Alright Boyz, here we go! Madden 10 first impressions thread

[EagleFan]

I am confused. Is this one of the better football games or does it suck? It seemed early opinions were good but now the bashing has begun.

[Epi_862]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

I am confused. Is this one of the better football games or does it suck? It seemed early opinions were good but now the bashing has begun.

I really dont think anyone is bashing the game... I at least am only saying: It is a great football game, but you NEED to do a lot of work with the sliders to make it realistic.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Epi_862

SO, what im saying is, the gameplay is EXCELLENT, but wildly unbalanced.

Not sure how you can say it's excellent. I mean you can throw for 500+ yards with any QB on any level in every game. I know Madden has always had money plays here and there over the years, but I can't remember one this bad.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

I am confused. Is this one of the better football games or does it suck? It seemed early opinions were good but now the bashing has begun.

Lot of stuff improved but there are some major gameplay issues that I think make it unplayable. If that was fixed, I think the game would be really good.

[The Jackal]

If you are on the fence I'd suggest waiting until they release the first patch, which I'm sure has to happen in the relatively near future what with adding Vick. They will hopefully have had time to make some tweaks.

[eiskrap]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Not sure how you can say it's excellent. I mean you can throw for 500+ yards with any QB on any level in every game. I know Madden has always had money plays here and there over the years, but I can't remember one this bad.

I don't think I've thrown for over 300 yards yet... and I've already played it more then 09. It feels much better than last year, whether there are issues I haven't discovered yet or not I'm not sure.

[The Jackal]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Not sure how you can say it's excellent. I mean you can throw for 500+ yards with any QB on any level in every game. I know Madden has always had money plays here and there over the years, but I can't remember one this bad.

I averaged 355 passing yards through my first two games of franchise on 15 minute quarters on All-Madden - you've been getting 500+ that easily? Granted I like to mix in a lot of runs so it's realistic gameplay, but still.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

I averaged 355 passing yards through my first two games of franchise on 15 minute quarters on All-Madden - you've been getting 500+ that easily? Granted I like to mix in a lot of runs so it's realistic gameplay, but still.

Just run Double Drags where your running back goes in the flat. It's a guaranteed 10+ yards a play. You can mix it up with any other screen or pass play to a RB in the flat. It can't be stopped.

[The Jackal]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Just run Double Drags where your running back goes in the flat. It's a guaranteed 10+ yards a play. You can mix it up with any other screen or pass play to a RB in the flat. It can't be stopped.

Yeah, I try to employ those only when I'm being all-out blitzed every play. I do recall my RB and FB averaging around 10 yards a catch because of it.

[The Jackal]

What difficulty are you playing on, RainMaker?

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

What difficulty are you playing on, RainMaker?

I was able to do it on every level including All-Madden.

[The Jackal]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

I was able to do it on every level including All-Madden.

Anything below All-Madden for anyone who has played this game a lot is kind of useless for stats. All-Pro and less is far too easy. You do it regularly or all the time on All-Madden?

[TroyF]

Some quickfire thoughts:

1) I said before the game came out that all I wanted was a fun football experience. I've got that. I love this game.

2) Of all the gripes, most either don't bother me or are minor. Let's address them:

A) Sliders - Yeah, so the game has to be tweaked to my skillset. I expect that. Outside of the swing passes (to be addressed in a second), I found a fairly realistic balance after 5 or 6 games.

B) DL Interceptions - Haven't noticed this problem at all. Only two I've had were after the QB was hit and he floated it up. (about 15 games or so in, not unrealistic at all)

C) Madden Shop - Haven't needed it and haven't seen any spot where it's mandatory. I've simmed through about 6 seasons and haven't seen any unrealistic retirements. That said, I think I'll purchase the one get out of jail free injury card. (can be used once per year)

D) RB/TE in the flats, double slants/drags - This is the one thing I've seen that could be a deal breaker for some. It's a pretty easy exploit. Like all easy exploits, I just don't use those type of plays. I'll keep the RB in to block for extra time and either use hot route to change a drag into something else or just not throw it to the guy on the drag play. Doing that, I get very realistic passing numbers. (19-29, 234 yards 3TD, 1 INT last game, two of the TD's on short throws inside the five) Where this could be killer is online. I hope the slider gurus can find a fix or EA patches it. As a 95% solo player, this isn't a big deal for me. (there are ALWAYS money plays in a football game. Even 2K5 had em)

3) Playing the game from the 360 HD seems to save a pretty good deal of time.

4) The Broncos are disaster in the game as with real life. All of the defensive players are old or playing out of position. I've decided when I start a franchise in depth I'm going to hold a fire sale in year one and tank it. Champ, Dawkins, Dumerville, DJ Williams, Orton will all be shipped out. I'll get the draft to where the Elway clone is. (won't spoil for those who don't know about head coach draft classes) Then I'll rebuild them.

5) I love the matching of the classic uniforms. I've thought about a Houston Oiler dynasty. (Chris Johnson doesn't hurt in that regard)

6) I'll be playing this for a long, long, long time.

[Eaglesfan27]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

I am confused. Is this one of the better football games or does it suck? It seemed early opinions were good but now the bashing has begun.

Bill Harris, one of the games harshest critics over the years, gives it a glowing review (and also discussed his custom sliders):

Dubious Quality

[Eaglesfan27]

Dola -

I agree with everything Troy said. There is a money play or two, but I simply do not call those plays and it ends up being a very fun experience. I'm going to be playing this all year long.

[CraigSca]

Originally Posted by TroyF

I'll get the draft to where the Elway clone is.

So, wait for the buck-toothed QB who refuses to play for the team he was drafted. Thanks!

-Disgruntled Baltimore Colts fan

[MizzouRah]

Originally Posted by CraigSca

So, wait for the buck-toothed QB who refuses to play for the team he was drafted. Thanks!

Amen!

[Balldog]

Originally Posted by Eaglesfan27

Bill Harris, one of the games harshest critics over the years, gives it a glowing review (and also discussed his custom sliders):

Dubious Quality

Going to check these out in a few, wasn't too thrilled with Drew Bledsoe's at OS. Kind of intimidated by the Very Fast setting!

[RedKingGold]

Yeah, I'm definitely going to try these DQ sliders out as well. I've still found it too easy despite my tweaks, perhaps these sliders would do the trick.

[Balldog]

Just finished my first game with his sliders, I like them...its fast!

Cincinnati 14, Cleveland (me) 13

Total Offense: Cin 261, Cle 264
Rushing: Cin 58, Cle 166
Passing: Cin 203, Cle 98
First Downs: Cin 11, Cle 134

I opened the game with a 13 play drive that resulted in a FG after Quinn overthrew an open receiver due to pressure. The Bengals couldn't do anything in the 1st half. Neither could I except for one other possession which ended in an 11 yard TD pass to Cribbs. It was a wounded duck as Quinn was rocked while making the throw.

I left them back in the game with a pick six in the 3rd, bad read on my part. Then the Bengals offense finally started to get going, resulting in a perfectly executed 30-yard wheel route to Benson. I later added a FG and had a chance to win it but they brought the house on a couple blitzes resulting in sacks that forced me into a 4th and 17.

Overall I liked it a lot, I'm going to play another game with two better teams.

Brady Quinn was 10-27, I started off doing well but then couldn't hit anything in the 2nd half. I haven't come close to having a game like that before. Jamal Lewis had 22 carries for 164 yards, including 38 and 39 yard runs. Palmer was 17-29 with 203 yards. Benson had 20 carries for 41 yards, most of his yards came in the 4th.

[TroyF]

Originally Posted by CraigSca

So, wait for the buck-toothed QB who refuses to play for the team he was drafted. Thanks!

-Disgruntled Baltimore Colts fan

sorry. If it's any condolence, you've got a much better QB than we do now.


Other quick notes while I'm thinking about them:

Those that are familiar with head coach need to use a house rule to prevent you from grabbing a superstar team. I liked the inclusion of some of the players, but they have a bunch of them in there and you can find steals galore in the draft because of it.

I tried a half with Bill's sliders and I like them quite a bit.

I hate the fact on a long play replay will only show so much of the play. That really, really sucks.

[Pumpy Tudors]

Originally Posted by Balldog

First Downs: Cin 11, Cle 134

Wow!

[Balldog]

Originally Posted by Pumpy Tudors

Wow!

haha I mean 13!

[Sun Tzu]

Balldog = cheeser.

[Balldog]

Second game with DQs sliders resulted in a 31-20 win with the Patriots against the Colts. It wasnt really that close, 31-6 midway through the 4th. Manning was 36-64 for 414 yards with 2 TDs and 2 picks. I was 19-34 (started 6-14) for 246 with Brady with 2 TDs and a pick. Got Moss and Welker both deep on man-to-man coverage with no help.

The Colts never really tried to establish a running game but Addai had 12 carries for 22 yards.

I'm leaning towards moving game speed to normal or fast. On very fast you basically have 3 seconds or less to pass, so its tough to make progressions. I'm not capable of reacting that fast.

I should also note I upped pass blocking to 90 for me and the CPU. I thought it played much better.

[EagleFan]

Just had a Maximum Football moment with the game while in the Superstar mode. Early in the 3rd my team scored to make it 48-24 (the scoring is WAY too high in this mode). While kicking the extra point there was a hold called against us. Instead of a 10 yard penalty and another attempt at the PAT the game made it 1st and goal at the 12 and kept the score 48-24. The following play was another touchdown and a 55-24 lead.

The choice should either be 10 yards on the kickoff or attempting the PAT from the 12. 1st and goal should not ever be an option.

I guess we found Daivd's influence...

Also, trying to us the 15 minute quarters in Superstar mode does not seem to take the runoff time into account when simming the plays (or something) as the scores are super inflated. I tried a second career to see what is going on but in my first the Chiefs (who drafted me) are averaging almost 60 points a game and giving up around 40 a game.

This bizarre game is my first in my second career and well on it's way to about 130 points scored in the game. (55-24 with 13:53 left in the 3rd).

[EagleFan]

dola: Final score of that game...

Colts 93 Vikings 34

My stats as HB:
20 carries, 216 yards, 3 TD
1 reception for 11 yards


We had me with 216 yards rushing, Addai with 178 and D. Brown with 119. On the same freaking team.

Our team was still throwing from the shotgun with under 5 minutes left in the game and with a 49 point lead at the time.

Total Offense: Vikings 503, Colts 791
Rushing: Vikings 227, Colts 522
Passing: Vikings 276, Colts 269
1st downs: Vikings 22, Colts 18 (18 1st downs with 93 points scored, though it should be 87 points scored thanks to the odd penalty call).

3rd down conversions:
Vikings 3/19
Colts 4/14



I do have to say this part of the game is seriously f'd up.

[Icy]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

Just had a Maximum Football moment with the game while in the Superstar mode. Early in the 3rd my team scored to make it 48-24 (the scoring is WAY too high in this mode). While kicking the extra point there was a hold called against us. Instead of a 10 yard penalty and another attempt at the PAT the game made it 1st and goal at the 12 and kept the score 48-24. The following play was another touchdown and a 55-24 lead.

The choice should either be 10 yards on the kickoff or attempting the PAT from the 12. 1st and goal should not ever be an option.

I guess we found Daivd's influence...

Also, trying to us the 15 minute quarters in Superstar mode does not seem to take the runoff time into account when simming the plays (or something) as the scores are super inflated. I tried a second career to see what is going on but in my first the Chiefs (who drafted me) are averaging almost 60 points a game and giving up around 40 a game.

This bizarre game is my first in my second career and well on it's way to about 130 points scored in the game. (55-24 with 13:53 left in the 3rd).

At least past year, you must play 6 minutes Q to have realistic stats in superstar more. The problem is the supersim clock.

[INDalltheway]

It's the same problem you see in NCAA. The game is just flat out enjoyable. If you're looking to nitpick or take advantage of the computer, you can and will find something. I agree with just about everything Troy wrote as I think we had the same mentality going into playing Madden. Bill Harris even mentioned that this game took the biggest step forward in 1 year that he has ever seen. That is really saying something, and it is only going to get better.

[Epi_862]

Anyone care to give me some info on the myskill-setting?

Im really struggling to find sliders that produce believable stats, and even though i hate the auto-difficulty concept, i might have to try it.

But the question is, does it feel like it's always easy, do the stats get inflated... Or basically, does the myskill-thing make the game produce realistic stats or does it make the game easy?

And what if i got a 50 rated half back on my franchise, will it make the running game so easy that i can get a 5.0ypc with him, or does it normalize to ratings?

Thanks in advance.

[Epi_862]

Originally Posted by Epi_862

Anyone care to give me some info on the myskill-setting?

Im really struggling to find sliders that produce believable stats, and even though i hate the auto-difficulty concept, i might have to try it.

But the question is, does it feel like it's always easy, do the stats get inflated... Or basically, does the myskill-thing make the game produce realistic stats or does it make the game easy?

And what if i got a 50 rated half back on my franchise, will it make the running game so easy that i can get a 5.0ypc with him, or does it normalize to ratings?

Thanks in advance.

So i went ahead, put the difficulty on "My Skill" and all i can say is, what... the... fuss is going on here? After ~25 games of Madden 10, im averaging somewhere below 3 ypc, and im killing teams on the passing game. My Skill puts my passing level on 2 (second to easiest!) and actually raises my rush offense skill by ten damn points!

I love the gameplay of Madden 10, but by god im getting frustrated of trying to make it play like football so i could actually enjoy it.

Any guys with similiar problems that have found some sliders that work?

[bhlloy]

You sound like you have the same problem I was having. I switched to Bill Harris' sliders linked somewhere in the thread, and the passing game became damn hard (Rivers averaging 3+ INT's a game) and the running game became way too easy, but that's with the Chargers who have a pretty sick line and running backs. I'm going to start a new franchise with the Texans and see if it's still too easy to run the ball, and maybe tweak Human run blocking down from there.

No matter what I do I can't get the CPU to run the damn ball effectively, even with Human reaction time and shed blocks at 20 and CPU run blocking at 100. They just get 1-2 yards per carry and give up on it. I still get shredded through the air but Harris' sliders have at least made it so I can stop somebody every once in a while.

I tried starting with My Skill and adjusting from there but Harris' sliders gave a much better game right off the bat. I should mention I'm not using his game speed adjustments, I love the feel of the Slow setting (best change to the game this year IMO) and don't really care if players aren't running a realistic 40. That may be why I'm finding it so easy to run thinking about it. But I'd rather tweak run blocking down a bit rather than bump the speed up.

[gstelmack]

Enjoying my superstar career, 3 games in as a QB with the Bucs. I'm not seeing the uber-flat routes or the uber-TEs. I've hit one or two big plays to the RB, but these are mostly coming on blitzes which is what I'd expect. I did end up turning down CPU interceptions; I may turn them back up when I get better at reading the defense, but on the default 50 they pick off anything that gets near them.

Whoever said you only get 3 seconds to throw on Very Fast, I'm lucky to get that on Slow with some of these teams that pick you up as a QB in superstar as they have crappy offensive lines. No way am I increasing the game speed.

[Epi_862]

A question, continuing the sliders/balance topic:

Has anyone had reasonable running stats for more than a game here, game there? I mean, running YPC in the realm of believable. And if so, what difficulty/settings are you using?

I might have OCD or something. I love this game but i cant play it if the computer runs a 2.0ypc. Should maybe get my head checked. Or maybe im expecting too much from a videogame.

[Kodos]

I used the DQ sliders last night, and in the only game I played, the Lions were running pretty well against my Dolphins. Their starting back broke the 100-yard mark, and was regularly getting 5 yard runs or better. But I could just suck at run D. If anyone's running game is underpowered, it was mine. I was getting stuffed for minimal gains until I broke off a big run at the end when the game was already decided.

On offense, you definitely need to get the ball off fast. I found it almost impossible to let guys get open downfield without getting sacked.

I also ran into the holding glitch on field goals. Twice in a row, I got called for holding on an FG, until I was successfully moved out of FG range and had to punt.

[Eaglesfan27]

I'm also getting run over quite a bit, maybe I'm just bad at run defense (but I'm good at it in NCAA), but most teams are running for about 100-120 yards per game against my Eagles with average YPC of about 4. I am using sliders though that boost the CPU run game.

[Mike Lowe]

Lions (me) @ Saints Week 1

Just scored with under a minute to go to make the score 24-19 Saints. We missed the 2-point conversion and did NOT get the onside kick. Game over.

NOPE! The Saints decide to pass (empty backfield) on 1st down. Mind you, I HAVE ZERO TIMEOUTS AND THERE ARE 50 SECONDS LEFT. Lions make the interception.

What the hell is that? Please patch this garbage. For every positive stride Looman and co. made with Head Coach, they have matched with awfulness in this years game.

[TroyF]

I got in two full "halves" with the Bill Harris sliders last night. Both playing as Pittsburgh against Cleveland.

In the first game, Lewis broke a 38 yard TD run and was pushing 85 yards at halftime. Big Ben threw 3 INT's. The Browns crushed me with 3 sacks and a ton of pressures. Almost all came from Wembley who abused my LT. I had one sack on them with Harrison destroying Quinn. Cleveland won the half 17-10.

The next game, I actually payed attention to ratings and saw Starks has a 69 in pass block footwork. Not get when going against a good pass rusher. I called rollouts to the other side of the formation. I called curls, hooks, short ins (not the drags, more like 8 yard ins) and quick outs. On defense, I put more men in the box, doubled Edwards and forced Quinn to beat me.

The results? Big Ben went 13-18, 165 yards and 2 TD's. Parker had 12 carries for 72 yards. The Browns "tried" to run the football. Lewis had 13 carries for 28 yards. Quinn went 5-14 with two pics. I won the half 24-0.

The end result of both halves was fair. The first time I played I acted as though I could do anything I wanted, didn't go in with a plan and was slaughtered. The second time I actually thought about how to play and the 93 rated team smoked the 69 rated team.

I was scared of the very fast game speed, but I really like it a lot. I may make a tweak or two, but I think these are my full time sliders.

[TroyF]

Originally Posted by Mike Lowe

Lions (me) @ Saints Week 1

Just scored with under a minute to go to make the score 24-19 Saints. We missed the 2-point conversion and did NOT get the onside kick. Game over.

NOPE! The Saints decide to pass (empty backfield) on 1st down. Mind you, I HAVE ZERO TIMEOUTS AND THERE ARE 50 SECONDS LEFT. Lions make the interception.

What the hell is that? Please patch this garbage. For every positive stride Looman and co. made with Head Coach, they have matched with awfulness in this years game.

The under two minute logic is good about 80% of the time. When it's not good, it's brutal.

I disagree overall. I still love the game, but I can see where the something like the above would cause some people to pull their hair out. Me? I'd run the ball out of bounds. Kneel on it twice and move on to the next game. If the game is "fun" for me to play, I can overlook a lot and I mean a lot of issues.

[TroyF]

dola:

The under two minute AI in Head Coach was also not very good. And Looman is not the end game AI logic for Madden. Ian Cummings runs the show, Looman's main job is franchise mode.

[Mike Lowe]

Originally Posted by TroyF

dola:

The under two minute AI in Head Coach was also not very good. And Looman is not the end game AI logic for Madden. Ian Cummings runs the show, Looman's main job is franchise mode.

There is no I in Looman! It's a team effort! JK, thanks for the info, I don't care who is responsible for it, it just blows.

I also love how in "training camp" for Superstar mode, I get to run the same exact play with my WR for which is eternity or until I quit the mode...the same play...with Tom Brady throwing to Randy Moss 100% of the time at the EXACT same time. I literally just starting running random routes trying to get him to notice haha. It was like a schoolyard game or something golly!

[Philliesfan980]

Hey Guys.. final chance for my copy of the PS3 version before it hits eBay. I'd actually prefer to trade if possible.

[RainMaker]

For those getting good games, are you just avoiding throwing to your running backs and tight ends? With these sliders that are out there I can still score every trip down if I want to. Am I doing something wrong?

[The Jackal]

Do you only run a few plays that are sort of glitchy? I sort of echo what other people have said, I like to mix in a ton of plays from the playbook anyways to give it a more realistic feel, plus the computer is supposed to be able to pick up on the same play if you run it multiple times, but it sounds like you aren't experiencing any difficulty.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

Do you only run a few plays that are sort of glitchy? I sort of echo what other people have said, I like to mix in a ton of plays from the playbook anyways to give it a more realistic feel, plus the computer is supposed to be able to pick up on the same play if you run it multiple times, but it sounds like you aren't experiencing any difficulty.

I just try to score. I mean I can play the game where I don't try to score but that's not really much fun to me. Avoiding passes to my running back and tight ends just doesn't seem like much fun for a football game.

[gstelmack]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

plus the computer is supposed to be able to pick up on the same play if you run it multiple times, but it sounds like you aren't experiencing any difficulty.

According to the thread on this topic at OS, you can run the exact same play over and over and over again with huge success.

So don't run the same play over and over and over again.

[Sun Tzu]

Note to self, don't play Rainmaker online.

[TroyF]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

For those getting good games, are you just avoiding throwing to your running backs and tight ends? With these sliders that are out there I can still score every trip down if I want to. Am I doing something wrong?

I answered the question above.

I avoid using drag routes. I keep my RB's in to block most of the time. When I do throw to a back, it's usually a circle route in the middle of the field. I'll have an occasional screen pass or quick flare to mix things up, but if I find a play the CPU can't stop, I just avoid using that play.

I have never played a football game that didn't have "money" plays. Heck, I've found few text sims that don't have some exploits.

I do agree that the Madden team made a mistake with the RB flat passes and made drag routes too easy. (that said, if you have a bad QB, the drag routes can get you in really big trouble, try throwing them with Derek Anderson (brutal). I know if they fix the flat routes, there will be another exploit I can use.

FWIW, I can still get my RB's and TE's touches without using drag routes or flares to the flats. It also makes the game much harder to move up and down the field on. I'm sure someone will find a defensive exploit as well. There is probably some defensive play out there that sacks the QB 50% of the time. If I find that play, I'll replace it in my playbook with another play.

The object of the game for me is to have fun. Finding and exploiting a money play (or money style) isn't that thrilling. If you can't contain yourself from throwing those routes, I'd exchange the game. (please understand, that's not an insult. If you don't like the game, you don't like the game. There are plenty of issues with this game that can cause someone to hate it or make it unplayable. Some of us can get around them and are finding an enjoyable game. Others can't and are taking it back. I'm just telling you how I get around the issue and in this case, I don't think there is a second way around it. Good luck. )

[TroyF]

dola:

Last year only 7 TE hit the 700 yard mark in the NFL. (That's about 44 yards per game)

The leading RB receiver had an average of 35 yards per game. The leading RB pass catcher caught 63 balls. (or 4 per game)

I can easily hit those numbers without resorting to throwing the ball in the flat all the time to do it.

[gstelmack]

I think I mostly like the DQ sliders, except that I suck so bad at reading defenses that I can't throw the ball even with the Patriots offense. 4 picks in my first half playing with them. I have this horrible time reading where the receiver will be when the ball gets there and some other defender keeps grabbing them. Need to work on my passing skills some more.