Superping-Jesus

[revrew]

Originally Posted by wig

I'm glad you're taking the time to answer my questions. The more I learn about how the rules work, the less I believe that anyone knows how the afterlife actually works.

I can try to pick it up a bit here, but I, too have time constraints.

The fundamental flaw that's creating a stumbling block, here, is the perception of the Bible as a "religious rule book." Anyone and everyone, Christian, Jewish, or otherwise, who has perceived the Scriptures this way intevitably gets confused.

In nearly every OTHER religion, the object of divine revelation (i.e. their "holy" writings) is a plan or guidebook on appeasing the divine power. "How to live for Allah" or "How to appease Asherah" or "How to make it into Nirvana" etc.

The Bible is unique in this respect. It is NOT a "how to make God happy and get into heaven and live by the rules" book. It is the LONG story of how GOD, and not humanity, can appease and please the one, holy, perfect, just Creator. The whole Old Testament points out how no matter how few or how many rules God gave for loving, pure community, people screwed it up. In fact, all humanity has ever done is kill, rape, maim, and torture one another and the rest of creation. So, just as any good and just god would, God said, "To hell with it."

And yet, something restrained him. That's the ol' John 3:16 thing. God loved us to much to send all of selfish, stinking humanity to hell. So he said, "Look, what if I take the beating you deserve? What if I go to hell for you? Would you trust me then? Would you let me live your life for you, before you screw up everything?" That's where Jesus came in. Now all He asks is that we trust Him and let Him live through us. The end result? He's making a place called Heaven. Those that live with him now get to live with him forever.

That's the whole point. It's not about rules and how to "be good." It's not even about "how to make God happy enough to get into heaven." The whole point is: we can't; but God alive inside of us can; so let him. Make sense?

[druez]

I just had this debate on the .400 forums but here are some of my highlights.

Jesus was a canabis user so why can't I be?

The Greek title "Christ" is the translation of the Hebrew word Messiah, which in English becomes "The Anointed" D. The Messiah was recognized as such by his being anointed with the holy anointing oil, the use of which was restricted to the instillation of Hebrew priests and kings (See CC#5). If Jesus was not initiated in this fashion then he was not the Christ, and had no official claim to the title.

The ancient recipe for this anointing oil, recorded in the Old Testament book of Exodus (30: 22-23) included over nine pounds of flowering cannabis tops, Hebrew "kaneh-bosm" B, extracted into a hind (about 6.5 litres) of olive oil, along with a variety of other herbs and spices.

Unlike the shamanistic priests and kings of earlier generations, Jesus did not follow the strict Old Testament taboos that limited the holy cannabis oils use to Yahweh's chosen few (Exodus 30:33), but broke tradition and began to liberally use it in both healing and initiation rites.

Through this open distribution the singular Christ, "the Anointed", was extended to become the plural term "Christians", that is, those who had been smeared or anointed. "By rubbing on this divine unction. . . obtained from certain special herbs or plants, they believed they were donning the panoply of God."7


As the New Testament's John explains:

. . . you have an anointing from the Holy One, and all of you know the truth. . . . the anointing you received from him remains in you, and you do not need anyone to teach you. But as his anointing teaches you about all things and as that anointing is real, not counterfeit - just as it has taught you, remain in him." (1 John 2: 27). L

". . . the Christian, the 'smeared or anointed one', received 'knowledge of all things' by his 'anointing from the Holy One' (1 John 2: 20). Thereafter he had need of no other teacher and remained forevermore endowed with all knowledge (v. 27)

[Buddy Grant]

Originally Posted by Sharpieman

Jesus isn't the only way to salvation. There are many other religions out there that can help one reach salvation. God takes many forms, Jesus, Ganesh etc...

Well I like that attitude, I suspect many Christians would disagree though.

[druez]

DOLA

This week is my point out silly things in christianity week I think. There are a quite a few more like these.

1. When I burn a bull on the altar as a sacrifice, I know it creates a pleasing odour for the Lord - Lev.1:9

2. I would like to sell my daughter into slavery, as sanctioned in Exodus 21:7

3. Lev. 25:44 states that I may indeed possess slaves, both male and female, provided they are purchased from neighboring nations

4. Most of my male friends get their hair trimmed, including the hair around their temples, even though this is expressly forbidden by Lev.19:27.

Lev = Leviticus

Pretty fun stuff. Because we all know the bible isn't wrong!

[heybrad]

Originally Posted by Subby

I believe in and love God.

The best examples of God on this Earth are seen in nature, my wife and my four sons.

God is compassionate and forgiving. He is NOT jealous. Jealousy is a human flaw.

God realized that when he created humans he was creating something that was incapable of perfection and to that end we will all likely join him in the afterlife.

Your mission in this life is a simple one. First, enjoy life. It is a grand gift. If you have children, be a good parent. If you are married, be a good spouse. Love your family unconditionally. Be a good neighbor and volunteer selflessly in your community. Respect and exalt in nature.

Realize your imperfections and take responsibility for your actions. But don't feel the need to take responsibility for everyone else's.

LOVE LIFE.

See you in Heaven.

This is far and away the best post I've ever seen in a religious thread.

[HornedFrog Purple]

Originally Posted by dawgfan

I'd like to believe in an afterlife, but faced with the alternative most people would as well. It's not a very comforting thought to try and imagine death and what that entails - is it the end of this consciousness? Or is there some way in which the thoughts and essences that comprise this consciousness 'live on' in some form?

The rationalist in me says that ideas like Heaven, an afterlife, reincarnation, etc. are concepts that man has created as a comfort to deal with this most difficult of ponderings.

The dreamer in me hopes that there is some way of living on. Of course, I'm still relatively young and vital - ask me again in 60 years if I've had enough...

If you love one other person on this Earth, you will live on through their love for you. And they will live on through someone else's love for them. In essence you will never die.

Above everything else Jesus said, he simply said "Love one another." This was his most important message and the one he stressed many many times throughout his life here on Earth.

My own personal beliefs are partly formed from some things I have seen because of what I do for a living. I have seen probably two dozen people in their last seconds of life of whom I have no attachment or preconception of and all I can tell you is that there is something there. I don't know what it is and it would be impossible to explain but it just happens. I believe they are moving on to something else and somehow, someway they know this, but I have no concrete proof or conception of what it is for you unless you saw it yourself.

You will find many doctors and other people who have seen things similar. It can change your life completely.

[Buddy Grant]

Heaven questions for any folks who believe in heaven: What is heaven like, is it like Earth in any way? Are winged angels singing religious hymns on clouds? Do people that get accepted into heaven look like they did on Earth or do they all look like Ken & Barbie?

[Cuckoo]

Originally Posted by revrew

I can try to pick it up a bit here, but I, too have time constraints.

The fundamental flaw that's creating a stumbling block, here, is the perception of the Bible as a "religious rule book." Anyone and everyone, Christian, Jewish, or otherwise, who has perceived the Scriptures this way intevitably gets confused.

In nearly every OTHER religion, the object of divine revelation (i.e. their "holy" writings) is a plan or guidebook on appeasing the divine power. "How to live for Allah" or "How to appease Asherah" or "How to make it into Nirvana" etc.

The Bible is unique in this respect. It is NOT a "how to make God happy and get into heaven and live by the rules" book. It is the LONG story of how GOD, and not humanity, can appease and please the one, holy, perfect, just Creator. The whole Old Testament points out how no matter how few or how many rules God gave for loving, pure community, people screwed it up. In fact, all humanity has ever done is kill, rape, maim, and torture one another and the rest of creation. So, just as any good and just god would, God said, "To hell with it."

And yet, something restrained him. That's the ol' John 3:16 thing. God loved us to much to send all of selfish, stinking humanity to hell. So he said, "Look, what if I take the beating you deserve? What if I go to hell for you? Would you trust me then? Would you let me live your life for you, before you screw up everything?" That's where Jesus came in. Now all He asks is that we trust Him and let Him live through us. The end result? He's making a place called Heaven. Those that live with him now get to live with him forever.

That's the whole point. It's not about rules and how to "be good." It's not even about "how to make God happy enough to get into heaven." The whole point is: we can't; but God alive inside of us can; so let him. Make sense?

Thank goodness you showed up revrew. Every time one of these threads starts, I think about getting involved. For the most part, though, I just hope that you'll appear because you explain things so much better than I ever could. Thanks.

[revrew]

Originally Posted by Buddy Grant

Heaven questions for any folks who believe in heaven: What is heaven like, is it like Earth in any way? Are winged angels singing religious hymns on clouds? Do people that get accepted into heaven look like they did on Earth or do they all look like Ken & Barbie?

1. Heaven like Earth? Largely, don't know. We only get glimpses from brief hints given by two people who saw it (Jesus, and John (in the book of Revelation)). Among a few other things, we can glean that it is a place of no more sorrow, no tears, and plently of joy, singing, worship. Furthermore, we can glean that we will know others there, that we will have some kind of "body", that God will be present and seeable. We can glean there is some kind of "river of life, crystal sea, emerald rainbows, etc." though some reasonably suggest these were only John's finite attempts at describing infinite things, a shadow of how cool it will really be. Furthermore, there is an uderstanding that there will be a new earth and new Jerusalem, a BIG city with mansions, where all will live in peace.

2. Winged angels? Again, we know little. We do know that we will be singing, and it will be an awesome concert.

3. Our bodies? We know even less. But here's what the Bible says about it: "New bodies that never grow old, tired, sick, or deformed. Incorruptible."

*These answers are those I gleaned from Scripture, not personal opinion. Of course, these answers only reflect a biblical perspective of heaven. For the "heavens" of other faiths, or other's personal opinions, you will have to see their writings. I only refer to the writings claimed to be breathed and inspired by the Christian God.

[QuikSand]

Originally Posted by Subby

Your mission in this life is a simple one. First, enjoy life. It is a grand gift. If you have children, be a good parent. If you are married, be a good spouse. Love your family unconditionally. Be a good neighbor and volunteer selflessly in your community. Respect and exalt in nature.

Realize your imperfections and take responsibility for your actions. But don't feel the need to take responsibility for everyone else's.

LOVE LIFE.

I echo the sentiment that Subby's was a very positive message.

I also find it interesting, but not surprising, that when stripped of all the God and heaven references (above), it stil holds an awful lot of water.

[vex]

Originally Posted by Daimyo

Why does god care if humans believe in him or not? If I was all-powerful I wouldn't waste time caring if people believed in me or not (especially if they were generally good people otherwise). Does god have self-esteem issues?

God created us to have fellowship with him.

[vex]

Originally Posted by Easy Mac

If God is supremely perfect, how can he create something with imperfections (humanity)? The very definition of perfection is that everything something does is perfect, it cannot create things that have imperfections.

Man was not originally created imperfect. It was when Adam and Eve disobeyed God that they were to be punished from then on.

[Huckleberry]

My impression has always been that original sin means even an infant doesn't go to heaven.

Can someone explain original sin? Is it an inheritance of your ancestors' sins? Because that's not very fair or just. Is it because you are the product of sex? Because sex for the purpose of procreation between a married couple seems to me to be okay in the eyes of God.

[Drake]

Originally Posted by nfg22

I just found out a couple weeks ago that the Shriners are acually muslim is there roots. and the sword and moon on their caps is from when Muhhamed went and slaughered a whole town of Christians that kicked him out. The moon is from the tribal god that Muhhamed came from. He was the god of the moon and the chosen god of Muhhamed's tribe.

No, no, no. This is patently false. I don't know what your source was for this , but I'd suggest that you at least make an effort to learn about the history and symbolism of Freemasonry before you start spreading lies about it.

[Huckleberry]

dola -

Okay, vexroid's last response seems to imply that my original sin is that Eve screwed up. Is that fair and just that I should be punished for a sin committed by some woman I never met?

[revrew]

Originally Posted by Huckleberry

dola -

Okay, vexroid's last response seems to imply that my original sin is that Eve screwed up. Is that fair and just that I should be punished for a sin committed by some woman I never met?

I know theologians and professors would get on my case for this...but does it matter? You don't have to worry about being punished for Adam's, Eve's, or your parents' sin. You've got enough of your own to merit punishment. So do I. Right?

[nfg22]

Seeing as the Old Testament issue of laws is still a big obstacle for all of you I would like to post on this. You have to understand that most of the OT books were written for the Isrealites and were not only meant to instruct them in God's ways but also Societal ways of that time. They had no laws before this, so some of the books are kind of like their constitution. They followed the books as laws of society and laws of religion. So we pick what God said to conform to him and what God said to conform to societal and distiguish them. Not as a means to differentiate between what we want and dont but to interpret it as religious and societal. Also homosexuality is not just a societal rule because it came from the babylonians yet was still condemned not because of baal but because it was wrong. Still was condemned in the New Testament although the Greeks and Romans used it profusely to unite the men in their armys and bring them closer in relationships so they would fight harder for each other.

[vex]

Originally Posted by revrew

I know theologians and professors would get on my case for this...but does it matter? You don't have to worry about being punished for Adam's, Eve's, or your parents' sin. You've got enough of your own to merit punishment. So do I. Right?

But you are constantly being punished for Adam & Eve's sin.

[nfg22]

Originally Posted by revrew

I know theologians and professors would get on my case for this...but does it matter? You don't have to worry about being punished for Adam's, Eve's, or your parents' sin. You've got enough of your own to merit punishment. So do I. Right?

The better answer to that is that Eve had the first chance then when she screwed up it violated the worlds rules and causes us to live in a fallen world. So now yes we are living in Eve's sin but you are born into the world of her sin and you also sin yourself. I dont want to sound holier than thou, because I am trying to come off as anything but that. I battle alot of sin in my life yet am striving to get rid of it, so dont think I that think I am better than you.

[nfg22]

I hope I am being helpfull to all of you. Please tell me if im not.

[Huckleberry]

I am referring to an infant that dies shortly after birth. The idea that such a creatures bears any responsibility for any sin is quite simply offensive to me. I can not accept any belief system that includes such a preposterous idea.

[revrew]

nfg22 - just noticed your sig line - "Bid that I may come and die and find that I may truly live"

I recognize that from Brad Olsen of The Waiting singing The Wonderful Cross. Is that where you get that from? Or is it picked up from an older source?

[Subby]

What is the Christian basis for the condemnation of homosexuality again? Is it a biblical passage or an almagam of mores that have been cobbled together over centuries or something else entirely?

[VPI97]

Originally Posted by Subby

Your mission in this life is a simple one. First, enjoy life. It is a grand gift. If you have children, be a good parent. If you are married, be a good spouse. Love your family unconditionally. Be a good neighbor and volunteer selflessly in your community. Respect and exalt in nature.

Realize your imperfections and take responsibility for your actions. But don't feel the need to take responsibility for everyone else's.

LOVE LIFE.

Originally Posted by QuikSand

I also find it interesting, but not surprising, that when stripped of all the God and heaven references (above), it stil holds an awful lot of water.

Ditto. The idea of enjoying life and respecting what life brings (minus the religious references) is the coda that I try to live my life by. It's worked out well so far.

[nfg22]

Originally Posted by revrew

nfg22 - just noticed your sig line - "Bid that I may come and die and find that I may truly live"

I recognize that from Brad Olsen of The Waiting singing The Wonderful Cross. Is that where you get that from? Or is it picked up from an older source?

Yes that is the most moving line of any worship I have ever sung.

[nfg22]

Originally Posted by Subby

What is the Christian basis for the condemnation of homosexuality again? Is it a biblical passage or an almagam of mores that have been cobbled together over centuries or something else entirely?

This is a topic of speciality for me.As I did a huge report on it.

Backround: Homosexuality originated in Babylon when they worshiped baal. The had sex with eachother to instill their good qualities in eachother and also masturbated from towers so their semen could hit the earth and inseminate it for baal to make feritle. This brings the argument that homosecuality is bad because it has to do with other religions. Yet the Greeks and Romans did it in their armys for reasons I stated earlier. Also in the book of Romans and other NT books it states that homosexuality is against God's will. Sex was meant for a united couple as one that God created to compliment eahother as said in Genesis. Males were not made to compliment eachother.

[revrew]

Originally Posted by Huckleberry

I am referring to an infant that dies shortly after birth. The idea that such a creatures bears any responsibility for any sin is quite simply offensive to me. I can not accept any belief system that includes such a preposterous idea.

Earlier there was a discussion about "age of accountability". Now, nowhere in the Bible or Jesus' recorded words do we get the question: "What happens when a baby dies? Well, what happens is..." So KNOWING for sure is tough.

However, there is the story of the death of King David's infant son. He said, point blank, "I will see my son later." This, and a few other instances, have led many to conclude that God must be allowing of infants into Heaven. It's not as ironclad as some other doctrines, but it is reasonable. Some would argue it is ironclad and provable. I, personally, would tend to agree with it.

The statement earlier that "original sin banishes all infants to hell" is a doctrine I'm unfamiliar with. It's possible some churches (where are Catholics on this one?) may take this stance, but I don't see much evidence of this one in Scripture.

btw, nfg--am a big fan of not only that song, but all of The Waiting's stuff. Agree that it's a powerful line.

[nfg22]

Originally Posted by revrew

Earlier there was a discussion about "age of accountability". Now, nowhere in the Bible or Jesus' recorded words do we get the question: "What happens when a baby dies? Well, what happens is..." So KNOWING for sure is tough.

However, there is the story of the death of King David's infant son. He said, point blank, "I will see my son later." This, and a few other instances, have led many to conclude that God must be allowing of infants into Heaven. It's not as ironclad as some other doctrines, but it is reasonable. Some would argue it is ironclad and provable. I, personally, would tend to agree with it.

The statement earlier that "original sin banishes all infants to hell" is a doctrine I'm unfamiliar with. It's possible some churches (where are Catholics on this one?) may take this stance, but I don't see much evidence of this one in Scripture.

btw, nfg--am a big fan of not only that song, but all of The Waiting's stuff. Agree that it's a powerful line.

Didnt know who sung it just sing it in chapel sometimes and love it.

Thanks it was David not Solomon. I knew it was in the OT before Psalms

[revrew]

I've got to go all, but I'll check back later.

I would advise us NOT to get into the homosexual debate. It's not worth trashing a perfectly good thread by bringing up a redflag and then allowing it red herring. Start another thread if you want to get into that. And nfg22, other Christian posters haven't had the wisdom to heed this warning. If you're baited to get into it, start another thread for it.

Later...

[John Galt]

Originally Posted by Subby

What is the Christian basis for the condemnation of homosexuality again? Is it a biblical passage or an almagam of mores that have been cobbled together over centuries or something else entirely?

It is from biblical passages. Some of them may have been mistranslated and most of the key ones are from Leviticus, but they can be derived from the text. It is still up in the air over whether the Bible truly condemns homosexuality (albeit, most here disagree with that), but there is textual support for the presumed condemnation.

[Subby]

Originally Posted by nfg22

This is a topic of speciality for me.As I did a huge report on it.

Backround: Homosexuality originated in Babylon when they worshiped baal. The had sex with eachother to instill their good qualities in eachother and also masturbated from towers so their semen could hit the earth and inseminate it for baal to make feritle..

That's interesting. Is there scientific or historical evidence that backs this up?

Originally Posted by nfg22

This brings the argument that homosecuality is bad because it has to do with other religions. Yet the Greeks and Romans did it in their armys for reasons I stated earlier.

Can you expand on this point? What is the argument exactly and how do protestant sects and catholics use it to condem homosexuality?

Originally Posted by nfg22

Also in the book of Romans and other NT books it states that homosexuality is against God's will. Sex was meant for a united couple as one that God created to compliment eahother as said in Genesis. Males were not made to compliment eachother.

What are the exact passages and what do they say? I don't really understand the "complement" angle. Does this refer to reproduction? Love? Sex?

I am not trying to bait you here. I am just not seeing a cohesive argument and would like some more information.

[John Galt]

Originally Posted by revrew

I've got to go all, but I'll check back later.

I would advise us NOT to get into the homosexual debate. It's not worth trashing a perfectly good thread by bringing up a redflag and then allowing it red herring. Start another thread if you want to get into that. And nfg22, other Christian posters haven't had the wisdom to heed this warning. If you're baited to get into it, start another thread for it.

Later...

I agree with that (although I posted without seeing your post).

[Huckleberry]

revrew -

I understand that position. Still doesn't remove the fact that most Christian churches view the newborn as bearing original sin. And that is what's preposterous to me.

[druez]

Am I the only one who thinks god is bi-polar or a skittso? In the old testiment, he punishes those who defy him. He is a bad ass pist off god, he drops bombs on those who defy him.

In the new-testiment, he is a kinder gentler god. Who loves us all and gives us free will in life. NO smiting there?

Seems like the people who wrote the old testiment, realized it wasn't working well enough, so they wrote a new version to controll the masses.......

[druez]

I still think that since Jesus was a canabis user and as many people claim, the US is based on Jedeo Christian Principals, I should be allowed to use canabis.

[druez]

Originally Posted by Huckleberry

revrew -

I understand that position. Still doesn't remove the fact that most Christian churches view the newborn as bearing original sin. And that is what's preposterous to me.

I always thought, that Jesus died to take away that sin and the sins of man.

Another point, Anyone see the Simpsons episode when Homer dove into the Holy Water when Ned Flanders tried to baptise Maggie?

[Subby]

Originally Posted by revrew

I would advise us NOT to get into the homosexual debate. It's not worth trashing a perfectly good thread by bringing up a redflag and then allowing it red herring. Start another thread if you want to get into that. And nfg22, other Christian posters haven't had the wisdom to heed this warning. If you're baited to get into it, start another thread for it.

Well, I would disagree with you. This thread was started by ngf22 as a means of trying to provide answers for people who had issues or questions about Christianity. Segregating homosexuality or abortion into a separate thread guarantees a devolution of discussion. Keeping them in here will probably go a long way toward keeping the discussion civil...

[nfg22]

Originally Posted by Subby

That's interesting. Is there scientific or historical evidence that backs this up?


Can you expand on this point? What is the argument exactly and how do protestant sects and catholics use it to condem homosexuality?

What are the exact passages and what do they say? I don't really understand the "complement" angle. Does this refer to reproduction? Love? Sex?

I am not trying to bait you here. I am just not seeing a cohesive argument and would like some more information.

I took this out of my paper. But I dont have the references on hand because that is packed away in all my papers. I will look at that if I have more time I need to go to work soon. But it was not biblical or Christian and came from some documents of archeologist.

The argument is that since the homosexuality is religion related(baal) then it is bad because it is tying u into another religion. but that is not true because the greeks and romans were condemned even though they didnt use it religiously. and Jesus also talked about sexual immorality but I dont have that off hand since im not a bible verse expert yet, but I am quite good with ideologys. I will look it up when I have more time.


The compliment angle is that woman was made from man's rib to beone with him. we are to be married and become one in God's eyes. worshiping him together and being uplifting in a spiritual way to eathother. I would love to expand but I have to leave for work thank you all.

[nfg22]

Originally Posted by druez

I still think that since Jesus was a canabis user and as many people claim, the US is based on Jedeo Christian Principals, I should be allowed to use canabis.

Last post before work
Cannabis is not condemned neither are drugs or driking. Problem being your body is the temple of God do not abuse it. If you get addicted and abuse these drugs then it is a problem but drinking sparingly or even cannabis I do not veiw as wrong.

[vex]

Originally Posted by druez

Am I the only one who thinks god is bi-polar or a skittso? In the old testiment, he punishes those who defy him. He is a bad ass pist off god, he drops bombs on those who defy him.

In the new-testiment, he is a kinder gentler god. Who loves us all and gives us free will in life. NO smiting there?

Seems like the people who wrote the old testiment, realized it wasn't working well enough, so they wrote a new version to controll the masses.......

Not read much of Revelation?

[nfg22]

By all have a good night...be back at like 11:00 central. to be lynched by all you

[Easy Mac]

Originally Posted by vexroid

Man was not originally created imperfect. It was when Adam and Eve disobeyed God that they were to be punished from then on.

They disobeyed him because he gave them free will, which is inherently an imperfect creation (hence why they were able to do the fall). Free will itself may be necessary to create a perfect thing, but the use of it is imperfect in the case of humans.

[druez]

Originally Posted by vexroid

Not read much of Revelation?

So, we are assuming that god realized the old testiment wasn't working. The rules were to harsh and he made a mistake. So in turn he changed his mind and decided to try a different approach?

[WSUCougar]

Another opinion to toss into the mix...

As humans we are largely driven by our instincts, like any other animal. Yet we have brain power - the power to choose - and that's what keeps us from being just another beast. We know the difference between right and wrong. Yet all too often we succumb to our base instincts, fear being the primary one. We steal, kill, lust, cheat, lie, and so on, because we are inherently selfish creatures still striving for survival in a harsh world.

I think the root message of Christianity is meant to counter those basic instincts. Instead of taking things for yourself, give them freely to others. Do not hurt other people for all the reasons that we humans do - instead, love one another. Help each other out instead of competing with one other in a battle for survival.

I think the notion of "original sin" speaks to this. We are all animals at our basest level. The "default setting" of our species is survival of the fittest, and we will sin by our very nature. The higher road beyond that is the difficult one.

[Subby]

Originally Posted by vexroid

Not read much of Revelation?

Most, if not all, of your answers in this thread have been flippant and/or snide.

It would work better if you tried to be a little more respectful. If I can do it, you can too

[CubsFan915]

Originally Posted by nfg22

Well I have a few more minutes now because my paper isnt due till tommrow. in my opinion which may not be right but I believe this. If you know about Jesus yet dont believe then you will go to hell. But if you dont know yet live a good life and keep to high morals God will have forgiveness for those sins.

So, if one believes in Jesus, yet lives a good life and keeps to high morals...?

[vex]

Originally Posted by druez

So, we are assuming that god realized the old testiment wasn't working. The rules were to harsh and he made a mistake. So in turn he changed his mind and decided to try a different approach?

I'll take that as a resounding "no".

[vex]

Originally Posted by Subby

Most, if not all, of your answers in this thread have been flippant and/or snide.

It would work better if you tried to be a little more respectful. If I can do it, you can too

All you have been doing is baiting people.

[CubsFan915]

Originally Posted by nfg22

Not to knock Catholics but there have been many times where they have done things for money. Like the wars when they incinuated that you could by salvation with donations wo the church to fund their wars.

We're not forgetting about Jerry Falwell and the baptists, now, are we? "I want you to reach deep into your hearts (and your pocketbooks) and take His hand. Because the Lord told me I need to have the mansion. And the Lord said that I NEED to open my own university."

[druez]

Originally Posted by nfg22

Last post before work
Cannabis is not condemned neither are drugs or driking. Problem being your body is the temple of God do not abuse it. If you get addicted and abuse these drugs then it is a problem but drinking sparingly or even cannabis I do not veiw as wrong.

The point I'm driving at is this. Drugs are very spiritual. Jesus was drenched in a canabis oil then had his visions where god spoke to him. I would imagine me or you might have a vision of god if we were drenched in canabis oil also. The Indians used to use drugs as a way to go on their spiritual journey's.

It is believed that canabis oil may have been used on the Leapors to help treat thier diesese... i.e. no miricles there.