COVID-19 - Wuhan Coronavirus (a non-political thread, see pg. 36 #1778)

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by PilotMan

Yeah, they were Dem ideas, that are now being put into play and practice that were long called stupid, overbearing, or unneeded. That's a win. You can claim that all day long and point fingers at the other side in the process.

Pelosi was demanding means-testing before she'd consider any proposal and Schumer is touting payday loans for small businesses. Sure members of the party have touted those ideas, but not the leadership.

Originally Posted by PilotMan

dola
Where are the hard core "free-market capitalists" in all this?

Everyone's a social democrat during a pandemic.

[IlliniCub]

Originally Posted by MIJB#19

One week is way too short, it's 14 days to not have caught it plus 14 days to develop symptoms. Results of measures won't show up until at least 4 weeks after the (semi) lockdown starts.

I was talking about Italy's numbers. By my calculations we're about a week or 2 from seeing how the experiment worked? Could be wrong?

[JPhillips]

Originally Posted by molson

We're going to do a dick measuring contest about who the most pessimistic was? Great!

And congrats to anyone that was fired up about people dying that you need to brag about that now. I've noticed that some people seem super excited about worst-case scenarios.

Stop. No one is excited. But there was ample evidence even at the level of news consumer to see that this was a potential major problem. Saying nobody could have known is simply not accurate and not only allows the mistakes of the past to be forgotten, but gives permission for more mistakes to be made and ignored.

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by molson

We're going to do a dick measuring contest about who the most pessimistic was? Great!

And congrats to anyone that was fired up about people dying that you need to brag about that now. I've noticed that some people seem super excited about worst-case scenarios.

I don't care who posted first. I do care deeply if, as it appears, high-ranking government officials understood how this was likely to go, but refused to act for political reasons.

[Brian Swartz]

Michigan is moving rapidly up the list of states in terms of confirmed case count. Tripled the number of cases in less than a day. Detroit, unfortunately a de facto disaster area for decades already, is clearly about to become the latest big city to become an even bigger nightmare

[Edward64]

Originally Posted by molson

We're going to do a dick measuring contest about who the most pessimistic was? Great!

And congrats to anyone that was fired up about people dying that you need to brag about that now. I've noticed that some people seem super excited about worst-case scenarios.

Uh no? A question, actually challenge, was proposed and it was answered.

[Arles]

I think when the dust settles, the Trump/fox news "poo-pooing" this in the early days really put us behind the 8-ball. I'm assuming most of the medical professionals consulted behaved like Ben's friend and Trump just decided not to listen. I know it would have been tough for him to make statements politically before it broke out, but the administration should have atleast been setting up the infrastructure behind the scenes to be ready if it did happen.

[ISiddiqui]

Or rather the folks who were seemingly more pessimestic a few weeks back were those who were taking these reports seriously? I mean it's undoubtable that Fox News was downplaying COVID-19 for a while, basically around the time when Trump was. And Fox News was telling it's viewers that it's basically no worse than the flu. This was the same time that CNN and MSNBC were getting worried about the pandemic. I don't think it's a coincidence that my friends who tend to watch Fox News were waiving off any fears and kept saying this is a 'media panic' and the 'media' should be ashamed of itself.

I don't think it's going too far to say Fox News has blood on its hands.

[cartman]

not sure if this has been posted here or not.

How Fox News has shifted its coronavirus rhetoric https://t.co/tTUOIV0tUi pic.twitter.com/q4FdGdduDX

— The Washington Post (@washingtonpost) March 18, 2020

[larrymcg421]

Originally Posted by molson

We're going to do a dick measuring contest about who the most pessimistic was? Great!

And congrats to anyone that was fired up about people dying that you need to brag about that now. I've noticed that some people seem super excited about worst-case scenarios.

No one is fired up. That's ridiculous and you know it.

There is no dick measuring contest. Panerd's post laid out a claim and JPhillips refuted the claim. The responses JPhillips cited weren't only his posts. They were posts from a variety of people who thought this was serious. You'd have known that if you spent 5 seconds looking at them before firing off your hysterical bullshit post.

[Arles]

This is the problem with our political system right now. If the republican side is in power, they want to do everything to protect it and keep things going well. It's really no different than a NFL team if a top player gets suspended for steroids. Their fans say it's no big deal while opponent fans act like that player is the worst person on the planet.

One hope for after we get through all this is maybe we dial that "us against them" rhetoric back a bit. But, given what I see on twitter right now (from the left and the right), that looks like a pipe dream.

[molson]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

Stop. No one is excited. But there was ample evidence even at the level of news consumer to see that this was a potential major problem. Saying nobody could have known is simply not accurate and not only allows the mistakes of the past to be forgotten, but gives permission for more mistakes to be made and ignored.

We've been warned periodically of worldwide virus and illness threats. Look at the Ebola thread. We were all going to die. Nobody here, private citizens, had expert information about where we'd be now. The amount of worry one had, or preparations one made, was entirely based on one's own personal worry and pessimism level.

The worriers were right this time. If they used that worry to help others or prepare to help others, than that's great. They're heroes. If it's about bragging on message boards and putting others down who don't think the world is ending every time there's a new flu reported, I'm not sure it's as productive.

I'm still more optimistic than most. It's just how I'm wired. I heed official advice. And my priority is helping people. But I sure as hell didn't think this is where we'd be on March 19. If I was a more depressed, pessimistic person, I would have been scared and started buying toilet paper in January I guess. I don't think that would have made me a better person.

[larrymcg421]

Generic "both sides" rhetoric is also very problematic.

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by Arles

I know it would have been tough for him to make statements politically before it broke out, but the administration should have atleast been setting up the infrastructure behind the scenes to be ready if it did happen.

Bingo, and the press is already misfiring on this story, from what I'm seeing. They're talking about how Burr "didn't inform the public." Whatever. Though all won't agree with it, there's a cogent argument to be made that the public didn't need to be informed until it was time for us to start social distancing, etc. My issue is if, as it appears, they had this guidance from medical experts and didn't DO anything.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Arles

One hope for after we get through all this is maybe we dial that "us against them" rhetoric back a bit. But, given what I see on twitter right now (from the left and the right), that looks like a pipe dream.

Another hope is we can drop this "best in the world" attitude and exceptionalism that no longer exists. This country has been exposed as behind the curve scientifically and bureaucratically. Perhaps this experience will be a lesson for us to catch up to the rest of the world.

[panerd]

Originally Posted by molson

We've been warned periodically of worldwide virus and illness threats. Look at the Ebola thread. We were all going to die. Nobody here, private citizens, had expert information about where we'd be now. The amount of worry one had, or preparations one made, was entirely based on one's own personal worry and pessimism level.

The worriers were right this time. If they used that worry to help others or prepare to help others, than that's great. They're heroes. If it's about bragging on message boards and putting others down who don't think the world is ending every time there's a new flu reported, I'm not sure it's as productive.

I'm still more optimistic than most. It's just how I'm wired. I heed official advice. And my priority is helping people. But I sure as hell didn't think this is where we'd be on March 19. If I was a more depressed, pessimistic person, I would have been scared and started buying toilet paper in January I guess. I don't think that would have made me a better person.

Yeah much better response than I had, thank you Molson. Let's just say JPhillips.posts and attitudes on this seem to be slighty politcial?

[molson]

Originally Posted by larrymcg421

Generic "both sides" rhetoric is also very problematic.

Maybe, but if we're going to draw a moral line between the optimistic and the pessimists, then I think the pessimists are on the wrong side to the extent they didn't take steps to help others when they knew where were headed.

I feel like this board right now is a lot of financially-secure people comfortably hiding out, patting each other on the back, and judging people who don't have that luxury.

[panerd]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Another hope is we can drop this "best in the world" attitude and exceptionalism that no longer exists. This country has been exposed as behind the curve scientifically and bureaucratically. Perhaps this experience will be a lesson for us to catch up to the rest of the world.

Serious question outside of China, Italy, and South Korea where exactly do the other countries of the world differ for better or worse? Because we are talking similar numbers as the US all across.Europe and those governments vary from highly bureaucratic and socialist to closer to us with seemingly similar results to one another. So what improvements could we have made that would have made any difference?

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by Brian Swartz

Hogwash. We need to stay above this level of ageism nonsense. Literally every 60+ I know - including multiple who had the amazingly poor judgement to vote for Trump - is taking this seriously, self-isolating, rescheduling stuff on their own when they can without having to be asked to etc. This isn't a generational issue, it's a some people are self-absorbed jerks issue. My personal observations in my area are that the only people I see refusing to observe social distancing at all in any form are those around 30 who apparently think they're immune or something. This isn't making me go off on millennials though - they are just people making bad, selfish decisions.

Originally Posted by GrantDawg

My daughter was tasked by her eye center with calling all 60+ year olds, and rescheduling their appointments. She called my wife crying because of the abuse she was taking, and none of the people she called was willing to reschedule.

Originally Posted by GrantDawg

Now for my wife's office. Her first patient came in and said "I was at a conference this weekend that one person was later diagnosed with the virus, but I feel fine." The second said, Oh, I can't pick out glasses right now. My daughter I as to help me, but I left her home because she is very sick."

Originally Posted by Radii

My 70 year old mom who hates trump and never turns on fox news is being her normal, erratic, irresponsible self. I don't speak with her anymore for my own well being but have been keeping up with my sister closely and trying to help her to get mom in the right mindset. Last Friday she wanted to go to urgent care for allergies. Sister is trying to help her get a bunch of groceries so mom doesn't have to go anywhere, mom is resisting in all kinds of strange ways, and is likely to just go out and run 20 errands as soon as she feels up to it. In addition to being 70, she's a poorly controlled diabetic, and has had 3 or 4 issues in the past that took a whack at her respiratory system. Her level of risk is completely off the charts, and there is zero way to get her to give a shit about it.

Yep, it's just those damn millenials being selfish...

Originally Posted by JAG

For a less doom and gloom look, here’s a more optimistic outlook: Thread by @trvrb: I've been mulling over the @MRC_Outbreak modeling report on #COVID19 mitigation and suppression strategies since it was posted on March 16.…

I know that some of the large biotech companies have started to roll out test kits. Roche has one and has shipped out 450,000 test kits. Abbott yesterday got approval for theirs and is shipping out 150,000, by the end of the month they supposedly will be able to ramp up to shipping 1 million test kits per week. BD I believe also has a test kit under FDA review and there may be others.

I don't trust the numbers out of China completely, but I'm willing to believe them that they've mostly got Wuhan under control, and we've obviously seen how South Korea's measures worked. In both cases it's been 6 (Korea)-10 (Wuhan) weeks for them to get to that point? So why are so many eager to take as gospel the Imperial College report where their hospitalization curve peaks in early July (14 weeks away) even under their best case long term scenarios https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ETbvzf2UcAAHWlR.jpg while also saying a full suppression tactic will just delay the spike https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ETbv-dPUUAEQGh5.jpg and we're guaranteed 1.1 million+ deaths?... Does anyone think South Korea, which has been the most successful at suppression and identification, is going to have a massive spike and resurgence in the future? I certainly don't, and I don't think we will here either as we can get testing ramped up - and there's plenty of evidence companies are already quickly ramping up our ability to test, just like I assume we'll be able to massively ramp up our number of ventilators as we focus on that too. The herd immunity stuff is also interesting to think about longer term, especially among medical professionals - it almost seems like 20-25% of the >45 population (or extending upwards among medical professionals if there are available beds) being exposed at this time & on a rolling basis going forward would be best if you can keep them separate from the highest risk 65+ population. Not sure entirely how that's manageable, more of an interesting thought exercise, but 60+ year old's not yelling at receptionists who try to reschedule eye exams or showing up in grocery store lines every time I stop in one could be a nice start.

[panerd]

Originally Posted by larrymcg421

No one is fired up. That's ridiculous and you know it.

There is no dick measuring contest. Panerd's post laid out a claim and JPhillips refuted the claim. The responses JPhillips cited weren't only his posts. They were posts from a variety of people who thought this was serious. You'd have known that if you spent 5 seconds looking at them before firing off your hysterical bullshit post.

Not really. Jphillips is a chicken little on everything Trump does. (Kind of like Ron Paul when the market fails right?) My original post was about others taklkng about great travel deals who now claim to have had the foresight that the sky was falling back then.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by BishopMVP

Yep, it's just those damn millenials being selfish...

I don't trust the numbers out of China completely, but I'm willing to believe them that they've mostly got Wuhan under control, and we've obviously seen how South Korea's measures worked. In both cases it's been 6 (Korea)-10 (Wuhan) weeks for them to get to that point? So why are so many eager to take as gospel the Imperial College report where their hospitalization curve peaks in early July (14 weeks away) even under their best case long term scenarios https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ETbvzf2UcAAHWlR.jpg while also saying a full suppression tactic will just delay the spike https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ETbv-dPUUAEQGh5.jpg and we're guaranteed 1.1 million+ deaths?... Does anyone think South Korea, which has been the most successful at suppression and identification, is going to have a massive spike and resurgence in the future? I certainly don't, and I don't think we will here either as we can get testing ramped up - and there's plenty of evidence companies are already quickly ramping up our ability to test, just like I assume we'll be able to massively ramp up our number of ventilators as we focus on that too. The herd immunity stuff is also interesting to think about longer term, especially among medical professionals - it almost seems like 20-25% of the >45 population (or extending upwards among medical professionals if there are available beds) being exposed at this time & on a rolling basis going forward would be best if you can keep them separate from the highest risk 65+ population. Not sure entirely how that's manageable, more of an interesting thought exercise, but 60+ year old's not yelling at receptionists who try to reschedule eye exams or showing up in grocery store lines every time I stop in one could be a nice start.

China and South Korea were far more prepared to handle this than we are. Really can't compare them to us.

[RainMaker]

CUOMO: "We did some projections. We think here in New York... we're looking here at a peak in about five or six weeks. We're looking at about 110,000 hospitalizations, about 25,000 to 37,000 people needing ICU beds. That vastly overwhelms our healthcare capacity."

— Ryan Struyk (@ryanstruyk) March 19, 2020

[AlexB]

Originally Posted by Ben E Lou

The combination of our inherent American individualistic thinking, the stubborn resistance to breaks in routine that many older folks have, and the initial downplaying by the administration and many in the right-wing media is going to be tough to overcome. I'm already seeing some dismissing the administration's change of message as "even Trump is capable of bowing to political correctness." It's maddeningly frustrating, and it sucks that your daughter caught flack for it.

My parents are similar, both over 70 and still going shopping, for coffees at the golf club, to a garden centre today.

It’s selfish & irresponsible in my eyes: the science says no, the government says so, me and my brother say no, but they don’t want to, so it’s screw the rest of country, risk their grandkids growing up without a full set of grandparents.

Mum’s a Daily Mail reader, dad’s just stubborn and doesn’t consider himself in the at risk group (he’s active and better than the vast majority at his age, but still 87 and takes pills for an elevated HR about which he had to go to A&E twice last year).

Nothing either me or my brother have said seems to have had much effect (they did ask me to get some stuff while I was at the supermarket today, but went to the garden centre at the exact same time).

My only option is to aggressively call them on it - my thought is to remind them that they voted Brexit as they felt it was better for the UK to govern ourselves, and then 3 months later they choose to directly and consciously ignore the UK government advice in the most serious time since WW2...

I don’t know what else to do TBH.

[JAG]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

China and South Korea were far more prepared to handle this than we are. Really can't compare them to us.

Even still, that take was too optimisitc. South Korea cases went from 95 to 150+ new so it’s still not exactly over there. There are already two strains of COVID-19 out there and it’s shown a pretty good ability to mutate, now add in infecting a bunch of new hosts. I don’t anticipate international travel opening up anytime soon.

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by larrymcg421

Generic "both sides" rhetoric is also very problematic.

Not to mention completely wrong. There is enough evidence that Fox News completely downplayed it based on what the President was saying. And now there is evidence that Republican Senators knew 3 weeks ago that it'd be far worse than the President was saying in public and prepped themselves while saying it was a nothingburger in public.

This isn't about pessimists 'winning', but the folks who were paying attention to what health experts were saying for weeks. It's another example of folks who constantly denigrate science not listening to the folks who had the facts and were warning people about it. And other media was getting concerned and talking about it. Sanjay Gupta has been on CNN for weeks saying this is going to be a problem. One major news network said it wasn't a big deal... they should not be left unscathed or benefit from the 'both sides' bullshit.

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Another hope is we can drop this "best in the world" attitude and exceptionalism that no longer exists. This country has been exposed as behind the curve scientifically and bureaucratically. Perhaps this experience will be a lesson for us to catch up to the rest of the world.

Originally Posted by RainMaker

China and South Korea were far more prepared to handle this than we are. Really can't compare them to us.

South Korea (and a few smaller Asian governments that were hit hard by SARS/MERS) have shown a much better response. I don't need to hear about China as a better example when there is ample evidence they suppressed evidence and information (and even called in medical professionals to have political chats with them in the early days) that allowed the virus to blow up in their own country. (Not going to 100% blame them for it's worldwide spread - enough foreigners seemed to be in the Wuhan area early and it probably would have been spread regardless).

But "American exceptionalism" has historically not been defined by us being ahead of the curve, it's been about our response when faced with threats. Part of South Korea's success wasn't government directed it was a private company acting early, and while it seems we missed that boat and there certainly should be questions about the manufacturing defect in the initial CDC developed test, Abbott, Thermo-Fisher & Roche are lined up to produce millions per week soon.

Massachusetts/Boston is a good barometer for all this in that it has a ton of high quality hospitals, medical research and manufacturing companies that are used to partnering, all within a small area. It was also one of the initial flare ups (the Biogen conference) and one where the state government took seemingly drastic action a couple days before many other states. They'll probably be one of the first states to really test people who need it so a better idea can develop of the scope, and also one that has higher health care capacity than many (and so far 0 deaths).

EDIT - I will add that unfortunately it seems like the NYC area and Georgia at a minimum will quickly turn into shitshows and have high death rates unfortunately. I won't be shocked if North Carolina joins them - Charlotte does have a large medical presence, but it is not being taken nearly as seriously here as up in Boston.

[Arles]

Originally Posted by panerd

Serious question outside of China, Italy, and South Korea where exactly do the other countries of the world differ for better or worse? Because we are talking similar numbers as the US all across.Europe and those governments vary from highly bureaucratic and socialist to closer to us with seemingly similar results to one another. So what improvements could we have made that would have made any difference?

It's just such and apples and oranges comparison between the USA, S Korea, Italy, UK and Germany:

US: 331 million
Germany: 83 million
UK: 67 million
Italy: 60 million
S Korea: 51 million

Don't you think it would be a lot easier to deal with if all we had to worry about was California, Oregon and Washington? (52 million). Basically the US is akin to all of Western and Southern Europe (340 million) trying to stop the virus from spreading while keeping all their borders open with no restrictions.

Originally Posted by RainMaker

China and South Korea were far more prepared to handle this than we are. Really can't compare them to us.

You're kidding me on China, right? They knew back on Dec 1, 2019 and did nothing until late January. If the US followed that model, we wouldn't do a thing until late April. The fact that China took over 7 weeks before taking serious steps is a major reason the rest of the world is dealing with it. China is an example of exactly how NOT to act when a potential outbreak occurs. If you think Trump is bad, look at how the Chinese treated Wuhan in December and most of January.

[cartman]

Talk about bad luck and timing. A cousin of mine opened up a new restaurant outside of Fort Worth a couple of weeks ago.

[NobodyHere]

Originally Posted by cartman

Talk about bad luck and timing. A cousin of mine opened up a new restaurant outside of Fort Worth a couple of weeks ago.

Did the restaurant go viral?

[cartman]

Sean Payton has tested positive for the coronavirus

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by cartman

Sean Payton has tested positive for the coronavirus

Was he at the Sloan Conference? I saw someone who is pretty sure he has it while at Sloan.

[Brian Swartz]

Originally Posted by panerd

what improvements could we have made that would have made any difference?

Observed what was going on in S. Korea and done the following:

** Not downplayed it in official rhetoric & pronouncements. Prepare the public for the fact that it was coming here ahead of time, instead of saying its not an issue, it's a hoax, everything is under control, etc.

** Begun at least at that point, as I realize there wasn't political will in past years to do advance pandemic prep, to ramp up drive-up testing capacity, production of hospital equipment, etc.

Originally Posted by BishopMVP

I don't think we will here either as we can get testing ramped up - and there's plenty of evidence companies are already quickly ramping up our ability to test, just like I assume we'll be able to massively ramp up our number of ventilators as we focus on that too.

Do you have a suggestion as to how we could ramp up competently trained medical staff in the relevant timeframe as well, since without that the additional ventilators/beds/etc. isn't going to do all that much good?

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by molson

I feel like this board right now is a lot of financially-secure people comfortably hiding out, patting each other on the back, and judging people who don't have that luxury.

I have not seen one person come across that way, and if I have then I am appalled.

There is a huge difference between criticizing people for how they live socially and doing something out of necessity.

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by NobodyHere

Can't say I've thought about this before

Coronavirus online school: Can closed schools offer special education?

Originally Posted by Edward64

My wife teaches special ed.

She is doing remote assignments and will be doing video soon. No real time interaction though. Not perfect, needs more parental involvement (which 60-70% couldn't care to do, school was a public-funded daycare). Yes, the students get short-changed for sure.

My wife has spent the last two days putting together lesson plans, remote assignments, links to various websites (She contacted all of the parents to make sure that the kids have access to a computer and internet) and individual suggestions for the parents/guardians of each kid.

5 of the 7 parents/grandparents/guardians of the kids don't know the user names nor passwords of the kid's e-learning accounts.

Thank goodness she doesn't drink

[Lathum]

So....very close to home

My Mother in Law has to get tested. 7 days ago she was at a hospital in New York, Columbia Presbyterian. She had a heart transplant 11 years ago there and isn't in great shape. She was there for 3 days due to really bad diarrhea and dehydration.

LShe came home last Thursday. Last couple days she has had a runny nose and sore throat. No fever and not dry coughing or having breathing issues. She called her doctor there today and he told her she needs to be tested. The earlier they find out the better.

She called her PCP who said she doesn't think she can get a test without a fever. She called the heart doctor back. this is her exact message from there

I have called all over and can't find a place. Tried even the CDC. I couldn't get through to a person. I spoke with the dept of health. She told me to call Marlboro immediate care because they were doing testing. I called the 800 number she gave me and they said all appointments were taken. Of course it was a machine. I called the CDC and was on the phone on hold. They said if you are calling about the virus to push a number that gave you info about the virus but no person to talk to. Its frustrating.

She is currently waiting for her doctor in New York to call back.

[ISiddiqui]

Senator Dumped Up to $1.6 Million of Stock After Reassuring Public About Coronavirus Preparedness — ProPublica

Soon after he offered public assurances that the government was ready to battle the coronavirus, the powerful chairman of the Senate Intelligence Committee, Richard Burr, sold off a significant percentage of his stocks, unloading between $582,029 and $1.56 million of his holdings on Feb. 13 in 29 separate transactions.

As the head of the intelligence committee, Burr, a North Carolina Republican, has access to the government’s most highly classified information about threats to America’s security. His committee was receiving daily coronavirus briefings around this time, according to a Reuters story.

A week after Burr’s sales, the stock market began a sharp decline and has lost about 30% since.

On Thursday, Burr came under fire after NPR obtained a secret recording from Feb. 27, in which the lawmaker gave a VIP group at an exclusive social club a much more dire preview of the economic impact of the coronavirus than what he had told the public.

Senator Burr needs to go to jail.

[Brian Swartz]

@ Lathum: not much that can be said I don't think other than I've very sorry someone close to you is in that all-too-common situation.

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by Lathum

Last couple days she has had a runny nose and sore throat. No fever and not dry coughing or having breathing issues. She called her doctor there today and he told her she needs to be tested. The earlier they find out the better.

Though on the bright side, her symptoms sound more like the cold than Covid 19.

[Edward64]

FWIW, wife came back from a run. She dropped by Publix and got some eggs! She said it was pretty busy but plenty of eggs, a guy was putting them out.

That's a good sign I guess.

[Edward64]

Haven't heard much from the socialist democrat on the Pandemic since Sun debates. Guess the social democrats don't have much to offer in the immediacy of the situation (or still putting aloe on their butts with the butt kicking they got).

Probably Bernie and the other like minded Gen Zed & Millennial socialists were sunning it up in the Florida beaches and dreaming of their Cuban utopia.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

Though on the bright side, her symptoms sound more like the cold than Covid 19.

I know!

TBH I am frustrated at her doctor for getting her worked up. She has virtually no symptoms and he has to know she wont be able to get tested. All it is doing is making her panic.

[Radii]

Originally Posted by Edward64

Haven't heard much from the socialist democrat on the Pandemic since Sun debates. Guess the social democrats don't have much to offer in the immediacy of the situation (or still putting aloe on their butts with the butt kicking they got).

Probably Bernie and the other like minded Gen Zed & Millennial socialists were sunning it up in the Florida beaches and dreaming of their Cuban utopia.

Yeah, its definitely a problem with some posters getting political about trump.

Jesus fucking christ dude.

[Edward64]

Originally Posted by Radii

Yeah, its definitely a problem with some posters getting political about trump.

Jesus fucking christ dude.

Nothing to do with Trump, see #1651 for the political cheap shot.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by panerd

Serious question outside of China, Italy, and South Korea where exactly do the other countries of the world differ for better or worse? Because we are talking similar numbers as the US all across.Europe and those governments vary from highly bureaucratic and socialist to closer to us with seemingly similar results to one another. So what improvements could we have made that would have made any difference?

We are barely getting started and nurses are already resorting to making their own masks. The UAE and Kuwait have tested more people than us.

And why "outside of China and South Korea"? Two different governments that have both made us look like a 3rd world country in terms of response. We should be at least at their level.

[Radii]

Originally Posted by Edward64

Nothing to do with Trump.

I was referring to the numerous comments made during the day today accusing people of being overly and unnecessarily political regarding Trump in this thread. If that gets called out then the bullshit way you are referring to some politicians that you don't like does too.

[Radii]

ah fuck it. Why I click on posts sometimes from people I have ignored is beyond me. Forget it, my fault.

[Edward64]

Originally Posted by Radii

I was referring to the numerous comments made during the day today accusing people of being overly and unnecessarily political regarding Trump in this thread. If that gets called out then the bullshit way you are referring to some politicians that you don't like does too.

Feel free to call it out in post #1651. Let's be fair and balanced (not Fox version)

[ISiddiqui]

Tbf, what can Senator Sanders do at this point in time? He was one of the voices calling for direct payments to people at least. It's probably for the best if he doesn't try to grab the airwaves right now. I think he's actually considering whether he should suspend his campaign or not (he should).

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Edward64

Nothing to do with Trump, see #1651 for the political cheap shot.

Government is setting up UBI for Americans as we speak. President just made a declaration to nationalize private factories. There are multiple bills being pushed through to provide government health care, day care, and funding for businesses. The military is setting up publicly funded medical facilities and testing as we speak.

That's not a cheap shot. The government is full of social democrats right now. There are no libertarians in a pandemic.

[JPhillips]

Originally Posted by Lathum

So....very close to home

My Mother in Law has to get tested. 7 days ago she was at a hospital in New York, Columbia Presbyterian. She had a heart transplant 11 years ago there and isn't in great shape. She was there for 3 days due to really bad diarrhea and dehydration.

LShe came home last Thursday. Last couple days she has had a runny nose and sore throat. No fever and not dry coughing or having breathing issues. She called her doctor there today and he told her she needs to be tested. The earlier they find out the better.

She called her PCP who said she doesn't think she can get a test without a fever. She called the heart doctor back. this is her exact message from there



She is currently waiting for her doctor in New York to call back.

The person I mentioned earlier was my mother-in-law. She tested negative, luckily.