Baseball Offseason 2004-5 Thread

[Suicane75]

Originally Posted by stevew

I doubt the DBacks do a straight Jacquez for Johnson trade. I would guess something like Lieberathal and Tim Worrell from Philly for Kevin Brown and Lofton. Then Posada and change for Johnson. Vasquez for Soriano. Resign Leiber and Duque Sign Beltran and Pedro.

Why oh why do you think the Phillies would trade their setup guy and clubhouse leader for an inury waiting to happen and a clubhouse cancer? That deal would never EVER happen.

[Ksyrup]

Lofton was already traded to the Phillies, along with cash for Felix Rodriguez.

[Suicane75]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

Lofton was already traded to the Phillies, along with cash for Felix Rodriguez.

I'm up to date on things, no?

[Buccaneer]

SI, sorry, I didn't see this earlier.

Basically the buzz on the Long/May trade was positive among Pads fans. Long was deadweight with a way overpaid contract. May will eat up innings and that's good for a 5th starter. Even though May is a flyball pitcher, Petco will help him that respect.

Here's a postive spin:

"May averaged 6 innings a start last season. Our 5th starter last season would never pitch that far into a game except for a few good home starts from Valdes.

I think with May pitching for a much better team and at Petco, his numbers will be more in line with his 2003 season. I predict a .500 record and 200 innings, not much more you can ask from a 5th starter and much more than the Padres had last season. We could have made the playoffs with a solid 5th starter.

I'm not a Tank or Long fan, I don't think Tank has it and we know KT has felt that way for awhile now. Long is a reserve outfielder, low obp, no power, average LF and terrible CF, he won't even start in KC unless they have injuries.

We get a 5th starter, clear up some space in the logjammed OF and swap pitching projects. Good trade by KT IMO. Hopefully Balsley can help Bukvich and this trade look like a steal."

And from a Royals fan:

"Well, I think you guys won this one. May will probably have a fantastic year, especially at the back end of your rotation. Kauffman is not really a hitter's ballpark anymore, though, since the fences moved back so not sure how much Petco will affect him. I think he is just better than he showed last year. The R's just have enough pitching questions without holding onto someone who will never be a 1, 2, or 3 starter who is making $3MM.

Bukvich could never stick with a club which was known as having the worst bullpen the AL 2 years ago and had 2 closers go down last year. So you do the math. Maybe getting him off a KC/Omaha diet will help out. Hopefully the jinx of Jay Witasik doesn't rear it's ugly head.

That being said, Tankersley probably will be starting for us this year and a power righty is definitely in our need category with all our junkball southpaws.

T-Long is a longshot that he busts out in a contract year. I hope Abe Nunez beats him out for RF."

[Crapshoot]

I think the Royals won that - in that they dumped a part they didnt for a RF who awful as he was, was better than anyone else the Royals had. Also, they got the most talented player in the deal - Tankersly. I think May will be happy in PETCO (where his fly balls will stay in the park) and be decent - but I think the greatest upside is with the Royals.

[sterlingice]

Frankly, this is how I see it, except I think it's a wash more than a Pads win because we both got rid of problems and might have improved. It's not as if we could have spun club cancer, below average innings eater Darrell May into anything else. But, yeah, he should get you guys 12 wins and 200 innings out of that #5 spot next year. That said, he wouldn't do that here next year- he'd get 8-10 wins and 200 innings and we might as well give some of the young guys a shot since we're rebuilding. Long's the exact same way: he does crap for you next year, but maybe he can do something here. That said, I agree with the guy that says "hopefully Nunez beats him out". Tank is the one we figure is worth a little more and hope the change of scenery helps him.

SI

[stevew]

Originally Posted by Suicane75

Why oh why do you think the Phillies would trade their setup guy and clubhouse leader for an inury waiting to happen and a clubhouse cancer? That deal would never EVER happen.

Look, Worrell for Lofton was supposedly already on the table(I guess it turned into FRod). Brown was rumored to go to Philly, and the D-backs alledgedly wanted Posada included in a deal for Big Unit(at least they did at one point). I didn't think i was speculating that hard that Lieby could be the Yankees catcher, considering he was talking about waiving his 10/5 to go to a winner(if he was gonna be traded).

[revrew]

Cubs + Carlos = Reverse the Curse??

[Cuckoo]

Originally Posted by revrew

Cubs + Carlos = Reverse the Curse??

Don't need the question marks on that one.

[Fonzie]

The Cardinals have resigned Matt Morris to a one-year deal. Terms of the deal have not yet been disclosed, and I think how much they got him for will go a long way in determining whether this was a good move or not. Matty Mo recently underwent shoulder surgery, which probably explains why he was so inconsistent this past year. This last year he pitched like a #4 starter, so hopefully they got him at something close to a #4 price, as I'd have much rather seen the Cardinals put that money toward Renteria (whom they have offered arbitration to).

We'll have to wait and see on this one, methinks.

[Ksyrup]

I think he re-signed for $2.5M, plus another $4.5M in incentives.

[Fonzie]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

I think he re-signed for $2.5M, plus another $4.5M in incentives.

In my opinion that would make this a decent signing for the Cardinals. That should (hopefully) leave them with enough cash to get Renteria back in the fold.

[WSUCougar]

Originally Posted by Fonzie

In my opinion that would make this a decent signing for the Cardinals. That should (hopefully) leave them with enough cash to get Renteria back in the fold.

Yup.

The Cubs signing Garciaparra is big on the Renteria front, since that was one of his expected wealthy suitors.

[DaddyTorgo]

Sox signed Matt Mantei to a one-year deal. Any D'backs fans out there who can tell us what this guy brings to the table? Should we as Sox fans be upbeat about this signing, or is it basically a crapshoot?

[Bomber]

I'd say its basically a crapshoot. You could have a very good setup man on your hands, or a serviceable reliever, or a pile of shit, but at 750k the risk is so little that its a good move.

[Bomber]

I'm hearing this right now:

Braves:
Get Danny Haren and Jeff Suppan
A's
Get Marcus Giles and another player
Cards:
Get Tim Hudson

[Fonzie]

Originally Posted by Bomber

I'm hearing this right now:

Braves:
Get Danny Haren and Jeff Suppan
A's
Get Marcus Giles and another player
Cards:
Get Tim Hudson

[korme]

Fuck that! I wish the Reds would A.) sign ANYBODY DECENT... PLEASE B.) trade for ANYBODY DECENT..

this sucks

[Bomber]

Apparently, Dan Patrick just said the trade is imminent, but is a combo of these players: Dan Haren, Jason Marquis, Kiko Calero, Rick Ankiel and Daric Barton. I guess no Braves then.

[Bomber]

Beat you to it.

[Ksyrup]

Originally Posted by Bomber

I'm hearing this right now:

Braves:
Get Danny Haren and Jeff Suppan
A's
Get Marcus Giles and another player
Cards:
Get Tim Hudson

From rotoworld:

According to TSN's Ken Rosenthal and ESPN's Dan Patrick, the Cardinals and A's could be close to agreeing to a Tim Hudson trade.

Some combination of Dan Haren, Jason Marquis, Kiko Calero, Rick Ankiel and Daric Barton would have to be involved in the deal. The A's wouldn't get both Haren and Marquis, but they'd have to get one of two and then one or two of the other three. Dec. 9 - 3:49 pm et

[ISiddiqui]

So, I'm trying to figure out why Troy Glaus signed with the abysmal D-Backs. If it was for money, couldn't he get that money from a better team? I'd think so!

[Ksyrup]

I think Glaus was only going to be offered 4 years by Detroit and Arizona. Maybe he's just a west coast kinda guy.

[Bearcat729]

Originally Posted by Shorty3281

Fuck that! I wish the Reds would A.) sign ANYBODY DECENT... PLEASE B.) trade for ANYBODY DECENT..

this sucks

We did resign Paul Wilson you know

And ESPN says we have been talking to Jason Christiansen.

I hate Carl Linder.

[Crapshoot]

Originally Posted by Bearcat729

We did resign Paul Wilson you know

And ESPN says we have been talking to Jason Christiansen.

I hate Carl Linder.

would be great if you signed JC- Sabean would get a draft pick despite his worst intentions.

[Bomber]

From http://forums.stltoday.com/viewtopic...eae41f46f0a99:

Just got off the phone with the GM moments ago....

Jocketty, who just landed in SoCal, called me from the airport.

Here's his response:

"We've had discussions with Oakland, but nothing is close. Oakland would like to move on something in the next few days, and we're talking, but so are a lot of teams. We're not close to anything."

On Renteria.... Jocketty said he expects to field a proposal from Barry Meister tomorrow (friday) and will try to hammer out a deal.

Cheers,
Bernie

[Fonzie]

Originally Posted by Bomber

On Renteria.... Jocketty said he expects to field a proposal from Barry Meister tomorrow (friday) and will try to hammer out a deal.

Cheers,
Bernie

*crosses fingers*

[Bomber]

Jeff Kent just signed with the Dodgers. http://msn.foxsports.com/story/3233520

[stevew]

Originally Posted by Bomber

Jeff Kent just signed with the Dodgers. http://msn.foxsports.com/story/3233520

I wonder if this means Beltre is gone?

[Mr. Sparkle]

Word is that the Angels have signed Steve finley for 20 million over 2 years, with an announcement coming tomorrow. Wow. As a Giants fan, this makes me very happy. Sabean had a raging huge mega boner over Finley. He even offered him a 3 year deal. 3 years. Just what we need, another 97 year old outfielder. Sheesh.

[stevew]

With the Angels out of the bidding, It appears that not many teams can afford or will have a need for Beltran. If the Astros come up a bit on their offer, maybe he will stay?

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by stevew

With the Angels out of the bidding, It appears that not many teams can afford or will have a need for Beltran. If the Astros come up a bit on their offer, maybe he will stay?

How about they tell Boras to fuck himself because the other serious team is out of the bidding and wait for him to settle. That'd be nice for baseball. Won't happen.

SI

[sterlingice]

Speaking of which, has this year seemed more insane than the last couple? So much stupid money being thrown around. The Yankees are to be expected, giving both Jaret Wright and Tony Womack twice what they are worth. Steve Finley at what?? He's pretty good but when the guy being touted as a "bargain" to Beltran gets that kind of money??? Gascan Headcase Benitez at $7M per? The Christian Guzman and Vinny Castilla duo? Omar Vizquel?

Not to say there aren't some bargains. I think Nomar and Lieber will have nice bouncebacks and look like bargains. Matt Mantei and Matt Morris seem fairly cheap for what they can offer (not too much money wasted if they don't pan out). But, all the talk of "the market correcting itself" seems to be going back on itself this season.

SI

[Desnudo]

I think the dearth of true quality pitching is contributing to the problem. Last year you had some serious guns out there: Andy Pettite, Clemens, and Schilling to name a few. This year it's really 2nd and 3rd starters with the possible exception of Pedro. With all the hype Pavano has gotten, he's really a one year wonder to this point and pitched in the NL. The fact that teams are drooling over him says something.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by Desnudo

I think the dearth of true quality pitching is contributing to the problem. Last year you had some serious guns out there: Andy Pettite, Clemens, and Schilling to name a few. This year it's really 2nd and 3rd starters with the possible exception of Pedro. With all the hype Pavano has gotten, he's really a one year wonder to this point and pitched in the NL. The fact that teams are drooling over him says something.

Schilling, sure. Clemens has question marks due to age. And Pettite, well, I've always contended Pettite is a glorified Brad Radke who has a high profile because he was on the Yankees which always helps you when your contract comes due.

SI

[SirFozzie]

Local TV reports that Pedro will sign a 3 year/40 Million Deal with the sox within the next 48 hours

[Desnudo]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

Schilling, sure. Clemens has question marks due to age. And Pettite, well, I've always contended Pettite is a glorified Brad Radke who has a high profile because he was on the Yankees which always helps you when your contract comes due.

SI

All that may be true, but I'm talking about what the value perception was. They set the market whatever their true worth actually was. There aren't any free agent pitchers this year with that capability.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by Desnudo

All that may be true, but I'm talking about what the value perception was. They set the market whatever their true worth actually was. There aren't any free agent pitchers this year with that capability.

I dunno. I'd equate Pedro to Clemens: great pitcher when on but with question marks (injury vs age). That said, he's the only "A"-grade free agent. However, if you have prospects to part with, Randy Johnson, Oakland's big 3, etc can be had.


SI

[Arles]

Interesting developments here in Arizona. The DBacks have signed both Glaus and Russ Ortiz and are trying to hammer out a 2-year deal with Royce Clayton. There's also a rumor that Johnson may be moved in a three-way deal that sends RJ to the Yankees, Vasquez and cash to the White Sox and Paul Konerko and Jon Garland + potential prospects from both NYY and the Sox to Arizona. Depending on the prospects, that may not be a bad move for Arizona as Konerko hit 41 HRs last season and Garland is a serviceable No. 3. I just hope the DBacks can get a catcher and one more legit starting pitcher as well.

[stevew]

Originally Posted by Arles

Interesting developments here in Arizona. The DBacks have signed both Glaus and Russ Ortiz and are trying to hammer out a 2-year deal with Royce Clayton. There's also a rumor that Johnson may be moved in a three-way deal that sends RJ to the Yankees, Vasquez and cash to the White Sox and Paul Konerko and Jon Garland + potential prospects from both NYY and the Sox to Arizona. Depending on the prospects, that may not be a bad move for Arizona as Konerko hit 41 HRs last season and Garland is a serviceable No. 3. I just hope the DBacks can get a catcher and one more legit starting pitcher as well.

Thats a pretty good deal for Arizona.

[Bomber]

ESPN 1050 in New York and Ken Rosenthal of the Sporting News is reporting that the Yankees and RHP Carl Pavano have agreed to a deal. Exact terms have yet to be disclosed.

[Bomber]

ESPN is reporting Renteria to the Sox for 4 years, 44 million.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by Bomber

ESPN is reporting Renteria to the Sox for 4 years, 44 million.

Congrats on the Red Sox for becoming the new Yankees who drive the market with retarded prices for free agents. Well, that's not entirely true (*cough*Jaret Wright*cough*)

SI

[Desnudo]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

Congrats on the Red Sox for becoming the new Yankees who drive the market with retarded prices for free agents. Well, that's not entirely true (*cough*Jaret Wright*cough*)

SI

*Omar Vizquel*

[Bomber]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

Congrats on the Red Sox for becoming the new Yankees who drive the market with retarded prices for free agents. Well, that's not entirely true (*cough*Jaret Wright*cough*)

SI

Not anymore:

According to CBS Sportsline's Scott Miller, reports are that Jaret Wright flunked his physical with the Yankees because of a shoulder problem.

Maybe now we'll make a big offer on Pedro.

[Bomber]

And the new report from Gammons is Renteria to the Sox for 4 years, in the 40 million range. I guess they must be planning on sending Ramirez somewhere for pitching.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by Desnudo

*Omar Vizquel*

True, it was stupid but that's $4M apples and $10M oranges.

SI

[Fonzie]

Originally Posted by Bomber

ESPN is reporting Renteria to the Sox for 4 years, 44 million.

Fuck

Yet another reason for this Cardinals fan, who used to root for the Red Sox out of sympathy, to absolutely hate them. Welcome to Steinbrenner's World, John Henry!

[Bomber]

Originally Posted by Fonzie

Fuck

Yet another reason for this Cardinals fan, who used to root for the Red Sox out of sympathy, to absolutely hate them. Welcome to Steinbrenner's World, John Henry!

I've been saying it all day, the Red Sox are becoming the new Yankees.

[Bomber]

Well maybe not:

The Yankees and Carl Pavano are currently putting the finishing touches on a four-year deal worth about $40 million.