Mixed Martial Arts Thread (UFC and others)

[k0ruptr]

The more I look at Strikeforce's heavy class, the more I think its A, A- compared to the UFC's B, B+

deeper, and probably better fighters.

[PilotMan]

I had strong reservations about Fedor's ability to be effective in this fight, but I still hadn't lost all hope. I picked Silva to win the fight before hand after waffling for most of the night. It came down to sheer size for starters and the fact that Fedor said himself that he doesn't change what he does to train for fights. A MMA fighter who doesn't evolve gets left behind, and Silva just had too many checkboxes in his favor to ignore.

Fedor was just a guy looking for a homerun shot with a wide, and wild right hand. His striking was sloppy and his chin was open constantly. His resilience should be considered legendary though because that was one of the worst ass whipping's I have seen. The best part was that he was still defending himself, and I thought that Murgliotta did a good job of not stopping it.

I can't see a 3rd round going any differently though, but who knows. Silva was completely gassed. What did he have left, and Fedor looked the same as he did walking in the cage, except for half his face being swollen.

I agree that Overeem's speed will be too much for Silva, and frankly too much for Werdum too. He is so freaking big, fast and skilled I don't know if he loses to anyone right now.

Arlovski is done. I said it last time, and I have said it over and over. His chin is done. Kharitonov was going to win, and he wasn't tested at all.

The Griggs fight was the most entertaining. Those boys set the bar high.

Shane Del Rosario has some skills. He needs to step up, and get more fluid. He still looks a bit stiff, and he was almost totally gassed at the end. He still couldn't catch his breath by the interview. In fact, Del Rosario should have been in there, not Arlovski.

I understand now, why Strikeforce built the bracket's the way that they did. And it makes perfect sense.

Strikeforce originally wanted the belt to be on the line throughout the entire tournament, but they couldn't get the fight commissions to agree on the terms of the deal.

Title fights are to be 5 x 5 minute rounds, and in order for the title to follow the fighters through all the fights would have needed to be 5 x 5 minute rounds. That is what Strikeforce was striving for. If they get this then, the brackets are perfect.

The first fight is with Werdum, who arguably is the first in line for the title. The winner then takes on the winner of Silva/Fedor, who among the remaining fighters, should be #2 in line. The winner of that fight then fights in the Grand Prix final, against the winner of the other side of the bracket, who will have the momentum from his wins, and deserve the #3 spot. It's actually quite clever, and I wish it would have worked out that way.

I think having Fedor out of the way at this point is actually better for Coker. He can now focus on the remaining fighters, all who are better, and build momentum with his own guys, rather than try and ride on the hopes of Fedor. I still think the entire tournament is worthy of the hype it's getting and hopefully, it will give Strikeforce some momentum of their own. Last night's show was very good. Good fights, that the commentators didn't annoy the crap out of me totally.

[PilotMan]

dola

Gina Carano.

She may never be a world champion, but she can just sit there and smile and it would be alright with me.

[DeToxRox]

I love this tournament, but I do have to be negative for one second. Assuming Overeem wins (and if he gets by his next two fights I don't see how he loses in the finals even despite his past loss to Kharitonov) then what is there left for him in Strikeforce? Hendo was asked to be the 8th guy in the tournament should anyone drop last minute and he said he'd do it willingly, but I mean come on; Overeem would kill Hendo.

They have a few up and comers such as Del Rosario and Cormier but neither of them are challenges.

He could go to Japan and fight but DREAM probably won't make it out of 2011 and there aren't exactly challengers over there.

I have to assume Overeem winning the tournament will be what it takes for Dana to go all in to get him in UFC. The question becomes does Overeem have a champions clause in his deal? He signed his contract so many years ago when SF was basically a regional promotion that I have to wonder if he does have that clause.

I think that this is great for SF in the interim but in the long run may not help the company and in fact, may cost them because it could end up leaving their best and most marketable fighter without much to come back to.

[BYU 14]

You may be able to make a fight with one the of guys that doesn't win the tournament, with Barnett coming to mind.

I can see a Barnett vs Griggs/Del Rosario matchup if Barnett gets bumped with the winner in line for Overeem. Problem there is Griggs is a heavy handed fighter with good speed but Overeem would overwhelm him with his strength and I don't see him beating Barnett anyway. Del Rosario has potential but he can be hit and his cardio is horrible.

Barnett could make it to the finals and might present the best matchup overall of the remaining fighters against Overeem due to his size and experience.

One thing to remember is that Overeem does not have a granite chin and a much smaller Tyrone Spong gave him fits at times in the 2010 K1 Grand Prix by giving him angles and keeping him off balance, even backing him up at times before he slowed down and Overeem took the decision. That is the good thing about MMA, though Overeem has to be considered the favorite, all it takes is one solid shot with the 4 oz gloves or a mistake on the ground that gets him subbed. If he does lose that might actually be a better scenario for Strikeforce as it opens the door for some other fighters to get a shot and then a big money rematch for Overeem.

[DeToxRox]

Originally Posted by BYU 14

You may be able to make a fight with one the of guys that doesn't win the tournament, with Barnett coming to mind.

I can see a Barnett vs Griggs/Del Rosario matchup if Barnett gets bumped with the winner in line for Overeem. Problem there is Griggs is a heavy handed fighter with good speed but Overeem would overwhelm him with his strength and I don't see him beating Barnett anyway. Del Rosario has potential but he can be hit and his cardio is horrible.

Barnett could make it to the finals and might present the best matchup overall of the remaining fighters against Overeem due to his size and experience.

One thing to remember is that Overeem does not have a granite chin and a much smaller Tyrone Spong gave him fits at times in the 2010 K1 Grand Prix by giving him angles and keeping him off balance, even backing him up at times before he slowed down and Overeem took the decision. That is the good thing about MMA, though Overeem has to be considered the favorite, all it takes is one solid shot with the 4 oz gloves or a mistake on the ground that gets him subbed. If he does lose that might actually be a better scenario for Strikeforce as it opens the door for some other fighters to get a shot and then a big money rematch for Overeem.

Yeah. The only issue with Barnett is you cannot trust the guy to be involved in a huge fight. If Overeem and Barnett meet in the finals Coker may as well book it to take place in Japan so he doesn't have to worry about his winner failing a test post fight.

[molson]

I did like Fedor's entrance music. It kind of made me want to lace up my boots and drive Napoleon out of Russia.

[PilotMan]

A fight that clearly shows the deficits of the 10-point must system for 3 round fights. Better result than MMAWeekly had though. Still, IMO, not the result that was earned.

Bisping's knee was so illegal, Rivera should have just quit. He wasn't even in the fight after that.

Some other shocking wins on the card from down under. Dana can't be happy with George dropping. That title fight might just come to Guida yet.

[Suicane75]

Jon Fitch is my new favorite fighter. BJ Penn looked like he had just been forced to watch his mother have a gangbang.

I love Bisping in so much as I'll gladly pay $50 to watch him in there against someone who I think will beat the shit out of him

Edit: The 10 point must really does need to be adjusted. I'd love if they went to a half point system but getting these judges to adjust will be like pulling teeth.

[Suicane75]

Dave Meltzer is reporting that UFC have purchased Strikeforce. I don't even know what to make of it but it's intriguing as all get out.

[sovereignstar v2]

I'm as UFC-centric as I've ever been right now, but I don't like monopolies.

[molson]

Originally Posted by Suicane75

Dave Meltzer is reporting that UFC have purchased Strikeforce. I don't even know what to make of it but it's intriguing as all get out.

It would suck if Strikeforce goes away, or goes PPV-only. I'll pay for Showtime, but I'm not going to pay $60/month or whatever it is for UFC PPVs.

[thesloppy]

Personally, I'm all for monopolies...in fighting sports, at least. Basically, any structural/organizational move that is the exact opposite of boxing is what I'm in favor of. Conceivably, the bigger the org, the better potential for bigger and better fights.

...that said, the few cards after the absorption of the WEC have been notably lacking in my mind (on paper/hype that is, in fact they haven't been too bad), so what do I know. And I suppose they might just keep them their own entity, like the WEC was, for all sorts of possible contractual/financial reasons.

I guess off the top of my head, now that Fedor has faded a bit, the most interesting thing to come out of that would be tossing Overeem into the UFC HW mix. Or maybe Henderson/Silva II? As crusty as that would've sounded a fight or two ago, right now it's just as good as anybody else at 185. I'll admit to not being super familiar with the depths of the Strikeforce roster, who would you guys like to see in the UFC?

[General Mike]

Originally Posted by molson

It would suck if Strikeforce goes away, or goes PPV-only. I'll pay for Showtime, but I'm not going to pay $60/month or whatever it is for UFC PPVs.

There is a video at Zuffa Purchases Strikeforce -- MMA Fighting with Dana White talking about the deal.

[DeToxRox]

Once Strikeforce's commitment to Showtime ends it'll cease to exist, much like WEC.

[moriarty]

Unfortunately, there goes EA's MMA game. Most of their key fighters (like Fedor) were Strikeforce. I guess it serves them right for their NFL monopoly.

[TLK]

I don't see anyone beating Jones for a good long while...

[AlexB]

I never saw Shogun fight in Pride, so have only seen his UFC performances. From these fights he's not anything like worth the hype the UFC gave him, and while Jones looks awesome, as the ref pulled Jones away at the end of the fight Shogun was tapping to the strikes anyway.

But Jones does look damned good!

[sovereignstar v2]

Like other former Pride fighters, Rua has a lot of wear in him. He might be 29, but he's like an overused runningback at this point.

[saldana]

Originally Posted by sovereignstar v2

Like other former Pride fighters, Rua has a lot of wear in him. He might be 29, but he's like an overused runningback at this point.

that is absolutely fair to say, but he didnt even look in shape last night..there is a difference between guys that are past their prime (Liddell) vs. guys that were just not ready to fight...not to mention his pants were 3 sizes too small.

[BYU 14]

Watched the Bobby Lashley fight on HDnet tonight, not at all impressed with his cardio. He seriously needs to lose some of that upper body mass, he was gassed after the first round and if the guy he was fighting wasn't a blown up middleweight he would have gotten stopped in the 3rd. Only won because he was so much stronger and able to hold Ott down everytime he got a takedown.

Not a great card up top, but a couple of solid undercard fights.

[PilotMan]

Bellator had a really good show tonight. There were 4 good fights, one finish with a flying knee that resulted in a great KO and lightweight title fight with Eddie Alvarez in a non-stop 5 round battle.

[Dutch]

Originally Posted by BYU 14

Watched the Bobby Lashley fight on HDnet tonight, not at all impressed with his cardio. He seriously needs to lose some of that upper body mass, he was gassed after the first round and if the guy he was fighting wasn't a blown up middleweight he would have gotten stopped in the 3rd. Only won because he was so much stronger and able to hold Ott down everytime he got a takedown.

Not a great card up top, but a couple of solid undercard fights.

That's basically the knock on Lashley to begin with. He needs to be able to come strong for at least 2 rounds and be ready to sit on his opponents for at least one.

I was really hoping one day for a Lesnar/Lashley matchup but it just doesn't seem like it's ever even gonna be close to a fair fight.

[BYU 14]

Originally Posted by Dutch

That's basically the knock on Lashley to begin with. He needs to be able to come strong for at least 2 rounds and be ready to sit on his opponents for at least one.

I was really hoping one day for a Lesnar/Lashley matchup but it just doesn't seem like it's ever even gonna be close to a fair fight.

That's what was so disappointing to me as all they talked about leading up to the fight was how much his cardio had improved. Lesner is a guy that can carry his mass while showing pretty good cardio. Lashley just needs to lose some of that bulk as it saps him too much.

I agree on the fight as well, since Lashley is not a standup guy Lesner would destroy him quickly.

[PilotMan]

I thought it looked like Lesnar has dropped a lot of his mass in this week's episode of TUF. Am I wrong? Could that be part of his plan for his next fight, to get a little faster?

[PilotMan]

Ever see a guy get completely knocked out and not go down?

[Dutch]

Damn! That's great. I want to say I've seen something similiar (maybe here on FOFC?) where somebody took a beating...wouldn't go down and then took another beating. Two ass-whuppins for the price of one!

[BYU 14]

Originally Posted by PilotMan

I thought it looked like Lesnar has dropped a lot of his mass in this week's episode of TUF. Am I wrong? Could that be part of his plan for his next fight, to get a little faster?

Haven't seen TUF yet this season, I thought he was pretty damn quick at his normal size, I will have to check it out.

[saldana]

Originally Posted by PilotMan

I thought it looked like Lesnar has dropped a lot of his mass in this week's episode of TUF. Am I wrong? Could that be part of his plan for his next fight, to get a little faster?

i did think so too...i was also wondering how long ago they filmed these episodes...his face being all busted up made me wonder if those were still from the beating Cain gave him

[PilotMan]

They were filmed in January/Feb I think. Early this year for sure. That's just a nasty scar, it was a nasty cut.

[PilotMan]

UFC 129 is so stacked I can't believe it. Wow what a card!

UFC 129: St-Pierre vs. Shields Fight Card Rumors

Posted on April 21, 2011 by MMAWeekly.com Staff
Date: April 30, 2011
Venue: Rogers Centre
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada

Main Bouts (On Pay-Per-View):
-Georges St-Pierre (21-2; #1 Welterweight)* vs. Jake Shields (26-4-1; #3 Welterweight)*†
-Jose Aldo (18-1; #1 Featherweight)* vs. Mark Hominick
-Vladimir Matyushenko (25-5) vs. Jason Brilz (18-3-1)
-Lyoto Machida (16-2; #4 Light Heavyweight)* vs. Randy Couture (19-10; #10 Light Heavyweight)*
-Ben Henderson (12-2) vs. Mark Bocek (9-3)
Preliminary Bouts (On Spike TV):
-Nate Diaz (13-6) vs. Rory MacDonald (10-1)
-Jake Ellenberger (23-5) vs. Sean Pierson (11-4)
Preliminary Bouts (On Facebook):
-Yves Jabouin (15-6) vs. Pablo Garza (10-1)
-Claude Patrick (13-1) vs. Daniel Roberts (12-1)
-Ivan Menjivar (21-8) vs. Charlie Valencia (12-6)
-Jason MacDonald (24-14) vs. Ryan Jensen (15-7)
-John Makdessi (8-0) vs. Kyle Watson (13-6-1)

[thesloppy]

Really no mention of last night's card, yet?

Lost of blood! Teeth kicked out! Massive hematomas! Overall, this card ended up being well worth the money, which is a pretty big accomplishment, considering the build-up.

BONUS: Worst corner advice ever: "Just stand in front of him for a bit". Thanks, coach. I'll have that printed on my new teeth.

DOUBLE BONUS: I am fucking LOVING the emergence of Steven Seagal as a looming dark force in MMA. You know Dana and the Fertitta's are just sitting there, gritting their teeth thinking "Please don't say Steen Seagal's name! Please don't say Steen Seagal's name! Please don't say Steen Seagal's name! D'OH!!!". They spend years and years calculating a precise strategy to inch MMA's mainstream respectability along, as carefully as they can, and Seagall just wipes that shit out an instant, simply by slithering around in the perimeter of the frame, in his stoopid doo-rag and tactical glasses. LOVE IT!

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by thesloppy

Really no mention of last night's card, yet?

Without looking, I'd guess that GSP won again (yawn) and that Couture is damned near dead.

{goes to check results}

Close enough.

They spend years and years calculating a precise strategy to inch MMA's mainstream respectability along, as carefully as they can, and Seagall just wipes that shit out an instant, simply by slithering around in the perimeter of the frame, in his stoopid doo-rag and tactical glasses. LOVE IT!

I'd say Segal has as at least as much mainstream credibility/respect as Dana. White is very good at what he does, that doesn't necessarily make him respectable. Just the shootfight version of Vince McMahon.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Former NHL enforcer Donald Brashear to try MMA - ESPN

[EagleFan]

As it turns out the main event was probably the dullest of the matches.

I could not believe that hemotoma, that could have been extremely ugly if he took a direct shot on that.

Shields had to win the magician of the night. GSP looked pretty battered after that fight, but with what shots? He didn't get hit with anything that had power and yet he couldn't see out of one eye and was pretty battered at the end. Thought that something big must have happened to his eye the way he reacted to it, surprised he still did that well if it is as bad as he said at the end. Also surprised the ref didn't step in and stop it, I guess he didn't happen to mention "I can't see out of it" to his corner until after the fight (which would explain their reaction to him about it, it looks fine calm down).

That Machida knockout was unreal. Hated seeing Couture's career end like that but Machida earned a lot of respect in my eyes with how he acted after the fight.

Aldo looked like he was going to win easily but man did he tire out. I don't think I have seen him get that exhausted before, not that I have seen a lot of his fights though.

[Carman Bulldog]

GSP mentioned the eye to Jackson when it happened. However, they obviously didn't mention it to the officials or doctors. While it had an impact, GSP also looked a lot slower fighting around 193 than he does at his usual weight of 188.

[thesloppy]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

I'd say Segal has as at least as much mainstream credibility/respect as Dana. White is very good at what he does, that doesn't necessarily make him respectable. Just the shootfight version of Vince McMahon.

Yeah, I didn't mean to suggest that Dana was respectable, so much as he and the Fertitta's have likely taken an extremely shrewd and calculated approach towards improving MMA's public image over a long period of time. And as much as Seagal and the UFC are arguably treading on similar grounds, they probably still don't want him continually sneaking his name into their major events. It's a not-so fine line between Kevin James' pre-arranged mugging for the choir from his seat, and your sport's top champion attributing (at least part of) his success to Steven Seagal's shadowy techniques.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by thesloppy

Yeah, I didn't mean to suggest that Dana was respectable

Okay, so long as you weren't trying to go there

[DeToxRox]

GSP is never going to 185. He will not beat Anderson and in fact I think it'd be fairly ugly. I don' think GSP would be able to beat Sonnen either. He cannot finish fights. He got beaten up vs Jake Shields of all people. GSP fights smart and is an amazing athlete but he is just not going to be the same fighter at 185 and judging by his post fight comments I think he knows it too.

[Travis]

Hard to judge GSP on last night. He found 3 out of the 5 rounds with blurred/little to no vision in one eye and I think that had him freaked out. That was why I thought he was so evasive in his post fight interview as he seemed to just want to get out of there to go get checked out.

He's now won two title matches where he's sustained pretty serious injuries and has been dominate in the others when healthy. Assuming that he takes a reasonable amount of time to build his body weight up properly for a fight with Silva (which is what he has hinted at in the past), it should make for a pretty impressive fight. Sure, he may not get a lot of finishes, but it's not like he's been in trouble in those fights. Also hard to blame him for not finishing Hardy or Koscheck as I'm still not sure how either of those guys made it through those fights without getting KO'd or having to tap (especially Hardy on this front). I think it'd be very interesting to see what kind of game plan they'd come up with when GSP wouldn't have the size advantage the way he usually does now and if that might encourage him to look for a finish more than he seems to at this point. I really do hope we get to see GSP/Silva, that's the kind of fight that I think the UFC would regret not doing for a very long time.

[DeToxRox]

I don't see how GSP can be the same fight at 185 as he is at 170. I just think he'll lose some of the athleticism that makes him so superior to everyone else at 170. He'll still be very good in 185 but I think he won't be able to just takedown guys at will like he can at 170.

[dubb93]

Without having seen the fight last night myself I will say that what George is best at is what Anderson is worst at. Anderson's takedown defense is not good. He has a history of being taken down and controlled. Whether George is as good of a wrestler as Sonnen remains to be seen, but I think it goes without saying that George is a better wrestler than Lutter(who was able to take Anderson down at will too). It also goes without saying that George's BJJ is at a higher level than Sonnen's too. So I wouldn't count George out.

[Travis]

Originally Posted by DeToxRox

I don't see how GSP can be the same fight at 185 as he is at 170. I just think he'll lose some of the athleticism that makes him so superior to everyone else at 170. He'll still be very good in 185 but I think he won't be able to just takedown guys at will like he can at 170.

That's exactly it and I think that move would force GSP to evolve. At this point he's fighting to minimize his opponent's chance at a one shot victory (ala Serra) while still trying to find ways to get to a stoppage, but ultimately he's not exposing himself to unnecessary risk.

If he moves up to face Silva it'll be because he wants to prove to himself that he is the best fighter in the UFC/history. To fight Silva he would not only have to properly redefine his body to move up the weight class, but totally reinvent his approach for that fight because he wouldn't be able to minimize Silva the way he does the guys in his current weight class. This is why I'm so interested in seeing this fight because if anybody can pull off that transformation, I think GSP/Jackson are the ones to do it.

He wouldn't be the biggest/strongest, but he wouldn't be too far behind in those areas and there is a chance that he may still be the faster of the two depending on how they add the weight to his frame. There's also the chance that they horribly botch how they do that or how they approach the fight and that would be horribly disappointing, but not as much (at least to me) as this fight not happening. It's not often that you can get two guys this close to their prime who have dominated in the fashion they have and make a super fight.

Some may counter with Jones vs Silva, but we're only seeing the tip of the iceberg with Jones. Hopefully by the time he's in his prime there'll be somebody else who could superfight with him but right now it'd be much more a youth vs experience fight, which isn't necessarily a bad thing, but keeps it as option 2 on my list. Let Jones get further along his development path and clear out his division a lot more before throwing him into fights of this nature.

[DeToxRox]

Both Edgar and Maynard have sustained injuries so their fight at 130 is off.

[DeToxRox]

Awesome stuff here by Zuffa:

UFC announces accident-insurance coverage for all 350 contracted fighters
by Dann Stupp on May 09, 2011 at 1:15 pm ET
In a room packed with hundreds of mixed martial arts' top athletes, the long-awaited announcement was met mostly with relief.

Officials from Zuffa LLC, the UFC and Strikeforce's parent company, today announced all of its contracted fighters now get accident-insurance coverage. The company's fighters learned of the additional coverage today at the four-day "fighter summit" in Las Vegas.

That means training injuries – which are costly and not previously covered by their independent-contractor agreements – will be picked up by the organization.

"Our athletes are some of the very best in the world, and we've committed significant financial resources to provide them with insurance that complements the gold standard we have set for event-related coverage," UFC Chairman and CEO Lorenzo Fertitta stated in today's announcement. "We’re pleased to provide coverage that enables our athletes to seek and receive treatment for injuries sustained while preparing for bouts."

Officials didn't state how much the additional coverage for the approximately 350 fighters will cost the company, but a media call is planned for this afternoon.

Sticking with requirements by the regulatory state-athletic commissions, Zuffa LLC previously covered all injuries sustained during fight night. But pre-fight camps, which often produce a myriad of injuries, weren't covered. That often left fighters, who were banking on needed paydays, unable to compete, unpaid, and likely saddled with thousands of dollars of expenses.

After all, getting any type of year-round healthcare insurance is all but impossible for a professional fighter. (In fact, many fighters have trade/sponsorships deals with their local physicians to get basic services.)

The UFC's new policy adds 24-hour worldwide medical-life insurance and dental coverage, as well as emergency medical evacuation. Zuffa will pay 100 percent of all premiums to its partner, Houston Casualty, while employing a fulltime claims processor in house.

"As this sport continues to grow, we have been working hard to secure additional insurance coverage so that our athletes can perform at the highest levels," UFC president Dana White stated. "We're proud to give our athletes access to this type of insurance."

[DeToxRox]

Brock is having another episode of diverticulitis so he is out from 131 vs JDS; Shane Carwin is replacing him. Brock's career is probably in serious jeopardy.

[PilotMan]

Originally Posted by DeToxRox

Brock is having another episode of diverticulitis so he is out from 131 vs JDS; Shane Carwin is replacing him. Brock's career is probably in serious jeopardy.

You're probably right, but that sucks. Granted Carwin/JDS will be a fantastic fight, and probably better than Brock, but that just totally sucks for Brock and MMA in general.

[DeToxRox]

The coaches for TUF 14 are Bisping and Mayhem Miller.

Must see TV right there.

The season will be 135's and 145's. Should be a lot of good talent there.

[AlexB]

Is that how underwhelming a card it was last night that there were literally zero posts? Wow.

Watched it this morning: the first two fights on the main card were good (Stann/Santiago & Struve/Brown) but the other three were average at best.

Note to Dana White: Matt Hamill should not be headlining a full card

[SirFozzie]

Lesnar had a foot of his colon removed to deal with his diverticulitis. He's done, in my opinion.