The OFFICIAL 2008-09 NHL Thread

[Travis]

Originally Posted by RomaGoth

I never said that Lemieux didn't whine. All great players whine, that is one of the reasons they are great (or a sense of entitlement....). Gretzky also scored more points in his career than Lemieux, what is your point with shorthanded goals exactly? I was saying that I always liked Lemieux more than Gretzky as a player. Lemieux matured into a great team player later on in his career, and I never saw that from Gretzky. One thing that is certain, Gretzky played on much better teams than Lemieux did. Besides the two cups he won while Jagr was in Pittsburgh (92-93), the Pens were not a great team most years.

He was (I'm assuming) referring to your proclamation that Mario was a much better two way player than Gretzky.

As for playing with great teams, that's another that can help/hinder. Playing with one great line meant that Mario was on the ice for a premium amount of time while the Oilers could and did play their second line a lot more than necessary because of the talent (and because of the score in a lot of games). You could definitely argue that had the Oilers had a bit less scoring talent that Gretzky would have seen more time, put up more points, etc, etc.

In the end, all that is conjecture. Gretzky had better longevity, greater individual seasons and was still a fantastic leader for the team and ambassador for the sport. Doesn't mean Lemieux wasn't, but to imply that Gretzky wasn't a team player/leader/etc is a disservice.

[Suburban Rhythm]

Originally Posted by Fidatelo

I don't believe Lemieux was a better two way player. Lemieux was indeed more talented overall, and the injuries/cancer certainly held him back. That said, he also never had the work ethic or heart that Gretzky had. Perhaps he wouldn't have had the back issues if he had worked out a little more?

Anyways, bottom line is that if I desperately needed a guy to go out for one shift and score a goal, I'd throw Lemieux over the boards, but in almost any other situation I'd choose Gretzky.

I'll give you work ethic, but not heart. I don't remember too many other players playing hours after a chemo treatment.

Hell, he even got a standing ovation from those Neanderthals in Philly for that!

[Fidatelo]

He grew a heart later in his career, but this is the same guy that refused to play for Team Canada, avoided games in small towns like Winnipeg (and that is before the cancer/back injuries), and also happened to be cheating on his wife in the same room that a girl was allegedly raped.

The Mario Lemiuex of 2000 was much different than the one in 1986.

[Fidatelo]

Dola...

And I should add that many people credit Gretzky as being the guy to straighten Mario out during the 87 Canada Cup by showing him how a professional should play.

[Dr. Sak]

Originally Posted by Fidatelo

He grew a heart later in his career, but this is the same guy that refused to play for Team Canada, avoided games in small towns like Winnipeg (and that is before the cancer/back injuries), and also happened to be cheating on his wife in the same room that a girl was allegedly raped.

Actually that happened before Lemieux was married.

[Fidatelo]

Originally Posted by Dr. Sak

Actually that happened before Lemieux was married.

True, although he was dating the girl that he had been dating for years prior and whom he eventually married.

[Dr. Sak]

Originally Posted by Fidatelo

True, although he was dating the girl that he had been dating for years prior and whom he eventually married.

Right...the only reason I even knew that is i was looking that up today because when I was at the Pens game last night my friend was talking about him getting accused of it.

[Double A]

I kind of like John Ferguson Jr's suggestion after Janssen put Kaberle out for a month on a cheap hit. Don't suspend him for as long as Kaberle is out -- force him to play Kaberle minutes for as long as he's out. - Maple Leafs

We would release Janssen quicker then a Sean Avery dive.

Finally found my ass on line and thought I'd check in to see what the good word is amongst the FOFC hockey boys. Looks like HB, MLeafs, bbor and company are still on this side of the grass.

Curious what the take up north was on the Stempniak trade??? I've been kind of bitching about it until Steen woke up last night...kid made a move that almost made me drop the budweiser...and cokeacola's been playing pretty damn well amongst our gang of stay at home defensemen. At this point, I am warming up to it. I like Stemper...he's got a quick release and was manning our point on the power play...I'm thinking this might be an even up trade. Time will tell. Giving JD the benefit of the doubt on these moves...dude is getting some love in the Lou despite the poor years in our rebuild.

Overall, we are a cursed franchise (you know this to be fact when your young franchise defensemen has his season end in July while playing golf) and for the 3rd year in a row we aren't making the playoffs, but I'm thoroughly enjoying watching the young kids go balls out each night...Berglund...Oshie...Perron...these kids are going to be players. Berglund is reminding me a LOT of a young Mats Sundin...and I don't say that lightly...but his wingspan...puck control...passing...feel for the game....hell, he even looks like him on the ice...kid has major skills. Fantasy players...pick him up now.

I still hate the Hawks. The Hawks still hate us. I still hate the Wings. The Wings don't seem to notice. And dude...Hossa and a hottie...you've got to have a cell phone on you for photographic documentation. You can't just wheel that shit in here and not share the scene.

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally Posted by Double A

I kind of like John Ferguson Jr's suggestion after Janssen put Kaberle out for a month on a cheap hit. Don't suspend him for as long as Kaberle is out -- force him to play Kaberle minutes for as long as he's out. - Maple Leafs

We would release Janssen quicker then a Sean Avery dive.

Finally found my ass on line and thought I'd check in to see what the good word is amongst the FOFC hockey boys. Looks like HB, MLeafs, bbor and company are still on this side of the grass.

Curious what the take up north was on the Stempniak trade??? I've been kind of bitching about it until Steen woke up last night...kid made a move that almost made me drop the budweiser...and cokeacola's been playing pretty damn well amongst our gang of stay at home defensemen. At this point, I am warming up to it. I like Stemper...he's got a quick release and was manning our point on the power play...I'm thinking this might be an even up trade. Time will tell. Giving JD the benefit of the doubt on these moves...dude is getting some love in the Lou despite the poor years in our rebuild.

Overall, we are a cursed franchise (you know this to be fact when your young franchise defensemen has his season end in July while playing golf) and for the 3rd year in a row we aren't making the playoffs, but I'm thoroughly enjoying watching the young kids go balls out each night...Berglund...Oshie...Perron...these kids are going to be players. Berglund is reminding me a LOT of a young Mats Sundin...and I don't say that lightly...but his wingspan...puck control...passing...feel for the game....hell, he even looks like him on the ice...kid has major skills. Fantasy players...pick him up now.

I still hate the Hawks. The Hawks still hate us. I still hate the Wings. The Wings don't seem to notice. And dude...Hossa and a hottie...you've got to have a cell phone on you for photographic documentation. You can't just wheel that shit in here and not share the scene.

Double A!!! Thanks for stopping in. Yeah, things are pretty much same ole, same old around here.

Don't worry, St. Louis will get a NHL team back sometime or another. If it makes you feel any better Chris Osgood seems to have remembered that he's Chris Osgood. He's got a horrible save percentage and is letting in shots from the red line again. Not good.

Don't be such a stranger.

[johnnyshaka]

Yikes...do teams now have to include snowblower clauses into contracts now??

Sorry, DD, this won't help...

hxxp://nationalpost.pa-sportsticker.com/default.aspx?s=nhl-news-display&nid=A3184451228935197A

[Draft Dodger]

yeah, good times

[Suburban Rhythm]

Is Sakic done for the year now? I thought they originally said 3 months, but the FSN Pittsburgh announcers just said done for the season.

Seriously, the guy has had to have made over $80M in his career. He can't afford someone to clear his driveway?

[Draft Dodger]

I think the official word "at least 3 months". that would put him back in mid-March, but it's still early.

[Maple Leafs]

Via Deadspin...

Last month, the Chiacgo Blackhawks had six straight road games sandwiched around the Thanksgiving holiday. They went from Phoenix to Dallas to Toronto (nice travel agent), then had three days off before heading out for a California swing. That three-day break was their only chance to get home before the holiday, and the team had arranged for a commerical flight to take the players back to Chicago right after their game against the Leafs on Saturday night. General Manager Dale Tallon was staying behind, to attend his father's funeral in rural Ontario. Take it away, crazy anonymous emailer.

This plane departs on schedule, but without a single member of the hockey team. Back in the locker room a vote is taken after the game was complete, and a unanimous decision is made by this young team to skip this flight and stay one more day. They make arrangements to check back in the hotel and on a frozen Sunday morning charter two buses that have no heat and begin a journey two hours straight north into a sparsely inhabited Canada , but where hockey is its passion. They arrive at their destination to the surprise of the teams general manager who is there attending his fathers wake.

After a few emotional hours, this team boards the buses and heads back for a two-hour trip back to Toronto . On the way they ask the drivers to stop in a tiny Canadian town because they are hungry. To the shock of the patrons and workers at this small hockey town McDonald's, a professional team walks out of two rickety buses and into the restaurant, which just happens to have pictures of two members of this team on its wall. The patrons know every single one of these players by sight being Fanatic fans of hockey in these parts. One can only imagine their amazement of the locals seeing and the entire professional hockey team sit down and have a meal in their tiny little town in the middle of a hockey season. After a while they board the buses and catch their same flight 24 hours later, giving one day to their general manager.

Have I made this up, is this an excerpt from some fictional book? No.

This a true story of the Blackhawks last Saturday night and they decided to attend Dale Tallon's fathers funeral. It's amazing that such a good story can be found nowhere on the internet, and not even mentioned in the Chicago papers. Had one of the Blackhawks got into a fight and punched some drunken loser in a Toronto bar it would be plastered all over papers and the television. This being said, its hard to imagine any professional football, basketball or baseball team doing this, but the members of the Blackhawks claim any "hockey" team would have done this. This is one reason I continue to be a big hockey fan, and another reason I am excited about this Chicago team. I thought I would share as this story appears to have gone unnoticed.

Still skeptical, I sent an email to Sarah Spain of Mouthpiece Sports, who has forgotten more about Chicago hockey than I care to remember.

Got a response from one of my contacts in the org. This is a funny addition - it's true that they took a bus up to his dad's funeral — and afterwards they all went to McDonald's where there were [Patrick] Kane and [Jonathan] Toews trading cards in the happy meals. I don't think the unheated part was true, but yeah - these guys are all nice, which makes the job very easy.

Yeah, the unheated bus did seem like a bit much, didn't it? Was that embellishment really necessary? But it is a sweet story nonetheless, and it is shocking that more media outlets haven't picked up on it. Do you know how much fuzzy, heart-tugging mileage SportsCenter could get out of this? Don't even get me started on Costas.

[Dr. Sak]

Originally Posted by Suburban Rhythm

Is Sakic done for the year now? I thought they originally said 3 months, but the FSN Pittsburgh announcers just said one for the season.

How many times do i tell you to stop listening to Staggy. He can't tell his ass from a hole in the ground.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by Maple Leafs

Via Deadspin...

SI

[Draft Dodger]

that stupid Chicago story makes it sound like all other athletes are barbarians

[bbor]

Hey Double A...nice to see you still come here for your hockey fix.

Stempy is doing fin...he is what he is...3rd liner with 15-20 goal potential....quick hard shot.

Steen will be around for awhile...he is a decent defensive guy.Carlo...well...when he ain't broke he's a good 4 or 5 guy.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by Draft Dodger

that stupid Chicago story makes it sound like all other athletes are barbarians

All other athletes ARE barbarians! Sheesh, aren't you a hockey fan?

[Chief Rum]

Oh, yeah, sorry for the rough go of it tonight, Double A. Nothing against the Blues, but I am still a Kariya hater, so I particularly enjoy beating St. Louis while he's there. I suppose it would help if Andy Mac wasn't hurt, always a classy guy, hated hearing about his broken leg, but he's hurt, so it's all about the hate!

[Galaxy]

Sabres won three straight, are back in 8th in the conference.

Vanek added two goals (and they were rather nice-looking ones) to his lead-leading 22 goals. He is starting to become an elite player (he's had 126 goals so far in 3 1/4 seasons). He's just isn't flashy or pretty like Crosby or Oveckin.

[NoSkillz]

Originally Posted by Galaxy

Sabres won three straight, are back in 8th in the conference.

Vanek added two goals (and they were rather nice-looking ones) to his lead-leading 22 goals. He is starting to become an elite player (he's had 126 goals so far in 3 1/4 seasons). He's just isn't flashy or pretty like Crosby or Oveckin.

The evolution of Vanek into an elite player has been something to watch.

From a lazy rookie who didn't know the meaning of the word 'backcheck' to the complete player he is becoming today. He broke up a rush the other night that saw him skate the whole length of the ice and dive into a passing lane to break up the play. That brought a tear to my eye it was so beautiful.

And he just keeps scoring big goals, game after game. That backhand goal, top shelf last night from in tight...just gorgeous! I've never seen him score that way before so he's STILL improving and getting better each game.

He seems like a lock for 50 this year and even 60 might not be out of the question. Just incredible. He's worth the price of admission alone on some nights.

[Galaxy]

Originally Posted by NoSkillz

The evolution of Vanek into an elite player has been something to watch.

From a lazy rookie who didn't know the meaning of the word 'backcheck' to the complete player he is becoming today. He broke up a rush the other night that saw him skate the whole length of the ice and dive into a passing lane to break up the play. That brought a tear to my eye it was so beautiful.

And he just keeps scoring big goals, game after game. That backhand goal, top shelf last night from in tight...just gorgeous! I've never seen him score that way before so he's STILL improving and getting better each game.

He seems like a lock for 50 this year and even 60 might not be out of the question. Just incredible. He's worth the price of admission alone on some nights.

He's becoming an excellent good two-way player (his defensive game has been terrific). He has great hands, a great burst, and just has great instincts. He's only got 22, but he gets at least a few great chances per game to put more goals in. I love how people jump on for an off-year last year while still scoring 36 goals in at only 24 years old. The thing that he doesn't have is a great player like a Malkin, Semin, or the top lines that an Ottawa or Tampa Bay has. Hecht, Roy, Pominville and Stafford are quality players, but they aren't what the top players around the league have to play with.

[Suburban Rhythm]

Through two periods, Pens lead the Isles 8-1...and have hit a couple posts, and had a goal disallowed.

Petr Sykora, prior to this game, led all active players with 43 2-goal games without ever registering a hat trick, appeared to reach that milestone...but the ref blew the whistle, losing sight of the puck (losing sight of it because it was hidden in the net!). No matter, he scored again about 3 minutes later, his first career HT. Then promptly hit a post about 2 mins after that.

Still a period to go...I expect it to get pretty ugly soon, as the Pens did not dress Eric Godard.

[Suburban Rhythm]

Dola

Looks like the Flyers have rallied from being down 5-1 to tie the game 5-5 and force OT vs. Carolina. Scottie Hartnell with a HT of his own.

Dr Sak...any truth to the rumors that fans threw their gloves in celebration?

[Dr. Sak]

What a comeback by the Flyers. Like Suburban said....down 5-1 going into the third and they won in a shootout. That should give them some momentum going into Saturday's game against the Pens in Philly, and I will be in attendance!

Haha! Post game comments Hartnell said that with this hat trick he can put the glove incident behind him. I guess right after it happened, the next day in practice Hartnell came down on a breakaway and Lupul hit him in the head with his glove. Hartnell didnt appreciate it too much and the two had words.

[Suburban Rhythm]

Pascal Dupuis adds his own 1st career HT, Pens win 9-2.

You realize this means the games Saturday....will be 2-1, in a shootout.

Crowd chanting "We want 10" last 2 mins of the game

[sabotai]

Originally Posted by Dr. Sak

Saturday's game against the Pens in Philly, and I will be in attendance!

Yell something mean at Crosby for me!

[Dr. Sak]

Originally Posted by sabotai

Yell something mean at Crosby for me!

That'll happen before the puck drops.

[Suburban Rhythm]

Originally Posted by Dr. Sak

That'll happen before the puck drops.

You don't mean that...you were cheering for him that game we were at!

[Dr. Sak]

Originally Posted by Suburban Rhythm

You don't mean that...you were cheering for him that game we were at!

To fail!

[Chief Rum]

http://sports.yahoo.com/nhl/news;_yl...v=ap&type=lgns

Awesome.

[samifan24]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

http://sports.yahoo.com/nhl/news;_yl...v=ap&type=lgns

Awesome.

I was hoping he would get a chance to play because I thought it would make a really cool story. As it is I'm sure he'll always remember his eight minutes as a backup goalie on an NHL bench.

[Maple Leafs]

So, did I miss it and the NHL passed a special bylaw that every team has to wear their alternate jerseys against the Leafs?

Everyone else is all excited about leaked third jerseys. I have to go online to try to figure out what teams' first jerseys look like.

[Double A]

St. Louis Post discussion on Sakic injury starts out with "Sakic a Blue?"

We're getting thumped on this road trip to the west coast. Last night against LA was horrendous...but third game in four nights with travel isn't a good scenario (yeah...I'm playing that card). Tkachuk has a nice string of games in a row where he has coughed the puck up with no one on him...and see it 9 seconds later in the back of our net. Starting to have Garth Butcher playoff flashbacks. I bleed blue...and lately, a lot of it.

And if Coliacovo is really nothing more then a 4 or 5, we're truly fucked because he is head and shoulders better then anyone else on our blueline with the puck on his stick. Steen continues to baffle me...he looks lost more times then not. On Stempniak, I personally think he is better then a third line player...30 goal potential there...wicked snap shot. Of course, I thought Jeff Taiffe was the shit and look what happened. :-\

[samifan24]

And the Bruins smoke Atlanta 7-3. A strange game with a lot of fights...perfect for the first game of a home-and-home.

[Draft Dodger]

Originally Posted by Maple Leafs

So, did I miss it and the NHL passed a special bylaw that every team has to wear their alternate jerseys against the Leafs?

Everyone else is all excited about leaked third jerseys. I have to go online to try to figure out what teams' first jerseys look like.

the Avs have had 4 games where the other team was debuting their 3rd. For kicks, they wore their away jerseys tonight at home so the stupid Blackhawks could wear their 3rds again.

[Suburban Rhythm]

Pens look terrible vs. the Cryers, lose 6-3. Philly now moves ahead of Pittsburgh in the standings.

I am looking forward to how Dr Sak spins Richards not dropping the gloves with Matt Cooke into a sign of a true leader.

(and please watch a replay of the hit on Timonen before you claim a hit from behind)

[Dr. Sak]

Originally Posted by Suburban Rhythm

Pens look terrible vs. the Cryers, lose 6-3. Philly now moves ahead of Pittsburgh in the standings.

I am looking forward to how Dr Sak spins Richards not dropping the gloves with Matt Cooke into a sign of a true leader.

(and please watch a replay of the hit on Timonen before you claim a hit from behind)

Why fight when you are up 6-3? Let the Pens wallow in their suckiness.

I didn't think it was a hit from behind but I did see YOUR captain out on the ice and didn't want anything to do with the scrum until the end where he could just jump on someone's back.

[samifan24]

The Bruins sweep Atlanta in a home and home. David Krejci had three assists and is now 26th in the league in scoring. I know most newspapers typically print the top 25 scorers and I'm guessing Krejci's name will be new to a lot of fans outside of Boston. The kid can really play.

[Dr. Sak]

Originally Posted by sabotai

Yell something mean at Crosby for me!

I started two Crosby Sucks chants at the game yesterday. The first one was in your honor.

[Dr. Sak]

By the way...you make the call...boarding or not?

[bbor]

Stars announce Avery will not be back with the team.

[Suburban Rhythm]

Originally Posted by Dr. Sak

By the way...you make the call...boarding or not?

We need the full replay, showing Timonen facing center ice, turning and jumping to avoid the hit. Unless he's got eyes in the back of his head, the only explanation for jumping is he saw Cooke coming before turning.

[Suburban Rhythm]

Originally Posted by Dr. Sak

Why fight when you are up 6-3? Let the Pens wallow in their suckiness.

I didn't think it was a hit from behind but I did see YOUR captain out on the ice and didn't want anything to do with the scrum until the end where he could just jump on someone's back.

I 100% agree with the Flyers had no reason to fight.

So it's OK that Richards didn't want to fight (and Cooke really isn't even a fighter, I'd put him and Richards at the low end of the middleweights) because it was 6-3, but not OK that Crosby "didn't want anything to do with it" when it was 6-3?

Two other things I did see (from TV)- After Godard-Hartnell, Hartnell tossed Godard's elbow pads into the crowd. He's taken to throwing other player's equipment now?

And the couple times Richards got chased from faceoffs, each time he had something to say the to refs. Glad MY captain doesn't do that.

[Dr. Sak]

Originally Posted by Suburban Rhythm

I 100% agree with the Flyers had no reason to fight.

So it's OK that Richards didn't want to fight (and Cooke really isn't even a fighter, I'd put him and Richards at the low end of the middleweights) because it was 6-3, but not OK that Crosby "didn't want anything to do with it" when it was 6-3?

Two other things I did see (from TV)- After Godard-Hartnell, Hartnell tossed Godard's elbow pads into the crowd. He's taken to throwing other player's equipment now?

And the couple times Richards got chased from faceoffs, each time he had something to say the to refs. Glad MY captain doesn't do that.

Wow I see you are being a whiny bitch like your captain.

At least you aren't crying as bad as some Pens fans who had their feelings hurt when the Flyers' organist kept the Crosby Sucks chant going.

I didn't see Hartnell throw Godards stuff, but the Phantoms are having a give away this week called "Scott Hartnell Glove Night". If Godard really needs equipment, I'll get him some gloves.

It's no shame to lose to the Flyers...of the possible 32 points in their last 16 games, the Flyers have gotten 27 of them. They are pretty hot right now and that is even without Briere and some of the middle defensemen.

[Suburban Rhythm]

Originally Posted by Dr. Sak

I didn't see Hartnell throw Godards stuff, but the Phantoms are having a give away this week called "Scott Hartnell Glove Night". If Godard really needs equipment, I'll get him some gloves.

Godard is a sniper now...his stick is more valuable than his elbow pad

Originally Posted by Dr. Sak

It's no shame to lose to the Flyers...of the possible 32 points in their last 16 games, the Flyers have gotten 27 of them. They are pretty hot right now and that is because they are without Briere and some of the middle defensemen.

Fixed

Thankfully, Fleury is back healthy. As well as Dany Sabourin played at the beginning of this 10 game stretch, he was equally awful at the end.

[Dr. Sak]

What I don't understand is why they dressed MAF but didn't play him. He should have been in there if he was well enough to play and if he wasn't healthy enough why was he the back up?

[samifan24]

What's the deal with Hartnell? Did he throw his equipment into the stands or something?

[Suburban Rhythm]

Originally Posted by Dr. Sak

What I don't understand is why they dressed MAF but didn't play him. He should have been in there if he was well enough to play and if he wasn't healthy enough why was he the back up?

Agree. Because I fully expected him to start the 3rd period. And if didn't because he wasn't game ready, then why dress him at all? They don't play until Thursday, so he'd have another 5+ days. They weren't forced to put him back on the active roster, keep John Curry another day, re-assign him after the game (like they did with Taffe and Connor James were) and give him a shorter trip back to Wilkes Barre.

Besides, what if Fleury needed to enter the game due to injury, like if Hartnell would have slide tackled Sabourin, as Flyers have been known to do?

Originally Posted by samifan24

What's the deal with Hartnell? Did he throw his equipment into the stands or something?

I don't know the exact player (was it Ryan Malone), but a game about a week ago, Hartnell threw his glove at a player on a breakaway.

After a fight (can it be a fight if only one guy throws punches?) with Eric Godard, Hartnell grabbed Godard's elbow pads off the ice and tossed them into the crowd.