POTUS 2016 General Election Discussion Thread

[Atocep]

10 years from now Trump will swear he didn't run for president.

[mckerney]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

Trump called a press conference to complain about a fire marshal

Just goes to show Trump doesn't understand how to keep Americans safe.

EDIT: Wait, the fire marshal he's complaining about today is a different one than he was complaining about last weekend?

[whomario]

Originally Posted by Atocep

10 years from now Trump will swear he didn't run for president.

Maybe he´s pulling a Borat on us ...

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Umm ... I think the "opposite" in the name stemmed from it's literal position in the paper, on the page "opposite" the traditional editorial page.

The opinions are not necessarily contrarian.

Correct.

[rowech]

Assange says emails they have show her arming ISIS and then lying under oath about it.

[JPhillips]

One of these things is different than the others...

[larrymcg421]

Wow at those 1988 and 1992 numbers for the Dems. Dukakis really blew it after the convention.

[albionmoonlight]

Originally Posted by rowech

Assange says emails they have show her arming ISIS and then lying under oath about it.

Then let him put it out there and let's debate it.

[Easy Mac]

Trump keeps fucking that chicken.

Trump says anti-terror border policy is what really bothered Khizr Khan.

[JPhillips]

Originally Posted by mckerney

Just goes to show Trump doesn't understand how to keep Americans safe.

EDIT: Wait, the fire marshal he's complaining about today is a different one than he was complaining about last weekend?

Fire marshals have a well known liberal bias.

[larrymcg421]

I think Trump loses a point every time he talks about Khan.

[Suicane75]

I'm getting this weird feeling in the back of my mind that Trump doesn't actually want to win.

[nol]

Shame on the bias mainstream media for only covering Khan and not Pat Smith ! Gotta hear both sides!1

http://www.mediaite.com/tv/fox-frien...t-one-problem/

[mckerney]

Originally Posted by nol

Shame on the bias mainstream media for only covering Khan and not Pat Smith ! Gotta hear both sides!1

http://www.mediaite.com/tv/fox-frien...t-one-problem/

Plus the whole difference that Hillary hasn't spent the last 4 days attacking Pat Smith in the media being what's been covered with Trump and Khan. Minor detail to Fox News I guess though.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by nol

Shame on the bias mainstream media for only covering Khan and not Pat Smith ! Gotta hear both sides!1

http://www.mediaite.com/tv/fox-frien...t-one-problem/

I think it was how it was covered. Smith was heavily criticized for her speech. Heck you even had a writer talk about how he wanted to beat her to death for it. And those that did treat it more respectfully played it out as her being manipulated by the GOP.

[Edward64]

Enjoying the Khan vs Trump flare-up so far. Wonder what the Trump kids really think (and also about the step-mom).

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

I think it was how it was covered. Smith was heavily criticized for her speech. Heck you even had a writer talk about how he wanted to beat her to death for it. And those that did treat it more respectfully played it out as her being manipulated by the GOP.

And Trump said he wanted to punch the people that talked bad about him at the DNC convention (which would include Khan).


There's still a huge fundamental difference in the two speeches. One is the republicans still trying to blame Clinton for something that $20+ million has been spent on trying to get anyone to find her at fault and failed. Even their own biased investigation couldn't place blame on her.

The other speech was an attack of an actual policy Trump has talked about.

It would be absurd for the two to be treated the same by the media.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Atocep

And Trump said he wanted to punch the people that talked bad about him at the DNC convention (which would include Khan).


There's still a huge fundamental difference in the two speeches. One is the republicans still trying to blame Clinton for something that $20+ million has been spent on trying to get anyone to find her at fault and failed. Even their own biased investigation couldn't place blame on her.

The other speech was an attack of an actual policy Trump has talked about.

It would be absurd for the two to be treated the same by the media.

I'm not defending Trump. I'm saying there is a heavy bias in how things are reported. Are you really arguing that the media is neutral?

Both parents held political opinions that relates to their sons death. I understand people who think Pat Smith is wrong in her views. Just as I understand people who think Khan is wrong in his. I don't think either was "manipulated" into holding those views.

[RainMaker]

Like I'm voting for Hillary in the election and I can see the enormous bias there is in reporting today. Take a look at the Twitter feeds of the people who are reporting on the election and you can get where they stand politically.

You also have activist sites like Vox being treated as news.

[mckerney]

Originally Posted by Atocep

And Trump said he wanted to punch the people that talked bad about him at the DNC convention (which would include Khan).


There's still a huge fundamental difference in the two speeches. One is the republicans still trying to blame Clinton for something that $20+ million has been spent on trying to get anyone to find her at fault and failed. Even their own biased investigation couldn't place blame on her.

The other speech was an attack of an actual policy Trump has talked about.

It would be absurd for the two to be treated the same by the media.

The content of the speeches aren't why this is still a story though. This is how Hillary responded to being asked about Pat Smith. The media isn't talking about the speech at this point, the response is due to Trump insinuating, "there's something going on with the mother," and that he'd made sacrifices because he'd hired people to make himself more money, and then continued to double and triple down on the statement. If Trump had given a similar answer about Khan saying something along the lines of, "My heart goes out to those two for the loss of their son, and I haven't made that sort of sacrifice but my position is so that other families won't have to," then the Khan family would have seen little to no coverage beyond that.

[SirFozzie]

Four days to call the father of a man who died saving his fellow americans a terrorist sympathizer.

New lows, being established daily.

Trump says anti-terror border policy is what really bothered Khizr Khan.

[SirFozzie]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

I'm not defending Trump. I'm saying there is a heavy bias in how things are reported. Are you really arguing that the media is neutral?

No, I'm arguing that the media has a reality bias. And as we all know, reality has a liberal bias

[mckerney]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

Four days to call the father of a man who died saving his fellow americans a terrorist sympathizer.

New lows, being established daily.

Trump says anti-terror border policy is what really bothered Khizr Khan.

Between that and calling Hillary the devil tonight someone is not happy about Monday's post convention poll numbers.

[NobodyHere]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Like I'm voting for Hillary in the election and I can see the enormous bias there is in reporting today. Take a look at the Twitter feeds of the people who are reporting on the election and you can get where they stand politically.

You also have activist sites like Vox being treated as news.

Just watch a few minutes of Fox News or listen to Rush and you'll change your mind.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by NobodyHere

Just watch a few minutes of Fox News or listen to Rush and you'll change your mind.

They are bias as well. But 5% of the media being in the bag for Trump means 95% isn't.

[albionmoonlight]

Originally Posted by mckerney

The content of the speeches aren't why this is still a story though. . . . If Trump had given a similar answer about Khan saying something along the lines of, "My heart goes out to those two for the loss of their son, and I haven't made that sort of sacrifice but my position is so that other families won't have to," then the Khan family would have seen little to no coverage beyond that.

This might be what scares me the most about Trump. The proper response to Khan is politics 101. Even simpler than that, really. And Trump--even in his own self-interest--couldn't do it.

If Trump can't take an obviously correct action when it is in his own interest, I am worried about when he has to make a hard decision and it is our interests at stake.

[flere-imsaho]

Originally Posted by NobodyHere

Just watch a few minutes of Fox News or listen to Rush and you'll change your mind.

Leave Lee / Peart / Lifeson out of this.

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by larrymcg421

Wow at those 1988 and 1992 numbers for the Dems. Dukakis really blew it after the convention.

Yeah. IIRC, Dukakis had like a 10 point lead at one point in the race before crapping the bed.

[Dutch]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

This might be what scares me the most about Trump. The proper response to Khan is politics 101. Even simpler than that, really. And Trump--even in his own self-interest--couldn't do it.

If Trump can't take an obviously correct action when it is in his own interest, I am worried about when he has to make a hard decision and it is our interests at stake.

I'm with you on that.I so desperately want to root for him but shit like this irritates me about him...and makes him come off as untrustworthy. I am afraid of his lasting legacy for "conservatives". So he still doesn't have my vote.

[Neon_Chaos]

“While I feel deeply for the loss of his son, Mr. Khan who has never met me, has no right to stand in front of millions of people and claim I have never read the Constitution, (which is false) and say many other inaccurate things. If I become President, I will make America safe again.”

Apparently, he jumped past the first ammendment?

[digamma]

Maybe, given his litigiousness, he'll sue Mr. Khan for slander.

Oh wait, truth is an absolute defense to slander.

[mckerney]

Originally Posted by Neon_Chaos

Apparently, he jumped past the first ammendment?

Trump's more an Article XII guy when it comes to the Constitution.

[Easy Mac]

"Would your father be willing to apologize and move on?" co-host Norah O'Donnell asked.
"I think that's a great question for him, and he has by calling them a hero," {Eric} Trump responded. "In terms of the one question -- whether you've made a sacrifice -- I think my father has. Now, that's certainly not the ultimate sacrifice, the ultimate sacrifice is a soldier dying for this nation, dying to protect the three of us, no doubt about it --"

How is this in any way a coherent response to anyone not associated with the Trump family?

I feel like the more idiotic he and his team sounds, the more they're pounded on for making no sense, the more it just strengthens his grip on his supporters. I'm honestly starting to worry about what might happen if he does mercifully lose the election. I could see many "patriot" groups really go off the deep end.

[albionmoonlight]

*phone rings*
John Kasich: Hello?
Paul Ryan: Hey John. So...uh...
Kasich: Fuck off.
*hangs up*

— Patton Oswalt (@pattonoswalt) August 2, 2016

[miked]

Originally Posted by Dutch

I'm with you on that.I so desperately want to root for him but shit like this irritates me about him...and makes him come off as untrustworthy. I am afraid of his lasting legacy for "conservatives". So he still doesn't have my vote.

I don't understand why you "want to root" for him other than the fact that he represents a party you seem to think represents your interests. Trump has never been about anybody other than himself, and we are all supposed to believe that suddenly he cares about all of our problems. Hillary may be in it for herself, but she also has a life of being a public servant, and at least if she has done it for her own glory, she has helped countless numbers of people...more than you or I. Trump pretty much had his wealth handed to him, fucked over most everyone he's worked with, and until about 8 years ago was against nearly everything your party stood for. I just don't get the appeal or "rooting" interest.

[Butter]

Originally Posted by rowech

Assange says emails they have show her arming ISIS and then lying under oath about it.

So let's say this is real. Let's say the proof is unassailable.

Two questions...
Does she drop out?
OR
If you are Obama, do you pardon her?
Would that even make a difference?

For my part, it wouldn't surprise me if there is something that could be argued to be proof, but could be lawyered effectively to not be foolproof.

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

Then let him put it out there and let's debate it.

Seriously. If they had them, what's he waiting for?

[SteveMax58]

Originally Posted by Suicane75

I'm getting this weird feeling in the back of my mind that Trump doesn't actually want to win.

I've been of that opinion for a number of months now.

He isn't stupid, literally. And as a matter of fact his GOP candidacy shows that he isn't tone deaf (to his electorate). I really think the job of being president isn't interesting to him. The grind of it, the policy discussions, the daily briefings, etc.

I think we'll find out in a few years that he said whatever came to mind because he didn't want the job. But even if it isn't true....we'll probably hear that anyway. Shurg

[molson]

Originally Posted by Dutch

I'm with you on that.I so desperately want to root for him but shit like this irritates me about him...and makes him come off as untrustworthy. I am afraid of his lasting legacy for "conservatives". So he still doesn't have my vote.

As a military guy, are you at all put off by Trump's attacks on McCain and this Khan family (and I think there's been a few other incidents)? Military families have always been such a strong part of the Republican base, I don't understand why Trump has been able to keep so many of them when he expresses so much hostility towards people who have served, and their families.

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by Butter_of_69

So let's say this is real. Let's say the proof is unassailable.

Two questions...
Does she drop out?
OR
If you are Obama, do you pardon her?
Would that even make a difference?

For my part, it wouldn't surprise me if there is something that could be argued to be proof, but could be lawyered effectively to not be foolproof.

My layman's impression is that the CIA was using State Department cover to run an operation and HRC knew about it well before the Benghazi attack, but not that Hillary authorized it. In which case, she definitely did lie at the Senate hearing... but I'm not sure a public hearing is where you want to be talking about heavily classified information. Now, if she's actually initiating the mission that would change things (and I think there's a very big question about who exactly is overseeing and authorizing some of these things), but that's not the impression I get of how these things work.

[Dutch]

Originally Posted by molson

As a military guy, are you at all put off by Trump's attacks on McCain and this Khan family (and I think there's been a few other incidents)? Military families have always been such a strong part of the Republican base, I don't understand why Trump has been able to keep so many of them when he expresses so much hostility towards people who have served, and their families.

I'm not a military guy any more.

I'm not supportive of him in a military sense though. I'm more of your new-con and he's not that. He was against the Iraq war when I was for it. I think Hillary is more hawkish, honestly.

I'm for him from a business perspective. I think he might do well for the economy. That's really the only thing that intrugues me about him. But with no vision, even that is kind of, meh.

miked, let me rephrase. I want to root for the party that I have always felt is better for creating growth through privatization. I know I'm just hanging that out there for scrutiny, but it's my belief. More generally, there are a lot of issues I back the right-wing on. More so than the left-wing. I'm for compromise though, I've backed off a lot of my social stances, for instance. But the economy, the debt, the aggressive defense vs passive defense and the protection of American jobs by all means are things I support.

I don't believe, overall, that "we" (my side), picked the right person. The field of 17 was a disastrous approach this cycle. We basically have to compromise by coalition in order to keep the party together and it's not looking so good. So, basically, I am desperate because I want to vote and be a part of the process, I just really dislike Trump so far and well, I've never voted Democratic for the same (ideological) reasons some never vote Republican. So I'm stuck with no vote or a throw-away vote.

[albionmoonlight]

There was a super-delegate proposal floated recently that I liked for both parties.

Superdelegates get no vote unless
(1) No candidate has a majority of pledged delegates by the end of the primaries and
(2) 2/3 of superdelegates vote to "activate" the superdelegates.

That keeps them out of a normal primary. But, in the "break glass in case of emergency" type situation, they are there as a backup.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by Dutch

I don't believe, overall, that "we" (my side), picked the right person. The field of 17 was a disastrous approach this cycle. We basically have to compromise by coalition in order to keep the party together and it's not looking so good. So, basically, I am desperate because I want to vote and be a part of the process, I just really dislike Trump so far and well, I've never voted Democratic for the same (ideological) reasons some never vote Republican. So I'm stuck with no vote or a throw-away vote.

I think it was 538 that stated that if you were able to rank your top 3 preferred candidates and the voting was based off of that then it's highly unlikely Trump wins the nomination. The huge field was what allowed him to get through.

Maine's Ranked Choice voting initiative is really interesting and seems like a far better way of finding the actual candidate of the people.

[JPhillips]

Because Gold Star families aren't the only third rail Trump will grab:

[Atocep]

Holy shit what an ass.

[mckerney]

Originally Posted by Atocep

Holy shit what an ass.

Hey now, that's a purple heart recipient you're calling an ass.



Trump: 'I always wanted to get the Purple Heart. This was much easier' - POLITICO

[albionmoonlight]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

Because Gold Star families aren't the only third rail Trump will grab:

Is this real life?

[corbes]

In all fairness the baby was probably criticizing him.

[cuervo72]

I'm gonna build a yuuuuuge playpen. And I'll get the babies to pay for it!

[NobodyHere]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

Is this real life?

or is this just fantasy