Crazy wierd thing with rookie contracts...anyone ever seen this? - Page 2

Nwobhm · 10-12-2005, 02:57 AM

I did a quick check of which other leagues this "Gmac" guy belongs to. It appears he's controlling the steelers in the PFL and the seahawks in the NFLfrontoffice league. Anyone currently in those leagues should probably make your commishes aware of this and decide for yourselves whether you want to play with this guy.

Edit: He's also in the dynasty football league, controlling the new mexico vipers..

mckerney · 10-12-2005, 03:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrBigglesworth

Good point, but that begs another question: if the commish's installation sees that as just another contract offer, why does the player accept it if it is so far below any of the four options that he is asking for?

My guess is that contracts handled this way as processed differently than the rookie contract negotiation system.

gottimd · 10-12-2005, 06:42 AM

Shocker that he was a league champion.

That means he gets an invite to that championship league, right?

Joe · 10-12-2005, 06:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gottimd

Shocker that he was a league champion.

That means he gets an invite to that championship league, right?

No, but he gets an invite to the FOF black list.

gottimd · 10-12-2005, 07:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by George W Bush

No, but he gets an invite to the FOF black list.

And if he isn't black?

VPI97 · 10-12-2005, 07:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mckerney

My guess is that contracts handled this way as processed differently than the rookie contract negotiation system.

Yep.

The guy needs to be banned from MP leagues.

WrongWay · 10-12-2005, 07:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrBigglesworth

If he were cut, and then resigned, wouldn't it say that he "signed a new contract" or "signed as an unrestricted free agent"? Not renegotiated?

This was my guess, but I didn't think about cutting the Player in Commish mode. Can anyone actually verify this cheat? Why is the game showing the Rokkie signing a "Renogiated Contract"?

Actually this is the 2nd year Denver has Renogiated with their 1st round draft pick. So, the owner must of just discovered this cheat recently, within the last month, as 3 years ago their first round pick signed a normal rookie contract.

For the rest of you I would say start checking your transaction logs and see if you can spot any rookies signing renogiated contracts.

Alf · 10-12-2005, 07:58 AM

moron

gstelmack · 10-12-2005, 08:38 AM

Do you keep backup files for a few stages? I have backups with all imports and the league status right before every turn, and keep several of them around. Seems like this would be useful data to send off to Jim to find out how he managed to get a "renegotiated" contract out of this. I'm actually concerned that someone figured out how to hack the import files to change the contract type.

stevew · 10-12-2005, 08:55 AM

I went to the trouble and replicated this occurance. My initial thoughts were correct, as step by step this is what the guy would have had to do in order to get the guy to sign the contract. In the FA stages (secondary), you open the game as commish, cut the player you wish to sign for an ultra cheap rookie deal, and save the game. Then in player mode you open the game, find the player you want to sign, sign him, and then export. And then when the export is opened in the original commish files(I made a backup for my test, reverting back to the pre-cut player files), it accepts the import, and does list the contract as being "renegotiated."

Slick guy, too, as he probably was evil enough to pick a high bonus amount, so the contract wouldnt appear to be fiddled with on first glance. My player i tested this with, only wanted the League min to sign.

Insta-ban this guy, like already.

stevew · 10-12-2005, 08:57 AM

dola, and i wouldnt doubt that if you were planning on using it to cheat with rookie contracts, you would try to use it on regular player contracts as well.

gottimd · 10-12-2005, 09:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nwobhm

I did a quick check of which other leagues this "Gmac" guy belongs to. It appears he's controlling the steelers in the PFL and the seahawks in the NFLfrontoffice league. Anyone currently in those leagues should probably make your commishes aware of this and decide for yourselves whether you want to play with this guy.

Edit: He's also in the dynasty football league, controlling the new mexico vipers..

Pinging all of those Commissioners.......you got a cheater!

Samdari · 10-12-2005, 09:15 AM

Does he work at Dell?

KWhit · 10-12-2005, 09:23 AM

I had no idea that the game could be opened in Commish mode by anyone. What other cheats does this make possible? And how do we detect them?

sovereignstar · 10-12-2005, 09:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stevew

Slick guy, too, as he probably was evil enough to pick a high bonus amount, so the contract wouldnt appear to be fiddled with on first glance. My player i tested this with, only wanted the League min to sign.

I saw this too.

I look in that 'View Drafted Player Status' thing all the time in the leagues that I'm in, since it's the only way to look at rookies stats in a somewhat organized way. Never would've gotten away with this in a league I'm apart of.

What a fucking clown.

Cuckoo · 10-12-2005, 09:46 AM

Wow. You know, honestly, this is just sad. How pathetic do you have to be to cheat in an online league? *sigh*

Samdari · 10-12-2005, 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KWhit

I had no idea that the game could be opened in Commish mode by anyone. What other cheats does this make possible?

It certainly makes "simming ahead" possible. I thought this was a well known way to cheat, and that we had a gentleman's agreement not to do so in the IHOF.

JeeberD · 10-12-2005, 10:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cuckoo

Wow. You know, honestly, this is just sad. How pathetic do you have to be to cheat in an online league? *sigh*

Ummm...just make sure you don't look at my signings for the last draft, k thx... :o

cuervo72 · 10-12-2005, 10:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Samdari

It certainly makes "simming ahead" possible. I thought this was a well known way to cheat, and that we had a gentleman's agreement not to do so in the IHOF.

Yep, and that's about all you can do, is have a gentlemen's agreement.

PackerFanatic · 10-12-2005, 10:36 AM

There is a Championship League?

I have been a champion! Where is my invite? lol

gottimd · 10-12-2005, 10:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PackerFanatic

There is a Championship League?

I have been a champion! Where is my invite? lol

http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~fof/foru...ad.php?t=43269

Nwobhm · 10-12-2005, 11:45 AM

I'm interested to find out whether he's done this in the other 3 leagues he's involved with.

Passacaglia · 10-12-2005, 12:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nwobhm

I'm interested to find out whether he's done this in the other 3 leagues he's involved with.

Dunno about the others, but the DFL is still in its first season.

digamma · 10-12-2005, 12:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Samdari

It certainly makes "simming ahead" possible. I thought this was a well known way to cheat, and that we had a gentleman's agreement not to do so in the IHOF.

I'm still a relative n00b in terms of MP, so I don't know what simming ahead accomplishes. Don't you still have to load the current game file? Is it simply to practice gameplanning against different teams?

MrBigglesworth · 10-12-2005, 12:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stevew

dola, and i wouldnt doubt that if you were planning on using it to cheat with rookie contracts, you would try to use it on regular player contracts as well.

This needs more attention! This guy was found cheating because of the disparity in the Drafted Player Status list. But what about guys that are already on the team? Would they accept low-ball offers sent in this manner? Is the likelihood to accept an offer sent with the export and not calculated after importing it? If so, it would be almost impossible to tell who was doing this.

albionmoonlight · 10-12-2005, 12:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by digamma

I'm still a relative n00b in terms of MP, so I don't know what simming ahead accomplishes. Don't you still have to load the current game file? Is it simply to practice gameplanning against different teams?

I would see the advantage as being able to practice some things with your roster that you would otherwise have to do in a game. I can see how it might be tempting to try lots of different things with the offense if your QB goes down with injury, for instance.

sovereignstar · 10-12-2005, 12:19 PM

I'm just starting to look through some of his other leagues. I'm not able to look at previous seasons for the PFL as they don't have their league files archived on the site (and they haven't done the draft yet this season), but this guy is a real piece of work as far as I can tell.

albionmoonlight · 10-12-2005, 12:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sovereignstar

I'm just starting to look through some of his other leagues. I'm not able to look at previous seasons for the PFL as they don't have their league files archived on the site (and they haven't done the draft yet this season), but this guy is a real piece of work as far as I can tell.

I for one think that it is refreshing to see a player of Leonard Davis' ability willing to accept such low base salaries. There's a guy who truly plays for the love of the game.

sovereignstar · 10-12-2005, 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

I for one think that it is refreshing to see a player of Leonard Davis' ability willing to accept such low base salaries. There's a guy who truly plays for the love of the game.

Oh, it ain't just Leonard Davis. It's about a 1/5th of his team. In 9 renegotiated contracts of the current season, he has handed out 134.3 million dollars in bonus money.

albionmoonlight · 10-12-2005, 12:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sovereignstar

Oh, it ain't just Leonard Davis. It's about a 1/5th of his team. In 9 renegotiated contracts of the current season, he has handed out 134.3 million dollars in bonus money.

Maybe players just like to play for him. Ever think of that? Maybe he gets them coke and hookers, and they are willing to give up a little cash in exchange? Coke and hookers tend to explain a lot.

Oh, forget it. This dude is such a tool, it's not even fun to joke about him. Permaban him from every league in existence and be done with it.

What a maroon.

albionmoonlight · 10-12-2005, 12:33 PM

dola--

Although I do hope that he shows up here to "defend himeself." That thread would become an insta-legend before SkyDog locked it.

CraigSca · 10-12-2005, 12:47 PM

If this indeed true, he just won our championship (FOFL).

sovereignstar · 10-12-2005, 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CraigSca

If this indeed true, he just won our championship (FOFL).

Not to be confused with the other FOFL.

cuervo72 · 10-12-2005, 12:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CraigSca

If this indeed true, he just won our championship (FOFL).

Our lawyers will be in touch...

timmynausea · 10-12-2005, 12:54 PM

So he has never actually posted on FOFC? That is weird.

Samdari · 10-12-2005, 12:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by timmynausea

So he has never actually posted on FOFC? That is weird.

Could be because his IP is banned - because he's HM.

I don't know that, but could be. I'm just saying.

timmynausea · 10-12-2005, 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Samdari

Could be because his IP is banned - because he's HM.

I don't know that, but could be. I'm just saying.

I was just thinking that it could mean he is actually a double for someone else, though I didn't have anyone specific in mind.

He registered in April and the account was last active in May. Here's his profile:
http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~fof/foru...ber.php?u=4246

It's completely possible that he just never got into the board, but it seems strange.

sovereignstar · 10-12-2005, 01:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by timmynausea

I was just thinking that it could mean he is actually a double for someone else, though I didn't have anyone specific in mind.

He registered in April and the account was last active in May. Here's his profile:
http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~fof/foru...ber.php?u=4246

It's completely possible that he just never got into the board, but it seems strange.

I know plenty of people from leagues that have never posted here. Some don't even have an account.

PackerFanatic · 10-12-2005, 01:32 PM

I know plenty of people that don't even know what FOFC is, but yeah, he has never posted here.

I have been in contact with him now and I will let you all know how that goes.

timmynausea · 10-12-2005, 01:36 PM

I guess I should clarify: It's not weird that a guy in a multi-player league has never posted here. It's weird that a guy that is in 4 or 5 leagues and goes so far as to cheat in them has never posted here. It doesn't really mean anything, I just thought it was weird.

Bee · 10-12-2005, 01:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PackerFanatic

I know plenty of people that don't even know what FOFC is, but yeah, he has never posted here.

I have been in contact with him now and I will let you all know how that goes.

Let us know if you find him cocky and funny.

Nwobhm · 10-12-2005, 02:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

I for one think that it is refreshing to see a player of Leonard Davis' ability willing to accept such low base salaries. There's a guy who truly plays for the love of the game.

I don't see anything fishy about this leonard davis deal. These kinds of contracts were discussed in our league after they were discovered. You can get significant savings by having minimum base salaries coupled with larger bonuses. This is the way jim redid the contract AI after the 5.1b bug.

The level of savings varies depending on the value of the deal, but i seem to recall getting players to sign deals as low as 60%-70% of their total asking price. The drawback of these contracts is that you're screwed should the player have a career ending injury, and since most ppl renegotiate in the final year of a deal, the savings are somewhat muted.

sovereignstar · 10-12-2005, 02:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nwobhm

I don't see anything fishy about this leonard davis deal. These kinds of contracts were discussed in our league after they were discovered. You can get significant savings by having minimum base salaries coupled with larger bonuses. This is the way jim redid the contract AI after the 5.1b bug.

The level of savings varies depending on the value of the deal, but i seem to recall getting players to sign deals as low as 60%-70% of their total asking price. The drawback of these contracts is that you're screwed should the player have a career ending injury, and since most ppl renegotiate in the final year of a deal, the savings are somewhat muted.

I didn't mean to imply that he was doing anything wrong. Ridiculously fucking stupid, yes.

Nwobhm · 10-12-2005, 02:51 PM

If the mechanics of how this cheat is used can't be solved easily, I'd suggest a more reasonable fix would be that a player should demand the exact same contract whether he's a free agent or on someone's roster. That way, there would be nothing to gain by pulling this crap.

WrongWay · 10-12-2005, 03:15 PM

Stop. Forget about the Rookies this cheat would allow you to make bonus money dissapear.

Take a player you have capped out the past 2 seasons and is now overloaded in bonus money. Use the Same process on him and all his old bonus money will vanish, and you will have a brand new contract without any old or wasted Bonus money. Correct?

And, what makes this even better is that it is going to be a pain in the ass to spot. It will just look like another renogiated contract if done correctly.

stevew · 10-12-2005, 03:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WrongWay

Stop. Forget about the Rookies this cheat would allow you to make bonus money dissapear.

Take a player you have capped out the past 2 seasons and is now overloaded in bonus money. Use the Same process on him and all his old bonus money will vanish, and you will have a brand new contract without any old or wasted Bonus money. Correct?

And, what makes this even better is that it is going to be a pain in the ass to spot. It will just look like another renogiated contract if done correctly.

Hmm, i think the massive bonus would hit the cap. But i will do a test to find out.

WrongWay · 10-12-2005, 03:26 PM

I just checked the transaction log and it looks like he "renogiated" with 4 other players using this cheat. They now all have brand new contracts with exactly the same bonus money evey year.(No old Bonus money)

This is why you can afford to spend 100+ million in bonus money every year, because you get to whipe the slate clean next year. No problems with dead cap space.

sovereignstar · 10-12-2005, 03:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WrongWay

Correct?

No.

gottimd · 10-12-2005, 03:29 PM

So has anyone confronted him about this, or are all of the Commish's just talking about it here?

stevew · 10-12-2005, 03:30 PM

I attempt to use this cheat in my test league with Dre' South(aka Randy Moss). He has something like 25 million in future bonus money. I replicate the cheat the same way as previous, cut him in manager mode, and then resign him in regular mode. However now his bonus money has gone way up, and this cheat does not work.

10-12-2005, 06:42 AM	#53
gottimd Dearly Missed (9/25/77-12/23/08) Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: DC Suburbs	Shocker that he was a league champion. That means he gets an invite to that championship league, right? __________________ NAFL New Orleans Saints GM/Co-Commish MP Career Record: 114-85 NAFL Super Bowl XI Champs In memory of Gavin Anthony: 7/22/08-7/26/08

10-12-2005, 07:58 AM	#58
Alf Pro Starter Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Rennes, France	moron __________________ FOFL - GML - IHOF - FranceStats

10-12-2005, 08:38 AM	#59
gstelmack Pro Starter Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Cary, NC	Do you keep backup files for a few stages? I have backups with all imports and the league status right before every turn, and keep several of them around. Seems like this would be useful data to send off to Jim to find out how he managed to get a "renegotiated" contract out of this. I'm actually concerned that someone figured out how to hack the import files to change the contract type. __________________ -- Greg -- Author of various FOF utilities

10-12-2005, 08:55 AM	#60
stevew Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: the yo'	I went to the trouble and replicated this occurance. My initial thoughts were correct, as step by step this is what the guy would have had to do in order to get the guy to sign the contract. In the FA stages (secondary), you open the game as commish, cut the player you wish to sign for an ultra cheap rookie deal, and save the game. Then in player mode you open the game, find the player you want to sign, sign him, and then export. And then when the export is opened in the original commish files(I made a backup for my test, reverting back to the pre-cut player files), it accepts the import, and does list the contract as being "renegotiated." Slick guy, too, as he probably was evil enough to pick a high bonus amount, so the contract wouldnt appear to be fiddled with on first glance. My player i tested this with, only wanted the League min to sign. Insta-ban this guy, like already. Last edited by stevew : 10-12-2005 at 08:56 AM.

10-12-2005, 09:15 AM	#63
Samdari Roster Filler Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Cicero	Does he work at Dell? __________________ http://www.nateandellie.net Now featuring twice the babies for the same low price!

10-12-2005, 08:57 AM	#61
stevew Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: the yo'	dola, and i wouldnt doubt that if you were planning on using it to cheat with rookie contracts, you would try to use it on regular player contracts as well.

10-12-2005, 09:23 AM	#64
KWhit Coordinator Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Conyers GA	I had no idea that the game could be opened in Commish mode by anyone. What other cheats does this make possible? And how do we detect them?

10-12-2005, 09:46 AM	#66
Cuckoo College Starter Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Edmond, OK	Wow. You know, honestly, this is just sad. How pathetic do you have to be to cheat in an online league? sigh __________________ Commissioner - North American Football League Dallas Cowboys GM

10-12-2005, 10:36 AM	#70
PackerFanatic Pro Starter Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Appleton, WI	There is a Championship League? I have been a champion! Where is my invite? lol __________________ Commissioner of the RNFL

10-12-2005, 11:45 AM	#72
Nwobhm Mascot Join Date: Sep 2002	I'm interested to find out whether he's done this in the other 3 leagues he's involved with.

10-12-2005, 12:19 PM	#77
sovereignstar Pro Starter Join Date: Feb 2004	I'm just starting to look through some of his other leagues. I'm not able to look at previous seasons for the PFL as they don't have their league files archived on the site (and they haven't done the draft yet this season), but this guy is a real piece of work as far as I can tell.

10-12-2005, 12:33 PM	#81
albionmoonlight Head Coach Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: North Carolina	dola-- Although I do hope that he shows up here to "defend himeself." That thread would become an insta-legend before SkyDog locked it.

10-12-2005, 12:47 PM	#82
CraigSca Pro Starter Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Not Delaware - hurray!	If this indeed true, he just won our championship (FOFL). __________________ She loves you, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah! She loves you, yeah! how do you know? how do you know?

10-12-2005, 12:54 PM	#85
timmynausea College Starter Join Date: Dec 2002	So he has never actually posted on FOFC? That is weird.

10-12-2005, 01:32 PM	#89
PackerFanatic Pro Starter Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Appleton, WI	I know plenty of people that don't even know what FOFC is, but yeah, he has never posted here. I have been in contact with him now and I will let you all know how that goes. __________________ Commissioner of the RNFL

10-12-2005, 01:36 PM	#90
timmynausea College Starter Join Date: Dec 2002	I guess I should clarify: It's not weird that a guy in a multi-player league has never posted here. It's weird that a guy that is in 4 or 5 leagues and goes so far as to cheat in them has never posted here. It doesn't really mean anything, I just thought it was weird.

10-12-2005, 02:51 PM	#94
Nwobhm Mascot Join Date: Sep 2002	If the mechanics of how this cheat is used can't be solved easily, I'd suggest a more reasonable fix would be that a player should demand the exact same contract whether he's a free agent or on someone's roster. That way, there would be nothing to gain by pulling this crap.

10-12-2005, 03:15 PM	#95
WrongWay Banned Join Date: Jan 2005	Stop. Forget about the Rookies this cheat would allow you to make bonus money dissapear. Take a player you have capped out the past 2 seasons and is now overloaded in bonus money. Use the Same process on him and all his old bonus money will vanish, and you will have a brand new contract without any old or wasted Bonus money. Correct? And, what makes this even better is that it is going to be a pain in the ass to spot. It will just look like another renogiated contract if done correctly. Last edited by WrongWay : 10-12-2005 at 03:17 PM.

10-12-2005, 03:26 PM	#97
WrongWay Banned Join Date: Jan 2005	I just checked the transaction log and it looks like he "renogiated" with 4 other players using this cheat. They now all have brand new contracts with exactly the same bonus money evey year.(No old Bonus money) This is why you can afford to spend 100+ million in bonus money every year, because you get to whipe the slate clean next year. No problems with dead cap space. Last edited by WrongWay : 10-12-2005 at 03:29 PM.

10-12-2005, 03:29 PM	#99
gottimd Dearly Missed (9/25/77-12/23/08) Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: DC Suburbs	So has anyone confronted him about this, or are all of the Commish's just talking about it here? __________________ NAFL New Orleans Saints GM/Co-Commish MP Career Record: 114-85 NAFL Super Bowl XI Champs In memory of Gavin Anthony: 7/22/08-7/26/08

10-12-2005, 03:30 PM	#100
stevew Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: the yo'	I attempt to use this cheat in my test league with Dre' South(aka Randy Moss). He has something like 25 million in future bonus money. I replicate the cheat the same way as previous, cut him in manager mode, and then resign him in regular mode. However now his bonus money has gone way up, and this cheat does not work.

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