FBI Opens Investigation into Shooting of Michael Brown

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

I don't know enough of the facts in the Wahlberg case, but lots of felons need pardoned, especially non-violent ones. The restrictions on voting and the limitations on employment carry on for decades after the crime has been "paid for".

Well his crime was violent. And had a racial-component to it it sounds like.

[CU Tiger]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

And had a racial-component to it it sounds like.

I will admit up front I may be way out in left field here as I have a hell of a temper and "lose my mind" a bit when over the edge. Adulthood and hours of anger management have helped me channel that emotion but not totally make it subside.

All that said, are we really going to hold what someone says in the midst of a fight against them? When involved in a fight the sole objective is to injure the other person as much as possible. If a husband calling his wife a derogatory term in the midst of a marital spat is he now a misogynist?

Heat of passion, moment of rage, whatever I think many have said things they didnt mean, even at the time, just to inflict injury.

[Buccaneer]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

Well his crime was violent. And had a racial-component to it it sounds like.

But then others here have used the excuse of "being young" or "we all have done stupid things".

[BYU 14]

Originally Posted by CU Tiger

I will admit up front I may be way out in left field here as I have a hell of a temper and "lose my mind" a bit when over the edge. Adulthood and hours of anger management have helped me channel that emotion but not totally make it subside.

All that said, are we really going to hold what someone says in the midst of a fight against them? When involved in a fight the sole objective is to injure the other person as much as possible. If a husband calling his wife a derogatory term in the midst of a marital spat is he now a misogynist?

Heat of passion, moment of rage, whatever I think many have said things they didnt mean, even at the time, just to inflict injury.

I am not saying you shouldn't forgive things that people do when young and stupid, especially when they have established an adequate history of acceptable behavior. In the two incidents specifically addressed, Wahlberg was the instigator and I don't really think you can write that off to heat of the moment in either case.

I had a bad temper too when I was young, and got in plenty of fights, but never used racial slurs. I think that bent is imbedded which causes it to come out in moments of anger. Again, that does not preclude people from changing their views and moving past that type of behavior, just saying.

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by CU Tiger

I will admit up front I may be way out in left field here as I have a hell of a temper and "lose my mind" a bit when over the edge. Adulthood and hours of anger management have helped me channel that emotion but not totally make it subside.

All that said, are we really going to hold what someone says in the midst of a fight against them? When involved in a fight the sole objective is to injure the other person as much as possible. If a husband calling his wife a derogatory term in the midst of a marital spat is he now a misogynist?

Heat of passion, moment of rage, whatever I think many have said things they didnt mean, even at the time, just to inflict injury.

It wasn't a fight. He committed unprovoked hate crimes and left a person blind in one eye. Fuck him.

Count I:

At approximately 9:00 p.m. on April 8, 1988, Thanh Lam, a Vietnamese adult male who resides in Dorchester, traveled by car to 998 Dorchester Avenue, Dorchester, Massachusetts. At 998 Dorchester Avenue, Thanh Lam left his car carrying two cases of beer. As he crossed the sidewalk, Mark Wahlberg attacked Thanh Lam. Wahlberg was carrying a large wooden stick, approximately five feet long and two to three inches in diameter. Wahlberg approached Thanh Lam calling him a “Vietnam fucking shit”, then hit him over the head with the stick. Thanh Lam was knocked to the ground unconscious. The stick broke in two and was later recovered from the scene. Thanh Lam was treated overnight at Boston City Hospital.

After police arrested Wahlberg later on the night of April 8, 1988, Wahlberg was informed of his rights and returned to the scene of 988 Dorchester Avenue. In the presence of two police officers, he stated: “You don’t have to let him identify me, I’ll tell you now that’s the mother-fucker whose head I split open”, or words to that effect.

Count II:

As a police officer arrived at the scene of 988 Dorchester Avenue, Wahlberg and two other youths who were with him fled up Dorchester Avenue toward Pearl Street.

Shortly after 9:00pm on April 8, 1988, Hoa Trinh, an adult Vietnamese male who resides in Dorchester, was standing several blocks away from 998 Dorchester Avenue, near the corner of Dorchester Avenue and Pearl Street. Hoa Trinh was not aware of the altercation outside of 998 Dorchester Avenue.

Wahlberg ran up to Hoa Trinh, put his arm around Hoa Trinh’s shoulder and said: “Police coming, police coming, let me hide.” After a police cruiser passed, Wahlberg punched Trinh in the eye, causing him to fall to the ground.

Police arrived and Hoa Trinh identified Wahlberg as the person who punched him. Wahlberg was placed under arrest and read his rights. Thereafter, he made numerous unsolicited racial statements about “gooks” and “slant-eyed gooks”. After being returned to 998 Dorchester Avenue, Wahlberg identified Thanh Lam as the person he hit over the head with a stick.

[BillJasper]

Originally Posted by BishopMVP

It wasn't a fight. He committed unprovoked hate crimes and left a person blind in one eye. Fuck him.

+1

[Jukeman]

Zimmerman's dad was "white" which make Zimmerman "white"

The man have the seed.

Lets not confuse ethnicity with skin color.

[JPhillips]

This is just evil.

Ferguson, Missouri, which is recovering from riots following the August shooting death of an unarmed black teenager by a white policeman, plans to close a budget gap by boosting revenue from public-safety fines and tapping reserves…

To close a projected deficit for fiscal 2014, which ended June 30, the municipality will deplete a $10 million capital-projects reserve, Jeffrey Blume, Ferguson’s finance director, said in a telephone interview. For the current year, the city is budgeting for higher receipts from police-issued tickets.

“There are a number of things going on in 2014 and one is a revenue shortfall that we anticipate making up in 2015,” Blume said. “There’s about a million-dollar increase in public-safety fines to make up the difference.”

Revenue from violations, which already represents the city’s second-largest source of cash after sales taxes, will rise to 15.7 percent of receipts in fiscal 2015, from a projected 11.8 percent this year, he said. In 2013, fines brought in $2.2 million, or 11.8 percent of the city’s $18.62 million in annual revenue, according to budget documents…

[NobodyHere]

Do you have a link to that?

[Dutch]

Originally Posted by Jukeman

Zimmerman's dad was "white" which make Zimmerman "white"

The man have the seed.

Lets not confuse ethnicity with skin color.

Sounds like you don't give much credit to the woman in this creation.

[JPhillips]

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-1...udget-gap.html

Originally Posted by NobodyHere

Do you have a link to that?

[Dutch]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-1...udget-gap.html

Ignorance of the law is not an excuse. I hope they dont riot because they cant park in handicapped spots and fire lanes.

[JPhillips]

You realize that the city decided over the next fiscal year to take a million more from people in and visiting Ferguson? For a guy that prefers small government, I'd think that would bother you.

[Dutch]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

You realize that the city decided over the next fiscal year to take a million more from people in and visiting Ferguson? For a guy that prefers small government, I'd think that would bother you.

Now you just sound ridiculous. There has never been a one-size fits all for anything any of us have "supported" here. I support small government, holding people accountable, and I appreciate the effort the police force does to keep us safe. Plus, fines are perfect for that because it's not universal and I don't have to pay them.

[DaddyTorgo]

I feel like this is the right thread for this

http://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions...3-604_ec8f.pdf

A robust 8-1 majority of the Supreme Court ruled today that, contrary to folk belief, ignorance of the law is a perfectly good excuse—as long as it's a cop who's claiming ignorance. The case, Heien v. North Carolina, dealt with a car owner who ended up charged with cocaine trafficking after a police officer, who thought the driver looked "nervous," followed the car and stopped it because it had only one working brake light.

The North Carolina state court of appeals had concluded that because state law says a car must have "a stop lamp," singular, it's not illegal to operate a car that's down to one functioning brake light. But the Supreme Court decided that even though the car was legal, the arresting officer's "mistaken understanding of the law was reasonable."

"To be reasonable is not to be perfect, and so the Fourth Amendment allows for some mistakes on the part of government officials,," the majority wrote.

The majority explained that this ruling, upholding an incorrect act of law enforcement, will not encourage the police to enforce laws incorrectly:

An officer may, however, also be suddenly confronted with a situation requiring application of an unclear statute. This Court's holding does not discourage officers from learning the law. Because the Fourth Amendment tolerates only objectively reasonable mistakes, cf. Whren v. United States, 517 U. S. 806, 813, an officer can gain no advantage through poor study. Finally, while the maxim "Ignorance of the law is no excuse" correctly implies that the State cannot impose punishment based on a mistake of law, it does not mean a reasonable mistake of law cannot justify an investigatory stop.

Surely the cops would never pull anyone over on bogus grounds, out of malice, and blame it a law that doesn't apply?!?!?!?!

[ISiddiqui]

To be fair, the owner was charged with cocaine trafficking because after the stop the cop asked if he could search the vehicle and the guy said yes.

Seriously, if the cop wanted to pull someone over on bogus ground in the aforementioned case, he could have said something like the driver was driving erratically.

[ISiddiqui]

Oh, in addition there was this:

There is little difficulty in concluding that Officer Darisse’s error of law was reasonable. The North Carolina vehicle code that requires “a stop lamp” also provides that the lamp “may be incorporated into a unit with one or more other rear lamps,” N. C. Gen. Stat. Ann. §20–129(g), and that “all originally equipped rear lamps” must be “in good working order,” §20–129(d). Although the State Court of Appeals held that “rear lamps” do not include brake lights, the word “other,” coupled with the lack of state-court precedent interpreting the provision, made it objectively reasonable to think that a faulty brake light constituted a violation.

8 members of the Court thought that the stop was reasonable was because they felt that the code section can be interpreted in either way and no state court ruling had been made on it.

[molson]

My state's appellate courts got rid of the reasonable mistake of law doctrine a while ago with regard to the state constitution. I'm sure we're not alone, but I don't know how many states there are where this is still a thing.

I can see both sides of it, but I'm kind of surprised it still exists, considering how much the Supreme Court and state appellate courts, have, in other contexts, helped transform the whole job of police officer to something that is much more professional, much more military-like, much more based on classroom-training - a modern officer has to know so much more about the nuisances of the law than an officer a few decades ago did. With all the good and bad that comes with all that.

[panerd]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

You realize that the city decided over the next fiscal year to take a million more from people in and visiting Ferguson? For a guy that prefers small government, I'd think that would bother you.

People aren't visiting Ferguson... now or before the shooting and riots. The national media has used St. Louis as a point of reference but it is not where the arch and Rams are and not where the shitstorm is either. To use a Cincinnati reference it would be like me going to visit my family and then taking a trip to the over the Rhine area as part of my itinerary.

[JPhillips]

I was just giving leeway for people going through and getting fined. The bulk of the extra million will fall on the citizens. The reality is that it's about a million dollars in regressive taxes.

[DaddyTorgo]

Cops like this give good cops out there a bad name and really put them behind the 8-ball as far as community relations.

San Jose Police Department officer on leave for controversial protest tweets | abc7.com

[TCY Junkie]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

Cops like this give good cops out there a bad name and really put them behind the 8-ball as far as community relations.

San Jose Police Department officer on leave for controversial protest tweets | abc7.com

Did he mean to say matter more than cops, it makes no sense the way it is worded unless he's a cold blooded killer.

[Dutch]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

Cops like this give good cops out there a bad name and really put them behind the 8-ball as far as community relations.

San Jose Police Department officer on leave for controversial protest tweets | abc7.com

Agreed.

I have no doubt that most cops at major departments receive training (not sure how it works in small Mayberry towns like Ferguson) and guidance on how and when it's appropriate to express their opinion. I'm not sure if it goes as far as it does in the military, but I'm sure they receive some training. If anything else, they should be instructed to pass on media to PR and whatnot. Social media presents a new challenge, but at the end of the day, most intelligent people will place the responsibility of his words on the individual and not all cops. Sounds like the SJPD is taking the appropriate steps to reprimand the cop.

[cuervo72]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

Cops like this give good cops out there a bad name and really put them behind the 8-ball as far as community relations.

San Jose Police Department officer on leave for controversial protest tweets | abc7.com

As do ones like these:

Indiana Cop Sells 'Breathe Easy Don't Break The Law' T-Shirts: Chicagoist

And (older story, but still):

What Cop T-Shirts Tell Us About Police Culture

[Dutch]

Yes, a little empathy with the people you protect goes a long way.

[jeff061]

Well, as much as I disagree with the tshirts and the amount of ignorance it must take to wear one as a cop, this got a chuckle out of me.

[CU Tiger]

The local police force had shirts printed up that said "55 your fine, 1 over your mine" They wear these off duty out and about in the community, amazes me.

[RainMaker]

The people that wear that stuff are the people you don't want being cops.

[Dutch]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

The people that wear that stuff are the people you don't want being cops.

And the people that won't wear stuff like that won't be cops. I'm so confused!!!

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by jeff061

Well, as much as I disagree with the tshirts and the amount of ignorance it must take to wear one as a cop, this got a chuckle out of me.

Same emotion here, sadly. I know it's a horrible idea to have something like in existence but I still chuckled

SI

[Logan]

Guy apparently murders his girlfriend in Baltimore, comes up to Brooklyn and kills two cops as "revenge" for Eric Garner and then kills himself.

Gunman kills self after 2 NYPD cops fatally shot ‘execution style’ as ‘revenge’ for Garner | New York Post

[kingfc22]

The amount of evil in today's society is sickening.

[Buccaneer]

Just "today's"?

[stevew]

Originally Posted by CU Tiger

The local police force had shirts printed up that said "55 your fine, 1 over your mine" They wear these off duty out and about in the community, amazes me.

They should be arrested for that grammar

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Logan

Guy apparently murders his girlfriend in Baltimore, comes up to Brooklyn and kills two cops as "revenge" for Eric Garner and then kills himself.

Gunman kills self after 2 NYPD cops fatally shot ‘execution style’ as ‘revenge’ for Garner | New York Post

You can guess which media outlets aren't reporting this part yet.

[molson]

The NY Post (so ya) reports that he killed his girlfriend this morning too. So I think this was more craziness than conscious revenge. Like the teenager who seriously wounded a California officer with a machete yesterday. (Edit: Revenge attack is a much better story so I'm sure we'll see that storyline fleshed out.)

[larrymcg421]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

You can guess which media outlets aren't reporting this part yet.

MSNBC is reporting it. Who isn't?

[cuervo72]

Plastered on the ABCNews front page too.

[RainMaker]

Most of the news outlets had left off the part of it being a protester with a grudge who killed the cops. It's being updated now at most news sites. I just found it funny that the right-leaning sites mentioned that prominently right away and the left-leaning sites avoided mention of that till it was everywhere.

[nol]

OK cool, the troll's been fed. Clearly the race hustler media is covering up a conspiracy here. Did you know that there is also black-on-black violence that's not reported in the news?

[RainMaker]

The media has agendas and wants to feed narratives to the public. This is news to you?

[Dutch]

Guess we can lower our "no justice, no peace" signs now...

[CU Tiger]

Originally Posted by stevew

They should be arrested for that grammar

That has been a running joke.
My son's baseball coach actually joked that he was going to have shirts made that said, "I coach baseball, because I can spell too good to be a cop"


(Sure its not really a "spelling error per se" but you get the point

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by CU Tiger

That has been a running joke.
My son's baseball coach actually joked that he was going to have shirts made that said, "I coach baseball, because I can spell too good to be a cop"


(Sure its not really a "spelling error per se" but you get the point

Spell too well...

He fails also.

[larrymcg421]

*"Liberal media isn't reporting it."
*Two posts mentioning media outlets that are reporting it.
*"Oh...um, yeah, they weren't reporting it before, but they are now."

I call bullshit.

[RainMaker]

They weren't. Directly under the article it shows the original post date and the updates. The article was updated hours after the original story and hours after other media outlets were reporting on him being a protester.

If you don't think certain media outlets have an agenda let me link you to some Mike Brown is a "gentle giant" stories.

[Dutch]

http://www.youmaker.com/video/sven-5...ec40e4629.html

"What do we want? Dead cops! When do we want them? Now!"

[Noop]

I think teaching these young black men emotional discipline at an early age would go a long way to helping the present situation. I am not sure what marching and protesting does or than make a speculate of the situation. Getting members of the community to organize and choose legitimate leadership who understands and supports their interest would resolve a lot of these problems.

To bad people like Al Sharpton, Jessie Jackson, and Co. have made a mockery of black (perhaps poor) plight.

[BYU 14]

Originally Posted by Dutch

http://www.youmaker.com/video/sven-5...ec40e4629.html

"What do we want? Dead cops! When do we want them? Now!"

Sure to sooth tensions, SMH.

[RainMaker]

I don't have a problem with marching and protesting. Sometimes it does help to spread a message. But it does seem like there is a lot more protest tourism taking place these days.

For instance we had a protest down the street a few nights ago. It was 100 people protesting in an area that really doesn't have much crime at all or issues with the police. Most of the people there seemed most concerned about taking pictures on their smartphones. Like they'd have a group of 10 run out and block some cars at a stoplight while their friends took pictures. Then they'd start singing like it was a party. I don't understand how that changes anything.

If you want change, go out and vote. Register people and get them to vote. Run for office or support a candidate you think will do good. That stuff takes effort and really doesn't get you a lot of attention. Hanging out with your friends posting images of yourself "protesting" on Facebook is much cooler.