Werewolf XXVIII: Mad Wizard and the Wolves (Game over Pg45)

[SirFozzie]

1,000 replies to my WW thread.

Yay.

(what do you want, it's a WW thread. It's supposed to go 1,000 posts. Sometimes by Day 2 )

BTW, don't blame my computer, blame the lightning outside, knocked out power to the entire area for 9 hours

[Tyrith]

Yesterday I tried to pry the vote off of path at the end once I became convinced he wasn't a bad guy. I started with hoops because that's where blade went, and then tried to go to anxiety in order to get people off of path somehow. The way Barkeep didn't come off of path yesterday makes me think we can't _completely_ clear him yet. Now, though, I'm with cronin. Anxiety is starting to smell real bad again, and unless momentum swings to a candidate that will provide more information, I think he's the way to go.

VOTE ANXIETY

[Tyrith]

HAh, I didn't even think about the use of the term "power supply" in that way. Stupid lightning is yet again a tool of the wizard :P

[hoopsguy]

Tyrith - lovers/brothers roles usually result in the death of both when one passes. I'm a little surprised that there were not any consequences for you here.

Was there anything in the role that gave you a reason to believe Blade's death would impact you?

[Tyrith]

After re-reading it, maybe. Appearantly we are the last two wolves out of our original group, and we were really important to each other. I suspect if anything happens it's going to happen the next night. Consider how weak the role's special power is, killing me off too would be a little much.

[Abe Sargent]

Actually hoops, didn't Foz say something about Blade's death having a bigger impact on someone. Let me check real quick.


-Anxiety

[Abe Sargent]

Actually hoops, didn't Foz say something about Blade's death having a bigger impact on someone. Let me check real quick.


-Anxiety

[Abe Sargent]

Tyrith - were you affected in any way by Blade's death?

-Anxiety

[hoopsguy]

AlanT, Post #997:

I do find it interesting that Hoops is giving Tyrith an out

I've asked the question about Blade/Tyrith a couple of times over the last 24 hours and no one touched it at all. I first posted on this yesterday afternoon (noting that each had mentioned someone being able to vouch for them) and immediately regretted doing so - even more so after the night actions showed Blade as the target. I was subtle about the "one affected more than others" part of the PM earlier today. And I referenced it again in the "Questions I Would Like Answered" this morning. There was no conversation emerging on this topic. So I went a little more direct this time around to try and get answers.

[Tyrith]

I did not get a PM during Night 4 -- not even frome blade, because of the bad timing; however, considering that he was about to be dead, I understand why our night actions were kind of skipped over :P

It wouldn't surprise me if something arises from this later, though.

[hoopsguy]

SirFozzie, Post #913:

The night quickly passes.. and apparently the wizard was worried about his lightning tricks becoming passe.. because come morning, BLADE6119 is found roasted by what's generally known by most non-magic users as a "Big-Ass Fireball".. the ground around him scorched and burned black.

Of course, seeing another of the rag-tag pack you have formed slain by the wizard is upsetting, but one of you seems to be more affected then the others. Will you all go the way Blade did, and soon?

Tyrith, my advice would be to be as forthcoming with information/opinions over this day cycle as you can - I would not be surprised if there is some delayed impact from the loss of your brother.

[hoopsguy]

Can you summarize the PMs the two of you swapped?

[hoopsguy]

Tyrith, did your role PM have any information about your pack, your character, or Blade's character?

[stevew]

Long weekend. I hope the wolves get a chance to plan a better strategy.

[Poli]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

I didn't know what to make of your "scent," so I pretended to trust you, just to see what happened. Then Blade's "scent" was described in a way that made me much more comfortable, so, yeah, I did a 180 on you. Then I started to think you might be the wizard, because I thought it would be very clear when I found a henchman. Now, I don't really know. I trust you maybe 90%. The same as Barkeep and CW.

I know this much:

A few games back I was the seer and hoops was a wolf. I tried to get hoops on my trusted side hoping for more information...and I never got anything useful at all.

[hoopsguy]

I'm hoping that Tyrith will answer a couple of the above questions - there is a method to my madness here.

Ardent - that was a fun game and I think that is the one that had the Lovers role with you and Mr. Wednesday if I'm remembering correctly.

[Poli]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

I'm hoping that Tyrith will answer a couple of the above questions - there is a method to my madness here.

Ardent - that was a fun game and I think that is the one that had the Lovers role with you and Mr. Wednesday if I'm remembering correctly.

Yep, and if I'm not mistaken SirFozzie was the one who chose the pairing...first of me and Schmidty...and then, ironically, me and Mr. Wednesday. Fozzie didn't have a choice in Wednesday.

Schmidty had to leave and Wednesday took over.

The two people I always vote for and I'm paired with them.

[Tyrith]

Okay, back now.

The flavor description of my role PM was literally two lines long. It really didn't have a lot to say except that we fought together and all our other pack members died.

Summary of what we said:

Night One - Blade tells me that we should stay seperate as much as possible. Lists cronin and possibly lathum as suspects, but really doesn't know much.

Night Two - Blade trusts me, path, schmidty, alan, and saldana. I honestly have no idea why he trusted schmidty. Talks about going after cronin again because he had attack me, blade, and hoops. He also wish me and Fozzie both a great evening, which just seemed out of character. :P

Night Three - No PMs because of the screwed up night cycle and both of us being gone all morning.

[Tyrith]

I suspect that I'm not long for this world. Knowing Fozzie, some weird shit is gonna happen Night 4 involving me. Best case scenario is me getting a go apeshit revenge kill, but that's also my own wishful thinking :P

[Blade6119]

Originally Posted by Tyrith

He also wish me and Fozzie both a great evening, which just seemed out of character. :P

REVERTING TO ASSHOLE STATUS

[Tyrith]

And here I was thinking you had turned over a new leaf...well, there's always next game

[saldana]

ok, i am back in, slightly drunk (read: pretty hammered), but i see a very simple equation in front of us....i trust cronin...even if he has doubts about me...he has called out hoops as having been odd when he sniffed him, so as far as i read this, anyone that believes in cronin, which i believe there are a few of us, should vote hoops....if he comes up clean, then we take cronin tomorrow for being full of shit about hoops.

vote hoopsguy

[saldana]

dola, cronin, what else would you like to know about my role...i have pretty much given you my entire role.

[Schmidty]

I just back, and notice that people are talking about me as being not trusted. I would really like to read some concrete reasoning, instead of just lumping me in with other people.

The fact that hoops and Tyrith seem to be pushing so hard for me, I am pretty sure that one or both are humans.

By the way, I haven't read through everything closely yet, so maybe I'm not getting things straight, but these is my initial impressions.

[Poli]

Originally Posted by saldana

ok, i am back in, slightly drunk (read: pretty hammered), but i see a very simple equation in front of us....i trust cronin...even if he has doubts about me...he has called out hoops as having been odd when he sniffed him, so as far as i read this, anyone that believes in cronin, which i believe there are a few of us, should vote hoops....if he comes up clean, then we take cronin tomorrow for being full of shit about hoops.

vote hoopsguy

You type a lot better than I do when I'm drunk.

[Coffee Warlord]

Originally Posted by saldana

dola, cronin, what else would you like to know about my role...i have pretty much given you my entire role.

From what you said earlier, I know your role, and I know, unless you've been converted, you're on our side. Your message touched on a key phrase that was included in mine (not repeating it so bad guys can hop on, but anyone else in our little gang should easily recognize things).

In short? As I said earlier, Saldana's one of us, folks.

[Coffee Warlord]

Dola.

Unless he's a convert. Then all bets are off.

[Coffee Warlord]

Double dola.

As I'm going out soon, I'm touching on points now.

Alan T and Anxiety both voting Tyrith concerns me. I have no reason to trust either of them, and neither of them presented much new evidence to push on Tyrith (and really, is there much evidence on him anyway?)

[Abe Sargent]

Originally Posted by Coffee Warlord

From what you said earlier, I know your role, and I know, unless you've been converted, you're on our side. Your message touched on a key phrase that was included in mine (not repeating it so bad guys can hop on, but anyone else in our little gang should easily recognize things).

In short? As I said earlier, Saldana's one of us, folks.

Okay. Like I said earlier, saldana or hoops are the people I'm looking at, so I'll swing hoops's way,

Unvote Saldana

Vote Hoopsguy


-Anxiety

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by Coffee Warlord

Double dola.

As I'm going out soon, I'm touching on points now.

Alan T and Anxiety both voting Tyrith concerns me. I have no reason to trust either of them, and neither of them presented much new evidence to push on Tyrith (and really, is there much evidence on him anyway?)

I voted for Anxiety, however I still do question Tyrith, and alot of that is due to how he has been all over the place with his stance on people. In all honesty if he had revealed before Blade died, and Blade confirmed it, I would feel entirely different. This is suddenly very convienant is all since Tyrith was one of my main suspects before.

Pretty much all of my "evidence" on my leading suspects Anxiety, Schmidty and Tyrith are all based on feel on how they are acting. I do believe though if you trust Cronin, jump with him on this one. Its one of the people I have suspected for days, and has not been cleared at all. The fact that almost everyone I trust so far this game feel the same three people are suspects right now, makes me feel pretty good about my opinions of them.

I could be entirely wrong about Anxiety, but he is who Im voting for now. Its a long weekend though, so I think we should discuss all three heavily.

[Coffee Warlord]

My fault there. I coulda sworn I saw another vote on Tyrith.

[Alan T]

Dola, here is the current vote count with 3 days remaining

Anxiety - Cronin (922), Alan T (998), Tyrith (1002)
Hoops - Saldana (1022), Anxiety (1029)

[Schmidty]

Originally Posted by Alan T

Pretty much all of my "evidence" on my leading suspects Anxiety, Schmidty and Tyrith are all based on feel on how they are acting.

This makes absolutely zero sense. I am acting exactly how I do every game.

[hoopsguy]

Saldana, if I've been angle-shooting here, then why hasn't anyone emerged in the last 1.5 days to challenge me as the bodyguard?

Cronin is positive that I'm not a henchman. So you are betting that:
1.) I started the game as the wizard - 1 in 16 chance
2.) I knew that the bodyguard was among the three people dead - not sure what the odds of this are, but wolves have incomplete knowledge of the lynched (two of the dead) and death by lightning bolt doesn't seem to lend itself to getting role info

Since Cronin can only detect henchmen - he knows I'm not a henchman as he knows what that description looks like based on messaging with SirFozzie. He doesn't know what a wizard will smell like - but does "unlucky" sound like a wizard? I would think there is a pretty good chance that the wolf shows up as a normal wolf (kind of like how the seer couldn't pick up the Sith Master in your Star Wars game).

[hoopsguy]

OK, this could be a reach - looking to see if other people think Fozzie would go this way with it:

Blade, Post #636:

A huge light engulfed the sky last night. I thought at first that the wizard was trying to destroy the whole village, but the light seems to be focused on me. I, being the honorable wolf i am, accept my fate and resign to dying properly with my honor intact. Suddenly though, i notice the light seeks out another wolf besides myself as well. Just as the lightning is about to destroy me, it strikes the other wolf. When this happens, there is a howling wind in which the other wolf communicates a message to the wizard about saving his pack from the wizard. With this, the lightning and thunder stops. As it all returns to normal, i hear the other wolf cry out (this is all paraphrasing, so i cant say the exact quote and all) how he will find the wizard, and he shall have his heartsblood run the ground. Mentioned in this second calling also was that the wizard was a traitor to the pack.

The second bolded line here about the wizard as a traitor to the pack has been running through my mind for awhile now. I could see Fozzie getting cute with the brothers, having one as the "honorable" one (mentioned twice in Blade's posted PM) and the other being the less-than-honorable (wizard). I'm probably thinking too hard here, but I would rather post a crazy idea now and then rather than find myself kicking myself later when one actually turns out to be right.

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by Coffee Warlord

My fault there. I coulda sworn I saw another vote on Tyrith.

As far as I know, no one has voted for Tyrith so far today. I have definitly questioned his story as up till now he's been pretty shady. Up till now I have also trusted hoops story enough to not pressure him any, despite being pursued by some known wolves pretty strongly. However I am a bit concerned about his teaming up with Tyrith today. I am leaning towards it just being him trying to be analytical about whats happened more so than coaching answers from Tyrith. I have to guess if they both were bad guys, they would be PMing each other with the setup rather than putting it out in the open like this.

I stand pretty strong by my vote right now and have wanted to go after Anxiety a few days now, and encourage others to do so too. I still however in no way feel any less suspicious about Schmidty or Tyrith despite not voting for them today. I'm not quite sure what either has done to really benefit or help us out so far.

[Coffee Warlord]

Oh. Now I know what I meant. The concern was both of you voting for ANXIETY. The whole point was the fact that I have no reads on either of you, and you both voted for someone who is popping up as a prime suspect.

(This is what I get for spending the last 2 hours at the office drinking)

[hoopsguy]

Schmidty, Post #1024:

The fact that hoops and Tyrith seem to be pushing so hard for me, I am pretty sure that one or both are humans.

I can completely sympathize with this. However, I deeply suspicious of you, Path, and Blade after the late votes against me on Day 2. Two of those three have been proven, in death, to be wolves.

The point I'm trying to make here is if you are playing as a wolf, don't let your frustration over being targeted blind you to the fact that it very well could be wolf-on-wolf. At least not to the point where you aren't giving a hard look to the others in the game. I'm trying very hard to follow my own advice today after being chastened by the results of the last 24 hours.

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by Coffee Warlord

Oh. Now I know what I meant. The concern was both of you voting for ANXIETY. The whole point was the fact that I have no reads on either of you, and you both voted for someone who is popping up as a prime suspect.

(This is what I get for spending the last 2 hours at the office drinking)

Well I can't promise you that Anxiety is a bad guy here, I haven't had very good voting luck so far this game. All I can do is go by my gut though. What I do know is that the number of people I trust strongly, or have pretty decent feel about is growing large. So all I can do is pick out the people who I don't have any good feelings about and try to eliminate them either through lynching or, through third party facts that builds my trust in them.

[Abe Sargent]

Originally Posted by Coffee Warlord

Double dola.

As I'm going out soon, I'm touching on points now.

Alan T and Anxiety both voting Tyrith concerns me. I have no reason to trust either of them, and neither of them presented much new evidence to push on Tyrith (and really, is there much evidence on him anyway?)

I wasn;t voting Tyrith either, but saldana.

-Anxiety

[saldana]

hoops, the thing that really set me off as far as you were concerned is the fact that you turned on me today, after yesterday i was rather high on your trusted list yesterday. you really didnt give a reason, i was just all of the sudden in your crosshairs, and that is not like you at all...you are methodical, deliberate, and thorough, and that action is none of these....in all honesty, what i am seeing from you is a great game of misdirection, pointing everyone away from yourself, which is what you did masterfully well in the Sith game, and ended up running the table against the Jedi.

my vote stands.


(and AE, i am a professional, hence the quality of typing. )

[hoopsguy]

Saldana, as of yesterday I thought that Barkeep was more likely to be angle-shooting than you. But Cronin cleared him this morning (well, unless he can't distinguish wolf from wizard) so I had to reassess my assumptions. Both Barkeep and Coffee were lower on my trust list before Cronin's reveal today.

I continue to be methodical, deliberate, and I like to believe thorough. But I'm not doing very well this game at finding bad guys. I don't like that your vote stands and I don't think you will feel satisfied with the outcome if your vote wins, but so be it. In poker terms, I think you are chasing at best a two-outer here (I know it to be a zero-outer) even with this being a game of incomplete information.

[saldana]

hoops, i am too drunk to go back and check, where is your vote?

[saldana]

dola, are we up against a deadline, or are we in a huge ass day cycle until monday...i dont recall seeing a deterimination of the deadline

[saldana]

double dola, never mind, i read the thread title and see that its monday.

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by saldana

dola, are we up against a deadline, or are we in a huge ass day cycle until monday...i dont recall seeing a deterimination of the deadline

No real rush to get votes out, we have a few days. I think its good to put some action behind people's words though. There is alot of folks listing half the group as people who are "suspicious", so seeing people stand behind their belief is good to have to look back on.

[Tyrith]

At this point, hoops reasoning about the bodyguard thing makes a lot of sense to me. While I don't really like coming out on his side because of the angle it gives people against me, I can't really justify lynching him for the sake of it.

As to yesterday, I was flipping around so much because I was genuinely unsure. We really didn't have any solid evidence to go on, and no one had anything really to go off of even from the posts, so we were just flipping around, and my mind was going with them. If I were a bad guy, it would have been very easy to keep my vote on path and try to bury the vote hours before, instead of switching around like a moron for the last couple of hours. The entire thing was pretty much an inexperience play, with me not having the quiet newbie shield to hide behind anymore. There is also all that I can give you from the PMs between me and blade (which admittedly not a lot) and, probably most importantly, the fact that blade never suspected me, never voted for me, and his story reconciles with mine. Oh, and the fact that if the lovers tradition holds, I might die during the next night cycle anyway. While even this might not be enough to completely clear me, I think it should be enough for me to live another day.

[st.cronin]

Saldana, even if you think hoops is bad, that means he's the WIZARD - which means lynching him is pointless.

hoops, CW, and Barkeep are NOT henchmen, and I'm pretty sure we can only lynch henchmen.

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

Saldana, even if you think hoops is bad, that means he's the WIZARD - which means lynching him is pointless.

hoops, CW, and Barkeep are NOT henchmen, and I'm pretty sure we can only lynch henchmen.

Cronin, I'm not doubting you, but where do you see that Fozzie said he cant be lynched? I tried looking for it, and all I could find was that he is nearly impossible to kill, only in certain circumstances. But the way I interpreteded it, lynching the Wizard he would have the option of fleeing to avoid death (which was one of the victory conditions)? Am I missing something, or just interpreting wrong?

[hoopsguy]

I'm of the same opinion on Tyrith that Cronin is with me - if Tyrith is a bad guy then I think he is the wizard and not a henchman.

Here is where I depart a little bit, though. I'm not convinced that we don't gain from "lynching" the wizard - I agree that we are unlikely to kill him on the first instance, but it might advance the plot (or allow a night kill by a wolf role). For example, in Coffee Warlord's game we had to attack an elemental twice to finish it.

My thoughts are entirely speculative, based on SirFozzie's description in Post #1 (wizard flees, victory conditions). Cronin, do you have anything in terms of role knowledge that validates that we cannot lynch the wizard?