Werewolf LXX Pleasure Cruise - (GAME OVER)

[claphamsa]

I wont out who I passed my item too... or tell what it is, becasue that would ruin its value (if they plan to use it like I was hoping to). sorry no ovbvious night kill for you.

[claphamsa]

vote cronin

Im pretty sure I havento voted yet.

[Passacaglia]

Morning all. Let me update you on my thinking. I was at the turtle farm when RA was killed. Both cronin and I found him dead. It sounds like neither of us saw it happen, but cronin made the comment (post 1465):

I don't know where oliegirl, Taz, KWhit, and maybe a few others were. Also it is not clear at all if Raiders Army was killed at the same time that I was at the turtlefarm. In fact, its plausible he was killed elsewhere and dumped there.

Does that seem right to you pass?

However, as I replied in post 1470, RA said he visited the turtles, so I really don't think cronin's scenario could be true. And the more I thought about it, the more it seemed he was trying to make himself look like less of a suspect for the crime. I think I could have nailed him for it then, but I was afraid of a runaway, and wanted to see if anyone would save him -- which is why I asked about that toward deadline.

On the other hand, when Barkeep came out with his stuff against cronin, after he came out with the controversial stuff, he was gone. This is some meta-gaming, but I remember a game where Barkeep said some stuff that got me lynched, and later he told me that he purposely didn't reply to me when I asked him about whatever he said (I think it was something like "he seems suspicious") because he didn't want me to have a chance to defend myself. I just kind of caught that vibe from him when cronin was foaming at the mouth, and BK had taken off. Granted, in the game I was talking about earlier, I was a wolf, and BK was a villager, so maybe he was right to try that tactic then, and maybe he's right to try it now. But for the record, I equate that with "lying as a villager," so maybe BK can see why that happens!

[Passacaglia]

Okay, that's out there. I welcome reading people's thoughts on that when I get to work.

[PurdueBrad]

I came out in my support of BK Friday and continue to see nothing that makes me doubt him other than, at worst, some aggressive villager play. I have a feeling we're going to be spread out again today for another probably no lynch which I know Chief Rum is against but I still have yet to see the huge disadvantage of since our numbers are still so high. That being said, any lynch at least gets us info and keeps us from arguing in circles. So if I'm not going to vote Barkeep, that leaves me Claph, Lathum, Anxiety, and Cronin who all have votes I believe.

In sticking with my Friday vote, I'll

vote St. Cronin

[Lathum]

anyone have a vote count?

[Barkeep49]

I'm sort of surprised that Chief has bought Anxiety's police report story. That, to me, was the straw that broke the camel's back in terms of believability. It just doesn't make sense.

[Barkeep49]

Lathum here's what I came up with:

Barkeep – cronin (2015), mccollins (2033), tax (2045)
KWhit – nfg (2019)
Anxiety – barkeep (2038)
Cronin – clap (2052), purdue (2055)
Clap – nfg (2047), Chief (2048)
Lathum – path (2049)

Needed votes to lynch assuming 40% minimum: 8

[Lathum]

I am really trying to wrap my brain around Paths continual voting of me.

[PurdueBrad]

Originally Posted by Lathum

I am really trying to wrap my brain around Paths continual voting of me.

Lathum, of the other four (outside of BK), I was curious about this as well and thought that I must have missed something about why you're on his list. Path is a strong player, as are you, so I was kind of curious about this dynamic as well.

[Barkeep49]

I apologize for going OT, BUT...

We have 18 players left in this game. The most any golden wolf thread has for votes is 12. That means MANY of you who are still playing haven't voted yet. Go vote.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by PurdueBrad

Lathum, of the other four (outside of BK), I was curious about this as well and thought that I must have missed something about why you're on his list. Path is a strong player, as are you, so I was kind of curious about this dynamic as well.

If he wants to vote me thats his buisness, but I think it is going to boil down to other candidates today.

It just seems to me that he is hiding his vote on me while using the excuse the he has voted for me in the past and doesn't want to change.

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by Passacaglia

However, as I replied in post 1470, RA said he visited the turtles, so I really don't think cronin's scenario could be true. And the more I thought about it, the more it seemed he was trying to make himself look like less of a suspect for the crime.

Well, if you think RA was killed by somebody at the turtle farm, that makes it either you or me, right? I know it wasn't me, and my guess is you know it wasn't me, either. Do you have still those drugs?

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

I apologize for going OT, BUT...

We have 18 players left in this game. The most any golden wolf thread has for votes is 12. That means MANY of you who are still playing haven't voted yet. Go vote.

I'm waiting til I am out of this game to vote.

[Barkeep49]

Originally Posted by Lathum

If he wants to vote me thats his buisness, but I think it is going to boil down to other candidates today.

It just seems to me that he is hiding his vote on me while using the excuse the he has voted for me in the past and doesn't want to change.

I'm not quite sure what to make of it, but I will say that voting for a random candidate is particularly harmful in this game because of the minimum % requirement.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

I'm not quite sure what to make of it, but I will say that voting for a random candidate is particularly harmful in this game because of the minimum % requirement.

which only adds to my suspiscoun of him.

[oliegirl]

Good morning everyone I'm here and will be catching up and hopefully casting a vote shortly.

[Passacaglia]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

Well, if you think RA was killed by somebody at the turtle farm, that makes it either you or me, right? I know it wasn't me, and my guess is you know it wasn't me, either. Do you have still those drugs?

Yes, I do. My plan had been to pass them to someone who would be removed from the game (i.e. lynched), but we haven't had one of those yet.

[st.cronin]

I think Passacaglia's actions/posts regarding the drugs are much, much shadier than anything Anxiety has posted.

[PurdueBrad]

Cronin, I agree because we would never be able to get verification that he actually gave them to the person since that person will be gone. Whereas with Anxiety, at least he and whoever it was passed to, are still conceivably around.

[PurdueBrad]

At the same token though (and this was supposed to be part of the previous post but I hit the wrong button), I understand what Pass is trying/hoping to do since they do seem dangerous. Tough argument here.

[st.cronin]

Except that I have asked Pass to use them on me. If you assume that Pass is a villager, and is telling the truth about what the drugs do, there's no compelling reason for him not to have done what I asked.

[jeheinz72]

Vote St.Cronin

I'm not voting for Anxiety. While I'm a little suspicious about his whole rigamarole I'm willing to wait out for the crime report.

That leaves BK and Cronin to vote for (as I still don't get the suspicion on clap or Lathum, really).

I think it's a good bet that one of Cronin and BK are wolves, so in a way, as long as we lynch SOMEONE, we should get some info from it. I'm sticking with Cronin as my opinion on that matter really hasn't changed from Friday.

[jeheinz72]

Here's what I have

Barkeep (3): St. Cronin (2015), mccollins (2033), TazFTW (2045)
Cronin (3): claphamsa (2052), PurdueBrad (2055), jeheinz72 (2073)
Anxiety (1): Barkeep (2038)
claphamsa (1): Chief Rum (2048)
Lathum (1): path12 (2049)

Not Voting (9): Jackal, nfg22*, Lathum, Passacaglia, oliegirl, ntndeacon, Qwikshot, Anxiety, KWhit

[st.cronin]

Dola, his claim that he's waiting to pass it to somebody who is going to be lynched can be translated: "I'm waiting to pretend to pass them to somebody in such a way that nobody can verify that I have passed them, that way I can actually hold on to them or pass them to somebody else in the Underground."

[mccollins]

Originally Posted by Lathum

McCollins, obviously there is no way for you to know this but quoting PM's is generaly forbiden. Just wanted to give you a heads up.

Thanks for the heads up - I had no idea.

Let's pretend that I just summarized the PM

[mccollins]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

Just a reminder that you all are voting for me based on how I've played this game not what I've done this game. Cronin's actions, I feel, speak much louder than my words, and Anxiety's inconsistencies are more troubling yet.

You lied when making your case for Cronin.

You said he was trying to persuade things a certain way leading up to a vote and then your basis was quotes from after the voting deadline.

[mccollins]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

Deseperation? Really? When we have someone who has lied about having a weapon?

Vote Anxiety

He lied? I haven't seen any proof that the status of the weapon isn't as Anxiety has stated.

[st.cronin]

Well, I've convinced myself at least:

unvote Barkeep49
vote Passacaglia

My circle of distrust is: Barkeep49, Passacaglia, and KWhit. Circle of trust is The Jackal and Lathum, maybe Anxiety.

[st.cronin]

I'll switch back to Barkeep at deadline if no momentum generates on Pass.

[Passacaglia]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

Dola, his claim that he's waiting to pass it to somebody who is going to be lynched can be translated: "I'm waiting to pretend to pass them to somebody in such a way that nobody can verify that I have passed them, that way I can actually hold on to them or pass them to somebody else in the Underground."

I thought the whole point was that you didn't want the act of passing them to be verified -- that we want to keep it secret, so that the wolves don't find out who really has it.

[Lathum]

I really want to vote for Path but it would probably be a futile vote.

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by Passacaglia

I thought the whole point was that you didn't want the act of passing them to be verified -- that we want to keep it secret, so that the wolves don't find out who really has it.

No, the point is to get them out of the game, which is I asked you to use them on me.

[Passacaglia]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

Pass - if the drugs are what Swaggs said they are (a knockout agent), then I recommend using them, and I think it almost doesn't matter who you use them on. You can use them on me, if you want. What I'm thinking, is, it might be possible for the drugs to have a different use for wolves as opposed to villagers, in which case passing them around might be too risky.

cronin, here's post 1366, the post where you recommend using them on you. I'm just not for that plan, and I agree with the seond part of your post, that passing them around might be too risky.

[Passacaglia]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

Except that I have asked Pass to use them on me. If you assume that Pass is a villager, and is telling the truth about what the drugs do, there's no compelling reason for him not to have done what I asked.

It sounds like the only way I can get in your good graces is to do exactly what you say, and use these drugs -- which might do different things for wolves -- on you. Someone who I think killed RA, and isn't exactly high on most people's trust lists.

That's just not going to happen.

[PurdueBrad]

Pass, I'm feeling more and more comfortable with you just holding on to the drugs. If you keep them, we know where they are and who uses them if used.

[st.cronin]

Pass, there are several other things you could have done: Used them on somebody else, or used them on yourself, or passed them on to somebody else. Any one of those moves I would have approved of. That you have held onto the drugs, and nothing has happened to you, is a point that makes me nervous. That you were at the turtle farm when RA was killed makes me nervous. Put everything together, and you just strike me as one of the most suspicious characters in the game.

[Passacaglia]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

Pass, there are several other things you could have done: Used them on somebody else, or used them on yourself, or passed them on to somebody else. Any one of those moves I would have approved of. That you have held onto the drugs, and nothing has happened to you, is a point that makes me nervous. That you were at the turtle farm when RA was killed makes me nervous. Put everything together, and you just strike me as one of the most suspicious characters in the game.

I'm not going to use them on someone else just to get rid of them -- I think that's unfair to knock someone out just for that, and besides, if we're working with the possibility that they do different things to wolves, that can be a dangerous idea. I'm not going to use them on myself, despite what CR suggests! And like you've said, passing them might be risky (post 1366), so I don't really think you'd have been happy with that.

I think it's strange that you didn't mention the turtle farm until I did. It seemed like you wanted to keep the idea under wraps, but now that I've brought it up, you're going after me.

It just doesn't seem suspicious to me. It seems more like you're trying to intimidate me into a) doing what you want me to with the drugs, and b) not asking any more questions about RA and the turtle farm.

[Passacaglia]

Thinking more about the drugs, it strikes me as odd that you implied you were going to get the drugs, then took it back -- could it be that you did purchase drugs, and learned something about them?

[st.cronin]

Where do you get the idea that they DO something different to a wolf? My suspicion was that they would have different value to a wolf as something possessed, not as something used on them. The idea that they would do something different to a wolf seems unlikely, and weird.

[mccollins]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

Where do you get the idea that they DO something different to a wolf? ...... The idea that they would do something different to a wolf seems unlikely, and weird.

Pass created the idea in 2085:

Originally Posted by Passacaglia

It sounds like the only way I can get in your good graces is to do exactly what you say, and use these drugs -- which might do different things for wolves -- on you.

[Passacaglia]

So the idea that they have a different use for a wolf (post 1366 of yours) is not weird, but my thinking (post 2085) is? What else could 'different use' mean?

[st.cronin]

Right, I know he put that out there, I'm just wondering what its based on.

[Passacaglia]

I just don't get it. The idea that the drugs have a different effect on wolves is weird, but you're proposing that if wolves possess them, they might be able to make it have a different effect on their victims, and that's NOT weird?

[Passacaglia]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

Right, I know he put that out there, I'm just wondering what its based on.

I really thought that's what you meant, and if that's not what you meant, I still don't know what you meant.

[Passacaglia]

Well, I have a guess as to what you might have meant (post 2094), but I just don't see how that's any less weird than my idea!

[st.cronin]

I was working off the idea, proposed back on day 1 or so by I forget who, that the wolves winning condition was based on accumulating items. That's why the way I tried to phrase it was they might "have a different value for the Underground."

[Passacaglia]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

I was working off the idea, proposed back on day 1 or so by I forget who, that the wolves winning condition was based on accumulating items. That's why the way I tried to phrase it was they might "have a different value for the Underground."

Can you show me when that idea was proposed?

[oliegirl]

For me, if I'd received these drugs I would have taken them myself. I don't ever remember a "suicide" in a WW game, and since most drugs are hallucinogens, I'd be thinking that they would provide some sort of insight - maybe a temporary seer capability, maybe the ability to "recreate" a specific event that has occurred in the game. In my experience, anything harmful is somehow marked, a black package, etc...somehow identifying that it's a harmful substance. Your unwillingness to take the drug is putting you at the top of my distrust list...

[oliegirl]

Dola - that post was directed to Pass....