I Have Been Saved

[Anthony]

Originally Posted by lighthousekeeper

wow good for you dude. now can you fill us in on the extreme whoring? what was that like?

i think i jacked to "Extreme Whoring 4: The Assgasm" last week. it was ok, but these days it seems people in porn are struggling to find ways to shock you.

[Anthony]

ok, i will not allow this thread to turn into the $3.7million virgin thread. i'm done.


congrats tarcone, live long and prosper.

[panerd]

As a non-believer I agree with what other people who don't buy into organized religion have said... if it makes you happy and doesn't effect others lives than I feel great for you. I feel bad for the morons who slammed you who don't even know you. They just look foolish themselves and they give non-believers like myself a bad name.

As far as the oxymoronic scientific evidence of God website. That is a whole other story. Posts like this should not be free from constructive criticism.

[Dr. Sak]

Originally Posted by Lathum

I consider myself somewhat religous, yet would never be one of those over the top Jesus saved me people.

That being said I am glad you found something that brings you peace and hope it continues to do so.

+1

[bignej]

Good for you for finding your happiness though not my personal cup of tea.

HA, I found your paragraph on the matrix and the carrot chasing incredibly insightful and plan to steal it as my own.

[WSUCougar]

Originally Posted by SCgoatman

glad to know you're a complete fucking retard.

You would know. That earns you 10 days in the cooler.

[flere-imsaho]

Originally Posted by path12

Not a believer but I'm happy for you and anyone else who finds peace in your faith.

Originally Posted by WSUCougar

You would know. That earns you 10 days in the cooler.

[M GO BLUE!!!]

What the hell is with people losing their damn minds because someone finds something in their life that brings them inner peace and happiness? I mean, it's not like Tarcone is in here throwing Bibles and shouting that without Him we are doomed to the fires of Hades!

Rock on, Tarcone! To quote a popular song, Jesus is just alright with me!

[RedKingGold]

Originally Posted by SCgoatman

Which leads me to a very libertarian belief that as long as one accepts others rights to believe whatever they choose; one should believe whatever they feel is most true and/or benefits their lifestyle.

Originally Posted by tarcone

I found Jesus Christ. I am celebrating that he died for me. My life has improved considerably since I found Him. This is an incredible feeling. I have never been this happy in my life. The peace I have found is intoxicating. I am now trying to improve my relationship with the Lord. Im not sure if this is the place for this. But part of a relationship with Christ is sharing your love of the Lord. I pray for everyone on this board to find Jesus Christ. Hell is a terrible alternative. This is a 41 year old who has lived an extremely risky and a not very fruitful life. I drank and whored to extremes. But in the past 2 months I found Jesus Christ and my life is more peaceful. Thanks for listening.

Originally Posted by SCgoatman

glad to know you're a complete fucking retard.

"shrug"

[Subby]

The bitter, poison ugliness in this thread is only surpassed by what seems to me like tarcone's unmitigated joy and happiness and love.

Tarcone wins in a landslide.

[Subby]

Originally Posted by Karlifornia

Well..lol...I can't endorse that. I did laugh out loud, but damn. By the way, I take this to mean tarcone is taking the Cardinals in the Super Bowl.

C'mon. I know you are better than this.

[Barkeep49]

Originally Posted by WSUCougar

You would know. That earns you 10 days in the cooler.

As I started this thread, I was surprised to not see "In the Box" next to his name. Does that not show up anymore?

[Crim]

Originally Posted by WSUCougar

You would know. That earns you 10 days in the cooler.

Glad you did it, WSUCougar, but the dude has twelve posts in 14 months... not sure any little ol' boxing is gonna break that stride. Just sayin.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by JediKooter

As an atheist, it's all about being happy, and if this makes you happy tarcone, then cool.

May the Force be with you

Perhaps it is, but it may also be about rooting out myths from society. Would we celebrate someone coming on this board and saying they believe in unicorns and fire breathing dragons? How about Santa Claus and the Tooth Fairy? Probably not.

And just because something helps someone find peace doesn't mean it's right. A labotomy could have the same effect on someone in finding peace. I certainly wouldn't recommend it to anyone I know.

But perhaps the point is that to some of us, drinking and whoring isn't a bad thing if no one gets hurt. It's religion that has made that "taboo". If stopping that was truly important to you for the sake of your health or life, then great. But I hope you didn't stop doing it because you thought you'd end up in some mythical place that doesn't exist. Do things for yourself, not a make believe God. You have shown you have the power to resist those temptations. You and you alone, not some God helping you along the way. Give yourself a pat on the back, no one else.

[Ryche]

Sorry, thread made me think of this

[Matthean]

Originally Posted by panerd

if it makes you happy and doesn't effect others lives than I feel great for you.

Technically, a Christian should be going out and effecting other people's lives.

[JediKooter]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Perhaps it is, but it may also be about rooting out myths from society. Would we celebrate someone coming on this board and saying they believe in unicorns and fire breathing dragons? How about Santa Claus and the Tooth Fairy? Probably not.

And just because something helps someone find peace doesn't mean it's right. A labotomy could have the same effect on someone in finding peace. I certainly wouldn't recommend it to anyone I know.

But perhaps the point is that to some of us, drinking and whoring isn't a bad thing if no one gets hurt. It's religion that has made that "taboo". If stopping that was truly important to you for the sake of your health or life, then great. But I hope you didn't stop doing it because you thought you'd end up in some mythical place that doesn't exist. Do things for yourself, not a make believe God. You have shown you have the power to resist those temptations. You and you alone, not some God helping you along the way. Give yourself a pat on the back, no one else.

I hear you RainMaker and I agree with you. I just felt that what SCgoatman said was rude in my opinion and you never know, maybe a word of kindness from a non-believer or two could go a long way.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by SCgoatman

glad to know you're a complete fucking retard.

You know, what I find funny is why everyone gets so emotional about what other people believe. I quote the above as the most extreme example, but it works other ways, too, for people who are emotionally happy for tarcone.

Not that being really, truly happy for tarcone is a bad thing--it just makes me wonder why it matters to them so.

At the level of "I am content you're happy", I am supportive of what is going on in tarcone's life. As in, one or two ticks above complete complacency, and that only because I like to think I am by and large a fairly decent guy who will generally wish well for the happiness of others, and if this makes tarcone happy, who I am to wish (or care) otherwise?

I always think people who are overly negative or positive about an announcement like this, that maybe there's something a little off about them on this particular subject.

[Karlifornia]

Originally Posted by Subby

C'mon. I know you are better than this.

Subby, you are my favorite poster on this board. I almost look at you as a FOFC posting mentor, strangely. So, could you do me the service of elaborating on this?

I didn't want to eviscerate SCgoatman. While his honesty was without a doubt tactless, it was honesty.

An honest asshole, or a lying saint?

[Karlifornia]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Perhaps it is, but it may also be about rooting out myths from society. Would we celebrate someone coming on this board and saying they believe in unicorns and fire breathing dragons? How about Santa Claus and the Tooth Fairy? Probably not.

And just because something helps someone find peace doesn't mean it's right. A labotomy could have the same effect on someone in finding peace. I certainly wouldn't recommend it to anyone I know.

But perhaps the point is that to some of us, drinking and whoring isn't a bad thing if no one gets hurt. It's religion that has made that "taboo". If stopping that was truly important to you for the sake of your health or life, then great. But I hope you didn't stop doing it because you thought you'd end up in some mythical place that doesn't exist. Do things for yourself, not a make believe God. You have shown you have the power to resist those temptations. You and you alone, not some God helping you along the way. Give yourself a pat on the back, no one else.

I agree with this post whole-heartedly. Rainmaker is a fuckin' champ.

[rowech]

I understand people's beliefs that there isn't a God. I question it myself sometimes but how someone can look at how the universe works so perfectly and so exactly and not believe there is some sort of higher being that designed it all...instead choosing that it is all a big happy series of accidents is beyond me.

[Chief Rum]

Ah, but you see, some of us don't believe it works all that perfectly.

But let's say we assume it does, this is flawed reasoning, because if it didn't work perfectly, well then, we wouldn't be around to question it.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by rowech

I understand people's beliefs that there isn't a God. I question it myself sometimes but how someone can look at how the universe works so perfectly and so exactly and not believe there is some sort of higher being that designed it all...instead choosing that it is all a big happy series of accidents is beyond me.

It works perfectly for us because we evolved for the universe. There is no such thing as perfect, it's just what it is.

And if the argument is that the Universe is so perfect that it had to be designed by something, wouldn't that make the designer even more perfect, and thus have to be designed by something? That just seems to start an endless loop.

[Flasch186]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Perhaps it is, but it may also be about rooting out myths from society. Would we celebrate someone coming on this board and saying they believe in unicorns and fire breathing dragons? How about Santa Claus and the Tooth Fairy? Probably not.

And just because something helps someone find peace doesn't mean it's right. A labotomy could have the same effect on someone in finding peace. I certainly wouldn't recommend it to anyone I know.

But perhaps the point is that to some of us, drinking and whoring isn't a bad thing if no one gets hurt. It's religion that has made that "taboo". If stopping that was truly important to you for the sake of your health or life, then great. But I hope you didn't stop doing it because you thought you'd end up in some mythical place that doesn't exist. Do things for yourself, not a make believe God. You have shown you have the power to resist those temptations. You and you alone, not some God helping you along the way. Give yourself a pat on the back, no one else.

some of this made a good point....than you injected opinion.

[bignej]

Tarcone,
Were you "saved" from being an atheist or were you just a bad christian? Curious because I've never know someone who absolutely didn't believe in God that became "saved".

[Anthony]

there's this part of me that always wants to be in on everything. obviously that can never be so. but right this second there's some cool techno party in Prague. or some tiny pub in Ireland or Germany where everyone is just vibing to some cool song or there's a positive aura in the room. or people in the Peace Corps unwinding after a hard day's work in the field helping villagers get water. there's always something going on and i don't want to feel i'm missing out on anything. so there's this small part of me who would like to feel the sense of togetherness and community by being active in a church, being with other people who all have this sense of shared belief. you know, that "we're all in this together" kinda wavelength.

of course, i don't believe in God so that kinda puts a monkey wrench in that, but i guess my point is i can see how finding Jesus, becoming part of a religious community and feeling connected is a wonderful opiate. that sensation you get from being with other like-minded individuals all striving for salvation and going to midnight mass and getting ashes on your forehead for lent and bible study discussions, it must feel awesome to be a part of. its not for me, just more of me wishing i was omnipresent and could experience everything everywhere when its happening. hard for me to elaborate on.

[Anthony]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

But perhaps the point is that to some of us, drinking and whoring isn't a bad thing if no one gets hurt. It's religion that has made that "taboo". If stopping that was truly important to you for the sake of your health or life, then great. But I hope you didn't stop doing it because you thought you'd end up in some mythical place that doesn't exist. Do things for yourself, not a make believe God. You have shown you have the power to resist those temptations. You and you alone, not some God helping you along the way. Give yourself a pat on the back, no one else.

i don't whore cuz i'm married, but i would if i was single. the drinking part i got locked down.

i don't go for anything that places limitations on me. Sheryl Crow once sang "if it makes you happy, it can't be that bad". a cheesy reference, yes, but i believe in it nonetheless. obviously if killing and raping is your thing then i can't defend you, but drinking and having fun and being friendly with the ladies isn't bad at all. we're all going to die, it's what you do while you're alive and the stories you can reflect on when you aren't able to do much - that's what life is about. when you're reaching the end of the ride and you're in the last final years and you sit and reflect on all the shit and stuff you've done - that's what life is.

over the years i've been subcribing to this theory of mine that the bible and the whole old testament was really a handle of stories created by the jews, the slaves of Egypt. they'd tell each other these positive stories to uplift their morale and have people looking for to a brighter day sometime in the future, telling of a great king who'd one day liberate them all and bring them to a promised land because even though they were all slaves they were in fact "the chosen ones". all that adam & eve and noah's ark was a way to embelish and add on to these initial stories. this is what i'm starting to believe. and you know what - anything that makes you feel good inside and gives you the strength to live a good life and add more positive forces than negative, that's a good thing. if religion helps you turn from a horrible human who's a poison to society into a dependable and trustworthy and helpful person, that's a good thing. whether or not God exists isn't the point. it's good to be a good human, as simple as that sounds. its just there are ways to be a good human that don't involve you eliminating things that make you happy. if you must eliminate things then you should do it because its healthy for you to do so, not because you think at the end of it all God is gonna come out in a gameshow voice and say

"you've lived a good life...tell him what he's won Bob."

"....a trip to Heaven where you'll have everlasting peace and happiness bathing in the warmth of your Creator's light!"

[RendeR]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Perhaps it is, but it may also be about rooting out myths from society. Would we celebrate someone coming on this board and saying they believe in unicorns and fire breathing dragons? How about Santa Claus and the Tooth Fairy? Probably not.

And just because something helps someone find peace doesn't mean it's right. A labotomy could have the same effect on someone in finding peace. I certainly wouldn't recommend it to anyone I know.

But perhaps the point is that to some of us, drinking and whoring isn't a bad thing if no one gets hurt. It's religion that has made that "taboo". If stopping that was truly important to you for the sake of your health or life, then great. But I hope you didn't stop doing it because you thought you'd end up in some mythical place that doesn't exist. Do things for yourself, not a make believe God. You have shown you have the power to resist those temptations. You and you alone, not some God helping you along the way. Give yourself a pat on the back, no one else.

I agree with you almost entirely RM, however its my belief that we ought to keep this opinion to ourselves. Its his life, he can run it his way. Who are we to tell him how to do it?

Originally Posted by Ryche

Sorry, thread made me think of this

This made me laugh.

Originally Posted by Matthean

Technically, a Christian should be going out and effecting other people's lives.

IMO this is what is the root problem with Religion in general. The propensity for not minding their own business and leaving others alone.

Originally Posted by Karlifornia

Subby, you are my favorite poster on this board. I almost look at you as a FOFC posting mentor, strangely. So, could you do me the service of elaborating on this?

I didn't want to eviscerate SCgoatman. While his honesty was without a doubt tactless, it was honesty.

An honest asshole, or a lying saint?

I was a little confused by this also. Your post wasn't antagonizing him that I could see. You stated that he could think as he pleased and the post simply made you laugh. I'm not seeing the issue?




Tarcone: The end result is, if you're happy, good for you. I hope your beliefs lead you to a long and fulfilling life.

[JT2008]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Perhaps it is, but it may also be about rooting out myths from society. Would we celebrate someone coming on this board and saying they believe in unicorns and fire breathing dragons? How about Santa Claus and the Tooth Fairy? Probably not.

And just because something helps someone find peace doesn't mean it's right. A labotomy could have the same effect on someone in finding peace. I certainly wouldn't recommend it to anyone I know.

But perhaps the point is that to some of us, drinking and whoring isn't a bad thing if no one gets hurt. It's religion that has made that "taboo". If stopping that was truly important to you for the sake of your health or life, then great. But I hope you didn't stop doing it because you thought you'd end up in some mythical place that doesn't exist. Do things for yourself, not a make believe God. You have shown you have the power to resist those temptations. You and you alone, not some God helping you along the way. Give yourself a pat on the back, no one else.

+1

[Marc Vaughan]

Originally Posted by Matthean

Technically, a Christian should be going out and effecting other people's lives.

I think it was fairly obvious he meant 'affecting other people's lives negatively'.

Its a bit like someone sitting in a bar and getting drunk - so long as they're a happy drunk I'm cool with it - will even have a laugh and a singalong with them if they ask nicely .... however if they're an angry drunk and push their attitude and opinions onto me then I don't like it

[Marc Vaughan]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Perhaps it is, but it may also be about rooting out myths from society. Would we celebrate someone coming on this board and saying they believe in unicorns and fire breathing dragons? How about Santa Claus and the Tooth Fairy? Probably not.

I'd react the same way to anyone saying they'd found happyness in anything so long as I didn't think it'd hurt others or themselves.

If you want to become a Pastafarian, cool .... decided that you believe in Father Christmas again, equally cool with me

(peronally I'd LOVE to believe in magic myself - especially if I could learn how to do it myself )

[illinifan999]

Are some people here trying to imply that Santa Claus is not real?

[Noop]

Santa is real.

[Raiders Army]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Perhaps it is, but it may also be about rooting out myths from society. Would we celebrate someone coming on this board and saying they believe in unicorns and fire breathing dragons? How about Santa Claus and the Tooth Fairy? Probably not.

And just because something helps someone find peace doesn't mean it's right. A labotomy could have the same effect on someone in finding peace. I certainly wouldn't recommend it to anyone I know.

But perhaps the point is that to some of us, drinking and whoring isn't a bad thing if no one gets hurt. It's religion that has made that "taboo". If stopping that was truly important to you for the sake of your health or life, then great. But I hope you didn't stop doing it because you thought you'd end up in some mythical place that doesn't exist. Do things for yourself, not a make believe God. You have shown you have the power to resist those temptations. You and you alone, not some God helping you along the way. Give yourself a pat on the back, no one else.

I agree with the latter paragraph of your post. As to your first paragraph, we probably wouldn't celebrate someone believing in unicorns, Santa Claus, etc....but I think the big difference there is that for the most part, we know that Christians have a good overall moral foundation. The same cannot be said for those who believe in the Tooth Fairy. In that respect, I think it's okay to tell someone good for you since you'll hopefully be a better person for society based upon our overall understanding of Christianity. Note I said overall, not every little thing.

I'm not sure what your second paragraph really means. If he's found peace within himself, even if it's a false peace, that's good right? The only downside I see is that if it is a peace based upon flawed principles then the fall could be much greater. That being said, I don't think we can disprove the existence of a God. There's a possibility they're right; I believe it is not probable, but there is still the possibility.

[Danny]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

You know, what I find funny is why everyone gets so emotional about what other people believe. I quote the above as the most extreme example, but it works other ways, too, for people who are emotionally happy for tarcone.

Not that being really, truly happy for tarcone is a bad thing--it just makes me wonder why it matters to them so.

At the level of "I am content you're happy", I am supportive of what is going on in tarcone's life. As in, one or two ticks above complete complacency, and that only because I like to think I am by and large a fairly decent guy who will generally wish well for the happiness of others, and if this makes tarcone happy, who I am to wish (or care) otherwise?

I always think people who are overly negative or positive about an announcement like this, that maybe there's something a little off about them on this particular subject.

I disagree with this. I think there is absolutely nothing off about someone who can find joy in other people's happiness. As a Christian myself, yes I am biased in this. Still, if someone announced they were incredibly happy because they found love of someone else, a career they're passionate about or any number of things, I am going to be happy for them. I mean, I'm not going to have a party at my house, but in that moment, I will be genuinely happy for them.

[DrAFTjunkie]

Very happy for you Tarcone.

I'm not a "believer, per say. I believe in a universal driving force, and for me, consider it to be undeniable. I won't get into the concepts of fate, synchronicity, or any of my other beliefs because I'm sick, and don't have the energy to be my usual, long-winded self.

But I'll say this: My cousin (more like a brother, really) was "saved" more than a decade ago. We were "pahtners" and headed down a very bad path together. One day, after not speaking to him for a couple of weeks, I rang him up to procure his assistance in an illicit activity, only to find him very happily and steadfastly unwilling.

He was living his life for "the word."

I was irate. I'll spare the struggle i had coming to grips with his "salvation" but right or wrong, I can tell you this: He's just recently gotten his masters, owns a house and has been downright thriving, which is a lot to say if you'd have known him--typical lost inner-city thug. Shit, the kid actually had a live grenade. But "the word" whether I like it or not, agree with it or not, has indeed saved him. I eventually found my own path to success, but I spent a lot of years as a n'er-do-well...unmotivated, a slave to opiates, blah blah. I'm glad I found my way, but I can't help but notice the inspiration he derived from his "salvation" and how quicker he made something of his life.

I still don't "believe," so to speak, but different strokes, y'know. He may have been long dead if it wasn't for Jesus.

[Schmidty]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

I think you can drink (unless you were an alcoholic), because Jesus did turn water into wine.

Yeah, but back then wine was generally watered down, and used for daily use. I read somewhere that drinking undiluted wine was considered coarse. So maybe Jesus made water into white wine spritzer.

[Subby]

Originally Posted by Karlifornia

Subby, you are my favorite poster on this board. I almost look at you as a FOFC posting mentor, strangely. So, could you do me the service of elaborating on this?

I don't know. It just struck me as kind of petty and mean-spirited. Seemed like a weird thing to piggy back (goatboy's post, that is).

The "found jesus" poster is solid, however.

Just one man's opinion.

[panerd]

Originally Posted by Danny

I disagree with this. I think there is absolutely nothing off about someone who can find joy in other people's happiness. As a Christian myself, yes I am biased in this. Still, if someone announced they were incredibly happy because they found love of someone else, a career they're passionate about or any number of things, I am going to be happy for them. I mean, I'm not going to have a party at my house, but in that moment, I will be genuinely happy for them.

I will piggyback on your finding the love of somebody else part. Suppose he falls in love with somebody who is completely wrong for him but he doesn't see it and is genuinely happy? There are two schools of thought. One is that he is happy and it is his life let him be. The other is that as a friend you have to help him out and show him the truth.

I am not his friend (not meant as a slam, I don't know him) so I choose option 1. But if I knew him well enough I would point out that he is just buying into one of the world's biggest cults. We laugh and see fallacies with Scientologists, and Christian Scientists, David Koresh, Osama Bin Laden, the followers of Thor, the Romans many Gods, etc but respect the same blind belief in Jesus Christ. Doesn't make any sense to someone who is not brainwashed into Christianity. Think about how much faith Tarcone has in the stories of Mohammad or Buddha, well that is how the non-Christians of the world see Jesus Christ and the whole entire world saw Jesus Christ 3000 years ago.

Kind of silly to not credit yourself for changing your life and instead give credit to a made up God. I don't think he is a moron like the poster from earlier in the thread but I think he is selling himself short for not crediting himself for the huge changes in his life and I think Christians in general are selling themselves short by not giving themselves for credit for loving and helping out people because of great character and instead choose to credit a person from 2000 years ago. Hate to break it to you guys but you did all of these great things on your own. Take some credit for it and be proud of yourselves! You can do everything good you claim relgion and Jesus cause you to do through your own free will. Not a slam, more of a wish that Christians would realize all of their morals and kindness and outlooks on life are because they are good people. No super power is causing it to happen, they are.

[CraigSca]

Originally Posted by panerd

I will piggyback on your finding the love of somebody else part. Suppose he falls in love with somebody who is completely wrong for him but he doesn't see it and is genuinely happy? There are two schools of thought. One is that he is happy and it is his life let him be. The other is that as a friend you have to help him out and show him the truth.

I am not his friend (not meant as a slam, I don't know him) so I choose option 1. But if I knew him well enough I would point out that he is just buying into one of the world's biggest cults. We laugh and see fallacies with Scientologists, and Christian Scientists, David Koresh, Osama Bin Laden, the followers of Thor, the Romans many Gods, etc but respect the same blind belief in Jesus Christ. Doesn't make any sense to someone who is not brainwashed into Christianity. Think about how much faith Tarcone has in the stories of Mohammad or Buddha, well that is how the non-Christians of the world see Jesus Christ and the whole entire world saw Jesus Christ 3000 years ago.

Kind of silly to not credit yourself for changing your life and instead give credit to a made up God. I don't think he is a moron like the poster from earlier in the thread but I think he is selling himself short for not crediting himself for the huge changes in his life and I think Christians in general are selling themselves short by not giving themselves for credit for loving and helping out people because of great character and instead choose to credit a person from 2000 years ago. Hate to break it to you guys but you did all of these great things on your own. Take some credit for it and be proud of yourselves! You can do everything good you claim relgion and Jesus cause you to do through your own free will. Not a slam, more of a wish that Christians would realize all of their morals and kindness and outlooks on life are because they are good people. No super power is causing it to happen, they are.

Everything I have was given to me by God. Once we begin to think that it IS about us is when we begin to have problems.

Everyone who takes issue with religion needs to take a step back and realize it's not Jesus or God that they have the problem with, it's the people. Inherently, we are human - we get selfish, we like to be told how wonderful we are, we get greedy, etc. The problem is - once you have religious organization you, by default, have the human element and, again, the human element has fault.

Finally, because you heard about some church that protests against a dead soldier, or overheard someone say that all wars are because of religion, or read about some priest who got arrested for molestation - don't confuse that with what Jesus is all about, and don't use that as an excuse for not getting to know Him.

[Toddzilla]

Originally Posted by CraigSca

Everyone who takes issue with religion needs to take a step back and realize it's not Jesus or God that they have the problem with, it's the people..

QFT.

If Christians were more like Christ, maybe they wouldn't have such a bad rep.

[JediKooter]

I don't know if it was tarone's intention to start a debate, but, I wish tarcone well and hope that he does not throw common sense to the way side and doesn't turn into one of those people who won't give medical attention to their kids because Jesus will cure them or some other extreme things like that.

[MJ4H]

I'm sure his intention was to tell people he was saved. Generally speaking, that's what you are supposed to do when you are saved.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by Danny

I disagree with this. I think there is absolutely nothing off about someone who can find joy in other people's happiness. As a Christian myself, yes I am biased in this. Still, if someone announced they were incredibly happy because they found love of someone else, a career they're passionate about or any number of things, I am going to be happy for them. I mean, I'm not going to have a party at my house, but in that moment, I will be genuinely happy for them.

I think we're talking semantics here, and that you and I are actually happy on the same level, with maybe you getting a slightly higher vibe because it meshes with your own beliefs (validation, connection, etc., like if you came out and said you were dedicating your fandom to the Angels, that would give me a slightly higher vibe, lol).

I am talking about the people who take that validation/connection and are downright exuberant and super lovey about it. They are pushing it too far, just as people like SCgoatman are pushing it too far in the other end. In no way does tarcone's announcement call for the disgust and anger from SCgoatman nor the overwhelming "praise the Lord!" plaudits from some others, because tarcone is just some guy on a MB. Not to say we're none of us friends, we are, but there is a certain disconnect here that's not present in real life, and strong emotional responses (at least without other stronger or more present interaction) are signs of issues unrelated to MB life.

It should be as you and I have it. We're glad for tarcone, more in a "happy if he's happy" sorta way. But not more than that.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by DrAFTjunkie

Shit, the kid actually had a live grenade.

Okay, I gotta know. What'd he do with the grenade?

[Chief Rum]

Just speaking to some of the general thought here regarding the role "YOU" versus the role of "GOD" in the success and/or happiness one has in life, and also the concept of the Christian humanity being the ones responsible for the views of those on the outside, I will say this meshes a lot with my own views.

I actually believe in, and hope for the possibility of God, and I believe the events of the New Testament happened. But I believe that everything that has happened in the 2,000 years since then has warped God's intended vision, and that no one really knows anymore what that was. Organized religion, IMO, is one of the worst things man has ever come up with. If we could pass along the beliefs and the mores and the basic spirit of goodness for all mankind, without also a healthy truckload-full of bullshit, I would be much more content with spirituality than I am.

[CraigSca]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

I am talking about the people who take that validation/connection and are downright exuberant and super lovey about it. They are pushing it too far, just as people like SCgoatman are pushing it too far in the other end. In no way does tarcone's announcement call for the disgust and anger from SCgoatman nor the overwhelming "praise the Lord!" plaudits from some others, because tarcone is just some guy on a MB. Not to say we're none of us friends, we are, but there is a certain disconnect here that's not present in real life, and strong emotional responses (at least without other stronger or more present interaction) are signs of issues unrelated to MB life.

It should be as you and I have it. We're glad for tarcone, more in a "happy if he's happy" sorta way. But not more than that.

I see what you're saying here, but as a "believer" this IS "more than that" since, in our faith, the belief in Christ, His works and message really IS everything. I've seen deeper conviction from others regarding agreement/disagreement over teams/players, etc., and that's okay, right? Frankly, to a believer this IS a big deal - and though I didn't say, "praise the Lord!" would I be wrong if I chose to?

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by CraigSca

I see what you're saying here, but as a "believer" this IS "more than that" since, in our faith, the belief in Christ, His works and message really IS everything. I've seen deeper conviction from others regarding agreement/disagreement over teams/players, etc., and that's okay, right? Frankly, to a believer this IS a big deal - and though I didn't say, "praise the Lord!" would I be wrong if I chose to?

Wrong? No. Just as with tarcone, for me it's whatever toots your horn. If that works for you, fine and I am happy for you in the same way.

That said, I am still of the opinion that anyone who gets unreasonably happy that someone they barely know has committed to their faith is a little unbalanced by their own need for that faith.

Keep in mind, for more people within that faith, the "need for that faith" is a virtue. So perhaps this is not something you would view as a bad thing. For me, though, as a non-believer (or at least "non" to the extent of most everyday Christians), it's a break from the pragmatic norm I view as a baseline, where in some cases outliers are absolutely wonderful--but usually not.

[panerd]

Sorry but I guess I have to chime in again here. Cheif Rum is absolutely correct that due to the fact that Jesus Christ was mentioned there is far more elation, interest, and over blown response than had he posted "Last night I decided to get my life together and quit whoring around and drinking". I think Tarcone was a recognized enough poster that he would have gotten some "Right on responses" but not the elation of strangers and the amount of responses.

Sadly as big of ass as the guy who called him a moron was had he called anyone a fucking moron in any other thread he would not have been placed in the penalty box. But since it involved Jesus Christ it was a given about what was on the way. A serious question to the strong believers... Do you really like the fact that is so much harder to question religion than just about any other topic? If I were a strong believer I would welcome the challenge and be sad that my faith is always treated with some kid gloves by everybody when there is so many interesting and debatable ideas.

[CraigSca]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

Wrong? No. Just as with tarcone, for me it's whatever toots your horn. If that works for you, fine and I am happy for you in the same way.

That said, I am still of the opinion that anyone who gets unreasonably happy that someone they barely know has committed to their faith is a little unbalanced by their own need for that faith.

Keep in mind, for more people within that faith, the "need for that faith" is a virtue. So perhaps this is not something you would view as a bad thing. For me, though, as a non-believer (or at least "non" to the extent of most everyday Christians), it's a break from the pragmatic norm I view as a baseline, where in some cases outliers are absolutely wonderful--but usually not.

I can understand that point of view. Certainly, I can take the "non-believer" stance with a lot of things that have nothing to do with Christianity - and our minds probably think the same way towards a lot of different things. However, to a believer, the concept of accepting Jesus as one's personal savior transcends all. It just can't be conveniently grouped into a pre-defined bucket like the rest of the every day things in the world.

One can certainly say, "oh, so-and-so is giving Joe Stranger a messageboard high-five because it just backs up his own beliefs and he therefore feels more secure in it." Gosh, I really hope my faith is stronger than that - if it relies solely on others for substance, it's really not faith at all.

CR - from your posts, you sound like you're sick of the human side of religion. There are a great many things in the church's history and the present day that dishearten me, only because man has screwed up (and we will continue to screw up). As in my earlier post, please don't let that distract you from wanting to learn more.