Wolverine Studios to release Draft Day Sports:Pro Basketball

[wade moore]

The international game would be a ery small piece for me. Just a little side note. I think if it takes significant programming time, it is probably not worth it for this version - I can't see it adding very many sales.

[Groundhog]

Originally Posted by wade moore

The international game would be a ery small piece for me. Just a little side note. I think if it takes significant programming time, it is probably not worth it for this version - I can't see it adding very many sales.

That's the other thing. Adding a scaled down version of an international game would not help sales a great deal, no. Even still, it would be awesome and greatly improve my personal enjoyment of the sim, and it would make it unique amongst the other bball sims out there.

Including a fully fleshed out international game in later versions would most certainly increase sales if marketed properly. Basketball is very popular throughout Europe and Asia, and I'd wager that those markets would love to control their local teams in a sim.

There is, to my knowledge, just one other simulator on the market that allows for the Euro and international leagues. It was released maybe 3 years ago and I can't recall the name of it, but it was poor, and even that's being too kind.

[Zippo]

Originally Posted by Groundhog

That's the other thing. Adding a scaled down version of an international game would not help sales a great deal, no. Even still, it would be awesome and greatly improve my personal enjoyment of the sim, and it would make it unique amongst the other bball sims out there.

Including a fully fleshed out international game in later versions would most certainly increase sales if marketed properly. Basketball is very popular throughout Europe and Asia, and I'd wager that those markets would love to control their local teams in a sim.

There is, to my knowledge, just one other simulator on the market that allows for the Euro and international leagues. It was released maybe 3 years ago and I can't recall the name of it, but it was poor, and even that's being too kind.

world basketball manager? http://www.gamespot.com/pc/strategy/...ball%20manager

[Groundhog]

Originally Posted by Zippo

world basketball manager? http://www.gamespot.com/pc/strategy/...ball%20manager

That's the one. Great idea, but a sloppy interface and weak engine.

[KeyserSoze]

Originally Posted by Gary Gorski

Ok since there is some interest in international play - what level of detail and realism are you looking for in a first version? I researched the European setup today (thanks KeyserSose and Icy) and it looks like theres 24 leagues in Europe that basically send a set amount of teams to two championship seasons and those teams play in both their home league and the championship league in that particular season. That's to say nothing of the rest of the world. I was thinking of starting simply by letting you play a modified version of the European system - take a specific number of teams, divide them into my own divisions and still model the two championships but just get the teams from a smaller number of combined domestic leagues. Would that be of interest or is this a feature you are looking at as an all or nothing type one?

Gary I think that is a great idea (in fact it was my "best scenario"). I suggest as European competitions the ULEB and the Euroleague and 3-5 domestics leagues. As I suppose, they are all modabbles so what leagues are by default is a minor detail.

[Brian Swartz]

For those of you who are interested in the Agent aspect of the game -- do you have anything specific you'd like to be able to do, or any comments on how you'd like it to work?

[DaddyTorgo]

bump

tick...tock...tick...tock

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

bump

tick...tock...tick...tock

Not cool!

[DaddyTorgo]

i know. but just hoping to get Gary's attention and find out what the latest is.

[fenrrris]

Got to agree. I've been checking the Wolverine site every day for weeks, but almost zero information has surfaced aside from the draft video.

Waiting with bated breath. Starting to get blue.

[Tim Tellean]

We are in beta testing and continue to work hard on the game. Gary and Jamie Gorski became proud parents of Elizabeth Ann Gorski on Friday.

[MJ4H]

Did they ask this Elizabeth girl if that was ok

[Gary Gorski]

lol MJ4H - yeah the birth of our second child interrupted the coding for a few days but its not like it wasn't expected

We're hard at work beta testing it. I'm still hopeful for a release this month but I don't like to give a date until Im sure of it. I am very excited about the game and I really want it to be spectacular so there is a bit of feature creep going on but I promise the minute I have a date it will be all over the place

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Gary Gorski

lol MJ4H - yeah the birth of our second child interrupted the coding for a few days but its not like it wasn't expected

We're hard at work beta testing it. I'm still hopeful for a release this month but I don't like to give a date until Im sure of it. I am very excited about the game and I really want it to be spectacular so there is a bit of feature creep going on but I promise the minute I have a date it will be all over the place

lol gary...what's with having babies right around game release dates? is there something about a pregnant woman that gets you in a coding frame of mind?

[MJ4H]

Congrats.

[Cork]

Originally Posted by Gary Gorski

I am very excited about the game and I really want it to be spectacular so there is a bit of feature creep going on but I promise the minute I have a date it will be all over the place

Oh oh, the ugly feature creep monster has reared it's ugly head. Not good. I fear for the agent mode.

-Cork

[King of New York]

Gary, That's great news about your new daughter. Best to you and yours.

[Gary Gorski]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

lol gary...what's with having babies right around game release dates? is there something about a pregnant woman that gets you in a coding frame of mind?

It only happens with the pro hoops game - my son was born when TPB 2005 was in testing and now my daughter with DDS: PB. So far college hoops and golf seem to be safe - maybe I should stick to those

[wbatl1]

Any updates? I was really hoping to get this for myself for Christmas...

Oh, and Congratulations Gary!

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Gary Gorski

It only happens with the pro hoops game - my son was born when TPB 2005 was in testing and now my daughter with DDS: PB. So far college hoops and golf seem to be safe - maybe I should stick to those

or not, depending on what you desire.

[RedKingGold]

Gary Gorski:I'm not sure where we are hiding the fact that the game is in testing. It is and has been for a few weeks now.

As for the release of the product I should be able to give some more news on that this week. It is possible we may bump it back slightly to allow for some additional testing but no decision has been made yet. Everyone has taken a few days off for Christmas and we're getting back at it today. I realize its been quiet from my front but I'm coding and fixing bugs and I figure that's more useful than posting on the forum at this stage.

I understand that's an unconventional approach in gaming because companies set release dates and ship the game done or not in some cases but we have the luxury of being able to release the game within a matter of hours - we just upload the file, flip the switch and its released to the world. If you've set aside money for it well you've seen screens, you saw a video, you know the game is being tested...its only a matter of time before it's released. It's not like its a bunch of smoke and mirrors and its going to be months before its done. It's close - there are just areas that need more work and that could mean a couple of days or a week or two and I don't want to keep telling people ok its going to be this day, no this day, no that day...I know you want a date or at least general range of days but the best I can do today is tell you that it won't be much longer.

Taken from: http://www.wolverinestudios.com/foru...3&postcount=10

[miami_fan]

Please test the hell out of the game. I'll wait

[JeffW]

Just curious: Why would anyone be interested in agent mode?

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by JeffW

Just curious: Why would anyone be interested in agent mode?

The opportunity to make millions of dollars for your clients and have the fans hate you for it.

[Deattribution]

Originally Posted by JeffW

Just curious: Why would anyone be interested in agent mode?

Why not? If nothing else(even if I don't buy/play the game) I applaud them for trying something new. Stuff like that typically leads to bigger and better things for all games if it catches on.

[wbatl1]

Originally Posted by RedKingGold

Taken from: http://www.wolverinestudios.com/foru...3&postcount=10

Thanks! I headed over there the other day, but didn't see any news, so I'm glad you helped me out.

And to address Gary's comment: If a company does set a release date (or timeframe) as he did, it seems proper that they inform the consumer if that date or timeframe changes. I'm glad I saw that post, because it informed me that he has pushed the timeframe back into the 1st Quarter of 2007.

Each one of these cases makes me appreciate Jim's business model more and more...

[RedKingGold]

I just think its funny when people complain that they have a right to complain when a game is not released when the developer said it would be. They only make my day better when they attempt to explain why they are justified.

Can someone give me one decent reason to feel this way?

[MizzouRah]

I think people just like to complain.

[dervack]

In case anyone missed it, Gary made two announcements regarding the game today. 1. It won't be out till sometime in January. 2. Agent mode is no longer in the game. The "framework" is there for the future but the game will not have it. Like I said over on his boards, the game went from a Buy to a not even worth looking at. Good Luck anyway Gary.

[DaddyTorgo]

wow dervack. GG: There were people who were willing to buy the game simply for the agent mode and to be honest it just wasn't deep enough to ask you to buy the game simply for that reason. I like the idea of the agent mode and like I said, the framework remains in the code so that if at some point we can flush it out a little better it can be added, but there just wasn't enough there to keep it interesting. So you're going to penalize him for looking out for you the consumer and not charging you for something that wasn't worth it by denying him even the opportunity of winning your business? seems a bit bass-ackwards.

[DaddyTorgo]

dola sorry bout the formatting on my last post, dunno why it's acting up and won't let me paragraph or italicize.

[dervack]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

wow dervack. GG: There were people who were willing to buy the game simply for the agent mode and to be honest it just wasn't deep enough to ask you to buy the game simply for that reason. I like the idea of the agent mode and like I said, the framework remains in the code so that if at some point we can flush it out a little better it can be added, but there just wasn't enough there to keep it interesting. So you're going to penalize him for looking out for you the consumer and not charging you for something that wasn't worth it by denying him even the opportunity of winning your business? seems a bit bass-ackwards.

Or maybe I don't find the basketball sim interesting enough to purchase the game on its own, but having a mode never been tried before was enough for me to purchase the game. I'm one customer. I think he'll get by.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by dervack

Or maybe I don't find the basketball sim interesting enough to purchase the game on its own, but having a mode never been tried before was enough for me to purchase the game. I'm one customer. I think he'll get by.

oh i agree he'll get by. i just think your post was a little harsh considering that we trash someone like Winters for releasing a game with features that don't provide value for the $, but then when Gorski makes a decision not to do that, the first thing he'll see is "wow then i'm not buying that game," instead of something more along the lines of "thanks for trying to get agent mode in there gary. sorry that it didn't work out, hopefully it will work out in the future, best of luck on the release."

[wbatl1]

I was frustrated with Gary earlier in the thread, but this announcement over at the WS forums is exactly what I wanted to see. Well Done Gary!

[Galaril]

Originally Posted by wbatl1

I was frustrated with Gary earlier in the thread, but this announcement over at the WS forums is exactly what I wanted to see. Well Done Gary!

I agree I could care less about an agent mode.

[Gary Gorski]

Originally Posted by dervack

Or maybe I don't find the basketball sim interesting enough to purchase the game on its own, but having a mode never been tried before was enough for me to purchase the game. I'm one customer. I think he'll get by.

One customer means a great deal to me. Trust me, I want your $35 very much - but not enough to take it without giving you your money's worth. You're exactly the kind of customer I considered when making this decision. The agent mode turned out to be more of a temporary diversion from the heart of the game rather than something that you could really get into. I wanted it to be like a game within the game but it just wasn't turning out that way and for a customer who was going to buy it solely for that feature alone I didn't think it was fair to ask you to pay $35 for that. I'm sorry to dissapoint you and anyone else who was looking forward to the agent mode - I honestly was looking forward to it as well - I think the idea is a good one and still one I would like to implement in the game at some point in time but it just wasn't deep enough at this point.

Had it been some other kind of feature that people were like "oh that will be cool" I might have left it in but when you and others were going to buy the game solely because of it I just didn't feel right about it. I'm sorry that decision cost me a sale or some sales but I honestly would rather you have your $35 if that is the only thing you were looking forward to because its better than you being dissapointed when the feature wasn't deep enough to give you your money's worth of gaming time.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Gary Gorski

One customer means a great deal to me. Trust me, I want your $35 very much - but not enough to take it without giving you your money's worth. You're exactly the kind of customer I considered when making this decision. The agent mode turned out to be more of a temporary diversion from the heart of the game rather than something that you could really get into. I wanted it to be like a game within the game but it just wasn't turning out that way and for a customer who was going to buy it solely for that feature alone I didn't think it was fair to ask you to pay $35 for that. I'm sorry to dissapoint you and anyone else who was looking forward to the agent mode - I honestly was looking forward to it as well - I think the idea is a good one and still one I would like to implement in the game at some point in time but it just wasn't deep enough at this point.

Had it been some other kind of feature that people were like "oh that will be cool" I might have left it in but when you and others were going to buy the game solely because of it I just didn't feel right about it. I'm sorry that decision cost me a sale or some sales but I honestly would rather you have your $35 if that is the only thing you were looking forward to because its better than you being dissapointed when the feature wasn't deep enough to give you your money's worth of gaming time.

class act ladies and gentleman...class act

[theclassic]

I was critical of Gary's text sim golf game, but I agree with others that he is a class act. I'll look forward to trying out a demo this January, and I'll avoid being a public critic.

[dervack]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

class act ladies and gentleman...class act

I never said he wasn't a class act. And if you bothered reading my post, you would see that I did wish him luck with his release.

I previously owned the first TPB and didn't feel like enough has been added over the years to justify another purchase. With Agent mode, it was something new and would push me towards buying the game. Without it in there, I'll stick with the text sims that I already have. I don't need your approval when I post.

[Galaril]

Originally Posted by theclassic

I was critical of Gary's text sim golf game, but I agree with others that he is a class act. I'll look forward to trying out a demo this January, and I'll avoid being a public critic.

Ditto.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by dervack

I never said he wasn't a class act. And if you bothered reading my post, you would see that I did wish him luck with his release.

I previously owned the first TPB and didn't feel like enough has been added over the years to justify another purchase. With Agent mode, it was something new and would push me towards buying the game. Without it in there, I'll stick with the text sims that I already have. I don't need your approval when I post.

i never claimed, or even implied that you needed my approval. in fact if you bothered reading MY post you'd see that I explicitly said you're welcome to post whatever you want.

[dervack]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

i never claimed, or even implied that you needed my approval. in fact if you bothered reading MY post you'd see that I explicitly said you're welcome to post whatever you want.

Actually, if you want to get technical, you never did say that. But whatever.

[DaddyTorgo]

aaah. my fault. i intended to say that, but my formatting has been all screwed up, so i must have lost the part where i said something to that effect

[AgustusM]

for me, I never saw the point in agent mode. I can't think of a group that adds more misery for me as a sports fan and provides not one thing in return.

I despise agents - so unless there was an option to make them all sent to Siberia - I doubt I would have played that mode at all.

as for the game, release it when is done and I will buy right away - I loved the last version and played the hell out of it.