POTUS 2024 - Biden vs Trump - General Election Discussion

[Lathum]

Trumps rant on electric boats and sharks is truly what we want from a world leader.

[Ghost Econ]

He already went full Quixote, why not full Santiago.

[SirFozzie]

We had a GOP senator call D-Day a "Failure", and then Reform UK (which might take over for the Conservative Party) said a candidate who was saying the UK would have been better off staying out of WWII and being neutral to Hitler was "exposing uncomfortable truths"

The right wing really thinks the wrong side won WWII apparently.

[Dutch]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

We had a GOP senator call D-Day a "Failure", and then Reform UK (which might take over for the Conservative Party) said a candidate who was saying the UK would have been better off staying out of WWII and being neutral to Hitler was "exposing uncomfortable truths"

The right wing really thinks the wrong side won WWII apparently.

Woah, I’m not really buying this “The GOP wanted Hitler to win”. That’s nuts. So, I had to look that up, because I don’t know a single conservative that was ever for Germany. My late grandfather who served in WWII included

So after listening, I see the confusion and how the sound bite can be exploited, but to then pre judge 50% of the voters (and growing) of being German sympathizers appears quite the fantastical stretch. If you listen to Graham carefully, his “dozen chances” refers to the actual dozen chances that the Western Allies had. You’ll have to fact check me on if it was actually 12…

but I distinctly remember reading quite a few books that highlighted the many diplomatic and military option failures that led to Germany conquering nearly all of Europe. The pacifist-minded Chamberlain rings a bel throughout much of the reading,, but also the specific examples such as the initial German march into the demilitarized zone of Alsace-Loraine when the French army and British Expeditionary forces were still far ahead of the German army and easily the stronger force that could have dismantled Hitler’s ambitions from the jump. The demilitarization of that region was pretty much #1 on Germanys WWI surrender terms. A good solid ass kicking opportunity was passed by. There was also the Czechs begging England to not allow the annexation of their fortified frontier and even the annexation of Austria as major events but also the failure to enforce the German military quotas. Do you remember any of that from your schooling or previous readings? I don’t say that to be sarcastic, I thought it was common knowledge. Meaning, this wasn’t a PhD, just regular reading of books and one class at the University of Maryland for some elective credit, but the book reading was done during my younger days in the military. I don’t knows the more I think about it, maybe it isn’t common knowledge and your words hold more weight as a result.

For reference: The reason for the UK and France to attempt their appeasement political strategy was admirable enough, France and England had just been through the hell of WWI, but a lot of opportunities to avoid WWII and the need for a D-Day were indeed missed. It was well known concern from the jump that Hitler wasn’t playing, so instead of a small regional war with a few thousand or tens of thousands dead, it wound up being 60,000,000-80,000,000 dead. So in that sense, even putting themselves and ultimately Russia and the U.S. into the position of having to conquer Germany was indeed the result of failure. At no point did Graham mention a tactical or strategic D-Day failure, only the “dozen” diplomatic ones. So in the limited context provided, he was very true in his words and did not suggest he was rooting for Germany to win in Normandy. Perhaps there was more to it, so if there is more that sound bite where he says he was rooting for the Nazi’s, I’d appreciate hearing it so I can re evaluate his intention.

(As for the UK quote, I don’t know about that one, I guess it could fall in line with Hitler’s weird crypto-love for the British people and that he really wanted the UK to remain peaceful (and why not, they had appeased him so many times previously) but I’ll let that quip play out in UK politics.)

[cuervo72]

Yeah, I didn't listen to the clip, but from what I've read about the general analysis is that Graham was going for one thing (he's one of the few R's who has seemed to be quite pro-Ukraine and was comparing WWII to that maybe?) but it came out really, really wrong.