Unofficial Official 2012-13 College Basketball Thread

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by Izulde

Anthony Bennett and Katin Rheinhardt are killing it right now for UNLV. Bennett hit three 3 pointers close together and I think White Mamba has three 3 pointers of his own. Both with 13 points and UNLV up 37-26 as of ESPN's shitty Gamecast.

Really kicking myself for not going but wanted to responsible and work on my thesis.

Yeah, they look good... but dumb 3rd foul by Bennett, and Colton Iverson is doing all he can to keep CSU in it with 17/8 in the first half.

[BishopMVP]

UCLA's Jordan Adams breaks a bone in his foot defending Solomon Hill's shot at the buzzer... done for the tournament.

[MrBug708]

Bad loss. Our usable rotation is 6

[britrock88]

We'll see if this gets some eyes in this thread.

I pulled together a list of threads re: NCAA tourney-related games that we had last year...

Standard
espn tournament challenge (george)
yahoo tournament pool (lathum)
$10 buy-in pool (clebrownsfan)

Funky
top gun (jbergey/radii)
pick 5 (butter_of_69)
starting eight (yd/wade moore)

IIRC, Lathum asked about Top Gun, and Radii said he likely wouldn't have time to run it again this year. I'm personally interested in the funky games, but figure it'd be good to ask all of you kind game managers if you plan on hosting these games once again.

[Radii]

Originally Posted by BishopMVP

Why judge A-10 and "power conference" teams by different standards - especially considering the A-10 is better than the SEC by pretty much any metric? I do think we need a win over VCU, I don't even think that guarantees it (and I'd rather make it a moot point by winning 2 games,) but I think our resume is at least comparable to those Last 4 in/Last 4 out he had and worthy of being in the discussion - and every other prominent bracket person/site seems to at least mention us.

I was responding to this:

I'm sure it has nothing to do with our low ranking in the BPI, a.k.a. ESPN's 2nd-dumbest attempt (after QBR) to replace admittedly flawed stats (RPI/QB Rating) with a worse, ESPN-branded version.

I think Lunardi wants to get the bracket right. I think the folks who write the Bubble Watch don't want to see teams they don't even list to get in. I think looking at their resume there is a very reasonable case to be made for why they are not going to get in. Thus, I don't think they are giving bias to their own branded rating. I think they're doing what they always do, trying to predict what the committee will think.

By the same token, that answers this:

Why judge A-10 and "power conference" teams by different standards

The goal of everyone doing any sort of predictions right now is to predict what the committee will do. So if you feel the selection committee has any sort of bias towards BCS conferences, or if you think that given equal resumes, Kentucky is in, whether its fair or not, the bracket predictor folks should be doing the same.

[Radii]

Originally Posted by britrock88

Radii said he likely wouldn't have time to run it again this year.

I'm definitely out. Not participating in any NCAA stuff either this year, lack of interest as opposed to time commitment.

[MizzouRah]

Typical Mizzou late game shenanigans!

[mauchow]

Tight game in Chicago. Wisconsin up three on Indiana.

IF we're going to win today we better win tomorrow to inch our way into the 3 seed much like FSU did last year after winning the ACC Tourney with 9 losses on the season.

I just hate the 4/5 seed spot. Highly probably that you would end up playing the #1 seed in the Sweet 16.

[Kodos]

Annoying that there was a double-overtime game, so we only got to see the end of the first half. Wisconsin is always a tough match-up for us. Should be a fun second half.

[mauchow]

Originally Posted by Kodos

Annoying that there was a double-overtime game, so we only got to see the end of the first half. Wisconsin is always a tough match-up for us. Should be a fun second half.

Ouch. I got to see the whole first half.

[mauchow]

Yucky few minutes for the Badgers there, looking like a bunch of middle school girls, dumb turnovers and lazy defense.

[dubb93]

Originally Posted by mauchow

Yucky few minutes for the Badgers there, looking like a bunch of middle school girls, dumb turnovers and lazy defense.

Don't worry. Crean does what he does in every game. He pulls Zeller and Olipido at the same time and IU struggles. This is usually when IU gives up a big lead and the game gets close. In a close game like this it allows a team like Wisconsin to spurt out to a moderate size lead.

[mauchow]

Originally Posted by dubb93

Don't worry. Crean does what he does in every game. He pulls Zeller and Olipido at the same time and IU struggles. This is usually when IU gives up a big lead and the game gets close. In a close game like this it allows a team like Wisconsin to spurt out to a moderate size lead.

Well Wisconsin just jumped out quickly with both of them in there.

[HerRealName]

In addition to being a complete asshole, Crean is vastly overrated as a game day coach. Zeller has been completely underutilized today and nearly every other game this year.

[Wolfpack]

Originally Posted by Wolfpack

Very nice and solid win by NC State over Virginia today. Especially so because Virginia's a team that gives talented head-case teams like State fits because they specialize in getting under the opponent's skin with all the hand-checking and banging the refs will let them get away with, not to mention frustrating a finesse team that wants to run (very much what State is) by grinding them into a half-court game.

I can't say whether UVa is tournament worthy because while they have good wins, those losses they have are just putrid. My hunch is that they aren't because the conference tournaments so far haven't produced much in the way of bid thieves, but usually there will be a small clutch of those every year.

...and then they follow it up with that drivel against Miami. Yet another guy with yet another career game against our semi-permeable defense (Durand Scott with 32(!) points), yet another game where one of our key players decides to not show up (Lorenzo Brown), yet another game where we always kill ourselves more than the other team does it to us, yet another game where the officiating was questionable (to be polite--though not a defining reason for the loss, it certainly seemed to keep working against us whatever the circumstance), and yet another game where we see the flashes of why they were rated so highly, but we also see why they squandered that ranking (free throws, turnovers, general inconsistency at one or both ends).

"Disappointing" is probably a nice, rational description of this game and this team this season as a whole. It is weird how expectations probably are shading things, though. Last year, State fans as a group were on pins and needles about getting into the NCAAs, euphoric about getting in for the first time in five years, and then over the moon when they played their way to the Sweet 16. This year, the NCAAs are a foregone conclusion and the fans are pretty much ready to wash their hands of this season. I can't say I totally disagree with that sentiment, though I still will believe and hope they can do some good things in the tournament.

[HerRealName]

Now for the fun part, who is Crean going to scream at in the post game? It's been a player (Aaron Craft) and the Michigan assistant coach the last couple games.

[HerRealName]

A smiling and laughing Tom Crean? That's shocking. I expected a blow-by hand shake at a minimum.

[mauchow]

I officially 100% regret backing out of going to the tourney now.

Good game Indiana. You guys will be just fine in the ncaa's.

[Kodos]

Good game, Mauchow. Good luck tomorrow. You guys have our number. I hope you end up in a different bracket.

[Kodos]

Rooting for MSU to beat OSU.

[Scoobz0202]

Originally Posted by Kodos

Rooting for MSU to beat OSU.

Shameful

[mauchow]

Originally Posted by Kodos

Rooting for MSU to beat OSU.

I don't want Wisconsin to lose another ugly game to them...

[Kodos]

Well, you can take comfort in the fact that I rarely ever get my way in sports.

[Matthean]

Originally Posted by Kodos

Rooting for MSU to beat OSU.

I'm rooting for a nuke.

[Scoobz0202]

Is Ohio State a lock for #2 or do they have a shot for a #1 with a win tomorrow

e: eh, looking over it they don't have a shot at a #1. Kansas and Miami both losing probably wouldn't get them over Duke, right?

[mauchow]

Nah they're a good solid 3 w a chance at 2.

[Kodos]

Originally Posted by Kodos

Well, you can take comfort in the fact that I rarely ever get my way in sports.

See?

[Matthean]

OSU should be a lock for a #2.

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by Radii

I think Lunardi wants to get the bracket right. I think the folks who write the Bubble Watch don't want to see teams they don't even list to get in. I think looking at their resume there is a very reasonable case to be made for why they are not going to get in. Thus, I don't think they are giving bias to their own branded rating. I think they're doing what they always do, trying to predict what the committee will think.

By the same token, that answers this:

The goal of everyone doing any sort of predictions right now is to predict what the committee will do. So if you feel the selection committee has any sort of bias towards BCS conferences, or if you think that given equal resumes, Kentucky is in, whether its fair or not, the bracket predictor folks should be doing the same.

I don't think the selection committee has a bias against mid-majors. I think ESPN has a bias towards giving more coverage and attention to leagues/teams it covers and stats it creates. And then analysts act all shocked when a VCU or George Mason makes it in. I'm sure someone on ESPN's payroll will be incredibly upset when Virginia and/or Maryland doesn't make it in.

Almost certainly a moot point now for us (CBS and Jerry Palm have us as the last team in, but he's seemed overly bullish on us for awhile). Half-court D was great, but tired legs led to some missed lay-ups that could have been dunks, we picked up our dribble on O way too much, and our 2 senior starters combined for 5 points and 8 turnovers. Plus DK insists on playing Sampson Carter for 30 minutes a night over guys like Esho/Putney/Bergantino. Really makes me wish Farrell or Morgan was healthy. Hopefully we get a good home game or two in the NIT at least.

[Lathum]

This Mountain West final has been fun to watch, what a great conference. Glad to see them get exposure on primetime.

[mauchow]

Louisville doesn't want that final #1 seed I guess. Syracuse may have played their way into a solid 3 seed and depending how much the committee factors the solid run in the tourney they may give 'em a 2 seed.

I would love for the Badgers to match up with Syracuse in the Sweet 16 again, like last year. The Badgers fair very well against zone defense teams, however 'Cuse would be able to probably score just as well as they did last year, too. Especially if they're doing this to the best defensive team in the country in Louisville.

[mauchow]

My opinion on final top three seeds with assumed results in parenthesis:

1 Seeds
Duke
Indiana
Gonzaga
Louisville

2 Seeds

Kansas
Ohio St
Georgetown
Miami (If they win tomorrow. If they lose then you might see New Mexico take this spot even if I disagree with it and an outside shot for Florida to get it over New Mexico)

3 Seeds

Florida (May jump into the 2 seed with a win and a Miami loss, they say they don't consider the B1G Championship because it ends after the submit the brackets...I would say that they would jump into OSU's spot if they lose to WI)
New Mexico (See Florida)
Michigan St
Michigan

[mauchow]

Louisville comes back quite nicely. Down 6 with plenty of time to go. Might need to update my seedings

2 minutes later and louisville has taken the lead.

[Lathum]

Wow. What a turnaround.

[mauchow]

90 seconds later and Louisville is up 9. Meltdown mode.

[Matthean]

Originally Posted by mauchow

3 Seeds

Florida (May jump into the 2 seed with a win and a Miami loss, they say they don't consider the B1G Championship because it ends after the submit the brackets...I would say that they would jump into OSU's spot if they lose to WI)
New Mexico (See Florida)
Michigan St
Michigan

Michigan could easily slide into a 4th seed.

[Buccaneer]

Ouch.

[mauchow]

Originally Posted by Matthean

Michigan could easily slide into a 4th seed.

Who takes it though? Marquette, KSU, Arizona, Syracuse, Ok St were all teams that ended up not winning their tourneys so they can't move up anymore.

At this point in time I think the only that could take them out of the 3-spot now is Wisconsin and that is a reach.. even though it's perhaps justified as Wisconsin would be 2-0 against them this season and 2-0 against Indiana and if they beat Ohio St they'd be 2-1 vs them on the season.

Michigan is pretty safe in the 3-spot right now.

[MrBug708]

UCLA might have fought it's way to a protected seed, but with Adams being out, might not get it

[Matthean]

Lunardi has Syracuse at #3, but to be honest I think it would be a coin flip between the two. Both probably feel like #4s but one gets a #3. At least for them they have a win over Georgetown on a neutral court and Michigan doesn't really have anything to compare. Michigan's last 12 doesn't have a road win of note. Beating MSU is likely countered by the PSU loss. They finally face a ranked team on a neutral court and they get beat.

[mauchow]

Cuse just gt slaughtered in a game they were winning by 15.

[rowech]

Why is Duke continuing to get mention for the number one seed? Miami won the conference, they very likely will win the conference tournament now too, and have essentially the same record. I know RPI and all but to me it seems pretty bad.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by rowech

Why is Duke continuing to get mention for the number one seed? They won the conference, they very likely will win the conference tournament now too, and have essentially the same record. I know RPI and all but to me it seems pretty bad.

Who is they? Miami?

And to answer your question about Duke, the committee takes into consideration the team you have now. They lost 2 games all year with Ryan Kelly in the lineup.

[rowech]

Originally Posted by Lathum

Who is they? Miami?

And to answer your question about Duke, the committee takes into consideration the team you have now. They lost 2 games all year with Ryan Kelly in the lineup.

Yes sorry.

[Lathum]

Looking closer at the body of work I think Duke deserves it over Miami easily. Duke has no bad losses on the year. Miami has losses to Florida Gulf Coast and Indiana State earlier in the year and more recently Ga Tech, at home, and Wake. They split head to head, with Dukes loss coming without Kelly.

[rowech]

Originally Posted by Lathum

Looking closer at the body of work I think Duke deserves it over Miami easily. Duke has no bad losses on the year. Miami has losses to Florida Gulf Coast and Indiana State earlier in the year and more recently Ga Tech, at home, and Wake. They split head to head, with Dukes loss coming without Kelly.

I guess this is why I don't like college basketball anymore. The two tewms essentially have the same record so we are not talking drastic differences there. To not reward the winning of a conference regular season title and tournament title when you put two teams side-by-side doesn't sit right with me.

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by rowech

I guess this is why I don't like college basketball anymore. The two tewms essentially have the same record so we are not talking drastic differences there. To not reward the winning of a conference regular season title and tournament title when you put two teams side-by-side doesn't sit right with me.

Getting in the field is the reward for a good season. Once you get in the field if you dont like your seed you have the opportunity to do something about it.

68 teams after today control their own destiny so its hard to blame college hoops for not allowing a fair opportunity at the end of the season.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by rowech

I guess this is why I don't like college basketball anymore. The two tewms essentially have the same record so we are not talking drastic differences there. To not reward the winning of a conference regular season title and tournament title when you put two teams side-by-side doesn't sit right with me.

This is an extremely flawed way of looking at it. You can't just say they have the same record. You have to look at the opponents they played. Miamis losses are much worse than Dukes, especially when you factor in Duke was missing their best player for almost all their losses.

Look at their non conference wins.Miami has a nice win against MSU, then their next best is probably LaSalle or UMASS.They also have a few terrible OOC losses.

Duke has OOC wins over VCU, Ohio State, Kentucky (with Noel), Louisville, Temple and Davidson. They also beat the same Florida Gulf Coast team Miami lost to by 21.

It isn't even close when you break down the records

[mauchow]

Listening to sports show on the way in and they believe if Miami should be a #1 seed over duke if they win today. I dont really care a whole lot but I will say this, if they're a 1-seed please give the Badgers a 4/5 in their region.. that would be the best possible scenario for Wisconsin.

I want nothing to do with being in Louisville's half of the bracket.

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by mauchow

Listening to sports show on the way in and they believe if Miami should be a #1 seed over duke if they win today. I dont really care a whole lot but I will say this, if they're a 1-seed please give the Badgers a 4/5 in their region.. that would be the best possible scenario for Wisconsin.

I want nothing to do with being in Louisville's regional.

Yeah, Louisville is interesting.

Their defense is so rock solid and their offense clicks some games but they have them games where they cant make shots that leave them ripe for an upset. I think having the optimist known as Rick Pitino saved them last night. I think 99 percent of the coaches out there wouldnt have given them the confidence at halftime that they could win that game.

I would agree though I dont think Wisky matches up well with them. Louisville is too quick for them.