Big 10 Expansion Thread -Big Ten ready for a playoff .. finally?

[miked]

Right, just look at Pitt and Syracuse

[Swaggs]

Originally Posted by miked

Right, just look at Pitt and Syracuse

Or Colorado or Boston College.

Really, Virginia Tech has probably been the best addition in the last several years of expansion and they weren't even seen as a desirable addition at the time.

[Ragone]

I'm not really sure What louisville is doing. I think they are waiting for an sec invite that just won't happen because kentucky will cblock that. Just hope they know what they are doing and aren't left standing after the music chairs of this shuffling is over.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by panerd

Mizzou doing their best to play their way out of an invite to any conference. I guess its good that they are probably more after our tv coverage than our football program. K-State will probably end up being an 8 or 9 win team but Mizzou looks like they have no heart at all.

Let's not forget that Mizzou plays 5 of their last 7 games inside the Missouri borders. There's still plenty of football left to play and the schedule is pretty favorable. Injuries have certainly played a factor. Regardless, that's not going to play any role in whether or not Mizzou gets a bid to another conference.

[Chubby]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

Let's not forget that Mizzou plays 5 of their last 7 games inside the Missouri borders. There's still plenty of football left to play and the schedule is pretty favorable. Injuries have certainly played a factor. Regardless, that's not going to play any role in whether or not Mizzou gets a bid to another conference.

which they don't have

[Toddzilla]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

whether or not Mizzou gets a bid to another conference.

WHAT? What about the bid they have from the SEC? You know, the one you told us about 75 times already?

[kcchief19]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

Let's not forget that Mizzou plays 5 of their last 7 games inside the Missouri borders. There's still plenty of football left to play and the schedule is pretty favorable. Injuries have certainly played a factor. Regardless, that's not going to play any role in whether or not Mizzou gets a bid to another conference.

My level of concern is growing but Missouri's schedule has been ridiculous. We're the only team in the country that has played three ranked teams on the road, and those three teams have a combined record of 15-1. The only loss is Arizona State's 3-point loss at 6-0 Illinois. Given how Oklahoma is running over people, our game at Norman is the biggest scare they've had all year.

We have Iowa State, Texas, Tech and KU at home. I'm optimistic we can go 3-1 in that stretch, and 4-0 is certainly a possibility. Oklahoma State is going to be brutal, and at Baylor and at A&M will be tough. The team just can't hang its head over three tough road losses.

I get all the shots Mizzou is taking about competing in the SEC, but even in what is shaping up as a down year with a new quarterback, Missouri is clearly better than five SEC teams, and I think we'd be competitive against everyone other than LSU, Bama and possibly Carolina.

[KWhit]

Originally Posted by kcchief19

I get all the shots Mizzou is taking about competing in the SEC, but even in what is shaping up as a down year with a new quarterback, Missouri is clearly better than five SEC teams, and I think we'd be competitive against everyone other than LSU, Bama and possibly Carolina.

Clearly better than 5 SEC teams? Uh, no.

[MJ4H]

At least tell us which 5!

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by MJ4H

At least tell us which 5!

I was trying to figure that out myself.

Kentucky, Ole Miss, Miss State are the three obvious. I'm guessing Vandy & UT must be the other two, not sure how else he could get to five.

[KWhit]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

I was trying to figure that out myself.

Kentucky, Ole Miss, Miss State are the three obvious. I'm guessing Vandy & UT must be the other two, not sure how else he could get to five.

They've done nothing to show they're better than Miss State.

The only SEC teams they're probably "clearly" better than are Kentucky and Ole Miss right now.

[Matthean]

Originally Posted by kcchief19

We're the only team in the country that has played three ranked teams on the road, and those three teams have a combined record of 15-1

LSU says "Hi." Kind of helps those teams be 15-1 when you go against 0-3 against them. Missouri being OU's toughest challenge says more about OU's schedule than it does Missouri.

[molson]

Does anybody know the status of BCS automatic qualifiers and how often that status can evaluated? Particularly with regard to the big east? It could be a few years before Pitt and Cuse are gone, but it could end up being sooner, and it doesn't look like TCU will ever be there. With MWC defections, there's no clear replacement, but another at-large spot might make sense.

[Matthean]

Ex-Big 12 commish Dan Beebe says Nebraska Cornhuskers balked at revenue sharing - ESPN

So wait, Big 12 wanted sharing like the Big Ten, Nebraska balked at it, and went to the Big Ten. Sounds like sour grapes from Beebe.

[Young Drachma]

Originally Posted by molson

Does anybody know the status of BCS automatic qualifiers and how often that status can evaluated? Particularly with regard to the big east? It could be a few years before Pitt and Cuse are gone, but it could end up being sooner, and it doesn't look like TCU will ever be there. With MWC defections, there's no clear replacement, but another at-large spot might make sense.

The Big East is part of the current TV deal and won't be in danger of being "demoted" from AQ status until at the very least 2014-15.

Under the terms of the agreements with the bowls and television rightsholder, the ACC, Big East, Big 10, Big 12, Pac-10 and SEC will have annual automatic qualification for their champions for the 2010-11, 2011-12, 2012-13 and 2013-14 seasons.

All the next evaluation period will determine is whether a new conference gets AQ status to join the six leagues that already do.

Results from the 2008, 2009, 2010 and 2011 regular seasons will be evaluated to determine whether a seventh conference earns automatic qualification for the 2012-13 and 2013-14 bowl games. The process is as follows:

AQ conferences could grow by one in 2012

[tarcone]

Its every other school except Texas. They are just trying to do whats best for everyone.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

More signs that the Big 12 is in big trouble. Air Force has passed on a B12 invite and will be going to the Big East.

Mark Kiszla: Air Force preparing to leave Mountain West for Big East - The Denver Post

The Big 12 is quickly running out of viable options to get the conference back to 12 teams as OU would like to fully commit.

[Young Drachma]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

Air Force has passed on a B12 invite and will be going to the Big East.

Mark Kiszla: Air Force preparing to leave Mountain West for Big East - The Denver Post

Mizzou propaganda aside...

The AD at Air Force seems on point. Go to the Big East, play Army and Navy each season in the same league. Be able to compete and not get pummled by football factories. TCU's (relative) demise this year means the MWC is unlikely to get an AQ bid and if they do, it'd be by the skin of their teeth. Maybe if Boise can somehow luck into the national title game and the bottom of the conference has an uncharacteristically strong rest of the season.

That's a lot of ifs.

"We were approached by the Big 12, and I told them we're not a good fit for that conference. In the Big 12, geography makes sense, the economics make sense, but recruiting makes no sense for us. I can't recruit against Texas, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State," Mueh said.
"That's why I turned down the Big 12. I can't do that to my kids, because they'll get beat up. I'd love the extra $12 million or whatever it would be per year from the TV money. And I know how I'd spend the money. I'd build a new soccer stadium, and I'd build a new baseball facility, all in one year. But I can't do that."

Air Force would be football-only and put their other teams in the Missouri Valley according to that story. I guess the MWC will need to invite Utah State as they planned to before to replace them.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by Dark Cloud

Mizzou propaganda aside...

The AD at Air Force seems on point. Go to the Big East, play Army and Navy each season in the same league. Be able to compete and not get pummled by football factories. TCU's (relative) demise this year means the MWC is unlikely to get an AQ bid and if they do, it'd be by the skin of their teeth. Maybe if Boise can somehow luck into the national title game and the bottom of the conference has an uncharacteristically strong rest of the season.

Not sure where the propaganda lies. The Air Force AD is exactly right and he's making the best decision. Regarding the B12, there's only so many teams that would have been considered a viable option as a strong enough member. Air Force would be on that list. The B12 needs teams bad and every school on that list that decides to go elsewhere or doesn't want to deal with Texas is one less team that gives them a chance to keep OU in the conference and hold it together. People joke about Tulane as a consideration but it's quickly reaching that point.

[Young Drachma]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

Not sure where the propaganda lies.

I'm talking about you and your hyperbole. Ok your team will probably leave. You don't have to convince us of how terrible a destination it is and how their prospects are bad and how they'll never be great. Schools are making decisions that suit them and invoking a service academy isn't exactly endorsing your claims.

Tulane once played in the SEC (albeit the 60s were a long time ago), plays in the Superdome in a major pro media market and has fallen on hard times but it's not like they're Texas State or something.

But I read nothing in that article that dealt with reluctance to deal with Texas. It was solely about not wanting to compete with schools that are football factories and the chance to play with other service academies. They're (Air Force) is a unique case and realignment has nothing to do with competitiveness for most schools, but the service academies probably care more about that than traditional universities.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by Dark Cloud

I'm talking about you and your hyperbole. Ok your team will probably leave. You don't have to convince us of how terrible a destination it is and how their prospects are bad and how they'll never be great. Schools are making decisions that suit them and invoking a service academy isn't exactly endorsing your claims.

Tulane once played in the SEC (albeit the 60s were a long time ago), plays in the Superdome in a major pro media market and has fallen on hard times but it's not like they're Texas State or something.

But I read nothing in that article that dealt with reluctance to deal with Texas. It was solely about not wanting to compete with schools that are football factories and the chance to play with other service academies. They're (Air Force) is a unique case and realignment has nothing to do with competitiveness for most schools, but the service academies probably care more about that than traditional universities.

And I didn't imply either. Mizzou is already all but gone. I'm discussing what's left of the conference. And I said nothing about Air Force's decision being related to Texas. I was referring to the possibility that the remaining schools on the list may balk for that reason. Given what's happened the past few weeks, that remains a real possibility.

Nothing against the Tulane folks, but the B12 is going down quickly if any team of that quality joins the conference.

[General Mike]

Originally Posted by Dark Cloud

Tulane once played in the SEC (albeit the 60s were a long time ago), plays in the Superdome in a major pro media market and has fallen on hard times but it's not like they're Texas State or something.

They might as well be Texas State with the way their fans attend the games. I watched parts of their game with Syracuse last night and their was barely anyone in the Superdome. From what you could see on TV, the only people there were the people sitting between the 40 yard lines. And they would be a good fit in an AQ conference. SMH

[CU Tiger]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

Regarding the B12, there's only so many teams that would have been considered a viable option as a strong enough member. Air Force would be on that list.

Sorry, I got nothing.

[DeToxRox]

Big East officials have discussed the possibility of adding Boise State for football-only, a move that would help the league retain its automatic qualifying status for a BCS bowl bid after the current contract runs out following the 2013 regular season, according to a college official.

The official requested anonymity because he is not authorized to discuss league matters.

Adding Boise would be another major boost to the rebuilding process on the football side, with Air Force athletic director Hans Mueh telling the Denver Post in today's editions that the academy is hoping to join the Big East for football-only as well.

"Our interest is high in the Big East. That's fair to say," Mueh told the Post. "This stuff is moving fast."

One major stumbling block for both schools is finding a conference for their other sports, with the Post reporting that Air Force would try to move its sports from the Mountain West, where Boise is also a member, to the Missouri Valley. Boise would need a similar landing spot for its other sports before it could join the Big East.

The Western Athletic Conference could be a possibility for the other sports for Air Force and Boise State as well.

"We've had discussions with Air Force about joining in all sports but football,'' WAC commissioner Karl Benson told Boston.com, the Boston Globe's on line home. "And we would certainly be willing to talk to Boise State about the same arrangement."

With Navy also on the Big East's expansion radar for football-only, that could get the league back to nine football schools after Pittsburgh and Syracuse leave for the ACC.

One follow-up scenario being considered if Air Force, Boise and Navy do join is for the Big East to then add two schools for all-sports (from a group that includes Central Florida, Temple and East Carolina) and then push Villanova to eventually make the move to the FBS level.

That would get the Big East to 12 schools in football and 16 in basketball.

The Big East currently has an automatic BCS bowl bid as long as it has a minimum of seven teams through the 2013 regular season.

The next BCS conference evaluation -- for automatic BCS bowl bids for the 2014-17 regular seasons -- will be based on a league's performance from 2010 through 2013 and is calculated on the conference membership as of Dec. 4 of this year.

The addition of Boise would help the Big East during that next evaluation, since the Broncos' successful 2010 and 2011 seasons would then be counted for the Big East.

Before the Big East formally begins the expansion process league officials are seeking to substantially raise the current $5 million exit penalty as a show of unity among the remaining schools. But with Louisville and possibly West Virginia being eyed by other conferences, and with Rutgers and Connecticut still not fully committed to the league for the long term, hopes of pushing that through have not happened as quickly as had been anticipated.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by CU Tiger

Sorry, I got nothing.

I'd agree with you. It's an armed forces school, but still leaves a lot to be desired from a competitive standpoint. It's the issue that the conference faces. The options are limited to keep the B12 as a strong BCS league.

[General Mike]

Boise, Air Force, Army, navy? I got nothing.

[Young Drachma]

TV contracts. Not wins and losses, folks.

[tarcone]

I might be overthinking this, but wouldnt the travel to Boise be a nightmare?

[Swaggs]

Originally Posted by tarcone

I might be overthinking this, but wouldnt the travel to Boise be a nightmare?

Not really if they are football-only. It would be more of a problem from Boise's point of view, as they would have to make 3-5 cross country trips per year. From the other school's perspective, it would only be once every two years, at most (depending on how big the conference grows).

The nightmare would be finding yourself married to Boise if/when they fall back to Earth.

[Swaggs]

Dola...

and I am not seeing the wisdom in adding the academies. None of them are in BCS conferences now, so I don't see how getting them to join would enhance the Big East's odds of keeping their BCS bid.

I think WVU and Louisville are leaving sooner, rather than later, but assuming they do not, I would much rather see the Big East double down in Florida and Texas and see how things fall.

I'd make the conference look like this:

Rutgers
UConn
WVU
Louisville
USF
Cincy

and add:
UCF
Houston
SMU
Temple
ECU or Navy
Memphis

That's not a great football conference, but realistically Pitt and Syracuse were ~.500 teams since the ACC raid, so it isn't like we're much worse off there. I think football keeps its BCS bid with that lineup. In basketball Louisville, UConn, WVU, and Memphis all have recent Final Four appearances and Temple, Cincy, and Houston have good histories. Pretty good markets (even though the programs are not primary draws, they are probably good enough to get on the air with the BCS tag) and having recruiting access to Florida and Texas would be attractive. If the basketball schools want to stick around, why not?

Patching things together with teams from two time zones away is just a band-aid solution.

[molson]

I'd love to see Louisville and West Virginia leave and Navy end up with a BCS spot with a 7-4 record in 2013 or so....Maybe the taxpayers could get the BCS payoff.

[Ksyrup]

You know what's weird? I was thinking about this after FSU lost to Wake and saw some tweets from former Wake players about beating FSU 4 out of the last 6 games, and it occurred to me: outside of Miami, I can't think of one team in the ACC I feel has a rivalry with FSU. I'm not talking they've beaten us enough to be competitive - heck, half the conference can claim that in the past decade - but I'm talking about one of those things where you root against the school even when they're not playing you, or when you beat them you take extra satisfaction in the win.

I can't say I care about any team in this conference that way aside from Miami. Not Clemson, not GT, not VT... none of them. In fact, I've been rooting for GT this year. Just struck me as odd. I'd be interested to know if I'm just an oddball, or if that's a normal sentiment.

I was thinking about that in relation to the SEC, where it seems like everyone hates everyone else. There's a real emotional investment in those games, a real rivalry between at least 8-10 of those schools, that's missing in the ACC, at least from my perspective. I think that's one of the things that sets the SEC apart. The ACC just feels so sterile - I can't get worked up about any of the schools, aside from one.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

I can't say I care about any team in this conference that way aside from Miami. Not Clemson, not GT, not VT... none of them. In fact, I've been rooting for GT this year. Just struck me as odd. I'd be interested to know if I'm just an oddball, or if that's a normal sentiment.

Probably not all that odd IMO. Probably the norm I imagine.

I was thinking about that in relation to the SEC, where it seems like everyone hates everyone else. There's a real emotional investment in those games, a real rivalry between at least 8-10 of those schools, that's missing in the ACC, at least from my perspective.

Well, I'd say that's yes & no.

Almost everybody in the SEC has somebody that they hate & would (as I usually put it) cheer for North Korea against. But on the whole, they'll cheer the conference teams, with maybe 1 or 2 exceptions, against anybody else.

That's similar to what you're saying about the ACC, it's just the whole really hating a couple of the other teams thing that's missing.

[Ksyrup]

Well, on another board we have a UGA fan, a South Carolina fan, and a UT fan. And each of them roots hard against UF, LSU, Alabama and Auburn, plus the 2 other teams (the UGA fan roots hard against USC and UT). So it seems like they have hard rooting interests against half the damn conference. T hey aren't rooting for LSU in any game, unless it works to their team's advantage.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

Well, on another board we have a UGA fan, a South Carolina fan, and a UT fan. And each of them roots hard against UF, LSU, Alabama and Auburn, plus the 2 other teams (the UGA fan roots hard against USC and UT). So it seems like they have hard rooting interests against half the damn conference.

The anti-SC thing for UGA is relatively new though & seems to be more about recent embarrassment than anything else. They haven't reached the level of seeing anti-SC bumper stickers around the state like you do for UF. Bama is weird because they've so rarely played UGA, but the anti-Tide thing goes all the way back to Bear.

They aren't rooting for LSU in any game, unless it works to their team's advantage.

I can certainly understand that

[digamma]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

I can't say I care about any team in this conference that way aside from Miami. Not Clemson, not GT, not VT... none of them. In fact, I've been rooting for GT this year. Just struck me as odd. I'd be interested to know if I'm just an oddball, or if that's a normal sentiment.

For GT, Clemson is easily #1. Virginia Tech a pretty clear #2, then you have a host of teams who could be the third biggest rival. FSU falls into that bunch. I'd probably put UVA 3rd and FSU 4th--UVA getting the nod because of the two 41-38 games and the long win streak by the Hoos in Charlottesville.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

NBC Sports reporting TCU announcement should come at 7:00 PM EDT today.

‘Major announcement’ expected from TCU today | CollegeFootballTalk

[Radii]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

Well, on another board we have a UGA fan, a South Carolina fan, and a UT fan. And each of them roots hard against UF, LSU, Alabama and Auburn, plus the 2 other teams (the UGA fan roots hard against USC and UT). So it seems like they have hard rooting interests against half the damn conference. T hey aren't rooting for LSU in any game, unless it works to their team's advantage.

I wonder if the sustained success of the conference generates this? In the 80s and 90s in basketball I hated most other ACC teams and loved it when they lost. Now I just desperately want there to be more quality teams and root accordingly. There's a lot more room to root against everyone else when you know in the end you will still get to confidently argue that your conference is the best. When you're struggling to get out of mediocrity I think it lends itself a lot more to rooting for some teams to break out of the pack and make it big and the hate is limited to the one rival.

[corbes]

Originally Posted by Radii

I wonder if the sustained success of the conference generates this? In the 80s and 90s in basketball I hated most other ACC teams and loved it when they lost. Now I just desperately want there to be more quality teams and root accordingly.

A UNC alum here with the same experience. In the 80s and 90s I was thrilled when an ACC team lost a basketball game (serves them right! Go to hell UVA!) but now it is just sad.

[ntndeacon]

As a Wake fan, I must admit that I am joyful when NC State loses....in anything.

[CraigSca]

As a Maryland fan, I agree. Nothing like the basketball rivalries with Duke and UNC (at least in the early 2000s).

[Ksyrup]

Originally Posted by Radii

I wonder if the sustained success of the conference generates this?

Could be. At this point, an OOC win by the ACC at any level is a good thing for all conference members, as is the best teams in any given year not being upset so the ACC can possibly have 1 or 2 teams ranked nationally. When you have 6 or 7 ranked, it's easy to root for the best ones to lose, because the conference is still perceived as the best.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

AP report detailing expected revenue increase for Mizzou in SEC. Small increase under current SEC contract, but new SEC deal currently being renegotiated could boost annual MU income by $12M.

APNewsBreak: Document outlines Mizzou SEC options

[Ksyrup]

When is this going to happen? SEC just had their fall meeting and reiterated no plans to expand. Seems odd they'd once again come out pretty shortly and reverse course. I don't get what the hold up is. Either Mizzou is really debating whether to stay, in which case they should stay, or they are ready to go but the SEC isn't ready to accept them.

[Chubby]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

AP report detailing expected revenue increase for Mizzou in SEC. Small increase under current SEC contract, but new SEC deal currently being renegotiated could boost annual MU income by $12M.

APNewsBreak: Document outlines Mizzou SEC options

You'd think that with the offer clearly in hand, Missouri would already be out the door to the SEC!

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

When is this going to happen? SEC just had their fall meeting and reiterated no plans to expand.

They indicated that no action was taken on expansion. They said nothing about whether they plan to expand. Until Mizzou officially leaves the Big 12 (expected this week from what I've heard), the SEC can't make any comment due to the tampering issues.

[Chubby]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

They indicated that no action was taken on expansion. They said nothing about whether they plan to expand. Until Mizzou officially leaves the Big 12 (expected this week from what I've heard), the SEC can't make any comment due to the tampering issues.

BOOK IT!!!

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by Chubby

You'd think that with the offer clearly in hand, Missouri would already be out the door to the SEC!

They can't leave until the Alabama alignment issue is resolved. Saw a few tweets that said that was resolved in the SEC meeting today, so that should open the door for Mizzou to proceed through the process.

[Ksyrup]

They've got some competition!

University of Memphis Athletic Director R.C. Johnson said the Tigers "deserve" to be in the SEC in an interview Monday with Action News 5.

Appearing on the first day of 'Paint the Town Blue' week, Johnson addressed the university's position in the midst of a flurry of conference re-alignments in recent months.

"We want to try to get ourselves in the best possible place," Johnson said. "Ultimately we would like to be in the SEC. That's where we think we belong geographically. We think we deserve to be."