Big 10 Expansion Thread -Big Ten ready for a playoff .. finally?

[Toddzilla]

Chuck Woolery?

[Buccaneer]

Originally Posted by JeeberD

that's a sign that UTEP is on their way out. Hopefully to the Mountain Worst...

Man, talking about making a bad conference worse.

[General Mike]

Originally Posted by timmynausea

Didn't the Big 12 just finalize their contract in September with the current lineup in place?

yes

[Logan]

Originally Posted by Solecismic

This would be more entertaining if Chuck Whorley were narrating for ESPN, and played little videos of each college president saying what he likes to do when attending a football game.

For those of you keeping score at home, 43 of the 127 FBS schools in 2015 will have made an affiliation switch in the last four years (with more to come, no doubt).

In 2015, football conferences will have the following structure:

(rankings are for the average school in each conference in academic strength, historic football performance and athletic budgeting)

Cut everything out for space...

But in your 2015 forecast, are you giving any credit for changes to budgets given increased revenues for those teams in new conferences?

[Solecismic]

Originally Posted by Logan

Cut everything out for space...

But in your 2015 forecast, are you giving any credit for changes to budgets given increased revenues for those teams in new conferences?

That's hard to do because every school is different and there are so many sports out there. What is an outside brand going to do in a new conference where there's more money?

The Big XII just signed for $20m/team for 13 years. I don't know when the opt-outs are. The ACC just signed for $17m/team for even longer. Right now, you have a bidding up because there's a perception that football inventory is quite valuable. Will this theory hold true? What will happen with ratings? Diluting a brand can cause damage, and that's what's happened - in the Big XII with key losses and in the ACC and Big Ten with rash additions. I'm not sure digesting and spitting out the Big East was a great idea. Short-term, these moves mean more cash. Long-term? It seems a lot like the mistakes baseball made that led to the end of baseball being a national sport.

[Young Drachma]

All of this daily realignment business makes me use FBCB daily to change the leagues and then see what the new leagues look like. Some look so odd so as to be hardly recognized.

I think I am going to go a step further and create that Super Catholic League (won't call it that) and see what that looks like, though.

[mckerney]

Report: Georgia Tech approved by Big Ten to become 15th member - Land-Grant Holy Land

Hoping this one is all smoke and no fire.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by mckerney

Report: Georgia Tech approved by Big Ten to become 15th member - Land-Grant Holy Land

Hoping this one is all smoke and no fire.

This would look like a push to get Notre Dame to the point we discussed previously. The B10 tells ND that the ACC is falling apart and there's only one spot left before you have nowhere to jump. Wouldn't be shocked to see the SEC make the same move (get Virginia to jump on board) and start pushing the same ND buttons.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by mckerney

Hoping this one is all smoke and no fire.

Amen to that. I'd honestly rather see GT join the Southern Conference.

Was talking about it over dinner earlier this week, I really think this might be the straw that would break the back of my fandom. It's tough enough to give a damn about ACC football but at least there's basketball history (relatively new thought it may be for GT) to make the conference feel meaningful. But this?

I simply don't see myself ever giving a flying fuck about Northwestern. Nothing personal mind you, I doubt there's many people in Evanston that have much interest in Georgia Tech either.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

(get Virginia to jump on board) and start pushing the same ND buttons.

I don't think UVA is even a prime candidate for the SEC. The Duke+UNC rumor that the Sporting News rolled out this week was interesting though.

[Logan]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

This would look like a push to get Notre Dame to the point we discussed previously. The B10 tells ND that the ACC is falling apart and there's only one spot left before you have nowhere to jump. Wouldn't be shocked to see the SEC make the same move (get Virginia to jump on board) and start pushing the same ND buttons.

I don't mean this as a slight to GTech, but would they really be enough of a football loss (if replaced by UConn for example) that it would keep FSU/Clemson thinking about jumping, which I assume would be the precursor to that ND convo?

[Young Drachma]

Originally Posted by mckerney

Report: Georgia Tech approved by Big Ten to become 15th member - Land-Grant Holy Land

Hoping this one is all smoke and no fire.

No other sources other than some SBNation blog? That's just weed smoke. No way Delaney and company managed to sneak attack the Maryland/Rutgers adds and then goes adding #15 before #13 has even managed to secure its buyout and been integrated into the league.

And outside of the JV FBS conferences, no league has integrated more than two new schools at a time.

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

This would look like a push to get Notre Dame to the point we discussed previously. The B10 tells ND that the ACC is falling apart and there's only one spot left before you have nowhere to jump. Wouldn't be shocked to see the SEC make the same move (get Virginia to jump on board) and start pushing the same ND buttons.

You think the SEC would try to push ND to the SEC by adding UVa? Or would try to push them to the Big 10? I don't get it. If the SEC went and added UVa it would be because they like them much more than VT for some reason and want to pre-emptively add them before the Big 10 does - ND and the SEC don't really want anything to do with each other.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by Young Drachma

No way Delaney and company managed to sneak attack the Maryland/Rutgers adds and then goes adding #15 before #13 has even managed to secure its buyout and been integrated into the league.

I would think just the opposite. If more schools are pulled into the fray, it weakens the ACC's will to fight and the number of people who want Maryland to stay goes down as well. If the SEC joins in (as most expect them to do), they could shred this conference in a hurry.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

and the number of people who want Maryland to stay goes down as well.

What would that be, something in decimal form?

I'm hard pressed to think there's very many people who genuinely give a shit whether Maryland stays or goes. They may not like what an exit symbolizes or who is chose to replace them or whatever, but I don't get any real sense there's much OMGwedontgettoplaymarylandanymore going on.

The most compelling thing about them ever was Lefty, and he's been gone a long time now.

[HerRealName]

It seems like more of a question of when and not if when it comes to GT. Also, the end goal may be 20 and not 16. Who knows at this point though?

[Kodos]

We could have the Big T(w)en(ty)!

[yacovfb]

It seems like the more you hear about something happening (Big12->Pac10 moves, GT & FSU to Big 12 by August 1, etc) the less likely it is to happen.

Likewise, all the moves that actually happen go down much more quietly and quickly (Pitt & Cuse to ACC, ND to ACC, Maryland & Rutgers to B1G).

I tend to keep that in the back of my mind when all of this stuff comes out.

[digamma]

Maybe some clarity on Monday.

[mckerney]

Originally Posted by Kodos

We could have the Big T(w)en(ty)!

If they go with Big Tens the conference would have the ability to go up to thirty without a name change.

[Solecismic]

Originally Posted by mckerney

If they go with Big Tens the conference would have the ability to go up to thirty without a name change.

Or 2,000 if they go with the Big Ton.

[sterlingice]

Mark Mangino and Ralph Friedgen could use head coaching jobs there

SI

[Solecismic]

Just to throw it out there, based on my assessment of criteria, the next Big Ten targets:

* - violates the oft-repeated statement from Delany and others that the Big Ten will not skip over states.
$ - violates the oft-repeated statement from many that a conference won't expand where it already has an excellent television base.

1. Texas *
2. Notre Dame
3. Pittsburgh $
4. Georgia Tech *
5. Virginia
6. North Carolina *
(7 would have been Maryland and 8 would have been Rutgers)
9. Kansas
10. Iowa State $
11. Duke *

I don't see any other schools they'd pursue, though if Virginia Tech were offered AAU status, it would jump up to #3 on this list.

I'm surprised Rutgers and Maryland were offered - I thought anything below Notre Dame wasn't a financial add for the conference. But we're in a new world here.

If I had to guess how they reach 16, I'm going with Notre Dame and Virginia.

[Solecismic]

Here's the SEC list:

* - violates the rule we've heard a lot that the SEC wants to avoid states where it already has a presence.

1. Texas *
2. Oklahoma
3. Notre Dame
4. Virginia Tech
5. Clemson *
6. Miami *
7. West Virginia
8. Georgia Tech *
9. Virginia
10. Texas Christian *
11. Florida State *

My guess, if the SEC goes to 16, is that it takes Virginia Tech and Miami (being far enough from Gainesville not to interfere with media stuff).

[tarcone]

Texas wont come. Why woyld they share money?
Notre Dame is pie in the sky. They have turned down the B1G many times.
Pitt is a no for the reason stated.
Geo Tech might be a good one. NW partner. I think they jump.
Virginia, UNC, Kansas yes for academics and TV markets. Of those 3, I think UVA and KU are the 2 most likely.
Iowa State will never get an offer. Too small a fish.
Duke for the same reason as Geo Tech. But doubt they get an offer.

[tarcone]

Here is the rumor mill churning quickly

Georgia Tech approved by Big Ten to become 15th member? - Land-Grant Holy Land

Georgia Tech next?

[Young Drachma]

Originally Posted by mckerney

Report: Georgia Tech approved by Big Ten to become 15th member - Land-Grant Holy Land

Hoping this one is all smoke and no fire.

Originally Posted by tarcone

Here is the rumor mill churning quickly

Georgia Tech approved by Big Ten to become 15th member? - Land-Grant Holy Land

Georgia Tech next?

A few hours late...

[tarcone]

I always am

[Young Drachma]

Georgia Tech denies Big Ten rumors - Big Ten Blog - ESPN

UPDATED: Tech denies Big Ten rumors | Georgia Tech

Amidst rumors and reports that Georgia Tech has applied and been approved for membership into the Big Ten, the school denied their veracity.

“There is no truth to the rumors,” Institute spokesman Matt Nagel said in an e-mail Friday afternoon.

In his conversations with school president G.P. “Bud” Peterson, acting athletic director Paul Griffin said that Peterson “has told me there’s been no communication (with the Big Ten), nor does he expect any.”

Griffin spoke from Charlotte, N.C., where Tech will play Florida State for the ACC football championship Saturday. Griffin said in addition he was not aware of any communications between Tech leadership and the Big Ten or any other conference.

Wednesday, on a teleconference with news media following the ACC accepting Louisville as a member, commissioner John Swofford said that the nature of conversations he had had with Peterson in the past 10 days regarding Tech’s future “has been emphatic in terms of their commitment to the ACC and Georgia Tech’s future.”

[Wolfpack]

The Land Grant Holy Land report is getting it from here: ACC Goes Boom! | Eers Authority

It's apparently all BS from some asshole WV fan who's pissed at the ACC for I guess not letting them in when the ACC went after Syracuse and Pittsburgh, based on these tweets on one of the GT boards:

The Dude of WV ‏ @ theDudeofWV
think about this ACC - none of this would have happened had you not insulted WVU.

The Dude of WV ‏ @ theDudeofWV
@ Mengus22 I did that weeks ago. To sow instability in the ACC & make poaching easier.

So, can this one be put down as garbage at this point?

[Young Drachma]

Originally Posted by Wolfpack

The Land Grant Holy Land report is getting it from here: ACC Goes Boom! | Eers Authority

It's apparently all BS from some asshole WV fan who's pissed at the ACC for I guess not letting them in when the ACC went after Syracuse and Pittsburgh, based on these tweets on one of the GT boards:

The Dude of WV ‏ @ theDudeofWV
think about this ACC - none of this would have happened had you not insulted WVU.

The Dude of WV ‏ @ theDudeofWV
@ Mengus22 I did that weeks ago. To sow instability in the ACC & make poaching easier.

So, can this one be put down as garbage at this point?

Subby needs to hire that asshole to boost his @UnHipDad twitter account.

[Young Drachma]

Rutgers elects to sue the Big East over exit fee - NCAA Football - SI.com

Rutgers University is suing the Big East Conference, trying to avoid paying an exit fee.
Rutgers is trying to avoid a $10 million hit for leaving en route to the Big Ten. Big East bylaws state a school must give 27 months' notice and pay a $10 million withdrawal fee.
The suit says the Big East selectively enforced the rules. Rutgers claims some schools did and some did not have to give notice or pay the fee on their way out of the embattled conference. The Big East allowed Syracuse, Pittsburgh, West Virginia and TCU to leave the league before the 27-month period had run its course.
The conference voted to increase its exit fee from $5 million to $10 million last month. Rutgers did not vote on the motion, but voiced opposition.
Rutgers has also asked the Big East for the $1.3 million it said it lost when a football game was canceled due to TCU's withdrawal. The Horned Frogs were headed to the Big East, but skipped out and landed in the Big 12 before ever playing a game. West Virginia also joined the Big 12, while Pitt and Syracuse will become members of the ACC next season.
v

[Matthean]

MSU's AD thinks 16 teams is the next logical step.

16-team Big Ten? Michigan State Spartans AD Mark Hollis sees advantages - ESPN

[Marmel]

Originally Posted by Young Drachma

Rutgers elects to sue the Big East over exit fee - NCAA Football - SI.com

Typical Rutgers. For decades they never contributed anything to the league. A couple crappy bowl games and no ncaa tournaments to add money to the Big East which is distributed to all schools. They sat at home with their hand out and collected money from the Big East and the success of other programs, the state of NJ, the student fund, etc. Why would they want to put any money out now?

[miked]

Yes, because no other school has sued and wrangled to get out of exit fees and waiting periods.

The bowl games for all Big East schools other than WVU have been crappy, but RU has certainly generated a lot of the Big East football interest the past few years (I can't remember the last time I saw UConn or Cincinnati on a Thursday night game). Fact is, Cuse and Pitt wiggled out of the waiting period, and I expect Louisville will follow suit.

I also read that RU lost revenue from canceled games against TCU and WVU (which the Big East fucked up). It's all a game in the end and they'll reach some settlement like the other schools.

[Marmel]

Originally Posted by miked

Yes, because no other school has sued and wrangled to get out of exit fees and waiting periods.

The bowl games for all Big East schools other than WVU have been crappy, but RU has certainly generated a lot of the Big East football interest the past few years (I can't remember the last time I saw UConn or Cincinnati on a Thursday night game). Fact is, Cuse and Pitt wiggled out of the waiting period, and I expect Louisville will follow suit.

I also read that RU lost revenue from canceled games against TCU and WVU (which the Big East fucked up). It's all a game in the end and they'll reach some settlement like the other schools.

Other schools have gotten out of the 27 month waiting period by paying more than the exit fee. Syracuse's exit fee was $5m, they paid $7.5 to leave a year early, WITHOUT a lawsuit. WV paid a lot more to leave a lot earlier. The only school who negotiated down an exit fee is TCU and they never played a single game in the Big East.

Also, the bowl games have not always been crappy in the Big East. There was football in this conference before 2006.

[Chubby]

Originally Posted by miked

Yes, because no other school has sued and wrangled to get out of exit fees and waiting periods.

The bowl games for all Big East schools other than WVU have been crappy, but RU has certainly generated a lot of the Big East football interest the past few years (I can't remember the last time I saw UConn or Cincinnati on a Thursday night game). Fact is, Cuse and Pitt wiggled out of the waiting period, and I expect Louisville will follow suit.

I also read that RU lost revenue from canceled games against TCU and WVU (which the Big East fucked up). It's all a game in the end and they'll reach some settlement like the other schools.

Rutgers has generated 0 interest in the Big East.

hmm I wonder why the Pinstripe Bowl was hot for SU again this year, oh yeah, it's in NYC

[Logan]

Originally Posted by Marmel

Other schools have gotten out of the 27 month waiting period by paying more than the exit fee. Syracuse's exit fee was $5m, they paid $7.5 to leave a year early, WITHOUT a lawsuit. WV paid a lot more to leave a lot earlier. The only school who negotiated down an exit fee is TCU and they never played a single game in the Big East.

Come on man, you don't need to go down this road. It's standard posturing and negotiating. Rutgers would gladly take the same deal that Syracuse got to leave early. It's a discussion point because the exit fee was raised from $5MM to $10MM which the school didn't vote for. The ACC is going through the same thing with Maryland with these last ditch efforts to raise fees to keep schools.

[Marmel]

Originally Posted by Logan

Come on man, you don't need to go down this road. It's standard posturing and negotiating. Rutgers would gladly take the same deal that Syracuse got to leave early. It's a discussion point because the exit fee was raised from $5MM to $10MM which the school didn't vote for. The ACC is going through the same thing with Maryland with these last ditch efforts to raise fees to keep schools.

I'm pretty sure the schools, including Rutgers, did vote for the increased fee in the Big East. What makes it so standard? Because West Virginia did it? Nobody has had their exit fee lowered, except TCU, and I think that was a different circumstance. Maybe they can work with the conference they were a part of for 20 years to negotiate a price to leave early. Say, $15-$20 million? To sue to try to get out of any exit fee is pretty sad and fucks over the remaining schools even more. God forbid we ask for any kind of ethics out of our institutions of higher learning.

[Young Drachma]

Rutgers did not vote for the increased fee, they abstained but expressed opposition to the increase.

[Logan]

Originally Posted by Marmel

I'm pretty sure the schools, including Rutgers, did vote for the increased fee in the Big East. What makes it so standard? Because West Virginia did it? Nobody has had their exit fee lowered, except TCU, and I think that was a different circumstance. Maybe they can work with the conference they were a part of for 20 years to negotiate a price to leave early. Say, $15-$20 million? To sue to try to get out of any exit fee is pretty sad and fucks over the remaining schools even more. God forbid we ask for any kind of ethics out of our institutions of higher learning.

Yes, the majority of the schools did vote for the fee increase. Rutgers didn't. These large fees have been viewed as being punitive and harsh, and the conference can't decide these for all of its members. Let's take an extreme example: if the entire Big East decided to vote for a $100 million exit fee, and everyone but Rutgers said yes, and Rutgers ended up leaving, do you think they would really be held to that arbitrary number? Suing forces the conference to defend that figure.

I can assure you that the school is not trying to get out of a fee, one will be paid. Depending on the agreed upon amount, it will be offset by what is still owed and what hasn't been disbursed from cash that has already been taken in from the other schools' exit fees.

[Passacaglia]

I understand the sentiment of saying a school didn't vote for the exit fee, but why would anyone vote for the exit fee, if it only applies to schools that vote for it?

[Logan]

Originally Posted by Passacaglia

I understand the sentiment of saying a school didn't vote for the exit fee, but why would anyone vote for the exit fee, if it only applies to schools that vote for it?

I understand that point as well. It's why this issue is being contested right now. My point, overall, is that Rutgers isn't being cheap or deceitful or "trying to fuck over" other schools by challenging the fee legally.

[Marmel]

Originally Posted by Logan

Yes, the majority of the schools did vote for the fee increase. Rutgers didn't. These large fees have been viewed as being punitive and harsh, and the conference can't decide these for all of its members. Let's take an extreme example: if the entire Big East decided to vote for a $100 million exit fee, and everyone but Rutgers said yes, and Rutgers ended up leaving, do you think they would really be held to that arbitrary number? Suing forces the conference to defend that figure.

I can assure you that the school is not trying to get out of a fee, one will be paid. Depending on the agreed upon amount, it will be offset by what is still owed and what hasn't been disbursed from cash that has already been taken in from the other schools' exit fees.

I did not vote for our a-hole state governor, but I still have to pay his tax increase.

[Logan]

Do you have to if you move out of his state?

[gstelmack]

Why did Rutgers abstain instead of voting no?

[Marmel]

Originally Posted by Logan

Do you have to if you move out of his state?

If I move out now, then I still have to pay for this year, yeah.

[Kodos]

I hear Texas is nice.

[Logan]

Originally Posted by gstelmack

Why did Rutgers abstain instead of voting no?

I'm guessing there was a legal reason for it. Louisville abstained as well. There was at least one more school that did the same but I'm blanking on who.

[Logan]

Bloodbath.

Big East deal could be worth as little as $60 million per year - CBSSports.com