Hello again ol' friend: Simcity 5 introduced

[SackAttack]

Originally Posted by Blackadar

3. The monetization of SC and the eventual total cost. I bet bigger cities are going to happen - but they'll cost you $20. Want a subway? $15.

Saw this coming when SC3K dropped a bunch of stuff from SC2K and then stuck it back in for SimCity 3000 Unlimited. I completely expected something similar here, and I am Jack's complete lack of surprise at discovering that subways have been removed, for example.

Originally Posted by Blackadar

"And because there's no save games, I can't go back in time to try a different route. There's no freedom to experiment."

And if the above and the always-on DRM hadn't been enough to kill my interest, that did the job nicely.

Kotaku's got an article that touches on another issue: griefers. If you have neighbors and those neighbors bulldoze everything to start over, it can torch an entire region. Yeah, you can get around that, but doing so requires playing the game either with people you already know or managing multiple cities "solo."

[Abe Sargent]

Originally Posted by CleBrownsfan

Anyone getting this tomorrow?? I'm suckered in by the name alone... Amazon still has their $20 promotion up for the "pre-order" of SimCity.

After the debacle of SC: Societies and the lackluster Spore, which had the potential to best the best video game of all time, I'm not even tempted anymore.

[Blackadar]

Originally Posted by SackAttack

Saw this coming when SC3K dropped a bunch of stuff from SC2K and then stuck it back in for SimCity 3000 Unlimited. I completely expected something similar here, and I am Jack's complete lack of surprise at discovering that subways have been removed, for example.

Yep.

I'd place any amount of money that EA is going to come out with a few different road packs... education building packs... transportation options... shipping... map size... tile sets... and just about anything else you can possibly think of. Knowing EA and how stuff is priced in The Sims, this stuff won't be cheap. But unlike The Sims, these aren't cosmetic changes (except for the tile sets) - these impact the core game play. They're not necessary (the game itself isn't necessary), but once released not playing with these types of packs will make many people feel as if they're playing only half the game.

It'd be like playing SC4 without Rush Hour. But at least that was just a one-time expansion and the mod community is robust. This is going to be long term milking of the customer base. For anyone who is interested in SimCity, I'd recommend they approach this like a subscription MMO. You have the $60 front-end, but you better budget $15/mo for the other stuff you're going to really want to have.

Originally Posted by SackAttack

And if the above and the always-on DRM hadn't been enough to kill my interest, that did the job nicely.

Yep, that bums me out. I've done many a demo job that wasn't saved when the results weren't what I projected. Can't do that here.

Originally Posted by SackAttack

Kotaku's got an article that touches on another issue: griefers. If you have neighbors and those neighbors bulldoze everything to start over, it can torch an entire region. Yeah, you can get around that, but doing so requires playing the game either with people you already know or managing multiple cities "solo."

This one I'm not as concerned about because you can play a region just by yourself. But if you play with anyone else be prepared for the downward spiral due to changes by your neighbor, even if they aren't griefing. A meteor that blows their power structure apart could send your city into the pits. The problem is that with such limited space on the maps, there's a very real possibility that even with enough money you couldn't fix the problem without destroying wholesale parts of your city because you don't have the space to put the buildings down that could fix the issue!

[Bad-example]

Someone made a lot of very bad decisions throughout the creation of this game. It's a crying shame. They leave me no choice but to pass.

[Blackadar]

Originally Posted by Bad-example

Someone made a lot of very bad decisions throughout the creation of this game. It's a crying shame. They leave me no choice but to pass.

I actually think the game will be pretty good and quite a bit of fun. I did enjoy much of my beta test. But given the number of games that I'm currently playing, the entry cost ($60), the projected ongoing costs, the drawbacks of the game itself (including small cities) and the always-on DRM, they've managed to talk me out of what should be a No Questions Asked Day One Purchase for me.

Given that I purchased SimCity, SC2K (Day 1), SC3K (Day 1), SC4 (Day 1), SC Societies, Cities XL 2011 and Cities XL 2012, that's saying something...and it ain't good.

[Sweed]

Originally Posted by Blackadar

I actually think the game will be pretty good and quite a bit of fun. I did enjoy much of my beta test. But given the number of games that I'm currently playing, the entry cost ($60), the projected ongoing costs, the drawbacks of the game itself (including small cities) and the always-on DRM, they've managed to talk me out of what should be a No Questions Asked Day One Purchase for me.

Given that I purchased SimCity, SC2K (Day 1), SC3K (Day 1), SC4 (Day 1), SC Societies, Cities XL 2011 and Cities XL 2012, that's saying something...and it ain't good.

Hope its ok to ask here but I would be like to know your opinion of the SC franchise, specifically SC4 Deluxe, to Cities XL? Last Steam sale I almost pulled the trigger on SC4 Deluxe but then saw Cities XL also on sale. Pretty sure I'll go with one of the other next time around. Thanks.

[CleBrownsfan]

To me this sounds intriguing with some friends/FOFCers grouping together in different "regions" rather than thinking of it as your own city...


Ok, I've been playing with a friend and we've been communicating the needs and wants of both of our cities. The city sizes are way too small to be a jack of all trades. Every city MUST specialize to support one another. I built a city that had a mix of industrial, commercial and residential. This city ended up being 70% residential and 30% commercial. I demolished every industrial zone and moved the power plant, waste disposal and water plant to another city just for industrial stuff. These things are way too big and take up a chunk of space that its not easy to build up your residential population. I found the beta was much easier somehow.

Example below

My industrial support city had only about 700 residents but it was really building up as the residents from the other two cities came over. My buddy built a university and my Sims went to school there. From there, they went to work in my Nuclear Power plant and this plant provided power for the 3 cities. I built a waste disposal in the industrial city with a bunch of garbage trucks for the sole purpose of collecting garbage from the other cities. My and my buddy then demolished the garbage dumps in our two cities while delegating the garbage collection to the industrial city.

My city broke 100k+ residents after doing the above. It may be small but when I tried to be a jack of all trades, my city was hovering at 28K with a lot of residents complaining of germs due to the industry air pollution. That was when I decided to move the industrial zone away and rezoned.

There is definitely some strategy here and you will need to make use of the data tables as well. It's a pretty deep simulation and I feel that the small city sizes only detract from the experience as I needed to jump back and forth between the cities.

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by CleBrownsfan

To me this sounds intriguing with some friends/FOFCers grouping together in different "regions" rather than thinking of it as your own city...

I enjoyed the beta the one time I got to play in it. I ended up buying this pre-order from amazon.. with my travel schedule though, not sure how much I'll be around to play it though for a while. (Travel next two weeks and at least one week in April if not two). I'd be up for joining a FOFC region though if someone put one together.

[stevew]

I don't really get into these kind of games normally, but I might get it if the consensus is that the game is good and you can build a group region of non-griefers. I'll be following and interested in impressions.

[sabotai]

So let me get this straight. They are making a modern city building game, and it doesn't include subways?

*groan*

[saldana]

yeah...those reviews basically convinced me not to buy it...i was seriously on the way to the store tomorrow but seems like at least a "wait til they patch it" kind of thing at this point.

[Mota]

It's funny that a full day before the game comes out, 2 web sites release reviews that are 90% and 95% and no one else does. I bet that tomorrow the average rating is going to drop substantially and that this was a deliberate attempt to skew things.

I did buy the game already so I'm locked in. I'm half excited and half scared.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by Mota

It's funny that a full day before the game comes out, 2 web sites release reviews that are 90% and 95% and no one else does. I bet that tomorrow the average rating is going to drop substantially and that this was a deliberate attempt to skew things.

I did buy the game already so I'm locked in. I'm half excited and half scared.

Rock, Paper, Shotgun has been very positive about it thus far (even though he admitted that he wanted to dislike it). I played the beta and enjoyed it; although I haven't played a sim city game since 2000.

I had some issues with it, but not enough to detract from my overall enjoyment of the game. I'm looking forward to playing it tonight.

[Sporkimata]

I am really hemming and hawing on buying this. Part of me really wants a new game to play around with. See if I can stay strong and see how launch goes tonight.

[Blackadar]

Originally Posted by Sweed

Hope its ok to ask here but I would be like to know your opinion of the SC franchise, specifically SC4 Deluxe, to Cities XL? Last Steam sale I almost pulled the trigger on SC4 Deluxe but then saw Cities XL also on sale. Pretty sure I'll go with one of the other next time around. Thanks.

Pros and cons to each game, but give the nod to SC4.

SimCity 4 is a very deep simulator of city life. There's a ton going on behind the scenes and you can watch your city grow organically. There's a huge ton of mods out there for it (Simtropolis), some of which are pretty much necessary (NAM mod) for the game to function properly. It's also 8 years old and can look it, doesn't perform all that well and you're limited to grid road systems.

Cities XL is more of a pure city building sandbox in that you set up the city the way you want and watch what happens. It doesn't grow organically in the way SC4 does. If you set up a low density residential section, that's all it will ever be. You "unlock" higher zone densities and buildings with population growth. It's a bit....soulless. Kind of like "put this here, put that there, done" and move on. It also has a nasty memory leak that requires the reloading of any substantial city size after about an hour of gameplay. It's not a *bad* game and I have more than a few hours into it, but it never grabbed me the way SC4 did. It's far prettier than SC4, though.

If you want something deep, then SC4 is your game (there's a reason why it has a 350 page guide with it). If you want something to make pretty cities with less effort, than Cities XL is the way to go.

[Blackadar]

Originally Posted by Atocep

Rock, Paper, Shotgun has been very positive about it thus far (even though he admitted that he wanted to dislike it). I played the beta and enjoyed it; although I haven't played a sim city game since 2000.

I had some issues with it, but not enough to detract from my overall enjoyment of the game. I'm looking forward to playing it tonight.

I love RPS, but let's face it...he's positive about most games. I'm not saying he's wrong here - I've said SC is a pretty decent game - but there are too many warts.

Seriously, what kind of city simulator launches without something as basic as a subway system? EA is going to milk the shit out of this game.

[Buccaneer]

I was right on the border of thinking I will likely not even bother with this when I read all of the references to The Sims (and their role in SC) and became will definitely not buy this at all. That and believing single-players games should have nothing to do with having an internet connection (except for initial downloads).

[Blackadar]

Oh, and if anyone wonders how small the cities are? This is it folks, this is the entire city. About 6x8 blocks.

[Swaggs]

Doesn't look like there are many single family homes in that screen shot, but 188K seems like a pretty good sized population to fit into a city.

I'd think it will become more of a problem if pollution has as much of a negative effect as in past versions.

[Abe Sargent]

That IS a small city

[Thomkal]

TotalBiscuit takes a very long look at the game (nearly an hour and a half) on YouTube.

â–º WTF Is... - SimCity ? (feat. Genna Bain) - YouTube

[Buccaneer]

So they believe all urban planning must fit in a rigid grid system? How pathetic and lame.

[Mota]

I think we're trying to fit the new game into the old box.

You're not supposed to create Toronto with the new game. You're probably supposed to create North York, Scarborough, Etobicoke, etc as different cities and tie them all together. That seems to be the vision from what I've read at least. Once we overcome that mental hurdle, it may be easier for us to embrace the new game.

[Neon_Chaos]

At the game store right now. They already have 3 dlc packs out for sale. British, German, and French city packs for roughly $8 each. Not surprised at all.

[SackAttack]

Originally Posted by Mota

I think we're trying to fit the new game into the old box.

You're not supposed to create Toronto with the new game. You're probably supposed to create North York, Scarborough, Etobicoke, etc as different cities and tie them all together. That seems to be the vision from what I've read at least. Once we overcome that mental hurdle, it may be easier for us to embrace the new game.

watching TB's vid for a bit, the region size seems to be equivalent to that of the old city map. SimBorough.

[NorvTurnerOverdrive]

great posts by Blackadar


one of my favorite quotes is, 'every manufacturer secretly wants to be a service provider' you see it everywhere but particularly in gaming. there are no final sales anymore

[HarryLime]

wow.. this looks more like an engine to drive DLC and micro transactions than any kind of enjoyable game.

EA. Its not in the game......

[Neon_Chaos]

Me, having first-hand experience in the D3 debacle... you'd think they would have learned from other's mistakes...

As expected...

North American SimCity Launch Disaster | Gamer Horizon

[Draft Dodger]

Originally Posted by Mota

I think we're trying to fit the new game into the old box.

You're not supposed to create Toronto with the new game. You're probably supposed to create North York, Scarborough, Etobicoke, etc as different cities and tie them all together. That seems to be the vision from what I've read at least. Once we overcome that mental hurdle, it may be easier for us to embrace the new game.

but I want to create Toronto

[Critch]

If you're itching for a city building game and SimCity 5 isn't cutting it, Cities XL Platinum isn't bad. It's still a bit clunky in places, and the trading model can be annoying and feels unbalanced, but its still worth looking at if you can get it cheap.

Over the last 10 days I've wasted a serious amount of time building up my little chunk of the map. im up to 13 towns and cities, ranging from 30k farming towns up to my 1.1 million population capital city. When you get to a certain point, the cash starts flowing in so any challenge disappears, but still fun.

[CleBrownsfan]

I have SImCity d/ling as I type this on my laptop. Don't know if I'll be able to get in once the game updates - I guess time will tell.

It looks like you'll have to invite friends to a region using their Origin name. I can start sending out invites today if you want to give me your Origin name. Mine is Broth32....

[kcchief19]

Just amazing. It's been at least a decade since I've seen a game design so completely out of touch with its customer base, much less a beloved franchise.

I'm sure it will sell like hotcakes the first few months because of the brand name, the fact many people don't frequent review sites and message boards, and people will assume it can't be that bad. But this sounds like a game bound to be dead in a year.

[spleen1015]

We've seen how successful the Sims has been following this sort of model. There are a lot of mindless drones out there. It will probably be a huge game.

The only thing keeping me away is the idea that I have to have an internet connection. With that BS, there will be maintenance and downtime.

I guess it is the wave of the future.

[Blackadar]

From what I'm hearing, there are queues and many people who should be able to play are now being told their software won't activate until the 7th. The first "alpha" for SimCity (less than 2 months ago) was an absolute horror and I've neve seen any company fix those kind of online issues in time for the real launch, so I'm not surprised to hear that things aren't going well.

Total Biscuit tears it up on the launch problems:

PSA: SimCitys launch - YouTube

For those who don't want to watch the video, he's stuck in a queue and can't play and none too happy about it. He comments about some people who are locked out, cancel their orders, repurchase and are instantly unlocked. Another potential issue - if your server is full and you want to play another, your cities don't transfer.

His advice "hold off very much on buying this game"

I have mixed feelings about this. I predicted these issues on other message boards and was dismissed by the fanboys. I like being right. At the same time, I really want this game to be good. I want to be wrong. This is probably my favorite genre of gaming because it appeals to my creative side. But damn it was easy to see this coming.

[Coffee Warlord]

Another potential issue - if your server is full and you want to play another, your cities don't transfer.

The fact that this is even a statement for a Sim City game is reason enough to stay the fuck away.

[Sporkimata]

I am really saddened by all this. By all rights this is a game I should want to throw my money at. Instead I will wait and throw my money at Fast Break Pro Basketball me thinks.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Coffee Warlord

The fact that this is even a statement for a Sim City game is reason enough to stay the fuck away.

Seriously - whoever thought this was a good model for a Sim City game ought to be shot.

This smells to me like "Sim City for Sims 3 fans" - like a dumbed-down relaunch for tweenagers.

[CleBrownsfan]

I'm d/l, updated and in the game. I set up a private region with 16 cities. The region name is simply called FOFC. I was just able to set my city name - I named it CleBrownsFan to make it simple

Again, if any of you want an invite to the region friend me and I'll invite.

[Blackadar]

Originally Posted by CleBrownsfan

I'm d/l, updated and in the game. I set up a private region with 16 cities. The region name is simply called FOFC. I was just able to set my city name - I named it CleBrownsFan to make it simple

Again, if any of you want an invite to the region friend me and I'll invite.

Let us know what you think, CleBrownie!

Someone I know had their entire region reset last night after two hours - two cities entirely wiped clean and reset to blank zones. Ouch.

[Neon_Chaos]

CleBrownie, shoot me an invite.

Origin id: neonchaos123

[SirFozzie]

Thank you Amazon, for "inadvertently" cancelling my order. I was dreading installing it today, and then saw that it had been cancelled. With the money I saved for this, I'm going to instead buy Franchise Hockey Manager and wait to see if SimCity improves

[RendeR]

Reading this thread about the game that was my first computer game addiction just makes me want to cry.

Does the original simcity work on todays PC's?

[Blackadar]

Originally Posted by RendeR

Reading this thread about the game that was my first computer game addiction just makes me want to cry.

Does the original simcity work on todays PC's?

I dunno, but GOG has SimCity 2000 for $6.

[mckerney]

Originally Posted by Blackadar

I dunno, but GOG has SimCity 2000 for $6.

If there's a dos version you'll be able to get it running through dosbox, though 2000 is probably the better option for a classic sim city.

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by CleBrownsfan

I'm d/l, updated and in the game. I set up a private region with 16 cities. The region name is simply called FOFC. I was just able to set my city name - I named it CleBrownsFan to make it simple

Again, if any of you want an invite to the region friend me and I'll invite.

Which server? I assume East?

[mckerney]

Originally Posted by Blackadar

From what I'm hearing, there are queues and many people who should be able to play are now being told their software won't activate until the 7th. The first "alpha" for SimCity (less than 2 months ago) was an absolute horror and I've neve seen any company fix those kind of online issues in time for the real launch, so I'm not surprised to hear that things aren't going well.

Total Biscuit tears it up on the launch problems:

PSA: SimCitys launch - YouTube

For those who don't want to watch the video, he's stuck in a queue and can't play and none too happy about it. He comments about some people who are locked out, cancel their orders, repurchase and are instantly unlocked. Another potential issue - if your server is full and you want to play another, your cities don't transfer.

His advice "hold off very much on buying this game"

I have mixed feelings about this. I predicted these issues on other message boards and was dismissed by the fanboys. I like being right. At the same time, I really want this game to be good. I want to be wrong. This is probably my favorite genre of gaming because it appeals to my creative side. But damn it was easy to see this coming.

For the people who can't play until the 7th I'm guessing that is probably people in Europe. Pretty shitty, but that is on retailers rather than EA in this case. Happens with pretty much every release and will continue to until there are more people purchasing digital copies.

[Blackadar]

Originally Posted by mckerney

For the people who can't play until the 7th I'm guessing that is probably people in Europe. Pretty shitty, but that is on retailers rather than EA in this case. Happens with pretty much every release and will continue to until there are more people purchasing digital copies.

You'd think, but that's not correct. Those reports are all over the SimCity forums from places like Chicago, Denver, etc.

[CleBrownsfan]

Originally Posted by Blackadar

Let us know what you think, CleBrownie!

Someone I know had their entire region reset last night after two hours - two cities entirely wiped clean and reset to blank zones. Ouch.

Will do - I messed with it a little @ lunch. Went back on to make sure it synced (saved) and it did.

I have a couple of you as friends in Origin launcher but it's not showing up in game. Not sure if it's a bug or it may take some time to convert friends in game. Hopefully this will get fixed soon so I can start adding you guys in the region I set up..

[mckerney]

Originally Posted by Blackadar

You'd think, but that's not correct. Those reports are all over the SimCity forums from places like Chicago, Denver, etc.

Hmm, odd. Wonder if they ordered keys from a third party site and wound up getting keys intended for Europe.

[Draft Dodger]

Originally Posted by spleen1015

We've seen how successful the Sims has been following this sort of model. There are a lot of mindless drones out there. It will probably be a huge game.

The only thing keeping me away is the idea that I have to have an internet connection. With that BS, there will be maintenance and downtime.

I guess it is the wave of the future.

I don't have a problem with the Sims model at all. The base game is plenty playable and the expansions generally actually add lots of stuff for the buck.

this sounds more like they are stripping out key features to sell you later, or overcharging you for stupid shit.