2010 NFL Offseason Thread - Offseason ends at 6 pm est

[Thomkal]

Originally Posted by Eaglesfan27

It was already mentioned in this thread, but is worth mentioning again. McNabb has to agree to sign an extension to make this trade work, and I think Washington was the only team he was willing to do that with. I don't blame him when the other options are Buffalo and Oakland.

You didn't quote the right part of my post where I said if this was the only deal they got. It might very well have been given McNabb's reported intention not sign the extension with the Bills or Raiders.

[Thomkal]

Originally Posted by boberot

Unless you are the Patriots sending Bledsoe to the Bills, giggling to yourself while Bills fans jack off all over themselves in anticipation.

Was Bledsoe still near his peak ability when they made that trade? I can't remember. McNabb still is near his peak ability at this point in my opinion.

[cuervo72]

Originally Posted by Thomkal

I can only imagine what the fury will be in Philly should the Redskins now beat the Eagles twice this season and/or beat them in a late in the year game (and you know there will be one scheduled for late in the season now) and knock them out of the playoffs. I don't really have a problem with trading McNabb-he's closer to the end of his career than the start and never won the Super Bowl despite his playoff appearances. But trading a still very good QB to a divisional rival that only increases that team's chances of doing better in the division now? Don't get it, unless it really was the only offer they got. I still trade him to Buffalo or Oakland even if the deal wasn't as good over Washington.

You don't honor a players years of service by trading him to where its a good fit for him first if it means trading him to a team you'll have to face at least twice during the season and potentially hurting your team in the process.

Either a) they still feel as if they are better than the Redskins, or b) they don't figure they would be better than the Cowboys/Giants WITH McNabb, in which case trading him to WAS doesn't matter.

a) is possible. I saw some comparisons of Campbell vs McNabb, and it was noted the Campbell was more accurate, but was awful throwing the deep ball, where McNabb would be better. That's fine, but I think part of Campbell's problem was that he had an offensive line that couldn't give him time, a set of WR that wasn't exactly stellar, and a band of idiots calling plays. The last has gotten better, but not so sure on the other two. Skins also have questions on defense, with a new scheme coming that doesn't suit all of the personnel (Haynesworth, A. Carter, Fletcher). And how good were McNabb's numbers on deep balls (major difference was YPA and TD, comp % was again similar) because of DeSean Jackson? The Eagles didn't trade HIM to WAS too, did they? Sure, WAS is probably better with McNabb. But remember, this was a 4-12 team.

b) sadly is also possible. The Eagles have some question marks with their own OL, are passing the torch at RB, and might have some defensive issues (LB, DB?) Would they have won the SB with McNabb? Probably not. No, he hasn't always had good WR, which they may have now. But they had a better defense and, well, a better McNabb. If you don't think you can win the SB, why not trade him now while you get value, especially if you have a QB you're itching to develop (ask BEL about that one - he'd have traded Wallman in FOFL a while ago if thought he couldn't win it).



And heck, even if he IS good, he still faces your other rivals (Giants/Cowboys) a couple of times a season. Maybe WAS steals a couple games vs them, too.

[SunDevil]

I would like to make the call that the Skins will now draft Tebow.

[molson]

Originally Posted by Thomkal

Was Bledsoe still near his peak ability when they made that trade? I can't remember. McNabb still is near his peak ability at this point in my opinion.

Bledsoe was four years younger than McNabb is now. It's hard to tell when Bledsoe's peak was though, because he was horrible for a couple of years on some really bad Patriots teams, and then put up maybe his best season with Buffalo in '02.

[SteveMax58]

Originally Posted by cuervo72

If you don't think you can win the SB, why not trade him now while you get value, especially if you have a QB you're itching to develop (ask BEL about that one - he'd have traded Wallman in FOFL a while ago if thought he couldn't win it).

I have this debate with a friend of mine all the time. IMHO, it is always better to keep a proven vet QB & try to win now. It's better because more fans show up to your games, TV ratings are better, quality free agents see your team as a winner they want to play for, and there is NO guarantee (and in fact...highly unlikely) of future success by expecting you will draft a new franchise QB.

Getting "something" for McNabb, without a proven replacement, is very risky if you intend to win this year. And if you have a bad season...it's rebuilding time as next year's starting vets w/ expiring contracts will head out as well. I don't think a year-in-year-out contender like Philly should be thinking of rebuilding after making the NFC championship 2 years ago, then (almost) winning the Division last season(at least they made the playoffs).

There are definitely times when just starting fresh can be the best option. But that is for teams that struggle to win 6 or 7 games with old vets. The Eagles were not that type of team with McNabb. IMO they are now without him.

[RedKingGold]

Originally Posted by NewIdentity

All the experts are behind you on this. Everyone is now saying that the Redskins are no longer interested in drafting a QB in the 1st round.

Like Todd McShay, who was convinced that Andre Woodson and Brian Brohm were first rounders?

McShay/Mel Kiper aren't "experts". I bet if someone actually looked at their hit/miss rate over the past five years, they've missed on a lot more guys than hit.

If you look at the timing; hours after Clausen worked out in Washington the Redskins were on the phone overpaying for McNabb it looks like Washington has changed their minds a Clausen.

When the Broncos traded up to draft Jay Cutler, it caught a lot of people by surprise because Shanahan had not met or worked out with Cutler before the draft. A lot of what the "workouts" you see now are more dog and pony show than anything. Teams have their draft boards completed and nothing will be done in these manufactured workouts which changes coaches/scouts perception.

I still think drafting a QB, who could sit behind a veteran for a couple of years, in the 1st would be the smart move for the skins.

Pick will be Russell Okung, another OT or a trade down. Write it down now.

[Izulde]

Originally Posted by Eaglesfan27

I agree. No way do you take a QB #4 overall in this day and age when you just traded for a quality QB that has 3 or 4 years left at least.

Agreed.

[cuervo72]

Originally Posted by SteveMax58

I have this debate with a friend of mine all the time. IMHO, it is always better to keep a proven vet QB & try to win now. It's better because more fans show up to your games, TV ratings are better, quality free agents see your team as a winner they want to play for, and there is NO guarantee (and in fact...highly unlikely) of future success by expecting you will draft a new franchise QB.

Getting "something" for McNabb, without a proven replacement, is very risky if you intend to win this year. And if you have a bad season...it's rebuilding time as next year's starting vets w/ expiring contracts will head out as well. I don't think a year-in-year-out contender like Philly should be thinking of rebuilding after making the NFC championship 2 years ago, then (almost) winning the Division last season(at least they made the playoffs).

There are definitely times when just starting fresh can be the best option. But that is for teams that struggle to win 6 or 7 games with old vets. The Eagles were not that type of team with McNabb. IMO they are now without him.

But in their minds they've already drafted the new franchise QB. Similar to Rodgers in Green Bay. They might not be right, but they've had Kolb for a bit of time now and haven't soured on him.

I don't think TV ratings are going to exactly dip in Philly any time soon, it would take a few years for that to happen (heck, for that look at the Skins - they've sucked for a decade and still make money hand-over-fist). I'm also not sure there are any really huge FA out there to be impressing.

[Subby]

A few things:

- Shanahan won his Super Bowls with a QB older than McNabb (Elway was 35, I believe, for the first win)

- I would be pretty shocked if the Skins went QB at 1.4. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised to see them trade down to try and recoup a 2nd rounder. There is a ton of OT talent in the draft and they can get one later in the first.

- This is much different than Gibbs bringing in the 8 car in exchange for a first day pick way back when. McNabb is still an all-pro calber QB. He is a massive upgrade over Jason Campbell. The move was a no-brainer.

- Shanahan is going to run this team for 4-5 seasons at most and then hand the reigns over to his kid. He wants to win now.

[Samdari]

Originally Posted by RedKingGold

McNabb was never completely Reid's guy,

Interesting, considering that Reid made an unpopular pick and chose to build the franchise around him as essentially the first move he made as a HC.

[Greyroofoo]

Originally Posted by Samdari

Interesting, considering that Reid made an unpopular pick and chose to build the franchise around him as essentially the first move he made as a HC.

That was a long time ago

[Eaglesfan27]

I disagree. I think Reid had a genuine bond with McNabb and that the upper powers that be were the ones who pushed for Kolb last year and this year.

[Arles]

There's no way Reid wanted to make this move. The personal risk on him with McNabb/Kolb vs. Kolb/Vick are immense. If McNabb struggles (or the team struggles), he can simply play Kolb and gain another 2 seasons as coach. Now, if Kolb struggles, he may be out of a Job in December.

I'm certain that McCarthy wanted no part of Rodgers over Favre in the first year Favre retired and played for the Jets. But, the GM had to make a long term decision on what was best for the franchise and went with Aaron. But, Mike would have gladly started Favre had that been an option because he wanted to win. Now, he's probably glad they went with Rodgers as he has a better chance to win for the next 2-3 years. But, at the time, the HC wants to win - not to help the HC in 3 years win.

[chesapeake]

Originally Posted by Subby

This is much different than Gibbs bringing in the 8 car in exchange for a first day pick way back when. McNabb is still an all-pro calber QB. He is a massive upgrade over Jason Campbell. The move was a no-brainer.

- Shanahan is going to run this team for 4-5 seasons at most and then hand the reigns over to his kid. He wants to win now.

It is not as different as you think. Brunell was the same age when he came to DC -- 33 going on 34. And, at the time of their respective trades, their QB ratings were virtually identical, with both in the mid-80s. Brunell had gone to 3 Pro Bowls, McNabb has been to what, 5? I'll concede that McNabb is probably the better QB, but neither is a HOFer. And Brunell now has 1 more SB ring.

Brunell's line for his only full year as Washington's starting QB (2005): 262/454, 57.7%, 3050 yds, 23TD, 10 INT, 85.9 rtg. McNabb has better yardages for the last 2 season and hit 60% completions. The other numbers are pretty similar.

Assuming McNabb's high end is going to be similar to his recent performances, Washington just got the second coming of Mark Brunell. Given that the o line in DC is abyssmal, I think I'm giving McNabb the benefit of the doubt here.

Ultimately, my point is that you don't bring in McNabb or Brunell if the owner and coach didn't believe that the team was going to win the Super Bowl in the next 3 years because neither QB has/had much more than that left. That just seems absurd to me. The Redskins are awful and deserved their 4-12 record last season. Maybe a coach other than Zorn gets them to 6-10, but the problem wasn't coaching anywhere near as much as it was a lack of talent. And they are further handicapped by the awful contracts left by Vinnie. (See Haynesworth, Albert).

They need a 2nd this year and what will probably be a 3rd next year more than they need 2-3 years of McNabb, because the Washington Football Team isn't going to the Super Bowl with the players they have now.

See the new Washington, same as the old Washington.

[larrymcg421]

I've always thought judging QB's by their Super Bowl Rings was pretty ridiculous, but never more ridiculous than when the guy won it while sitting his ass on the bench.

[chesapeake]

Originally Posted by Eaglesfan27

I disagree. I think Reid had a genuine bond with McNabb and that the upper powers that be were the ones who pushed for Kolb last year and this year.

Looking at all the Iggles' offseason moves, including trading Sheldon Brown this weekend and cutting Westbrook and others, it seems clear that the team determined that they couldn't win with what they had and needed to start over. Given that, it makes far more sense to play Kolb and see what he has than to keep trotting McNabb out there. I think Reid signed off on it from a pragmatic standpoint. And I think that the organization agreeing to send him somewhere that he preferred, even if they got less out of it, showed respect.

[chesapeake]

Originally Posted by larrymcg421

I've always thought judging QB's by their Super Bowl Rings was pretty ridiculous, but never more ridiculous than when the guy won it while sitting his ass on the bench.

dola

I agree with the latter point. I threw it in to be capricious. The Pro Bowls and stats points stand. They are pretty similar QBs.

[DeToxRox]

Lions trade a 5th round pick to Seattle for LG Rob Sims. Love the deal. Guy isn't amazing but he's solid and will for sure be our best LG in a long time.

[Travis]

I think it's a great value trade for the Lions. I understand why the Seahawks did it but am still disappointed as the guy seems to have a lot of potential, especially as a mauler (which they don't value as highly with the ZBS they're installing).

Kind of scary how many recent Seahawks are on that roster now. I'm really curious to see how Burleson does opposite Johnson. That could be a really fun duo to watch.

[RedKingGold]

Originally Posted by Samdari

Interesting, considering that Reid made an unpopular pick and chose to build the franchise around him as essentially the first move he made as a HC.

Originally Posted by Greyroofoo

That was a long time ago

Originally Posted by Eaglesfan27

I disagree. I think Reid had a genuine bond with McNabb and that the upper powers that be were the ones who pushed for Kolb last year and this year.

Reid took McNabb when he was a rookie head coach. I think as Andy gained more of an idea of what he wanted to do with playcalling, it became clear that he had to fit his system around McNabb moreso than getting a quarterback to fit his system.

Watching games over the past few years, I think McNabb is a guy who just plays better when relying on his natural instincts...that doesn't play well in the kind of system Andy wants to run. No secret Andy likes to pass a lot, but to make it work, he needs a guy who will consistently and accurately complete those short and intermediate throws.

McNabb always struggled with that. But, for every clearly open guy he overthrew, he would make up for that by escaping three potential sacks and throwing a beautiful deep ball down the field. Yet, as great as that is/was, it's not what Andy wants.

I think it all became clear the year Jeff Garcia took over for an injured McNabb. Even in the Super Bowl year, I never saw quarterback-coach with the Eagles more in sync than in the late part of that regular season. It's no secret that Andy ran the ball more that year, but I think one of the reasons he ran more was because the pass was working as he intended it and he felt comfortable with the gains he was getting running the ball.

Again, I throw the parallel out there with Mike McCarthy-Brett Favre-Aaron Rodgers. By all accounts, Favre should have been the perfect guy for McCarthy. Mike Holmgren was able to coach Favre so there was experience in a system similar to McCarthy's. However, the freelancing was not what McCarthy liked, and he had a talented system QB on the roster with Rodgers.

So, to make a long story short, I think there is and was a bond between McNabb and Reid but it just could not get past that Donovan is not the right guy for what Andy wants to do. Kolb is that, and Kolb and Andy will both succeed or fail together.

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally Posted by DeToxRox

Lions trade a 5th round pick to Seattle for LG Rob Sims. Love the deal. Guy isn't amazing but he's solid and will for sure be our best LG in a long time.

I like the deal. LG has been horrible for a few years now. No guarantee that Sims will be the answer, but they had to do something and he's likely a better option than anyone they would have drafted in the 5th round.

Given this move and the likelihood that they wont be able to trade down, it's looking more like the Lions will either go with Suh or McCoy at #2. I am fine with that.

Depending on who is available in the second round, I could see Mayhew trading dow to get some more picks. The most glaring needs at that spout would appear to CB/RB/DE at the moment.

[SteveMax58]

Originally Posted by cuervo72

But in their minds they've already drafted the new franchise QB. Similar to Rodgers in Green Bay. They might not be right, but they've had Kolb for a bit of time now and haven't soured on him.

I don't think TV ratings are going to exactly dip in Philly any time soon, it would take a few years for that to happen (heck, for that look at the Skins - they've sucked for a decade and still make money hand-over-fist). I'm also not sure there are any really huge FA out there to be impressing.

Oh, I know thats what they are going to publicly state...but I just dont see how they could truly believe that. Iregardless of playcalling, style, schemes, etc...football is football and McNabb is a better pro football QB than Kolb.

TV ratings more in the sense of getting Monday/Sunday night football games and the like. General team exposure and fan support is more what I'm talking about. If you have the same opinion of the Eagles playoff hopes that I have (which is certainly debatable)...I dont think you can expect much in the way of that for a few seasons. Of course...they wont go broke or anything, just not as much exposure as they'd have otherwise.

[NewIdentity]

Originally Posted by larrymcg421

I've always thought judging QB's by their Super Bowl Rings was pretty ridiculous, but never more ridiculous than when the guy won it while sitting his ass on the bench.

Is this about my comment on Chase Daniel?

I think Chase made the right decision to go to the Saints and be on their active roster as the #3 QB, rather than stay with Washington and be put on their inactive practice squad last year. With Brunnel retired Chase Daniel is now the Saints backup, on paper at least.

And yes, he does now have a Super Bowl ring because of his decision to sign with the Saints.

[NorvTurnerOverdrive]

rams released bulger. i got twenty says he's in buffalo by friday.

[chesapeake]

Originally Posted by DeToxRox

Lions trade a 5th round pick to Seattle for LG Rob Sims. Love the deal. Guy isn't amazing but he's solid and will for sure be our best LG in a long time.

The guy isn't even solid. Seattle desperately needs good offensive linemen. If they don't want him, that should be telling you something.

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally Posted by chesapeake

The guy isn't even solid. Seattle desperately needs good offensive linemen. If they don't want him, that should be telling you something.

Originally Posted by Travis

I think it's a great value trade for the Lions. I understand why the Seahawks did it but am still disappointed as the guy seems to have a lot of potential, especially as a mauler (which they don't value as highly with the ZBS they're installing).

Or perhaps the fact that they are changing their blocking scheme should be telling you something.

That said, until he comes here and actually plays well, I have no reason to think he'll be anything. It's very rare, even under the Mayhew regime, for the Lions to trade for a player or sign a free agent who comes in and actually performs at a decent level.

[Swaggs]

Originally Posted by NorvTurnerOverdrive

rams released bulger. i got twenty says he's in buffalo by friday.

I kind of hope he waits around to see what happens with Roethlisberger.

[dervack]

Originally Posted by NorvTurnerOverdrive

rams released bulger. i got twenty says he's in buffalo by friday.

Nah, Arizona. Wouldn't the natural progression for the Cardinals to be going from St. Louis to Arizona? Team, Warner (eventually) and now Bulger?

[SunDevil]

Originally Posted by dervack

Nah, Arizona. Wouldn't the natural progression for the Cardinals to be going from St. Louis to Arizona? Team, Warner (eventually) and now Bulger?

Too bad they already signed Derek Anderson....

[chesapeake]

Originally Posted by Honolulu_Blue

Or perhaps the fact that they are changing their blocking scheme should be telling you something.

A fair point, but Sims didn't play particularly well (when he wasn't hurt) under Holmgren either before Mora started to add some zone blocking. In fact, he got so far into Holmgren's doghouse that the Hawks overpaid for Mike Wahle to play LG because they had so little confidence in Sims at that spot. Regardless, taking a flyer with a 5th rounder is hardly the end of the world. I'll take the pick, you take Sims, and we'll both go away thinking we robbed the other guy.

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally Posted by chesapeake

I'll take the pick, you take Sims, and we'll both go away thinking we robbed the other guy.

I don't consider this "robbery" for either team. In fact, I'd be surprised if either Sims or whoever the Seahawks take with that pick pan out to much of anything for their respective team. If anything, it's a bit of a toss up. Given the Lions' draft history, if Sims even starts just half the games this year and that's it, that's likely more than they would have ever gotten out of that pick.

Still, you don't tend to get too many quality players for low picks. That's why I am not overly thrilled (though I'm not down on it either) about the Chris Houston trade or this trade. If it works, great. If not, a small price to pay.

[dervack]

Originally Posted by SunDevil

Too bad they already signed Derek Anderson....

And? They also already have Matt Leinart, too. So, they have two backups to replace Kurt Warner. Why not add a third?

[Eaglesfan27]

I'm home sick today and I think I'm going to torture myself and watch the McNabb-Washington press conference at 11 AM (12 Eastern.)

[Dr. Sak]

Originally Posted by Swaggs

I kind of hope he waits around to see what happens with Roethlisberger.

You already have one quarterback made of glass (Batch)...no need for another.

[Dr. Sak]

Originally Posted by Eaglesfan27

I'm home sick today and I think I'm going to torture myself and watch the McNabb-Washington press conference at 11 AM (12 Eastern.)

I was in DC yesterday for the Phillies/Nats game and the reactions from both fan bases were mixed on McNabb.

[Subby]

Originally Posted by Dr. Sak

I was in DC yesterday for the Phillies/Nats game and the reactions from both fan bases were mixed on McNabb.

Were you doing an exit poll at Nationals Stadium?

[Dr. Sak]

Originally Posted by Subby

Were you doing an exit poll at Nationals Stadium?

I had a 45 minute ride on the metro each way and that was pretty much the topic of conversation both ways. Same with where i was sitting in the stadium.

Smart ass

[Subby]

[NorvTurnerOverdrive]

what's on your mind brian baldinger?

The Eagles should be ecstatic. I view McNabb as a flawed player, and it was never more apparent than in the back-to-back losses to the Cowboys last season. His flaws will never go away. Now, the Eagles get at least two chances to expose the same flaws they've been covering up for 11 years. It works against the Redskins that McNabb is still in the division. Andy Reid can finally stop covering up for one of the most overrated quarterbacks in the history of the game. The Eagles will go to the playoffs. The Redskins will be watching from the golf course.

look, i get it. you see the influx of skirts on your channel and you wanna build a little heat for yourself by saying something polarizing. good for you.

you and that mannequin they claim is charlie casserly are truly invaluable to the nfl network.

[flere-imsaho]

Originally Posted by NorvTurnerOverdrive

rams released bulger. i got twenty says he's in buffalo by friday.

It's amazing to me that the Rams basically just spent what, 8 years after getting rid of Warner trying to convince themselves that Bulger was going to be their franchise.

And of course maybe he could have been had they invested in an offensive line.

[Galaril]

[quote=RedKingGold;2258349]Like Todd McShay, who was convinced that Andre Woodson and Brian Brohm were first rounders?

McShay/Mel Kiper aren't "experts". I bet if someone actually looked at their hit/miss rate over the past five years, they've missed on a lot more guys than hit.



When the Broncos traded up to draft Jay Cutler, it caught a lot of people by surprise because Shanahan had not met or worked out with Cutler before the draft. A lot of what the "workouts" you see now are more dog and pony show than anything. Teams have their draft boards completed and nothing will be done in these manufactured workouts which changes coaches/scouts perception.



Pick will be Russell Okung, another OT or a trade down. Write it down now.[/QUOTE]

Actually, Alfred Williams, the retired former two time SB mlb here on Denver radio says it will be Trent Williams, the LT out of Oklahoma St. not Okung taken by the Skins since Okung is great except he is not a kneebender and is totally susceptible to the bullrush at htis point in his career.

[Eaglesfan27]

I thought McNabb was very classy today (as usual), particularly when asked about Kolb among other things.

[JediKooter]

Man, if I was the owner of a team that was on the cusp of finally breaking through and going deep in the playoffs, I'd take McNabb in a heartbeat.

[Raiders Army]

Brett Favre is a grandpa...officially now.

[albionmoonlight]

Originally Posted by Eaglesfan27

I thought McNabb was very classy today (as usual), particularly when asked about Kolb among other things.

I'm sorry for you guys that McNabb couldn't stay an Eagle. Y'all having to watch him play for the Skins would be like me if the Saints had traded Deuce to the Panthers for the last few years of his career.

Football is a business, and we all know that, but it is tough for fans whenever a face-of-the-franchise player goes to a rival team.

Hell, I've had players in FOF that I kept around longer than I should for sentimental reasons. And those aren't even real people.

[Doug5984]

Saints signed Bears DE Alex Brown to a 2 year 6 million dollar deal.

I personally love the move- he comes in and replaces Charles Grant, and I think he is instantly a better player. He will be in a rotation with Bobby McCray / Anthony Hargrove so he should do solid.

[Apathetic Lurker]

Originally Posted by NorvTurnerOverdrive

rams released bulger. i got twenty says he's in buffalo by friday.

God I hope not

[cuervo72]

Originally Posted by RedKingGold

Reid took McNabb when he was a rookie head coach. I think as Andy gained more of an idea of what he wanted to do with playcalling, it became clear that he had to fit his system around McNabb moreso than getting a quarterback to fit his system.

Watching games over the past few years, I think McNabb is a guy who just plays better when relying on his natural instincts...that doesn't play well in the kind of system Andy wants to run. No secret Andy likes to pass a lot, but to make it work, he needs a guy who will consistently and accurately complete those short and intermediate throws.

McNabb always struggled with that. But, for every clearly open guy he overthrew, he would make up for that by escaping three potential sacks and throwing a beautiful deep ball down the field. Yet, as great as that is/was, it's not what Andy wants.

The more I think about it, the more this makes sense. I wonder if there were certain situations specifically where the Eagles looked at numbers and noticed that McNabb was either slipping or just not as good comparatively anymore. Overall his pct was 60.3, which was only good for 20th.

What situations might they look for? 3rd & Med? Wasn't all that good, just 50.9% (cherry picking, but E. Manning was 65.9). McNabb *was* very good on 3rd & Long - 60.4%. Break that down though and it's 48% for 3rd & 8-10, 68.8 for 3rd & 11+. Realistically, how can you expect that last number to stay that high? When else? 2nd and long? 2nd and medium (Eli actually stunk in those...unless it was 11+. McNabb was a little better, but not great - much better on 1st downs). How many of these situations came out positive in the past because of McNabb's legs - which he increasingly won't be able to rely on? There has to be some metric that the Eagles' brass looked at and concluded McNabb was slipping.

The Eagles' offense was great at times, but just wasn't consistent enough. You can't live off of bombs and conversions on 3rd and 10+, because they won't always be there (and you'll have games like Oakland).

[RedKingGold]

Originally Posted by cuervo72

The more I think about it, the more this makes sense. I wonder if there were certain situations specifically where the Eagles looked at numbers and noticed that McNabb was either slipping or just not as good comparatively anymore. Overall his pct was 60.3, which was only good for 20th.

What situations might they look for? 3rd & Med? Wasn't all that good, just 50.9% (cherry picking, but E. Manning was 65.9). McNabb *was* very good on 3rd & Long - 60.4%. Break that down though and it's 48% for 3rd & 8-10, 68.8 for 3rd & 11+. Realistically, how can you expect that last number to stay that high? When else? 2nd and long? 2nd and medium (Eli actually stunk in those...unless it was 11+. McNabb was a little better, but not great - much better on 1st downs). How many of these situations came out positive in the past because of McNabb's legs - which he increasingly won't be able to rely on? There has to be some metric that the Eagles' brass looked at and concluded McNabb was slipping.

The Eagles' offense was great at times, but just wasn't consistent enough. You can't live off of bombs and conversions on 3rd and 10+, because they won't always be there (and you'll have games like Oakland).

Yup. I've always felt a closer look at the stats would bear this out.

I think that Reid might actually run the ball a bit more than he gets credit for, but his overall run/pass split is skewed because of 2nd/3rd-and-long situations.

The more and more I think about it, the more I like this trade for the Eagles. I like Kolb a lot and think he could be the real deal (at least for this offense).

EDIT: Also, along with stats, it could just be that McNabb's injury history was becoming too risky. I think it's almost fair to label Donovan as injury-prone at this point in his career.