The Thread of the 2009-2010 NBA Season - Page 23

k0ruptr · 02-18-2010, 09:52 PM

wow, great play by Lebron, and now Anthony! wowowowow

1.9 left. Carmelo with the fkn dagger.

Groundhog · 02-18-2010, 09:52 PM

Is it time to quote the Carmello clutch discussion from a page or 2 ago in this thread yet?

k0ruptr · 02-18-2010, 09:53 PM

HOLY !!! wow, james almost made that. SOB.

k0ruptr · 02-18-2010, 09:54 PM

first loss in over a month for the Cavs. haha. these guys are going to be so so good when Jamison starts. geez.

Radii · 02-18-2010, 09:56 PM

Only saw the overtime, but that was damn entertaining.

TroyF · 02-18-2010, 10:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Groundhog

Is it time to quote the Carmello clutch discussion from a page or 2 ago in this thread yet?

Well, Melo did it all in the clutch tonight. He passed the ball multiple times. His spin move on James with the game on the line in regulation should have been an and one. (Lebron still looking for his jock by the way) Then he hit the game winner.

No, he's not bron and never will be. But he's a special player. A very, very special player.

stevew · 02-18-2010, 10:29 PM

Lemme guess. Antawn couldn't play tonight cause the clippers guys didn't report in time? Or was drew gooden at fault?

jbergey22 · 02-18-2010, 10:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Groundhog

Is it time to quote the Carmello clutch discussion from a page or 2 ago in this thread yet?

I dont recall any of that conversation being about how clutch he was.

If I remember correct is was about how he loses interest at times and doesnt seem to want to pass at times with a how athletic they are discussion on the side.

larrymcg421 · 02-18-2010, 11:59 PM

I really hate Rasheed Wallace.

DaddyTorgo · 02-19-2010, 12:05 AM

signing wallace and trading house are/will be the death knell of this team. along with Garnett's knees having collapsed too of course.

whomario · 02-19-2010, 04:57 AM

Robinson is a good pickup imo. Sometimes you have to take risks and go with potential ability instead of staying put with a know commodity, this is one of those cases. Robinson gives them a player than can create his own shot and can break down defenses, something no one outside of Rondo and Pierce could do before.

Rodriguez in New York and playing for D´Antoni

Really glad for the guy, the knicks wanted him for a long time and D´Antoni was a fan of hisas well.

And Milicic gets one last shot apparently, will indeed report to the Timberwolves after Kahn talked to him in New York (he was all set to negotiate a buy out in New York and join a team in Europe to get adjusted before next season) and will get minutes.
I am again hoping for the best, even though i´m no longer holding my breath.

Brewer to the Grizzlies is a good pickup. A shooter would have been better, but with that bench you can´t be picky. Maybe they casn still challenge for the POs.

Charlotte looks like a dangerous team in the first round. But why did those morons try to trade Nazr Mohammed ? The guy has been incredibly productive this year and a solid option at the 5 ... And they wanted to trade him for fringe players ...

For the Rockets for the rest of the year it´ll be interesting what the rotation at SG/SF will look like. I´d bring Ariza off the bench personally, but what do i know.
Hill should pick up quite a few minutes, although i first think that Andersen will play more as well.

Arles · 02-19-2010, 09:32 AM

I don't know about the Suns making out poorly. If they can either keep Amare (talking about an extension @ $14 per) or trade him in the offseason, I think they make out OK. Iguadala has an awful contract and is a SG who can't hit 3s (not exactly a blessing for the Suns' system). And the poo poo platters offered by everyone else left little to be desired.

If Phoenix had traded Amare for a PF with the ceiling of a 7th man (Hickson), what amounts to an early 2nd round pick (Cle's #1 this season) and the old bones of Z - then they would have been bigtime losers. Even the Iguadala swap (which was never confirmed) would have been bad. He would make as much as Amare in the next 4 seasons (if the Suns extended him), shoots 30% from 3 and plays a spot easily replaceable (guard/SF in the Suns system). Heck, Raja Bell, Jared Dudley, 90-year old Grant Hill, Eddie House and numerous others have had career seasons in that spot.

TroyF · 02-19-2010, 09:36 AM

Arles,

The Suns not making a move was incredibly dangerous. You have an injury plagued PF who has a 17 million dollar option for next season. Say Amare has another big injury before the end of the year. You are now going to pay him 17 million dollars next season to sit out and then have to decide weather to pay for an extension or not.

They had chances to get quality players now. If they sign him to the extension, then they win. If he takes off, even if they pull off a sign and trade, they aren't going to come out with as much as they would have if they'd pulled it off now.

whomario · 02-19-2010, 10:16 AM

granted that he had major knee surgery but other than that he had an eye injury, that´s injury plagued ?

Other than that layoff due to the eye injury/surgery he missed only 3 games in the last 4 seasons.

How do you know they won´t get more in a sign and trade than they would have gotten now ? As said, Igoudala is a lateral move at best and no one to build a team around.
The cavs offer ? Pretty sure they get more than that in a sign and trade.

If he just takes off ? Yeah, that´s bad. But then again the Suns at least didn´t take on a player just for the sake of taking on a player. I wouldn´t want Igoudala on my team at that salary for free, much less trade a guy like Stoudemire for him.
And it´s not like i´m high on Stoudemire´s ability either.

sterlingice · 02-19-2010, 10:17 AM

I'm trying to remember if I ever saw a trade for Amare that was worth anything.

SI

Chief Rum · 02-19-2010, 10:22 AM

Sign and trades...

These just aren't common in the NBA anymore; there's probably some reason related to the cap and last CBA. Regardless, I wouldn't count on a sign and trade happening.

TroyF · 02-19-2010, 10:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by whomario

granted that he had major knee surgery but other than that he had an eye injury, that´s injury plagued ?

Other than that layoff due to the eye injury/surgery he missed only 3 games in the last 4 seasons.

How do you know they won´t get more in a sign and trade than they would have gotten now ? As said, Igoudala is a lateral move at best and no one to build a team around.
The cavs offer ? Pretty sure they get more than that in a sign and trade.

If he just takes off ? Yeah, that´s bad. But then again the Suns at least didn´t take on a player just for the sake of taking on a player. I wouldn´t want Igoudala on my team at that salary for free, much less trade a guy like Stoudemire for him.
And it´s not like i´m high on Stoudemire´s ability either.

OK, so how do you put any fans in the seats? Who do you build around? If Amare bolts, they are screwed. If he gets hurt, they are screwed.

As far as Iggy goes, I think he's one of the most underrated players in basketball. If you put him on a team with shooters, his offense will look a lot better. Put him on a team with clankers from the outside and his biggest weakness is exposed. His offense will never be at an elite level because of how he plays on defense. While guys like Melo and Bron pick their spots on when to D up on the best player on the court, Iggy does it every night. What you get is an elite defensive player, a guy who plays 40 minutes a night, a guy who has missed 6 games in 6 years, and a guy who will do every little thing to help you win basketball games.

I don't think the Suns will get anything remotely close to that in a summer trade. If Kerr had pushed the right buttons, I think he could have gotten him. Or they could have shipped him for expirings and an actual real live first round pick so they could start the rebuilding process.

We'll see how it plays out..

Arles · 02-19-2010, 12:17 PM

They had their choice of 2-3 poo platters with either bad contracts, over-rated prospects (ie, Hickson) or end of the first round picks (marginal value at best). If they moved Amare for the Cleveland deal, there's a chance the team's fan base gets fed up and quits watching.

Now, in order for the Suns to "get burnt" - all of the following need to happen:

1. Amare decides not to extend with Phoenix before the offseason (rumors are he wants a 4-year at $14 mil per and the Suns are offering a 2-year at $14 mil per - not all that far off).
2. Amare decides to not pick up his option for $17+ million for next season - more than any team could sign him to in the initial year.
3. Either Miami or New Jersey agree to make him a max FA offer - little chance Chicago (want Bosh), New York (Mike D doesn't get along) or the Clippers (have Griffin) will.
4. Amare agrees to accept that offer instead of working out a sign-and-trade for potentially more money with a team like Houston or other contender.

I would put the chance that all 4 happen at around 15-20% max. Plus, there's some risk with Amare declining his option in that if Miami decides to sign Boozer and the Nets go a different direction - there may not be a $14+ million option for him. Then, he's forced to come back to Phoenix without his $17 million option or take a lot less money somewhere else.

But, even if the "worst case" happens - Amare finishes the season for Phoenix and then signs a max deal with Miami. The Suns then have $39 million on the books for 8 players. They also have a $14 million expiring deal in Jason Richardson. So, they can either sign a $10-12 million FA and deal Richardson for a quality player and picks to a team freeing up salary. Or, they can play through a down next season and end up with a good pick in 2011, only $17-19 million on the cap and decent group of young players + Nash (Dragic, Clark, Lopez, Barbosa, Dudley, Amundson, multiple picks).

Again, giving up the somewhat likely chance to keep Amare for Hickson and the 31st pick or expirings and a mid-round pick from Miami is silly. Moving one of the top offensive forwards in the game for a similar contract SG (Iguodala) doesn't make much sense either - esp when the team already has Barbosa, Richardson, Hill and Dudley and would have no post presence without Amare.

At the end of the day, the Suns were smart to hold on to Amare and they will have numerous options no matter how this offseason plays out. Trading Amare for crap or bad contracts in a panic move gives them significantly fewer options - all for the chance to watch JJ Hickson become Hakim Warrick or get a scrub player at pick 30 in the draft.

TroyF · 02-19-2010, 01:23 PM

Arles,

You make good points. I just don't like it. Even if Hickson sucks (and I do think he does), he's a small contract and has some talent and value on the trade front. We'll see what happens this offseason. I really wouldn't put anything past Amare though. I'd move your odds up over 35%.

I really look at Iggy like I look at Kenyon Martin. Is he overpaid? Yeah. Does he do things that can help a good team win a title? Yeah. If you are going to have an overpaid guy (and if Amare gets the max, you've already said he'd be overpaid earlier in the thread), wouldn't you rather have a guy who never misses a game, plays his ass off night in, night out and does a few things exceptionally well as opposed to a guy who takes nights or weeks off when he isn't feeling it?

Again, we'll see how it plays out.

Arles · 02-19-2010, 02:57 PM

There's always a risk with any situation/move. There's a risk that the Suns moved Amare for Hickson and a pick - Hickson busts and the pick ends up never playing for the team.

I agree that Amare isn't a max player, but $14 mil a season isn't a max contract (and that's what they are talking about now). Plus, if I'm going to slightly overpay, I'd rather it be for an effective PF than an effective SG. The former is a lot harder to find in the NBA.

If the Suns sign Amare to a 4-year extension, I won't be thrilled - but I won't be upset. Pretty much every other moved discussed here involving him would have me be fairly disgusted as a Suns fan.

Arles · 02-19-2010, 04:35 PM

AZ republic is reporting the Suns (Sarver-Kerr) had a good meeting with Amare and the extension talks are back on. Here's what Amare said today:

Quote:

"Obviously, I want to have a sense of security," Stoudemire said. "With that being said, I'm not really going to get into the years and dollar signs right now. Ultimately, we just want to make sure that we both accomplish the decision we make and go from there. We haven't got to an agreement yet but we're getting there."

"I have a certain bond and loyalty in the city of Phoenix," Stoudemire said. "With that being said, staying here would be a great option for me."

The article said there's a good chance that an extension is reached before the offseason hits.

mauchow · 02-19-2010, 05:03 PM

as long as they can put food on their tables for their family

Neon_Chaos · 02-19-2010, 05:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mauboy1

as long as they can put food on their tables for their family

How's Latrell Sprewell supposed to feed his family on a 3-year $21-mil contract!?

whomario · 02-19-2010, 06:47 PM

Lebron James has been averaging 11 Assists over his last 13 games btw (and 7 in the first quarter today) which is kind of ridiculous no matter how much he dominates the ball and even with the 4 TOs a game ... 7 again today. Really an incredible player. Not that it is news, but still hits me every now and then ...

Jamison off the bench for today.

For Washington Andray Blatche really has tons of upside, as does Javale McGee imo (why in the world didn´t he get PT for a team like the Wizards ? I mean, his rookie season wasn´t that bad at about 14/9 with 2+ blocks per 36)

Jamison has been blocked on basically every attempt so far, almost funny

CleBrownsfan · 02-19-2010, 07:51 PM

My god - Jamison is having a horrible game - 0-10 from the field so far. Bad game for the Cavs overall. Z come back please..

jbergey22 · 02-19-2010, 08:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by whomario

For Washington Andray Blatche really has tons of upside, as does Javale McGee imo (why in the world didn´t he get PT for a team like the Wizards ? I mean, his rookie season wasn´t that bad at about 14/9 with 2+ blocks per 36)

Blatche has no consistency at all. He has shown these flashes over the past couple of years but he wont maintain it. Hes basically Gerald Wallace without the toughness.

Radii · 02-20-2010, 02:05 AM

Isiah Thomas was on PTI today and said the following:

"The jury is probably still out on whether I would be a good pro coach or not. I had a good run in Indiana and was on my way to having a good run in New York"

That's unedited and he didn't qualify that statement anymore. LOL?

whomario · 02-20-2010, 11:45 AM

kind of looking forward to see McGrady play again, D´Antoni allready said that he´ll start right away.
Throw in Sergio Rodriguez and and getting even smaller up fron and see what happens

Ironhead · 02-20-2010, 07:45 PM

McGrady absolutely balling in NY tonight. 19 points at the half with 3 assists, including one laser bounce pass up the floor on the break. This is the most unselfish the team has played in months.

whomario · 02-20-2010, 07:48 PM

McGrady with 19 on 7-12 shooting at the half, add in a couple beautiful assists. I´d be so glad if he really would come back. Didn´t look particularly agile, but that is to be expected and he did a great job picking his spots and his basketball-IQ is just so high that i could see him finding his role as a pick and roll specialist and contributing even with lesser athleticism and without great shooting ability.

martin off the bench for now in houston.

Neon_Chaos · 02-20-2010, 08:57 PM

TMac and House are having outstanding debuts for the Knicks.

DaddyTorgo · 02-20-2010, 08:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neon_Chaos

TMac and House are having outstanding debuts for the Knicks.

Neon_Chaos · 02-20-2010, 09:06 PM

Ok, if TMac takes and makes the game winner for this one, the Knicks have officially found a new hero.

whomario · 02-20-2010, 09:08 PM

nice little game between the knicks and thunder, going to OT. Thunder very sloppy on defense, but the knicks did a good job taking advantage of the mismatches they create with that crop of 6´8, 6´9 guys at the 2 and 3 and 4 spots.
Antoni blew it by playing without a PG at the end ...
T-Mac 26/4/4 so far.
eddie house with 19, lee 26.

rodriguez with some good plays as well.

Durant with a bad 2nd half guarded by Gallinari (don´t think that was really the reason though

) but then nails the game-tying 3.

random thought : Eddie House´s release is ridiculous.

Neon_Chaos · 02-20-2010, 09:08 PM

Gallinari, you ass.

Ironhead · 02-20-2010, 09:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neon_Chaos

Gallinari, you ass.

Can't disagree more. The play was defended well and Gallo got a bailout pass from Lee. Was he supposed to make an off balance three from about 27 feet out? It was really just a poor play from D'Antoni out of the timeout.

Ironhead · 02-20-2010, 09:42 PM

Tough loss but that was the best effort the Knicks have shown since early January. Durant was just a killer down the stretch and the Thunder are a good team so I have to hand it to them. I don't see too many more wins the rest of the year because the same glaring problem is there - just no resistance in the paint. If the team shows this effort it will make the last 28 games more bearable though.

Really liked what I saw out of Sergio Rodriguez tonight. Played miles above and beyond anything Duhon has shown this season. Sergio showed some really impressive court vision. I am hoping he quickly takes Duhon's minutes for the rest of the year.

RainMaker · 02-20-2010, 10:19 PM

Just got back from the Bulls game and saw them slaughter the Sixers and pick up their 4th in a row. Vinny is starting to look like a decent coach. Did not expect us to be 3 games over .500 at this point.

Not sure if there are any 76ers fans here, but what a pathetic team. They just play with zero emotion and didn't seem to care. Bulls had 11 dunks in the game, free reign around the hoop, and went on a 29-1 run at some point. Turnovers were 15-3 which isn't just the Bulls playing well, but the 76ers just not making any effort on defense. It's one thing to be a bad team, it's another to just completely mail a game in.

And Kirk Hinrich became the Bulls franchise leader in 3-point field goals tonight. One of my favorite players this franchise has ever had.

Chief Rum · 02-21-2010, 03:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Not sure if there are any 76ers fans here, but what a pathetic team. They just play with zero emotion and didn't seem to care... It's one thing to be a bad team, it's another to just completely mail a game in.

The Clippers have done this as well, which frustrates me to no end.

That said, I still regard Elton Brand, along with his gloryhound agent, as a traitor for the crap he pulled two offseasons ago, and he deserves to play for a crap team. Nice to see karma show up every now and then and remind the asshats they don't run everything in the world.

whomario · 02-21-2010, 04:31 AM

Rockets looked terrible defensively tonight. Actually they´ve been bad all season, now you really see how valuable and key Yao in the middle is for that defense. They allways were a To 3-5 defensive team with him, no matter what players played around him.
Now he´s gone and the defense is barely league average, worse on many nights.
It´s not like Hayes is a bad defender (he´s actually amazing man defender) and Battier/Ariza is as good as it gets on the wing, Lowry is a good defender and Scola is ok.
But the schemes just fall apart. And Brooks is a huge part of the problem, terrible defender...

Martin looked off tonight. Played with a ton of effort, but his shot was really, really, really off.
Scola was great, as he´s been all season. If he had a decent PG next to him (Brooks is a decent player and a good scorer, but a terrible PG) who could run the Pick and Roll he could average 20 a game.
For the Pacers, Granger couldn´t miss and Ford had propably his best game of the season.

Chief Rum · 02-21-2010, 04:38 AM

A lane clogging huge center with the ability to modify and reject shots is still the one proven and true way to make a lackluster defense look great.

whomario · 02-21-2010, 05:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

A lane clogging huge center with the ability to modify and reject shots is still the one proven and true way to make a lackluster defense look great.

yep, especially if that guy doesn´t care if he gets scored or even dunked on and has a high basketball IQ. God, i hope he comes back successfully ...

Chief Rum · 02-21-2010, 05:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by whomario

yep, especially if that guy doesn´t care if he gets scored or even dunked on and has a high basketball IQ. God, i hope he comes back successfully ...

I always liked Yao, but as a fan of a Western Conference team, I can't really wish the Rockets well.

But, yeah, I hope Yao gets his feet right and returns next year with a flourish.

RainMaker · 02-21-2010, 05:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

The Clippers have done this as well, which frustrates me to no end.

That said, I still regard Elton Brand, along with his gloryhound agent, as a traitor for the crap he pulled two offseasons ago, and he deserves to play for a crap team. Nice to see karma show up every now and then and remind the asshats they don't run everything in the world.

Trust me on this, you are very lucky not to be stuck with Elton Brand. He has one of the worst contracts in the NBA. I just watched Taj Gibson and Hakim Warrick destroy him last night.

whomario · 02-21-2010, 12:04 PM

Very intrigued by the upcoming Cavs-Magic matchup starting at this very moment.

sterlingice · 02-21-2010, 12:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by whomario

yep, especially if that guy doesn´t care if he gets scored or even dunked on and has a high basketball IQ. God, i hope he comes back successfully ...

It's like I was telling the guys in the office- they didn't understand why we did this since they both said we'd have a better team this year with McGrady on the floor. And I kept telling them this isn't about this year, it's about next year. The best we can do this year is make it into the first round and get drilled. But this nets us a good team *if* Yao can come back *and* helps rebuild for the future even if he doesn't and that's why it was such a great move.

SI

BishopMVP · 02-21-2010, 03:43 PM

Who had the 2nd quarter for "Joe Crawford T's up a coach and gets himself on TV during a national game?"

TroyF · 02-21-2010, 05:12 PM

Can the playoffs start already so Denver can just play elite teams? In their defense, a lot of people are making something of the Washington game, but that was pure tiredness in the fourth quarter. The Cleveland game took a lot out of them.

Against the best of the best, Denver has been fantastic this year. Against the worst of the worst, they've looked mediocre.

The Orlando/Cleveland matchup is always really fascinating for me to watch. Cleveland does a lot of things really, really well. And they have the best of the best playing for them. Orlando really seems to take a lot of that away. Dwight+ the depth of bigs means they can control the boards and will have a gazillion fouls to spend on Shaq in the playoffs.

The smaller fours really take away what Varajao does. He's a guy who stops penetration, but he's out on the floor trying to cover the three point shot. They have about 4 guys the same size who can cover Lebron. Not stop Lebron, but they don't have any one guy who will get tired covering him.

The one wild card is Jamison. He allows the Cavs to match up better with the Magic. I really want to see those two in a seven game series again. My dream would be to see exact rematches of last years final four. Lakers/Nuggets, Cavs/Magic. May the best teams win.

BishopMVP · 02-21-2010, 05:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TroyF

Can the playoffs start already so Denver can just play elite teams? In their defense, a lot of people are making something of the Washington game, but that was pure tiredness in the fourth quarter. The Cleveland game took a lot out of them.

If you're using that defense, this was the back end of a west coast swing and the C's 3rd game in 4 days, plus Nate Robinson isn't there yet. We came back and made a game of it, but going down 19 after 1 points to some tired legs coming in.

02-18-2010, 09:51 PM	#1101
Groundhog Coordinator Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Sydney, Australia	Wow. __________________ Politics, n. Strife of interests masquerading as a contest of principles. --Ambrose Bierce

02-18-2010, 09:52 PM	#1102
k0ruptr Pro Starter Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Las Vegas	wow, great play by Lebron, and now Anthony! wowowowow 1.9 left. Carmelo with the fkn dagger. __________________ Xbox Live Gamertag: k0ruptr My Favorite Teams : Chicago White Sox - Carolina Panthers - Orlando Magic - Phoenix Suns - Anaheim Ducks - Hawaii Warriors - Oregon Ducks

02-18-2010, 09:52 PM	#1103
Groundhog Coordinator Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Sydney, Australia	Is it time to quote the Carmello clutch discussion from a page or 2 ago in this thread yet? __________________ Politics, n. Strife of interests masquerading as a contest of principles. --Ambrose Bierce

02-18-2010, 09:53 PM	#1104
k0ruptr Pro Starter Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Las Vegas	HOLY !!! wow, james almost made that. SOB. __________________ Xbox Live Gamertag: k0ruptr My Favorite Teams : Chicago White Sox - Carolina Panthers - Orlando Magic - Phoenix Suns - Anaheim Ducks - Hawaii Warriors - Oregon Ducks

02-18-2010, 09:54 PM	#1105
k0ruptr Pro Starter Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Las Vegas	first loss in over a month for the Cavs. haha. these guys are going to be so so good when Jamison starts. geez. __________________ Xbox Live Gamertag: k0ruptr My Favorite Teams : Chicago White Sox - Carolina Panthers - Orlando Magic - Phoenix Suns - Anaheim Ducks - Hawaii Warriors - Oregon Ducks

02-18-2010, 09:56 PM	#1106
Radii Head Coach Join Date: Jul 2001	Only saw the overtime, but that was damn entertaining.

02-18-2010, 10:29 PM	#1108
stevew Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: the yo'	Lemme guess. Antawn couldn't play tonight cause the clippers guys didn't report in time? Or was drew gooden at fault?

02-18-2010, 11:59 PM	#1110
larrymcg421 Head Coach Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Georgia	I really hate Rasheed Wallace. __________________ Top 10 Songs of the Year 1955-Present (1976 Added) Franchise Portfolio Draft Winner Fictional Character Draft Winner Television Family Draft Winner Build Your Own Hollywood Studio Draft Winner

02-19-2010, 12:05 AM	#1111
DaddyTorgo Hall Of Famer Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Massachusetts	signing wallace and trading house are/will be the death knell of this team. along with Garnett's knees having collapsed too of course. __________________ If I've ever helped you and you'd like to buy me a coffee, or just to say thanks, I have my Bitcoin and Ethereum addressed listed below :) BTC: bc1qykhsfyn9vw4ntqfgr0svj4n9tjdgufryh2pxn5 ETH: 0x2AcdC5cd88EA537063553F5b240073bE067BaCa9

02-19-2010, 04:57 AM	#1112
whomario Pro Starter Join Date: Jul 2007	Robinson is a good pickup imo. Sometimes you have to take risks and go with potential ability instead of staying put with a know commodity, this is one of those cases. Robinson gives them a player than can create his own shot and can break down defenses, something no one outside of Rondo and Pierce could do before. Rodriguez in New York and playing for D´Antoni Really glad for the guy, the knicks wanted him for a long time and D´Antoni was a fan of hisas well. And Milicic gets one last shot apparently, will indeed report to the Timberwolves after Kahn talked to him in New York (he was all set to negotiate a buy out in New York and join a team in Europe to get adjusted before next season) and will get minutes. I am again hoping for the best, even though i´m no longer holding my breath. Brewer to the Grizzlies is a good pickup. A shooter would have been better, but with that bench you can´t be picky. Maybe they casn still challenge for the POs. Charlotte looks like a dangerous team in the first round. But why did those morons try to trade Nazr Mohammed ? The guy has been incredibly productive this year and a solid option at the 5 ... And they wanted to trade him for fringe players ... For the Rockets for the rest of the year it´ll be interesting what the rotation at SG/SF will look like. I´d bring Ariza off the bench personally, but what do i know. Hill should pick up quite a few minutes, although i first think that Andersen will play more as well.

02-19-2010, 09:32 AM	#1113
Arles Grey Dog Software Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Phoenix, AZ by way of Belleville, IL	I don't know about the Suns making out poorly. If they can either keep Amare (talking about an extension @ $14 per) or trade him in the offseason, I think they make out OK. Iguadala has an awful contract and is a SG who can't hit 3s (not exactly a blessing for the Suns' system). And the poo poo platters offered by everyone else left little to be desired. If Phoenix had traded Amare for a PF with the ceiling of a 7th man (Hickson), what amounts to an early 2nd round pick (Cle's #1 this season) and the old bones of Z - then they would have been bigtime losers. Even the Iguadala swap (which was never confirmed) would have been bad. He would make as much as Amare in the next 4 seasons (if the Suns extended him), shoots 30% from 3 and plays a spot easily replaceable (guard/SF in the Suns system). Heck, Raja Bell, Jared Dudley, 90-year old Grant Hill, Eddie House and numerous others have had career seasons in that spot. __________________ Developer of Bowl Bound College Football http://www.greydogsoftware.com Last edited by Arles : 02-19-2010 at 09:33 AM.

02-19-2010, 09:36 AM	#1114
TroyF Coordinator Join Date: Oct 2000	Arles, The Suns not making a move was incredibly dangerous. You have an injury plagued PF who has a 17 million dollar option for next season. Say Amare has another big injury before the end of the year. You are now going to pay him 17 million dollars next season to sit out and then have to decide weather to pay for an extension or not. They had chances to get quality players now. If they sign him to the extension, then they win. If he takes off, even if they pull off a sign and trade, they aren't going to come out with as much as they would have if they'd pulled it off now.

02-19-2010, 10:16 AM	#1115
whomario Pro Starter Join Date: Jul 2007	granted that he had major knee surgery but other than that he had an eye injury, that´s injury plagued ? Other than that layoff due to the eye injury/surgery he missed only 3 games in the last 4 seasons. How do you know they won´t get more in a sign and trade than they would have gotten now ? As said, Igoudala is a lateral move at best and no one to build a team around. The cavs offer ? Pretty sure they get more than that in a sign and trade. If he just takes off ? Yeah, that´s bad. But then again the Suns at least didn´t take on a player just for the sake of taking on a player. I wouldn´t want Igoudala on my team at that salary for free, much less trade a guy like Stoudemire for him. And it´s not like i´m high on Stoudemire´s ability either.

02-19-2010, 10:17 AM	#1116
sterlingice Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Back in Houston!	I'm trying to remember if I ever saw a trade for Amare that was worth anything. SI __________________ Houston Hippopotami, III.3: 20th Anniversary Thread - All former HT players are encouraged to check it out! Janos: "Only America could produce an imbecile of your caliber!" Freakazoid: "That's because we make lots of things better than other people!"

02-19-2010, 10:22 AM	#1117
Chief Rum Hall Of Famer Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Where Hip Hop lives	Sign and trades... These just aren't common in the NBA anymore; there's probably some reason related to the cap and last CBA. Regardless, I wouldn't count on a sign and trade happening. __________________ . . I would rather be wrong...Than live in the shadows of your song...My mind is open wide...And now I'm ready to start...You're not sure...You open the door...And step out into the dark...Now I'm ready.

02-19-2010, 12:17 PM	#1119
Arles Grey Dog Software Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Phoenix, AZ by way of Belleville, IL	They had their choice of 2-3 poo platters with either bad contracts, over-rated prospects (ie, Hickson) or end of the first round picks (marginal value at best). If they moved Amare for the Cleveland deal, there's a chance the team's fan base gets fed up and quits watching. Now, in order for the Suns to "get burnt" - all of the following need to happen: 1. Amare decides not to extend with Phoenix before the offseason (rumors are he wants a 4-year at $14 mil per and the Suns are offering a 2-year at $14 mil per - not all that far off). 2. Amare decides to not pick up his option for $17+ million for next season - more than any team could sign him to in the initial year. 3. Either Miami or New Jersey agree to make him a max FA offer - little chance Chicago (want Bosh), New York (Mike D doesn't get along) or the Clippers (have Griffin) will. 4. Amare agrees to accept that offer instead of working out a sign-and-trade for potentially more money with a team like Houston or other contender. I would put the chance that all 4 happen at around 15-20% max. Plus, there's some risk with Amare declining his option in that if Miami decides to sign Boozer and the Nets go a different direction - there may not be a $14+ million option for him. Then, he's forced to come back to Phoenix without his $17 million option or take a lot less money somewhere else. But, even if the "worst case" happens - Amare finishes the season for Phoenix and then signs a max deal with Miami. The Suns then have $39 million on the books for 8 players. They also have a $14 million expiring deal in Jason Richardson. So, they can either sign a $10-12 million FA and deal Richardson for a quality player and picks to a team freeing up salary. Or, they can play through a down next season and end up with a good pick in 2011, only $17-19 million on the cap and decent group of young players + Nash (Dragic, Clark, Lopez, Barbosa, Dudley, Amundson, multiple picks). Again, giving up the somewhat likely chance to keep Amare for Hickson and the 31st pick or expirings and a mid-round pick from Miami is silly. Moving one of the top offensive forwards in the game for a similar contract SG (Iguodala) doesn't make much sense either - esp when the team already has Barbosa, Richardson, Hill and Dudley and would have no post presence without Amare. At the end of the day, the Suns were smart to hold on to Amare and they will have numerous options no matter how this offseason plays out. Trading Amare for crap or bad contracts in a panic move gives them significantly fewer options - all for the chance to watch JJ Hickson become Hakim Warrick or get a scrub player at pick 30 in the draft. __________________ Developer of Bowl Bound College Football http://www.greydogsoftware.com

02-19-2010, 01:23 PM	#1120
TroyF Coordinator Join Date: Oct 2000	Arles, You make good points. I just don't like it. Even if Hickson sucks (and I do think he does), he's a small contract and has some talent and value on the trade front. We'll see what happens this offseason. I really wouldn't put anything past Amare though. I'd move your odds up over 35%. I really look at Iggy like I look at Kenyon Martin. Is he overpaid? Yeah. Does he do things that can help a good team win a title? Yeah. If you are going to have an overpaid guy (and if Amare gets the max, you've already said he'd be overpaid earlier in the thread), wouldn't you rather have a guy who never misses a game, plays his ass off night in, night out and does a few things exceptionally well as opposed to a guy who takes nights or weeks off when he isn't feeling it? Again, we'll see how it plays out.

02-19-2010, 02:57 PM	#1121
Arles Grey Dog Software Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Phoenix, AZ by way of Belleville, IL	There's always a risk with any situation/move. There's a risk that the Suns moved Amare for Hickson and a pick - Hickson busts and the pick ends up never playing for the team. I agree that Amare isn't a max player, but $14 mil a season isn't a max contract (and that's what they are talking about now). Plus, if I'm going to slightly overpay, I'd rather it be for an effective PF than an effective SG. The former is a lot harder to find in the NBA. If the Suns sign Amare to a 4-year extension, I won't be thrilled - but I won't be upset. Pretty much every other moved discussed here involving him would have me be fairly disgusted as a Suns fan. __________________ Developer of Bowl Bound College Football http://www.greydogsoftware.com

02-19-2010, 05:03 PM	#1123
mauchow Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Murfreesboro, TN	as long as they can put food on their tables for their family

02-19-2010, 06:47 PM	#1125
whomario Pro Starter Join Date: Jul 2007	Lebron James has been averaging 11 Assists over his last 13 games btw (and 7 in the first quarter today) which is kind of ridiculous no matter how much he dominates the ball and even with the 4 TOs a game ... 7 again today. Really an incredible player. Not that it is news, but still hits me every now and then ... Jamison off the bench for today. For Washington Andray Blatche really has tons of upside, as does Javale McGee imo (why in the world didn´t he get PT for a team like the Wizards ? I mean, his rookie season wasn´t that bad at about 14/9 with 2+ blocks per 36) Jamison has been blocked on basically every attempt so far, almost funny Last edited by whomario : 02-19-2010 at 06:51 PM.

02-19-2010, 07:51 PM	#1126
CleBrownsfan Pro Rookie Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: C-Town	My god - Jamison is having a horrible game - 0-10 from the field so far. Bad game for the Cavs overall. Z come back please.. __________________ *XBox Gamertag:* Pronk32 FOOL-X - Cleveland Naps FOOL - Cleveland Cyclones SLOP - Cuyahoga Spiders

02-20-2010, 02:05 AM	#1128
Radii Head Coach Join Date: Jul 2001	Isiah Thomas was on PTI today and said the following: "The jury is probably still out on whether I would be a good pro coach or not. I had a good run in Indiana and was on my way to having a good run in New York" That's unedited and he didn't qualify that statement anymore. LOL?

02-20-2010, 11:45 AM	#1129
whomario Pro Starter Join Date: Jul 2007	kind of looking forward to see McGrady play again, D´Antoni allready said that he´ll start right away. Throw in Sergio Rodriguez and and getting even smaller up fron and see what happens

02-20-2010, 07:45 PM	#1130
Ironhead College Prospect Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Barnegat, NJ	McGrady absolutely balling in NY tonight. 19 points at the half with 3 assists, including one laser bounce pass up the floor on the break. This is the most unselfish the team has played in months.

02-20-2010, 07:48 PM	#1131
whomario Pro Starter Join Date: Jul 2007	McGrady with 19 on 7-12 shooting at the half, add in a couple beautiful assists. I´d be so glad if he really would come back. Didn´t look particularly agile, but that is to be expected and he did a great job picking his spots and his basketball-IQ is just so high that i could see him finding his role as a pick and roll specialist and contributing even with lesser athleticism and without great shooting ability. martin off the bench for now in houston. Last edited by whomario : 02-20-2010 at 07:54 PM.

02-20-2010, 08:57 PM	#1132
Neon_Chaos Pro Starter Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Parañaque, Philippines	TMac and House are having outstanding debuts for the Knicks. __________________ Come and see.

02-20-2010, 09:06 PM	#1134
Neon_Chaos Pro Starter Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Parañaque, Philippines	Ok, if TMac takes and makes the game winner for this one, the Knicks have officially found a new hero. __________________ Come and see.

02-20-2010, 09:08 PM	#1135
whomario Pro Starter Join Date: Jul 2007	nice little game between the knicks and thunder, going to OT. Thunder very sloppy on defense, but the knicks did a good job taking advantage of the mismatches they create with that crop of 6´8, 6´9 guys at the 2 and 3 and 4 spots. Antoni blew it by playing without a PG at the end ... T-Mac 26/4/4 so far. eddie house with 19, lee 26. rodriguez with some good plays as well. Durant with a bad 2nd half guarded by Gallinari (don´t think that was really the reason though ) but then nails the game-tying 3. random thought : Eddie House´s release is ridiculous. Last edited by whomario : 02-20-2010 at 09:24 PM.

02-20-2010, 09:08 PM	#1136
Neon_Chaos Pro Starter Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Parañaque, Philippines	Gallinari, you ass. __________________ Come and see.

02-20-2010, 09:42 PM	#1138
Ironhead College Prospect Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Barnegat, NJ	Tough loss but that was the best effort the Knicks have shown since early January. Durant was just a killer down the stretch and the Thunder are a good team so I have to hand it to them. I don't see too many more wins the rest of the year because the same glaring problem is there - just no resistance in the paint. If the team shows this effort it will make the last 28 games more bearable though. Really liked what I saw out of Sergio Rodriguez tonight. Played miles above and beyond anything Duhon has shown this season. Sergio showed some really impressive court vision. I am hoping he quickly takes Duhon's minutes for the rest of the year. Last edited by Ironhead : 02-20-2010 at 09:42 PM.

02-20-2010, 10:19 PM	#1139
RainMaker General Manager Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Chicago, IL	Just got back from the Bulls game and saw them slaughter the Sixers and pick up their 4th in a row. Vinny is starting to look like a decent coach. Did not expect us to be 3 games over .500 at this point. Not sure if there are any 76ers fans here, but what a pathetic team. They just play with zero emotion and didn't seem to care. Bulls had 11 dunks in the game, free reign around the hoop, and went on a 29-1 run at some point. Turnovers were 15-3 which isn't just the Bulls playing well, but the 76ers just not making any effort on defense. It's one thing to be a bad team, it's another to just completely mail a game in. And Kirk Hinrich became the Bulls franchise leader in 3-point field goals tonight. One of my favorite players this franchise has ever had. Last edited by RainMaker : 02-21-2010 at 03:19 AM.

02-21-2010, 04:31 AM	#1141
whomario Pro Starter Join Date: Jul 2007	Rockets looked terrible defensively tonight. Actually they´ve been bad all season, now you really see how valuable and key Yao in the middle is for that defense. They allways were a To 3-5 defensive team with him, no matter what players played around him. Now he´s gone and the defense is barely league average, worse on many nights. It´s not like Hayes is a bad defender (he´s actually amazing man defender) and Battier/Ariza is as good as it gets on the wing, Lowry is a good defender and Scola is ok. But the schemes just fall apart. And Brooks is a huge part of the problem, terrible defender... Martin looked off tonight. Played with a ton of effort, but his shot was really, really, really off. Scola was great, as he´s been all season. If he had a decent PG next to him (Brooks is a decent player and a good scorer, but a terrible PG) who could run the Pick and Roll he could average 20 a game. For the Pacers, Granger couldn´t miss and Ford had propably his best game of the season.

02-21-2010, 04:38 AM	#1142
Chief Rum Hall Of Famer Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Where Hip Hop lives	A lane clogging huge center with the ability to modify and reject shots is still the one proven and true way to make a lackluster defense look great. __________________ . . I would rather be wrong...Than live in the shadows of your song...My mind is open wide...And now I'm ready to start...You're not sure...You open the door...And step out into the dark...Now I'm ready.

02-21-2010, 12:04 PM	#1146
whomario Pro Starter Join Date: Jul 2007	Very intrigued by the upcoming Cavs-Magic matchup starting at this very moment.

02-21-2010, 03:43 PM	#1148
BishopMVP Coordinator Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Concord, MA/UMass	Who had the 2nd quarter for "Joe Crawford T's up a coach and gets himself on TV during a national game?"