WW XCV: Land of the Role Reveals GAME OVER - Page 30

Danny · 06-01-2009, 12:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PurdueBrad

I cannot support a move to take out somebody that I scanned villager right now. If we're at end game (or even close to it) this could be a very, very costly mistake.

I'm more content to leave my vote as is and IF we're wrong on Lathum, then Danny takes out dubb, meaning we net one wolf between the two of them.

I suggested Tyrith on day two, obviously not now. I think he meant Telle who I did suggest today as I think she is a wolf either way.

PurdueBrad · 06-01-2009, 12:09 PM

Danny, I agree, Telle is quite possibly a wolf but I think the ONLY way we solve this is to lynch Lathum and then if he turns up good, you nightkill dubb.

At least that way we 100% guaranteed get a wolf. IF Lathum turns up wolf, you can nightkill the person that we 'believe' today although I think we're still waiting for three people to man (or woman) up.

Lathum · 06-01-2009, 12:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PurdueBrad

I'm more content to leave my vote as is and IF we're wrong on Lathum, then Danny takes out dubb, meaning we net one wolf between the two of them.

When you are wrong on me we lose the game.

PurdueBrad · 06-01-2009, 12:10 PM

For what it is worth Danny, I'm actually believing that Hoops is likely a villager.

hoopsguy · 06-01-2009, 12:10 PM

Danny, the wolves are going to have a ton of freedom to manipulate the vote no matter which way we go if it is 6-5. Even if it is 7-4 they still have a lot of room to move around, but we at least have some margin for error.

The above plan gives them a smidge more freedom but I think it is almost splitting hairs when talking about 6-5 versus 5-5 if we have a villager/wolf showdown.

And, with the plan above we learn more from the lynch than any other scenario I can concoct.

But I'll defer to the cleared masses. I accept that anything I propose is going to be viewed with (best case) skepticism to (worst case) outright disdain, but I really am trying to win a game here even if it may not look like it based on results.

Danny · 06-01-2009, 12:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PurdueBrad

Danny, I agree, Telle is quite possibly a wolf but I think the ONLY way we solve this is to lynch Lathum and then if he turns up good, you nightkill dubb.

At least that way we 100% guaranteed get a wolf. IF Lathum turns up wolf, you can nightkill the person that we 'believe' today although I think we're still waiting for three people to man (or woman) up.

This doesn't really work because if Dubb is lying we are at end game and lynching Lathum does cost us the game.

PurdueBrad · 06-01-2009, 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lathum

When you are wrong on me we lose the game.

So you think we're 6-5, meaning we started this game 13-4 and with a cultist (so really, for the most part 12-5), I really don't think so. Even if we're wrong, I don't think one lynch makes end game but putting off the dubb/Lathum debate till tomorrow does not work IMHO. So yeah, I think it is going to come down to you or dubb today and, at least my way of

lynch Lathum
Danny can nightkill dubb if we're wrong

works because if we do it in reverse, we can't nightkill you and I'm not wasting the believe on you when I plan on nailing down a different possible wolf with it.

Danny · 06-01-2009, 12:13 PM

Hoops, who do you think the wolves are then. You've been adamant Racer and Dubb are both not wolves and you know you're not a wolf, who could it be then as that would only leave Dubb, Telle, USFL and Schmidty

Danny · 06-01-2009, 12:14 PM

Telle sure is quiet, I think she has to be a wolf, if we lynch Lathum I want her to be the believed target.

Danny · 06-01-2009, 12:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dubb93

When I had actually noticed Racer made the switch it was too late for me to change my vote.

Like I said, the play Racer made was to tie it up and "test" if I was the duke. At that point in time everyone thought the tie break was my vote instead of just me. I don't think a wolf would make that play. It seemed much more likely that the wolf would make the play Hoops did, basically going out of his way to make sure I couldn't prove I was the duke as that would confirm my seer scans.

It was too late to change your vote, but not too late to send a PM to Barkeep?

Lathum · 06-01-2009, 12:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PurdueBrad

So you think we're 6-5, meaning we started this game 13-4 and with a cultist (so really, for the most part 12-5), I really don't think so. Even if we're wrong, I don't think one lynch makes end game but putting off the dubb/Lathum debate till tomorrow does not work IMHO. So yeah, I think it is going to come down to you or dubb today and, at least my way of

lynch Lathum
Danny can nightkill dubb if we're wrong

works because if we do it in reverse, we can't nightkill you and I'm not wasting the believe on you when I plan on nailing down a different possible wolf with it.

And that is why I am saying Lynch Racer and night kill Dubb.

hoopsguy · 06-01-2009, 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danny

Hoops, who do you think the wolves are then. You've been adamant Racer and Dubb are both not wolves and you know you're not a wolf, who could it be then as that would only leave Dubb, Telle, USFL and Schmidty

Pure gut tells me that Dubb is a wolf. I just do not buy his moving versions of the Duke. But I don't think we are getting that lynch today. If we are at end-game with him as a wolf then I'm pretty sure we lose.

So I'm hoping that we are not at endgame or that Dubb is telling the truth. In that case, the wolves would have to be Lathum, Telle, Schmidty, USFL, and Racer. If there are only four wolves then that would allow one of those names to fall off the list.

I've maintained that Dubb/Racer were almost certainly on opposite teams because Racer put Dubb in jeopardy (blowing his duke story) at the end of Day 3. No way in hell they are wolves together. I also thought wolf Racer would want to push villager Dubb on the off chance that he might find himself getting out of a tie. Why not, if you are going down, right? I suppose villager/villager between those two is possible but it just seems remote given how few people there are to fill the "wolf musical chairs". So the assumption that they were on separate teams made sense.

What doesn't jive with that, and what I've been struggling with, is Lathum coming out (after being fingered as a wolf) and targeting Racer. There are really on two explanations for it if Dubb is good:
1.) Racer really is a villager, something that wolf Lathum would know
2.) Racer is a wolf along with Lathum, and Lathum is hoping to buy him some trust later by creating separation between them now.

Anyway, I've wrapped my head around this game quite a bit over the past couple of days ... well, when I wasn't enjoying a really awesome Chicago weekend. And I've come to the conclusion that I really don't have any idea how we win this game. That said, we may as well try to create the best possible scenarios that we have a chance to execute. We probably need to be both lucky and good down the stretch to win given the margin right now. The only thing we have going for us is that our original roles remain intact despite the growing body count for "vanilla V.I.L.L.A.G.E.R.".

hoopsguy · 06-01-2009, 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danny

Telle sure is quiet, I think she has to be a wolf, if we lynch Lathum I want her to be the believed target.

Me too

Danny · 06-01-2009, 12:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Me too

I still don't understand your vote switch. At that point we had to believe Dubb was going to break the tie for Racer and you switched to him which would have covered Dubb's changing story.

dubb93 · 06-01-2009, 12:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danny

It was too late to change your vote, but not too late to send a PM to Barkeep?

Yea, normally the tie can't be broken until the lynch vote is in. It would be kinda silly to break the tie before it is official.

Schmidty · 06-01-2009, 12:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danny

Hoops, who do you think the wolves are then. You've been adamant Racer and Dubb are both not wolves and you know you're not a wolf, who could it be then as that would only leave Dubb, Telle, USFL and Schmidty

Why is my name being bandied about? I don't see what I've done that's wrong or suspicious. I guess the wolves need to throw someone out.

Schmidty · 06-01-2009, 12:38 PM

Anyway, I'm in and out, but I'll follow along as much as I can today.

hoopsguy · 06-01-2009, 12:38 PM

Because at that point I didn't think Lerriuqs was a wolf (which, for the record, was correct).

I had left my vote on Lerri earlier because I would potentially have needed to protect myself for self-defense by having the vote on either Lerri or Racer. If Racer was in the lead and someone tied me up with Racer then I could not save myself by moving my vote to the other leader. Up to this point, I think that thought process is identical for a villager who believes they need to stay alive or a wolf.

NTN put his vote on Lerri, making the margin 5-4 Racer vs Lerri. Racer had his vote elsewhere and was looking at moving it to Lerri to create the tie. At that point, I saw late movement onto a candidate that I was on and towards a guy that wasn't around at the deadline. That strongly suggest a late attempt by the wolves to work their way out of the lynch.

I had been suspicious of Dubb getting as much trust up to that point. I'll pull posts if you need me to support this. I was not then, or now, convinced that he was a villager and I saw an opportunity to clear myself with a late switch from what I thought was a villager to what I thought was a wolf.

This is not something that I would have done as a wolf. I would have sat tight, since I was on a villager in a tie (still do not know what side Racer was on). But I made what I would consider a very aggressive play that I thought would be helpful for the village.

Was there risk? Sure, I could have completely read the situation wrong and Lerri could have been a wolf. But that was risk I was willing to take. What I did not count on was being a second late, having it stay a tie, having the Dubb/duke thing go haywire, and everything else that has unfolded since then.

hoopsguy · 06-01-2009, 12:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Schmidty

Why is my name being bandied about? I don't see what I've done that's wrong or suspicious. I guess the wolves need to throw someone out.

Because you are alive at this stage in the game.

What else have you given us in the thread to work with to help prove your innocence or dispute your guilt?

We haven't found a wolf yet, we have a medium/large (depending on how good it is) COT, and you are one of the people not in it. I actually think you are getting less discussion as a wolf than just about anyone who has not been cleared ... well, maybe a tie with USFL in that regard.

Schmidty · 06-01-2009, 12:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Because you are alive at this stage in the game.

What else have you given us in the thread to work with to help prove your innocence or dispute your guilt?

We haven't found a wolf yet, we have a medium/large (depending on how good it is) COT, and you are one of the people not in it. I actually think you are getting less discussion as a wolf than just about anyone who has not been cleared ... well, maybe a tie with USFL in that regard.

I see how a few people might be cleared, but I don't get how others aren't, including you. I know I haven't said much, but I don't really have anything to say. I'm observing like normal. To be quite honest, this game's rules have me not trusting anyone more than any other game I've ever played.

hoopsguy · 06-01-2009, 12:56 PM

Schmidty, I'm about as far from cleared as you get without being a declared wolf. So me being suspicious of you, or at least lumping you in groups of potential wolves, is probably helping garner you trust with some of the others.

Lathum · 06-01-2009, 01:01 PM

Schmidty, just vote Racer. Trust me.

Schmidty · 06-01-2009, 01:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Schmidty, I'm about as far from cleared as you get without being a declared wolf. So me being suspicious of you, or at least lumping you in groups of potential wolves, is probably helping garner you trust with some of the others.

I get that, and I suppose I understand people calling me out. I just know what I am, so I am a bit touchy about it. That is so lame, but I don't know what else to say. I'd add analysis, but I'd just be pulling stuff out of my ass. "Trust" was establish at the beginning of the game, arbitrarily, and that makes me skittish. I hate assuming that the reality of this game is what it is. Wolves could have created the whole start, and we are just lambs to the slaughter.

Meh, I don't what else to say.

Danny · 06-01-2009, 01:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lathum

Schmidty, just vote Racer. Trust me.

Still stuck on voting Racer? That makes no sense.

Lathum · 06-01-2009, 01:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danny

Still stuck on voting Racer? That makes no sense.

YOU MAKE NO SENSE!!!

Telle · 06-01-2009, 01:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danny

Telle sure is quiet, I think she has to be a wolf, if we lynch Lathum I want her to be the believed target.

Not going to happen. I'm not going to offer myself up to be night killed so that you can lose the game for us by killing a villager.

And why am I drawing more heat than the other UTR players? Danny, you seem so SURE that I'm a wolf.. only way for you to really know one way or the other is by either being a seer or a wolf yourself. And if you hadn't already been cleared, I'd be doubting your allegiance right about now.

But that reminds me.. did dubb ever actually scan PurdueBrad?

PurdueBrad · 06-01-2009, 01:09 PM

Lathum, give this idea thought for a moment. Let's say you are good but you are the fake seer and Racer ends up good, what have we accomplished. IMHO, you should at least be voting on dubb.

Lathum · 06-01-2009, 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PurdueBrad

Lathum, give this idea thought for a moment. Let's say you are good but you are the fake seer and Racer ends up good, what have we accomplished. IMHO, you should at least be voting on dubb.

I have said it before, I have no reason to doubt my scan.

Danny · 06-01-2009, 01:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lathum

I have said it before, I have no reason to doubt my scan.

So you believe PurdueBrad is the false seer?

Danny · 06-01-2009, 01:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Telle

Not going to happen. I'm not going to offer myself up to be night killed so that you can lose the game for us by killing a villager.

And why am I drawing more heat than the other UTR players? Danny, you seem so SURE that I'm a wolf.. only way for you to really know one way or the other is by either being a seer or a wolf yourself. And if you hadn't already been cleared, I'd be doubting your allegiance right about now.

But that reminds me.. did dubb ever actually scan PurdueBrad?

So at this point you trust Dubb more than PurdueBrad?

Racer · 06-01-2009, 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PurdueBrad

So you think we're 6-5, meaning we started this game 13-4 and with a cultist (so really, for the most part 12-5), I really don't think so. Even if we're wrong, I don't think one lynch makes end game but putting off the dubb/Lathum debate till tomorrow does not work IMHO. So yeah, I think it is going to come down to you or dubb today and, at least my way of

lynch Lathum
Danny can nightkill dubb if we're wrong

works because if we do it in reverse, we can't nightkill you and I'm not wasting the believe on you when I plan on nailing down a different possible wolf with it.

Considering you are the only person I fully trust (since Lathum is either the fake seer or a wolf), I'm going to go which ever way you go with your vote (as long as it's on Lathum, Dubb, or Hoopsguy).

Racer · 06-01-2009, 01:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Telle

Not going to happen. I'm not going to offer myself up to be night killed so that you can lose the game for us by killing a villager.

And why am I drawing more heat than the other UTR players? Danny, you seem so SURE that I'm a wolf.. only way for you to really know one way or the other is by either being a seer or a wolf yourself. And if you hadn't already been cleared, I'd be doubting your allegiance right about now.

But that reminds me.. did dubb ever actually scan PurdueBrad?

Yeah I agree it's a bit ridiculous that you are drawing a lot more heat then Schmidty, USFL, and Saldana (who chose to kill ntndeacon over guys like Hoops, Lathum, and dubb).

I'm most suspicious of Schmidty (based on how he voted the 1st two days), but I don't trust any of you four at this point.

Schmidty · 06-01-2009, 01:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Racer

Considering you are the only person I fully trust (since Lathum is either the fake seer or a wolf), I'm going to go which ever way you go with your vote (as long as it's on Lathum, Dubb, or Hoopsguy).

Just curious, since I haven't followed much over the weekend, and haven't done much than scan past pages today, why are you so sure Lathum is either a fake seer or wolf?

Telle · 06-01-2009, 01:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danny

So at this point you trust Dubb more than PurdueBrad?

I'm honestly not sure. It just seems like everyone is 100% trusting PB and his scans, which could be dangerous. At least dubb is already being questioned.

It could be that PB is a wolf and knew that there was no false seer in the game. So he claims seer knowing that there's only one other seer out there who then won't contest the claim since there can be a false seer. I don't know if it's the most likely scenario, but I think trusting him completely without question might not be the best way to go. I would feel better if he had been scanned. Still wouldn't be 100% since it could be they're both wolves.. but that's even less likely.

Danny · 06-01-2009, 01:24 PM

Well, Saldana could only be bad if Dubb is bad, so that is why he is not drawing as much heat. My read on Schmidty, and USFL is not be wolfish right now, but Telle I got the wolfish feeling all game. As Hoopsguy said, there was a good chance she either had a role or was a wolf and at this point I don't think she has a role.

Schmidty · 06-01-2009, 01:24 PM

Dola.

Disregard my last post. I know why. Duh.

Schmidty · 06-01-2009, 01:25 PM

This game seems really random. Why trust anyone?

Racer · 06-01-2009, 01:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Schmidty

Just curious, since I haven't followed much over the weekend, and haven't done much than scan past pages today, why are you so sure Lathum is either a fake seer or wolf?

His "scan" of me "turned" up a wolf.

Danny · 06-01-2009, 01:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Telle

I'm honestly not sure. It just seems like everyone is 100% trusting PB and his scans, which could be dangerous. At least dubb is already being questioned.

It could be that PB is a wolf and knew that there was no false seer in the game. So he claims seer knowing that there's only one other seer out there who then won't contest the claim since there can be a false seer. I don't know if it's the most likely scenario, but I think trusting him completely without question might not be the best way to go. I would feel better if he had been scanned. Still wouldn't be 100% since it could be they're both wolves.. but that's even less likely.

If PB bad the game is over, we have to believe he is good at this point. I also strongly feel he is good.

Danny · 06-01-2009, 01:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Schmidty

This game seems really random. Why trust anyone?

You have to make some leaps, for me that is believing PB, I also strongly believed Dubb early on which I have my reasons for that I will explain after the game. At this point though, that reason does not hold as much weight, so I am not as sure now.

Telle · 06-01-2009, 01:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danny

Well, Saldana could only be bad if Dubb is bad, so that is why he is not drawing as much heat. My read on Schmidty, and USFL is not be wolfish right now, but Telle I got the wolfish feeling all game. As Hoopsguy said, there was a good chance she either had a role or was a wolf and at this point I don't think she has a role.

Show me one thing I have said or done that's wolfish all game. The only complaint on me is that I've been quiet. So what? I'm quiet sometimes.. especially when I don't have a lot to say (imagine that). And while I haven't checked the post counts, I doubt I've been the most quiet one here. So basically all you're going on is your "intuition". Which is a fine way to lose a game of WW.

Danny · 06-01-2009, 01:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Telle

Show me one thing I have said or done that's wolfish all game. The only complaint on me is that I've been quiet. So what? I'm quiet sometimes.. especially when I don't have a lot to say (imagine that). And while I haven't checked the post counts, I doubt I've been the most quiet one here. So basically all you're going on is your "intuition". Which is a fine way to lose a game of WW.

As opposed to what right now? Voting record? All we have at this point minus the scans if intuition. If there is something more concrete to go off of, I would be happy to, but there is nothing there right now.

Danny · 06-01-2009, 01:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Telle

Show me one thing I have said or done that's wolfish all game. The only complaint on me is that I've been quiet. So what? I'm quiet sometimes.. especially when I don't have a lot to say (imagine that). And while I haven't checked the post counts, I doubt I've been the most quiet one here. So basically all you're going on is your "intuition". Which is a fine way to lose a game of WW.

You've played very cautiously, Hoops (not that he is on the good side) had the same read that I did. I may be wrong, but like I said until we find a wolf and have some record to go on, we have to go on gut. Trust me, I don't like playing off of gut.

Racer · 06-01-2009, 01:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PurdueBrad

So you think we're 6-5, meaning we started this game 13-4 and with a cultist (so really, for the most part 12-5), I really don't think so. Even if we're wrong, I don't think one lynch makes end game but putting off the dubb/Lathum debate till tomorrow does not work IMHO. So yeah, I think it is going to come down to you or dubb today and, at least my way of

lynch Lathum
Danny can nightkill dubb if we're wrong

works because if we do it in reverse, we can't nightkill you and I'm not wasting the believe on you when I plan on nailing down a different possible wolf with it.

Alright, getting ready to leave for awhile. I feel it's important for villagers not to split their votes at this point. Since I 100% trust PB,

Unvote Dubb
Vote Lathum

Also, now that I think about it, voting for Lathum makes the most sense. If Lathum turns up as the fake seer/villager, then Dubb can be night killed by Danny (who has been cleared by PB) tonight. If I were PB, I would strongly consider scanning Dubb even if Lathum turns up a wolf though.

Schmidty · 06-01-2009, 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danny

As opposed to what right now? Voting record? All we have at this point minus the scans if intuition. If there is something more concrete to go off of, I would be happy to, but there is nothing there right now.

And that is why this game has annoyed me so far. There is nothing to go on, yet most people are acting like this is a normal game where analysis means something. This game is just a needle in a haystack situation.

PurdueBrad · 06-01-2009, 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Racer

Considering you are the only person I fully trust (since Lathum is either the fake seer or a wolf), I'm going to go which ever way you go with your vote (as long as it's on Lathum, Dubb, or Hoopsguy).

Racer, I appreciate it. I will not be voting Hoops unless something drastic happens and I won't likely vote dubb.

My thoughts on the play are as such: IF we're wrong about Lathum, Danny nightkills dubb, and tomorrow we vote out Racer. That nets us two wolves, which makes this a game again. I think we probably follow that with a lynch of Saldana (sorry if you're good, but we may need the info if I don't get a scan on you), likely netting us a third wolf.

IF we're right about Lathum, I think we've got a pretty good run of cleared players that we then go fish in a barrel against the remaining four/five. I would consider, at that point, dubb, Saldana, PB, Danny, and Tyrith cleared. I would give Hoops a pass for now and take aim at the rest: Telle, Schmidty, USFL, and Racer.

Sorry Racer, Lathum's play leaves us in a tough spot with you whether or not he is a wolf.

PurdueBrad · 06-01-2009, 01:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Racer

If I were PB, I would strongly consider scanning Dubb even if Lathum turns up a wolf though.

Definitely on my short list.

Danny · 06-01-2009, 01:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Schmidty

And that is why this game has annoyed me so far. There is nothing to go on, yet most people are acting like this is a normal game where analysis means something. This game is just a needle in a haystack situation.

I had some information no one else did to work with at the start, It may have ended up leading me down the wrong path though. I agree for the most part, but we're trying to make the best decision possible here.

Danny · 06-01-2009, 01:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PurdueBrad

IF we're wrong about Lathum, Danny nightkills dubb, and tomorrow we vote out Racer. That nets us two wolves, which makes this a game again. I think we probably follow that with a lynch of Saldana (sorry if you're good, but we may need the info if I don't get a scan on you), likely netting us a third wolf.

I know I've said it, but if we're wrong about Lathum, we will almost certainly lose today.

PurdueBrad · 06-01-2009, 01:40 PM

Danny, I must have missed it, what info did you have or are you not able to or is it not smart to share?

06-01-2009, 12:38 PM	#1467
Schmidty Coordinator Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Early, TX	Anyway, I'm in and out, but I'll follow along as much as I can today. __________________ Just beat the devil out of it!!! - Bob Ross

06-01-2009, 01:24 PM	#1486
Schmidty Coordinator Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Early, TX	Dola. Disregard my last post. I know why. Duh. __________________ Just beat the devil out of it!!! - Bob Ross

06-01-2009, 01:25 PM	#1487
Schmidty Coordinator Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Early, TX	This game seems really random. Why trust anyone? __________________ Just beat the devil out of it!!! - Bob Ross

06-01-2009, 12:10 PM	#1455
hoopsguy General Manager Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Chicago	Danny, the wolves are going to have a ton of freedom to manipulate the vote no matter which way we go if it is 6-5. Even if it is 7-4 they still have a lot of room to move around, but we at least have some margin for error. The above plan gives them a smidge more freedom but I think it is almost splitting hairs when talking about 6-5 versus 5-5 if we have a villager/wolf showdown. And, with the plan above we learn more from the lynch than any other scenario I can concoct. But I'll defer to the cleared masses. I accept that anything I propose is going to be viewed with (best case) skepticism to (worst case) outright disdain, but I really am trying to win a game here even if it may not look like it based on results.

06-01-2009, 12:13 PM	#1458
Danny Head Coach Join Date: Jul 2001	Hoops, who do you think the wolves are then. You've been adamant Racer and Dubb are both not wolves and you know you're not a wolf, who could it be then as that would only leave Dubb, Telle, USFL and Schmidty

06-01-2009, 12:14 PM	#1459
Danny Head Coach Join Date: Jul 2001	Telle sure is quiet, I think she has to be a wolf, if we lynch Lathum I want her to be the believed target.

06-01-2009, 12:38 PM	#1468
hoopsguy General Manager Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Chicago	Because at that point I didn't think Lerriuqs was a wolf (which, for the record, was correct). I had left my vote on Lerri earlier because I would potentially have needed to protect myself for self-defense by having the vote on either Lerri or Racer. If Racer was in the lead and someone tied me up with Racer then I could not save myself by moving my vote to the other leader. Up to this point, I think that thought process is identical for a villager who believes they need to stay alive or a wolf. NTN put his vote on Lerri, making the margin 5-4 Racer vs Lerri. Racer had his vote elsewhere and was looking at moving it to Lerri to create the tie. At that point, I saw late movement onto a candidate that I was on and towards a guy that wasn't around at the deadline. That strongly suggest a late attempt by the wolves to work their way out of the lynch. I had been suspicious of Dubb getting as much trust up to that point. I'll pull posts if you need me to support this. I was not then, or now, convinced that he was a villager and I saw an opportunity to clear myself with a late switch from what I thought was a villager to what I thought was a wolf. This is not something that I would have done as a wolf. I would have sat tight, since I was on a villager in a tie (still do not know what side Racer was on). But I made what I would consider a very aggressive play that I thought would be helpful for the village. Was there risk? Sure, I could have completely read the situation wrong and Lerri could have been a wolf. But that was risk I was willing to take. What I did not count on was being a second late, having it stay a tie, having the Dubb/duke thing go haywire, and everything else that has unfolded since then.

06-01-2009, 12:56 PM	#1471
hoopsguy General Manager Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Chicago	Schmidty, I'm about as far from cleared as you get without being a declared wolf. So me being suspicious of you, or at least lumping you in groups of potential wolves, is probably helping garner you trust with some of the others.

06-01-2009, 01:01 PM	#1472
Lathum Favored Bitch #1 Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: homeless in NJ	Schmidty, just vote Racer. Trust me.

06-01-2009, 01:24 PM	#1485
Danny Head Coach Join Date: Jul 2001	Well, Saldana could only be bad if Dubb is bad, so that is why he is not drawing as much heat. My read on Schmidty, and USFL is not be wolfish right now, but Telle I got the wolfish feeling all game. As Hoopsguy said, there was a good chance she either had a role or was a wolf and at this point I don't think she has a role.

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