GroupThink - 1993 offseason - Page 3

primelord · 03-11-2003, 01:00 PM

What are we going to do with our RB's next season? I don't think we can keep both Crawford and The Ox. Should we consider trading one of them this season? I am guessing if we still have The Ox on the roster we don't have to offer Crawford a deal.

Of course if we trade Crawford or The Ox we don't have any depth then either.

Bee · 03-11-2003, 01:05 PM

I think Crawford is more popular than the Ox so I think we still have to make him an offer (unless the popularity changes during the season and the Ox passes him).

My guess is we will trade the Ox next season and pick up a backup in the draft (I don't think we'll be able to trade Crawford because of his fan popularity being greater than the Ox). I think Wade really likes the Ox and didn't want to trade him this season unless it was necessary.

Anrhydeddu · 03-11-2003, 01:22 PM

Quote:

Sign DT Wolfe for 4yrs, $72.5m ($14m this year)

How did you come up with this? I thought he was asking for $93.6/5yrs?

Bee · 03-11-2003, 01:28 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Anrhydeddu
How did you come up with this? I thought he was asking for $93.6/5yrs?

I think that was at the beginning of free agency and his demands have come down since then (although no other teams have offered him that kinda money

).

QuikSand · 03-11-2003, 03:14 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Anrhydeddu
How did you come up with this? I thought he was asking for $93.6/5yrs?

Under our rules, we have two options:

-offer him exactly what he seeks; or

-offer him a deal with a bonus at least as big as the highest year salary

My shortened offer to Wolfe (which was very tough to work out) was of the latter persuasion.

QuikSand · 03-11-2003, 03:21 PM

Practically speaking, if we were going to re-sign Wolfe, I think the only reasonable way to do it would be as follows:

-Cut MLB Lonnie Bell to save $9m
-Trade/cut either CB Armstrong or RB Oksenberg to save more money
-Re-sign OLB Gerald John to start at SLB
-Move LB Wilkerson to MLB (a bigger hit than moving to SLB)

That would leave us in fair shape to fill in the rest of the roster with scrubs. We'd be weakened significantly in the secondary (assuming it's Armstrong we released), but would have a torrential group up front on defense.

Short of cutting one of those big two salaries, I don't see any other way to afford Wolfe.

Anrhydeddu · 03-11-2003, 03:22 PM

If it's not too much trouble, can you itemized by year what his exact demands were and then the details of the latter persuasion? Thanks.

QuikSand · 03-11-2003, 03:24 PM

And thus, DT Kent Wolfe presents us with one of these crossroad issues.

Were I playing this game myself, there's no way in hell I'd sign DT Kent Wolfe like this. His demands are totaly unreasonable, and it woudl kill me for a long time - I'll be able to find somebody else with that money... no-brainer.

However, were I actually running a real football team, a season is a much, much longer time - and of much more consequence. Going without a player who was a key to a recent title would be very tough to do- in all seriousness, I think I'd be saying "do whatever it takes" to get him back. A year or two is a pretty long time in real life... unlike in this sim (even as we move fairly slowly through).

So, which way are we going to go?

QuikSand · 03-11-2003, 03:28 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Anrhydeddu
If it's not too much trouble, can you itemized by year what his exact demands were and then the details of the latter persuasion? Thanks.

Actually, I cannot - I put it together in the game, but for obvious reasons did not save it. I'm pretty certain that the bonus amount was $18m, as was the final year's salary. So it probably read something like this:

$9.5
$12
$15
$18
+$18 bonus
=$72.5 million

Actually, in retrospect, I think that might be accurate.

Here is what he is asking for at this point:

$9.5
$11.87
$14.82
$17.76
$20.91
+$18.82 bonus
=$93.68 million

primelord · 03-11-2003, 03:33 PM

Well my vote is to sign him. Despite our success on defense last year I still believe the DLine is the key to our success. Personally I would lean towards trading The Ox. I think Crawford has been productive for us and if we are going to trade The Ox after the season anyway why not do it now when it allows us to sign Wolfe?

Of course I am very biased in this decision. I think we can get by without Armstrong too. It's also likely we may be able to get a little better deal for Armstrong in a trade since CB's tend to be valued higher in FOF. But I think either way we should try and sign Wolfe.

Bee · 03-11-2003, 03:53 PM

Trading the Ox to sign Wolfe seems like robbing Peter to pay Paul to me. I think it goes back to what QS was saying about approaching this like a normal game or approaching it like real life. In a normal game, I'd have traded the Ox a while ago because of his salary. IRL, I can't imagine a team trading one of the best RBs in football still in his prime to free up cap space to sign their DT.

I'm more inclined to let Wolfe go. I'd rather keep him, but with those salary demands I could see a real NFL team with a tight salary cap not being able to keep him either. Thinking back now, maybe we should have franchised him?

primelord · 03-11-2003, 04:01 PM

Franchising him would have only made about 1 million dollars difference in this season.

Bee,

I agree with what you are saying to a point, but only one of our RB's can be on the field at any given time where as both our star DT's are on the field at the same time. Thats why I was thinking it makes more sense to have your money in Wolfe instead of Oksenberg.

I'll say this I think we will probably be fine without Wolfe. We can play Castillo in running situations and Hammond on passing downs. I agree with Quik in that had we thought we might do this we could have maybe taken a CB early and it would have been easier to trade Armstrong.

Have we looked into renegotiating Bridgemans deal? Will that save us any money? I am still in favor of signing Wolfe even if we don;t trade The Ox by trading Armstrong. I think Godfrey is a major downgrade from Armstrong, but still capable of starting in our system. However if either him or Boyd go down we are in serious trouble in the secondary. Still if we can get through the season with Godfrey, assuming we got a 1st round pick for Armstrong, I think we can find a stud to replace Armstrong in next years draft.

QuikSand · 03-11-2003, 04:32 PM

So, primelord, as DC - I'm inclined to make this your call. The plan as laid out above makes sense to you?

-Cut MLB Lonnie Bell to save $9m
-Trade/cut CB Armstrong to save more money
-Re-sign OLB Gerald John to start at SLB
-Move LB Wilkerson to MLB (a bigger hit than moving to SLB)

With CB Armstrong, we'd ask for a first rounder from whoever is atop the "interested" list, and if we don't get it, we just cut him. That's the rule, correct?

Bee · 03-11-2003, 04:42 PM

Bridgeman wants $25million over 3 years. Renegotiating with him will increase his cap hit by around $2 million this year.

You're right about the franchising of Wolfe, wouldn't have made sense.

Trading Armstrong would be a major blow to our secondary IMO. I don't see anyone who can take his place. We look a lot more solid at DT than at CB.

If we trade the Ox, we should probably consider resigning Keith Baker as a backup to Crawford. That would give us some insurance there. But I don't think we'd have the cap room to make that happen without even more trades.

My opinion is we should resign Gerald John at SLB and let Wolfe go, but I'm not the defensive coach so I think primelord and QS should make the call.

Edit: I really need to type faster.

Bee · 03-11-2003, 04:48 PM

I really like URFA RB Jack McAfee. He could prove to be a nice pickup.

Bee · 03-11-2003, 04:50 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by QuikSand
So, primelord, as DC - I'm inclined to make this your call. The plan as laid out above makes sense to you?

-Cut MLB Lonnie Bell to save $9m
-Trade/cut CB Armstrong to save more money
-Re-sign OLB Gerald John to start at SLB
-Move LB Wilkerson to MLB (a bigger hit than moving to SLB)

With CB Armstrong, we'd ask for a first rounder from whoever is atop the "interested" list, and if we don't get it, we just cut him. That's the rule, correct?

Can we cut Bell?
He's our only fan favorite at MLB.

QuikSand · 03-11-2003, 06:24 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bee
Can we cut Bell?
He's our only fan favorite at MLB.

Good catch, Bee... I keep forgetting to look at the popularity ratings. That seems to slam the door shut, to me - if we cannot cut MLB Bell, then our hands are practically tied here. The only way we could go after Kent Wolfe would be to trade/cut both Oksenberg and Armstrong, gutting two significant portions of the team. I have to think that's going too far, just so we can overpay this one guy.

QuikSand · 03-11-2003, 06:25 PM

This "resign popular players" rule is a bitch, eh?

Doug5984 · 03-11-2003, 06:30 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by QuikSand
This "resign popular players" rule is a bitch, eh?

yup- I am just waiting to see how much money Crawford is going to be asking for after next season....also I think it would just be to hard to sign Wolfe, he is a very good player...and it would be nice to have him, but i just can't see us cutting a bunch of players for only one.

QuikSand · 03-11-2003, 06:44 PM

Okay... I have not saved teh game yet, but I have filled the roster up to 59 players, re-signing two of our really cheap RFAs and filling in the rest with URFAs. At this point, we have $2,200,000 in cap room... not quite enough to re-sign LB Gerald John. With a little finessing, we could re-sign someone like QB John Barker (who could then be traded next year, I suspect) or perhaps DE Gabe Blow.

Any thoughts? Are we close enough for me to go ahead, make these moves, and move onward?

wade moore · 03-11-2003, 06:45 PM

Boy, I missed some active conversation.. I'll say my opinion on what we should do, but first..

WOW.. this is EXACTLY what we wanted, isn't it? If you go back and read this dialogue from today, it is just so extremely what I was going for... we have a DC who really wants his guy, butting heads with a GM who has a different vision along with an offensive representative chiming in to save the star RB.. Those personalities combined with our house rules have made it so it has taken an entire day to discuss ONE guy, and we still haven't decided to sign him or not to sign him... not to sound all cheesy, but I got this great rush reading through that.. I think this Group Think has far surpassed the last one (no offense to those involved) in my enjoyment factor (of course, i just ran the files last time)...

Anyway... Yes, I would really like to keep the Ox. As well as Crawford performed, I think you all know by now that ypc is very important to me as it seems to be the best indicator of how much damage they are going to do.. Crawford didn't even outperform Baker in YPC (3.7 vs. 4.0) and is a mere shadow of The Ox (3.7 vs 4.6). That is almost an entire yard more per carry. The Ox had 277 carries last year. Over the same carries, Crawford would have had (theoretically) 1,025 yards instead of 1,290 as The Ox did. That may not seem like much, but it adds up. In addition, if we trade The Ox, Crawford has diddly behind him, atleast in the way of a proven backup. The decision that will have to be made (probably to trade the ox) will be a quite painful one for me (seems like on the lines of letting Wolfe go for Prime

) and if I can avoid it, I will do what I can -- but it does not seem likely. If we are going for a championship, I think that The Ox is just so much more crucial of a part of the puzzle. Over his career, you can see that the games where The Ox wasn't there, the team wasn't there for the most part. If he has to be traded, I will take my licks, but to me he is a far superior back to Crawford which is the pivotal position in this offense. Without a dominant back, we don't have an offense. In all honesty, I'm hoping among hopes that The Ox becomes idolized.

Just a note, The Ox is a classy veteran.. not that it matters that much

Anyway.. I've said my piece... as stated in the past, I'd rather get rid of Pritchett than the Ox, but he doesn't seem to be expensive enough to help us in that area..

wade moore · 03-11-2003, 06:47 PM

I definatley like the idea of signing Barker, but it seems to be merely a move to use for trade bait (not necessarily a bad thing)... Blow would seem like the smarter move with the DLine injuries last year, but with that luck QB would be plagued with injuries this year

Bee · 03-11-2003, 06:55 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by QuikSand
Okay... I have not saved teh game yet, but I have filled the roster up to 59 players, re-signing two of our really cheap RFAs and filling in the rest with URFAs. At this point, we have $2,200,000 in cap room... not quite enough to re-sign LB Gerald John. With a little finessing, we could re-sign someone like QB John Barker (who could then be traded next year, I suspect) or perhaps DE Gabe Blow.

Any thoughts? Are we close enough for me to go ahead, make these moves, and move onward?

We'll need to do something about a starting SLB if we don't resign John. Any suggestions?

cthomer5000 · 03-11-2003, 07:03 PM

I don't chime in too often, so I'm not sure what my opinion is worth. (Also it seems irrelevant at this point)

I just don't see how it would make sense to sacrifice depth at RB (trading the Ox) and DB (cutting Armstrong) to keep 1 guy who will give us cap headaches for years to come.

Simply put I don't think it's worth hurting 2 units to strengthen 1. Also, I think last year's performance showed the D-Line might not be as important as we think.

QuikSand · 03-11-2003, 07:03 PM

I think the default would be to slide Wilkerson to the strong side, and let our other two WLBs battle it out fo the weak side job.

Bee · 03-11-2003, 07:18 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by QuikSand
I think the default would be to slide Wilkerson to the strong side, and let our other two WLBs battle it out fo the weak side job.

Ok. Not very attractive, but looks like the only option we really have. I don't see anywhere we could cut to get Johns back.

Bee · 03-11-2003, 07:19 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by cthomer5000
I don't chime in too often, so I'm not sure what my opinion is worth. (Also it seems irrelevant at this point)

I just don't see how it would make sense to sacrifice depth at RB (trading the Ox) and DB (cutting Armstrong) to keep 1 guy who will give us cap headaches for years to come.

Simply put I don't think it's worth hurting 2 units to strengthen 1. Also, I think last year's performance showed the D-Line might not be as important as we think.

That was my feelings too. I really liked Wolfe though and will miss him. He was quite a steal in the draft for us.

wade moore · 03-11-2003, 07:23 PM

BTW.. anyone else notice how much Cunningham and Kramer have really filled in their red bars? Just a side note that I noticed while looking through the roster..Same with McAlister and Blaine..

Bee · 03-11-2003, 07:27 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by wade moore
BTW.. anyone else notice how much Cunningham and Kramer have really filled in their red bars? Just a side note that I noticed while looking through the roster..Same with McAlister and Blaine..

Yep playing time really makes a big difference. I think that was a big factor for DT Wolfe too. When you can get them on the field early in their careers they really grow fast, but the negative is they want big bucks as soon as their contracts are up.

wade moore · 03-11-2003, 07:30 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bee
Yep playing time really makes a big difference. I think that was a big factor for DT Wolfe too. When you can get them on the field early in their careers they really grow fast, but the negative is they want big bucks as soon as their contracts are up.

This makes me very torn about Coghill.. I don't want him to miss his opportunity to grow, but I just can't see not starting Pritchett..

While we have activity.. is there anyone that thinks Cog should start over the old man?

Bee · 03-11-2003, 07:32 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by wade moore
Boy, I missed some active conversation.. I'll say my opinion on what we should do, but first..

WOW.. this is EXACTLY what we wanted, isn't it? If you go back and read this dialogue from today, it is just so extremely what I was going for... we have a DC who really wants his guy, butting heads with a GM who has a different vision along with an offensive representative chiming in to save the star RB.. Those personalities combined with our house rules have made it so it has taken an entire day to discuss ONE guy, and we still haven't decided to sign him or not to sign him... not to sound all cheesy, but I got this great rush reading through that.. I think this Group Think has far surpassed the last one (no offense to those involved) in my enjoyment factor (of course, i just ran the files last time)...

It's definitely a lot of fun. I wasn't involved in the last one, but it's fun having different people looking out for their own interests while trying to build the entire team. It would be nice if a few of the other coaches would get more involved, but I know it can be difficult because of work and everything.

I think next offseason may even be more interesting with 4 "fan favorites" out of contract and a few other starters as well that will be finishing up their contracts.

Bee · 03-11-2003, 07:35 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by wade moore
This makes me very torn about Coghill.. I don't want him to miss his opportunity to grow, but I just can't see not starting Pritchett..

While we have activity.. is there anyone that thinks Cog should start over the old man?

I would start Pritchett because he gives us the best chance to win this season IMO. After this season, we're going to have quite a few issues to deal with. This might be our last chance for a couple seasons to make a big push for the Championship. I look for Pritchett to retire after this season and Coghill can take over what's left of our team then.

wade moore · 03-11-2003, 07:36 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bee
It's definitely a lot of fun. I wasn't involved in the last one, but it's fun having different people looking out for their own interests while trying to build the entire team. It would be nice if a few of the other coaches would get more involved, but I know it can be difficult because of work and everything.

I think next offseason may even be more interesting with 4 "fan favorites" out of contract and a few other starters as well that will be finishing up their contracts.

I agree on the other coaches.. I wonder, again, if we need to solicit for other participants? Or perhaps it is just too feverish of a pace? We had a lot of interested parties at first, but admittedly many of them were not people who have been around awhile and probably just didn't have the dedication to go at our speed..

now that something is established and working, maybe some other vets would be interested in entering the mix?

Bee · 03-11-2003, 07:49 PM

I think anyone who wants to join in is more than welcome. Even if someone doesn't have the time to dedicate to the dynasty as a "full-time" participant, they can still jump in and make comments, ask questions or make suggestions.

QuikSand · 03-11-2003, 07:58 PM

Maybe it woudl be a good time for someone with web space to post a single file that people could use to get completely up to date... that might be the easiest way to get some people involved. (A file including everything in your universe folder except box scores and such)

primelord · 03-11-2003, 07:59 PM

Allright I have shed my tear over having to give up Wolfe and I am ready to move on without him.

Lets hope he doesn't sign with someone in our division.

Quik,

I am comfortable with you moving on from where we are at. We can slide Wilkerson over to SLB and then go into training camp. I don't know if it matters or not but maybe we should make sure we move him before trainign camp just in case a full training camp at the new position helps him gain some of the red bars back.

I will echo everyone elses thoughts that it was fun discussing our options. I don't think Bell gives us much over Peabody so had we gone forward with the plan I don't think we were really weakining two areas to strengthen one. I think we would have weakend the secondary to strengthen the line. The argument can be made though that Castillo/Hammond are a better replacement for Wolfe than Godfrey is for Armstrong. So I am happy with the defense and think we are going to have a good season.

Do we want to try and resign Bridgeman now? I know his cap number would raise with what he is asking for, but since his signing bonus is higher than any of the years salaries he is asking for I think our house rules give us some room to play with that number.

primelord · 03-11-2003, 08:00 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by QuikSand
Maybe it woudl be a good time for someone with web space to post a single file that people could use to get completely up to date... that might be the easiest way to get some people involved. (A file including everything in your universe folder except box scores and such)

I will try and get that together this evening.

Bee · 03-11-2003, 08:05 PM

Good question about Bridgeman.

I would guess it would be better to wait until his contract was up and offer him what he wanted in free agency. Considering his age, his request might drop slightly with another year of experience added in. Also, he might retire. No sense paying him extra money for that.

QuikSand · 03-11-2003, 08:10 PM

Okay, I ahve gone ahead, filled in the roster, and gone through a vanilla trainng camp. I had to cut our punter in order to re-sign our third-string QB... who is a pretty solid player himself. I anticipate a potential trade next season.

Anyway - here's the first file update...

QuikSand · 03-11-2003, 08:12 PM

Second file

QuikSand · 03-11-2003, 08:15 PM

First thing I notice about the rookie class: DT Howard Hammond is already improving. I'm telling you - he'll be good.

Uhhhh... second thing. Check out WR Perea. Yowza!

LB Clay Harden... uh, he's going to be pretty good, too. He's already better than he started out - he probably ought to start this year, he's going to get better in a hurry.

Nobody else blows me away, but this might not have been a half-bad draft after all, considering... (perhaps a testament to the "insider drafting" technique?)

primelord · 03-11-2003, 08:18 PM

Quik,

Or don't move Wilkerson before you run the training camp. Thats cool too.

Bee · 03-11-2003, 08:20 PM

To whomever is running the preseason.

Can we split time between Marshall Cunningham and Emmanual Johnston at RT? They both look about the same quality and I'd like to see if one or the other stands out on the field.

Thanks!

primelord · 03-11-2003, 08:20 PM

Yes it looks like you made a good call on Hammond. He kind of has that Kent Wolfe look to him. Harden does look very good too. Nice job boss.

QuikSand · 03-11-2003, 08:21 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by primelord
Quik,

Or don't move Wilkerson before you run the training camp. Thats cool too.

Rats! I was sure I had done so already...

Alas. Probaby doesn't matter too much. Mea culpa. Does Clay Harden make up for it?

primelord · 03-11-2003, 08:23 PM

On a side note Kent Wolfe signed a 1 year deal with Pensecola (of course a team in our division.) So we will get to face Mr. Wolfe twice this season. Who knows since he will probably be a free agent again after the season maybe we can find a way to bring him back to that time.

Oh also he had yet another bump up in ratings. I miss him already

primelord · 03-11-2003, 08:31 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by QuikSand
Rats! I was sure I had done so already...

Alas. Probaby doesn't matter too much. Mea culpa. Does Clay Harden make up for it?

He does.

Like you said looking at the guys we got now it doesn't look like a bad draft at all. Especially when you consider we didn't have a first round pick. Perea looks like a star. That was an excellent pick.

cthomer5000 · 03-11-2003, 09:32 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by QuikSand
Maybe it woudl be a good time for someone with web space to post a single file that people could use to get completely up to date... that might be the easiest way to get some people involved. (A file including everything in your universe folder except box scores and such)

this would be very helpful. I missed some files at some point and I don't currenlty have a functiong game file

wade moore · 03-12-2003, 03:46 AM

Ok prime, here are my preseason settings... If you run the games, after the second game, swap the RT and C starter and backup...

I did not make any cuts, but I believe most of our excess is on defense.. if we need to cut, we can cut Escobedo and whatever lineman Bee would recommend

... I'm figuring either Van DeWedge or Shephard...

I'd rather we wait before running the regular season until I can take a look at what happened...

wade moore · 03-12-2003, 03:49 AM

File 1..

03-11-2003, 01:00 PM	#101
primelord Pro Rookie Join Date: Oct 2000	What are we going to do with our RB's next season? I don't think we can keep both Crawford and The Ox. Should we consider trading one of them this season? I am guessing if we still have The Ox on the roster we don't have to offer Crawford a deal. Of course if we trade Crawford or The Ox we don't have any depth then either. __________________ .

03-11-2003, 03:33 PM	#110
primelord Pro Rookie Join Date: Oct 2000	Well my vote is to sign him. Despite our success on defense last year I still believe the DLine is the key to our success. Personally I would lean towards trading The Ox. I think Crawford has been productive for us and if we are going to trade The Ox after the season anyway why not do it now when it allows us to sign Wolfe? Of course I am very biased in this decision. I think we can get by without Armstrong too. It's also likely we may be able to get a little better deal for Armstrong in a trade since CB's tend to be valued higher in FOF. But I think either way we should try and sign Wolfe. __________________ .

03-11-2003, 04:01 PM	#112
primelord Pro Rookie Join Date: Oct 2000	Franchising him would have only made about 1 million dollars difference in this season. Bee, I agree with what you are saying to a point, but only one of our RB's can be on the field at any given time where as both our star DT's are on the field at the same time. Thats why I was thinking it makes more sense to have your money in Wolfe instead of Oksenberg. I'll say this I think we will probably be fine without Wolfe. We can play Castillo in running situations and Hammond on passing downs. I agree with Quik in that had we thought we might do this we could have maybe taken a CB early and it would have been easier to trade Armstrong. Have we looked into renegotiating Bridgemans deal? Will that save us any money? I am still in favor of signing Wolfe even if we don;t trade The Ox by trading Armstrong. I think Godfrey is a major downgrade from Armstrong, but still capable of starting in our system. However if either him or Boyd go down we are in serious trouble in the secondary. Still if we can get through the season with Godfrey, assuming we got a 1st round pick for Armstrong, I think we can find a stud to replace Armstrong in next years draft. __________________ .

03-11-2003, 04:42 PM	#114
Bee Pro Starter Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Fairfax, VA	Bridgeman wants $25million over 3 years. Renegotiating with him will increase his cap hit by around $2 million this year. You're right about the franchising of Wolfe, wouldn't have made sense. Trading Armstrong would be a major blow to our secondary IMO. I don't see anyone who can take his place. We look a lot more solid at DT than at CB. If we trade the Ox, we should probably consider resigning Keith Baker as a backup to Crawford. That would give us some insurance there. But I don't think we'd have the cap room to make that happen without even more trades. My opinion is we should resign Gerald John at SLB and let Wolfe go, but I'm not the defensive coach so I think primelord and QS should make the call. Edit: I really need to type faster. Last edited by Bee : 03-11-2003 at 04:43 PM.

03-11-2003, 07:59 PM	#136
primelord Pro Rookie Join Date: Oct 2000	Allright I have shed my tear over having to give up Wolfe and I am ready to move on without him. Lets hope he doesn't sign with someone in our division. Quik, I am comfortable with you moving on from where we are at. We can slide Wilkerson over to SLB and then go into training camp. I don't know if it matters or not but maybe we should make sure we move him before trainign camp just in case a full training camp at the new position helps him gain some of the red bars back. I will echo everyone elses thoughts that it was fun discussing our options. I don't think Bell gives us much over Peabody so had we gone forward with the plan I don't think we were really weakining two areas to strengthen one. I think we would have weakend the secondary to strengthen the line. The argument can be made though that Castillo/Hammond are a better replacement for Wolfe than Godfrey is for Armstrong. So I am happy with the defense and think we are going to have a good season. Do we want to try and resign Bridgeman now? I know his cap number would raise with what he is asking for, but since his signing bonus is higher than any of the years salaries he is asking for I think our house rules give us some room to play with that number. __________________ .

03-11-2003, 01:05 PM	#102
Bee Pro Starter Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Fairfax, VA	I think Crawford is more popular than the Ox so I think we still have to make him an offer (unless the popularity changes during the season and the Ox passes him). My guess is we will trade the Ox next season and pick up a backup in the draft (I don't think we'll be able to trade Crawford because of his fan popularity being greater than the Ox). I think Wade really likes the Ox and didn't want to trade him this season unless it was necessary.

03-11-2003, 03:21 PM	#106
QuikSand lolzcat Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Annapolis, Md	Practically speaking, if we were going to re-sign Wolfe, I think the only reasonable way to do it would be as follows: -Cut MLB Lonnie Bell to save $9m -Trade/cut either CB Armstrong or RB Oksenberg to save more money -Re-sign OLB Gerald John to start at SLB -Move LB Wilkerson to MLB (a bigger hit than moving to SLB) That would leave us in fair shape to fill in the rest of the roster with scrubs. We'd be weakened significantly in the secondary (assuming it's Armstrong we released), but would have a torrential group up front on defense. Short of cutting one of those big two salaries, I don't see any other way to afford Wolfe.

03-11-2003, 03:22 PM	#107
Anrhydeddu Resident Curmudgeon Join Date: Oct 2002	If it's not too much trouble, can you itemized by year what his exact demands were and then the details of the latter persuasion? Thanks.

03-11-2003, 03:24 PM	#108
QuikSand lolzcat Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Annapolis, Md	And thus, DT Kent Wolfe presents us with one of these crossroad issues. Were I playing this game myself, there's no way in hell I'd sign DT Kent Wolfe like this. His demands are totaly unreasonable, and it woudl kill me for a long time - I'll be able to find somebody else with that money... no-brainer. However, were I actually running a real football team, a season is a much, much longer time - and of much more consequence. Going without a player who was a key to a recent title would be very tough to do- in all seriousness, I think I'd be saying "do whatever it takes" to get him back. A year or two is a pretty long time in real life... unlike in this sim (even as we move fairly slowly through). So, which way are we going to go?

03-11-2003, 03:53 PM	#111
Bee Pro Starter Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Fairfax, VA	Trading the Ox to sign Wolfe seems like robbing Peter to pay Paul to me. I think it goes back to what QS was saying about approaching this like a normal game or approaching it like real life. In a normal game, I'd have traded the Ox a while ago because of his salary. IRL, I can't imagine a team trading one of the best RBs in football still in his prime to free up cap space to sign their DT. I'm more inclined to let Wolfe go. I'd rather keep him, but with those salary demands I could see a real NFL team with a tight salary cap not being able to keep him either. Thinking back now, maybe we should have franchised him?

03-11-2003, 04:32 PM	#113
QuikSand lolzcat Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Annapolis, Md	So, primelord, as DC - I'm inclined to make this your call. The plan as laid out above makes sense to you? -Cut MLB Lonnie Bell to save $9m -Trade/cut CB Armstrong to save more money -Re-sign OLB Gerald John to start at SLB -Move LB Wilkerson to MLB (a bigger hit than moving to SLB) With CB Armstrong, we'd ask for a first rounder from whoever is atop the "interested" list, and if we don't get it, we just cut him. That's the rule, correct?

03-11-2003, 04:48 PM	#115
Bee Pro Starter Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Fairfax, VA	I really like URFA RB Jack McAfee. He could prove to be a nice pickup.

03-11-2003, 06:25 PM	#118
QuikSand lolzcat Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Annapolis, Md	This "resign popular players" rule is a bitch, eh?

03-11-2003, 06:44 PM	#120
QuikSand lolzcat Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Annapolis, Md	Okay... I have not saved teh game yet, but I have filled the roster up to 59 players, re-signing two of our really cheap RFAs and filling in the rest with URFAs. At this point, we have $2,200,000 in cap room... not quite enough to re-sign LB Gerald John. With a little finessing, we could re-sign someone like QB John Barker (who could then be traded next year, I suspect) or perhaps DE Gabe Blow. Any thoughts? Are we close enough for me to go ahead, make these moves, and move onward?

03-11-2003, 07:03 PM	#125
QuikSand lolzcat Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Annapolis, Md	I think the default would be to slide Wilkerson to the strong side, and let our other two WLBs battle it out fo the weak side job.

03-11-2003, 07:49 PM	#134
Bee Pro Starter Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Fairfax, VA	I think anyone who wants to join in is more than welcome. Even if someone doesn't have the time to dedicate to the dynasty as a "full-time" participant, they can still jump in and make comments, ask questions or make suggestions.

03-11-2003, 07:58 PM	#135
QuikSand lolzcat Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Annapolis, Md	Maybe it woudl be a good time for someone with web space to post a single file that people could use to get completely up to date... that might be the easiest way to get some people involved. (A file including everything in your universe folder except box scores and such)

03-11-2003, 08:05 PM	#138
Bee Pro Starter Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Fairfax, VA	Good question about Bridgeman. I would guess it would be better to wait until his contract was up and offer him what he wanted in free agency. Considering his age, his request might drop slightly with another year of experience added in. Also, he might retire. No sense paying him extra money for that.

03-11-2003, 08:10 PM	#139
QuikSand lolzcat Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Annapolis, Md	Okay, I ahve gone ahead, filled in the roster, and gone through a vanilla trainng camp. I had to cut our punter in order to re-sign our third-string QB... who is a pretty solid player himself. I anticipate a potential trade next season. Anyway - here's the first file update...

03-11-2003, 08:12 PM	#140
QuikSand lolzcat Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Annapolis, Md	Second file

03-11-2003, 08:15 PM	#141
QuikSand lolzcat Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Annapolis, Md	First thing I notice about the rookie class: DT Howard Hammond is already improving. I'm telling you - he'll be good. Uhhhh... second thing. Check out WR Perea. Yowza! LB Clay Harden... uh, he's going to be pretty good, too. He's already better than he started out - he probably ought to start this year, he's going to get better in a hurry. Nobody else blows me away, but this might not have been a half-bad draft after all, considering... (perhaps a testament to the "insider drafting" technique?) Last edited by QuikSand : 03-11-2003 at 08:16 PM.

03-11-2003, 08:18 PM	#142
primelord Pro Rookie Join Date: Oct 2000	Quik, Or don't move Wilkerson before you run the training camp. Thats cool too. __________________ .

03-11-2003, 08:20 PM	#143
Bee Pro Starter Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Fairfax, VA	To whomever is running the preseason. Can we split time between Marshall Cunningham and Emmanual Johnston at RT? They both look about the same quality and I'd like to see if one or the other stands out on the field. Thanks!

03-11-2003, 08:20 PM	#144
primelord Pro Rookie Join Date: Oct 2000	Yes it looks like you made a good call on Hammond. He kind of has that Kent Wolfe look to him. Harden does look very good too. Nice job boss. __________________ .

03-11-2003, 08:23 PM	#146
primelord Pro Rookie Join Date: Oct 2000	On a side note Kent Wolfe signed a 1 year deal with Pensecola (of course a team in our division.) So we will get to face Mr. Wolfe twice this season. Who knows since he will probably be a free agent again after the season maybe we can find a way to bring him back to that time. Oh also he had yet another bump up in ratings. I miss him already __________________ .

03-12-2003, 03:49 AM	#150
wade moore lolzcat Join Date: May 2001 Location: williamsburg, va	File 1..

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