NBA Draft Lottery/Draft/Offseason thread.

[Neon_Chaos]

Wade left Converse for Nike.

God, we might have 3 puppets now.

[whomario]

Originally Posted by ThunderingHERD

Golden State does have some good young players (I like Brandan Wright as well), but Summer league stats really don't mean anything. Last year, for example, Jerryd Bayless scored 30 a game and won the summer league MVP. He averaged 4 ppg on 36% shooting in the regular season.

wasn´t going to take them as important by any means, for Golden State f.e. anyone could see that Randolph can play when he got the chance (and the production was there, too) and Morrow produced like 11 PPG in 22 Minutes last season and simply can shoot the ball like few others while being a decent enough athlete and ball handler to have potential to be more than just a spot up shooter.
I really don´t tend to look at summer league stats but only judged when i see games myself (btw : greedy ass-move by the NBA to charge for summer league ...) . Just brought up Budingers stats because they are kind of ridiculous and perfectly underline what you could see watching the games.
I don´t think he took more than a handful shots that you can´t classify as "great look" and allways seemed to be in the perfect spot to receive the ball, moves extremely well off the ball and makes himself space that way.

And as for Bayless : His problem is that he relies on qualities that are tough to translate into production until you are at a certain level. He´s not a role player but a guy that needs the ball in his hands and needs to attack, a guy that is anything but a spot up shooter. But if you are playing for a good playoff spot and have a Brandon Roy at the 2 you aren´t going to give playing time to a guy that produces like 4 mental errors per Minute on defense and is out of control every other trip on offense. But the talent is definitely there.

[stevew]

Originally Posted by Neon_Chaos

Wade left Converse for Nike.

God, we might have 3 puppets now.

converse is owned by nike, fwiw.

[ThunderingHERD]

Actually, he left Converse for Jordan. And, yes, both are owned by Nike.

[stevew]

In relation to what these guys are paid, do Nike and others actually benefit from the endorsements?
Like how well does the LeBron line sell. Vs. Jordan.


Anyone read a good article on the shoe/endorsements market lately that they'd like to share?

[ThunderingHERD]

Originally Posted by stevew

In relation to what these guys are paid, do Nike and others actually benefit from the endorsements?
Like how well does the LeBron line sell. Vs. Jordan.


Anyone read a good article on the shoe/endorsements market lately that they'd like to share?

I'm not sure what the expectations are when they sign someone like, say, Lebron, and how much of it is tied to their specific shoe lines (vs. just generally being a face of the brand). I've read that the Jordan brand (including Chris Paul and Carmelo Anthony shoes) still dominates the premium shoe market, though, with something like 90% of the market share.

[whomario]

Yao going to sit out the season, surgery next week :

ROCKETS: Yao Ming to undergo surgery next week

basically getting a surgery similar to what Ilgauskas got to fix his foot-problems.

Just heartbreaking if you follow the guy, just a great personality and hard worker ... But maybe this gives him another good run of 3 or 4 years from 2010 on (where he´ll be turning 30 in september).


Bucks sign their former draft pick Ersan Ilyasova again: He left the Bucks after his first 2 years and was in Europe for 2 years playing for Barcelona who now lost 2 of their Front Court players with him and Andersen. Had about 11/7 on 47% shooting including 40% from 3 in both the ACB and the Euroleague. And the Bucks sign him for 3 years and 7 million, indicating he´s propably getting a solid shot at being a rotation player.
Still only 22 years old (well, supposedly anyways ... There´s been a lot of talk about him being actually 3 years older) and a good signing imo.

[Groundhog]

Celtics sign Marquis Daniels, a guy who figures to fit in perfectly to their rotation as a backup SG/SF.

[whomario]

yeah, that´s a good signing. They didn´t have any real backups at those spots last year (Tony Allen maybe, but he also only played like half the games and is short). Daniels can even guard some PGs giving them the option to play him next to Pierce/Allen.
What he can´t do is shoot from long range, so playing him and Rondo together at times would be a challenging in terms of setting up the offense.
But good defender, rebounds some, finishes well and can handle the ball some. And for that kind of money (1,9 mio veteran exception) he´s a bargain.

[whomario]

Quentin Richardson got traded, again. Now to the Timberwolves in exchange with Craig Smith, Telfair and Madsen (wait, he´s still around ?) .
Has a player ever been traded 3 times in less than a month ?

Kind of hilarious. What´s the over/under for the rest of the offseason ?

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by whomario

Quentin Richardson got traded, again. Now to the Timberwolves in exchange with Craig Smith, Telfair and Madsen (wait, he´s still around ?) .
Has a player ever been traded 3 times in less than a month ?

Kind of hilarious. What´s the over/under for the rest of the offseason ?

2.5? Does Q have an expiring contract after next season? If not this trade doesnt make much sense to me.

EDIT I looked it up and he does. Twolves must have plans in place to get some free agents next year. Not exactly sure who would want to go there right now but atleast Kahn is freeing up some of McHales mess.

Its looking like their cap for next season will be around 30 million(2010-2011) which means even with the projected cap of 53 million theyd have 23 million in room which leaves them lots of options.

[JeeberD]

So it's being reported that TMZ has the Lebron getting dunked on video and will be posting it on their site tomorrow...

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by JeeberD

So it's being reported that TMZ has the Lebron getting dunked on video and will be posting it on their site tomorrow...

[Big Fo]

haha I hope so

hopefully his ego isn't too wounded

[Neon_Chaos]

I bet it's not that bad, and LeBron is just being a diva.

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by Big Fo

haha I hope so

hopefully his ego isn't too wounded

This whole deal makes me laugh. Lebron is set up for life and yet he is too much of an egomaniac to help let an 18 year old get over on him and possibly help him out in the future. C'mon Lebron grow a sack.

[albionmoonlight]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

LeBron/Nike had a skills camp. At that camp, a college kid dunked on LeBron. Nike and/or LeBron confiscated the tapes of the dunk.

This turns out to be much worse for LeBron's image than had they/he just let the video out, had a laugh at it, and let it be forgotten in 15 minutes.

[DaddyTorgo]

lol nice

"OMG SOME KID DUNKED ON LEBRON!!! HIS IMAGE IS RUINED!!!"

[Subby]

I thought for sure that with Nike's savvy they would have repackaged it and let it go viral with the message "you wear LeBron's shoes, you dunk on LeBron"

...or something like that.

[Ronnie Dobbs2]

From everything I've read it was LeBron who asked for the footage to be taken, not Nike.

[Neon_Chaos]

Video's up on TMZ.

I'm disappointed. That was it? That's what LeBron wanted confiscated? Jeez.

[Fidatelo]

Uh-ho-ho-ho oh my gawd!

[MikeVic]

Really, that's it? I can't even tell if it's LeBron. Was there any more to this? Seems like a crazy overreaction from Queen James.

[ThunderingHERD]

Ricky Rubio plans to leave Spanish team even if Minnesota Timberwolves can't agree on buyout - ESPN

Spanish basketball clubs Real Madrid and Barcelona are both interested in signing Rubio if he cannot make it to the NBA this season. Unlike the Timberwolves, they are not subject to the collective bargaining rules of the NBA and could pay the entire buyout fee to get him.

[Ronnie Dobbs2]

Originally Posted by MikeVic

Really, that's it? I can't even tell if it's LeBron. Was there any more to this? Seems like a crazy overreaction from Queen James.

Much cleaner version on Ebaums.

hxxp://ebaumnation.com/2009/07/22/jordan-crawford-dunks-on-lebron-james

[Groundhog]

Well that was a massive dissapointment.

[Samdari]

That's much more dunking near him than dunking on him.

[Big Fo]

At least it got ESPN to show Vince Carter's dunk over Frederic Weis in the Olympics again, in a top ten of people getting dunked on.

[Logan]

Nothing gets ESPN more excited than balls in the face of a Frenchman.

[Subby]

Wednesday, July 22, 2009
Who's at the head of the rookie class?

By David Thorpe

Curry, Thabeet, Rubio and Griffin all have the potential to be impact players in year one.

Ranking the rookies before the season relies on a simple formula: Talent plus opportunity equals overall production. Much guesswork remains in terms of predicting opportunity, as teams are still filling out their depth charts, so we'll tweak this list as the offseason moves along. And we'll add more second-rounders once we get a better idea of which ones will actually make a roster.

Until then, here's my first 2009-10 rookie report:

The top 10

1. Blake Griffin, Clippers
His combination of talent, powerful athleticism and passion for the game is unique. And he can be a culture changer for a franchise in desperate need of one.

I once heard Christian Laettner, then starring for back-to-back NCAA championship runs at Duke, explain that the key to his success was that he "played poor." No description better defines Griffin's style -- he plays with an attitude that seems bent on proving he belongs, despite being rich in talent.

2. Tyreke Evans, Kings
Evans is playing for a team in need of talent upgrades, especially at the point guard spot. So it is hard to imagine anything less than 30 minutes a night for this scoring machine.

Similar to Derrick Rose's situation last season, Evans can expect the offense to revolve a good deal around what he does best. The Kings will post him up, spread the floor for him and feature him as the clock winds down on numerous occasions. With his craftiness, length and skill as a finisher, he could lead the rookie class in points per game.

3. Jonny Flynn, Timberwolves
As of today, he's the starting point guard for a team that has great talent inside (and two big bodies to use as ball screens). Flynn has great charisma on the floor, and he can use his jets in both the half-court and full-court game.

Considering the Wolves don't have a backup point guard who demands playing time, Flynn may lead this rookie class in minutes played. And with his confidence and talent, he'll put up very productive numbers. Unless … Ricky Rubio decides to suit up for the Wolves, too.

4. DeMar DeRozan, Raptors
No player impressed me more during the summer league than he did. He played like a bigger version of Courtney Lee -- he was smart with the ball, didn't force things and played off his teammates very well. Those attributes are perfect for his role on the Raps, who look very similar to last season's Magic.

DeRozan can simply make plays within the system and let his veteran teammates carry the tougher work until he evolves into the quality starter he seems destined to become.

5. Brandon Jennings, Bucks
If Ramon Sessions stays in Milwaukee, Jennings will fall out of the top 10. But because Sessions is expected to leave, Jennings projects to play major minutes. And he's too talented not to put up some impressive numbers.

Jennings plays like a true point, looking to score only if it's the best option. And he showed in summer league that he can make players better, especially in transition. As I watched him play in Vegas, I kept thinking, "Who wouldn't like playing with this guy?" If Jennings accepts the tough love he'll get from Bucks coach Scott Skiles, he will be a candidate for rookie of the year.

6. James Harden, Thunder
I think Harden is the second-best American player in this class, but he's competing for playing time with Thabo Sefolosha, an up-and-coming player who does many of the same things Harden does. The Thunder need to develop both guys, which means Harden probably won't get the minutes that the guys ahead of him on this list will.

Still, this gifted passer plays the game beautifully, with a veteran's pace and intelligence, so he'll be productive in the time he gets. Should Sefolosha falter, Harden immediately would become a ROY contender.

7. Stephen Curry, Warriors
On one hand, Curry might have been the second-most disappointing rookie in Vegas (though he was second by a long shot to Hasheem Thabeet), shooting poorly and with seemingly no thoughts behind his actions. But on the other hand, he found a way to contribute in other areas.

Curry will figure out a smarter way to play offense (his coach will help), so it seems likely that he'll end up performing solidly this season.

8. Earl Clark, Suns
As I tweeted from Vegas, it'll be very hard to keep Clark off the floor this season -- primarily, and perhaps a bit ironically, because of his talents on defense. Clark can defend bigs and wings, using his length, quickness and excellent feel for the game. With Phoenix's front line in flux, it looks as though he'll earn ample opportunities to show he deserved to be a high lottery pick.

He's also an excellent passer and a perfect fit in the Suns' offense.

9. Tyler Hansbrough, Pacers
He showed in Orlando summer league that what we saw from him at UNC for four years is what we'll get going forward; he's a beast of a player. He's better off coming off the bench, where his energy will be even more valuable.

One item of concern: Hansbrough relies on getting to the free throw line a great deal, and that might not happen often as a rookie. He's better off focusing on finishing rather than trying to get the whistle. He also will be a factor in the Pacers' transition game, as he rarely fails to race the floor.


10. Jordan Hill, Knicks
Like Clark, the current lack of an identity on the Knicks' front line suggests that Hill will get minutes. And he's the type of player who will perform better when surrounded by veterans who understand spacing and timing. Hill will compete at a high level, and his size and agility combined with his effort will translate well to the Knicks' system.

The next 10

This is where the lack of starter talent jumps out, especially compared with last year's rooks. In truth, that argument can be made after the first seven or eight guys listed above. The next 10 are all solid NBA prospects, but they have a lot of work to do to ensure that their teams don't draft the same position next year.


11. Wayne Ellington, Timberwolves
He's already a good NBA shooter, and he has the rangy athleticism that will help him defend and rebound. Playing with a dynamo point guard (Flynn) and talented bigs (Al Jefferson, Kevin Love) will help him get easier shots, too. The lack of shooting guards on Minnesota's roster should guarantee Ellington minutes from the get-go.

12. DeMarre Carroll, Grizzlies
As I've written over and over again, energy is a talent. Carroll excels in this area. Memphis has a need for his ability, especially when its starters have poor starts. Carroll will change the flavor of a game often enough to continue to demand minutes. He's a solid finisher, too.

13. Darren Collison, Hornets
He'd be a top-10 guy for me if he were playing on almost any other team. His ability to handle the point guard duties for the Hornets will be evident from day one. Of course, playing behind the world's best point guard will make it hard for Collison to play more than 10 minutes a game. Maybe New Orleans coach Byron Scott will develop him earlier and get CP3 more rest during the season.

14. Jeff Teague, Hawks
We didn't see him during summer league, but his talents are undeniable. Although Mike Bibby has a new deal, Teague is Atlanta's point guard of the future. I think we might see them play together some as well.

15. Ty Lawson, Nuggets
When Lawson is the best offensive player on a team, the results may not be pretty. But on a loaded Nuggets squad, he's perfect -- as long as he focuses more on defense. Like Jennings, he's a joy to play alongside.


16. Gerald Henderson, Bobcats
This athletic guard has a chance to fly up our board if he can get playing time from a coach who doesn't just give minutes away to rooks. Of course, Henderson is used to strong coaching, so his learning curve could be swift.

17. Terrence Williams, Nets
He's the hardest guy to project in a sense. He's not much of a scorer. However, he loves to compete, and he's a terrific passer. His athleticism helps him a great deal, too. Will he find a position fast enough to crack the rotation early? I think so, and he could do it as a small forward.

18. Austin Daye, Pistons
He deserves to be higher based on his summer debut, but playing behind Mr. Do-it-all (otherwise known as Tayshaun Prince) suggests that he'll spend most of the season learning and getting stronger

19. Omri Casspi, Kings
"The Zohan" struggled on offense in Vegas, partly because of forced inactivity until his FIBA contract got resolved. He looked more comfortable at the end of summer league, bringing energy and playmaking skills to a team in desperate need of both. Donte Greene's poor performance this summer left the door wide open for Casspi.


20. Toney Douglas, Knicks
Douglas may have been the worst shooter on the worst team in Vegas. But his ability to run a team and defend his position ranked near the top. His shooting woes likely will not continue on the Knicks, and his playmaking and ball-hawking skills will translate into decent minutes.

The best of the rest

Some of these guys are second-round guys; others are first-rounders who looked OK in summer league but are stuck behind too many good players.


James Johnson, Bulls
He showed excellent talent as a passer and had some impressive moments during summer league. But with Luol Deng, John Salmons, Tyrus Thomas and Joakim Noah in front of him at the 3 and 4 spots, how much will he play?

DeJuan Blair, Spurs
Blair did as expected -- he moved people around and got buckets and boards. He has lost 50 pounds since college but still plays "heavy" (below the rim or too slow in transition) too often. However, he could be one of a few rookies playing meaningful minutes in the spring.

Marcus Thornton, Hornets
Thornton needs lots of shots to score, but unlike most volume shooters, he can really play the game. And he brings great tenacity, too. I think he and Collison can end up forming a strong bench nucleus for the Hornets.

DaJuan Summers, Pistons
Might have been a top-five rookie performer in Vegas. The huge changes on Detroit's front line suggest that Summers will spend a lot of time on the court … and in our top 20 eventually.

Jodie Meeks, Bucks
It's hard to ask for more than what Meeks did in Vegas, where he hit a lot of big shots and competed at a high level. He looks like a surefire NBA player, and his attitude seems perfect for the kind of coaching he'll get. He was all business during summer league play.

Chase Budinger, Rockets
The comparisons to Adam Morrison (all offense, no defense) are missing one huge factor: Budinger is a purer shooter than Ammo was coming out of college. Budinger shot incredibly well all week in Vegas and made the best argument possible that he belongs on the Rockets' roster.

Dante Cunningham, Blazers
I'm not sure he'll make Portland's roster this year, but not because of how he played in Vegas. He was a standout there.

The project list


Ricky Rubio, Timberwolves
He's not a project on the court, but getting him to Minnesota seems to be the biggest project facing the T-Wolves. He's going to make everyone on that team better, once he's in uniform. One hundred percent of the executives I spoke with felt he should have been a top four selection, and all cited his master set of passing skills. They also said his shooting is underrated and will get much better in time.

Jrue Holiday, 76ers
Holiday had the double misfortune of not playing the point for an entire season at UCLA (though after watching Collison's talent it's easy to understand why), then getting to do it for the hybrid Nets-Sixers team that never jelled at all. The bad news is that every part of his offensive game seemed below par, but the good news is that his talent was obvious. He's a solid prospect to be sure, and the best news is that he defended the ball better than any guard we saw in either summer league.

Hasheem Thabeet, Grizzlies
This much is certain: The Grizzlies knew they were getting a project when they drafted him. And although his attitude seemed positive and his demeanor on the court was professional, his effort level never came close to what it will take for him to have success in the NBA. His lack of strength, balance or scoring skills is not the issue. Give him that same set of weaknesses, but replace his passion for the games with Blake Griffin's, and Memphis would have a center who would be the envy of the entire league.

[mckerney]

Originally Posted by Subby

Ricky Rubio, Timberwolves
He's not a project on the court, but getting him to Minnesota seems to be the biggest project facing the T-Wolves. He's going to make everyone on that team better, once he's in uniform. One hundred percent of the executives I spoke with felt he should have been a top four selection, and all cited his master set of passing skills. They also said his shooting is underrated and will get much better in time.

David Kahn has reportedly lined up $4 million in endorsement deals that will help pay Rubio's buyout. Plus, trading Sebastian Telfair without really having another PG on the roster besides Flynn it seems he's confident Rubio will be playing for the Wolves next season.

[MikeVic]

Nice to hear about DeRozan.

[Logan]

Originally Posted by MikeVic

Really, that's it? I can't even tell if it's LeBron. Was there any more to this? Seems like a crazy overreaction from Queen James.

Before I realized that Nike put out a statement condemning two journalists for "not respecting their no videotaping policy," I thought I figured out the genius behind this whole scam:

- Be the guy behind the camera when LeBron gets somewhat dunked on.
- Pocket said tape.
- Send emails to blogs like Deadspin saying that LeBron got dunked on by some kid and that he and Nike, in a fit of panic and diva-ness, confiscated all tapes.
- Let the story build up for a few days, when of course LeBron and Nike would deny any wrongdoing.
- Sell tape to TMZ.

If it were only that bad...

[Groundhog]

Originally Posted by Subby

Wednesday, July 22, 2009
1. Blake Griffin, Clippers
His combination of talent, powerful athleticism and passion for the game is unique. And he can be a culture changer for a franchise in desperate need of one.

I once heard Christian Laettner, then starring for back-to-back NCAA championship runs at Duke, explain that the key to his success was that he "played poor." No description better defines Griffin's style -- he plays with an attitude that seems bent on proving he belongs, despite being rich in talent.

A comparison to Laettner and a Clippers uniform should just about doom Griffin's NBA career.

2. Tyreke Evans, Kings
Evans is playing for a team in need of talent upgrades, especially at the point guard spot. So it is hard to imagine anything less than 30 minutes a night for this scoring machine.

Tall PGs have a habit of becoming SGs after a few seasons.

17. Terrence Williams, Nets
He's the hardest guy to project in a sense. He's not much of a scorer. However, he loves to compete, and he's a terrific passer. His athleticism helps him a great deal, too. Will he find a position fast enough to crack the rotation early? I think so, and he could do it as a small forward.

I was surprised to watch Terrence Williams in the summer league, given what I've seen of him in college. He was taking a lot of midrange and longer jumpers, and looked confident taking them, and they were going down more often than not. The rest of his game is pretty tight, so if he can knock down the open J he'll be a solid rotation guy.

DeJuan Blair, Spurs
Blair did as expected -- he moved people around and got buckets and boards. He has lost 50 pounds since college but still plays "heavy" (below the rim or too slow in transition) too often. However, he could be one of a few rookies playing meaningful minutes in the spring.

Don't know how he can be ranked so low. He was a beast in the summer league, and his game should transfer over to the NBA fairly well if he can avoid foul trouble.

Jodie Meeks, Bucks
It's hard to ask for more than what Meeks did in Vegas, where he hit a lot of big shots and competed at a high level. He looks like a surefire NBA player, and his attitude seems perfect for the kind of coaching he'll get. He was all business during summer league play.

Meeks was very impressive. If Redd misses time this season, Meeks will get minutes.

Hasheem Thabeet, Grizzlies
This much is certain: The Grizzlies knew they were getting a project when they drafted him. And although his attitude seemed positive and his demeanor on the court was professional, his effort level never came close to what it will take for him to have success in the NBA. His lack of strength, balance or scoring skills is not the issue. Give him that same set of weaknesses, but replace his passion for the games with Blake Griffin's, and Memphis would have a center who would be the envy of the entire league.

At the beginning of the article he states that Thabeet could be an impact player in his first season, and then at the end of the article details every reason why there is no way in hell that will happen. Thabeet was this year's "Big Guy Project That Somebody Has To Draft in the Lottery But You Hope It Isn't Your Team To Do It", or BGPTSHTDitLBYHIIYTDI for short.

[ThunderingHERD]

Yeh, I don't care for that list. Not sold on Evans, don't like Derozan or Jennings. Curry may get points by virtue of getting minutes and shots, but his efficiency will be awful.

[Warhammer]

I wish the league would force out Michael Heisley as owner of the Grizzlies. Ever since he has taken over more control of the team, the worse they have gotten.

[RainMaker]

Blair was the steal of the draft. They virtually pay him nothing and he can give any team in the league a strong 10 minutes a night off the bench rebounding.

[whomario]

I gotta say one thing about Thabeet though : As crappy as his stats were and as awful he looked at times offensively, the guy changed the game defensively even while not getting anything going. Seriously, everyone had a tough time scoring in the lane when he was in the game.
Haddadi as backup good in that regard as well, the low points allowed by the Grizzlies far from a coincidence.

Other than that i agree about Curry. His shot will come arround and i take a summer league where his shot is off but he looks solid handling the ball and plays better-than-expected defense for encouragement .

@ Groundhog : For that ranking he basically tries to project their impact this year and Blair has gotten pretty stiff competition with the signings of McDyess and Haislip, Bonner is going to get minutes as well. Wouldn´t be surprised if he´s the 4th big at best and hovers at arroung 15 MPG for most of the year with a couple DNPs thrown in depending on matchups.

[Gary Gorski]

Thabeet is awful - but it fits the Grizzlies organization. Memphis could have done something smart in the draft (but that would be out of character for them). Why not trade #2 to the Knicks for #8 and Wilson Chandler? Everyone knows NY wanted Rubio and vice versa - at 8 the Grizz could have gotten Jordan Hill which would fill a need at the 4 (they already have Marc Gasol at the 5) plus Chandler would have been a phenomenal 6th man.

I can't imagine anyone really "wanted" to draft Thabeet - why not stick someone else with that choice? The thing is if they really wanted Thabeet who else was going to take him? OKC maybe but their GM is a pretty savvy guy - I don't think he would have gone with Thabeet. Sacramento has Hawes, Minnesota had 5 and 6 and has Jefferson and Love and Golden State has Biedrins. They could have had something from the Knicks plus gotten Thabeet at 8 potentially and then nobody would have questioned the pick. It's much easier to say you couldn't pass up a chance on a guy like that at 8 than it is at 2.

[albionmoonlight]

Originally Posted by Gary Gorski

Thabeet is awful - but it fits the Grizzlies organization. Memphis could have done something smart in the draft (but that would be out of character for them). Why not trade #2 to the Knicks for #8 and Wilson Chandler? Everyone knows NY wanted Rubio and vice versa - at 8 the Grizz could have gotten Jordan Hill which would fill a need at the 4 (they already have Marc Gasol at the 5) plus Chandler would have been a phenomenal 6th man.

I can't imagine anyone really "wanted" to draft Thabeet - why not stick someone else with that choice? The thing is if they really wanted Thabeet who else was going to take him? OKC maybe but their GM is a pretty savvy guy - I don't think he would have gone with Thabeet. Sacramento has Hawes, Minnesota had 5 and 6 and has Jefferson and Love and Golden State has Biedrins. They could have had something from the Knicks plus gotten Thabeet at 8 potentially and then nobody would have questioned the pick. It's much easier to say you couldn't pass up a chance on a guy like that at 8 than it is at 2.

Good post

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by Gary Gorski

Thabeet is awful - but it fits the Grizzlies organization. Memphis could have done something smart in the draft (but that would be out of character for them).

FWIW......I've been excited of late to see a few articles noting that Memphis may have got a steal drafting Carroll where they did, so perhaps not all is lost. But I do agree with you that Thabeet is overrated as a pro.

[Gary Gorski]

Carroll could make for a good role player in the NBA - 15 to 20 minutes a night of high energy and hustle. You can't have enough of that kind of player on the bench. But if you're a bad team you can't afford to waste top 5 picks.

[MikeVic]

Originally Posted by whomario

I gotta say one thing about Thabeet though : As crappy as his stats were and as awful he looked at times offensively, the guy changed the game defensively even while not getting anything going. Seriously, everyone had a tough time scoring in the lane when he was in the game.
Haddadi as backup good in that regard as well, the low points allowed by the Grizzlies far from a coincidence.

Other than that i agree about Curry. His shot will come arround and i take a summer league where his shot is off but he looks solid handling the ball and plays better-than-expected defense for encouragement .

@ Groundhog : For that ranking he basically tries to project their impact this year and Blair has gotten pretty stiff competition with the signings of McDyess and Haislip, Bonner is going to get minutes as well. Wouldn´t be surprised if he´s the 4th big at best and hovers at arroung 15 MPG for most of the year with a couple DNPs thrown in depending on matchups.

Wasn't Thabeet averaging like 5 fouls a game though? In the summer league. That can't bode well for the regular season. Oden Jr.?

[whomario]

Originally Posted by MikeVic

Wasn't Thabeet averaging like 5 fouls a game though? In the summer league. That can't bode well for the regular season. Oden Jr.?

For this upcoming regular season ? Surely not. But in 3 years he´ll be more than fine imo.
Maybe i´ll look like an idiot on this but that´s fine with me. Thabeet seems like a great kid with great work ethic who improved drastically every year in College and imo will do just that at the NBA Level.
Not saying the Grizzlies made the best choice here but Thabeet will be fine.
And as said : Watching him he made an impact, stats be what they are. I expect more of the same of him in the future.

While we are at it : I still see Oden as a potential DPOY with 18-20 Points thrown in, very interested in seeing him play this year. He got blindsided by the Refs and had trouble adjusting his game to that, but towards the end of the season he looked really spring physichally and produced at a good level.
MacMillan needs to involve him in a lot of Pick and Rolls, he´s shown great ability there.
Too bad Steve Blake can´t run it ...

[Gary Gorski]

What I don't like about Thabeet is that he appears to play with no heart. Everything I've heard about him is that he's really a nice guy and is going to help out his home country and stuff like that - but that just puts him in the Shawn Bradley category. I'll be surprised if he ever has more of an impact in the league than Bradley did.

Oden has just been crushed with injuries. At this point I think his ceiling is lower than what most people thought it would be simply because it's going to obviously be a challenge for him to stay healthy. It's too bad because again, seems like a nice guy and he certainly had a world of potential. If he can manage to stay healthy I think he will still have a very nice career but I just fear that he's going to fall into that chronically unreliable category of player - he's going to put up good numbers but you're going to hold your breath every game hoping he doesn't get hurt - kind of like Yao.

[whomario]

Originally Posted by Gary Gorski

What I don't like about Thabeet is that he appears to play with no heart.

Don´t agree really. Sure he´s not running around screaming, but he´s definitely also not coasting in games or being indifferent. I mean, if you are a lanky 7´3 kid in College you aren´t going to look like Mark Madsen, but from what i saw in College and also in the summer league he definitely plays with heart and also isn´t discouraged easily. When a No2 pick plays terrible offensively and makes a lot of mistakes but still plays with effort every trip and defends hard than i am willing to cut him some slack. Really, Thabeet looked like he had 20/10 games in terms of how he was keeping up his efforte, that really impressed me.

For Oden "crushed with injuries" is not sth i would clame after 2 years of NBA play. If his knee holds up and has healed as supposed (and he did look pretty mobile, getting better there as the season went on too) i am not worried, not more than about any other player playing a competitive sport. Okay, maybe at least not more than about any other 260 pound guy playing basketball
I mean, both those short term injuries last year aren´t really of much concern as both weren´t nescessarily his body breaking down (stepping on a guys foot and banging knees) .

But maybe i just got a heart for the Underdog and the injury plagued players ...

What is interesting is that apparently David Lee still has no offer on the table. Yeah, he´s propably not worth 8 digits but he´s a sure fire Double double with intesity every game, thought that would be worth sth in a sign and trade...

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by MikeVic

Wasn't Thabeet averaging like 5 fouls a game though? In the summer league. That can't bode well for the regular season. Oden Jr.?

I think it takes a couple years for centers to figure out how to play without getting into foul trouble. I remember Tyson Chandler here in Chicago always showed talent but just got into foul trouble too much. It wasn't until his last year in Chicago and first year in New Orleands before he really figured out how to stay out of foul trouble.

I wasn't a fan of the Thabeet pick, but considering Rubio may have given Memphis issues with his overseas team, I can understand why they passed on him. He'll never be an all-star, but he can be an NBA starter in the mold of a Marcus Camby with some more height. A guy who gets you 8 points, 11 rebounds, and 3 blocks a night. That isn't great for the #2 pick in most people's minds, but it's a relatively bad draft and I don't know what other options they had.

Just to toot my own horn, if you go back like 20 pages, I'm the one who said they would take Thabeet right after the lottery.

[Atocep]

Bobcats about to send Emeka Okafor to Hornets for Tyson Chandler - NBA - SI.com

Okafor for Chandler?

[Groundhog]

Dumb trade for Charlotte.

[Coffee Warlord]

Horrid trade for Charlotte.