the note I put on people's mailboxes today

[Passacaglia]

Originally Posted by Fidatelo

Actually it's worse: my understanding is he's the real-estate agent, so he's looking to make larger comissions. Classy.

I knew he was a real estate agent -- I don't have a problem with that alone, as increasing his commissions also increases the amounts the sellers get. Of course, if people aren't selling their houses, and want to, you know, live in them, then they're probably not going to care.

[Lathum]

I think he should set the example and offer to mow all his neighbors lawns

[Ben E Lou]

Originally Posted by Toddzilla

My first impression - geez, what a douchebag. If you got something to say to me about my house/lawn, then be a man and tell me face to face.

Bingo. I would read such a letter as roughly 75% "pussy," 25% "douchebag."

[Bee]

Originally Posted by SkyDog

Bingo. I would read such a letter as roughly 75% "pussy," 25% "douchebag."

So I can put you down for less than 6 5-year olds to kick Flasch's ass?

[Toddzilla]

Wait...what?

He doesn't actually *live* there, he's just a real-estate agent?

[Flasch186]

my commissions are fixed, I work for a builder, I cannot buy or sell any resale home in the neighborhood so I make nothing financially from the bulk of the homes in the community. Im not selling my home and plan on keeping it forever even if I move from it (if it's possible financially) as i feel it would be a good home to retire too someday. I live in the neighborhood (the one im talking about) I sell in so you could say I will sell more if it's a nicer looking neighborhood but I also live here too so I'm not sure why you would weigh one above the other.

---actually, if the neighborhood went to crap and the builder had to lower prices to sell we'd actually sell more homes since, for Jacksonville, we're a neighborhood that seems to be above the sweet spot price-wise (<$250K). I'm actually hurting myself financially.

[Buccaneer]

You need to update your sig.

Originally Posted by Flasch186

policing hypocrisy one thread at a time.
(As long as it doesn't apply to Democrats or to me.)

[Flasch186]

Originally Posted by Fidatelo

Actually it's worse: my understanding is he's the real-estate agent, so he's looking to make larger comissions. Classy.

see my post above. I wont make larger commissions and I make zero off of the majority of the homes for sale in this community and as a matter of fact compete against them (in a way) so it's the opposite. I could argue it's better for me financially if the resale homes look crappy so I can sell someone a new one, in the newer section. I am not thinking that way and am trying to bring the entire community up. After reading the thread I understand that the people doing the things I am describing against will not change regardless. I did have a neighbor thank me for it when I got home from the grocery store and said that he couldnt stand the fact that his neighbor behind him parked up on the street on his backyard (he lives situated on a cul-de-sac). I have a feeling the "amens" wont hesitate to say thanks to my face while the people that think I'm a "douche" will happily talk about me, in groups, behind my back and my house will probably get egged.

[BYU 14]

The only reason this shit comes up now is because neighborhoods are no longer that......people don't know each other and just allow HOA's, many with too much power to dictate who life in their development should be.

I remember growing up in a neighborhood where people knew each other, helped those that couldn't take care of their yards do so and shared pride in their streets.

I live in a place now where the HOA spent over $35,000.00 last year on litigation on things like backyard Gazebos and putting an extra tree in the front yard.....Money that could have been better spent installing speed bumps to curb the fucking Nascar mentality that inflicts about half the people that drive through here.

Up until three months ago we had three teenagers in the house, which meant 5 cars and space in the garage and driveway for 4. The HOA threatened to sanction us and denied a request for a waiver to park one in the street. Their response was add on to your driveway!! Well we live on a corner lot and there is no room to expand the driveway, unless I did it in front of the house, which would look like shit. They also suggested parking one car outside the neighborhood....sure, I will have my 19 yr old Daughter park a mile away at 11pm when she gets off work and walk......safe area or not, shit can happen. I battled them on this for 4 months before one of my sons moved out to go to school on the other side of the valley......

Stuff like this is typical of HOA's in Arizona, and that letter posted by Flasch could have come from anyone of them here and would have drawn mostly ire. Flasch, I respect what you are trying to do, that was probably just not the best way to go about it....And besides, let's not forgot why Homes are overvalued now, people make their own beds and putting a Car in the driveway won't fix the problem.

[Flasch186]

Originally Posted by BYU 14

The only reason this shit comes up now is because neighborhoods are no longer that......people don't know each other and just allow HOA's, many with too much power to dictate who life in their development should be.

...and I think that that stinks. thanks for the support

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Flasch186

... the people doing the things I am describing against will not change regardless.

Damned sure not based upon some anonymous* note.

If there are rules in place to handle these things, use them if you genuinely want to see change in behavior.

Ultimately, if there's no power of enforcement then you have zero chance of success, and your opinion in the note (apparently) had nothing to back it up.
Truth is, nobody gives a damn what you randomly think unless you've got some power behind it.

*I know you didn't intend it that way but ultimately it is what it is.

[Flasch186]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

*I know you didn't intend it that way but ultimately it is what it is.

thanks. It sucks but from this thread, which may be the best thing to come out of this all, Ive learned that the people I was trying to affect wont be affected. That frustrates me cuz I look back on what I wrote and there isn't really a debate that it's true but, like people said, to get the desired effect, this apparently wasn't the best way to go about it. I am still glad I did it though.

Kinda funny that Fidatelo got me to think more about it and financially, I think by "helping" the other half of the neighborhood (literally the neighborhood branches off in 2) I might be hurting myself. I hadnt thought about it until now LOL

[Anthony]

i think you went about it the wrong way.

i think you should've present it as "Proven Tips To Increase The Value Of Your Home: Looking to Refinance/Sell? Here are some tidbits you may have overlooked to help you maximize your returns, from an experienced realtor".

i would've left out the part about giving the kids enough room when they ride their bike and the part about not speeding. that's too preachy and plays no part in increasing/decreasing a home's value. when i see people speeding in my neighborhood - and it doesn't happen too frequently fortunately - i don't automatically assume the speedster was from my neighborhood. those are isolated, random events. likewise, i don't think prospective homebuyers see a driver not helping up a kid who fell from his bike as a negative aspect about a neighborhood.

you had honest intentions, obviously, but how you presented it was off and you probably rubbed a couple people the wrong way. but there's nothing wrong with trying to bring the standards of a community up. i applaud your effort, but the way you went about it was not the best way. you live, you learn.

[Flasch186]

That's what Ive learned. Thanks HA

BTW Im not a Realtor, Im technically a "site agent" which is why I cant help people buy or sell homes outside of New construction in this community although I do help their appraisers on their Resales when they need comp info because generally our homes are more expensive.

[Anthony]

no prob. i find sometimes it's not the message that moves people or gets through to people, but how the message is presented. i mean, Hitler got an entire country to subscribe to the theory that exterminating all Jews was a pretty logical idea. point is, you can go a long way in getting people on your side largely based on how you convey what you're trying to get across.

seems like you were trying to kill two birds with one stone. you started off pointing out how not taking care of your property reduces the overall appeal of the neighborhood. that i agree with. i read things like that all the time on websites (like cnn.com, etc). i'm always on the lookout for quick little bullet points as to what i could be doing to enhance the value of my home without spending much time and effort. then you went off on a tangent on how to live life - how much room to give kids when they're riding bikes, a quick how-to on what to do when you encounter a fallen child. by that point you lost me.

maybe what you coulda done, which, like hindsight, doesn't do much for you now, is put that same note in people's mailboxes minus the life-coach etiquette part. at the bottom of the note could've been a PS pointing people to a simple little website you could've set up where you went into detail and then also added maybe a section for "gripes" or blog/forum section where you then could've wrote things like "top 10 things that saddens/irratates me about the neighborhood". then invite people to comment on your thoughts and better - start their own threads about things they don't like and would like to change.

implemented properly, your site could be the de facto sounding board for your town or neighborhood where people could annonymously voice their displeasure and/or concerns about the community.

so basically you rope them in offering to provide your insight as to how to enhance the value of the neighborhod, then when you got people seeking further info you get them to read your comments on other neighborhood no-no's.

[flere-imsaho]

Originally Posted by BYU 14

The only reason this shit comes up now is because neighborhoods are no longer that......people don't know each other and just allow HOA's, many with too much power to dictate who life in their development should be.

+1

Originally Posted by Hell Atlantic

i think you should've present it as "Proven Tips To Increase The Value Of Your Home: Looking to Refinance/Sell? Here are some tidbits you may have overlooked to help you maximize your returns, from an experienced realtor".

+1

I have no content to add, other than to say that I'm glad I don't live in a neighborhood with an association.

[CraigSca]

Funny -we see the exact opposite in our neighborhood. People blatantly disregard the rules they signed up for upon move-in, and the association that we pay roughly $300 a year to sits on its butt and doesn't do a thing about it.

Oh, and then there's the people who don't pay their fees at all, causing ours to go up. Lovely.

[ShaneTheMaster]

I think it sucks I make over 70,000/year in Florida and can't afford a new home.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by ShaneTheMaster

I think it sucks I make over 70,000/year in Florida and can't afford a new home.

we make a combined 150K plus and could barely afford a home in NJ

[Flasch186]

Originally Posted by ShaneTheMaster

I think it sucks I make over 70,000/year in Florida and can't afford a new home.

not true, give me a call and I can get you an awesome deal and make zero on the commission for you. You only have to buy in this neighborhood I mentioned above and buy a new home, not a resale....and for it to be the best deal it needs to be a Spec home.

[Lathum]

so hows the neighborhood looking these days?

[fantom1979]

Besides the flaming poo in his yard, it is probably pretty nice.

[Flasch186]

not any better and those that said the people who are the problems wont care about the letter and those that do care about the letter arent the one's were talking about, were right. Only one lawn is really really bad but the HOA is cutting it. Lots of kids almost hit though which is partially due to them playing in the street but I do see that all the time and people that are in my car to see property do make comments about how dangerous the streets are because of the cars in the road. It'll take a kid getting hit before things change (for a while before going back to the same old same old). You just simply cant see them until its almost too late.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by Flasch186

Lots of kids almost hit though which is partially due to them playing in the street but I do see that all the time and people that are in my car to see property do make comments about how dangerous the streets are because of the cars in the road. It'll take a kid getting hit before things change (for a while before going back to the same old same old). You just simply cant see them until its almost too late.

Now if you wanted to be proactive, you could just hit one of the little urchins. I mean, just enough to wing him and show all the parents in the neighborhood- like a warning shot where it doesn't do any real damage but gets the point across. Pick the one that's the biggest brat, too, so you get some satisfaction out of it

SI

[RedKingGold]

Originally Posted by Flasch186

not any better and those that said the people who are the problems wont care about the letter and those that do care about the letter arent the one's were talking about, were right. Only one lawn is really really bad but the HOA is cutting it. Lots of kids almost hit though which is partially due to them playing in the street but I do see that all the time and people that are in my car to see property do make comments about how dangerous the streets are because of the cars in the road. It'll take a kid getting hit before things change (for a while before going back to the same old same old). You just simply cant see them until its almost too late.

Priorities man, priorities.

[flere-imsaho]

Why are people parking on the street? Laziness?

Interesting how we don't have any of these "problems" in my non-HOA neighborhood.

[lordscarlet]

This is vaguely off topic, but I think kids should be able to play in the street. In a suburban neighborhood, that is often the only choice. This is why low speed limits are posted. (This is not meant as an endorsement of the "mailbox letter")

[Marc Vaughan]

I personally bought my house because I liked the neighbourhood - its friendly and reasonably neat without disappearing up a posterior (ie. cars don't park on driveways all the time).

I agree with Flasch that such things probably do affect house valuations, however the house I live in isn't an investment its a family home which is much more important imho than its current market value .... I'd prefer a slightly scruffy friendly neighbourhood where my family are happy to one which is immaculate where I'm not.

PS - The points about looking out for each others kids and property though I whole heartedly agree with, just common sense imho.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by lordscarlet

This is vaguely off topic, but I think kids should be able to play in the street.

Only if I can drive on the sidewalk and through the yards.

[flere-imsaho]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Only if I can drive on the sidewalk and through the yards.

Bucc, is that you?

[lordscarlet]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Only if I can drive on the sidewalk and through the yards.

No, you slow down and give the kids a chance to get out of the street. That's how it was where I grew up, at least. It just takes some courtesy and understanding on both sides.

Maybe we're talking about neighborhoods with yards much larger than where I grew up, but the street was the only place for us to play football. If a car was headed down the street, you get the "CAR!" yell and everyone vacates the asphalt.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by lordscarlet

No, you slow down and give the kids a chance to get out of the street.

Sorry, but if you were dumb enough to play in the street where I grew up (and that's a town so small that it wasn't even a "town" officially) you stood a pretty good chance of getting your ass run over. Happily most kids were smart enough to know that.

Streets are for cars, they are neither private nor public playgrounds. And kids have as much business playing in them as I have driving on the sidewalk.

[jeheinz72]

I personally wouldn't want to live in a neighborhood with perfectly manicured lawns, no one parked on the street and I felt any actual pressure to do X, Y and Z. We keep a clean house/yard but still, that kind of attitude just wouldn't work for me whatsoever.

Kid safety, yeah. That's gotta be a big priority. I played in the street when I was a kid, but I also grew up on a cul-de-sac so not really the same deal. If it's that big of a problem, petition to put in speed bumps...and watch the mailbox shitting hilarity that follows that one.

[chesapeake]

Originally Posted by Flasch186

thanks. It sucks but from this thread, which may be the best thing to come out of this all, Ive learned that the people I was trying to affect wont be affected. That frustrates me cuz I look back on what I wrote and there isn't really a debate that it's true but, like people said, to get the desired effect, this apparently wasn't the best way to go about it. I am still glad I did it though.

Kinda funny that Fidatelo got me to think more about it and financially, I think by "helping" the other half of the neighborhood (literally the neighborhood branches off in 2) I might be hurting myself. I hadnt thought about it until now LOL

I missed this thread the first time through. I would have recommended that you issue your flyer under the aegis of the homeowner's association. Most folks will dismiss recommendations made by another neighbor -- even if it is solid sdvice offered with the best of intentions. Assuming your HOA has the authority to fine or otherwise make trouble for those that fail to meet the community's regulations, the same jerk that picks up the flyer and gets irriatated at you for being presumptuous at least has to read the flyer if it comes from the HOA, fearing that not being aware of the information might come at some cost to him/her.

It won't be 100% effective, but it raises the bar some from the compliance you got.

It also may have helped if you got the HOA President to write a couple of lines to open it to make it appear as if the HOA had asked you to provide advice based on your expertise rather than you volunteering the suggestions as the neighborhood crank. Then, rather than someone giving you a dirty look, you can simply shrig your shoulders and point them at the HOA.

You might even want to take another shot at this next year, but passing the same information through the HOA this time.

[spleen1015]

The President of our HOA had a scathing letter in our last newsletter about the upkeep of some of the yards around the neighborhood. Pretty much telling everyone that shitty yards were driving down the value of the other houses.

There is a house across the street from me and one 2 doors down that have the worst yards I have ever seen. They aren't mowed regularly and there are more weeds than grass.

Guess who owns these to houses as rentals?

[chesapeake]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Sorry, but if you were dumb enough to play in the street where I grew up (and that's a town so small that it wasn't even a "town" officially) you stood a pretty good chance of getting your ass run over. Happily most kids were smart enough to know that.

Streets are for cars, they are neither private nor public playgrounds. And kids have as much business playing in them as I have driving on the sidewalk.

Where I grew up on the Puget Sound, the street was one of the few places that 1) didn't have huge trees in the middle of it; and, 2) was mostly flat enough that you could play a game. The golden age of outdoor sports play in my neighborhood was a period when the lot next door was cleared of trees and brush for a house and then the contractor went belly-up. We had almost 2 years of a nice lot to play on.

[Flasch186]

a few things of note:

We have a very diversifed neighborhood and sometimes I have found that cultural differences play a part in yard and street and home expectations.

Speed bumps would probably the only way to get people to show up at the HOA meetings, so they can rail against them.

One of the reasons in Florida for street parking is people use their garages as storage units so they cant park their cars in them. Then you put two on the driveway eventhough they afford 4 on them. After that add in just one more car and a bit of laziness or anticipated inconvenience from having to do the car shuffle (like we do at my house) and you get a neighborhood where you have to look way down at the end sometimes to see if there is a car coming towards you through what is essentially left of the road (1 lane in between rows of cars) and you dart through. Sometimes you have to communicate via hand signal to see who is going to go. I have seen a few more cars with minor damage to mirrors and stuff and wonder if it was due to being 'clipped'. All that being said, there are some homes that park zero cars in the drive and use the road for the most parking they can get.

This is a very family occupied neighborhood so the kids are everywhere.

-------------------

It's a tough situation. I had good intentions but didnt realize until pointed out on here (which is why I love you guys [most of you]) that the actual people who need to change wont care or read the letter. I hadnt thought about that. Whether the HOA stamps it or not those that dont care (there is one home that parks ZERO cars in the driveway and 4 on the road in front of the neighbor's yards) just aren't going to change. That was an eye opening revelation.

[lordscarlet]

Originally Posted by chesapeake

Where I grew up on the Puget Sound, the street was one of the few places that 1) didn't have huge trees in the middle of it; and, 2) was mostly flat enough that you could play a game. The golden age of outdoor sports play in my neighborhood was a period when the lot next door was cleared of trees and brush for a house and then the contractor went belly-up. We had almost 2 years of a nice lot to play on.

Exactly. It's not like we're talking about highways here. A little politeness and common sense goes a long way. There is no way a child should be in danger of being hit by a car going 25mph in a residential neighborhood, even if they are playing in the street. If you feel the need to go in severe excess of 25mph, of course it will be dangerous for children, but 25mph is very slow.

[Anthony]

in my neighborhood suburbs we have a 30 mph limit. that's really slow.

where i grew up, the more urban Astoria in Queens NYC, we all knew the cars had the right of way and that we were in "their turf". playing in the street was something to do when there were no cars coming, we didn't feel as if we had a right to be in the street. it can get rather disruptive to have all these human roadblocks on the street. in my town everyone has ample backyard space, i know i have one of the larger backyards in town. for those that don't (due to extending their house, thereby decreasing the amoung of yard space) they have themselves to blame and i shouldn't have to suffer because someone's kid is forced onto the street cuz their dad wanted a bigger den. there is common respect in my neighborhood, so disruptions are minimal and there's a small baseball field/park closeby that is utilized more than the streets are. when i drive i don't look straight ahead so much as i scan from left to right continually, always on the lookout for a stupid kid/dog chasing a ball onto the street.

[NobodyHere]

Flasch,

Please stop causing trouble

Elderly Couple Gets Angry Letter Criticizing Home's Curb Appeal

[Toddzilla]

This is the MOTHER of all callbacks.

[Lathum]

man, just reread this thread, Flash sure did take a beating...

[molson]

I'm really glad that I never want to live in a neighborhood nice enough to where people are obsessed with this stuff. I really like my grungy, friendly neighborhood. It's nice not to aspire to have more.

[DaddyTorgo]

What was the eventual resolution to this? Did things change in that neighborhood at all over the past few years?

[cartman]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

What was the eventual resolution to this? Did things change in that neighborhood at all?

After the Great Yard and Street Parking Schism of 2009, it took months to get even basic services back to the area. The only recognizable features were overgrown flower beds, mailboxes covered in concertina wire, and defaced movie posters for "The Punisher". No one was really sure what set the conflagration off. Rumors persisted of a note left on mailboxes, others pointed to vehicles unable to turnaround in a cul-de-sac. The truth may never be known.

[stevew]

Was watching Flip or Flop the other day and some house they bought had an HOA of $590/month. That's like more than my house payment. Crazy.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by stevew

Was watching Flip or Flop the other day and some house they bought had an HOA of $590/month. That's like more than my house payment. Crazy.

our association fees in our condo in Seattle was about that much.

[Marc Vaughan]

Originally Posted by stevew

Was watching Flip or Flop the other day and some house they bought had an HOA of $590/month. That's like more than my house payment. Crazy.

How much was the house? - I'm figuring its either 'free' and the HOA are like the monthly fees in a similar system to when you get a new phone from AT&T ... or its a multi-million pound neighborhood where if you have to ask you can't afford it ..

[Blackadar]

I'm glad the home I'm moving into in FL doesn't have a HOA...

[Desnudo]

Originally Posted by stevew

Was watching Flip or Flop the other day and some house they bought had an HOA of $590/month. That's like more than my house payment. Crazy.

I think my parent in-laws is something like that. On the plus side they can't build a 2 foot white picket fence in their front yard because it's against HOA policy.