]

it definately didn't mean anything...particularly coming off a weekend. just force of habit i guess.

[DaddyTorgo]

*waves to evil-Passacaglia*

[DaddyTorgo]

i thought there was a kill coming?

*major let-down*

[BrianD]

I've been holding off on saying much until I figure out if I am still alive.

[EagleFan]

Wow, long write up. Someone mentioned an idea that maybe they get two every other night. Is this that "night"?

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by BrianD

I've been holding off on saying much until I figure out if I am still alive.

unless it's some sort of reveal or something, you should probably get it out there. gives us more thoughts to work with

[BrianD]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

unless it's some sort of reveal or something, you should probably get it out there. gives us more thoughts to work with

Nothing that cool, just ramblings from a confused villager.

[EagleFan]

Blocked somehow? Another unsuccessful attempt on DT? Mod got tied up with RL issues?

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by BrianD

Nothing that cool, just ramblings from a confused villager.

He was a man and a friend always
He stuck with me in the hard old days
He never cared if I had no dough
We rambled around in the rain and snow

And here's to you, my rambling boy
May all your rambling bring you joy
Here's to you, my rambling boy
May all your rambling bring you joy

In Tulsa town we chanced to stray
We thought we'd try to work one day
The boss said he had room for one
Said my old pal we'd rather bum

And here's to you, my rambling boy
May all your rambling bring you joy
Here's to you, my rambling boy
May all your rambling bring you joy

Late one night in a jungle camp
The weather it was cold and damp
He got the chills and he got 'em bad
They took the only friend I had

And here's to you, my rambling boy
May all your rambling bring you joy
Here's to you, my rambling boy
May all your rambling bring you joy

He let me here to ramble on
My rambling pal is dead and gone
If when we die we go somewhere
I bet you a dollar he's a rambling there

[Passacaglia]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

*waves to evil-Passacaglia*

I'm around.

[hoopsguy]

The conspiracy must have access to my client's network - got pulled to address an issue ...

Although the hunt for the Conspiracy is going well at the moment, are the forces of the Government running out of time to stop the plot that is already in motion? The report from the Center of Disease Control and Prevention is not good - the cases of hemorraghic fever look to be related to some type of weaponized ebola virus.

Agents are dispatched to the Russian embassy to investigate reports of a rogue Conspiracy agent seeking shelter, but instead find a deathtrap. The ebola report appears to have been a fake, but the explosion that took out several agents and every living person in the embassy most certainly was not.

Among the dead is NFG22, whose back-channel service to your cause will be greatly missed. Hopefully the politicians can find some way to finesse the death of yet another president (albeit a Russian one) on US soil over the last week.

You are President Suvarov. While the FSB is but a mere shadow of what the KGB once was, it is still one of the world's foremost intellegence agencies. As President of Russia every 24 hours you may direct the FSB to investigate one player to learn if they are are a member of the Conspiracy (i.e. you're the seer).

[DaddyTorgo]

fuck

[The Jackal]

Damn. I didn't think he was the seer, you guys did a decent job of hiding that.

[BrianD]

Ouch.

[PurdueBrad]

Damn!

[DaddyTorgo]

i figured chief rum had figured that out in his role, and if not they would have figured it out when they nabbed him up.

but that's why i trusted NFG all game. Kudos to him for playing a great game as seer. i know he was bummed he didn't discover more wolves early, but he built us a hell of a CoT and also plucked Pass (which was if i recall correctly) something i mentioned in my final PM, to potentially take a look at Pass because that'd tell us about pass and 2 people he had views on.

and he managed to get all of his info out before he died.

not too shabby for a first game as seer!! you done will dude!!!

[DaddyTorgo]

so yeah, everyone else in the high-trust list was seer scanned, except for BrianD who I interrogated. That's why I trust all of them (notwithstanding a cunning wolf in there).