College Football Program Dilemma?

[MylesKnight]

With what has been going on recently with the program from Blacksburg, Virginia, this question comes to mind.. (not picking solely on VT, as this kind of stuff occurs at a lot more places than most folks want to admit).


If these were your two choices, would you, as a supporter of a particular I-A Football Program prefer;


A. A consistent BCS Bowl caliber program with questionable ethics (just win baby), and a rep for a bit of hooliganism.

B. A program that doesn't engage in postseason play often and realistically has no shot at ever winning a national title, but keeps its nose clean across the board.


Thoughts?

[st.cronin]

The way the question is phrased is a little curious. Is it possible to be a supporter of a football program without also having some affection for the school? If the school is the source of the affection for the football program, then I think obviously the answer is B.

[albionmoonlight]

As someone who grew up as a fan of Tulane and the New Orleans Saints, I have always found winning to be gravy. Accordingly, I would rather option B.

Besides, with Team B, you are happy when they make a bowl and disapointed when they don't.

With Team A, you are happy when they win the National Title and disapointed when they don't.

I imagine that your disapointment and happiness are about the same--just on a totally different level of expectation. So, given that, I'd rather cheer for a team that did not engage in activity that I found personally embarassing.

[MylesKnight]

Well, I believe that you have to have at least a little bit of affection for the university as a whole to pull for it's football program, don't you St. C?

I did clean up the initial question a bit though..

[MylesKnight]

I'm right there with you Albion..

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by MylesKnight

Well, I believe that you have to have at least a little bit of affection for the university as a whole to pull for it's football program, don't you St. C?

I would think so, but there were people disappointed that VaTech kicked Vick off the team, so who knows. The only explanation I can come up with is that they don't care about the university, and only care about wins and losses.

[sterlingice]

You could be KU where we get into little skirmishes with the NCAA but likely not much major and still only make a bowl game every few years and be happy when it happens

SI

[st.cronin]

I have a friend who attended U of Miami, Florida who actively roots against the football team because he's so embarrased by it.

[scooper]

Speaking of VT. Are you Marcus Vick?

http://www.everydayshouldbesaturday....1599#more-1599

From one of the best football blogs out there.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by scooper

Speaking of VT. Are you Marcus Vick?

http://www.everydayshouldbesaturday....1599#more-1599

From one of the best football blogs out there.

Funny

SI

[st.cronin]

7. A table sits in front of you, piled high with anywhere from $20-30 million dollars in cash. On the table is a note taped to the collar of an adorable puppy. The note reads, “This money is yours on the condition you do NOT kill this puppy, grill it, and eat it with lettuce and tomato on a whole wheat hoagie roll.” You:

a.) Take the money and leave the puppy.

b.) Take the money and adopt the puppy.

c.) Fire up the grill, bitches. Puppies gotta die, too.



GOLD

[PSUColonel]

Let me just say this: starting in 1967 a man by the name of Joseph Vincent Paterno decided he would start something caled the "Grand Experiment" (academics and winning being obtained at the same time)at a little cow college in the middle of Pensylvania...how does the rest of this story go?.....ahh damn I can't remember!!

[Klinglerware]

Originally Posted by PSUColonel

Let me just say this: starting in 1967 a man by the name of Joseph Vincent Paterno decided he would start something caled the "Grand Experiment" (academics and winning being obtained at the same time)at a little cow college in the middle of Pensylvania...how does the rest of this story go?.....ahh damn I can't remember!!

I also respect Paterno for his very strong stances in favor of preferences in college admissions. The fact that his football players in general and the African-Americans on his team in particular graduate at a level only a few percentage points below the student body, despite having an academic profile a bit lower than the general student body shows me that preferences don't hurt the overall academic quality of a school so long as you pick the right kids to take a chance on and you provide strong institutional support.

FYI:
PSU Graduation Rates:

Football: 74%
African-American Football: 72%
Overall Student Body: 81%

Not too shabby for a 1-A scholarship school...

[timmynausea]

I think you can have a balance between those two. You can have success and go to bowl games without all kinds of trouble, and there is going to be some trouble everywhere at some point. The best you can hope for as a fan is that you have a coach and/or AD who make doing it the right way a point of pride and the number 1 priority.

[PSUColonel]

Originally Posted by Klinglerware

I also respect Paterno for his very strong stances in favor of preferences in college admissions. The fact that his football players in general and the African-Americans on his team in particular graduate at a level only a few percentage points below the student body, despite having an academic profile a bit lower than the general student body shows me that preferences don't hurt the overall academic quality of a school so long as you pick the right kids to take a chance on and you provide strong institutional support.

FYI:
PSU Graduation Rates:

Football: 74%
African-American Football: 72%
Overall Student Body: 81%

Not too shabby for a 1-A scholarship school...

Football is at 85 percent.

[Klinglerware]

Originally Posted by PSUColonel

Football is at 85 percent.

I got these numbers from a study that reported NCAA graduation rate data for 03-04/04-05

http://www.bus.ucf.edu/sport/public/..._Grad_Rate.pdf


This report was discussed on this board a few months ago...

As I stated in that thread, the interesting thing about that report for me was that grad rates for football players at strong academic schools (e.g., Virginia and ND) are appallingly low compared to the overall student body. This indicates that elite schools have to make academic compromises in order to succeed on the athletic field. This seems to undercut the argument for preferences, but I do think that preferences would still be acceptable so long as the admitted students are not too far removed from the rest of the student body academically. In other words, schools should still accept students they think would have a reasonable chance at actually graduating.

At PSU, while PSU athletes have slightly lower academic credentials than the rest of the student body, they are not that much lower (900-1000 average SATs for athletes, 1100-1200 for non-athletes). So, athletes at schools like PSU have a reasonable chance at competing with their non-athletic peers.

The problem for schools like UVA and ND is that there are not enough legitimate 1-A athletes in the recruiting pool that are in line with their school's overall academic profile. In order to be competitive athletically, they have to accept kids that probably wouldn't get in regular admission, resulting in a much deeper academic divide between the athletes and regualar students (say, 1000-1100 SATs for the athletes vs. 1300-1400+ SATs for the regular students). While many of the student athletes are still reasonably good academically, they have to compete in the classroom with kids with elite academic credentials.

[Emiliano]

Originally Posted by scooper

Speaking of VT. Are you Marcus Vick?

http://www.everydayshouldbesaturday....1599#more-1599

From one of the best football blogs out there.

Great stuff.

[Radii]

Originally Posted by scooper

Speaking of VT. Are you Marcus Vick?

http://www.everydayshouldbesaturday....1599#more-1599

From one of the best football blogs out there.

wow, awesome. I read some of the comments. These 3, by 3 different people, in rapid fire succession, is just awesome:



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Isn’t the purple tele-tubby gay?

Comment by PSUrob — January 10, 2006 @ 3:57 pm


No, just a Northwestern fan.

Comment by Stranko Montana — January 10, 2006 @ 3:59 pm


Not that there’s anything wrong with that.

Comment by DevilGrad — January 10, 2006 @ 4:00 pm
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