Today, 05:39 PM | #4351 | |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2005
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Assumptions 1) Using the 80-20 rule, I assume 80% are law abiding and 20% have some sort of ding against them (e.g. felonies, known cartel associate etc.). Using 11M illegals as baseline, that means 8.8M vs 2.2M. 2) We do not need to give path to citizenship for illegals. We only need to give legal status such as renewable guest worker status (e.g. no voting rights). The only exception I can think of is DACA, give them citizenship 3) This is one time program only. Won't ever happen again. Any illegals after X date will be kicked out 4) Members have pointed out question of constitutionality or legal standing of X, Y, Z. Sure, any of these actions will be challenged in courts and SCOTUS will make the final ruling. Shouldn't stop us from trying to get a solution 5) There's always going to be some exception to the rule e.g. I'd probably give DACA citizenship ... even if they've committed felonies. Maybe some extreme hardship cases As President Edward 6) Implement a holistic immigration reform program (see the Immigration thread for my ideas). This goes hand in hand with the below steps to get rid of illegals. 7) One key reform from #6 is to create/consolidate key pieces of info from all system/databases (social security, visa, immigration, Border Patrol, Homeland security, Prison etc.). I can pick a gun, get a background check done, and out the store in 20 min. If we can do that, we can certainly consolidate all the info to check legal status assuming there is funding and political will. Won't be perfect, but certainly better than what we have now 8) All US citizens/PR get a nice check box on their driver's license or some other card or digital method 9) Ask the 80% to step forward, process them from illegal to guest worker assuming they pass and eligible, see #1. They get ID cards they need to carry around everywhere 10) For the 20% baddies, focus law enforcement on capturing them and tossing them out. Their native country don't want them? I like the idea of paying their one-way ticket to Rwanda (aka the failed UK solution) or giving them an option to join the French/Ukraine Foreign Legion or ask the Vatican to take some since Pope Francis talks a good game. Whatever, given enough time and money, we can probably repatriate vast majority Last edited by Edward64 : Today at 06:00 PM. |
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Today, 05:39 PM | #4352 |
This guy has posted so much, his fingers are about to fall off.
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: In Absentia
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Why is all this Robinson stuff such a surprise? It's been out there for awhile. I do find it funny that the Ashley Madison stuff is an issue in the age of Trump. Why is this an issue for everybody but Trump? I don't get it. Even my Trumpy SIL wasn't going to vote for Robinson (i assume she was going to leave it blank).
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M's pitcher Miguel Batista: "Now, I feel like I've had everything. I've talked pitching with Sandy Koufax, had Kenny G play for me. Maybe if I could have an interview with God, then I'd be served. I'd be complete." |
Today, 05:39 PM | #4353 | ||||
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2005
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I've collected your questions and have answered them individually ...
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I don't see how my above solution will be violating the rights of Americans. Sure, there'll be some exceptions but for the most part, most American's will be okay albeit slight inconvenience at times. But yes, I do believe you have to break a few eggs to make an omelet. The initial Obamacare that passed broke alot of eggs to make the omelet. GOP challenged and eventually the individual mandate was found to be unconstitutional. If I propose a program, get it passed by Congress (somehow), I'll let the final constitutionality be determined by SCOTUS. Same with Joe's student debt forgiveness. He proposed it, got shot down. He went around it, got $100B - $150B forgiven (?) and was recently forced to stop again. Another example of how Presidents break eggs to try get the omelet done. Quote:
Low hanging fruit are the illegals in jail. Should be easy enough to monitor and then eventually toss out. Their home country don't want them back? The UK plan to send unwanted to Rwanda is a creative option, only stopped by a new political party that came into power. If there is a political will and money, I'm sure we can find some country to take them.
So my question to you is: You've acknowledged there is an illegal immigration problem. Does it rise to the level where you believe something needs to be done? And if so, what is your proposed solution? Last edited by Edward64 : Today at 06:03 PM. |
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Today, 05:52 PM | #4354 | |||
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2005
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That may be true, but there are always creative solutions. It may not get 100% but if it gets us 80% there, that's pretty good. Hence, you cannot start with a vision/objective and say "can't be done, it's impossible" and not even try. You start with the vision/objective and then brainstorm on what the options are, come up with some assumptions, budget, risks etc. then go talk to your boss. Quote:
So, assuming everyone has a check box on their drivers license (or some other card), and they are asked for it when you and I are normally asked for it (traffic stop, bank transaction, TSA etc.), what is the problem? I certainly do not expect the bank teller to jump over the counter and perform a citizen's arrest. But yeah, illegal on a traffic stop that don't have a drivers license (or unwilling to present it), sure detain him ... that's what happens to US citizens already (I watch a lot of police YT videos). Question to you, same one I asked Lathum Quote:
Last edited by Edward64 : Today at 05:55 PM. |
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Today, 06:01 PM | #4355 |
World Champion Mis-speller
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Covington, Ga.
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Erik Erickson says these stories were known by the Republicans in the primary race, but they did not use them. He says they knew that Trump would endorse him, and these stories would not have stopped the endorsement. He also said this is just the beginning. The next group of revelations are financial improprieties.
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Today, 06:06 PM | #4356 |
This guy has posted so much, his fingers are about to fall off.
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: In Absentia
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The specifics may or may not have been known or public, but the underlying substance has been out there for months - mostly straight from this POS's own mouth.
__________________
M's pitcher Miguel Batista: "Now, I feel like I've had everything. I've talked pitching with Sandy Koufax, had Kenny G play for me. Maybe if I could have an interview with God, then I'd be served. I'd be complete." |
Today, 06:06 PM | #4357 | |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2005
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Eh, Diddy is more compelling. Think of all the important people he's got on tape! |
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Today, 06:10 PM | #4358 |
Hall Of Famer
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Newburgh, NY
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The guy is the Lt Gov. He didn't crawl out of the forest.
__________________
To love someone is to strive to accept that person exactly the way he or she is, right here and now.. - Mr. Rogers |
Today, 06:15 PM | #4359 |
Coordinator
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Puyallup, WA
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This wasn't particularly difficult to find. He used same screen name on this message board that he uses for Youtube and other accounts. It was also tied to an email address that the campaign confirmed is one he uses.
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Today, 06:19 PM | #4360 | |
Coordinator
Join Date: Oct 2000
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Is there any data to support the 80-20 rule? I’ve honestly never heard of that in regard to immigration and crime. |
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Today, 06:25 PM | #4361 |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2005
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Today, 06:29 PM | #4362 |
World Champion Mis-speller
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Covington, Ga.
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95-5? Maybe 99-1? Considering every study I have seen, says undocumented immigrants commit crimes at lower rate than citizens, i would think it is pretty low.
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Today, 06:32 PM | #4363 | |
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2005
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Fine, that works great for me. Actually makes the logistics for my plan even easier. |
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Today, 06:43 PM | #4364 | |||
Coordinator
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Puyallup, WA
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If you took a plan to your boss that would cost 25-50% of your total annual budget, drop your revenue, and have no viable path to getting it done, you'd be fired and laughed out of the building. You want to do something extraordinary, it's on you to present how this is somehow doable. Not just say "good ol' American ingenuity will get us through it". Not a single person, not here, not in the Trump administration, not in Congress, or anywhere else has been able to present a plan on what it would look like. Why do you think that is? Quote:
What checkbox? It doesn't currently exist. If you want to create that on an existing form of ID then I suggest you look into the rollout of REAL ID and how that's gone. Quote:
You can be detained on reasonable suspicion of committing a crime. Being in the US in violation of immigration laws is not a crime. If you want to move forward on making that a federal crime, what would you consider reasonable suspicion to be that doesn't involve not being white? |
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Today, 06:48 PM | #4365 |
Hall Of Famer
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Newburgh, NY
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Driver's license for most doesn't prove citizenship. Are you willing to detain everyone who can't prove citizenship when stopped? What's the process to allow them to get/show citizenship?
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To love someone is to strive to accept that person exactly the way he or she is, right here and now.. - Mr. Rogers |
Today, 06:51 PM | #4366 | |||||
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2005
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re: violation of immigration laws is not a crime? Sound like you are only 45% right, see below. Quote:
I'll re-ask my question to you, same one I asked Lathum Quote:
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Today, 06:54 PM | #4367 | ||
Head Coach
Join Date: Oct 2005
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For your first question re: driver's license, start with #7 and #8 I'll ask you same question I asked Lathum Quote:
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Today, 07:06 PM | #4368 |
Morgado's Favorite Forum Fascist
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Greensboro, NC
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Before any of this stuff, he had posted straight-up Holocaust denial nonsense, said the civil rights moment was “crap,” said that he wished we could go back to when women couldn’t vote, declared that the movie Black Panther was created by the Jews to extract every last shekel from your pockets, had admitted to paying for an abortion, has a porn store worker here in Greensboro claiming that Robinson owes him money for the tab he ran up there, has had serious financial mismanagement revealed (don’t recall all the details…maybe a bankruptcy or two,) and I’m sure I’m leaving out at least one or two other things.
Bottom Line: there’s absolutely nothing revealed today that’s remotely surprising to anyone who has been paying attention to this race and isn’t a hopeless partisan. All of this is consistent with his previously-known words and deeds.
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The media don't understand the kinds of problems and pressures 54 million come wit'! Last edited by Ben E Lou : Today at 07:09 PM. |
Today, 07:06 PM | #4369 |
Hall Of Famer
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Newburgh, NY
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We've been trying to implement Real ID that could also serve as proof of citizenship, but we haven't gotten it done for years. In part that's because conservatives won't agree to a national ID. How do you overcome that?
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To love someone is to strive to accept that person exactly the way he or she is, right here and now.. - Mr. Rogers |
Today, 07:26 PM | #4370 | ||||
Coordinator
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Puyallup, WA
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Number is 6 would never happen. We can't get REAL ID off the ground because you're talking about getting 50 states and multiple agencies on the same page, it would take many many years, drain money, and administrations get tired of the money sink and eventually pull funding. Don't believe it? That's exactly what's been going on with REAL ID. Then you add in the GOP seeing this as government tracking akin to vaccine chips from Bill Gates and good luck. We're 20 years into REAL ID and you effectively want to start that process all over again with even more challenges. If something ever had a less than zero percent chance of happening, this would be it. Quote:
You don't think that driving while not being white wouldn't become a crime in significant portions of the country under something like this? Quote:
I'm not 45% right. In your scenario, if I didn't produce my proof of citizenship I'd be in violation of immigration laws. That's not a crime. Quote:
People that are already here? A one, if that. They commit crimes at significantly lower rate than the general population, pay into social security and our tax systems, with either nothing or relatively little in return, and boost production. People currently entering? Maybe a 5. We should do something, but spending trillions to remove people already here is about dumbest use of money I can think of. Beefing up border security using technology, increasing the number of judges on the border to clear the 3 million backlog there, cleaning up the terrorist watch list, and then increasing legal immigration and create better paths to citizenship would incentivize coming in the right way and be a much better and more effective use of funds. |
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Today, 07:43 PM | #4371 |
College Starter
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Kalamazoo, MI
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Surprised Trump didn't just abuse the 100 mile border enforcement zone for warrantless searches. Probably not enough money.
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