The OFFICIAL 2009-10 NHL Regular Season Thread

[MikeVic]

I guess I don't follow the NHL a ton, but the Leafs seem to have made two really good trades today. I thought Dion was one of the better dmen in the league, weird to see him get traded like this.

[samifan24]

Originally Posted by MikeVic

I thought Dion was one of the better dmen in the league, weird to see him get traded like this.

He is one of the elite defensemen in the league. I follow the NHL closely and I'm not really sure why a team would deal its star defenseman to "shake things up." I know the Flames have Bouwmeester but still.

[bbor]

Dion was having big troubles in Calgary...I think it was addition by subtraction for tehm.Apparently he had turned into a bit of a cancer in the dressing room.Still i would think they would get at least 1 top flight name for him.I like the deal for T.O but i dunno how they are gonna fill all the holes they made in their line up.I imagine Kabere will be moved now for a forward.

I think the Leafs made out really well in the Anahiem deal.....Although both teams got rid of unmovable contracts(js and Toskula) but T.O wins the deal by getting rid of two unmovable contracts Toskula and Blake.Blake has speed to burn but really offers nothing else at all.

All in all a good day in Leafland(after a horrible night of blowing a 3-0 lead to the Nucks)

Now i wait patiently for the other shoe to drop.

[bhlloy]

Toskala is an UFA after this season so his contract means nothing at all. Looking at it in the light of day I agree with Johnny that it's a good deal for both teams.

[bbor]

Interesting tidbit...If Hiller gets injured the Ducks goalies would be Toskula and Pogge.

Been there...done that

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by bbor

DI think the Leafs made out really well in the Anahiem deal.....Although both teams got rid of unmovable contracts(js and Toskula) but T.O wins the deal by getting rid of two unmovable contracts Toskula and Blake.Blake has speed to burn but really offers nothing else at all.

I don't think this is a deal where one team wins over the other. Both teams got something out of this.

As bhlloy pointed out, Toskala is an UFA. He's off the books by July, or back for much, much cheaper. Blake will probably playing with better linemates and out of the media circus of Toronto. Also, most of the Ducks' forwards are speedy--he'll be a better fit there. So I suspect Blake will play a little better in Anaheim than he did in Toronto. Koivu (UFA) and Selanne (retirement) are probably gone after this year, so good to get a potential top six forward now, even at Blake's cap hit.

And we gained that by moving an openly disgruntled backup GK to Toronto who will be making around $7 M next year, with a cap hit of $6 M.

With the cap hit saved, the next contract will be to Bobby Ryan to keep him out of RFA this summer.

So this is a deal that is entirely positive for the Ducks.

And I like the deal for the Leafs as well, for the reasons stated already by Leafs fans.

Could Chief Rum be a Leafs fan in the EC? I don't have a team to follow out there, but now that you guys have Jiggy, Beauch, former Ducks coach Ron Wilson and Burke, it would be hard for me not to root for you guys over other EC teams more often than not.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by bbor

Interesting tidbit...If Hiller gets injured the Ducks goalies would be Toskula and Pogge.

Been there...done that

A pox on you.

[bbor]

I think i am starting to agree with you guys on the Toskula/Blake for Jiggy deal.It really does make sense for both teams.I guess i am just amazed that the Leafs moved both players.It does not make sense for the Ducks to have 7 mil sitting on their bench.

The Toronto Ducks has a nice ring to it...no?

Perhaps we need one more Duck before we change our name....Bobby Ryan perhaps

[Honolulu_Blue]

It looks like the Toronto/Anaheim deal is essentially swapping Blake's contract for Giguere's. Blake can, at times, provide some secondary scoring for Anaheim to take some pressure off that top line. That said, if you had to compare the two contracts, a team is likely to get better value out of Giguere than Blake.

It makes sense for Anaheim to move a big contract that was sitting on the bench for a slightly smaller contract that, at the very least, will see some ice time.

The Calgary/Toronto deal is a bit odd. Phanuef, two years ago, was considered one of the young, elite defensemen in the league. His play dropped off last year and he's actually been pretty brutal so far this year. Just a huge liability defensively and without the offensive upside. Still, he's only 24, so there's hope for him yet.

As for what Calgary is getting... I like Hagman, Mayers and Stajan are ok and White has been pretty decent so far this year. I am just not sure if this trade solves their issues.

I guess, at the end of the day, if you judge a trade by which team got the best player, I think Toronto got the best player in each deal. I still have no idea how they plan on scoring, but at least Giguere should help keep the puck out of the net a little better.

[lerriuqs]

Originally Posted by samifan24

He was one of the elite defensemen in the league. I follow the NHL closely and I'm not really sure why a team would deal its star defenseman to "shake things up." I know the Flames have Bouwmeester but still.

Fixed for you. Phaneuf hasn't been close to elite for over a season now. He's looked lost in about 3 quarters of the rink on many a night and got himself in trouble trying to do too much lugging of the puck (often with very little tangible results). Also, the guy was apparently a cancer in the locker room...he made himself expendable.

[samifan24]

Calgary trades C Olli Jokinen to NYR for RW Ales Kotalik & C Chris Higgins

[Suburban Rhythm]

Originally Posted by lerriuqs

Fixed for you. Phaneuf hasn't been close to elite for over a season now. He's looked lost in about 3 quarters of the rink on many a night and got himself in trouble trying to do too much lugging of the puck (often with very little tangible results). Also, the guy was apparently a cancer in the locker room...he made himself expendable.

I'l go one futher-

He is/was expected to be one of the top defensemen in the league. He had an oustanding rookie year and has regressed since. Too soon to write him off as a bust, but he hasn't reached the level most thought he'd be at by this point of his career.

He's still young for a defenseman, so he might yet "get it". He has a big shot, and throws big hits, but he doesn't play a total game yet.

[Suburban Rhythm]

Originally Posted by samifan24

Calgary trades C Olli Jokinen to NYR for RW Ales Kotalik & C Chris Higgins

Tortarella is gonna love Jokinen

[Suburban Rhythm]

DOLA

Is it March 3rd?

[chrisj]

Question: How to make Dion Phanuef 10x more overrated than he already is?

Answer: Trade him to Toronto.

--

Seriously, like many have said, Phanuef was great his first 2-3 years in the league - but something happened. Maybe the league figured him out? I'm not sure. His numbers are still look good - but his defensive play has been awful, and he is not nearly as effective offensively.

In fact, from just a #'s perspective, Ian White looks better than Phaneuf (I haven't seen White play much, so I have no idea how his play compares to Dion...).

Honestly, that trade is a win for Calgary. Gives them a bit of depth up front, and moves a guy who can be a clubhouse distraction.

--

On a final note - a bit of a funny story. A couple years ago a few of us were out at a Calgary club one night. One of my friends is a very attractive blonde girl. A guy comes up to us (well, her) and starts hitting on her. She turned him down, and he was like "do you know who I am?". She said "no", and he got all pissed off and walked away cursing at her.

Of course, it was Dion Phaneuf.

[Galaxy]

Miller wore his Olympic mask in practice today. Pretty sharp. (only going to wear it for the Olympics). Love the throwback Uncle Sam.

wgrz.com | Buffalo, NY | Ryan Miller's Olympic Mask

(I believe the stars represent the 13 colonies.)

[Johnny93g]

Originally Posted by chrisj

Seriously, like many have said, Phanuef was great his first 2-3 years in the league - but something happened. Maybe the league figured him out? I'm not sure. His numbers are still look good - but his defensive play has been awful, and he is not nearly as effective offensively.

In fact, from just a #'s perspective, Ian White looks better than Phaneuf (I haven't seen White play much, so I have no idea how his play compares to Dion...).

Honestly, that trade is a win for Calgary. Gives them a bit of depth up front, and moves a guy who can be a clubhouse distraction.

Of course, it was Dion Phaneuf.

Ian White and Dion Phaneuf have probably performed very similarly this season. Here's the big difference. Ian White is playing at about 95% of his ability. He won't get much better then he his right now. People seem to agree that Phaneuf is playing at about 50-60% percent of his ability.

Toronto has Gunnarsson, Beauchemin and now Phaneuf who are all capable of at the very least, doing what Ian White did.

Matt Stajan was a product of his ice time and line mates. You play enough, with guys who score every once in a while, you'll get a few points. Can John Mitchell play Stajan minutes and score 20 points in the remaining 34 games(approximately Stajan's pace) maybe, he'll probably finish closer to 15 points, but the difference is negligible.

Mayers is a 4th line tough guy. The Leafs have Colton Orr and Jay Rosehill. Won't miss him.

Nick Hagman is having a great season. 20 goals, very streaky, but producing. Will the Leafs miss him. Ya, probably, but they weren't winning with him in the lineup.

My point is, the Leafs aren't taking a huge chance here. If Phaneuf doesn't get back to his early form, then the Leafs have a ok defensmen, who is a good pp goal scorer. If he reaches the potential everyone believes he has, it's a home run.

I don't know anyone who knows hockey that wouldn't make this trade from the Toronto perspective. They lose next to nothing, and pick up a package that could be great. As of right now, they are the clear winners.

[Dr. Sak]

Originally Posted by Suburban Rhythm

Tortarella is gonna love Jokinen

Hey it worked for Gaborik.

[Ajaxab]

Originally Posted by Johnny93g

Ian White and Dion Phaneuf have probably performed very similarly this season. Here's the big difference. Ian White is playing at about 95% of his ability. He won't get much better then he his right now. People seem to agree that Phaneuf is playing at about 50-60% percent of his ability.

+1 This seems like a classic buy low and sell high for Burke and the Leafs.

[johnnyshaka]

Dion signed his big deal and promptly started phoning it in. Maybe Keenan started calling him on his pussy antics (loves to take runs at guys but scurries away as soon as things get physical in hopes that one of their other tough guys will step up for him) and now both Sutters have seen what Keenan was whining about and finally rode him out of town.

Without Phaneuf, the Flames D will be just fine and that's before you factor in White. But I'm sure the Sutters have something else up their sleeve to sort out their scoring issues...and I hope to God they haven't figured out a way to play the Oilers the rest of their remaining games!!!

[Fidatelo]

I think these trades are all pretty reasonable from every side. It's kind of cool, actually. Too often in sports nowadays the trades are lop-sided and some dude is getting sold for 60 cents on the dollar (for various reasons not usually related to how the player fits on the field/rink/court). I hope this trend continues.

[Pyser]

paul martin has pulled out of the olympics. his broken arm hasnt healed in time.

[chrisj]

Originally Posted by Johnny93g

My point is, the Leafs aren't taking a huge chance here. If Phaneuf doesn't get back to his early form, then the Leafs have a ok defensmen, who is a good pp goal scorer. If he reaches the potential everyone believes he has, it's a home run.

I don't know anyone who knows hockey that wouldn't make this trade from the Toronto perspective. They lose next to nothing, and pick up a package that could be great. As of right now, they are the clear winners.

Except for the fact that Phaneuf has the 8th highest cap hit for a d-man - but is far from the 8th best d-man in the league. Granted, the Leafs are in good shape salary cap wise next season - but how about in 2013/2014 if Phaneuf is still a #3/#4 d-man who is good on the powerplay?

I mean, it's not as bad as Shawn Horcoff, but to suggest that this is a steal is a little bit off. There's quite a bit of risk for both teams here.

[Galaxy]

What's with Ryan Miller and the Pens? I know he didn't get much help from the guys in front (hey D, learn to lay down to take away the pass on 2-on-1s), but he just seems to be having a tough time against them .

[johnnyshaka]

Holy shit, the Oilers just might win a game...sorry, Carolina.

[bbor]

Originally Posted by chrisj

Except for the fact that Phaneuf has the 8th highest cap hit for a d-man - but is far from the 8th best d-man in the league. Granted, the Leafs are in good shape salary cap wise next season - but how about in 2013/2014 if Phaneuf is still a #3/#4 d-man who is good on the powerplay?

I mean, it's not as bad as Shawn Horcoff, but to suggest that this is a steal is a little bit off. There's quite a bit of risk for both teams here.

In 13/14 Phaneuf will still only be 29.I think a lot of people fail to realize this guy is still only 24.Granted he may have leveled off,but most D-men do develop a little bit later than forwards.Bottom line is the Leafs were going nowhere with the players they traded for Phaneuf,will they go somewhere with Phaneuf?Who knows?As they sayyou need to break a few eggs to make a omlette.

A risk well worth taking IMHO.

[Galaxy]

Originally Posted by bbor

In 13/14 Phaneuf will still only be 29.I think a lot of people fail to realize this guy is still only 24.Granted he may have leveled off,but most D-men do develop a little bit later than forwards.Bottom line is the Leafs were going nowhere with the players they traded for Phaneuf,will they go somewhere with Phaneuf?Who knows?As they sayyou need to break a few eggs to make a omlette.

A risk well worth taking IMHO.

I guess the one problem with Phaneuf is he's not the most popular player in the locker room (just was listening to Rob Ray talk about it on the radio today).

[bbor]

Originally Posted by Galaxy

I guess the one problem with Phaneuf is he's not the most popular player in the locker room (just was listening to Rob Ray talk about it on the radio today).

Definatly a concern.Especially since the Leafs don't have a player with a strong dressing room presence.

[chrisj]

Originally Posted by bbor

In 13/14 Phaneuf will still only be 29.I think a lot of people fail to realize this guy is still only 24.Granted he may have leveled off,but most D-men do develop a little bit later than forwards.Bottom line is the Leafs were going nowhere with the players they traded for Phaneuf,will they go somewhere with Phaneuf?Who knows?As they sayyou need to break a few eggs to make a omlette.

A risk well worth taking IMHO.

Oh - I know he could become a star, he certainly has the potential. All I am saying is that some media out of Toronto are talking about how this was a steal - and while it could look that way in a few years, it does come with a lot of risk.

With that being said - I won't argue that in 4 years, Phaneuf could be be as good or better as someone like Chris Pronger was in his prime. Just saying he could also be Jason Smith.

Won't argue with the fact the Leafs needed to do something. With no first rounders for the next two years, they needed to do some sort of deal. If Phaneuf and Kessle both develop to be elite players, Toronto could have something really good.

[Johnny93g]

Originally Posted by chrisj

Except for the fact that Phaneuf has the 8th highest cap hit for a d-man - but is far from the 8th best d-man in the league. Granted, the Leafs are in good shape salary cap wise next season - but how about in 2013/2014 if Phaneuf is still a #3/#4 d-man who is good on the powerplay?

I mean, it's not as bad as Shawn Horcoff, but to suggest that this is a steal is a little bit off. There's quite a bit of risk for both teams here.

I see what your saying, but compared to some of the crazy 10, 12 year contracts, Pronger's 6 year contract, Hossa's, DiPietro's, I guess i don't see it as a problem, or even that bad a contract.

If the cap goes down, and Phaneuf is bad, then it's a bit of a problem, but most teams will be in bad shape in that scenario.

The Leafs have been pretty bad this year. They traded 3 key players, who contributed to a bad record, whose number's looked nice, but couldn't help us win, for a young, physical, offensive, norris trophy nominated defenseman, who may or may not be the next coming of Jesus.

I think we'll just have to agree to disagree here, as I see almost no risk for Toronto. NHL2010 AI would not make this trade!!!

[Suburban Rhythm]

Originally Posted by Galaxy

What's with Ryan Miller and the Pens? I know he didn't get much help from the guys in front (hey D, learn to lay down to away the pass on 2-on-1s), but he just seems to be having a tough time against them .

SAT analogy (those are still on the SATs, right?)

Penguins : Miller as Brodeur : Penguins

Whatever it is, Pittsburgh has his number, but can not beat Brodeur this year. NJ 4-0 against Pens, outscoring them 14-2 with shutouts in the last 2.

[Maple Leafs]

Originally Posted by Pyser

paul martin has pulled out of the olympics. his broken arm hasnt healed in time.

Interesting... normally being forced to pull out causes the sore forearm, not the other way around.

[Logan]

I really like the Jokinen trade for the Rangers. Not only should it be good for Gaborik, but the Kotalik signing was beyond awful at $3M per with two years left. I don't know what the hell Sather thinks when he signs some guys, but he seems to have a knack for getting out from under the albatrosses.

[Dr. Sak]

Today's stat of the day...Jokinen's first game as a Flame was a 2 goal performance against the Flyers in Philly. His last game as a Flame was a 0 point performance against the Flyers in Calgary.

[Logan]

I'd expect his next game against Philly to be a 0 pointer.

In all honesty, he could not score a point for the rest of the season and it would still be a win based on money.

[bbor]

Originally Posted by Dr. Sak

Today's stat of the day...Jokinen's first game as a Flame was a 2 goal performance against the Flyers in Philly. His last game as a Flame was a 0 point performance against the Flyers in Calgary.

A contributing factor to him getting zero points against the Flyers in his last game could have been that he knew the trade was happening brfore the game started.

Dumb Dumb Dumb decision by the Flames to play him.

[Dr. Sak]

Oh definitely...but I'm not complaining. The Flyers need all the points they can get.

[Galaxy]

I think teams should stay away from signing former Sabre players. They never seem to live play at the same level and play up to the contract values they get after they leave.

[DeToxRox]

Haven't seen this in forever but Kronwall's blade broke right off his skate during the middle of a Sharks PP. Thankfully SJ got a penalty so he could get off the ice.

[JonInMiddleGA]

So ... where's Kovy going to end up?

And how bad a deal will Waddell end up making?

edit: Some brief ATL local linkage
http://blogs.ajc.com/atlanta-thrashe...ks-heating-up/

[Wolfpack]

Originally Posted by johnnyshaka

Holy shit, the Oilers just might win a game...sorry, Carolina.

Don't mention it. Ever.

Seriously, it was weird to watch a team that was 28th in the standings take a team that was 30th in the standings somewhat for granted, but that seemed to happen last night, especially after Alberts popped in that bomb early on. From that point, Carolina just seemed to be content to see if they could sneak in another one like that while the Oilers decided to actually play hockey. Just a flat performance all the way around and Ward was off his game enough that he couldn't make up for the shoddy play in front of him unlike in the Blackhawks game.

Sure did bring the "playoff drive" to a screeching halt, though.

[DeToxRox]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

So ... where's Kovy going to end up?

And how bad a deal will Waddell end up making?

edit: Some brief ATL local linkage
Kovalchuk trade talks heating up | Atlanta Thrashers

LA makes the most sense. They have a young, disgruntled franchise potential Dmen (Jack Johnson), plus tons of depth to get it done.

I don't know all the finances though.

[Chief Rum]

Key game tomorrow night between the Ducks and Wings.

[DeToxRox]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

Key game tomorrow night between the Ducks and Wings.

Wings need points but hey, 3 of 4 points from Pit/SJ on the road works for me. Kronwall is probably out tomorrow which sucks. He tweaked something in the third. They say its not bad but I doubt he starts. I also assume Ozzy gets the start. I hope he can have a good one finally but I'm not holding my breath.

[johnnyshaka]

Originally Posted by Wolfpack

Don't mention it. Ever.

Seriously, it was weird to watch a team that was 28th in the standings take a team that was 30th in the standings somewhat for granted, but that seemed to happen last night, especially after Alberts popped in that bomb early on. From that point, Carolina just seemed to be content to see if they could sneak in another one like that while the Oilers decided to actually play hockey. Just a flat performance all the way around and Ward was off his game enough that he couldn't make up for the shoddy play in front of him unlike in the Blackhawks game.

Sure did bring the "playoff drive" to a screeching halt, though.

The Oilers didn't deserve to win that game but believe it or not, they actually got the puck to bounce their way for a change. Our goalie was luckier than yers is essentially what it boiled down to.

[Maple Leafs]

In one of his first shifts as a Leaf, Dion Phaneuf beat up Colin White.

I think Pumpy and I had simultaneous climaxes.

[johnnyshaka]

I think "beat up" is being used a little too liberally when describing that fight...that was Phaneuf holding on as best he could while wearing his "you can't punch me without messing your hands up" hat.

I didn't think it was possible to dislike the Leafs anymore than I did before that trade...but I think I do now. And all Burke would have to do is acquire Tootoo and I think I just might have to start throwing around the word "hate" when it comes to the Leafs.

[MikeVic]

Originally Posted by Maple Leafs

In one of his first shifts as a Leaf, Dion Phaneuf beat up Colin White.

I think Pumpy and I had simultaneous climaxes.

I saw the highlights, and when they mentioned Colin White it made me smile.

[Maple Leafs]

Originally Posted by johnnyshaka

I think "beat up" is being used a little too liberally when describing that fight...that was Phaneuf holding on as best he could while wearing his "you can't punch me without messing your hands up" hat.

If you want a guy to take off his lid, you can't jump him and try for a bear hug right off the bat.

[Fidatelo]

I'm seeing on TSN.ca that the Leafs are looking to trade Ponikarovski now. I don't get it, why would you trade 29-year old guy that puts up 20+ goals and about 60 points and is always a + player (on a crappy team, no less)? Seems like a pretty solid second line player to me. Is his salary totally out of control or something? And even then, why would Toronto care? It's not like they are in cap trouble or don't have the financial means. This seems strange to me.