10-16-2007, 10:01 PM | #551 | |
Head Coach
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Location: Colorado
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No. Having personality doesn't mean that it comes at the expense of class and respectfullness. |
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10-16-2007, 10:04 PM | #552 | |
Head Coach
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...says the guy who finds the one poster who brings up the fans, while the rest of us were talking about the celebration of the guys on the field. Don't be pissed at me just because your people can't form a logical sentence. Last edited by Logan : 10-16-2007 at 10:08 PM. |
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10-16-2007, 10:05 PM | #553 |
Coordinator
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10-16-2007, 10:10 PM | #554 | |
Hall Of Famer
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Location: Behind Enemy Lines in Athens, GA
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There probably are still a few scattered systems missing, but on the whole the numbers are actually pretty close to all the other major cable networks. As of Jan 07, TBS was available in an estimated 91.7 million homes. ESPN & CNN were in 92.3 million, USA was in 92.0 million, A&E in 91.8 million. On the bright side for TBS (and I'm surprised they didn't try to spin it this way more than they did) is that Games 1 & 3 of the Ari-Col series were the 4th & 6th most watched shows on cable for the week, trailing only MNF, Game 4 of NYY-CLE, and a couple of Friday night shows on Disney. And they actually hold up pretty well compared in isolation to last night's numbers for BOS-CLE which finished last among the big four broadcast networks, posting a number about like what American Dad did on Sunday night. But still, the difference in total viewers for a single show on cable vs broadcast is sometimes just astonishing, even to me & I deal with this stuff regularly.
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10-16-2007, 10:14 PM | #555 |
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I don't know if it's always "nice" ... but I sure saw an example of how important it is over the weekend. Sitting in a restaurant on Saturday night, one TV showing baseball with the other 7 or 8 showing college football (it's Athens, GA, whaddya expect) but when Manny came up damned if the whole room didn't turn their attention to his AB. I actually had to turn around to see what everybody was looking at all of a sudden, it was that obvious a shift in attention. His AB ends and everybody goes back to their conversation/football game. It was the damndest thing I'd seen in public like that in a while.
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10-16-2007, 10:14 PM | #556 | |
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Dec 2003
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You know Bucc, there's nothing quite like old "fans" carping about "respect" - Manny was excited. Yeah, it wasn't the smartest move in the world, but the whole "classless" and what not is more than a little self-righteous, and a little too much of "back in my day." Last edited by Crapshoot : 10-16-2007 at 10:21 PM. |
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10-16-2007, 10:16 PM | #557 |
High School JV
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10-16-2007, 10:25 PM | #558 |
Coordinator
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10-16-2007, 10:27 PM | #559 | |
High School JV
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uh, that's because Ramirez is one of the best right-handed hitters of all time. his hitting is entertaining, his grandstanding is not. well, it's not entertaining to me. the "look at me!!!" routine that some people need to put on has never impressed me in sports or any other aspect of life, but evidently some folks admire it. to each his own. Last edited by dime : 10-16-2007 at 10:31 PM. |
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10-16-2007, 10:29 PM | #560 | |
Head Coach
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There are a lot of players today, including those still in the playoffs, that don't act like they're clowns in a circus. There were classless players "back then" as well so that shit don't stick. |
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10-16-2007, 10:32 PM | #561 | |
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Trust me, there was nothing in the reaction (anecdotal though it may be) that indicated that it was about him being a great hitter, at least not in & of itself. I never saw Tony Gwynn get that sort of reaction. It was all about entertainment (or the potential for it), as they immediately went back to what they were doing & couldn't have cared less about the game itself (with the exception of a group of about 5 or 6 that were all wearing either Red Sox or Yankees gear). Welcome to Hollywood I guess, or something like that.
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10-16-2007, 10:35 PM | #562 | |
Coordinator
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What is the difference between standing at home plate and watching a homer and a pitcher pumping his fist after a strikeout? There's none. The only difference we've been told our whole lives that you shouldn't stand at homeplate and watch your homer because its disrespectful. If every player were like Manny it'd be annoying as hell, but in an era where sports is business and everyone is so image conscious its nice to see someone playing the game the way they want to. Last edited by Atocep : 10-16-2007 at 10:35 PM. |
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10-16-2007, 10:40 PM | #563 | |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2000
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You were in the wrong part of the country. I traveled 100 miles to go see Tony play and those in the SD area would hang on to his every move. I really don't care or give any credibility to what American Idol- or Britney Spears-obsessed TV zombies desire. |
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10-16-2007, 10:44 PM | #564 | |
Head Coach
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What if for some reason a incoming breeze catches the ball and it hits the wall? Manny would still be standing at home plate flicking his locks instead of hustling around second. That's the difference. |
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10-16-2007, 10:46 PM | #565 |
General Manager
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: The Mountains
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Some people would prefer that all baseball players act the same, not bring attention to themselves, ect. What a horribly boring league that would be.
There's nobody quite like Manny. He decided long ago that he wasn't going to have any relationship with the media. He was going to do his own thing. Obnoxious, immature - I won't argue that he's not. But thank god there's at least a handful of players who aren't so scared of the media that they're willing to be themselves. As for the series - extremely disappointing so far as a Red Sox fan, but with Beckett pitching a game 5, you expect a win. Then you need to manage 2 at Fenway. They've done it before. |
10-16-2007, 10:48 PM | #566 | |
General Manager
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So what should we do? Lock him in jail or something? We gotta keep things in perspective. It's just Manny being Manny. Hate it or love it. |
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10-16-2007, 10:50 PM | #567 | |
Hall Of Famer
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Quote:
Where is this love for Barry Bonds?
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10-16-2007, 10:51 PM | #568 | |
Grizzled Veteran
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The Sox hold significant rooting interest for me after living there (Giants will always be my true love), and I love Manny. I don't want a league full of Mark Grace's, Cal Ripken's Jr's, and HTWG's - I love guys like Manny, who have some spirit, and seem to be actually enjoying the game. With you all the way. |
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10-16-2007, 10:54 PM | #569 |
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Dec 2003
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Ooh - Pick me! I love Bonds. My greatest regret is that he hasn't given Jay Mariotti, Skip Bayless, Woody Paige, Bill Conlin, Bill Plashke heart attacks just yet - anyone who pisses of the self-righteous blowhards is a-ok with me. |
10-16-2007, 10:54 PM | #570 |
High School JV
Join Date: Sep 2006
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I can certainly see why guys like Ramirez or Melido Perez or whomever would be entertaining to folks who don't really watch baseball or follow it closely...they do "weird" things and that is interesting to someone who doesn't really appreciate the game or finds it boring.
I don't see why it's something that would be considered special or charming, though. The arguments I'm reading in that vein don't hold up at all. Just because 99% of manny's peers don't make an ass of themselves doesn't mean they're cowtowing to the media or that they are afraid of what other people will think. More likely, it means that those players are just more secure than the mannys and the bonds of the world. Last edited by dime : 10-16-2007 at 10:55 PM. |
10-16-2007, 11:03 PM | #571 | |
General Manager
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Maybe - but as crazy at it is, I find that a part of Manny's charm. He doesn't get in trouble with the law, he's not a jerk to fans, he's a nice guy by all accounts. And he's as quirky as shit, seemingly completely oblivious and indifferent to the world's opinion of him. i can't think of anybody who compares - we'll really appreciate him when he's gone. |
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10-16-2007, 11:10 PM | #572 | ||
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And the former seemed to be the majority of the crowd in my little story. Outside of the Braves, I figure the only people in the room who gave a damn about baseball were the ones in NY/BOS gear, sure as hell nobody else was paying attention to that TV except for the Manny AB. And I won't argue that many of them were "charmed" by it, but they were definitely "entertained" enough to pay attention, which sort of makes it "special" by comparison to the rest of what was taking place on that screen. Meanwhile, since I'm already posting, lemme backtrack to something Bucc said Quote:
I was just picking out Gwynn for a random great hitter example. Of course people in the SD area paid attention to him, people watch Chipper & Andruw bat here too (and neither is in the "great" territory). And as for those AI fans, I would assume that you've figured out at some point that I'm pretty much in agreement with you as far as the difference in what entertains them & what entertains me ... but at the same time, I'd have to have my head in the sand not to realize those folks account for somewhere between 80% & 90% of the tickets sold to Turner Field any more. Show up in the 3rd, leave in the 6th or 7th, mostly there to see & be seen and to make a cell call or two from their company season ticket seats they happened to be employee of the week to get. The odds of sitting next to someone at a game these days who actually finds baseball even equally interesting to American Idol are getting slimmer & slimmer.
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10-16-2007, 11:17 PM | #573 | |
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10-16-2007, 11:23 PM | #574 | |
Grey Dog Software
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10-16-2007, 11:30 PM | #575 | |
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{shrug} All I can tell you is that I've never seen that dramatic a reaction to a non-Brave in a similar situation in my life, with the possible exception of Sosa. Pujols? Not even close, A-Rod either. Bonds is an exception, because so many are hoping to watch him fail although that too is as personality driven as anything. edit to add: Truth is, it shocked the hell out of me. I had no idea there were that many people in this area who could have even picked the guy out of a police lineup, much less wanted to see him at bat.
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"I lit another cigarette. Unless I specifically inform you to the contrary, I am always lighting another cigarette." - from a novel by Martin Amis Last edited by JonInMiddleGA : 10-16-2007 at 11:32 PM. |
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10-16-2007, 11:45 PM | #576 |
Grey Dog Software
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I remember being in school in Illinois in 1985 and our class stopping everytime Jack Clark came to bat. Now, he was about as low-key as you can get as a person. In fact, Vince Coleman, Ozzie Smith and Willie McGee were much more "interesting" to watch as people, but no one stopped on their ABs. Clark had power and that's what excited people.
Same thing happened for McGwire vs Sosa. I don't think people in 1998 said "Well, I'll watch Sosa but not McGwire, Sammy's got more personality". As Greg Maddux once said - chicks dig the long ball. And, if you can combine the long ball with a known icon, you have atleast some interest from most fans. |
10-17-2007, 12:07 AM | #577 | |
Coordinator
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Jack Clark wasn't a guy your average fan stopped to watch hit. Neither was Dale Murphy. I'd argue that no one really stops to watch Pujols hit either. Before McGwire started getting hype for the HR chase, no one watched him outside of St. Louis or Oakland. Canseco got more attention than McGwire did when they played in Oakland. Sosa wasn't known by many outside Chicago before the HR chase. They did something special and the attention followed them the rest of their careers. Reyes is a guy that isn't exactly a slugger that gets people to watch his at bats and while he's on the bases. Carl Crawford would probably be the same if he played in a different market. Its not necessarily all about power. Bo Jackson wasn't all that good of a baseball player, but I'll be damned if you didn't want to watch everything he did. With Manny, you want to see him hit, but at the same time you want to see if he's going to something. I'd bet if you asked your average fan they'd have no clue he's one of the top right handers to ever play baseball. They know him as a great player that does things that make you want to watch. |
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10-17-2007, 07:31 AM | #578 | |
High School JV
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sorry, but this (and the later stuff I snipped) is just not true at all. people aren't watching ramirez hit because he has dreadlocks and is a head case. they're watching because he can hit any pitch out of the ballpark. people DO stop to watch pujols hit for the same reason...not because they're hoping he will do a cartwheel to first base or break down in tears or something. the folks hoping for a cartwheel don't really care about baseball to begin with, and while the red sox probably have gained a good number of these "fans" in the last few years (hey, jimmy fallon and drew barrymore are on the field! they think manny is wacky!) I don't think it's wise to extend their views to categorize baseball or sports fans as a whole. most of us want to see someone play because they're good, not because they show off. Last edited by dime : 10-17-2007 at 07:33 AM. |
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10-17-2007, 07:51 AM | #579 |
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Cleveland has been the better team so far.. looks like the Sox season will be over soon.. :/
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10-17-2007, 07:54 AM | #580 | |
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Most of "us" here at FOFC? Yeah, I would agree. Most of the people who end up at a lot of the stadiums around the country? I disagree, likewise with a significant portion of those watching in the postseason.
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10-17-2007, 10:31 AM | #581 |
Dark Cloud
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I think Cleveland and Colorado matchup a lot better for the Rockies than what the Red Sox would've done. If you're looking for the better story, both stories are compelling in a Rox v. Indians world series. I want them to win the World Series and then change their damn mascot.
But it would be funny of the Indians could lose another World Series at the hands of the other member of the expansion class of '93.
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10-17-2007, 12:00 PM | #582 | |
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I don't necessarily agree. Yesterday, they hit the ball very hard, but had some bad luck - most went straight to a fielder; solo homeruns, etc., etc.. The game yesterday could easily have had the score reversed had lady luck shined the other way. Just one of those games. Definitely still have a good chance at it. |
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10-17-2007, 12:02 PM | #583 |
Head Coach
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CC Sabigass for teh win!
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10-17-2007, 01:34 PM | #584 | |
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Whether you like it or not, the casual fan makes up a much larger population than the people that sit and watch every pitch of every game. These casual fans are the ones that stop to watch guys like Manny or Reyes or Bonds hit and then go back to what they're doing. These are fans that give the large market teams huge ratings. These are the people ESPN and other networks look to pull in because they know that you, me, and other baseball fans are going to watch the games regardless. Your true baseball fans will stop to watch Pujols hit, but your casual fan isn't going to watch him like they do some other players. Your mistake is trying to categorize a player's following by the "true" baseball fans while overlooking the casual fan, which is the group that makes a much bigger impact in TV ratings. |
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10-17-2007, 05:34 PM | #585 |
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What a difference a game makes I guess. From the bottom of the ratings to the top, as Fox wins the night for broadcast with a stronger showing for Game Four.
Easier competition on the other networks surely helped, but total viewers look to be up by about 20% over Game 3. http://www.medialifemagazine.com/art...l_playoffs.asp
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10-17-2007, 08:35 PM | #586 | |
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I'm going to call shenanigans for trying to slip in Reyes's name over Pujols. It's just dead wrong. SI
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10-18-2007, 12:54 AM | #587 |
Coordinator
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10-18-2007, 11:49 AM | #588 |
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10-18-2007, 11:55 AM | #589 | |
Dark Cloud
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Pretty hilarious indeed. I doubt Beckett will shed a tear, given more people know who he is, versus how many people have any freakin' idea who she is. He probably hit last night for old time's sake.
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10-18-2007, 12:48 PM | #590 |
Dark Cloud
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Interesting story from The NY Times about the Rockies fan base out west:
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/18/us...tml?ref=sports
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10-18-2007, 12:53 PM | #591 | |
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Never heard of her. This could also backfire, and tick Beckett off enough that he's throwing 3 - 4 MPH faster than normal...
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10-18-2007, 01:02 PM | #592 |
Dark Cloud
Join Date: Apr 2001
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This kid went to Yankee Stadium and beat the Yankees to win a World Series.
He might choke, but this won't be the reason for it. I wouldn't give him material to fuel him.
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Current Dynasty:The Zenith of Professional Basketball Careers (FBPB/FBCB) FBCB / FPB3 Mods Last edited by Young Drachma : 10-18-2007 at 01:03 PM. |
10-18-2007, 07:19 PM | #593 |
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Maybe but definitely not more recognizable to casual fans. SI
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10-18-2007, 08:26 PM | #594 |
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Good for you piece of shit Manny Ramirez! Way to loaf your lazy ass around the bases and take that single!!!
I hope the Indians beat them tonight. |
10-18-2007, 08:36 PM | #595 |
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I have to admit, that is a funny ebay commercial
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10-18-2007, 08:43 PM | #596 |
Favored Bitch #1
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It is inexcusable that a major league player can't get a bunt down in an elimination game with 2 on and nobody out.
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10-18-2007, 09:00 PM | #597 |
Banned
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I now have a good idea what Tim McCarver sounds like when he orgasms. Thanks.
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10-18-2007, 09:01 PM | #598 |
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BTW, full marks to the ump..they got the call right on Manny's "Single". :/
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10-18-2007, 09:12 PM | #599 |
Favored Bitch #1
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Location: homeless in NJ
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these are the kind of lost oppritunities that have killed the sox
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10-18-2007, 09:13 PM | #600 |
Favored Bitch #1
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