Am I In The Wrong? - Page 2

Ronnie Dobbs2 · 12-10-2009, 11:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Sak

See that's my point. I am far from a perfect person and have done somethings that I regret now. So I don't feel that I have the right to judge him or tell him that he's screwing up.

If a real friend of mine ever thought I was fucking something up, I would hope he tells me.

edit: Though I've come to realize I am not really lockstep with my peers on many things.

RomaGoth · 12-10-2009, 11:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ronnie Dobbs2

If a real friend of mine ever thought I was fucking something up, I would hope he tells me.

This is exactly how I see things. Unfortunately, society doesn't seem to think it's ok to do this, because of the whole "look at your life, you have fucked up too so who are you to talk" mentality.

I think Sak has every right to say something to his friend, regardless of his own mistakes, such as they are.

MacroGuru · 12-10-2009, 11:49 AM

Not overboard, call him out on it and what he is doing. Especially if you are his friend.

Sometimes it takes a smack upside the head by someone that we know or "protects" us to truly wake us up.

CraigSca · 12-10-2009, 11:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Sak

See that's my point. I am far from a perfect person and have done somethings that I regret now. So I don't feel that I have the right to judge him or tell him that he's screwing up.

But, there's a child involved (or soon to be). No one's perfect, but I don't see that as a reason not to let a friend know what he's doing is wrong. I mean, I'm not sure, but I don't really think it's a grey area here. Of course, there's a wrong way and a right way to go about it.

Ronnie Dobbs2 · 12-10-2009, 11:50 AM

Yeah, he'll probably be pissed about it. That's the natural reaction. No one likes being told they're in the wrong. But if he's got half a brain and the advice is right, he'll come around to it.

MacroGuru · 12-10-2009, 11:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CraigSca

But, there's a child involved (or soon to be). No one's perfect, but I don't see that as a reason not to let a friend know what he's doing is wrong. I mean, I'm not sure, but I don't really think it's a grey area here. Of course, there's a wrong way and a right way to go about it.

Bingo - just a personal example...my move out to Buffalo went great until my company folded on me and I went back traveling with my old company. My wife hit a major depression and was thinking maybe she didn't want to be married anymore, she missed out on life...yada yada.

She called me up when I was on the road asked me to move out so she could "find herself"....I was shocked, tore up and emotional over it...but it took her parents and her friends here saying you need to wake up you have 3 kids, there is nothing wrong in your life, you are just away from a main support structure and branch out.

She called me back within 2 days after and rescinded her statement, begging me to forgive her and told me what her friends and family said, oh and she was pissed at them for pointing out that she was being a jackass but got over it.

edit: I was still in a stressful funk when I got home but Render helped me get out of that one...with a night of lots of alcohol.

RomaGoth · 12-10-2009, 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MacroGuru

Bingo - just a personal example...my move out to Buffalo went great until my company folded on me and I went back traveling with my old company. My wife hit a major depression and was thinking maybe she didn't want to be married anymore, she missed out on life...yada yada.

She called me up when I was on the road asked me to move out so she could "find herself"....I was shocked, tore up and emotional over it...but it took her parents and her friends here saying you need to wake up you have 3 kids, there is nothing wrong in your life, you are just away from a main support structure and branch out.

She called me back within 2 days after and rescinded her statement, begging me to forgive her and told me what her friends and family said, oh and she was pissed at them for pointing out that she was being a jackass but got over it.

edit: I was still in a stressful funk when I got home but Render helped me get out of that one...with a night of lots of alcohol.

Glad to hear things turned out ok for you and your wife. Doesn't "Buffalo" = "Alcohol" in the English language?

RendeR · 12-10-2009, 12:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RomaGoth

Glad to hear things turned out ok for you and your wife. Doesn't "Buffalo" = "Alcohol" in the English language?

Buffalo is a great drinking town with a "sports" problem....

RendeR · 12-10-2009, 12:31 PM

Oh and just to put my nickel in here:

Sack just do this:
Go to the door, stand next to it and say
"Dude, look, Your my friend and I let you stay here as a friend because I wanted you to be able tow ork this through."

"However, you're a royal prick for screwing around on your wife. You have a child on teh way and you're using me and my home as some sort of Party zone where you think you can act like a teenager and not get caught for it."

"You need to leave. You need to get your shit together and talk to your wife and figure out WTF you need to do."

"Stop acting like a fucking moron"

"I hope you work things out, but you gotta get outta my house"

then stand there until he leaves.

ISiddiqui · 12-10-2009, 12:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RomaGoth

This is exactly how I see things. Unfortunately, society doesn't seem to think it's ok to do this, because of the whole "look at your life, you have fucked up too so who are you to talk" mentality.

I think that comes more from the Sermon on the Mount (Matthew 7:1-4)...

Anyways, the excesses of P.C. to me comes from a very judgemental point of view. Ie, "you should call these people this term because doing otherwise would be offensive to them" is a pretty judgmental sentiment to me.

Logan · 12-10-2009, 12:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cuervo72

Tell Tiger to find his own damned place!

This is the greatest FOFC response ever.

Marc Vaughan · 12-10-2009, 12:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Sak

The only reason i ask this is because i was out to dinner with him and one of his co-workers who knows about this situation and she berated me for throwing him out. Asking me what kind of friend am I.

Hope you asked her how long she was happy to have him stay with her ... I would have

I'm sorry - you've been a good friend, but he has to get on with his life and you have your own to live, I don't know your situation but for example if you have a girlfriend that relationship could be seriously damaged by having a live in lodger (similarly but different if you don't but get one you have the same issue).

Eaglesfan27 · 12-10-2009, 12:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ronnie Dobbs2

You agreed that he would stay for a week. You are doing a huge favor for him. Him not being ready to leave by the agreed time makes him totally in the wrong.

Haven't read the rest of the responses, but this sums up my reply perfectly.

BishopMVP · 12-10-2009, 12:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eaglesfan27

Haven't read the rest of the responses, but this sums up my reply perfectly.

+2. I've crashed on friends couches, had friends crash on mine but it's always with a game plan and eventual end goal. You did the most important part by stating he was good for a week upfront, and now he hasn't been taking proactive steps to solve the problem, so give him the kick in the ass he needs. He clearly won't be sleeping on the street tomorrow.

Logan · 12-10-2009, 01:16 PM

Good job helping Macro render.

Lathum · 12-10-2009, 01:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Sak

See that's my point. I am far from a perfect person and have done somethings that I regret now. So I don't feel that I have the right to judge him or tell him that he's screwing up.

Big deal.

If you are good enough friends that he feels comfortable asking if he can crash at your place then you should be able to tell him he is being a wanker.

I sure as hell know Saldana would rip me to shreds if I acted the way your friend is, as would I rip him if the roles were reversed.

( insert jokes here)

Dr. Sak · 12-10-2009, 01:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lathum

( insert jokes here)

Seriously though...thanks everyone for all your advice

BrianD · 12-10-2009, 01:36 PM

The reason he asked to stay with you rather than with his family is because he knows that there is a better chance of you letting him avoid growing up and facing his problems. Really, if you let him stay and make your place into his party-house, you are just enabling him. If he was working on his troubles and not quite done, then kicking him out might be bad. As it stands now, kicking him out will make him face his problems and work toward a solution. It may be painful, but it will be good for him in the long run.

DanGarion · 12-10-2009, 02:54 PM

When did you start hanging out with Tiger Woods?

ISiddiqui · 12-10-2009, 03:00 PM

Too late!!

DanGarion · 12-10-2009, 03:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

Too late!!

Yeah. Oh well.

RendeR · 12-10-2009, 05:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Logan

Good job helping Macro render.

I just drove him around and got him drunk.

MacroGuru · 12-10-2009, 05:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RendeR

I just drove him around and got him drunk.

Which makes you a saint in some circles

RendeR · 12-10-2009, 05:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MacroGuru

Which makes you a saint in some circles

*quietly polishes his halo*

cougarfreak · 12-10-2009, 05:34 PM

You're a better friend that I am. I'd tell him to get his shit together, grow up, and be a responsible adult.

dawgfan · 12-10-2009, 06:57 PM

Just to re-state what many others have already said: no, you're not in the wrong. Not in the slightest in fact.

While acknowledging that I obviously don't know all the details, based off what you've said is going on, seems clear your buddy wasn't really ready to settle down. He still thinks he's hot shit, and he was struggling with the idea of being with one woman for the rest of his life. Maybe his wife is letting herself go, or maybe he's over-stating things to try to justify being a cheater. And now that she's pregnant, he's panicking.

From what you've said, this situation is pretty much his deal - he's freaking out about being committed to his wife for the rest of his life and now having a child, which will greatly change his life.

You were very nice to offer him a place to stay, but it's clear he's not really interested in figuring things out - if that were the case, he'd be staying with family. No, he's interested in having an easier time hooking up with other women without any judgment.

You've been more than fair with him. Time for him to grow up and address his issues. It's too bad he didn't do so before his wife got pregnant, but hopefully for the child's sake he figures his shit out, whether that's staying with his wife and committing himself to really work on his marriage, or making a decisive break and not stringing things along with a series of affairs behind her back. Either way, he'll need to commit himself to being a good father.

And regardless of your past, that doesn't mean you can't offer up your opinion of what he's doing. Being a good friend sometimes means applying a figurative (and occasionally an actual) slap across the face.

cuervo72 · 12-10-2009, 06:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cougarfreak

You're a better friend that I am

Dr. Din?

Drake · 12-10-2009, 09:07 PM

Quote:

Maybe his wife is letting herself go, or maybe he's over-stating things to try to justify being a cheater.

Ding.

If a handbook exists for cheaters, this is on page one, second paragraph. First paragraph contains the phrase "my wife hasn't had sex with me in years[1]."

If I was wagering on this, I'd bet his wife's apparent depression is very likely directly related to the fact that he's a cheating, dishonest, lying bastard. Being around toxic people has a tendency of taking a toll on even the healthiest individuals.

[1] Sorry, cuervo.

JHandley · 12-10-2009, 09:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Sak

The only reason i ask this is because i was out to dinner with him and one of his co-workers who knows about this situation

It has been my experience that this isn't true. I'm quite certain she thinks this is true. It's always been fascinating to me that people get caught up in the fallacy that "Sure, he's lying to everyone else, but he's telling me the truth." This guy is a cheater which, by definition, means he's a liar. He has absolutely zero credibility.

There is no reason to believe he's treating you or this co-worker, with more respect than he treats either his wife or the women he's sleeping with. He's simply giving you enough of the story to make him still be likeable.

I'm with you on giving him a place to live for a week, but if you wait on him to draw the line on when enough is enough, he'll never get there.

cuervo72 · 12-10-2009, 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drake

[1] Sorry, cuervo.

It is what it is. I'm thinking I'm about due though, so being optimistic.

Solecismic · 12-11-2009, 02:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RendeR

Buffalo is a great drinking town with a "sports" problem....

Good to know. I'll be there this weekend.

Yeah, the handbook on affairs begins with the justification. How someone cheats on a child who needs both a mother and a father to make the most of his or her life is beyond my limited comprehension.

Regret your marriage? Get out before you cheat, before you decide to bring an innocent child into the equation.

Dr. Sak · 12-11-2009, 07:23 AM

A little update....had a talk with him last night. He packed his stuff up and went to his parents.

MacroGuru · 12-11-2009, 07:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Sak

A little update....had a talk with him last night. He packed his stuff up and went to his parents.

Awesome...now the true question is...How did he take it?

Dr. Sak · 12-11-2009, 07:28 AM

We talked over IM cause I wasn't going to get home till late cause of the gym. He sent me an email saying that he got his stuff and is going over to his parents. It was going to be easier that way. He thanked me for letting him stay and said if I wanted to hang out this weekend to let him know.

Mizzou B-ball fan · 12-11-2009, 07:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Sak

We talked over IM cause I wasn't going to get home till late cause of the gym. He sent me an email saying that he got his stuff and is going over to his parents. It was going to be easier that way. He thanked me for letting him stay and said if I wanted to hang out this weekend to let him know.

Sounds like he was at least smart enough to realize he was overstaying his welcome. Good to see he didn't take it out on you.

Moving in with his parents is probably the best thing for him. Eventually, they'll drive him nuts and he'll have to confront the situation at hand.

SportsDino · 12-11-2009, 08:06 AM

Looks resolved, but you say a week thats all you had to give. It was charity to begin with, and nothing irks me more than people think you give a little all the sudden you OWE something. Seems like your friend realized it was stupid and settled down.

RomaGoth · 12-11-2009, 08:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Sak

We talked over IM cause I wasn't going to get home till late cause of the gym. He sent me an email saying that he got his stuff and is going over to his parents. It was going to be easier that way. He thanked me for letting him stay and said if I wanted to hang out this weekend to let him know.

Sounds like he took it pretty well. Hopefully his parents will help him get his life together.

12-10-2009, 11:49 AM	#53
MacroGuru Coordinator Join Date: May 2003 Location: Utah	Not overboard, call him out on it and what he is doing. Especially if you are his friend. Sometimes it takes a smack upside the head by someone that we know or "protects" us to truly wake us up. __________________ "forgetting what is in the past, I strive for the future"

12-10-2009, 11:50 AM	#55
Ronnie Dobbs2 Pro Rookie Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Bahston Mass	Yeah, he'll probably be pissed about it. That's the natural reaction. No one likes being told they're in the wrong. But if he's got half a brain and the advice is right, he'll come around to it. __________________ There's no I in Teamocil, at least not where you'd think

12-10-2009, 12:31 PM	#59
RendeR Coordinator Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Buffalo, NY	Oh and just to put my nickel in here: Sack just do this: Go to the door, stand next to it and say "Dude, look, Your my friend and I let you stay here as a friend because I wanted you to be able tow ork this through." "However, you're a royal prick for screwing around on your wife. You have a child on teh way and you're using me and my home as some sort of Party zone where you think you can act like a teenager and not get caught for it." "You need to leave. You need to get your shit together and talk to your wife and figure out WTF you need to do." "Stop acting like a fucking moron" "I hope you work things out, but you gotta get outta my house" then stand there until he leaves. __________________ http://wotlabs.net/s...8/signature.png http://wotlabs.net/sig_dark/na/banichi18/signature.png

12-10-2009, 02:54 PM	#69
DanGarion Coordinator Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: The Great Northwest	When did you start hanging out with Tiger Woods? __________________ Los Angeles Dodgers Check out the FOFC Groups on Facebook! and Reddit! DON'T REPORT ME BRO!

12-10-2009, 03:00 PM	#70
ISiddiqui Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Decatur, GA	Too late!! __________________ "A prayer for the wild at heart, kept in cages" -Tennessee Williams

12-10-2009, 01:16 PM	#65
Logan Head Coach Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: NYC	Good job helping Macro render.

12-10-2009, 01:36 PM	#68
BrianD Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Appleton, WI	The reason he asked to stay with you rather than with his family is because he knows that there is a better chance of you letting him avoid growing up and facing his problems. Really, if you let him stay and make your place into his party-house, you are just enabling him. If he was working on his troubles and not quite done, then kicking him out might be bad. As it stands now, kicking him out will make him face his problems and work toward a solution. It may be painful, but it will be good for him in the long run.

12-10-2009, 05:34 PM	#75
cougarfreak College Starter Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Out of Grad School Hell :)	You're a better friend that I am. I'd tell him to get his shit together, grow up, and be a responsible adult.

12-10-2009, 06:57 PM	#76
dawgfan Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Seattle	Just to re-state what many others have already said: no, you're not in the wrong. Not in the slightest in fact. While acknowledging that I obviously don't know all the details, based off what you've said is going on, seems clear your buddy wasn't really ready to settle down. He still thinks he's hot shit, and he was struggling with the idea of being with one woman for the rest of his life. Maybe his wife is letting herself go, or maybe he's over-stating things to try to justify being a cheater. And now that she's pregnant, he's panicking. From what you've said, this situation is pretty much his deal - he's freaking out about being committed to his wife for the rest of his life and now having a child, which will greatly change his life. You were very nice to offer him a place to stay, but it's clear he's not really interested in figuring things out - if that were the case, he'd be staying with family. No, he's interested in having an easier time hooking up with other women without any judgment. You've been more than fair with him. Time for him to grow up and address his issues. It's too bad he didn't do so before his wife got pregnant, but hopefully for the child's sake he figures his shit out, whether that's staying with his wife and committing himself to really work on his marriage, or making a decisive break and not stringing things along with a series of affairs behind her back. Either way, he'll need to commit himself to being a good father. And regardless of your past, that doesn't mean you can't offer up your opinion of what he's doing. Being a good friend sometimes means applying a figurative (and occasionally an actual) slap across the face.

12-11-2009, 07:23 AM	#82
Dr. Sak Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Stuck in Yinzerville, PA	A little update....had a talk with him last night. He packed his stuff up and went to his parents.

12-11-2009, 07:28 AM	#84
Dr. Sak Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Stuck in Yinzerville, PA	We talked over IM cause I wasn't going to get home till late cause of the gym. He sent me an email saying that he got his stuff and is going over to his parents. It was going to be easier that way. He thanked me for letting him stay and said if I wanted to hang out this weekend to let him know.

12-11-2009, 08:06 AM	#86
SportsDino College Prospect Join Date: Oct 2001	Looks resolved, but you say a week thats all you had to give. It was charity to begin with, and nothing irks me more than people think you give a little all the sudden you OWE something. Seems like your friend realized it was stupid and settled down.

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