Werewolf L Kate Beckinsale - day 7, deadline Thursday 10pm Eastern Time

[Neon_Chaos]

I really thought that in light of the misfired PM by DC, st.cronin should have just removed her from the game to avoid any confusion.

As it is, we are indeed metagaming a bit, and I feel bad having to vote via metagaming. Anyway, it has to be done, seeing KWhit's analysis of the logic of DC's message... and the fact that there isn't a "reply to all" button.

VOTE OLLIEGIRL

[DaddyTorgo]

another option would be (if dc was a wolf) to randomly reassign that wolf among the remaining players?

reshuffle as it were...

[Schmidty]

Originally Posted by Gonzo

Strong evidence against her, though.

Yeah, but I am always scaed of the "obvious" choice. No where else to go right now, I guess.

Vote Oliegirl

[Neon_Chaos]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

another option would be (if dc was a wolf) to randomly reassign that wolf among the remaining players?

reshuffle as it were...

Then that would be meta-GM'ing. I doubt that wolf roles would be shuffled midway through the game.

[Telle]

From how things happened, I have to think the Oliegirl is either a wolf or a special character. If it's the latter, I strongly suggest she speak up and be prepared to offer some amount of evidence. Otherwise, it would probably be prudent to lynch her as a "just in case" measure.

[KWhit]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

another option would be (if dc was a wolf) to randomly reassign that wolf among the remaining players?

reshuffle as it were...

Yeah, but I think that would really screw up the game - all prior analysis, voting patterns, etc. would be thrown out the window.

And who knows? We may be wrong and there's another explanation, but at this point it is by far the best choice for lynch tonight, IMO (unless we get some new info during the day today).

[KWhit]

Originally Posted by Telle

From how things happened, I have to think the Oliegirl is either a wolf or a special character. If it's the latter, I strongly suggest she speak up and be prepared to offer some amount of evidence. Otherwise, it would probably be prudent to lynch her as a "just in case" measure.

True. It's entirely possible she's the mad scientist. That might make things really confusing if we lynch her and she turns out to be human, but cest la vie.

[cartman]

I'm still trying to figure out who stole my hanky.

[cartman]

Dola

Or if it was even stolen at all.

[Alan T]

This thread is almost as dead as I am today!

[JHandley]

Wait till 20 minutes to deadline.

[oliegirl]

There isnt' much I can say to defend myself because I've only been in the game for 24 hours...I realize DC was here, but I swear I'm not a wolf...wouldn't it make more sense to scan me tonight? I went with my gut based on what I had read through the whole thread yesterday, and obviously I was wrong but so were a bunch of other people. And it doesn't seem right to lynch me based on things that DC said or did because I'm not her. If I didn't think it would get me kicked out of the game I'm cut and paste the PM that I received asking me to be a replacement and describing my role - which is just villager/normal person - nothing special. I'm not a wolf and I'm not the mad scientist.

[JHandley]

I'm the rookie here, so I gotta ask. How has something like this been handled in the past?

Like I said before, I don't like it, I'm morally against any kind of outside interference affecting a game. But, we can't put the toothpaste back in the tube. It comes down to this for me. Is there any situation where a player is allowed PM contact with other players when they aren't a wolf?

[Gonzo]

Originally Posted by oliegirl

I realize DC was here, but I swear I'm not a wolf...wouldn't it make more sense to scan me tonight?

How do you know you haven't already been scanned? If people were asking for you to be scanned yesterday I feel its quite likely you have.

[oliegirl]

Originally Posted by Gonzo

How do you know you haven't already been scanned? If people were asking for you to be scanned yesterday I feel its quite likely you have.

Because at 10:42 I posted and said to go ahead and scan me b/c I'm not a wolf, but the PM's had already been sent out. Plus, and most importantly, if I had been scanned then the scanner would know I'm not a wolf.

[JHandley]

Originally Posted by oliegirl

Because at 10:42 I posted and said to go ahead and scan me b/c I'm not a wolf, but the PM's had already been sent out. Plus, and most importantly, if I had been scanned then the scanner would know I'm not a wolf.

This seems to be a common plea from people on the block and I don't understand it. Waiting for you to be scanned does us no good. We don't know who the seer is, so the only way for waiting for you to be scanned does any good is if the seer outs themselves. There's no way a seer is going to out themselves to save a villager. Now, when it gets late in the game, day 8 I imagine, then I can understand the seer outting themselves to give a full list of who we can trust. But right now, there's simply no way a scan tonight accomplishes anything.

[Telle]

Originally Posted by JHandley

This seems to be a common plea from people on the block and I don't understand it. Waiting for you to be scanned does us no good. We don't know who the seer is, so the only way for waiting for you to be scanned does any good is if the seer outs themselves. There's no way a seer is going to out themselves to save a villager. Now, when it gets late in the game, day 8 I imagine, then I can understand the seer outting themselves to give a full list of who we can trust. But right now, there's simply no way a scan tonight accomplishes anything.

Agreed. Maybe you're a villager, maybe you're not. But unless you're a special character, we're better off lynching you now than leaving this whole thing lingering.. and even if you have been scanned it's not worth a seer outing himself to save a plain villager at this point in the game.

VOTE OLIEGIRL

[oliegirl]

Originally Posted by JHandley

This seems to be a common plea from people on the block and I don't understand it. Waiting for you to be scanned does us no good. We don't know who the seer is, so the only way for waiting for you to be scanned does any good is if the seer outs themselves. There's no way a seer is going to out themselves to save a villager. Now, when it gets late in the game, day 8 I imagine, then I can understand the seer outting themselves to give a full list of who we can trust. But right now, there's simply no way a scan tonight accomplishes anything.

True, but if I had been scanned then I would have someone sticking up for me. I'm telling you guys I'm not a wolf. I don't care what DC did or said or how it looks, I'm NOT a wolf!!! If you lynch me you will be down another villager.

Schmidty has been very quiet today...he commented that the "oliegirl vote" seemed very "bandwagony, kind of like the Ant vote", but nonetheless he voted for me. Doesn't that tell you guys something? Schmidty is not a follower, he is one of the most outspoken members of this board, but yet here he is, admitting that the vote against me is a bandwagon and he has no reason to vote for me, but he did it anyway.

VOTE SCHMIDTY

[path12]

Originally Posted by JHandley

But right now, there's simply no way a scan tonight accomplishes anything.

It does if they find a wolf. If a seer has found a wolf, I would expect them to let us know.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by oliegirl

True, but if I had been scanned then I would have someone sticking up for me. I'm telling you guys I'm not a wolf. I don't care what DC did or said or how it looks, I'm NOT a wolf!!! If you lynch me you will be down another villager.

Schmidty has been very quiet today...he commented that the "oliegirl vote" seemed very "bandwagony, kind of like the Ant vote", but nonetheless he voted for me. Doesn't that tell you guys something? Schmidty is not a follower, he is one of the most outspoken members of this board, but yet here he is, admitting that the vote against me is a bandwagon and he has no reason to vote for me, but he did it anyway.

VOTE SCHMIDTY

interesting point

[hoopsguy]

Barkeep49 - dead for 0.5 days

Cronin, can you bring back the dead guys? I'm getting bored following this during the day.

K thx.

[KWhit]

I agree that it is very very quiet.

Too quiet.

[oliegirl]

I probably won't be on tonight, I have plans, but I'll try to check in if I can on my phone. But please reconsider and look at Schmidty and Neon Chaos...I have hunches about both of them. They both posted to vote for me and basically admitted they had no reason to but since everyone else was they would just join in. Yes, we have "bandwagon votes" in day 1 and 2 sometimes, but come on...at this point you should have a damn good reason for voting for someone. If they REALLY thought I was a wolf it seems that they would have come out with posts from DC that incriminate her, something more than the PM fiasco, but that is all they have. That is all anyone who has voted for me today has.

I've been saying it all day, I'm not a wolf.

[RendeR]

Originally Posted by oliegirl

I probably won't be on tonight, I have plans, but I'll try to check in if I can on my phone. But please reconsider and look at Schmidty and Neon Chaos...I have hunches about both of them. They both posted to vote for me and basically admitted they had no reason to but since everyone else was they would just join in. Yes, we have "bandwagon votes" in day 1 and 2 sometimes, but come on...at this point you should have a damn good reason for voting for someone. If they REALLY thought I was a wolf it seems that they would have come out with posts from DC that incriminate her, something more than the PM fiasco, but that is all they have. That is all anyone who has voted for me today has.

I've been saying it all day, I'm not a wolf.

Thats just it, based on the way things have gone down in this game we DON'T have a clue about anyone at this point. After 2 no lynches, one lynched wolf and one lynched human, all the night kills have eliminated the real suspects already. We're basically sitting on a day 1 again with no real knowledge to go on.

[oliegirl]

I was reading back to what KWhit said when he pointed the finger at me last night and something dawned on me. IF DC was a wolf, then when she dropped out and St. Cronin came to me - wouldnt' he have switched some roles around, knowing that the "incident" made it look like DC was a wolf?

Maybe there is something going on with DC and Ant...DC said she wasn't that into the game, and Ant was very quiet until he was lynched last night...maybe they have something going on and that is why DC just said forget it when the whole incident happened...

I've given you 2 names to be suspicious of, Schmidty and Neon Chaos. Go back through the posts and look into them, I'm telling you one of them is a wolf.

[RendeR]

I have to believe Cronin wouldn't just leave a sitting duck wolf out there to be lynched right off the game like that. What would be the point? Would be simpler to remove DC and just say we caught another one by accident.

By bringing OG in like this I think he almost HAD to change that role or move it to another player.

The logic makes sense for voting OG tonight, but something about it just stinks.

VOTE SCHMIDTY

[Schmidty]

Originally Posted by oliegirl

True, but if I had been scanned then I would have someone sticking up for me. I'm telling you guys I'm not a wolf. I don't care what DC did or said or how it looks, I'm NOT a wolf!!! If you lynch me you will be down another villager.

Schmidty has been very quiet today...he commented that the "oliegirl vote" seemed very "bandwagony, kind of like the Ant vote", but nonetheless he voted for me. Doesn't that tell you guys something? Schmidty is not a follower, he is one of the most outspoken members of this board, but yet here he is, admitting that the vote against me is a bandwagon and he has no reason to vote for me, but he did it anyway.

VOTE SCHMIDTY

As I've said numerous times, I freaking work graveyard shift, and I'm on PST. I woke up today at 1 p.m. PST and had to take my daughter to the doctor.

I have nothing to defend myself for, and nothing to say. If you want to kill me for nothing, go for it. I'm a villager.

[Schmidty]

Originally Posted by RendeR

I have to believe Cronin wouldn't just leave a sitting duck wolf out there to be lynched right off the game like that. What would be the point? Would be simpler to remove DC and just say we caught another one by accident.


VOTE SCHMIDTY

I agree with your statement, but I have no idea why you would vote for me either. I'd like to see some good reasons other than "He's quiet and not around" (which I've explained), so I can at least defend myself from something.

[Schmidty]

Double Dola.

I'm going to mow the lawn right now, but I'll leave myself in the thread, and check back in when I'm done (like an hour).

[KWhit]

Originally Posted by RendeR

I have to believe Cronin wouldn't just leave a sitting duck wolf out there to be lynched right off the game like that. What would be the point? Would be simpler to remove DC and just say we caught another one by accident.

By bringing OG in like this I think he almost HAD to change that role or move it to another player.

The logic makes sense for voting OG tonight, but something about it just stinks.

I agree that it stinks. I don't like it at all.

But I don't think cronin moved roles around without telling us he did something like that because it would change the whole game. Past voting records and posts would be shot all to hell. It would kill any analysis that we would try to do.

Maybe I'm wrong, but logically, OG has the higher likelyhood of being a wolf right now than anyone else. She is the best choice for the reasons I laid out. I could totally be wrong, but I feel confident that absent any other strong evidence, the best choice for lynch tonight is Oliegirl.

[oliegirl]

Originally Posted by KWhit

I agree that it stinks. I don't like it at all.

But I don't think cronin moved roles around without telling us he did something like that because it would change the whole game. Past voting records and posts would be shot all to hell. It would kill any analysis that we would try to do.

Maybe I'm wrong, but logically, OG has the higher likelyhood of being a wolf right now than anyone else. She is the best choice for the reasons I laid out. I could totally be wrong, but I feel confident that absent any other strong evidence, the best choice for lynch tonight is Oliegirl.

But isn't that exactly where you guys say you are - basically on day 1 without a read on anyone???? You are proving your own point! Maybe you don't have a read on anyone b/c cronin pulled a fast one...maybe this is all part of some grand scheme he came up with - it is werewolf after all. All eyes have been on me today and no one has taken the time to look at anyone else, yet every time I make a post defending myself someone says "yeah, you are right". How is that a good strategy?

I'm telling you again, I'm not a wolf!

[path12]

Been swamped today. Main thing that bothers me on the OG vote is that nobody has come out to defend much at all today.

[JHandley]

I need something more than her word for it to make me switch my vote. If I recall, Chief Rum told us he was a villager, too. There's nothing about this that isn't shitty. But every single one of us will adamantly claim to be a villager right up until the noose is tightened.

[path12]

Dola, out again. Back before deadline.

[JHandley]

Just to reiterate. If someone can explain to me a logical, reasonable and legal reason for one of us to message other players, I'd love to hear it.

[KWhit]

Originally Posted by JHandley

Just to reiterate. If someone can explain to me a logical, reasonable and legal reason for one of us to message other players, I'd love to hear it.

In a simple game like this, it is very rare for there to be a rule that allows a villager to PM any else in the game.

Occasionally, there are two people whose role is called The Brothers or somesuch like that and they are able to pm each other. But those roles are pretty seldomly included and really never allow you to PM more than just one other specific person.

[tanglewood]

I don't think Olliegirl is a wolf:

1) I believe that if Dodgerchick had a role, she would have stayed in the game rather than walk away

2) If Dodgerchick had received a PM saying she was a wolf, that would list who her fellow wolves were. To me this makes it highly unlikely that she would then enter 3 names from a different PM, by typing or copying as you cannot reply to all, and send it assuming this PM was being sent to her fellow wolves.

Two players I would like to look at today:

1) Neon Chaos on day two was at one point 5-2 in the lead with an hour to go to deadline. Of the final seven votes, five were for Barkeep, one for him and one for Alan T. Barkeep we know now was human. Were the wolves mobilising to save one of their own? It has to be considered seriously. Also consider that at the time Barkeep was attacking Alan T who had unwittingly at the time presented to the village the wolf Chief Rum. If Barkeep was lynched and turned human more credence could have been placed on his criticism of Alan T and help get him lynched, thus possibly saving Chief Rum.

2) If we consider Neon Chaos as fishy, then we must look at Render, who was prominently involved in the day two vote, switching from Neon Chaos to Barkeep late on to tie. He also voted for me on day three late on before being the last player to switch to an already doomed Chief Rum.

[DaddyTorgo]

dinner and then i'll be back to post

[path12]

Looks like it's gonna be Oliegirl, which although I'm not convinced I absolutely see the logic on the lynch. However, I think we need to focus on voting records tomorrow.

VOTE OLIEGIRL

Sorry Olie, you just stepped into a tough spot.

Well, unless you're really a wolf, in which you still stepped into a tough spot

[DaddyTorgo]

I like the idea of render...we were all hot n bothered about him for a while and then kind of dropped it.

and schmidty seems overly defensive in his post about graveyard shift and all.

Either way tangle, I see your point about DC/OG

UNVOTE OLLIEGIRL

[tanglewood]

Originally Posted by RendeR

I have to believe Cronin wouldn't just leave a sitting duck wolf out there to be lynched right off the game like that. What would be the point? Would be simpler to remove DC and just say we caught another one by accident.

By bringing OG in like this I think he almost HAD to change that role or move it to another player.

The logic makes sense for voting OG tonight, but something about it just stinks.

VOTE SCHMIDTY

If Cronin swapped the roles around either when DC quit, or after it came out or after the PM or at any time after the game started, I will never play another WW game moderated by him again. Which is why I am 100% confident that he didn't do something so idiotic.

[tanglewood]

Originally Posted by path12

Looks like it's gonna be Oliegirl, which although I'm not convinced I absolutely see the logic on the lynch. However, I think we need to focus on voting records tomorrow.

VOTE OLIEGIRL

Sorry Olie, you just stepped into a tough spot.

Well, unless you're really a wolf, in which you still stepped into a tough spot

No offence, but voting for someone because "it looks like they'll be lynched anyway" is the stupidest reason possible. You would be better of abstaining.

[Gonzo]

Originally Posted by tanglewood

1) I believe that if Dodgerchick had a role, she would have stayed in the game rather than walk away

That doesn't make much sense. If she was a wolf, surely it'd be a big deal that she accidentally PMed random people saying that she was? I can't see her PMing people telling them she was a wolf if she didn't recieve a PM saying she was a wolf in the first place.

[DaddyTorgo]

VOTE RENDER

[LoneStarGirl]

Originally Posted by path12

Been swamped today. Main thing that bothers me on the OG vote is that nobody has come out to defend much at all today.

Path you have been very under the radar this game, maybe we should look at you.

[LoneStarGirl]

Originally Posted by tanglewood

I don't think Olliegirl is a wolf:

1) I believe that if Dodgerchick had a role, she would have stayed in the game rather than walk away

2) If Dodgerchick had received a PM saying she was a wolf, that would list who her fellow wolves were. To me this makes it highly unlikely that she would then enter 3 names from a different PM, by typing or copying as you cannot reply to all, and send it assuming this PM was being sent to her fellow wolves.

Two players I would like to look at today:

1) Neon Chaos on day two was at one point 5-2 in the lead with an hour to go to deadline. Of the final seven votes, five were for Barkeep, one for him and one for Alan T. Barkeep we know now was human. Were the wolves mobilising to save one of their own? It has to be considered seriously. Also consider that at the time Barkeep was attacking Alan T who had unwittingly at the time presented to the village the wolf Chief Rum. If Barkeep was lynched and turned human more credence could have been placed on his criticism of Alan T and help get him lynched, thus possibly saving Chief Rum.

2) If we consider Neon Chaos as fishy, then we must look at Render, who was prominently involved in the day two vote, switching from Neon Chaos to Barkeep late on to tie. He also voted for me on day three late on before being the last player to switch to an already doomed Chief Rum.

Tanglewood... you have never played with Dodgerchick I believe and she is VERY hard on herself. She has actually taken herself out of three games that I remember, and she did have an important role in one of them. That is just her.

I also think that Neon Chaos and Render are terrific targets for a vote tonight, probably better than olie girl. But I think Gonzo has gone unnoticed by most people so far so we should look at him as well. He was the only one that wouldn't believe alant for being Van Helsing and some of the things he has posted has really nagged at me

[LoneStarGirl]

I am actually about to get in the car to drive back home to Little Rock, which is 2.5 hours away. So I definitely wont be around for lynch. I am going to put in my vote for somebody whom I think a lot of people will also vote for, so I wont be wasting my vote on Gonzo again today.

vote Render

[JHandley]

This is quickly becoming a trend, isn't it?

Early votes the after the previous night actions go largely undefended until the closing hours of the next day and then suddenly accusations start flying.

This observation means nothing as it happened yesterday to Ant who was a villager. Just think it's odd.

[Gonzo]

Originally Posted by LoneStarGirl

But I think Gonzo has gone unnoticed by most people so far so we should look at him as well.

Unnoticed? I almost got lynched yesterday!

[tanglewood]

Originally Posted by LoneStarGirl

Tanglewood... you have never played with Dodgerchick I believe and she is VERY hard on herself. She has actually taken herself out of three games that I remember, and she did have an important role in one of them. That is just her.

I also think that Neon Chaos and Render are terrific targets for a vote tonight, probably better than olie girl. But I think Gonzo has gone unnoticed by most people so far so we should look at him as well. He was the only one that wouldn't believe alant for being Van Helsing and some of the things he has posted has really nagged at me

I have played with Dodgerchick several times before and know she is very hard on herself. However to me it simply doesn't make sense how she could be a wolf. If she was a wolf then the she would have had to open up a different PM to the one listing her fellow wolves, which would obviously clearly state it is a wolf role pm as opposed to the generic one we all recieved. Then deliberately copied each of the names of all the players from the generic PM to the PM she sent and sent it off, all without realising that the list she was copying and sending was different to the list of wolves that she had been sent earlier. I think that is highly unlikely. I think it is highly more likely that for whatever reason DC thought she was a wolf and PMed the players CC'd in the start pm. I must admit that when I saw the PM had been cc'd I assumed I was a wolf until I read the message. I have never been in a game where ordinary villagers are sent PMs that have been cc'd to other players.