The official 2008 MLB thread

[DeToxRox]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

bawhahaha

the indians are from ohio.

ohio can go fuck itself

QFT.

[watravaler]

John Danks should have been a lock, but I guess the 2.50 ERA and 1.1 WHIP doesn't go as far as it used to. With that being said, I'll take him out-dueling Harden and the A's any day of the week. Being 120th in run support kills all-star chances, apparently...

[samifan24]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

bawhahaha

the indians are from ohio.

ohio can go fuck itself

And you are...a Red Sox fan?

[Jas_lov]

Brett Gardner beats Papelbon! Yankees stay within 3 games of the Sox. Great game.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by samifan24

And you are...a Red Sox fan?

I'm an ohio-hater first and foremost.

[samifan24]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

I'm an ohio-hater first and foremost.

Sorry to hear that.

[Jas_lov]

Originally Posted by watravaler

John Danks should have been a lock, but I guess the 2.50 ERA and 1.1 WHIP doesn't go as far as it used to. With that being said, I'll take him out-dueling Harden and the A's any day of the week. Being 120th in run support kills all-star chances, apparently...

I agree. He should have gotten in over one of the 2 Angels starters that got picked. And I apologize to Francona, I think he picked Varitek. Are the players who vote even paying attention to Varitek's atrocious season? Jermaine Dye deserves to go too, but he'll have to beat Giambi and Longoria in the fan vote to get there.

[Mantle2600]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

I'm an ohio-hater first and foremost.

We hate you too.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by Jas_lov

I agree. He should have gotten in over one of the 2 Angels starters that got picked. And I apologize to Francona, I think he picked Varitek.

Really? Which one? The one tied for the AL and MLB in wins, or the one with the third most Ks in the league?

Not saying Denks doesn't deserve, but Santana and Saunders deserve as much as anyone.

[Izulde]

I think Longoria deserves to go over Dye, to be honest.

And now that Joe Crede's an All-Star can we please trade him at this inflated value and bring Josh Fields back up?

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Mantle2600

We hate you too.

LOL. I know at least one person there does.

(I hate with reason - bitter towards a certain single person in OH, if you get my drift)

[Chief Rum]

Checking out Danks, he is actually a tough call, and not so straight forward. Yes, he has a better ERA than Santana and Saunders (Santana has the "worst" ERA on the All Star staff at 3.28 except for Sherrill), but he is only 5-4. Yes, wins are a crappy stat at times, but they do make a difference. Plus, Danks is actually closer to 1.20 WHIP, rather than 1.1, and Santana beats his WHIP significantly there, along with the wins and Ks. And Saunders, as I said, leads the AL in wins. He might even be the starter, I am thinking.

No, if Danks were to get in, the guy I actually think should have been left off was probably a homer or player pick: Papelbon. Not that 2.19 ERA and 25 saves is bad, but there are six relievers on the squad. The Red Sox have plenty of representation, and frankly, Papelbon isn't having as good a year as Soria, Rivera, Nathan or K-Rod. And Sherrill, I think, is the O's lone rep. The staff is over-represented with relievers as it is. Papelbon should be on vacation next week while Danks or maybe another pitcher (a starter), like Shields (James) should be in NY.

[Jas_lov]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

Really? Which one? The one tied for the AL and MLB in wins, or the one with the third most Ks in the league?

Not saying Denks doesn't deserve, but Santana and Saunders deserve as much as anyone.

Saunders

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by Jas_lov

Saunders

You would leave the league leader in wins off of the All Star team? I don't think that has ever happened. Saunders also has a better WHIP than Danks, while whipping him on win/loss record. Neither are strikeout mavens (Danks has the edge there).

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by Izulde

I think Longoria deserves to go over Dye, to be honest.

And now that Joe Crede's an All-Star can we please trade him at this inflated value and bring Josh Fields back up?

I agree with this. Put Danks in, take Papelbon out. White Sox are repped, so we can remove Dye and put in Longoria, who should be on the team.

[Crapshoot]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

You would leave the league leader in wins off of the All Star team? I don't think that has ever happened. Saunders also has a better WHIP than Danks, while whipping him on win/loss record. Neither are strikeout mavens (Danks has the edge there).

Yes, because wins are a context-dependent statistics. Evaluating pitchers by wins is only slightly better than evaluating hitters by RBI's (in the short term).

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by Crapshoot

Yes, because wins are a context-dependent statistics. Evaluating pitchers by wins is only slightly better than evaluating hitters by RBI's (in the short term).

What about WHIP?

[SackAttack]

Originally Posted by Jas_lov

Brett Gardner beats Papelbon! Yankees stay within 3 games of the Sox. Great game.

Or, y'know, within 4 games. Same difference.

I do get a laugh out of the Yankees and the Red Sox fighting tooth and nail...over second place.

To the Rays.

The best-record-in-the-majors Rays.

It's like a ludicrous Disney movie made flesh.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Hey, the Royals have a new streak going! Yeah!

Oh, wait. It's another losing streak.

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by SackAttack

Or, y'know, within 4 games. Same difference.

I do get a laugh out of the Yankees and the Red Sox fighting tooth and nail...over second place.

To the Rays.

The best-record-in-the-majors Rays.

It's like a ludicrous Disney movie made flesh.

Yep .

For one of the few times ever I was rooting for the Yanks over the Red Sox, to give the Rays a bit more breathing room on top of the division. The Rays just have to keep on winning (I know, easier said than done) and I hope the Red Sox and Yankees take each other out (as well as the rest of the league ).

[molson]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

Yep .

For one of the few times ever I was rooting for the Yanks over the Red Sox, to give the Rays a bit more breathing room on top of the division. The Rays just have to keep on winning (I know, easier said than done) and I hope the Red Sox and Yankees take each other out (as well as the rest of the league ).

And their schedule the rest of the way is far weaker than what it's been up to this point.

[Ksyrup]

Rays have 2 against the Yanks starting tomorrow, then on to Cleveland, where I think they might have faced CC is he hadn't been traded.

[rkmsuf]

Rays will tighten right up down the stretch.

[hoopsguy]

I thought that Longoria belonged ahead of Crede (17 errors!) but that the White Sox got screwed on the Varitek thing. Is there another AL catcher that belonged ahead of AJ Pierzynski?

Dye is also having a very solid season - particularly against my Cubs - but the AL outfield picture is a lot more competitive than the one in the NL.

Danks - has there ever been an All-Star with 6 wins? That is a pretty low number, even if it "context dependent". He has been terrific, but I have a hard time explaining him as an All-Star ahead of the guys on the roster.

[ISiddiqui]

Laird may have belonged on the team, but he has had a season limited by injury.

Longoria did get screwed, but he's a rook and that happens sometimes. Still has a chance. Though I think Giambi got screwed over by Mourneau. And Dye should have made the squad too.

For the final vote, I picked Longoria (for the NL I took Burrell).

[Ksyrup]

Originally Posted by rkmsuf

Rays will tighten right up down the stretch.

Eh, they're probably not THIS good, but if they falter, it'll be more likely due to guys coming to earth a bit and tiring out, as opposed to not having enough of a "veteran presence" or "being too young to handle the pressure" or some nonsense like that.

[Ksyrup]

I tihnk the players did Varitek a disservice by voting for him rather than honoring him, since now he's got to play in the game with those awful numbers that will be even more highlighted compared to the rest of the team.

[rkmsuf]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

Eh, they're probably not THIS good, but if they falter, it'll be more likely due to guys coming to earth a bit and tiring out, as opposed to not having enough of a "veteran presence" or "being too young to handle the pressure" or some nonsense like that.

call it what you will

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

Eh, they're probably not THIS good, but if they falter, it'll be more likely due to guys coming to earth a bit and tiring out, as opposed to not having enough of a "veteran presence" or "being too young to handle the pressure" or some nonsense like that.

On the other hand, Pena has been utterly HORRIBLE early this year and is just coming out of it. On the same token, Garza is really coming into his own. And Crawford has been playing below his career numbers. So I think that rise will counter any coming back to Earth of Longoria or Navarro.

[JonInMiddleGA]

After losing three players (2 RP's & a UTIL) to the DL yesterday, the Braves recall Francoeur after just three days in the minors.

He hit over .500 down in AA but what remains to be seen is whether the problem was mental (and should now be corrected) or physical (because major league pitchers are a lot tougher than AA pitchers).

If I had to guess what'll happen, I think the most likely outcome is that he hits around .280 through the rest of July & then regresses back around .240-.260 for the rest of the season.

[ISiddiqui]

Has Franky learned in his 3 days in the minors that sometimes you just gotta take some pitches and maybe even a walk ever once in a while?

[Ksyrup]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

On the other hand, Pena has been utterly HORRIBLE early this year and is just coming out of it. On the same token, Garza is really coming into his own. And Crawford has been playing below his career numbers. So I think that rise will counter any coming back to Earth of Longoria or Navarro.

We'll see. I knew they'd be good, just not this good, this fast. But look at the 1991 World Series. Neither of those teams had any real let down and still finished with around 95 wins each, I think.

[Ksyrup]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

After losing three players (2 RP's & a UTIL) to the DL yesterday, the Braves recall Francoeur after just three days in the minors.

He hit over .500 down in AA but what remains to be seen is whether the problem was mental (and should now be corrected) or physical (because major league pitchers are a lot tougher than AA pitchers).

If I had to guess what'll happen, I think the most likely outcome is that he hits around .280 through the rest of July & then regresses back around .240-.260 for the rest of the season.

If he didn't have a mental problem before, he sure will now, since he called the decision to send him down a "betrayal" and questioned Wren's 3-minute "we're sending you down" meeting. Neyer had a blog entry about this, and basically showed that more than anything, he's just been unlucky this year. Add in the fact that he's not really as good as people think he is (although he has improved his walk rate, to his credit), and he'll eventually get back to what he was.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

Has Franky learned in his 3 days in the minors that sometimes you just gotta take some pitches and maybe even a walk ever once in a while?

Sunday: 4-5, 0 BB, 1 K
Saturday: 1-4, 0 BB, 1 K
Friday: 2-4, 1 BB, 0 K

3 game total 7-13, 1 3B, 2 RBI, 1 BB, 2 K's

[ISiddiqui]

While it was a joke, at least he had one .

The funny thing is that the one Braves game I went to see this season (against the Mets, of course), the guys sitting next to us informed us that Franky, no matter what the pitcher throws will swing on the first two pitches without fail. Franky then proceeded to prove this person right 3 out of the 4 at bats during the game (including swinging at some UGLY pitches). The last one, when he layed off the 2nd pitch, the fans in our section were literally cheering... it was great stuff .

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

... Franky, no matter what the pitcher throws will swing on the first two pitches without fail. Franky then proceeded to prove this person right 3 out of the 4 at bats during the game (including swinging at some UGLY pitches). The last one, when he layed off the 2nd pitch, the fans in our section were literally cheering... it was great stuff .

His career splits are kind of interesting to look at.
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/player...&type=batting3

1550 career AB's.
310 AB's on 0-0 counts
159 AB's on 0-1 counts
159 AB's on 0-2 counts

But he actually appears to lay off more than it seems from just watching him.
698 AB's after 0-1 counts, 542 AB's after 1-0 counts (plus the 310 first pitch AB's). Just from watching him I wouldn't have given you a nickel for the odds of him being 1-0 roughly 1/3rds of his AB's.

[ISiddiqui]

Yep.. and that's why we have statistical analysis.

Good job, JIMG!

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

Hey, the Royals have a new streak going! Yeah!

Oh, wait. It's another losing streak.

Good job jynxing that one

SI

[Chief Rum]

Shades of Erstad. Somewhere Estrada is shaking in his boots. Not Ramirez, though.

I just watched a Rangers C named Ramirez (never heard of him) basically take a charging wall while standing blocking the plate against Jeff Mathis. Knocked him completely off his feet and a few feet back. But he held onto the ball for the out. Then after being momentarily dazed, he suddenly jumps up and guns out Kotchman trying to take third while Ramirez was "dazing" on the ground. Way to play tough, Ramirez (even if it was against my Angels).

You'll probably be able to see it on Sportscenter.

[Logan]

Willy Wagner is currently causing me to pull out my hair...all over my body.

[Logan]

Congrats on YOUR FUCKING SAVE ALL STAR.

[Lathum]

they tried hard to blow that game

[MrBug708]

So...um...Dodger game?

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by MrBug708

So...um...Dodger game?

Watching. But from my experience, you guys should be losing.

[larrymcg421]

Braves win a crazy game (a one run game at that!) in 17 innings. Terrific performance from the bullpen, with 11 shutout innings.

[Coffee Warlord]

Just announced. Sorry to see Murton go, I always liked him.

The Cubs answered the Brewers acquisition of CC Sabathia, picking up Rich Harden and Chad Gaudin from Oakland on Tuesday for Sean Gallagher, Eric Patterson, Matt Murton and Josh Donaldson.

The right-handed Harden is 5-1 with an 2.34 earned-run average and 92 strikeouts over 13 games for Oakland, bolsters a Cubs rotation that just got saw the return of Carlos Zambrano.

Harden is 36-19 with a 3.42 ERA and a .224 opponents average over his career.

Patterson and Murton had spent time between Chicago and Triple-A Iowa this season. Patterson hit .237 with 1 home run, 7 runs batted in and 2 stolen bases in 13 games in Chicago this season. Murton hit .250 with 6 RBI in 19 games with the Cubs this season.

Gaudin is expected to join the Cubs bullpen but could spot start if needed, general manager Jim Hendry said. He is 5-3 with a 3.59 ERA over 62 2/3 innings. He has struck out 44 and walked 17. He is 24-23 over his career with 4.33 ERA, 299 strikeouts and 197 walks.

Gallagher went 3-4, 4.45 with the Cubs this season. Donaldson was with Double-A Peoria.

[Neuqua]

Hopefully Harden can stay healthy enough...

[hoopsguy]

Hard to believe that after rooting for Wood + Prior for about five years that we now have a guy who is a bigger injury risk than either of them. Love Harden when he pitches, but it seems like he is always hurt.

I won't miss Matt Murton at all, but Gallagher is a decent prospect. Not sure about Patterson quite yet - he crushed the White Sox for a couple of days but otherwise has been very non-descript at the big league level. No idea about the 4th prospect (Donaldson). As Ronnie said, Beane usually does pretty well at assessing talent.

[Logan]

Jesus. Anyone see the 2nd at bat in the Mets-Giants game? Fred Lewis on 1st, ground ball to 2nd, Easley fields it cleanly, goes to tag Lewis. Lewis runs onto the grass by about 3 feet, right in front of the umpire, causing Easley to miss the tag, and he throws to 1st for the sole out. No help from any umpire.

[watravaler]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

Checking out Danks, he is actually a tough call, and not so straight forward. Yes, he has a better ERA than Santana and Saunders (Santana has the "worst" ERA on the All Star staff at 3.28 except for Sherrill), but he is only 5-4. Yes, wins are a crappy stat at times, but they do make a difference. Plus, Danks is actually closer to 1.20 WHIP, rather than 1.1, and Santana beats his WHIP significantly there, along with the wins and Ks. And Saunders, as I said, leads the AL in wins. He might even be the starter, I am thinking.

No, if Danks were to get in, the guy I actually think should have been left off was probably a homer or player pick: Papelbon. Not that 2.19 ERA and 25 saves is bad, but there are six relievers on the squad. The Red Sox have plenty of representation, and frankly, Papelbon isn't having as good a year as Soria, Rivera, Nathan or K-Rod. And Sherrill, I think, is the O's lone rep. The staff is over-represented with relievers as it is. Papelbon should be on vacation next week while Danks or maybe another pitcher (a starter), like Shields (James) should be in NY.

No doubt, after looking at the numbers Danks certainly wasn't a lock, and I do believe it's probably better(strategy-wise) to stack the squad with closers. With that being said, I do think the AL's best pitching staff(by the numbers) deserved to have a representative at the game, Danks/Floyd/Jenks/Linebrink, whoever, but it matters not. As long as the AL wins!