Werewolf XXXIV: Tombstone (GAME OVER - Night 13)

[Chubby]

It's a miracle I actually posted anything, FOFC is being insanely buggy (now that I'm actually in which took forever)

[Chubby]

I'll be back online later tonight, got to go to Rochester with the gf to get some stuff done.

[path12]

Originally Posted by Chubby

St Cronin did most of the talking with NTNdeacon listening

I'm not sure what to think about that. If ntn visited wouldn't he be the one who would be talking?

[Chubby]

Originally Posted by path12

I'm not sure what to think about that. If ntn visited wouldn't he be the one who would be talking?

That's what I would have thought and the reason why I bolded it after the comments already about last nights happenings.

[Barkeep49]

Well that's very interesting. Very interesting indeed.

[Chubby]

I'm going to end up checking in when I'm in Rochester and I'll certainly either be back in time for lynch vote or make a vote from Rochester.

[hoopsguy]

NTN and Cronin - does this coincide with your perception of events as well?

Chubby, did you hear anything on Night 1?

[Lathum]

ok, here is what I have.

When Saldana let me out of Jail he escorted me to my house in the SE because he had buisness there, I assume he arrested swaggs. NTN confirmed as much so I have no reason not to trust him at this point.

When I left jail GE was still in his cell so I can only assume he escaped when Saldana left but my question about that is who did he show his badge to if Saldana was gone?

As far as sheriff goes I see no reason to replace saldana but IF we do I think it needs to be with someone who doesn't have a significant night action so they can focus on their sherif duties.

[spleen1015]

Since I don't have a role, I don't have any night actions. I'm sure the group doesn't have any confidence in me to make me sheriff, but I just wanted you guys to know this just in case you need someone to do it.

[LoneStarGirl]

I dont have any night roles either, and I didn't get a PM last night, so i would be happy to step up as sherrif. I personally think GE needs to challange Saldana to a duel, and we should elect Barkeep as Sherrif

Elect Barkeep



Plus, I dont know much about ntndeacon, or about chubby....I think one of the two should be jailed. Plus, Swaggs should be in jail until he feels comfortable to come out. But I DEFINITLY don't like Saldana telling us that he is going to jail GE tonight no matter what. That is not his job. We (well y'all) voted for him because you thought he would listen to us and do what we ask. I dont see anybody asking to have GE back in jail.

[spleen1015]

Originally Posted by LoneStarGirl

We (well y'all) voted for him because you thought he would listen to us and do what we ask. I dont see anybody asking to have GE back in jail.

This is an accurate statement.

[path12]

Originally Posted by LoneStarGirl

I dont see anybody asking to have GE back in jail.

I certainly would have before seeing the night results. He seems to have verified his ability/role somewhat last night. I wouldn't call him clear by any stretch though -- and if he starts a duel with Saldana (who still in my opinion hasn't really done anything suspicious) I would look on that very poorly.

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by Chubby

If someone kills me in a showdown, your an idiot.


Goldeneagle and Lathum both had guns when arrested.
Ntndeacon went to St Cronins house last night
St Cronin did most of the talking with NTNdeacon listening

I don't understand where you're going with this.

also, I'm pretty sure in the rules that the sherriff can still perform his other night duties. Going to check on that now.

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by path12

I certainly would have before seeing the night results. He seems to have verified his ability/role somewhat last night. I wouldn't call him clear by any stretch though -- and if he starts a duel with Saldana (who still in my opinion hasn't really done anything suspicious) I would look on that very poorly.

Pretty much my take as well. Path, what are your thoughts on who should be sherriff?

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by Alan T

The Sheriff has two additional night actions each night (to add to any other possible night actions they may have previously due to their game role.)

1st post of the thread.

So, Barkeep or ntndeacon or anybody else with a neccesary night action could be made sherriff. I think it should be the most trusted player. For me, right now that's ntndeacon.

[path12]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

Pretty much my take as well. Path, what are your thoughts on who should be sherriff?

I'm fine with Saldana still. Swaggs IIRC suggested that he might be able to use some protection last night after duking, so that didn't really raise any red flag with me. I would have rather had someone we could vote for but it was a tough spot.

If I was forced to suggest someone else, I'd probably lean Barkeep or Swaggs.

[path12]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

1st post of the thread.

So, Barkeep or ntndeacon or anybody else with a neccesary night action could be made sherriff. I think it should be the most trusted player. For me, right now that's ntndeacon.

With that clarification you can put ntndeacon in my list above also.

[LoneStarGirl]

Please explain why NTNDeacon is in your COT.

[LoneStarGirl]

And I don't think it would be wise to put Swaggs at Sheriff. Mayors usually dont make good sherrifs.

[path12]

Originally Posted by LoneStarGirl

Please explain why NTNDeacon is in your COT.

I don't have any direct knowledge or a COT at this point, but he's been vouched for by Anxiety, st. cronin and one other person I believe, which makes him more trusted than most of us.

[path12]

Originally Posted by LoneStarGirl

And I don't think it would be wise to put Swaggs at Sheriff. Mayors usually dont make good sherrifs.

Why is that?

[LoneStarGirl]

They say that he is vouched for, but i dont know what he has done. Wolves will probably vouch for Wolves, but i want to know why

[path12]

Originally Posted by LoneStarGirl

They say that he is vouched for, but i dont know what he has done. Wolves will probably vouch for Wolves, but i want to know why

I doubt wolves are going to align themselves together this early and publicly in the game.

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by LoneStarGirl

Please explain why NTNDeacon is in your COT.

Because of his visit last night, and what didn't happen - because if it had happened, I think it would have meant he was a cowboy. If you follow closely what I've said from day 1, you might be able to guess both his role and why he visited me.

Even before that, he was obviously out and about on night 1, visiting Anxiety and not killing anybody. So, he checks out in a couple of ways.

[st.cronin]

dola

I half expected Chubby to show up as some sort of bodyguard, but that appears not to be the case.

[Abe Sargent]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

I appreciate the sentiment cronin has expressed for me to be sheriff and would, if people wanted, be willing to step-up at this point. I could also, whole heartedly, get behind Lathum as a candidate. I've grown a little more uneasy with Anxiety today as I would have thought his using of his dress up would count to make him tired. Anxiety, without saying what it is, do you have another night ability? I still think he'd likely make a good candidate too. While I trust NTN, I'm not sure where he's at gamewise and would be more reluctant to trust that he'll use the powers well at this point.

All this is not to say that I'm ready to jump off of saldana. I really want to hear from him about his rationale for the night actions. He released Lathum, which I see as good. Swaggs seems like it needs some explanation, but I remain open minded.

Nope, no extra abilities right now. But I would prefer not to say more about the future and I hope you can understand that.

[Abe Sargent]

Originally Posted by path12

I'm not sure what to think about that. If ntn visited wouldn't he be the one who would be talking?

This is not inconsistent info with what I know of ntndeacon, and in fact, makes him even more trusted to my mind.

[hoopsguy]

OK, I was hoping to get an answer from Chubby yesterday on this point.

I asked if he heard anything last night. Several people had posted yesterday that they heard gunshots. Chubby didn't answer me when I asked today.

Chubby posted today that he knew that both Lathum and GoldenEagle had guns yesterday - information that is now public knowledge but was not yesterday until late in the day. Yet he voted "no lynch" on each of these guys yesterday. Why?

Chubby is coming out with information on St. Cronin and NTN from last night, expanding on the initial descriptions. That tells me he was out last night. And the fact that he is tired today verifies that he was out on the first night. But the information he "revealed" from his first night strikes me as very inconsistent with his vote.

I'm definitely thinking it makes sense to jail Chubby.

I'm also still waiting for Saldana to comment on the Swaggs jailing. As of right now, we have one man dead and a decent chance of a conversion - I'm holding out hope that someone has information on that topic as well.

[hoopsguy]

Originally Posted by Chubby

off to work

I still think we shouldn't lynch anyone in jail so I won't vote to lynch anyone.

Here is Chubby's post yesterday suggesting we should not lynch anyone in jail. Now he may be correct that neither GE nor Lathum are Cowboys, but why would he think this if both of them had guns? This isn't adding up for me ...

[st.cronin]

I don't know if Chubby was really saying that he knew those two had guns prior to the rest of Tombstone knowing. I feel like he was trying to make a case for something based on that fact and the other facts, but I have no idea what it was.

unelect Barkeep

elect ntndeacon

I think it's important to have somebody who is above suspicion in that role. This vote is NOT a reflection of how I feel about saldana, but as last night's little j'accuse match between GE and sal demonstrated, we need to have somebody in the office that can't be accused of being a cowboy. Otherwise, it will just be too confusing.

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Here is Chubby's post yesterday suggesting we should not lynch anyone in jail. Now he may be correct that neither GE nor Lathum are Cowboys, but why would he think this if both of them had guns? This isn't adding up for me ...

I think you're way off base here.

[Lathum]

Well I think it is a foregone conclusion no lynch again tonight so we need to discuss 2 things.

1. Do we elect a new sheriff. I could go eaither way with this. I have no problem with saldana but if we go in a different direction I am confident with NTN or barkeep.


2. Who to jail? I think chubby has some explaining to do at this point.

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by Lathum

Well I think it is a foregone conclusion no lynch again tonight so we need to discuss 2 things.

1. Do we elect a new sheriff. I could go eaither way with this. I have no problem with saldana but if we go in a different direction I am confident with NTN or barkeep.


2. Who to jail? I think chubby has some explaining to do at this point.

I agree it would be helpful for Chubby to explain more what he has been up to, but at this point I trust him more than LSG, hoopsguy, Fouts, and quite a few others.

It costs us NOTHING to change sherriffs. It only makes sense to have the most trusted player in there.

[hoopsguy]

Cronin, do you disagree with how I'm interpreting events or do you have other information that leads you to believe that Chubby is not a Cowboy?

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Cronin, do you disagree with how I'm interpreting events or do you have other information that leads you to believe that Chubby is not a Cowboy?

I don't have any more information than you, and it would if Chubby would be a bit more DETAILED in his posts. But Chubby was not the only one arguing "no lynch" on that day. That argument doesn't have to be connected to his role, which I'm still puzzled by.

[hoopsguy]

Originally Posted by Chubby

If someone kills me in a showdown, your an idiot.


Goldeneagle and Lathum both had guns when arrested.
Ntndeacon went to St Cronins house last night
St Cronin did most of the talking with NTNdeacon listening

Cronin, this was Chubby's post. I took the below information to indicate what he learned through his role. The bolded part was him expanding on Night 2 information, in a way that suggests he is helping us out.

But if you interpret the first piece of information to suggest that he learned about GE and Lathum on Night 1 (and remember he is tired today so he had a Night 1 action when there was a kill) then why would he vote "No Lynch" for two people who were arrested with guns when there was someone shot that night? I was definitely looking to lynch yesterday even without the knowledge of guns.

He can help me clear up any misconceptions here with his reply.

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Cronin, this was Chubby's post. I took the below information to indicate what he learned through his role. The bolded part was him expanding on Night 2 information, in a way that suggests he is helping us out.

But if you interpret the first piece of information to suggest that he learned about GE and Lathum on Night 1 (and remember he is tired today so he had a Night 1 action when there was a kill) then why would he vote "No Lynch" for two people who were arrested with guns when there was someone shot that night? I was definitely looking to lynch yesterday even without the knowledge of guns.

He can help me clear up any misconceptions here with his reply.

Well, I'll wait for him to comment, since I'm not at all sure what that post is supposed to be telling us. But I have him mildly trusted, since his actions last night are pretty benevolent, afaict.

[hoopsguy]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

Well, I'll wait for him to comment, since I'm not at all sure what that post is supposed to be telling us. But I have him mildly trusted, since his actions last night are pretty benevolent, afaict.

That was my first thought on a spy role - seems pretty villager friendly. But unless someone is validating that is what he did then we are just going on his presentation of evidence.

1. There are suggestions about jailing Chubby, who is tired today
2. Chubby says we should not jail him, reveals some information (under duress?)

What if his role is a Cowboy who determines villager roles? What if he can plant evidence? There is a decent amount of supposition here, but I think it is important to look at these "reveals" critically. If he learned about the guns on Day 1 before the rest of us then why vote no lynch?

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

That was my first thought on a spy role - seems pretty villager friendly. But unless someone is validating that is what he did then we are just going on his presentation of evidence.

1. There are suggestions about jailing Chubby, who is tired today
2. Chubby says we should not jail him, reveals some information (under duress?)

What if his role is a Cowboy who determines villager roles? What if he can plant evidence? There is a decent amount of supposition here, but I think it is important to look at these "reveals" critically. If he learned about the guns on Day 1 before the rest of us then why vote no lynch?

I'm almost positive he didn't learn ntndeacon's role. If he did, his posts today make no sense to me. And having a gun in this game is evidence of nothing.

[Abe Sargent]

Okay, let's talk about a new sheriff. Ntndeacon? Barkeep? Me? Swaggs? Lathum? Who are your folks comfortable with, because leaving us with Swaggs as the only options essentially wasted a day.


AlanT - If someone is elected sheriff but is in jail at the time, do they have to spend a night action to release themself?


-Anxiety

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by Anxiety

Okay, let's talk about a new sheriff. Ntndeacon? Barkeep? Me? Swaggs? Lathum? Who are your folks comfortable with, because leaving us with Swaggs as the only options essentially wasted a day.


AlanT - If someone is elected sheriff but is in jail at the time, do they have to spend a night action to release themself?


-Anxiety

Yes they have to use a night action to release themselves.

Unless of course they wish to remain in jail. But then they obviously couldn't do much else.

[ntndeacon]

My guess is Chubby did not find out nor does he know my role now. I do have an inkling of what his role is, but that is it. If his role is what I think it is I would want to keep Chubby out of jail. The only questions I have about Chubby's info is the following...

Was both Golden Eagle and Lathum arrested in the same part of town?
Was Lathum's having a gun well known?

Probably these are back in the posts I just cant remember the answers right now.

[Barkeep49]

I would like to come to some sort of consensus about a candidate to go against saldana. While I think there might not be anything wrong with saldana, it would be good to have one person to unite behind whether it is me or ntn or somebody. That way if we decide, by the end of the day we want to replace saldana, we have somebody to go to. Again I'm not even sure we need to go and replace saldana. But we still haven't heard from him, and I'd like to be prudent.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by ntndeacon

My guess is Chubby did not find out nor does he know my role now. I do have an inkling of what his role is, but that is it. If his role is what I think it is I would want to keep Chubby out of jail. The only questions I have about Chubby's info is the following...

Was both Golden Eagle and Lathum arrested in the same part of town?
Was Lathum's having a gun well known?

Probably these are back in the posts I just cant remember the answers right now.

saldana pointed out that I had a gun. He also pointed out that is was cold and all six chambers were full.

[spleen1015]

ELECT Barkeep

I will go with what everyone else wants. So, if I need to change it I will.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Anxiety

Okay, let's talk about a new sheriff. Ntndeacon? Barkeep? Me? Swaggs? Lathum? Who are your folks comfortable with, because leaving us with Swaggs as the only options essentially wasted a day.


AlanT - If someone is elected sheriff but is in jail at the time, do they have to spend a night action to release themself?


-Anxiety

if this is the route we are going I say NTN or barkeep, they seem the most trusted at this point.

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

I would like to come to some sort of consensus about a candidate to go against saldana. While I think there might not be anything wrong with saldana, it would be good to have one person to unite behind whether it is me or ntn or somebody. That way if we decide, by the end of the day we want to replace saldana, we have somebody to go to. Again I'm not even sure we need to go and replace saldana. But we still haven't heard from him, and I'd like to be prudent.

I'm curious why nobody sees it the way I do, or has even bothered to respond. I've said this several times:

It costs us nothing to elect a new sherriff. It makes sense to have the most trusted player as sherriff. There is no reason to believe saldana is not a cowboy. There are several other players who we have reason to believe are not cowboys. One of them should be elected sherriff.

[ntndeacon]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

1st post of the thread.

So, Barkeep or ntndeacon or anybody else with a neccesary night action could be made sherriff. I think it should be the most trusted player. For me, right now that's ntndeacon.

Ok that was a reason I did not want either myself or anyone with a valuable night role to be sheriff. However since this makes it appear that you can do your action and the role of Sherriff as well. I would be ok with either Barkeep, Lathum, Anxiety, or myself.

[Glengoyne]

Originally Posted by Anxiety

Okay, let's talk about a new sheriff. Ntndeacon? Barkeep? Me? Swaggs? Lathum? Who are your folks comfortable with, because leaving us with Swaggs as the only options essentially wasted a day. ...

I'm losing faith in Saldana. There is still apparently no call for arresting GE again. OK, I think Hoops is still in the arrest GE camp, but just he and Saldana are there as far as I can tell.

As far as the wasted day bit... I'm curious. Yesterday Sal was in the "No lynch absolutely benefits the wolves" camp. Today we find that he jailed Swaggs, at Swaggs' request essentially. But he HAD to know that putting Swaggs in jail would result in a second consecutive No Lynch day. Something that he strongly feels benefits the wolves.

At this point I definitely don't want Sal as sheriff. I think I might actually want to throw Sal in the pokey, and see how he handles that situation.

I'm maybe even to the point where I could do with any of the folks listed in Anxiety's post as sheriff. In fact, as my trust for Sal diminishes, my trust for GE increases, so I'd be tempted to add GE to the list of Sheriff candidates. At least he's on the list of folks I'd prefer as sheriff over Saldana.

[st.cronin]

dola

never mind, a bunch of you folks posted before I got mine in

I think ntn makes the most sense, but Anxiety or Lathum would be fine with me as well. I do trust Barkeep, but not quite to the same degree.