Need help with a dilemma...

[oliegirl]

Originally Posted by lordscarlet

So it's not gossip because they'll never find out?

I consider "gossip" to be harmful, and since this conversation I had with my friend will not get back to the parties involved, and since the conversation was had in order to try to help the girl, I guess no, I don't consider it gossip.

[lordscarlet]

gos·sip /ˈgɒsəp/ noun, verb, -siped or -sipped, -sip·ing or -sip·ping.
–noun
1. idle talk or rumor, esp. about the personal or private affairs of others: the endless gossip about Hollywood stars.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/gossip

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by lordscarlet

1. idle talk or rumor, esp. about the personal or private affairs of others

Based on the definition, there's probably a pretty reasonable argument that this wouldn't qualify since it wasn't idle, it was with a specific purpose.

[Autumn]

Exactly. Gossip about celebrities is exactly that because it's none of our business, and we aren't intending to do anything useful with it. Talking about your friends with the intent to help them is not gossip.

[Lorena]

Yes it's to help, but I don't think the parents would see it that way.

[RendeR]

Originally Posted by Dodgerchick

Yes it's to help, but I don't think the parents would see it that way.

If in the end it helps the teenager out of a bad situation or at least gets her talking to someone so she can make better decisions for herself then I think you'll be wrong here.

it could go badly, that depends on the girl. But if the situation is as described and Olie is a'friend' and talks to her about it as such, then I think a positive result is more than plausible.

Its going to come down to how gently olie can broach the subject and how willing the older girl is to actually talk to her about it.

I wish to god someone had been MY Oliegirl when i was a teen. I lost my firginity at 12 and had all sortsw of weird issues about sex until I was 20-something. I never had anyone to turn to or talk to about it and it sucked.

I for one am extremely happy that Olie can be there for these kids. The parents will be too if they have half a brain.

[Lorena]

Originally Posted by RendeR

If in the end it helps the teenager out of a bad situation or at least gets her talking to someone so she can make better decisions for herself then I think you'll be wrong here.

it could go badly, that depends on the girl. But if the situation is as described and Olie is a'friend' and talks to her about it as such, then I think a positive result is more than plausible.

Its going to come down to how gently olie can broach the subject and how willing the older girl is to actually talk to her about it.

I wish to god someone had been MY Oliegirl when i was a teen. I lost my firginity at 12 and had all sortsw of weird issues about sex until I was 20-something. I never had anyone to turn to or talk to about it and it sucked.

I for one am extremely happy that Olie can be there for these kids. The parents will be too if they have half a brain.

See that's the thing, it was the younger sister who approached oliegirl, not the 16 year old. I'd imagine if the 16 year old wanted to talk, she would have approached oliegirl herself.

[RendeR]

Originally Posted by Dodgerchick

See that's the thing, it was the younger sister who approached oliegirl, not the 16 year old. I'd imagine if the 16 year old wanted to talk, she would have approached oliegirl herself.

Yeah I see what you mean, but Olie is still an authority figure in some ways. I've got a sneaking suspicion that the older girl talked to the younger and the idea to talk with Olie came up but was avoided because she didn't want to dissapoint her "second mom" so the younger one , being worried about her sister, broke the ice a bit.

Maybe I'm being optimistic here, but its as good a theory as any atm.

[Ksyrup]

Once again, a thread I wish I hadn't read.

[judicial clerk]

I think you might be overthinking this and/or trying to "manage" the situation too much. If you decide to talk to anybody, you need to be honest. If you try make it seem to the 16yo that the 13yo told you by accident, the 16 yo may see through the ruse and think you are dishonest. If you try to tell the mother and leave out details, she may find out later what the 13yo actually told you and think you are dishonest.

Once either of these people learn you have been dishonest with them, you will lose credibility.

I personally vote for telling the parents. These chidren are there responsibility.

[Subby]

Originally Posted by RendeR

I wish to god someone had been MY Oliegirl when i was a teen. I lost my firginity at 12 and had all sortsw of weird issues about sex until I was 20-something. I never had anyone to turn to or talk to about it and it sucked.

What is awesome about you is that you can take a completely fucked up situation and turn it around and make it about you!

Bravo!

[Telle]

I think it's very important for teenagers to have an adult that they can confide in without fear of reprisal. And I say that as a mother.

Now the fact that it was actually the younger sister that talked to you rather than the 16 year old does make things a bit more complicated. I'd probably start with a "So, what's going on with you and so-and-so?" and if she shrugs it off give her a good look in the eye and tell her something like "Just be careful, ok? And I don't mean just practice safe-sex.. make sure he doesn't take advantage of your feelings for him," and see if she wants to talk more or not.

[RendeR]

Originally Posted by Subby

What is awesome about you is that you can take a completely fucked up situation and turn it around and make it about you!

Bravo!

Its not about me subby, its about the girls having someone like Olie to be able to go to and talk to. I simply used myself as an example of what NOT having that could be like. Supporting evidence of a stated opinion. Ever heard of it?

Go back under your rock. You just lost what little respct your apology in that other thread gained you.

[Schmidty]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

Honestly, it doesn't sound like its that bad a situation. She wouldn't be the first 16 year old girl to lose her cherry to a 19 year old douchebag, and she wouldn't be the first girl to go too far too fast. Those aren't, imo, warning signs that she's headed for a bad end or a career in porn.

You say that as a person without a daughter.

That changes one's mind on a whole mess of things relating to parenting and kids.

[Schmidty]

Dola.

I didn't mean that to sound rude. I just know that I changed my thoughts on certain issues like that as soon as I became a dad, and I would imagine that's the case for a lot of parents.

[RendeR]

What you say is valid to a point schmidty, but I think the bigger concern is that wouldn't we all have been happier if someone we knew and trusted had talked to us about some bad choice we were making? Instead of just letting us flounder without any guidance at all?

Thats the point I think Cronin is dismissing a little too easily.

[BrianD]

Originally Posted by RendeR

What you say is valid to a point schmidty, but I think the bigger concern is that wouldn't we all have been happier if someone we knew and trusted had talked to us about some bad choice we were making? Instead of just letting us flounder without any guidance at all?

Thats the point I think Cronin is dismissing a little too easily.

I also don't have kids, but I think the answer to your question is that it depends on the bad choice that is about to be made. People don't learn from bad choices they are talked out of. They learn from the bad choices they make. One of the tough parts of being a parent (I assume) is figuring out which choices to protect your kids from and which ones to let them learn from.

[BrianD]

Originally Posted by Dodgerchick

Yes, exactly, that's the point I was trying to make in my first post. We can say so much, but teens are especially stubborn and sometimes the only way they learn is by experience.

Nicely said Brian.

Thanks, but I would extend that to most people and not just teens. There are plenty of things people can learn without direct experience (e.g. shooting yourself in the head with a gun is bad), but most things require experience to be truly learned.

The real difficulty is allowing things to be learned without causing permanent damage. It sounds like the 16-year old has already had the experience to learn from...now she just needs to learn the lesson without her head getting all messed up in the process. Maybe the way to go about this situation is to go after the root-cause of the problem and not confront the girl about the relationship directly. Don't talk to the girl about this guy being bad for her, work on her self-esteem (if that is what is lacking), or whatever else is causing her to seek this relationship. The relationship itself is not the real problem, just a symptom.

[Lorena]

Originally Posted by BrianD

Thanks, but I would extend that to most people and not just teens. There are plenty of things people can learn without direct experience (e.g. shooting yourself in the head with a gun is bad), but most things require experience to be truly learned.

The real difficulty is allowing things to be learned without causing permanent damage. It sounds like the 16-year old has already had the experience to learn from...now she just needs to learn the lesson without her head getting all messed up in the process. Maybe the way to go about this situation is to go after the root-cause of the problem and not confront the girl about the relationship directly. Don't talk to the girl about this guy being bad for her, work on her self-esteem (if that is what is lacking), or whatever else is causing her to seek this relationship. The relationship itself is not the real problem, just a symptom.

hah i had deleted my post, i didn't think anyone would quote it.

but yes, you're right. It sounds like the parents aren't giving her the attention she needs so she's looking for it outside the home.

We know there's neglect, but is there physical abuse too?

[oliegirl]

OK, I talked to her this afternoon. Called her and asked her to come by so I could "get her opinion on a few things". I think she kind of knew something was up, she looked a little - not nervous, but apprehensive maybe - when she got here. We went out on the porch where there was some privacy and I started off by telling her that I really enjoy our friendship, and feel like of like a "big sister" to her because we talk about guys and stuff and I never had that (I'm an only child). Also told her that I hoped she saw me that way as well and that the reason I had called her was because I had picked up on a couple of things that were said and that because I'd been a 16 year old girl before, I had read between the lines and was concerned. Told her vaguely about what I'd heard, that she'd snuck the guy in, that she, the other girl and guy had all been in bed together and that the guy was at least missing his shirt. Just told her I didn't think that was a good situation for a 16 year old girl to put herself in, that I had figured out a while ago that they were sleeping together, and that I wasn't going to lecture her about that, but let her know that even though she thinks she is ready for "everything" and can handle it, she can't. At first she tried to blow it off, but then on her own gave me more information...the only 2 kissing were her and the guy, and she got mad at him b/c he started rubbing the other girls back, so she got jealous and upset. That opened up the "he thought he was getting a threesome with 2 hot 16 year olds" and it was like a lightbulb went off over her head. I really don't think she realized the situation she'd put herself in. We talked alot, and I ended up reiterating that I was her friend, and was there for her if she needed to talk about anything, and that she could trust me. I did tell her that at some point, if I saw really destructive behavior that I would go to her parents out of concern. She seemed to understand and didn't get upset or anything. All in all it went really well, the hardest part was starting the conversation, but from there it went on it's own and she seemed very open to talking, and even thanked me. I feel so much better now that it's over and it turned out well.

[Flasch186]

i commend you for stepping up. IMO too many people stand aside when theyre presented with the opportunity to perhaps change someone's life. I'm sure some on the other side fall into the "mind your own business" camp but as evidence by my prior threads over the last few years, that is not me. I think you did the right thing and encourage all people to intercede when they see a wrong and do/say something when you have an opportunity....However on the other hand you should also say something when you see something right and be sure to commend someone for doing the right thing too.

[lordscarlet]

For some reason this just occurred to me: In the "good old days" neighbors would always step in if they saw a problem. This is, in my opinion, partially "what's wrong with the world today." If we all lived in stronger communities like those years past, I think things would be a lot "better" now. I do commend oliegirl for attempting to help in what she felt was the best way (and what probably was the way that was likely to get the best response from the girl), rather than sitting by and watching a situation go unaddressed and potentially become bad because she sat by and did nothing.

[RendeR]

Well handled OG, Bravo for being there for her and being the friend she needs.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Perhaps it's just my nature or maybe it's a sign of the times but the first thing that went through my mind after reading this was "oliegirl got played".

Probably didn't (since she was there & presumably could have read the girl better than that) but that was my first reaction.

[RendeR]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Perhaps it's just my nature or maybe it's a sign of the times but the first thing that went through my mind after reading this was "oliegirl got played".

Probably didn't (since she was there & presumably could have read the girl better than that) but that was my first reaction.

Cynical much? =)

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Perhaps it's just my nature or maybe it's a sign of the times but the first thing that went through my mind after reading this was "oliegirl got played".

Probably didn't (since she was there & presumably could have read the girl better than that) but that was my first reaction.

Even if she did (and I dunno either way), at least she was able to get her concerns out there to the 16 year old, and that's what she really wanted to do. Make the girl think a little bit more about what's going on and let her know that olie was there if she needed it. So even if she's having sex, maybe she at least knows a few more things she needs to think about.

[Neon_Chaos]

Sigh.

I never got threesomes with two 16-year olds as a 19-year old.

[Lorena]

It went better than I anticipated, hopefully the girl learned her lesson.

[tyketime]

Originally Posted by oliegirl

We talked alot, and I ended up reiterating that I was her friend, and was there for her if she needed to talk about anything, and that she could trust me.

BINGO! We have a winner

If more adults spent this type of quality time with younger kids (whether their own or not), I think it would have a lasting impact on the next generation.

Well done...

[Eaglesfan27]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Perhaps it's just my nature or maybe it's a sign of the times but the first thing that went through my mind after reading this was "oliegirl got played".

Probably didn't (since she was there & presumably could have read the girl better than that) but that was my first reaction.

My first reaction as well.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Eaglesfan27

My first reaction as well.

Gosh, with that level of cynicism it's a good thing you don't have to deal with teenagers on a regular basis

{cynicism my ass, it's realism}

[oliegirl]

I can understand you guys thinking I got played, but I am 99% sure I didn't. For one thing, you guys weren't there so you didn't see her reaction or the sincerity in her voice. And another, there was A LOT of conversation that I left out, simply because of the detail and because it wasn't necessary to post. We talked for a little over an hour, and she did a lot of the talking, so it wasn't a one sided thing - she brought up things I didn't know about and asked questions, so she was listening and I think she appreciated it. She gave me a hug when she was leaving and said she was glad she knew me.

[Passacaglia]

olie plays werewolf -- she's probably more on the lookout for lies than most people.

[oliegirl]

Originally Posted by Passacaglia

olie plays werewolf -- she's probably more on the lookout for lies than most people.

LOL.

[ISiddiqui]

LOL, the life benefits of werewolf .