The Obama Presidency - 2008 & 2012

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Lathum

I got nothing.

You should have aimed better.

[JPhillips]

I read a good article suggesting that Christie is hoping for an override of his veto. That way it won't really hurt him in 2013 when he runs for reelection and if he runs for the White House in 2016 he can tell conservatives he tried, but those damn liberals did it anyway.

Marriage equality is about to pass in Maryland. Surprisingly one of the people lobbying for equality is Dick Cheney. Maybe he's trying to redeem himself for the 2004 plan to drive the conservative vote by putting gay marriage banning amendments on state ballots.

[JPhillips]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

Big Banks Accused of Manipulating Key Interest Rates | Business | TIME.com

and heeeeeeeeeerrre comes the next banking scandal...

I propose doing nothing and blaming brown people.

[SteveMax58]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

Marriage equality is about to pass in Maryland. Surprisingly one of the people lobbying for equality is Dick Cheney. Maybe he's trying to redeem himself for the 2004 plan to drive the conservative vote by putting gay marriage banning amendments on state ballots.

I think he's doing it because he disagrees with the conventional Republican base. He was always in disagreement with Bush on this issue but, contrary to popular opinion, George Bush was actually the guy in charge (for better or worse).

[rowech]

Originally Posted by SteveMax58

I think he's doing it because he disagrees with the conventional Republican base. He was always in disagreement with Bush on this issue but, contrary to popular opinion, George Bush was actually the guy in charge (for better or worse).

He's doing it because his daughter is a lesbian and viewpoints change on things once they involve someone you love.

[PilotMan]

Originally Posted by rowech

He's doing it because his daughter is a lesbian and his opinion won't significantly harm the Republican party now. The man has priorities.

Fixed that for you.

[SteveMax58]

Originally Posted by rowech

He's doing it because his daughter is a lesbian and viewpoints change on things once they involve someone you love.

His daughter was a lesbian in 2004 as well. His viewpoint, from all public accounts that I've ever seen, has not changed.

He's more vocal about it today because he no longer has a boss that disagrees and is pushing a different agenda. Such is life, you don't contradict your boss publicly.

[ISiddiqui]

From all that I read, Cheney wasn't all that happy with the 2004 anti-gay push. That was all Rove.

[sabotai]

Maybe I'm not remembering this right, but I could have sworn that during one of the debates between him and either Edwards or Lieberman, he explicitly expressed support for gay marriage. Or maybe it was during one of the political shows.....

I do remember him being asked if he supported gay marriage, and he said yes. Gonna have to do some digging....(aka, googling)

[sabotai]

After putting in as much time as I'm willing to on a Saturday afternoon, about 10 minutes (I've got some CKII to play!), all I could find is that in 2000, Cheney said that "freedom means freedom for everyone", that people should be free to enter into relationships of their choosing and that the states should decide the issue (in that, he was opposed to a constitutional amendment banning gay marriage).

I also saw on YouTube the entire debate between Cheney and Lieberman is posted.

EDIT: Ok, I decided to skip through the videos to see if the topic came up. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k4YeiItymfo

Starts at around 3minutes in. Lieberman said he was against gay marriage and Cheney didn't explicitly say either way, but both played the political game by calling it a "tough issue" and whatnot.

[stevew]

Obama was great on the BS Report today.

[rowech]

Originally Posted by stevew

Obama was great on the BS Report today.

Maybe he should try being a president instead of a celebrity.

[SirFozzie]

President spends one hour speaking to someone about sports and pop culture, and people act like he's blowing off his job. As things stand, in my opinion, he's being president just fine, thank you very much.

[SirFozzie]

Well, it ain't like Congress is sending him anything to sign... and with the election coming in November, it's probably just killing time until campaign season starts. If he was doing things unilaterally folks would be screaming at him for that. I mean, there's a limit of times he can meet with the ambassador from EastWTFistan..

[stevew]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

President spends one hour speaking to someone about sports and pop culture, and people act like he's blowing off his job. As things stand, in my opinion, he's being president just fine, thank you very much.

It was like 22 minutes. I'm sure he takes contemplative shits longer than that a few times a week.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

Well, it ain't like Congress is sending him anything to sign... and with the election coming in November, it's probably just killing time until campaign season starts. If he was doing things unilaterally folks would be screaming at him for that. I mean, there's a limit of times he can meet with the ambassador from EastWTFistan..

Is that like Ubeki-beki-beki-stan-stan - Wikiality, the Truthiness Encyclopedia ?

SI

[Buccaneer]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

. I mean, there's a limit of times he can meet with the ambassador from EastWTFistan..

I had to laugh at that.

[rowech]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

Well, it ain't like Congress is sending him anything to sign... and with the election coming in November, it's probably just killing time until campaign season starts. If he was doing things unilaterally folks would be screaming at him for that. I mean, there's a limit of times he can meet with the ambassador from EastWTFistan..

I understand. The whole thing is dysfunctional at this point but why not just sit in the White House and not do anything like this for a couple of weeks. Make it look like you're at least working at something.

I know every day is an exaggeration but I just get irritated seeing him constantly doing stuff like this. Truth is, he doesn't even need to campaign to win the next election.

[molson]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

I mean, there's a limit of times he can meet with the ambassador from EastWTFistan..

EastWTFistan is one of our key allies though.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by molson

EastWTFistan is one of our key allies though.

Were they part of the Coalition of the Willing?

SI

[SirFozzie]

We have to protect our valued allies in East WTF-istan from the evil Lulzamy,.. rumor has it that they're developing LOLLERBLADES and ROFLCOPTERS, in clear violation of international law..


(it was either that or try the 1984-speak "We have always been at war with East WTF-istan. West WTF-istan have always been our friends."

[SirFozzie]

(besides, Obama's just getting ready for his one hour ESPN "Obama's Bracket" special***)

***I'm joking. There's no such thing &&&

&&& Although if there was such a thing, I'm sure ESPN would air it.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by rowech

I understand. The whole thing is dysfunctional at this point but why not just sit in the White House and not do anything like this for a couple of weeks. Make it look like you're at least working at something.

I know every day is an exaggeration but I just get irritated seeing him constantly doing stuff like this. Truth is, he doesn't even need to campaign to win the next election.

Or be like W. and go on countless vacations home to your ranch.

It's a non-story dude. Every President does stuff like this/even more than this. Don't get your panties in a bunch.

[SirFozzie]

I know I have a habit of saying this DT, but could you back that last post off a bit, it wasn't personal until you made it personal.

[cartman]

Sheriff Arpaio is trying to fan the flames of birtherism.

Ariz. Sheriff Arpaio: Obama Birth Certificate 'Computer Generated Forgery' : The Two-Way : NPR

[SirFozzie]

When Arapio's big point "LAYERS! SEE IT WAS COMPUTER GENERATED" was debunked a year ago.. by Fox News.. you start to realize that they're desperately trying to grab something, anything to avoid having to say "I'm wrong"

Expert: No Doubt Obama's Birth Certificate Is Legit | Fox News

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

I know I have a habit of saying this DT, but could you back that last post off a bit, it wasn't personal until you made it personal.

You mean the "don't get your panties in a bunch" line? That wasn't me trying to make it personal...it's just an expression right? Or do people view it as something personal?

[cartman]

I have yet to see a manually generated PDF, for what its worth. Every single one I've ever come across has been computer generated.

[BYU 14]

Originally Posted by cartman

Sheriff Arpaio is trying to fan the flames of birtherism.

Ariz. Sheriff Arpaio: Obama Birth Certificate 'Computer Generated Forgery' : The Two-Way : NPR

I think Joe should be focusing on cleaning up the clusterfuck that was operation fast and furious before he practices his forgery detection skills.

I don't think one person has ever polarized internally as much as Arpaio. I love some of the stuff he does, but am absolutely appalled at some of his actions too.

[Grover]

Federal Judge Sent Joke Email Implying Obama’s Mother Had Sex With Dog | TPMMuckraker

Sigh.

[miked]

Originally Posted by Grover

Federal Judge Sent Joke Email Implying Obama’s Mother Had Sex With Dog | TPMMuckraker

Sigh.

I missed the first part of this that he was actually a federal judge. I mean, it's pretty sour overall, but moreso being in that position. To be fair, at least he initiated proceedings against himself for forwarding that email. But is it cool for judges to openly admit they are against a president? Doesn't that put in to question their interpretation of federal laws enacted by said president?

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by miked

Doesn't that put in to question their interpretation of federal laws enacted by said president?

Not nearly so much as a gay judge hearing a gay marriage appeal. That seems like a considerably more vested interest than disliking an elected official.

Plus, give or take, it seems reasonable to figure that at least a third of all cases involving rulings on laws would involve a judge that liked or disliked someone in the food chain of said law. Not sure how you get around some aspects of that without eliminating humans entirely.

[AENeuman]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Not nearly so much as a gay judge hearing a gay marriage appeal. That seems like a considerably more vested interest than disliking an elected official.

It's been awhile since a classic Jon quote... I knew the forum was dying, glad to see some crazy again...

It's a shame that people categorize someone by only identifying the thing that they most dislike about that person.

[albionmoonlight]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Not nearly so much as a gay judge hearing a gay marriage appeal. That seems like a considerably more vested interest than disliking an elected official.

Plus, give or take, it seems reasonable to figure that at least a third of all cases involving rulings on laws would involve a judge that liked or disliked someone in the food chain of said law. Not sure how you get around some aspects of that without eliminating humans entirely.

The nature of the beast is that judges have to be pretty political and well connected to get appointed in the first place. And they are human. And the Constitution has the mechanism in place to get rid of them--impeachment. Forwarding a racist email does not strike me as an impeachable offense. Classless. But that isn't the standard.

An independent, life-tenured judiciary is a great thing. But it comes with some downsides. And one of them is that a racist like this guy gets to stay on the bench.

As for your other point, Jon (about the gay judge), I never quite got that complaint. The argument against gay marriage, as I understand it, involves the idea that allowing gay marriage hurts and/or devalues and/or diminishes straight marriage. So why wouldn't a straight judge be just as subjected to bias in a gay marriage case? Wouldn't she have a personal incentive in keeping the value of her straight marriage and therefore a bias against gay marriage?

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by AENeuman

It's a shame that people categorize someone by only identifying the thing that they most dislike about that person.

Or by the most relevant thing about the person with regard to the subject at hand (and the controversy about their involvement in the case)

Judge Vaughn Walker's Gay Partner Raised in Proposition 8 Case

In this case, "gay" seemed to be a lot more practical adjective for the judge in question (who I assumed everyone was familiar with) than "the federal judge who was in a long-term relationship with another man".

The latter just seems a bit wordy under the circumstances.

[JediKooter]

So then by your logic, Jon, a heterosexual judge should not be presiding over heterosexual issues? I mean, after all, there's that bias they would have.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by JediKooter

So then by your logic, Jon, a heterosexual judge should not be presiding over heterosexual issues?

Do they appear to be directly affected by their own ruling? If so, then no, they shouldn't be.

Remember though, the only reason I introduced that particular case to this discussion (as opposed to its own) was the suggestion that merely disliking a President was grounds for concerns about their ability to hear a case involving a federal law. Point being, it seems pretty silly to have that concern unless you're also concerned about a much more glaring situation as well.

[Kodos]

Originally Posted by cartman

Sheriff Arpaio is trying to fan the flames of birtherism.

Ariz. Sheriff Arpaio: Obama Birth Certificate 'Computer Generated Forgery' : The Two-Way : NPR

Here's the perfect gift for the Sheriff.

[JediKooter]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Do they appear to be directly affected by their own ruling? If so, then no, they shouldn't be.

Remember though, the only reason I introduced that particular case to this discussion (as opposed to its own) was the suggestion that merely disliking a President was grounds for concerns about their ability to hear a case involving a federal law. Point being, it seems pretty silly to have that concern unless you're also concerned about a much more glaring situation as well.

I can't say I disagree with that. Not the I do agree with it, it's just a fair point you made.

I do think (and I'm painting with a broad brush here and very generally speaking) that a lot of judges think way too highly of their percieved usefulness and never even think about recusing themselves from cases they should.

[AENeuman]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Or by the most relevant thing about the person with regard to the subject at hand (and the controversy about their involvement in the case)

In this case, "gay" seemed to be a lot more practical adjective for the judge in question (who I assumed everyone was familiar with) than "the federal judge who was in a long-term relationship with another man".

The latter just seems a bit wordy under the circumstances.

Well, you certainly don't want to be accused as being "wordy"

I understand your view. For you being gay is something someone is constantly achieving. Unlike being white or a male, one has keep acting gay to be gay.

[JPhillips]

I think it's like mana and when you use your gay you have to charge it back up or risk turning straight.

[Rizon]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

I think it's like mana and when you use your gay you have to charge it back up or risk turning straight.

I heard they recharge during every rainbow.

[Edward64]

Interesting tidbit about Obama's popularity in Israel. Does anyone know what Jews think of Mormonism and vice versa?

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/46598663/ns/world_news/

Interestingly, Israeli Jews appear to have a slight preference for Barack Obama over the current front-runner for the Republican presidential nomination, Mitt Romney. Some 32 percent of Israeli Jews prefer Obama over Romney, while 29 percent prefer the Republican. Among all Israelis, both candidates have 29 percent support – which indicates a more negative view of Obama among Israel's 20 percent Arab minority than among Israeli Jews.

[Edward64]

I like the "I don't bluff" and believe him (hey he went in and took out OBL). The conspiracist makes me wonder if this will/may heat up Sept, Oct timeframe and cause a rallying effect for Obama?

Obama to Iran and Israel: 'As President of the United States, I Don't Bluff' - Jeffrey Goldberg - International - The Atlantic

At the White House on Monday, President Obama will seek to persuade the Israeli prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, to postpone whatever plans he may have to bomb Iran's nuclear facilities in the coming months. Obama will argue that under his leadership, the United States "has Israel's back," and that he will order the U.S. military to destroy Iran's nuclear program if economic sanctions fail to compel Tehran to shelve its nuclear ambitions.

In the most extensive interview he has given about the looming Iran crisis, Obama told me earlier this week that both Iran and Israel should take seriously the possibility of American action against Iran's nuclear facilities. "I think that the Israeli government recognizes that, as president of the United States, I don't bluff." He went on, "I also don't, as a matter of sound policy, go around advertising exactly what our intentions are. But I think both the Iranian and the Israeli governments recognize that when the United States says it is unacceptable for Iran to have a nuclear weapon, we mean what we say."

[Edward64]

I get Rush is an ass but Obama calling the law student seems beneath the presidency and reeks. There are alot more worthy people/families he could be calling with his free time.

Obama calls Sandra Fluke, student dissed by Rush Limbaugh - POLITICO.com

President Barack Obama on Friday phoned the Georgetown University law student who was called a “slut” by Rush Limbaugh to find out if she is OK.

“He encouraged me and supported me and thanked me for speaking out about the concerns of American women,” Sandra Fluke, a third-year law student said. “And what was really personal for me was that he said to tell my parents that they should be proud. And that meant a lot because Rush Limbaugh questioned whether or not my family would be proud of me. So I just appreciated that very much.”

[DaddyTorgo]

Ugh. The drums of war beating on Iran do not have me enthusiastic or overjoyed.

How about we stay the fuck out of foreign entanglements and fix ourselves hmm? Instead of bankrupting ourselves for another generation (or since it's Iran, likely two generations).

Ugh.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Edward64

I get Rush is an ass but Obama calling the law student seems beneath the presidency and reeks. There are alot more worthy people/families he could be calling with his free time.

Obama calls Sandra Fluke, student dissed by Rush Limbaugh - POLITICO.com

LMAO - really? "Beneath the presidency??"

Give me a break.

[panerd]

Not sure about it being beneath the presidency but I wonder who gets more mileage out of it. Obama's supporters or Rush's? My thought is to not even acknowledge Rush and to act like he is irrelevant. This seems like it might fire up the Rush supporters more than it helps Obama.

[panerd]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

Ugh. The drums of war beating on Iran do not have me enthusiastic or overjoyed.

How about we stay the fuck out of foreign entanglements and fix ourselves hmm? Instead of bankrupting ourselves for another generation (or since it's Iran, likely two generations).

Ugh.

Yeah I think it's coming no matter who wins the election. I don't claim to be an expert on the Middle East and there certainly are compelling arguments to be made on both sides on this issue but discussions I have had with coworkers/friends and comments I read online seem to believe this as a war against dirty Muslims who all want to kill us and there doesn't seem to be a whole lot of room for reasoning with that line of thought. I have more hope with Obama than Romney or (dead God) Santorum but not much more.

[larrymcg421]

Um, she's not just some random law student, she was a witness in a major political issue. She was called a slut in front of millions of listeners and I'm sure has had her life turned upside down as a result. I'm not sure what Obama can do now if he's going to get criticized for a simple phone call.