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-   -   Werewolf XLV - ROME! (Game over, post 3425) (https://forums.operationsports.com/fofc//showthread.php?t=58090)

Alan T 04-11-2007 09:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ardent enthusiast (Post 1439132)
Ardent Enthusiast sues Alan T for defamation.


Hey, you look hot in a skirt.

Alan T 04-11-2007 09:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barkeep49 (Post 1439135)
My list of potential arrests:

1. Narcazio -- Moved up a rank of wealth for no apparent reason
2. ITC -- Hardly ever an active player so this game isn't unusual, but as a rule I'm in favor of going after those who are less active
3. Ironhead -- Troubling inconsistencies

I would be open to other ideas as well.


In Narcizo's case, it seems apparent to me that you will always have the 3 richest, 5 next most wealthy, 8 semi-wealthy and then everyone else. Narcizo likely was the most wealthy of the bottom group before the day started and moved up with kwhit at the end of the day. (Remember Sndvls died and was in that group, and Mustang moved down from that group to the lower group apparently due to lawsuits).

What is concerning is I can't imagine Narcizo didn't notice that and chose not to say anything or mention it. That in itself is more suspicious to me than what appears to simply be a game mechanic.

Abe Sargent 04-11-2007 09:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ImTheCrew (Post 1439047)
i have a feeling Bulletsponge is a Tarq plus we need to see what happens when some one is thrown off the cliff so.....

VOTE KILL BULLETSPONGE




Gravity?

Poli 04-11-2007 09:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KWhit (Post 1439136)
Ardent seems to be posting just to be posting.

QFT. I don't want to start the review lesson in front of me. But you're right, I should probably get to it.

Abe Sargent 04-11-2007 09:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan T (Post 1439056)
Right now I am assuming that the bad guys ended up hiring alot of the services due to the complete lack of anyone speaking about the service availability. So far we know Hoops and I purchased horse dealer service, we know Ardent was one of the legionares. That leaves 1 legionare, 1 sex dealer, 1 warlord and 1 priest purchased. So that either leaves 4 bad guys who purchased those services or good guys who just haven't been around yet since or are just being rather selfish about the information.


*I* purchased horse dealers on Day one sir, as a reminder.

Abe Sargent 04-11-2007 09:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan T (Post 1439078)
Yes, day 1 I almost arrested daddyTorgo and day 2 I almost arrested him also. He's been bugging me alot this game for some reason I haven't quite put my finger on yet.

I kind of agree about Barkeep. not sure what exactly is up with him. I don't feel badly yet about Autumn or Ironhead, but perhaps its because they both are fairly new. Ironhead had some agenda that I couldn't put my finger on last night that I called him out on, but I don't think thats enough to say he's a traitor, he could have just been wrong.

On your second list, Anxiety really is the one that bugged me the most. He made references to things that I asked about and then tried to change the subject, to which I responded and then he just stopped responding all together on it.



Last night was date night, so if it was then, then there you go. I honestl;y don;t even remember,

Alan T 04-11-2007 09:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anxiety (Post 1439146)
*I* purchased horse dealers on Day one sir, as a reminder.


Someone is incorrect or lying or something then I believe. There were only two horse dealers available. I purchased one, and both Hoops and Anxiety claim to have purchased the other.

Alan T 04-11-2007 09:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anxiety (Post 1439149)
Last night was date night, so if it was then, then there you go. I honestl;y don;t even remember,


No.. you responded to me something really random, and then didn't reply after that.

Alan T 04-11-2007 09:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hoopsguy (Post 1439055)
I placed a bid on the horses on Day 1 - can go look up my PM to see which one it was if that is noteworthy. There were two of them and one of them went to Alan.

I think that Chief Rum's posted thoughts on the services are pretty well thought out.

I'm going to give Bullet the benefit of the doubt for a little while today. But I definitely want to hear from him and will move to throw him from the rock (likely by mid-day) if that doesn't appear to be forthcoming.


Here is where Hoops mentioned he also purchased the other service of a horse dealer.

Lexus Postus, owner of many horses
Blakus Fortunatus, owner of many horses

I am not going to say who I purchased from. I know, and one other person knows since I included the name of the horse owner in my message to them. I would like Hoops and Anxiety to both state which horse owner they won the services from.

Narcizo 04-11-2007 09:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barkeep49 (Post 1439135)
My list of potential arrests:

1. Narcazio -- Moved up a rank of wealth for no apparent reason


Narcazio? Who's that?

I thought that was a bit odd as well but my idea is that I must have been at the top of the bottom tier and KWhit's reduction of peoples' wealth must have bumped me up. My impression is that the wealth listings is relative so other people losing money means that I'm relatively wealthier.

Abe Sargent 04-11-2007 09:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan T (Post 1439150)
Someone is incorrect or lying or something then I believe. There were only two horse dealers available. I purchased one, and both Hoops and Anxiety claim to have purchased the other.


Are you sure you didn;t buy yesterday, Day Two? I had Blake Fortunatus as my purchase.

Narcizo 04-11-2007 09:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan T (Post 1439142)
What is concerning is I can't imagine Narcizo didn't notice that and chose not to say anything or mention it. That in itself is more suspicious to me than what appears to simply be a game mechanic.


I didn't mention it because I thought it was pretty obvious that that's what happened. If I was trying to disguise the fact for whatever reason it's unlikely that I'd bring up the question of wealth with regards to suing and even go as far as to provide a clear indication of what tier of wealth I currently am in.

Narcizo 04-11-2007 09:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KWhit (Post 1439136)
Ardent seems to be posting just to be posting.


Indeed. If we are to actually count relevant posts I think he'd be a long way down the list of posts in the thread rather than the second place he currently has.

Alan T 04-11-2007 09:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anxiety (Post 1439158)
Are you sure you didn;t buy yesterday, Day Two? I had Blake Fortunatus as my purchase.


This is the name of the other horse dealer that I did not purchase. So now the ball is in Hoops' court. Since there is some unexplained discrepency here.

Alan T 04-11-2007 09:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Narcizo (Post 1439161)
I didn't mention it because I thought it was pretty obvious that that's what happened. If I was trying to disguise the fact for whatever reason it's unlikely that I'd bring up the question of wealth with regards to suing and even go as far as to provide a clear indication of what tier of wealth I currently am in.


Its werewolf, everything is suspicious and nothing is obvious.

st.cronin 04-11-2007 09:53 AM

Game note:

I am planning the following deadlines for the rest of the week.

Day III 9pm Eastern Time Wednesday
Day IV 9pm Eastern Time Thursday
Day V 9am Eastern Time Saturday
Day VI 9pm Eastern Time Sunday

The rationale here is three fold:

1. Fridays are usually pretty iffy days in terms of participation, especially around deadline.
2. I would like to fool around with my girlfriend on Friday night, and if I say "hang on while I go update my werewolf game," the mood will be hampered.
3. Mustang suggested he would have problems making a regular deadline on Friday, and I wanted to get him in.

If that schedule is a problem for you, pm me and I'll work something out.

Poli 04-11-2007 09:54 AM

I sooo want to comment on the fool around part, but I don't want to be struck down by the Gods with a bolt of lightning.

st.cronin 04-11-2007 09:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ardent enthusiast (Post 1439216)
I sooo want to comment on the fool around part, but I don't want to be struck down by the Gods with a bolt of lightning.


You are growing wise in your old age.

Poli 04-11-2007 09:59 AM

I *am* a lawyer.

hoopsguy 04-11-2007 09:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan T (Post 1439150)
Someone is incorrect or lying or something then I believe. There were only two horse dealers available. I purchased one, and both Hoops and Anxiety claim to have purchased the other.


I never claimed what date that I purchased the horse dealers. Although by deduction it should be pretty clear.

hoopsguy 04-11-2007 10:01 AM

I bid on Day 1 and lost (no PM). I bid on Day 2 and won. I'll be using it today.

DaddyTorgo 04-11-2007 10:02 AM

morning.

my personal life has been a mess guys, so I'm just not checking the thread every 2 minutes. i apologize, i'm not trying to play it UTR last night/this morning or anything

hoopsguy 04-11-2007 10:03 AM

Day 1 - bid on Fortunatas
Day 2 - bid on, and won the services of, Felix

Narcizo 04-11-2007 10:06 AM

I'm off and might well not be back at all for the rest of the day. I'll try to check back in later on though.

path12 04-11-2007 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Narcizo (Post 1439053)
I think this is an excellent idea but I'd take it one step further. I would like everyone to state what service they bid on in day one even if they were unsuccessful. The reason for this is that I think it will give us a better idea of who's lying. (eg If a tier two Senator bid for the priest and wasn't accepted that means that the priest must have gone to a tier one or tier two senator).


I put a bid in for the priest day one.

path12 04-11-2007 10:22 AM

Dola, didn't get it.

path12 04-11-2007 10:29 AM

I did get Maximus Maximus last night. He may protect me, he may protect the consuls, he may protect the lawyers. The Tarquins may try and guess which, if they feel lucky.

KWhit 04-11-2007 10:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by path12 (Post 1439250)
I did get Maximus Maximus last night. He may protect me, he may protect the consuls, he may protect the lawyers. The Tarquins may try and guess which, if they feel lucky.


I know you will do the right thing.

;)

DaddyTorgo 04-11-2007 10:36 AM

okay: i actually didn't bid on the sexy ladies. my personal life went to shit and i ended up with a bunch of stuff to do so i never got around to PMing cronin with a bid. hadta go pickup some furniture for my sister's new apartment

me as LEAST active? i'd be VERY suspicious of anyone who says this. It was me back on D1 who was hashing out this strategy with you two Alan and Hoops. The whole "using lawsuits to get some sort of clearance" thing. As well as...whatever the other idea that the other person had, I forget.

That's a damm meaningful contribution. But ya know what...arrest me and toss me off the rock if you want.

Just remember who is accusing me and what they're accusing me of. I was there on D1 trying to formulate strategies, looking for ways to "game the game" as it were to get us as much info as possible.

path12 04-11-2007 10:37 AM

It's also time to sue a few folks. I haven't gone into the prior results in much detail, this is more a matter of my gut feel as to how these might work:

Pathus Twelvus sues Antus Meisterus
Pathus Twelvus sues Autumnus Leavus
Pathus Twelvus sues Tyrus Ithus
Pathus Twelvus sues Chiefus Rumus

Alan T 04-11-2007 10:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hoopsguy (Post 1439224)
I never claimed what date that I purchased the horse dealers. Although by deduction it should be pretty clear.


Fair enough. I went back and reread and your posts seem to be purposefully misleading, but you are correct that you never said you won on day 1. Just gave the impression of it.

This seems like a really silly thing for a traitor to lie about and get caught, so I'm giving the benefit of the doubt that I didn't trap the great Hoopsguy in some lie about a horse. :) Plus its easy enough for someone to vouch for it tommorrow whether or not they receive a message from you.

KWhit 04-11-2007 10:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo (Post 1439255)
okay: i actually didn't bid on the sexy ladies. my personal life went to shit and i ended up with a bunch of stuff to do so i never got around to PMing cronin with a bid. hadta go pickup some furniture for my sister's new apartment


I don't understand this statement. Did you SAY that you had bid on the ladies?

KWhit 04-11-2007 10:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan T (Post 1439258)
This seems like a really silly thing for a traitor to lie about and get caught.


That was my thinking on it as well. Doesn't make sense for him to lie about this, IMO.

Barkeep49 04-11-2007 10:41 AM

DT's little diatrbe reminds me I haven't cast my vote on bullet.

For the same reasons as yesterday, villagers don't win without some pain, I'll go ahead and

Vote to execute Bullet

I don't have nearly the same good feeling about him as I did with CW which makes me even happier to cast my vote.

Coffee Warlord 04-11-2007 10:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bulletsponge (Post 1439099)
ohh i see how it goes, everyone wants to kill me! of course thats how the traitorous Tarqs want me to go, because i can buy services that will make it hard to assassinate me. I am loyal to the republic but it seems some of you have a thirst for my blood. at least someone can hire some horizontal refreshment from the sex dealer, jail is lonely


That....wasn't much of a defense.

Alan T 04-11-2007 10:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo (Post 1439255)
okay: i actually didn't bid on the sexy ladies. my personal life went to shit and i ended up with a bunch of stuff to do so i never got around to PMing cronin with a bid. hadta go pickup some furniture for my sister's new apartment

me as LEAST active? i'd be VERY suspicious of anyone who says this. It was me back on D1 who was hashing out this strategy with you two Alan and Hoops. The whole "using lawsuits to get some sort of clearance" thing. As well as...whatever the other idea that the other person had, I forget.

That's a damm meaningful contribution. But ya know what...arrest me and toss me off the rock if you want.

Just remember who is accusing me and what they're accusing me of. I was there on D1 trying to formulate strategies, looking for ways to "game the game" as it were to get us as much info as possible.



Actually on day 1 I was very nervous about how easily you went along with it, and then you became really quiet the rest of the game. Call me suspicious for thinking that if you will, but its how i feel about you. Prove me wrong today by contributing more :)

KWhit 04-11-2007 10:43 AM

Note:

I am open to suggestions on whom I should arrest today. Please let your voice be heard.

Alan T 04-11-2007 10:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KWhit (Post 1439267)
Note:

I am open to suggestions on whom I should arrest today. Please let your voice be heard.


I mentioned a few of the people I considered and didn't arrest yesterday mainly based on inactivity (DaddyTorgo, Lonestargirl, Imthecrew).

A few other names if you choose to not like the inactive route that I am wary of: Anxiety (still never answered the questions from yesterday that he avoided), and Tyrith (seemed to be the most "go with the flow" voter I can remember in recent history.

Coffee Warlord 04-11-2007 10:46 AM

He'll want to sue me into oblivion (which I find quite detrimental to the side of the Republic), but AE is still high on my suspect list.

Poli 04-11-2007 10:47 AM

Bah! You're already being sued, or I'd sue you again!

KWhit 04-11-2007 10:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coffee Warlord (Post 1439270)
He'll want to sue me into oblivion (which I find quite detrimental to the side of the Republic), but AE is still high on my suspect list.


Why so?

I have noticed that he has posted about 1000 times without doing any meaningful analysis, but is there anything other than that?

Poli 04-11-2007 10:48 AM

Kwhit, I really don't have a suggestion for you. Noone leaps out to me as suspicious at this point.

KWhit 04-11-2007 10:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan T (Post 1439269)
I mentioned a few of the people I considered and didn't arrest yesterday mainly based on inactivity (DaddyTorgo, Lonestargirl, Imthecrew).

A few other names if you choose to not like the inactive route that I am wary of: Anxiety (still never answered the questions from yesterday that he avoided), and Tyrith (seemed to be the most "go with the flow" voter I can remember in recent history.


I agree completely with you on LSG and ITC. Slightly less on DT at this point (just because he seems to have been slightly more active than the other two, not because I have a good feeling about him).

Not sure about Anxiety or Tyrith. I'll have to go back and reread some of their posts.

But thanks for the input. We need more of this kind of talk today than we had yesterday.

Abe Sargent 04-11-2007 10:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan T (Post 1439269)
I mentioned a few of the people I considered and didn't arrest yesterday mainly based on inactivity (DaddyTorgo, Lonestargirl, Imthecrew).

A few other names if you choose to not like the inactive route that I am wary of: Anxiety (still never answered the questions from yesterday that he avoided), and Tyrith (seemed to be the most "go with the flow" voter I can remember in recent history.


Ask them again, like I said, I was out much of the day yesterday, and I didn;t see you re-asking them when I had some time and was available this morning, so if they are still important to you, bring them back up.

Abe Sargent 04-11-2007 10:51 AM

KWhit I already mentioend what I found to be suspicious yesterday on Day Two - people who avoid the spotlight when it comes to being a consul.

path12 04-11-2007 10:51 AM

As for arrests, I can't discount the idea of wolves hiding in the sheer numbers and as such would look at folks such as Imus Thecrewus, Ironsus Headus, Marcus Vaughnus and Antus Meisterus (though as it's his first game it might just be trying to get his feet under him, but of course we learned from Ironhead that you can't assume anything). I realize that I could be placed in the quiet list up to this point also, but as I get familiar with the mechanics I'm starting to get some ideas and should be more to my normal activity level (right in the middle).

Coffee Warlord 04-11-2007 10:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KWhit (Post 1439274)
Why so?

I have noticed that he has posted about 1000 times without doing any meaningful analysis, but is there anything other than that?


What I mentioned last night. I freely admit it's not much and there are several good alternate explanations, but it's something. Swaggs has the ability to, when hired, scan someone at the request of whoever hired him. Assuming Dodgerchick is on the level, AE had this ability to. If he was in fact, a traitor, he'd definately push for the death of Swaggs, both to move him up in the lawyer ranks AND remove a quasi-seer from play.

I will admit that it's entirely possible he wasn't informed about this ability, which makes the above totally moot, but it's a piece of remotely solid evidence on someone.

Poli 04-11-2007 10:57 AM

Kwhit, something I'd like to add in regards to me:
I typically don't like to go back and search through posts as a villager. It's something I'll do as a bad guy, since I'm actually looking to see if I can catch someone with a misinterpretation of the truth, if you will.

I did a lot of lieing as Daredevil, if I'm not mistaken, and I was a villager then.

In fact, I think I've been a villager in every game since my return. However, I haven't lied at all in the games since Daredevil, and that's the truth. Truth is, I haven't had a role with a special action since then.

It's actually a fun way of playing. Kind of refreshing. I just post what's happened to me, and I think you'll see...IF you go back and look at my posts (and again, I probably wouldn't look myself) you'll see that as soon as I have info, I share it.

Tyrith 04-11-2007 10:58 AM

This is the most go with the flow I ever remember being in WW. Honestly, I'm almost completely clueless right now, I can't even really begin to formulate ideas as to who is what except that we need to crush the quiet people. But we don't even have voting records to speculate on so far, no real information, and I don't have a basis for flinging crap around and waiting for something to stick, yet.

Abe Sargent 04-11-2007 10:58 AM

I guess I have to tell my nanny that I'll be away for a few hours or else he'll think that I;m intentionally avoiding him or something. Nanny, I'll be away for a while. When I come back, if your very very good, you can ask me any three questions you want, and I'll answer each with total truthness.

Poli 04-11-2007 10:59 AM

CW, since I had no clue that I was used (or reportedly used) as an investigator, I doubt that Swaggs knew either.

That said, if I were bad, then I probably would report Alan T as the opposite of what he really was.

Just a quick thought.

DaddyTorgo 04-11-2007 11:00 AM

alan...i went along with it so easily because it was the exact same idea i was having about them (i honestly don't recall without looking who had the ideas first, but i just know that as i was looking i was like "hey i just had that idea! +1 for alan in my trust. +1 for hoops in my trust...i just had that idea too!"

it seemed like we were all on the same page with regards to trying to think of the best ways to get information for us villagers.

maybe you're just not giving me enough credit and i'm that good??

and as for being quiet...my day was long. my day today will be long too...meeting up with a friend after work so i will likely have to vote from my phone or from work before the end of the afternoon.

Poli 04-11-2007 11:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anxiety (Post 1439293)
I guess I have to tell my nanny that I'll be away for a few hours or else he'll think that I;m intentionally avoiding him or something. Nanny, I'll be away for a while. When I come back, if your very very good, you can ask me any three questions you want, and I'll answer each with total truthness.

?

Alan T 04-11-2007 11:01 AM

Here you go Anxiety,

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anxiety (Post 1438094)
I don't know. As a good guy, as a GM, and as a bad guy I've seen villagers waste a day or more in a game because they started t osecond guess a candidate for no real reason other than "we can;t all support a candidate this soon."

I, for one, trust KWhit. I always have, including our little survivor Lupus team. As such, I'm happy to spend my other vote.

Vote to Consul whatever KWhit's nick is.


I mainly was giving you grief figuring you were saying it to be funny that you trusted someone when you were actually a wolf, so I replied:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan T (Post 1438110)
Wern't you a bad guy in that game? :)


To which you suprised me by avoiding the question, referencing things that didn't even have anything to do with your post that I quoted.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anxiety (Post 1438121)
In which game. The city? Nope. The sheffir and the town? No. i've seen people chjoose not to vote for someone to power just because, and it was silly on multiple occasions when I wasn't the bad guy.


So I responded back letting you know how I felt, figuring we'd put it to rest as just some silly joke.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan T (Post 1438136)
I dont think my response, or the comment from you that I quoted referred to the city, the sherrif and the town or anything along those lines.

You made a comment that you trusted kwhit in the survivor game, and I asked wern't you a bad guy in that game? I found that more funny then anything at the time, but not sure why you are avoiding answering it.


But you never responded, yet still posted other things.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anxiety (Post 1438366)
I hate it when we play games like this with PM words.



So yeah, it seemed like a funny joke that I laughed at which turned into you avoiding answering for who knows what reason to me.

Alan T 04-11-2007 11:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anxiety (Post 1439293)
I guess I have to tell my nanny that I'll be away for a few hours or else he'll think that I;m intentionally avoiding him or something. Nanny, I'll be away for a while. When I come back, if your very very good, you can ask me any three questions you want, and I'll answer each with total truthness.


Yeah, you're really funny. Just keep avoid answering questions or answer with completely unrelated nonsensical replies. Like I said, I figured it was just a joke. I honestly have no idea why you're being so stubborn.

KWhit 04-11-2007 11:11 AM

It's always interesting in these games when something very simple turns out to become a big issue. Not sure that is happening here, but it sure seems to be heading that way.

saldana 04-11-2007 11:29 AM

ok, i waited on commenting on this until after i had a chance to speak with St.Cronin....

i never put in arrest warrant last night because i was never told definitively that it was mine to do. i was expecting a PM from him at any point during the day telling me that i needed to choose someone, and i never got such a message, so i assumed he was still working on a replacement. I dont even know what the exact mechanic for arrests is (that is to say, when they had to be in by) since it wasnt part of my role PM. this actually does matter, because with everything resolving at the same time, to me, it seemed logical that the timing of the arrests should be after the timing of the execution (what if i wanted to arrest coffee warlord, and was waiting to see if he was executed or not)

as soon as i woke up and saw that I "missed the deadline" i sent a PM with a name that i wanted to have arrested. Cronin has informed me that he is not going to accept it because it is past the deadline.

my apologies to my fellow players for not making the assumption that i should have issued a warrant for someone, despite not ever being told definitively that it was my responsibility.

vote execute bulletus spongeuos (or whatever his name is)

Grammaticus 04-11-2007 11:31 AM

I tried for the Priest guy on day one and did not get his services. Being in the bottom wealth tier would pretty much mean anyone could have beat me. But, since both Path and I bid for the guy, and neither got him. That means somebody did.

Also, I did bid for one of the horse traders on the second day and got nothing.

KWhit 04-11-2007 11:56 AM

Testing a couple of theories...

KAYUS WHITUS SUES:

Abeus Anxietus
Antus Meisterus
Autumnus Leavus
Barkeepus Valerius Fortynineus
Narcizus Lispus
Pathus Twelveus
Peregrinus Barbarus

Tyrith 04-11-2007 12:02 PM

Are the theories anything you care to enlighten us about in the near term?

Ironhead 04-11-2007 12:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barkeep49 (Post 1439135)
My list of potential arrests:

1. Narcazio -- Moved up a rank of wealth for no apparent reason
2. ITC -- Hardly ever an active player so this game isn't unusual, but as a rule I'm in favor of going after those who are less active
3. Ironhead -- Troubling inconsistencies

I would be open to other ideas as well.


At work right now, posting this in a hurry so forgive any typos or rambling.

I want to try and give some insight into my Day 2 thought process. We started off with 28 players. I am new to Werewolf but from what I gather in a game of this size we can probably expect there to be 5-6 wolves. Anyone can bid on services, but not everyone has equal access to those services because of wealth. Given that the wolves are small in number, and only a few of them likely have enough wealth to access services it would take them longer to figure out what all of the services do. By specially defining in the open what each service does they 1)can narrow down the services that best aid them and 2)they can coordinate which services each person will bid on. Keep in mind that the village does not have the advantage of avoiding double, triple, etc... bids for the same service. To me a reveal of what services do what benefits the wolves more than it does the village.

From his day 1 & 2 posts I had AlanT on at least a neutral trust level, and I felt better about my through process regarding services when he had posted he didn't favor their reveal either. When I checked in last night and he was asking that they be revealed it set of a red flag for me. It turned out it was my fault though because I had only remembered his post about them not being revealed, and not the later post about revealing them after the deadline. When Dodgerchick posted that she scanned AlanT and cleared him, and then she posted her trust list based on what I personally felt was iffy reasoning I felt the need to push further into it.

If you wanted to say I had any kind of agenda it would be to make sure the village did not make the same mistake it did last game, when Hoopsguy was cleared by the seer and turned out to be bad. Granted that was due to a conversion, but still. The whole thing felt very convenient to me given that AlanT was the first person to vote Dodgerchick for Consul, then Dodgerchick cleared him and lumped him in a neat little trust group.

Now regarding services I am willing to reveal that I was the person who won the services of the Priest on Day 2. I did not use his ability yesterday as it did not come into play. I also won another service last night, one that if in the wrong hands could be dangerous to the village. I also do not want to reveal that in the open.

I should be back on around 7 pm to check in after work.

KWhit 04-11-2007 12:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyrith (Post 1439361)
Are the theories anything you care to enlighten us about in the near term?


Not really. Right now, I'm suing everyone in my wealth bracket to see what happens.

Barkeep49 04-11-2007 12:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KWhit (Post 1439368)
Not really. Right now, I'm suing everyone in my wealth bracket to see what happens.

I have to admit based on yesterday I'm a little scared of you right now.

Peregrine 04-11-2007 12:10 PM

Well it looks like we're going to have a pretty overwhelming vote today, as almost everyone is voting to kill bulletsponge. That's not going to get us too much info. We definitely need those two arrests for tomorrow.

I'd have to say I'm pretty suspicious of LoneStarGirl. She's barely been here at all with only three posts, and none of them have really been very helpful. If we're looking for someone who is under the radar, she's definitely there.

Tyrith 04-11-2007 12:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peregrine (Post 1439371)
Well it looks like we're going to have a pretty overwhelming vote today, as almost everyone is voting to kill bulletsponge. That's not going to get us too much info. We definitely need those two arrests for tomorrow.

I'd have to say I'm pretty suspicious of LoneStarGirl. She's barely been here at all with only three posts, and none of them have really been very helpful. If we're looking for someone who is under the radar, she's definitely there.


Once upon a time we killed bulletsponge with something like a 16-0 vote. He even voted to kill himself. It was quite grand.

Alan T 04-11-2007 12:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peregrine (Post 1439371)
Well it looks like we're going to have a pretty overwhelming vote today, as almost everyone is voting to kill bulletsponge. That's not going to get us too much info. We definitely need those two arrests for tomorrow.

I'd have to say I'm pretty suspicious of LoneStarGirl. She's barely been here at all with only three posts, and none of them have really been very helpful. If we're looking for someone who is under the radar, she's definitely there.


I placed him under arrest, but I haven't yet voted on him. So far his defense of himself has been very non-spectacular. I'm willing to give him a bit more time to try to say why he is worth saving though. I think most of the senate was reasonable in listening to CW, and only time will tell if that was wise or they were duped. So I think that Bullet at least needs to make an effort today.

KWhit 04-11-2007 12:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peregrine (Post 1439371)
Well it looks like we're going to have a pretty overwhelming vote today, as almost everyone is voting to kill bulletsponge. That's not going to get us too much info. We definitely need those two arrests for tomorrow.


I am more than likely going to vote to kill BS today, but was hoping to hear something from him first.

KWhit 04-11-2007 12:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peregrine (Post 1439371)
I'd have to say I'm pretty suspicious of LoneStarGirl. She's barely been here at all with only three posts, and none of them have really been very helpful. If we're looking for someone who is under the radar, she's definitely there.


I agree, but think she's almost TOO under the radar. Usually the bad guys try to avoid being COMPLETELY inactive like she has been.

Tyrith 04-11-2007 12:16 PM

There is certainly information to be gleaned from the lawsuits, at least in theory. It's possible, as has been discussed, we have secret rankings as to our skill in winning in court -- a dueling mechanic, like in Gramm's game. And if that's the case knowing kind of where we stand would be nice, especially since we can sick the best arguer on everyone and see if evidence comes out. This would also give this information to the wolves, making the better litigators targets, but at least we'd have a clue as to where we stand.

However, I would also think it's reasonable that there might be alternate win conditions at work here, and KWhit has turned into the lawsuit freak to achieve his own ends, regardless of what side he's on. So a degree of caution is in order.

hoopsguy 04-11-2007 12:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyrith (Post 1439373)
Once upon a time we killed bulletsponge with something like a 16-0 vote. He even voted to kill himself. It was quite grand.


And he was a villager, if I recall correctly.

I'm not truly expecting him to mount a big defense, but that is what stinks about the position we find ourselves in. He is among the wealthiest citizens and has resources that could likely help the cause.

But he doesn't actively participate, which causes distrust. Which he doesn't really try to negate. There is a group dynamic that comes into play with WW that he just doesn't really acknowledge. And I can't see how it is much fun.

KWhit 04-11-2007 12:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barkeep49 (Post 1439369)
I have to admit based on yesterday I'm a little scared of you right now.


Another thing I'm very interested in is whether or not my success rate changes from day to day. That's why I wanted a fairly large group of lawsuits to see what happens both tonight and tomorrow night.

Tyrith 04-11-2007 12:18 PM

I think it'll be easier to differentiate the UTRs once we kill off a few more people. We still have 26 people in the game, and while we need to start cutting down the ranks of quiet people there are just so many candidates that it's kind of hard for me to differentiate now. Once the game is a little smaller I will personally be able to judge things better. Right now, just too many variables.

KWhit 04-11-2007 12:19 PM

And don't forget that lawyers can sway the vote. It is not enough to just throw your vote away (or not vote at all) because it appears that we have a majority. Every vote really does count in this game.

Alan T 04-11-2007 12:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyrith (Post 1439383)
There is certainly information to be gleaned from the lawsuits, at least in theory. It's possible, as has been discussed, we have secret rankings as to our skill in winning in court -- a dueling mechanic, like in Gramm's game. And if that's the case knowing kind of where we stand would be nice, especially since we can sick the best arguer on everyone and see if evidence comes out. This would also give this information to the wolves, making the better litigators targets, but at least we'd have a clue as to where we stand.

However, I would also think it's reasonable that there might be alternate win conditions at work here, and KWhit has turned into the lawsuit freak to achieve his own ends, regardless of what side he's on. So a degree of caution is in order.


I can't imagine someone having a winning condition based on something that we can't stop... ie: winning or placing X amount of lawsuits. None of us have the ability as far as i know to prevent others from placing lawsuits. That feels like a broken winning condition to me.

Alan T 04-11-2007 12:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyrith (Post 1439387)
I think it'll be easier to differentiate the UTRs once we kill off a few more people. We still have 26 people in the game, and while we need to start cutting down the ranks of quiet people there are just so many candidates that it's kind of hard for me to differentiate now. Once the game is a little smaller I will personally be able to judge things better. Right now, just too many variables.


I disagree completely. Once we get in to day 5, 6, 7 we'll have more evidence to try to push on people regardless if they are quiet or not. Every game people talk about going after the UTR folks, but no one ever does once evidence starts coming out pointing at other people. Really the only time in any game that UTR people are actively targeted is at the beginning of a game. That is why an UTR wolf can be so effective if they make it past the first few days.

Poli 04-11-2007 12:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KWhit (Post 1439389)
And don't forget that lawyers can sway the vote. It is not enough to just throw your vote away (or not vote at all) because it appears that we have a majority. Every vote really does count in this game.

I wish the lawyers had more knowledge of what they were doing, honestly.

I feel like people are questioning what happened with me.

I'm confident, though, that Schmidty (who I believe is the new lawyer) will back me up on lack of information.

Alan T 04-11-2007 12:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KWhit (Post 1439389)
And don't forget that lawyers can sway the vote. It is not enough to just throw your vote away (or not vote at all) because it appears that we have a majority. Every vote really does count in this game.


I haven't had time yet today to total up the votes like I did yesterday, but so far I don't recall us having enough for a lynch yet. 14 votes is alot of votes to get no matter how you cut it.

Alan T 04-11-2007 12:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ardent enthusiast (Post 1439392)
I wish the lawyers had more knowledge of what they were doing, honestly.

I feel like people are questioning what happened with me.

I'm confident, though, that Schmidty (who I believe is the new lawyer) will back me up on lack of information.


I am assuming no one hired schmidty for today as no one knew he was a lawyer until today started. So I don't think he'll be able to back you up on much right now.

Poli 04-11-2007 12:23 PM

!

Tyrith 04-11-2007 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan T (Post 1439391)
I disagree completely. Once we get in to day 5, 6, 7 we'll have more evidence to try to push on people regardless if they are quiet or not. Every game people talk about going after the UTR folks, but no one ever does once evidence starts coming out pointing at other people. Really the only time in any game that UTR people are actively targeted is at the beginning of a game. That is why an UTR wolf can be so effective if they make it past the first few days.


Hrm, true. But the thing is with a game this size is that it's probably going to last longer. Especially since we didn't really have a day 1. I feel like right now we're still in day 2 or so, in terms of the maturity level of the game. And we don't even really have any voting records, since no one has died to tell us their allegiance. Unless we get more info unexpectedly I'd expect we have another day or two of UTR crushing left.

That said, people that I'd really like to hear more from, if I had to narrow the UTR list down:

Marc Vaughn
Antmeister
Neon Chaos

LSG's behavior doesn't strike me as terribly out of line for her, if I'm remembering past games correctly. ITC, likewise. Schmidty generally has low post count, so he's okay so far -- I'm not worried about him staying out of the limelight ;) Another person that strikes me as not being as involved as I might expect is saldana, but it's still early for that. And AE's post a lot, but not say too much stance has already been documented.

KWhit 04-11-2007 12:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyrith (Post 1439383)
However, I would also think it's reasonable that there might be alternate win conditions at work here, and KWhit has turned into the lawsuit freak to achieve his own ends, regardless of what side he's on. So a degree of caution is in order.


So far, we have not hit the lawsuit limit on either day. So I am not keeping others from making their lawsuits. And I purposefully waited until late-ish in the day so people could have plenty of time to make their suits before I got on the court docket, so to speak.

I definitely have no winning condition that relates to lawsuits. I however, do have the most information to work from (based on sample size) that we can use to discover what the mechanic at work might be. So I'm continuing to sue to do three things:

1) Give us more data.
2) Test out a half-baked theory or two of my own
3) Get some more money to protect the cause of the Loyal Romans

I want money. It is true. Why? Because I KNOW I'm a good guy. And because many others seemingly are starting to at least slightly believe that I'm good too. So I'm using this opportunity to play my advantage a bit and see what happens.

I assure you, I am not just doing this for myself. I am not opposed to buying services and sharing them with others if I get in the position where that makes sense.

And I appreciate the fact that others have shared their services with me.

Tyrith 04-11-2007 12:28 PM

Is exactly 50% going to count as a majority in this game? This has probably also been answered before, but we're at 26, so it could be 13 or 14.

Tyrith 04-11-2007 12:31 PM

KWhit, makes sense to me. But I still don't think it's impossible that you have your own motivations, but for now you seem to be working in our best interests, and your logic is sound. So I'll just let it go as the enemy of my enemy is my friend, until further notice.

FWIW I suspect that there isn't a lawsuit cap, as these Roman courts appear to be much more efficient than their modern equivalents. And I also expect to get my butt beat down by you today ;)

Alan T 04-11-2007 12:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyrith (Post 1439404)
Is exactly 50% going to count as a majority in this game? This has probably also been answered before, but we're at 26, so it could be 13 or 14.


My assumption is majority is > 50% so in this case would be 14 votes. (Since 13 wouldn't be a majority)

Alan T 04-11-2007 12:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyrith (Post 1439407)
KWhit, makes sense to me. But I still don't think it's impossible that you have your own motivations, but for now you seem to be working in our best interests, and your logic is sound. So I'll just let it go as the enemy of my enemy is my friend, until further notice.

FWIW I suspect that there isn't a lawsuit cap, as these Roman courts appear to be much more efficient than their modern equivalents. And I also expect to get my butt beat down by you today ;)



Cronin hinted before that the courts could only handle so many cases.

path12 04-11-2007 12:33 PM

Until I hear some reasons not to, I am going to:

VOTE EXECUTE BULLETUS SPONGEUS

Tyrith 04-11-2007 12:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan T (Post 1439409)
Cronin hinted before that the courts could only handle so many cases.


Then what the heck is the cap going to be? We've already been suing the pants off of each other for two days. Is it possible that it's a decaying cap over time, in relationship to the number of players in the game? And is this a piece of information worth seeking out? If so we can just jam the process with random lawsuits at the end of the day.

path12 04-11-2007 12:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan T (Post 1439409)
Cronin hinted before that the courts could only handle so many cases.



Seems to be quite a high number though. It doesn't look as though a lot of information has come out of the ones processed so far though, so other than wealth distribution I'm not sure how useful they're going to be.

Tyrith 04-11-2007 12:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by path12 (Post 1439415)
Seems to be quite a high number though. It doesn't look as though a lot of information has come out of the ones processed so far though, so other than wealth distribution I'm not sure how useful they're going to be.


If we generate enough lawsuits we might be able to get some sort of an oratory ranking, just by sheer volume of information. It'll be like piecing together a really big logic puzzle tough....Alan, oh Alan, care to help us out? :P

Alan T 04-11-2007 12:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyrith (Post 1439418)
If we generate enough lawsuits we might be able to get some sort of an oratory ranking, just by sheer volume of information. It'll be like piecing together a really big logic puzzle tough....Alan, oh Alan, care to help us out? :P


I already made some suits and put together what info I had earlier! I don't think we can find out more until later tonight. I'll likely place more lawsuits later, but have been waiting to let others have opportunities before I place a bunch more.

Tyrith 04-11-2007 12:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan T (Post 1439421)
I already made some suits and put together what info I had earlier! I don't think we can find out more until later tonight. I'll likely place more lawsuits later, but have been waiting to let others have opportunities before I place a bunch more.


Well, I expect it'll be important to keep track from day to day who beats who in some sort of ladder function. You seem to like torturing yourself with stuff like that...or maybe hoops!

KWhit 04-11-2007 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan T (Post 1439393)
I haven't had time yet today to total up the votes like I did yesterday, but so far I don't recall us having enough for a lynch yet. 14 votes is alot of votes to get no matter how you cut it.


True. I just reread my post and it reads as if I'm saying that we currently have a mojority. That's not correct, and not what I meant. I just meant that even if it looks like a vote is out of reach one way or the other, YOU NEED TO STILL MAKE A VOTE, because lawyers can sway the vote.

Tyrith 04-11-2007 12:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KWhit (Post 1439432)
True. I just reread my post and it reads as if I'm saying that we currently have a mojority. That's not correct, and not what I meant. I just meant that even if it looks like a vote is out of reach one way or the other, YOU NEED TO STILL MAKE A VOTE, because lawyers can sway the vote.


And like narzico said, people need to be voting just so we have a way to track their opinions. Not voting is a way of UTRing, and in a situation like this, when you only have one choice, the line gets blurred.

So I'm in agreement with KWhit and Narzico, EVERYONE NEEDS TO VOTE. If you don't vote be warned that it's likely we'll talk about getting you chucked off the cliff :P

Poli 04-11-2007 01:02 PM

+1

Abe Sargent 04-11-2007 01:06 PM

I'm not convinced GS is a baddie, but if he were, I think he'd have done more to save himslef. So, ironically,

Free Bulletsponge wherever the "us"'s are

st.cronin 04-11-2007 01:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyrith (Post 1439404)
Is exactly 50% going to count as a majority in this game? This has probably also been answered before, but we're at 26, so it could be 13 or 14.


14 votes are required to execute bulletsponge.

KWhit 04-11-2007 01:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anxiety (Post 1439450)
I'm not convinced GS is a baddie, but if he were, I think he'd have done more to save himslef. So, ironically,

Free Bulletsponge wherever the "us"'s are



Huh?

KWhit 04-11-2007 01:14 PM

The more I think about this, the more I think we need to lynch Bulletsponge. I think letting CW go last night was okay, because he was quite active and I have a slightly good vibe about him. But BS has not been around, and I feel that it would be a bad idea to go 2 nights without a lynch.

VOTE KILL Bulletus Spongeus.

Chief Rum 04-11-2007 01:16 PM

I have put together a "standings" from lawsuits so far, and will continue to do so. At some point, I will post it and my thoughts, although I think at this point (one dayu's suits only), there is little to gain except to provide the wolves with potential info on winning lawsuits. Not that the results I have so far are particularly revealing or involve information no one else here can get, but why do the work for them?

I will contribute some more suits to today's docket, continuing to test theories of my own (guessing at some Roman names):

CHIEFUS RUMUS SUES SALDANUS LATHUMUS
CHIEFUS RUMUS SUES DODGUS ERCHICKUS
CHIEFUS RUMUS SUES NARCIZUS LISPIS
CHIEFUS RUMUS SUES PEREGRINUS BARBARUS
CHIEFUS RUMUS SUES DADDYUS TORGOUS
CHIEFUS RUMUS SUES MUSTANGUS SALLUS


In the matter of bulletsponge, I feel he is likely innocent. In fact, of th ebest candidates suggested by others, most of the suspects are playing to form. LSG often will make a suspicious post and not be around early on, bulletsponge is usually UTR and almost intentionally unhelpful, ITC has shown an early indication to disappear and not post much; etc. And that's when all are villagers.

My guess is our UTR wolves (let's assume that's 2-3) are active and contributing, but not too much (and more than the above three). Then there are likely two very active wolves (at least) contributing all of the time.

Still, I am also of the thinking that if you're not contributing (and especially if you have a pattern of not being a helpful villager), you aren't with us. As such...

VOTE EXECUTE BULLETSPONGE

It would be nice to see him be more active, but would we get more than more jokes? I'm not sure we would. But that's up to him.

For arrests, I am still feeling out the ones that are active and likely hold some of our wolves. Until I can see more patterns, it is probably best to go with the UTR group. I would certainly be for arresting LSG, as her execute order was aimed at me and there still wasn't an explanation whatsoever. ITC would also be a good choice.

Some others: Mustang (even as a replacement player, I would have hoped he would post more by now); Marc Vaughan (if Narcizo can post off-time-zone as often as he does, MV should be able to as well); path12 (recdently more active in the thread, but was UTR for a while before that); Daddy Torgo (although I am sorry he is going through personal issues, but regardless, if someone has issues that interfere with his ability to play the game, it might be best if we arrest him).

Abe Sargent 04-11-2007 01:16 PM

Actually, if you take a look at what you quoted, you'll see that you quoted two previous game points that I made. Then you replied with a quick question about previous game experience. That I thought you referring to the first in teh quote and not the second is merely your bad quoting ability.

That's your first answer.

I did trust KWhit completly and explicitly. That was a game where wolf and non-wolf didn't have as much of an impact on the game. I forged an alliance with KWhit, and kept it throughout. I never once attacked him, never once put him in danger, and once my wolf leader tried to kill him at night, issuing a night kill for him, and I argued that we should go elsewhere, so I even saved him from a kill. It was a bond of mutual trust, and that I was a wolf did not enter into that fact. Thus, I feel a bond with KWhit as a result that means, given a lot of neutral people to vote about that I don;t have any info on, with KWhit being someone withb a vote already, I'll roll with that bond.

That's your second answer.

You'll note that with over twenty players, it's would be hard to impossible to catch up with a thread, make some comments as your are doing it, and then take off making sure every single time that someone hasn;t asked me something or whatnot before I do between writing some comments and heading off. I have a life. You can either accept that or not, but I;m not going to spend every ten minutes hitting refresh throughout the entire day.

That's your third answer.



Now, it's my turn. This has got to be the cheapest, most worthless attack anyone has ever leveled against me in a WW game. You quoted a post where I referred to two previous game experiences and ask me a question, and when I think you are talking about one you get in a huff because you were secret asking about the other? Seriously? And then the huff continues because I left without really reading your post about nothing but a previous game, and you got secret angry too? Does my answer to previous games really matter to this one?

Does my ass smell really nice? Because it seems you enjoy spending time down there.

Haven't we established previously that you have NO ABEDAR? Now let's move on.



Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan T (Post 1439300)
Here you go Anxiety,



I mainly was giving you grief figuring you were saying it to be funny that you trusted someone when you were actually a wolf, so I replied:



To which you suprised me by avoiding the question, referencing things that didn't even have anything to do with your post that I quoted.



So I responded back letting you know how I felt, figuring we'd put it to rest as just some silly joke.



But you never responded, yet still posted other things.




So yeah, it seemed like a funny joke that I laughed at which turned into you avoiding answering for who knows what reason to me.



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