*World Cup Game Discussion Thread* (SPOILERS)

[Desnudo]

Originally Posted by kingfc22

Need an Italy/Ghana tie.

Is that the best scenario?

To be honest, if this the quality of play to expect then it won't matter because they'll come nowhere near Italy. If they can't unlock the Czech defense, they have no chance against Italy.

It seems like Johnson is the only one doing anything on the attack.

[Galaril]

A few things. Twellman should have been selected for the team. And it is timefor Arena to go. He has been in that positon for quite some time and has become to cautious in his lineups as well as strategy. The US has got to do better than this or all the hardwork and success from last WC will go to waste. I mean by that is people were just starting to care about soccer in the USA thansk in part to the last cup success.

[rexallllsc]

Originally Posted by Karlifornia

Claudio Reyna gets my vote for man of the match...I mean, without him we easily could have lost 8-0

Well, he was certainly our best player. Kinda funny considering some of the BigSoccer posters wanted Pablo M. to start over him.

Landon Donovan certainly doesn't look like he's improved from 02. Maybe you should've stayed in Europe, Landon.

[Dunleavy]

Eddie Johnson gets US man of match 7/10, everyone else gets 5/10 at best.

[Bisbo]

Hey I was watching a replay of the 94 Cup on ESPN Classic - oh no, wait - its today's game.


Boys vs men. Beasely should not start the rest of the tournament. But no surprise, he hasn't looked good for months.

[rexallllsc]

Their guys are so much stronger than ours - weight program,
Bruce Arena?

[Dunleavy]

anyway...i have the Czech's as my runner up but now they have both strikers, Koller and Baros, injuried. if you finish second in the group you get Brazil so that game v Italy should mean alot for the two

[kingfc22]

This is a horrible result for the US soccer program. Now we have to hear the media bash soccer and make fun of the US until at least Saturday.

[rexallllsc]

Onyewu
Anticipation: 4

[cartman]

Our only hope now is about 20 injuries per team in the Italy-Ghana match.

[RendeR]

Lets not go handing Italy a win over us right away either. Everyone from coaches, players and announcers/analysts have agreed that Italy is not a real quality team right now, far below the average in this world cup event.

Ghana we can beat, I think we can take Italy if we show up and play with some energy. With a 3-0 today though we have to win, draws will not help us due to point differential.

[daedalus]

Originally Posted by BrianD

Did that announcer just say that the US is very capable of getting a result against Italy?

Most of the announcers have also been saying that the US *would* (not could) beat the Czechs.

[Galaril]

Originally Posted by kingfc22

This is a horrible result for the US soccer program. Now we have to hear the media bash soccer and make fun of the US until at least Saturday.

Yeah, no kidding if the US loses soccer sucks and if we win, it is mildly amusing to the media in the US.

[RendeR]

The worst thing I saw out there is a total and complete lack of heart from anyone but Johnson and Reyna.

[Crapshoot]

Beasley was awful, but I wouldn't be as downhearted as many of you are - offensively, the Czech's are one of the 5 best teams in the world, up there with the Brazilians (well, not quite) and the Argentinians. Being taken apart by two world class players (Nedved, Rosicky) isn't a failure requiring a teardown. Yes, they need to tighten up, but all 3 of those goals involved a little bit of magic from someone. I'm more inclined to credit the Czech's as opposed to bashing the US team.

[Desnudo]

Originally Posted by kingfc22

This is a horrible result for the US soccer program. Now we have to hear the media bash soccer and make fun of the US until at least Saturday.

They deserve it. Like Lalas just said, if you want the hype, you take the criticism. Worst defeat so far in the tournament, so what else can be said?

[RendeR]

No matter what magic happened, when you play at this level you have to be able to stand up and play the elite teams close, we didn't today and our players need to seriously make a gut check and come out firing in the next match.

[rexallllsc]

Originally Posted by Crapshoot

Beasley was awful, but I wouldn't be as downhearted as many of you are - offensively, the Czech's are one of the 5 best teams in the world, up there with the Brazilians (well, not quite) and the Argentinians. Being taken apart by two world class players (Nedved, Rosicky) isn't a failure requiring a teardown. Yes, they need to tighten up, but all 3 of those goals involved a little bit of magic from someone. I'm more inclined to credit the Czech's as opposed to bashing the US team.

Yes, those guys are world class players, but the first goal was not a World Class goal, and the third goal was just a complete breakdown in our own end. Rosicky was completely unchecked.

The second goal was a beauty, and I'll give them that, but that also was just a dumb clear.

The team came out flat and uninspired. Beasley shouldn't play next game, and Donovan should be dropped back to the Mid..

[kingfc22]

A couple of quotes from the hattrick conferences:


Some guy from Isreal:

The only truth is that USA is not up to the challenge of a WC. They being on the tournament only levels down the competition.

They seem an amateur team today, and I hope CR scores 2 more goals.

Keller sucks, and the one who thinks he's the best keeper in the world should be treated from drug abuse.

From Austria:

Like i mentioned earlier, the US is playing the best they can, they are just not used to the class of european teams. Dont you get it, the US cant perform better than this

Again from Austria

This is why i looove watching the US in a WC soccer game. They're so used to playing those carppy North- and mid-american teams, that they proclaim their equality with the european teams. The arrogance can't be mistaken, and yet they are always clearly overmatched.

Would be nice to have a gotten a win a told these guys to STFU

[moriarty]

Blah, I hope Gooch signed w/ 'boro already, otherwise he's staying in Belgium for a while (assuming they want him).

Good to see EJ put in a strong performance. Perhaps a bit selfish at times, but hell someone needed to at least get a shot on goal.

Donovan, DMB, Convey ... supposedly the strengths of our team pretty much shut down.

[rexallllsc]

Originally Posted by Desnudo

They deserve it. Like Lalas just said, if you want the hype, you take the criticism. Worst defeat so far in the tournament, so what else can be said?

Yup. If T&T and Angola can come out and stand toe-to-toe with teams - what the hell is wrong with our guys?

[rexallllsc]

Originally Posted by moriarty

Good to see EJ put in a strong performance. Perhaps a bit selfish at times, but hell someone needed to at least get a shot on goal.

Yeh, funny. I saw Landon bickering with EJ after EJ took a shot. Stop it Landon.

[tanglewood]

The US just had no ideas or creativity going forward whatsoever. Donovan was completley anonoymus, maybe it's the food in Germany?

[moriarty]

Originally Posted by rexallllsc

The team came out flat and uninspired. Beasley shouldn't play next game, and Donovan should be dropped back to the Mid..

Problem is, who do you replace Beasley with? Dempsey? If so, Dempsey better score b/c he can't cover back on the right side.

Same with Eddie Lewis and Gooch (can't believe he'll play that bad again .. I really think he cost us at least two of the goals) - if you yank them out, who are you going to replace them with.

We need depth ... desparately. Maybe 2010.

[kingfc22]

So what is our record playing in South Africa? Can we win there?

[RendeR]

Originally Posted by rexallllsc

Yup. If T&T and Angola can come out and stand toe-to-toe with teams - what the hell is wrong with our guys?

Today? laziness. They stood around as if they expected someone to hand them the ballsand the goals on a platter. No energy, no heart today. Whats it take to get our players to play with some passion?

[moriarty]

Originally Posted by kingfc22

So what is our record playing in South Africa? Can we win there?

Not sure, but my kid will by 5 by then. If I train him he ought to be able to start at left back for us based on that show I saw out there.

[BrianD]

I think we'll have to wait for another match or two to really pass judgement on the US team. They were completely outmatched today, so it isn't a surprise that they looked bad. The next 2 matches will show whether we are a mid-tier WC team, or worse.

[Butter]

France '98!

Beasley
Dribbling: 4
First Touch: 2

[kingfc22]

I bet Lalas and Wynalda feel like they got slapped in the face watching us fall all over ourselves today.

[Dunleavy]

Originally Posted by Desnudo

Is that the best scenario?

To be honest, if this the quality of play to expect then it won't matter because they'll come nowhere near Italy. If they can't unlock the Czech defense, they have no chance against Italy.

It seems like Johnson is the only one doing anything on the attack.

best scenario might be Ghana upsetting Italy, but a draw is also good, it will give US hope

[AlexB]

Don't get over downhearted yet: while the FIFA rankings are not necessarily 100% accurate, they are not miles out. Teams will take points off each other in this group - if the next game is a draw even four points might be enough for 2nd, although I tend to agree the goal difference may mean you need 6.

[Desnudo]

Originally Posted by moriarty

Problem is, who do you replace Beasley with? Dempsey? If so, Dempsey better score b/c he can't cover back on the right side.

Same with Eddie Lewis and Gooch (can't believe he'll play that bad again .. I really think he cost us at least two of the goals) - if you yank them out, who are you going to replace them with.

We need depth ... desparately. Maybe 2010.

Johnson on for Beasley and move to a 4-4-2. They lost 3-0 w/Beasley, surely they can lose 3-0 with Dempsey.

[moriarty]

Originally Posted by BrianD

I think we'll have to wait for another match or two to really pass judgement on the US team. They were completely outmatched today, so it isn't a surprise that they looked bad. The next 2 matches will show whether we are a mid-tier WC team, or worse.

If they were outclassed today, it's a pretty fair assumption they'll be outclassed by Italy as well. I think the real question is how we compare against the African team ... Ghana bets anyone?

[moriarty]

Originally Posted by Desnudo

Johnson on for Beasley and move to a 4-4-2. They lost 3-0 w/Beasley, surely they can lose 3-0 with Dempsey.

That's a good point.

[kingfc22]

I think our best chance is to have Italy and Ghana tie. (1 pt. each)
Have them both lose the the CR.
And then it is up to us to get a tie and a win in our last two games.

CR - 9 pts.
US - 4 pts.
Ghana or Italy - 2 pts.
Ghana or Italy - 1 pt.


Not sure how realistic this is, but it's the only way I see us advancing to the round of 16.

[Desnudo]

Lalas is pissed. He's the only guy who seems to know what he's talking about.

[sachmo71]

so much for the rise of pro soccer in the US. we don't like losers much.

[rexallllsc]

Originally Posted by kingfc22

I bet Lalas and Wynalda feel like they got slapped in the face watching us fall all over ourselves today.

Definitely. Lalas is going off.

[Dunleavy]

Renya
"first goal un-nerved us" "put us on our heels"
"second half we made tactical changes, it didn't work out, we didn't get the width"
"alot of guys nervous" "at times all over the field we were hesitant"

[cartman]

Originally Posted by sachmo71

so much for the rise of pro soccer in the US. we don't like losers much.

1998 didn't seem to affect the MLS too much.

[sachmo71]

Originally Posted by cartman

1998 didn't seem to affect the MLS too much.

i would say that the difference is that many of the us fringe fans who heard about this probably heard that the US was "#5 in the world". Then they decide to watch a game or two and get a little excited. A loss like this, and probable elimination from any chance to make a dent in the games, will kill any extra boost MLS might have seen from this, as far as fringe fans are concerned. If the US had played like the 5th best team in teh world, and done something in the tournament, they might have gained quite a few fans. now they just have to hope they get fans who fall in love with the game, not the team.

[Desnudo]

Originally Posted by kingfc22

I think our best chance is to have Italy and Ghana tie. (1 pt. each)
Have them both lose the the CR.
And then it is up to us to get a tie and a win in our last two games.

CR - 9 pts.
US - 4 pts.
Ghana or Italy - 2 pts.
Ghana or Italy - 1 pt.


Not sure how realistic this is, but it's the only way I see us advancing to the round of 16.

Or Ghana beats Italy, Czech beats Ghana, US beats Italy and Ghana, Czech ties Italy.

[Crapshoot]

Originally Posted by rexallllsc

Yup. If T&T and Angola can come out and stand toe-to-toe with teams - what the hell is wrong with our guys?

Again, putting myself into the strange position of defending the US team: 1. The Czech's are better than the Portugeuse. 2. Angola did not even attempt to tie the game - they were happy to lose 1-0, given the long history. The US, to their credit, attempted to play football. I think losing 3-0 playing like the US did (and remember, 2 inches to the left and Reyna scores) is better than losing 1-0 the way Angola did - if anything, it was a sign of a competitive nature, and I appreciate that.

[Coffee Warlord]

Originally Posted by Crapshoot

Again, putting myself into the strange position of defending the US team: 1. The Czech's are better than the Portugeuse. 2. Angola did not even attempt to tie the game - they were happy to lose 1-0, given the long history. The US, to their credit, attempted to play football. I think losing 3-0 playing like the US did (and remember, 2 inches to the left and Reyna scores) is better than losing 1-0 the way Angola did - if anything, it was a sign of a competitive nature, and I appreciate that.

Uh, like what? Continually sloppy passing all over the field and sluggish play is not competitive. It's just ugly.

[Desnudo]

So, how much would people be willing to pay for a DVD copy of this game?

[Huckleberry]

Originally Posted by sachmo71

i would say that the difference is that many of the us fringe fans who heard about this probably heard that the US was "#5 in the world". Then they decide to watch a game or two and get a little excited. A loss like this, and probable elimination from any chance to make a dent in the games, will kill any extra boost MLS might have seen from this, as far as fringe fans are concerned. If the US had played like the 5th best team in teh world, and done something in the tournament, they might have gained quite a few fans. now they just have to hope they get fans who fall in love with the game, not the team.

And that falls on ESPN. Nobody takes the FIFA rankings seriously. Nobody.

The USA is a Top 20 squad.

[Butter]

Originally Posted by Butter_of_69

Beasley
Dribbling: 4
First Touch: 2

Forgot one:

Favored foot: Left Only

[Critch]

Men versuses boys out there. Without Reyna's workrate in midfield, and the Czechs settling, it could have been worse. Too many of the younger US players seem to have believed the hype.

[sachmo71]

Originally Posted by Huckleberry

And that falls on ESPN. Nobody takes the FIFA rankings seriously. Nobody.

The USA is a Top 20 squad.

I don't know if it really matters in the end. US fans are ignorant of almost everything, but they know rankings. We love lists!