WTH? Youth baseball team kicked out for being too good?

[cuervo72]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Giving a damn about winning is what makes it interesting.

Tough to give a damn about winning when you know full well you are going to have your ass handed to you.

[Gary Gorski]

Originally Posted by rkmsuf

That's reasonable but I don't fault the league for admitting their mistake and taking actions for the greater good of the league. I think the situation is so obvious here and if you saw a game you might think differently.

Shame on the league but shame on this all star team too. That would be like making our Minor League Little League team play the All Star travelling team once a week.

So its ok that the league kicked out this one group of players simply because they were better than other players? Now if this team could move into a different league with better competition or something then in the end perhaps it can all work out but from the sounds of it now this team cannot play in any league because its too late.

Why not make the adjustment next year to not allow this team in or better yet have some type of random setup of teams or allow coaches to pick players. Yes this team would win every game this year - so what. Is whoever wins the league now going to have a great sense of accomplishment knowing that they are the league champs because the best team got kicked out for being too good? I don't see how this helps the self esteem of any of the kids playing.

If the league is so worried about the fragile self esteem of these kids then why not throw out everything that makes them feel bad? No more losses, no more outs, everyone gets the same amount of times to bat, everyone has to play the same amount of innings in the infield and outfield, coaches pitch so they can lob grapefruits in there for little Johnny to hit...

I agree that its dumb that a team this good is playing in such a league but unless they did something wrong that wasn't in the story that is their right. Is it wrong for the best high school kids or even grade school kids to all go to one certain school to play in school sports? At some point you have to teach kids that there are going to be challenges in life and that sometimes there will be people who are better than them and in those situations you just need to do your best and be proud of what you did. 6,7,8 years old may be a bit young for that but 11-12? These kids are about to be teenagers. I'm not saying its time to break out the "winning is the only thing" speech but they're old enough to face a little bit of reality at least.

[rkmsuf]

It's all on the coach to me. He's smart enough to amass the talent, he's smart enough to have them practice 4 days a week, he's smart enough to teach the game, then he's smart enough to know where they belong.

If his goal was to get in a league with creampuffs, he and the team got what they should have.

Somehow he's organized enough to amass and train talent yet can't get them in an appropriate league.

THEY CARRY AROUND BIRTH CERTIFICATES. That is not normal.

[Barkeep49]

I agree with Jon in this instance. In general I think some slaughter rules (for instance the house league I coached in limited innings to 7 runs) can be fine, but they should be established and agreed to ahead of time. Learning how to lose, especially against an impossible foe, is an important life lesson and these coaches are robbing their players of that opportunity

[Klinglerware]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

I agree with Jon in this instance. In general I think some slaughter rules (for instance the house league I coached in limited innings to 7 runs) can be fine, but they should be established and agreed to ahead of time. Learning how to lose, especially against an impossible foe, is an important life lesson and these coaches are robbing their players of that opportunity

Which team are you talking about? The all-star team is certainly not learning how to lose in the cream-puff league, either...

[Barkeep49]

We don't know that it is an all-star team. I am referring to the other teams.

[Glengoyne]

I'm guessing there is indeed more to this story...aka the other side as mentioned above.

A friend's son is playing tee ball as a five year old. My friend volunteered to be a coach, he played college level baseball(D1). He was very annoyed at the competitiveness of some parents as well as other coaches. One team was full of seven year olds that had been playing tee ball together for the previous two years. They generated quite a bit of animosity with other teams because they allowed their players to run out their hits instead of stopping at first or second. Stuff that is pretty uncalled for in a league where score isn't kept.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by rkmsuf

I've seen more joy in a kid's eyes from making a great play, blocking a ball or being praised irregardless of whether it was in a "winning" effort.

If you read/remember/can find my thread on my coaching last year, you'll know that I understand exactly what you're talking about. Find the part about the smallest kid on the team, who could barely see much less play baseball, and you'll know I understand those things & appreciate them.

But ...

The rest of the team doesn't put in their effort, their talents, their time, in order to give the "Little Billy's" of the world the opportunity to make contact once in a while. I believe coaches owe the best 9 (or 10) they've got every chance at winning, because that's the most "fun" you can have.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by rkmsuf

THEY CARRY AROUND BIRTH CERTIFICATES. That is not normal.

As somebody said about something else earlier, that's pretty common as far as I know, going back all the way to even ancient times when I played.

Remember, too, the context of that bit of info, it was a way to quieten the endless challenges about the age of the players. (And I've never seen a league, 70's,80's, 90's, or today where that wasn't a constant issue, even seen that happen in a no-score-kept league a couple of times).

[TurnerONU22]

From being around the Columbus area, Canal Winchester is probably one of the biggest growing "suburbs" around, they have been building tons of new houses in that area, put up a new shopping plaza, ect. I'm not sure how exactly the rec league extends to down there, but going a few mins away from Canal, you're in farm land. New neighborhoods vs. farms, there's a ton of talent that's going to be in the neighborhoods.

It seems to me that they should do away with the whole "community" teams of which it appears would have worked well when it was just mostly farm land a few years ago, and now these new "neighborhoods" where the kids live right beside each other, and a coach can gather up a team that probably lives within a mile of each other in the neighborhood verses a coach that has kids strung out in the farmland and its harder to get together to practice.

Now, I could totally wrong about how this league is structured, but from knowing the area and its growth in the past few years, I think it makes sense. Of course, I've never heard of a rec league where the coaches can pick their entire team to enter the league. I can understand that the team doesn't want to travel, but if that is the case, then tough luck for keeping the team together. If these are the best 9 kids in the league on 1 team, maybe they would actually benefit from being on different teams, so that each of them could learn to be a "leader" of their team.

[Easy Mac]

I'd have to agree that the league was asking for it. Hell, when I was 11 and 12, my team didn't lose at all. We routinely won games 20-0, and these were shortened by mercy rules. We won the championship games my last year by a combined 50 something runs. And this wasn't an all-star team, this was by a draft. And of course, the team I was on had won every championship since my brother in law was in rec leagues (and he's 7 years older than me). Sometimes that stuff just happens.

I'm just saying that kids have to learn to win and lose in life just as much as they have to learn to have fun. What good is a society where everyone grows up thinking they'll always succeed. As soon as they don't succeed, they'll fall apart. Look at all the kids my age graduating with no idea what to do, or are having a hell of a time not being the shit at a job. The best lessons I learned from winning and losing at sports were just as important as what I was taught in school. I had some good times playing high school soccer getting our asses handed to us by 10 goals. Sure, it was embarrasing, but its also good to be humbled every now and again. I think its more parents not being able to handle watching their kids not excel at everything that is the problem. We've become a society where we have to coddle kids to make them think they're perfect, because so many parents feel like a failure if their kids don't succeed. Sometimes they need to get beat to make them work harder so it doesn't happen again. We lost to the #2 soccer team in the state at home by 12-1. We went to their house later and losts 3-2 on penalty kicks. We never would have tried that hard if we hadn't got killed the first time. Sure, it didn't always work out like that, but the times it did were some of the best of my sporting life.

[TurnerONU22]

Read this in the paper today and thought you guys would like to read the update.

Squad sent packing lines up new foes
Canal Winchester team won’t travel far to play games
Saturday, June 25, 2005
Kirk D . Richards
THE COLUMBUS DISPATCH

A baseball team that was booted from a Canal Winchester youth league for blowing out opponents has gone from having no one to play to having too many requests to fill.

News reports of the Columbus Stars’ struggle to find opponents drew responses from people across the country — and challenges from other teams.

Clay Branch, a parent in a youth league in Atlanta, offered to arrange for the Stars to play in Georgia. He said he heard about the controversy on the radio and decided to read The Dispatch story.

"I’d never heard of anything like that, and it blew my mind," Branch said. "I wish we were closer."

A trip that far — or even one to answer challenges from teams in Cincinnati and northern Kentucky — will not be necessary.

Instead, the Stars will start competition closer to home on Sunday with a game against the Screamin’ Demons, a team from Delaware.

On Tuesday, the Stars will play a Worthington Christian team. Next month, the Stars plan to go to Georgian Heights on the West Side and to Jeffersonville for tournaments.

Darla Perry, whose 11-year-old son, R.J., was interviewed by the Orlando Sentinel, said the Stars are considering other requests, including one from a Walnut Ridge team.

However, the team that no one wanted to play in the Canal Winchester league is no longer undefeated.

On Thursday, the Fox Sports Network filmed what turned out to be the Stars’ first loss of the season: a 5-4 defeat to Georgian Heights, a team the Stars had beaten twice this year.

Stars pitcher Josh Dameron, 12, said the loss served as a good lesson.

"We learned that you can’t win every game," Josh said. "The mood of our team is the same. We don’t care about the loss. The next time we play them, we hope we win."

The Stars thought they were set for the season when they joined a Canal Winchester recreation league. But when the Stars started pulling off lopsided victories, which they say were the result of practicing 2½ hours, four nights a week, other teams complained.

The Stars won five games by a combined score of 82-8 before the league pulled them from the schedule. Officials returned the team’s $150 entry fee.

Michael Mirones, chairman of the Canal Winchester Joint Recreation District, acknowledged that he has faced lots of criticism since news of the Stars’ ouster became public. He said the team belonged in a travel league playing better teams as opposed to a recreation league.

Matt Harwood, coach of the Screamin’ Demons on which his son, Swade, 12, plays, said he felt sorry for the Stars. He eagerly sought Sunday’s matchup, which will be at 2 p.m. at Mingo Park, Rt. 23 and E. Lincoln Avenue, in Delaware.

Mack Brahier, a member of the Screamin’ Demons comes from a recreation team that has a 9-1 record. His Mid-Ohio Lightning Sails won one game 23-2 and another game 10-0.

Mack, who plays shortstop and second base, said opponents did not complain.

"They thought we were cool." If he were on the losing side, "I’d probably be mad," he said. But he added that for the next game, "I’d try harder."

[email protected]

I still think they should have been allowed in the rec league for this year, but its nice to see these other teams coming out and wanting to play the Stars, who will now be the team with the target on their backs for the rest of the year.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Thanks for the update Turner, good to know.