2017 College Football Season thread

[larrymcg421]

Apparently Schiano was Miami's fall back option if they didn't get Richt. Yikes!

[digamma]

Originally Posted by Logan

I did some quick googling to see if I could find a quote but came up empty. I doubt there was a legitimate reason. Just think he didn't expect to see the offense out there, got flustered by it and wasn't thinking clearly.

I thought maybe the ESPN game recap would've had something but there was just this. Talk about underselling the story...

"With the Mountaineers facing a fourth down, Rutgers called a
timeout with four seconds left, thinking West Virginia was going
to punt. But it backfired as Rasheed Marshall tossed an 83-yard
TD strike to Chris Henry as time expired to make it 17-3 at the
intermission."

Here's an article with a little more detail.

Pittsburgh Post-Gazette - West Virginia University

"We wanted to come after them and block the punt," Schiano said. "Unfortunately, we did not readjust to their play call. I put that one on me. We got a little greedy when I should have been satisfied with taking 10-3 at halftime.

"Still, if they punted and we had blocked it, I'm a genius."

[Logan]

That last line is a haymaker. Takes some serious stones to just throw that out there on the heels of an uncovered 83 yard touchdown.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Logan

That last line is a haymaker. Takes some serious stones to just throw that out there on the heels of an uncovered 83 yard touchdown.

At least he didn't say "champions of life"

[larrymcg421]

I guess you could put 11 DB's in the game on 4th and inches and then say, "Still, if they threw the ball and we picked it off, I'm a genius."

[Ksyrup]

"I didn't get internet access until 2001. Still, if I had invented the internet, I'm a genius."

[miami_fan]

Huh?

Jason Witten says he won't leave Dallas Cowboys for Tennessee coaching job

[bronconick]

Originally Posted by miami_fan

Huh?

Jason Witten says he won't leave Dallas Cowboys for Tennessee coaching job

That moron Travis said that was in the works

[dawgfan]

So apparently the buyout for Mullen to leave Florida is just $2M. Seems awfully low - guess he must have had considerable leverage in his negotiations with them.

[CU Tiger]

I was having a conversation just now with my son and something he said struck me pretty interesting about the UT job.

For reference my son is 16, a JR in high school, a college football junkie, and has now been on the campus of about 40 schools at various levels...including UT which is the focus here.

Now to put all that into perspective he was born in 2000 and started playing tackle football at age 8.

His point was, 'I know UT's history because Ive studied every SEC and ACC school. But since I've been playing football UT has only finished a season ranked 2 times and has never won 10 games. This is their problem. They think they are Alabama and no one my age has ever seen them be any good. To me they might as well be the Miami Dolphins - sure you had an undefeated season 2 generations ago but you are not relevant to my age group. I can't understand how they talk about hiring Fuente from VT. VT always wins except for Beamer's last few years. They are a traditional powerhouse UT is an old timer power house"

Now take all that and understand. He likes UT a lot. He had Butch Jones and Coach Wells numbers and has received texts and recruiting mail from them. I think that's what we all miss. We remember when they were great, the demographic they need to remember doesn't. They need a hire that embraces the past but recognizes they have to sell a vision of the future.

[dawgfan]

That's a good point CU - recruits have a much smaller window of exposure to the history of any program. What a team did in the 1990's is all fine and good, but today's recruits probably only really started paying attention to CFB somewhere around 2008 to 2011.

[larrymcg421]

Originally Posted by CU Tiger

I was having a conversation just now with my son and something he said struck me pretty interesting about the UT job.

For reference my son is 16, a JR in high school, a college football junkie, and has now been on the campus of about 40 schools at various levels...including UT which is the focus here.

Now to put all that into perspective he was born in 2000 and started playing tackle football at age 8.

His point was, 'I know UT's history because Ive studied every SEC and ACC school. But since I've been playing football UT has only finished a season ranked 2 times and has never won 10 games. This is their problem. They think they are Alabama and no one my age has ever seen them be any good. To me they might as well be the Miami Dolphins - sure you had an undefeated season 2 generations ago but you are not relevant to my age group. I can't understand how they talk about hiring Fuente from VT. VT always wins except for Beamer's last few years. They are a traditional powerhouse UT is an old timer power house"

Now take all that and understand. He likes UT a lot. He had Butch Jones and Coach Wells numbers and has received texts and recruiting mail from them. I think that's what we all miss. We remember when they were great, the demographic they need to remember doesn't. They need a hire that embraces the past but recognizes they have to sell a vision of the future.

This post just served to make me feel really old. I was literally thinking, "Wait, didn't Tennessee win a national ti.... OH GOD!"

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by CU Tiger

I was having a conversation just now with my son and something he said struck me pretty interesting about the UT job.

For reference my son is 16, a JR in high school, a college football junkie, and has now been on the campus of about 40 schools at various levels...including UT which is the focus here.

Now to put all that into perspective he was born in 2000 and started playing tackle football at age 8.

His point was, 'I know UT's history because Ive studied every SEC and ACC school. But since I've been playing football UT has only finished a season ranked 2 times and has never won 10 games. This is their problem. They think they are Alabama and no one my age has ever seen them be any good. To me they might as well be the Miami Dolphins - sure you had an undefeated season 2 generations ago but you are not relevant to my age group. I can't understand how they talk about hiring Fuente from VT. VT always wins except for Beamer's last few years. They are a traditional powerhouse UT is an old timer power house"

Now take all that and understand. He likes UT a lot. He had Butch Jones and Coach Wells numbers and has received texts and recruiting mail from them. I think that's what we all miss. We remember when they were great, the demographic they need to remember doesn't. They need a hire that embraces the past but recognizes they have to sell a vision of the future.

I get it, but schools like Tennessee are the right hire away from being up there with the Alabamas of the college football world. Before Saban Alabama was coming off of Mike Shula, Franchione, DuBose, and NCAA sanctions which resulted in hitting a lower point than Tennessee has ever seen. Alabama was Rich Rodriguez not getting cold feet away from never seeing Saban as well.

I don't think Schiano would have been a bad hire, but I don't think his ceiling is where Tennessee wants to go and with their resources I can't blame the fans for wanting more.

[Edward64]

Originally Posted by larrymcg421

This post just served to make me feel really old. I was literally thinking, "Wait, didn't Tennessee win a national ti.... OH GOD!"

Thanks for reminding me how old I am (and also the Clint Stoerner fumble!)

[cuervo72]

Originally Posted by Atocep

I get it, but schools like Tennessee are the right hire away from being up there with the Alabamas of the college football world.

You might be able to say that about a dozen other programs before thinking of Tennessee though.

[Vince, Pt. II]

Originally Posted by cuervo72

You might be able to say that about a dozen other programs before thinking of Tennessee though.

In terms of teams who need the right hire to get to the top of the mountain (or hell, ON the mountain), does it matter where they ranked prior to the hire?

Put another way - does the fact that Tennessee isn't the first school you think of make a demonstrable difference here?

I ask this with no agenda as someone whose college football fandom started with the release of TCY and hasn't grown to much more than "that game last week was pretty cool."

It seems to me that just being in that tier of "used to be great and could easily become great again" is enough; where you rank within that tier seems immaterial.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by cuervo72

You might be able to say that about a dozen other programs before thinking of Tennessee though.

Those dozen programs didn't have openings this year. Tennessee is top 10 all time in D1 wins, has 6 national titles, excellent facilities, and draws 100k per game. You can't name a dozen programs that can match that. Their coaches since Fulmer left are Kiffin, Dooley, and Butch Jones. That's inexcusable and I can see why some would see Schiano as more of the same. It's a high profile job that should be attracting better candidates, but the administration has been obsessed with trying get Gruden out of the booth and they end up settling for mediocrity.

[CU Tiger]

Originally Posted by Atocep

Those dozen programs didn't have openings this year. Tennessee is top 10 all time in D1 wins, has 6 national titles, excellent facilities, and draws 100k per game. You can't name a dozen programs that can match that. Their coaches since Fulmer left are Kiffin, Dooley, and Butch Jones. That's inexcusable and I can see why some would see Schiano as more of the same. It's a high profile job that should be attracting better candidates, but the administration has been obsessed with trying get Gruden out of the booth and they end up settling for mediocrity.

Right. But 2 points.
1) unlimited budget, your are UT AD... who are your top 5 picks?

Who isn't an inexcusable hire?

2) I think my point is more about frame of mind. I'll give an example to explain. Clemson despite current success certainly doesn't have the storied tradition of Tennessee. But before Swinney many in the fan base were still stuck in 1989 and wanted Danny Ford rehired every time the job came open. There is a segment of Clemson fan who argue that it is the PREMIER job in college football. One of Swinney's first moves was tactical genius. He went to visit coach Ford (who owns a farm 10 miles from campus) and visited with him, and brought him back around the program. He embraced the past, then immediately told anyone who would listen. The good ole days are ahead and the best is yet to come. He repeated that like a broken kids toy for 2 years. He caught flak for not running a power i offense, he didn't try to go back. He talked to recruits about building something from scratch. Not about restoring past glory.

Butch Jones had been selling kids on being next in a line of greatness. That works for Saban, none of these kids know who UT's legends other than Manning are. I'm not saying to minimize their accomplishments, but it can't be your focus.

[dawgfan]

Originally Posted by Atocep

Those dozen programs didn't have openings this year. Tennessee is top 10 all time in D1 wins, has 6 national titles, excellent facilities, and draws 100k per game. You can't name a dozen programs that can match that. Their coaches since Fulmer left are Kiffin, Dooley, and Butch Jones. That's inexcusable and I can see why some would see Schiano as more of the same. It's a high profile job that should be attracting better candidates, but the administration has been obsessed with trying get Gruden out of the booth and they end up settling for mediocrity.

Let's break that down a little further though. Top-10 in wins is great, nothing to really knock there. They've been a good to great program for most of their long history, and that's added up. Worth noting that by winning percentage, they drop a few spots to 12th, but that's quibbling.

The National Championships though - let's look at that. Of their six claimed, all but one happened before 1968, and only two of them were awarded by the AP and/or UPI/Coaches Polls. And of those two, the first one (1951) happened back when the final polls took place before the bowl games.

Now, they've definitely been capable of being a great program in the modern era. Doug Dickey, Bill Battle, Johnny Majors and especially Phillip Fulmer have proven you can win big there. The fan support is there, and they obviously benefit financially and from a perception standpoint by being in the SEC.

But I don't know that I would consider them a clear-cut top-10 job at this point. Top-20, yeah. But while their history out-paces UCLA (as an example), at this point in time I don't think it's a better job. The Bruins are a sleeping giant with tremendous potential for success.

[cuervo72]

Well no, I can't name twelve schools that are in the top-10 all-time for wins. But generally I'd put most if not all of those teams up there, outside maybe Nebraska. Plus Georgia, LSU, Florida, FSU. Probably Auburn. Clemson is kinda on their way there. Even then though, there's a bit of "what have you done for me lately." When were most of those titles, in the 40s? Might as well have been for kids.

[cuervo72]

(dola - when I was making up my original list I did put UCLA in there as having the ability to rebound into that upper echelon)

[tarcone]

In todays day and age, I think most programs can become top echelon. With scholarship limits, and TV money, you can win. You have to put the right guy in there (See Clemson and Alabama as examples. And add a Baylor and TCU.)

I see Tennessee fans wanting something better. Im on board with that. And reading the post about UTs attributes, they SHOULD look for more.

But that can come from the outside 5 or a lower division. Look what Campbell did at ISU. With unlimited resources and prestige, he could be a superstar at UT.

The question is, would the fan base allow that to happen? Or are they hyper delusional right now?

Sometimes you gotta take a chance and catch lightning in a bottle. And I agree with e base that Schiano want it.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by CU Tiger

Right. But 2 points.
1) unlimited budget, your are UT AD... who are your top 5 picks?

Who isn't an inexcusable hire?

I worked with that very notion a little bit last night. I had Kelly as the clear #1 on the market. Not a sure thing but the highest ceiling guy I could come up with.

After that I thought the drop off was pretty steep honestly. There wasn't anyone else that was reasonably available (even if you stretch that list with the unlimited budget) that I felt like would ever bring a national title.

Which means you're looking for guys who can get you into maybe Mark Richt territory, double digit wins as often as not, ride that until you find someone that could be THE guy down the road to get you over the top.

I probably had Mike Leach as my #2 (though he'd have been a better fit at UF). After that, it's more like "the field" including Frost, Campbell, maybe a Chad Morris (tho is he really the next group down maybe?), Fuente possibly? Maybe Jim Bob Cooter? Make Gary Patterson say no? Possibly Cutcliffe, though you better have a coach-in-waiting ready pretty quickly.

Guys who were never on my list for any reason? Gruden, Fulmer, Miles, Petrino, Neal Brown, Mullen (I think he's a next group guy as a long-term ceiling honestly). I also didn't seriously consider Norvell because the whole "Tiger High" connection would just be too touchy a thing, he'd get the shortest leash of anyone because of that.

After that -- which is where we likely are now -- it's just another body waiting to be fired after hitting the same ceiling Jones did.

[tarcone]

Jim Leonhard

[CU Tiger]

Agreed I'm just not sure who is the can't miss guy.
I think UT could do much worse than Schiano.

If I am UT Fuente has to tell me no. Twice.
Other names not on your list, maybe Brohm?
Dave Clawson isnt sexy but would be a great hire there. Great.
Maybe a Cut/Martin combo.
Maybe Pruitt.

Chad isn't the fit there. All his recuiting ties are in Texas and he doesn't have a rolodex to build a P5 staff, yet.

Charlie Strong?

I personally would kick the tires on Fleck, I like him a lot.

Les Miles? Joking. Kinda.

After that, I'm not sure where to even look. As crazy as this is there is message board chatter that Muschamp may have been contacted by Tennesse. As much as I'd love to watch SC cry about a coach leaving for a division rival, I prefer he stays right where he is.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by CU Tiger

Other names not on your list, maybe Brohm?

I considered Brohm, but the current season would have made that a need for a fast start because there'd have been no patience for him. And this roster doesn't have fast start potential.

Dave Clawson isnt sexy but would be a great hire there. Great.

You're underestimating just how despised he was in his year there. He was genuinely lucky someone didn't take a shot at him. Think Mike Bobo at UGA but multiplied about 10-20 fold. He'd guarantee an empty stadium.

Charlie Strong?

Oh FUCK no. I'd just as soon have Schiano. Zero belief he can get the job done where there's any pressure.

I personally would kick the tires on Fleck, I like him a lot.

I'm 180 from you on that. I think he's Butch Jones 2.0. I don't think he avoids the ax even at UM within 2 seasons. Another guy that literally would be a trade down for a couple dozen HS teams in Georgia alone. Wouldn't let him coach Saturday morning peewees.

The one guy I didn't mention that I've seen brought up once or twice is Venables. I didn't include him because I don't think any amount of money would have moved him, making it a non-issue.

[lungs]

Does Fleck even have a rolodex of coaches built up? A lot of angst among the Goof faithful this year seems to be aimed at the O Coordinator. Not that he has much talent to work with. But from what I've read, Fleck's style is to give his coordinators a lot of leeway as he's more of the CEO type of coach. Maybe he's using Minnesota to build that up a bit.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Fire John Currie sign, front row at RAW

https://www.seccountry.com/tennessee...nday-night-raw

[mauchow]

Originally Posted by tarcone

Jim Leonhard

If we can get 2 more years of him at DC before he goes I'll be happy.

Go after Dave Aranda first...

[lungs]

Originally Posted by mauchow

If we can get 2 more years of him at DC before he goes I'll be happy.

Go after Dave Aranda first...

I'm thinking the NFL snags Leonhard at some point. Packers?

[CU Tiger]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

The one guy I didn't mention that I've seen brought up once or twice is Venables. I didn't include him because I don't think any amount of money would have moved him, making it a non-issue.

Venables wants to be a head coach.
He had been waiting for the perfect opportunity, but I think that's about to end.

There is some friction between he and Swinney. Is not major but is festering. On his side. I think he's ready to move on, honestly.

[BishopMVP]

I think Schiano would be a solid hire for them and have always thought Gruden was a pipe dream, but I'm curious why a couple posters think he'd be light years better than Gruden? Is it just Gruden's long layoff from actually coaching?

[CrescentMoonie]

Heard on ESPN radio today, don't remember who as I wasn't really paying attention, that the last 3-4 HC hires at Tennessee all have the same agent as Schiano. Wouldn't say who the agent is.

[molson]

Originally Posted by BishopMVP

I think Schiano would be a solid hire for them and have always thought Gruden was a pipe dream, but I'm curious why a couple posters think he'd be light years better than Gruden? Is it just Gruden's long layoff from actually coaching?

Gruden's never even coached even at the coordinator level in college. He's a slightly-less successful Brian Billick in the NFL (by career W/L %). Maybe he'd be great, but, it just seems like a total crapshoot for $10+ million v. someone who actually has experience coaching in college and who has had success there in a difficult environment - whether that person be Shiano or some other college coach who has had success.

Has there ever been a coach, college or basketball, who was successful as a first-time college coach after a 10 year layoff from any coaching at all? Or even someone in that position who became a hugely-paid hire for a big program? It's so random that Gruden is still such a huge name talked about when vacancies come up. He must be working hard to keep his name out there so he can get one last huge payday in case the broadcasting career ever fizzles out.

[Warhammer]

Originally Posted by CrescentMoonie

Heard on ESPN radio today, don't remember who as I wasn't really paying attention, that the last 3-4 HC hires at Tennessee all have the same agent as Schiano. Wouldn't say who the agent is.

More than likely Jimmy Sexton. He is an alum of UT.

[jbergey22]

I wonder how many quarterbacks Gruden would recruit each year though?

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by molson

Gruden's never even coached even at the coordinator level in college. He's a slightly-less successful Brian Billick in the NFL (by career W/L %). Maybe he'd be great, but, it just seems like a total crapshoot for $10+ million v. someone who actually has experience coaching in college and who has had success there in a difficult environment - whether that person be Shiano or some other college coach who has had success.

Has there ever been a coach, college or basketball, who was successful as a first-time college coach after a 10 year layoff from any coaching at all? Or even someone in that position who became a hugely-paid hire for a big program? It's so random that Gruden is still such a huge name talked about when vacancies come up. He must be working hard to keep his name out there so he can get one last huge payday in case the broadcasting career ever fizzles out.

I don't get the Gruden talk either. Reports are he makes $6.5 million at ESPN which is a pretty sweet gig with good job stability. I think if anything he'd go back to the NFL or take a front office position.

Not sure how deep the Tennessee pockets are but you'd think they'd have to put up at least $8 million a year to pry him away and that's with a longer term deal.

[RainMaker]

I'm also a little surprised at how much shit the Schiano signing stirred up. I know he flamed out in the NFL but the guy won 11 games at Rutgers.

[molson]

The funny thing is, as someone else here alluded to, it seems like it's only Tennessee who is still obsessed with Jon Gruden.

At the moment, over at the Tennessee subreddit, the #1 and #2 desired targets right now seem to be Lane Kiffin and Tee Martin. But the second most upvoted post from a pre-Schiano meltdown thread from a few weeks ago was calling for Bill Belichick. He was actually born in Nashville after all. I'm not even joking.

I think Tennessee should probably just hire Bellichick, Gruden, Peyton Manning, Nick Saban, Urban Meyer, and they can all just form a super-coach committee or something and rule the world.

I'd also like to point out that one of the several Tennessee state legislators going off on a claimed ethics crusade against Schiano retweeted a message of support of Roy Moore.

[RainMaker]

The only idea I liked was them hiring Cutcliffe for a few years with Tee Martin as the OC/associate head coach who would take over when Cutcliffe retires. But it sounds like Cutcliffe is happy playing out his final years at Duke.

The whole thing sounds like a clusterfuck which makes Lane Kiffin the perfect choice.

[Logan]

Originally Posted by lungs

Does Fleck even have a rolodex of coaches built up? A lot of angst among the Goof faithful this year seems to be aimed at the O Coordinator. Not that he has much talent to work with. But from what I've read, Fleck's style is to give his coordinators a lot of leeway as he's more of the CEO type of coach. Maybe he's using Minnesota to build that up a bit.

Fleck is actually under the Schiano tree, oddly enough. He moved up a level under Schiano at Rutgers and then went with him to Tampa Bay. His staff at Western Michigan also was full of Schiano guys including his OC and DC. He took the same OC to Minnesota with him and his DC is a Schiano protege.

Originally Posted by Warhammer

More than likely Jimmy Sexton. He is an alum of UT.

Sexton represents pretty much everybody in coaching, so not a major surprise. Fun Fact...Schiano used to be repped by Bryan Harlan, who I believe is still Fleck's agent.

[Warhammer]

Honestly, you could make the case Tiger High is the better job than UT. They have gone to their title game the last few years. They have had as good of a program as UT the last few years, and have actually been ranked.

[tarcone]

Josey Jewell wins the Jack Lambert and Josh Jackson wins the Jack Tatum award.

Man, we had a great defense. As good as it was our offense was that bad.

[Logan]

McElwain is getting $7.5MM of his buyout from Florida.

[JPhillips]

Originally Posted by tarcone

Josey Jewell wins the Jack Lambert and Josh Jackson wins the Jack Tatum award.

Man, we had a great defense. As good as it was our offense was that bad.

That's a lot of Js.

[mauchow]

Wisconsin got a nice draw!

I would love to avoid playing OU and Auburn in round 1! Let them beat each other up!

[bronconick]

Mississippi State (with 4 losses and soft non-conference schedule) and Fresno State are in the poll so that next week the committee can justify putting Bama in the playoff by pointing to the MSU and Fresno wins as wins over top-25 teams.

[CrescentMoonie]

Fresno is better than 75% of Wisconsin's schedule.

[MrBug708]

Arizona State is interviewing Herm Edwards.

Wow.

[Edward64]

New AR AD supposedly to be announced tomorrow.

Hopefully that will spur the HC search.