Werewolf XLV - ROME! (Game over, post 3425)

[Poli]

Hmm.

ELECT HOOPUS GUYUS CONSUL

If CW wasn't so paranoid of me, he'd probably have my vote.

Autumn was actually my 2nd choice behind hoopus.

[Abe Sargent]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

There have been a couple of people who have talked about coordinating the service bids today. I'll run a list of these with what I think are good choices if that is interesting to people. In truth, I think this is challenging given the lack of activity from some of our wealthier citizens.

I already have my sex slave target

[Abe Sargent]

Alright, time to toss somone off the rocksies. Gotta start sooner or later.

Vote to see if ITC can fly

[Peregrine]

My current vote count (based on st. cronin's last post)

Looks like we're up to 11 of 13 needed to execute.


Current votes to execute Imus Thecrewus (13 needed to execute):

Ardent (1160), Narcizo (1168), KWhit (1245), Chief Rum (1288), Path12 (1294), Grammaticus (1301), Peregrine (1302), Tyrith (1317), Dodgerchick (1319), Saldana (1350), Anxiety (1353)

[path12]

Out for awhile. Hope to be back before deadline but it'll be iffy.

[Barkeep49]

Ok my list of potential arrests are coming from the following list of three:

Lonestargirl: She normally is quite out there with her attempts to make sense of the game. I've seen no such struggle here.

Peregrine: Granted he hasn't played in a long time, but I've found his analysis somewhat weak compared to what I remember him capable of doing.

Antmeister: Has been pretty quiet and what little analysis seems flawed (casting doubt on KWhit? What's up with that?). Sure he's a new player but I don't want him to be able to pull an Ironhead on us.

So yeah my arrest will come from that list KWHit.

[Peregrine]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

Ok my list of potential arrests are coming from the following list of three:

Lonestargirl: She normally is quite out there with her attempts to make sense of the game. I've seen no such struggle here.

Peregrine: Granted he hasn't played in a long time, but I've found his analysis somewhat weak compared to what I remember him capable of doing.

Antmeister: Has been pretty quiet and what little analysis seems flawed (casting doubt on KWhit? What's up with that?). Sure he's a new player but I don't want him to be able to pull an Ironhead on us.

So yeah my arrest will come from that list KWHit.

Lonestargirl is already being arrested by Kwhit, as per his post in huge letters earlier.

As for me, it's probably nostalgia. I consider myself at best a middle-of-the-road WW /player/, I prefer to run games or play WW face-to-face, those are what I'm good at.

Antmeister has been pretty quiet but so have others. You might consider looking at Grammaticus or Neon Chaos, also.

[Barkeep49]

Ok I lie. I'm adding one more to my list:

ITC -- I think he's trying the same strategy as Bullet. Since we saw bullet was innocent perhaps it'll work for him? I don't like it and I CAN issue a conditional order to have him rearrested.

[Barkeep49]

Originally Posted by Peregrine

Lonestargirl is already being arrested by Kwhit, as per his post in huge letters earlier.

As for me, it's probably nostalgia. I consider myself at best a middle-of-the-road WW /player/, I prefer to run games or play WW face-to-face, those are what I'm good at.

Antmeister has been pretty quiet but so have others. You might consider looking at Grammaticus or Neon Chaos, also.

Really? I missed that completely.

[DaddyTorgo]

VOTE TOSS ITC FROM THR ROCK

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

VOTE TOSS ITC FROM THR* ROCK

*the

[Abe Sargent]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

Ok I lie. I'm adding one more to my list:

ITC -- I think he's trying the same strategy as Bullet. Since we saw bullet was innocent perhaps it'll work for him? I don't like it and I CAN issue a conditional order to have him rearrested.

That sounds very reasonable, actually.

[Barkeep49]

As I indicated in 1358 I remain suspicious of ITC, so I'm going to go ahead and Vote to toss ITC

[Abe Sargent]

Originally Posted by Peregrine

I consider myself at best a middle-of-the-road WW /player/, I prefer to run games or play WW face-to-face, those are what I'm good at.

I love GM'ing. And one day, when I become good at it, I'll be very happy.

[Mustang]

Normally I would think the quiet ones would have a greater chance of being traitors but, given that I specifically asked why the pile on to Bullet and no one responded and given that Bullet wasn't a traitor, I'd lean personally that the more vocal people are the traitors.

And given that I'm at the bottom of the wealth chart...

Mustang Salleous sues Ironsus Headus
Mustang Salleous sues Lonestarus Girlus
Mustang Salleous sues Abeus Anxietus
Mustang Salleous sues Autumnus Leavus
Mustang Salleous sues Barkeepus Valerius Fortynineus
Mustang Salleous sues Kayus Whitus
Mustang Salleous sues Narcizus Lispus

[Barkeep49]

Originally Posted by Anxiety

I love GM'ing. And one day, when I become good at it, I'll be very happy.

GM'ing is my passion. I'm a little upset Peregrine is back since I was all set to overtake him as the one who'd GM'ed the most games

[Peregrine]

I've been working like crazy on designing my next game. When you change one of the fundamental WW rules, it brings up all kinds of weird balance issues, I'm trying to think of as many of them as possible before play starts, and deal with them.

[Barkeep49]

Originally Posted by Peregrine

I've been working like crazy on designing my next game. When you change one of the fundamental WW rules, it brings up all kinds of weird balance issues, I'm trying to think of as many of them as possible before play starts, and deal with them.

You tease, you tease. I'm very excited about you being back. River's Edge was a great game, even if I did have to go and undelete a lot of stuff so I could wiki it .

[Peregrine]

Yeah by the way, thanks a lot for the Wiki. As for River's Edge, the deleting stuff seemed necessary at the time, with people griping about it, but later on it needed to be put back, glad someone did it.

[Mustang]

I don't necessarily agree with the 'culling the herd' mentality by eliminating people that aren't speaking up right now (seems to be a considerable amount of them, including myself). Seems like a good way for the Tarqs to eliminate a bunch of people quickly and easily without alot of hassle.

ITC sure hasn't spoken up really so.. either he wants out or doesn't have a good defense. I'm leaning towards the first just on a hunch.

[Mustang]

Vote Free ITC

[Peregrine]

Overall this game is quite difficult, possibly even slanted against the loyalists. We need to figure out what we can do to even things out.

Problems that I see:

Limited Voting - Obviously we can't vote on whoever we like. This removes pressure voting, trying to play two people off against each other, and all the other usual voting tactics. Instead we have to go through two people who may themselves be corrupted by the bad guys, thus ruining the whole process.

Solutions - Several people including myself have already suggested unofficial votes and then expecting the consuls to arrest the people we choose. Hasn't really happened yet though. As for arrest votes, it's going to be even trickier to get a majority to vote for someone to be executed. Others?

Mercenary Roles - All the roles are up for the highest bidder. Instead of having a loyal seer or other roles to rely on, we have to buy them. This leads to all kinds of problems as a rich wolf can basically assure we rarely get to get a critical role. Also, with at least one role a murder role (based on the sword death from earlier in the game) this gives the wolves another way to remove us.

Solutions - Hard to say. Loyalists can try to get more money through lawsuits, that seems to be the obvious one, but again, since we don't know who's who, this is a very sub-par solution. We can also try to tell people which role to pick, but this removes choice, and fun, and is impossible to enforce. Again, wolves can manipulate that system to their choosing.

Lots of Quiet People - Not an issue with game design of course, but we have a large number of quiet people in such a huge game. That really cuts us off from a lot of discussion, and it naturally leads many (including me) to go towards suspecting the UTR people. Of course this also plays into the wolves hands, they can have a few UTR and at this rate, it will take them forever to be executed. Or they can be active and turn the rest of us around, based on the limited voting above.

Solutions - Encourage people to be more active? I don't think that's any good. Replace some of the worst offenders - seems to be slowly happening, that's good. Others?

Well just a bunch of nonsense from me...

[Mustang]

I think the light bulb churned to life in my head.

Trying to do an unofficial vote on the arrest warrants I would think would be the prefered way. I can't imagine a Tarq would be too keen to have to issue an arrest warrant for one of their own and would tend to argue for someone else. Although.. benefits might not be there until the numbers are down a bit.

Replacing players is kind of hard.. game has a little bit of a learning curve. For some reason, I was scratching my head for 24 hours...

I can pretty much guarantee that I'm not going to be getting any services any time soon based on my wealth.

[DaddyTorgo]

huge red flags raised there by mustang's explanation and vote. But i'm not sure to what extent that's because he may be newer to the game versus being a wolf. Seems like it'd be a very clumsy wolf-play

[Autumn]

Peregrine - I think that's a good analysis and summary of the place, and bind, we're in.

[Mustang]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

huge red flags raised there by mustang's explanation and vote.

Why? Was just stating a case why it isn't necessarily a good thing to jump on the quiet ones. I didn't get much of a response (any) to my question of why we were voting to execute Bullet so.. given that, my deduction is the more vocal players right now are more likely to be Tarqs in my eyes than the quiet ones.

Same thing seems to be happening to ITC today. Unless I misread something...

[Autumn]

Right now I have the following people in my list as not having voted on Executing ITC. Now, most of these people probably spoke up and I just didn't write anything down, but I want to confirm.

Cofeeus Yakus, Ironsus Headus, Lonestarus Girlus, Pascalligus, Schmidtyus, Antus Meisterus, Hoopus Guyus.

[Autumn]

Mustang, I haven't heard anyone speak to a reason to Execute Imus Thecrewus except for his quietness, and the fact that while quite wealthy he has not bid on any services yet in the game.

It seems like the majority are starting to learn towards offing him. And for the most part the sentiment I'm hearing is htat it's important to not miss chances to lynch, and that if he's not using his wealth he's either a traitor or just not helping much anyway.

So far I've voted to free him, as I don't want to get burned and I think it's fairly likely he just hasn't been active, not that he's a traitor. Still, I'm new enough to this game to not have a good intuition how to proceed in these cases.

[Schmidty]

Vote execute ImusTheCrewisiusness

[Ironhead]

ELECT NARCIZUS CONSUL
ELECT AUTUMNUS CONSUL

Narcizus has been doing some really solid analysis for the village so far. The other two possibilities for this vote were either going to be for Hoopus Guyus or myself. Hoopus has also been doing some excellent analysis, but given that I have seen first hand how evil he can be I am not ready to put him in a position of power yet. Sorry bud. I chose not to vote for myself because I feel the game is about about 1 or 2 days away from having enough information to make some very important arrests for the village, and I want to have the shot to make those arrests knowing that I am good.

Autumnus has been doing some good analysis too and his thoughts about what the village should do have matched my own at several points. I also know from my first game that as a wolf I was very cautious about what I would say because I was constanlty concerned about being caught - the wolves are few and I didn't want to screw up my "teammates" in my first game. Being a villager in your first game, especially a large one, allows much more freedom to really post what is on your mind and that is what I see Autumnus doing.


VOTE TOSS IMUS THECREWUS OFF THE ROCK

I am willing to take a chance on. Of the original three players in the top 3 ImtheCrew is the only one who has no record of obtaining any services. For someone to just completely not vote for services for three days just seems absurd to me. By this point we have narrowed down the field of what he could have actually bid on to two roles - and admitting to either of them could possibly confirm him as a wolf. His odds of survivoring a lynch actually go up by just acting like he is lazy and uncaring.

[Autumn]

Originally Posted by Autumn

Right now I have the following people in my list as not having voted on Executing ITC. Now, most of these people probably spoke up and I just didn't write anything down, but I want to confirm.

Cofeeus Yakus, Ironsus Headus, Lonestarus Girlus, Pascalligus, Schmidtyus, Antus Meisterus, Hoopus Guyus.

Oh and Neonus Chaosus also. My count right now is 3 votes to free ITC, 13 votes to execute, and 8 that are either free him, or no vote yet.

[hoopsguy]

I'll throw my vote on Crew - we have enough people in play to get the execute so I'll back it to avoid any lawyer action denying the will of the masses (3 vote swing as demonstrated with Warlord on Day 2).

VOTE AIRMAIL IMUS CREWUS

[Schmidty]

Can someone show me where the current people for hire are posted? I'm not being lazy, I just can't seem to find it.

[Antmeister]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

... Antmeister: Has been pretty quiet and what little analysis seems flawed (casting doubt on KWhit? What's up with that?). Sure he's a new player but I don't want him to be able to pull an Ironhead on us.

So yeah my arrest will come from that list KWHit.

Say what you will, but if another innocent dies today, it will still make me wonder. And believe me, I don't know how deep this is. Does anyone have any idea how many Tarqs are among us at this time? This is driving me crazy right now. I don't know if we have one or two Tarqs in the consul right now, so don't count yourself out either.

[Mustang]

Originally Posted by Autumn

Oh and Neonus Chaosus also. My count right now is 3 votes to free ITC, 13 votes to execute, and 8 that are either free him, or no vote yet.

Well, I don't think any miracle is going to save ITC at this point. Of course, if he is a Tarq, logic would dictate that the arrest warrants would be targeted towards the people that voted to free ITC.

[Lorena]

The only person I trust is myself, obviously, and that's why I voted for bullet, Mustang. I'm leary of anyone other than myself that's at the top.

[Lorena]

dola,

Looks like Imus Thecrewus is screwedus. I like how people are getting creative with throwing people off the cliff or whatever.

[Schmidty]

I like myself, so:

Vote Schmidtyus McShmidty-a-lot Consul

And because I am a basketball fan:

Vote Hoopius Guysnessius Consul

[Schmidty]

Originally Posted by Dodgerchick

dola,

Looks like Imus Thecrewus is screwedus. I like how people are getting creative with throwing people off the cliff or whatever.

I had to dust.

[KWhit]

Originally Posted by Antmeister

Say what you will, but if another innocent dies today, it will still make me wonder. And believe me, I don't know how deep this is. Does anyone have any idea how many Tarqs are among us at this time? This is driving me crazy right now. I don't know if we have one or two Tarqs in the consul right now, so don't count yourself out either.

You're pushing really hard to target me (and now possibly BK) as a Tarq. Especially when you say "If another innocent dies today...". It is quite likely that ITC is innocent. We have NOTHING to go on - no way to tell who might be innocent and who might be guilty at this point. To try to set me and BK up as potential Tarqs if ITC turns out to be a good guy (which just according to the odds is very likely) sounds very suspicious to me.

I have pointed out numerous times to you why it would be a HORRIBLE logical strategy for a Tarq (or 2) as Consul to avoid amking an arrest, but you refuse to listen. instead you keep trying to paint me into a corner of suspicion. Which instead only brings suspicion on yourself.

[Antmeister]

I still don't really know who to trust right now, but these individuals seem to be safe picks.
ELECT HOOPUS GUYUS FOR CONSUL
ELECT NARCIZUS FOR CONSULSince Barkeepus and KWhitus claim to be upstanding members of the Senate, I am warily going to choose to:
VOTE IMUS CREWUS FOR EXECUTION

And I hope we can learn of his allegiance with the execution so that I will know if I can go to sleep feeling much safer or to watch my back for the traitors among us.

[Autumn]

Originally Posted by Passacaglia

I guess I meant from the living -- what are the major controversies, and what are the arguments for each side?

Welcome Senator Passacaglia. There is an issue of importance that you could address. Your absence from the Senate has caused some concern. You are one of the wealthiest members of our group, and therefore hold great power. We do not know whether you have been using your wealth to aid us or harm us.

But the deadline grows very near. If you want to vouch your loyalty to the Senate very clearly, you can do so. Today only Dodgerus Chickus and you have remain to bid among the wealthiest of our group. There is a dangerous mercenary out there, named Furio Fuirious or something? If you pledge to bid for his services today, and do not use him to kill anyone tomorrow, your loyalty will be very clear to us I think. If you refuse to pledge for his servcies, especially if he kills someone tomorrow, then I would consider your loyalty very much in question.

So this is a vital task you could take on for us and join the ranks of the loyal Senators, if you act quickly before hte deadline.

[hoopsguy]

Originally Posted by Schmidty

Can someone show me where the current people for hire are posted? I'm not being lazy, I just can't seem to find it.

Don't have the post # handy, but I pulled this earlier today:

Day 4:
Maximus Maximus, ex-legionnaire
Vitus Avidus, ex-legionnaire
Durus Pimpus, dealer in sexual slaves
Macro Gothicus, barbarian turned citizen for his service during wartime
Balbus Senna, political philosopher from Corsica
Faustus Felix, owner of many horses
Bonus Oceanus, owner of many horses
Ardentus Enthusiastus
Schmidtyus Schmidtyus

[Antmeister]

Originally Posted by KWhit

You're pushing really hard to target me (and now possibly BK) as a Tarq. Especially when you say "If another innocent dies today...". It is quite likely that ITC is innocent. We have NOTHING to go on - no way to tell who might be innocent and who might be guilty at this point. To try to set me and BK up as potential Tarqs if ITC turns out to be a good guy (which just according to the odds is very likely) sounds very suspicious to me.

I have pointed out numerous times to you why it would be a HORRIBLE logical strategy for a Tarq (or 2) as Consul to avoid amking an arrest, but you refuse to listen. instead you keep trying to paint me into a corner of suspicion. Which instead only brings suspicion on yourself.

Well the fact that you are not trying to ignore me and are constantly trying to state you side of the case also says alot. If it is flawed, why argue against it at all since everyone else will see it as flawed logic as well.

[Schmidty]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Don't have the post # handy, but I pulled this earlier today:

Day 4:
Maximus Maximus, ex-legionnaire
Vitus Avidus, ex-legionnaire
Durus Pimpus, dealer in sexual slaves
Macro Gothicus, barbarian turned citizen for his service during wartime
Balbus Senna, political philosopher from Corsica
Faustus Felix, owner of many horses
Bonus Oceanus, owner of many horses
Ardentus Enthusiastus
Schmidtyus Schmidtyus

I thank you kindly.

[hoopsguy]

Antmeister, welcome to WW. Good to see some paranoia and suspicion kick in

In all seriousness, I'm having a blast playing with the new(er) players so far this game.

[Autumn]

Well, that makes me feel a bit less worried. Several of the members of the Senate I trust most had not voted yet, and were making me wonder what they might know.

Like Kayus Whitus I think it's very possible ITC is innocent. It seems clear that the vote is going to go through at this point though, minus some sort of last minute changes.

I am actually very suspicious of Antus Meisterus right now. His behavior sounds like someone working up to instigate suspicion. His behavior would make most sense if as a traitor he knew that Imus was innocent, and wanted to lay the groundwork for making the consuls look bad in the morning. That makes me actually more certain of Imus's innocence, so I'll retain my vote to free him even though it seems clear he will be killed. If he is guilty, I'm sure that will cast doubt on me, but none of the people I suspect as traitors have tried very hard to argue his innocence, so I think perhaps theyh're glad to let him die.

[Autumn]

I guess I had the names wrong of the services. I would liek to publicly ask Passacaglia to bid for the service of the guy that kills people, if someone can remind me who that is.

[hoopsguy]

Pretty sure it is this guy

Macro Gothicus, barbarian turned citizen for his service during wartime

although Ironhead should be able to 100% confirm. I based my earlier "rich suggestions" post on it being him.

[Lorena]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Antmeister, welcome to WW. Good to see some paranoia and suspicion kick in

In all seriousness, I'm having a blast playing with the new(er) players so far this game.

I was hoping some of you would give him a harder time... c'mon man. Where's blade when you need him?!

Alright, the kids need to eat and I need to take a nap. Hopefully we got it right today.